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There are two guards: one always speaks the truth, the other gouges the eyes out of people who ask tricky questions.
August 3, 2007 4:10 PM   Subscribe

All men are liars. Start with the follow-up to this much-discussed article.
posted by goodnewsfortheinsane (103 comments total) 2 users marked this as a favorite

 
"Every man is evil, yes, every man's a liar. Unashamed with a wicked tongue, sing in the black soul choir."
posted by klangklangston at 4:16 PM on August 3, 2007 [2 favorites]


And women are not? I think studies show women lie more often then men, actually.
posted by delmoi at 4:18 PM on August 3, 2007


All men are liars.
God is a man.
Therefore God is a Liar.


I fucking knew it.
posted by seanyboy at 4:19 PM on August 3, 2007


Yes, we are.
posted by synaesthetichaze at 4:23 PM on August 3, 2007


And what a lame article. A house of cards built on hackneyed "men drive like this" bullshit, and an elaborate attempt to justify his hitting it with a whore.

Hey, maybe women don't want no-strings-attached sex with him because he comes across as kinda a selfish jerk? Wouldn't that be the simpler explanation?
posted by klangklangston at 4:24 PM on August 3, 2007 [2 favorites]


Yeah, his responses to the criticism are unnecessarily pretentious.
posted by ageispolis at 4:29 PM on August 3, 2007


"Surely, exploiting the childhood abuse that many sex workers suffered, rendering them the ability to separate their bodies from their minds, is a less noble deed than convincing someone you love them for a night?"
Beyond the poor grammar of the letter writer, what he says doesn't make much sense. The mind is part of the body, but the mind and the rest of the body really are physically distinct. The ability think about the two separately isn't a psychological flaw.
posted by delmoi at 4:34 PM on August 3, 2007


> Yes, we are.

And we're helpless to stop--why, I'm lying right now!
posted by jfuller at 4:35 PM on August 3, 2007


Misandry by chauvinist pigettes.

After sixty years of feminsm women are still so insecure thay need to wallow in and celebrate their rampant sexism.
posted by HTuttle at 4:36 PM on August 3, 2007


Hey, at least women can be sexist bitches now.
posted by taursir at 4:37 PM on August 3, 2007


Oh, everyone's a liar.

LOL I MEAN EVERYONE ISN'T A LIAR LOLOL
posted by Sticherbeast at 4:37 PM on August 3, 2007 [2 favorites]


Yeah. I couldn't get beyond "There is more than four people" written by both Tina and Dick. They are morons and deserve whatever hell they live in.
posted by beelzbubba at 4:37 PM on August 3, 2007


Chris Rock: All women are liars. (with bonus laughing parrot, NSFW)
posted by LordSludge at 4:38 PM on August 3, 2007


"Every man is evil, yes, every man's a liar. Unashamed with a wicked tongue, sing in the black soul choir."
posted by klangklangston at 4:16 PM on August 3 [+] [!]


DAmned Hutterites. They're everywhere.
posted by beelzbubba at 4:39 PM on August 3, 2007


only insofar as we are a subset of humans; I believe you will find the problem to be common to all sets therein.
posted by boo_radley at 4:39 PM on August 3, 2007


what hapened to Socrates? he is not even mentioned.
posted by Postroad at 4:41 PM on August 3, 2007


If all men are liars, why should I believe this?
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:44 PM on August 3, 2007 [3 favorites]


So what you're saying is the reason that no one likes me, and that I have no friends is because I'm basically a jerk?

I guess I always suspected as much, but that link was truly convincing.
posted by blue_beetle at 4:48 PM on August 3, 2007


No, no, it's just Cretans. This man must be a Cretan.
posted by klangklangston at 4:49 PM on August 3, 2007 [2 favorites]


Dad always said I'd be good for nothing, but he was wrong. I'm good for fifty bucks.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:50 PM on August 3, 2007 [1 favorite]


I have never told a lie.

Except that one.
posted by quin at 4:50 PM on August 3, 2007


"Misandry by chauvinist pigettes.

After sixty years of feminsm women are still so insecure thay need to wallow in and celebrate their rampant sexism."

Sometimes I worry that statements like this will lead to the detachment of my optic nerve, from rolling my eyes so hard.
posted by klangklangston at 4:50 PM on August 3, 2007 [9 favorites]


Man, this guy constantly brings up Race, even when it's unimportant (he mentioned that Micheal Vic was black, that his friend was a "wog") it's really weird to read from American perspective.

One of my co-workers at my last job was from there, and if you saw him you'd think he was white, but according to him in Australia he was a (IIRC) wog, because he was greek or eastern European, something like that. According to him Australia was "Just a very racist place". And he'd grown up there, still spoke with the accent, etc. A lot of times when I read about it, I get the same impression.
posted by delmoi at 4:50 PM on August 3, 2007


Hey IRFH, where's that $50 you owe me?
posted by klangklangston at 4:51 PM on August 3, 2007


Other way around klang, other way around. Unless you're implying I was bad - cause bad'll cost you a hunnerd.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:53 PM on August 3, 2007 [1 favorite]


Hey, maybe women don't want no-strings-attached sex with him because he comes across as kinda a selfish jerk? Wouldn't that be the simpler explanation?

The subset of women that want no-strings attached sex is smaller than the subset of men that want no-strings attached sex. Thus some men aren't going to be able to achieve their goal of no-strings attached sex, and the women that do are in a position to be pickier than they normally would be.
posted by MillMan at 4:54 PM on August 3, 2007 [3 favorites]


Hey, maybe women don't want no-strings-attached sex with him because he comes across as kinda a selfish jerk? Wouldn't that be the simpler explanation?

Nah, I'm a selfish jerk and everybody wants to have sex with me. Dude must be butt ugly.
posted by jonmc at 4:57 PM on August 3, 2007


The subset of women that want no-strings attached sex is smaller than the subset of men that want no-strings attached sex.

That's because women, being generally more intelligent than men, understand that there is no such thing as no-strings-attached sex.
posted by The World Famous at 4:59 PM on August 3, 2007


there is no such thing as no-strings-attached sex.

Well, some people use duct tape...
posted by jonmc at 5:00 PM on August 3, 2007 [3 favorites]


The subset of women that want no-strings attached sex is smaller than the subset of men that want no-strings attached sex. However, the subset of women that have no-strings attached sex is exactly the same as the subset of men that have no-strings attached sex. How does this support your theory that women are "women, being generally more intelligent than men?"
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:02 PM on August 3, 2007


Huh. Screwed that up, didn't I? Well - there's your proof!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:03 PM on August 3, 2007


You messed up the joke in the title, btw.
posted by puke & cry at 5:04 PM on August 3, 2007


Well, some people use duct tape...

Or handcuffs, but you may have to pay extra for that.
posted by quin at 5:05 PM on August 3, 2007


Yeah, the fact that this guy is a huge asshole is the relevant frame for analysis here, rather than his views on gender or honesty.
posted by ibmcginty at 5:07 PM on August 3, 2007


Listen very carefully.

I. am. lying.
posted by tkchrist at 5:09 PM on August 3, 2007


Hey, maybe women don't want no-strings-attached sex with him because he comes across as kinda a selfish jerk? Wouldn't that be the simpler explanation?

I dunno if it's the simpler explanation or not. However, if you doubt his account, it's fairly simple to do a small empirical experiment to test his thesis.

My strong suspicion, if you're honest, is that you'd get the same results as he did.
posted by PeterMcDermott at 5:11 PM on August 3, 2007


Victimist powers, activate!
posted by oncogenesis at 5:12 PM on August 3, 2007 [2 favorites]


I dunno if it's the simpler explanation or not. However, if you doubt his account, it's fairly simple to do a small empirical experiment to test his thesis.

Any Mefite Honeys wanna have no-strings attached sex?
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:13 PM on August 3, 2007


I have a headache.
posted by jonmc at 5:15 PM on August 3, 2007 [1 favorite]


"Other way around klang, other way around. Unless you're implying I was bad - cause bad'll cost you a hunnerd."

IRFH, bad comes with props.

There were no props.

"My strong suspicion, if you're honest, is that you'd get the same results as he did."

I think I want different things, since I was honest and have had a string of really great girlfriends.
posted by klangklangston at 5:16 PM on August 3, 2007


Ocassionally he'll get things right, but mostly - not a chance. His attempt to educate his readers on Feminist Lite falls on deaf ears as witnessed by a lot of the comments on his blog posts.

At least he's much better than his counterpart on the site, Ask Sam!
posted by liquorice at 5:17 PM on August 3, 2007



I wanna know why you never
Look me in the face
Broke a confidence just to please
Your ego should've realised
You know what I know
- Sex Pistols, "Liar"

I'm tired of the stories that you always tell
Shakespeare couldn't tell a story that well
You're the largest liar that was ever created
You and Pinocchio are probably related
- Too Much Joy, "That's a Lie"

I havent time to sympathise
With all this nonsense and your lies
You are the king of nothing
- New Order, "Liar"

you feel so lucky
but your ego obscures reality that you never bothered to
wonder why things are going so well
you want to know why?
'cause I'm a liar, yeah, I'm a liar
I'll tear your mind up, I'll burn your soul
I'll turn you into me, I'll turn you into me
- Rollins Band, "Liar"

Your daddy is a wino, and your mommy is quite insane
From alter boy to sewer rat, you don't give a damn
Your sister is a junkie, gets it any way she can
Your brother's a gay singer in a stud leather band
Your girlfriend's got herpes to go with your hep and AIDS
There ain't one person you know you ain't ripped off yet.
- Megadeth, "Liar"

And I'm on tonight
You know my hips don't lie
And I'm starting to feel it's right
All the attraction, the tension
Don't you see baby, this is perfection
- Shakira, "Hips Don't Lie"

posted by davejay at 5:19 PM on August 3, 2007


That's because women ... understand that there is no such thing as no-strings-attached sex.

That might be true.


For women.
posted by bashos_frog at 5:20 PM on August 3, 2007


It's Raining Florence Henderson, that last one was just for you, baby.

i lie!
posted by davejay at 5:21 PM on August 3, 2007


No, baby. Assuming we're more equality-minded about who or what a honey is than the author of the article was.
posted by imperium at 5:22 PM on August 3, 2007


Wow, that's that failure to preview thing again. Small prize for working out what I was referring to.
posted by imperium at 5:23 PM on August 3, 2007


Hey, maybe women don't want no-strings-attached sex with him because he comes across as kinda a selfish jerk? Wouldn't that be the simpler explanation?

I dunno if it's the simpler explanation or not. However, if you doubt his account, it's fairly simple to do a small empirical experiment to test his thesis.

My strong suspicion, if you're honest, is that you'd get the same results as he did.


Doing some statistics on internet dating sites at least verifies the notion that many more men want no strings attached sex than women for the internet dating crowd. Also of note from my locale, a disproportionately larger percentage of men looking to find a mate or a relationship are atheist/agnostic compared to women.

So, if there's disparity between what women 'want' and what men 'want', which should really be encouraged? Should men be chastised for wanting only sex and lying to get it? Or should women be chastised for rewarding liars more than honest men?
posted by kigpig at 5:27 PM on August 3, 2007


No lie: dude's Ferris Bueller blog entry is worth a read.

And props to davejay for quoting Too Much Joy!
posted by kimota at 5:29 PM on August 3, 2007


the subset of women that have no-strings attached sex is exactly the same as the subset of men that have no-strings attached sex

This is not necessarily true. Whether it is Casanova having his way with multitudes of women, or Debbie doing Dallas, there isn't necessarily a 1:1 correspondence.

And I think the preponderance of the evidence shows that the much smaller set of women into NSA encounters generally have their calendars fully booked. I had a roommate who fit this description. She was pretty busy but still turned down an order of magnitude more men than she hooked up with.
posted by bashos_frog at 5:29 PM on August 3, 2007


the subset of women that have no-strings attached sex is exactly the same as the subset of men that have no-strings attached sex

This is not necessarily true.


Of course not. All men are liars.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:34 PM on August 3, 2007


When my love swears that she is made of truth,
I do believe her, though I know she lies
Lest she think me some untutored youth
Unlearned in the world's false subtleties.
-Shakespeare

Everyone lies
-Gregory House

The worst aspect of this (not the thread, which has given rise to some great discussion, but the posts the thread is based on), is that this guy was getting an amazing amount of hits for what is not new, insightful or particularly well-written.
posted by misha at 5:36 PM on August 3, 2007 [1 favorite]


"is that this guy was getting an amazing amount of hits for what is not new, insightful or particularly well-written."

Welcome to the Internet! I see you've not been here long!
posted by klangklangston at 5:40 PM on August 3, 2007


Well, Mark Twain did say "A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is still putting on its shoes", of course he was a man and therefore this is probably not true.
posted by quin at 5:41 PM on August 3, 2007


Yah, a link to 16horsepower!
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 5:51 PM on August 3, 2007


This is not necessarily true. Whether it is Casanova having his way with multitudes of women, or Debbie doing Dallas, there isn't necessarily a 1:1 correspondence.

And as was the point of his article, through lying one party with the intention of NSA sex can get what they want with another for whom it isn't NSA.
posted by kigpig at 5:52 PM on August 3, 2007


I'm a thief, I'm a liar
There's my church, I sing in the choir (yes, even Pearl Jam)
posted by anthill at 5:53 PM on August 3, 2007


Some of his more interesting blogs include:

Shagging Paris

Fathers: Best mate or dead weight?

High Heels: what are they good for?

Make up and the veil: Same difference?

Childfree not childless: Why kids are a luxury.

Bitches, Hos and your daughter

True, he's not coming up with anything groundbreaking or that hasn't been hashed and reshashed before but he's opening up these ideas to a more mainstream audience, which is something.
posted by liquorice at 5:55 PM on August 3, 2007


However, the subset of women that have no-strings attached sex is exactly the same as the subset of men that have no-strings attached sex.

As has been pointed out, this is not true. Sexual activity is far more 'democratically' distributed among women. When a woman wants casual sex (which is far less often than men, on average), she gets it, barring some kind of unusual condition. With guys, there are a few men who get a ton of action, while the rest of us experience constant low-level (or not so low-level) frustration.

In my experience, women have as hard a time understanding men's true feelings about sex as we have understanding the woman's perspective. This is ironic, since it is spoken about all the time, but there is a relatability-gap here. I find even the most sexually advanced women can't help but occasionally be naive about male desire, and its indiscriminate nature. Likewise, it's hard for me to wrap my head around the female experience. As I get older, I think I'm getting a better handle on it, but then when I read about women getting all in a huff about some guy seeing a prostitute, I realize that I still have a ways to go.
posted by Edgewise at 6:00 PM on August 3, 2007


Oh man that is fucking weird anthill, I not a fan of Pearl Jam (they do, maybe, two songs I like), and one of them you just quoted. But what's strange is that I haven't even thought of that song in years before today, and two hours ago I looked up the lyrics.

Plate of beans shrimp!

posted by quin at 6:01 PM on August 3, 2007


quin: awesome. video.
posted by anthill at 6:13 PM on August 3, 2007


Some of his more interesting blogs include:

And by "blogs" I take it you mean "posts"?
posted by Hildegarde at 6:15 PM on August 3, 2007


Blogs, posts, comments, fpp's, blah fucking blah.
posted by liquorice at 6:19 PM on August 3, 2007 [1 favorite]


I don't think he is that much of a jerk, as some have said, actually. He mainly comes across as pretty frustrated by the dating scene, and I definitely know a few "unattached" guys in their 30s who have had the same idea and reasoning. One or two of them went ahead with it, and had pretty much the same sad experience.

It really just seems to me that he has the same problem as my friends. He is dead sure that he will know almost instantly if someone is worth pursuing (in the article he calls it "a gift"), and that girls like that only come along every two years or so. Well, that's BS in my opinion. Either his expectations are way too high and he is looking for "the perfect woman" - something that is doomed to fail - or he isn't trying hard enough to be open minded about who would make a good partner. Two hours? Please, you barely know their name and surface story by then.

I wasn't upset with the article, as some people apparently were for whatever strange reason. I just thought it was annoying that this was the flawed reasoning behind the whole thing.
posted by gemmy at 6:34 PM on August 3, 2007


Do you remember Rick Astley
He had a big fat hit
It was ghastly
He said "I'm never gonna give you up
Or let you down
Well I'm here to tell that Dick's a clown

posted by maryh at 6:47 PM on August 3, 2007


However, the subset of women that have no-strings attached sex is exactly the same as the subset of men that have no-strings attached sex.

As has been pointed out, this is not true.


Sigh. Okay - for the record, the comment "the subset of women that have no-strings attached sex is exactly the same as the subset of men that have no-strings attached sex" was never intended to be taken at face value. I pulled it painfully out of my ass to jokingly bring us back full circle to Sam de Brito's point that there are tons of women out there who think they are having strings-attached sex who are in fact having no-strings attached sex because they are having sex with liars.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 6:47 PM on August 3, 2007


I once had a brief no-strings-attached sexual relationship with a woman who wanted it that way and made it unambiguous. She said that she had a hard time finding partners, because when she met someone and had no-strings-attached sex with him, before too long he'd decide he wanted something more.

Anecdotal, sure, but in all my experience there's something more subtle than "guys want sex girls want love DURR" going on.
posted by L. Fitzgerald Sjoberg at 6:56 PM on August 3, 2007 [3 favorites]


Didn't anybody ever tell you not to bring a personal anecdote to a sweeping generalities fight, Lore?
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 7:03 PM on August 3, 2007 [2 favorites]


I think some women do want NSA sex, and possibly as many as men, just as Lore said, but they are much more conditioned to feel guilty about those instincts and repress them than men are.

Also, men can be very possessive of women once a relationship turns sexual, so I can understand why Lore's woman-friend (for lack of a better word) might have felt that a little NSA sex was a relief.
posted by misha at 8:37 PM on August 3, 2007 [1 favorite]


You know what I'd like? If we could, just for a moment, stop trading in the hackneyed gender-relations clichés of stand-up comics, and stop proclaiming what men and women want as a whole.
posted by klangklangston at 8:58 PM on August 3, 2007


Men like Sarah Silverman . Women like Dane Cook.

*ducks*

Labradors like ducks.

*covers*
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 9:03 PM on August 3, 2007


But, yeah.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 9:05 PM on August 3, 2007


No, no, it's just Cretans. This man must be a Cretan.

perhaps from the Isle of Crete? Because it is the word "cretin" that means profoundly brain deprived.
posted by longsleeves at 9:11 PM on August 3, 2007


Uh, longsleeves, they were referring to the Epimenides paradox. Epimenides, the Cretan, said "all Cretans are liars."
posted by Justinian at 9:25 PM on August 3, 2007


What I don't get is how this guy (and so many others) needs to be having regular sex as some sort of masculine validation. It's like he's afraid his dick will cease to exist if he's not sticking it into something.

If prostitutes will keep me from having to deal with him I'm all for it.
posted by Violet Hour at 9:28 PM on August 3, 2007


"Listen very carefully.

I. am. lying."


tkchrist, you win. Belly laugh from me. Can you say it with a charming twinkle in the eye and a jaunty twirl of the handlebar 'stache? :)
posted by zoogleplex at 10:17 PM on August 3, 2007


I stand corrected.
posted by longsleeves at 11:15 PM on August 3, 2007


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bg-BiWZMXPA
posted by celerystick at 12:03 AM on August 4, 2007


all men are liars
posted by celerystick at 12:04 AM on August 4, 2007


I stand corrected.
Orthopaedic shoes are a medical marvel! :p
posted by Abiezer at 12:55 AM on August 4, 2007


"I would lie to a woman only out of pity. The woman, on the other hand, lies out of the falseness of her heart."
posted by Shakeer at 1:18 AM on August 4, 2007


I, uh, don't think he wants to have sex as "masculine validation." You're ascribing additional motives to one of the most basic of instincts. A great deal of men don't need a reason to have sex. When I have a cheeseburger, it's not to assert my carnivore dominance over the herbivore, it's because a cheeseburger is satisfying in and of itself. I'm not exercising my privilege as a capitalist. It's not a social display. It's cheeseburger ... nummy. In a similar manner, this guy wants to have it off with someone easy on the eyes, and then go home. Yes, I agree that the quick cheeseburger is nowhere near as transcendent as a fancy meal out with good company and sparkling conversation. Sometimes that's not so easily arranged and, in the meantime, a cheeseburger will do nicely.

I'm not a pariticularly randy person, and I doubt I'd ever visit a prostitute, seeing as how I've yet to even attend a strip club, but if he wants to, what on earth is the point of sneering at the guy?

If you're interested in looking for additional motives to people's behavior, I suggest you look into the people who feel the need to insult this guy or who are desperate to tell you about the evils of prostitution and pornography; you will find a rich lode there to mine.
posted by adipocere at 2:28 AM on August 4, 2007 [2 favorites]


"Did you f--- that bitch in the arse?"

Ugly words for some, but many guys reading this are probably chuckling or at least have heard similar a million times before from their mates.


Really? This is what you guys talk about behind our backs? Because I can honestly say never once in my life has any of my girl friends asked me if my boyfriend has fucked me in the ass.

And color me dense, but I'm not getting this:

Misandry by chauvinist pigettes.
After sixty years of feminsm women are still so insecure thay need to wallow in and celebrate their rampant sexism.


Where is the misandry? This is a guy writing the stuff posted, right?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 8:07 AM on August 4, 2007


“Human kind cannot bear very much reality.”
posted by The Card Cheat at 8:52 AM on August 4, 2007


I've wavered for several hours trying to decide whether to post in this topic because so much of this discussion is personally repugnant to me. But here goes anyway.

First, I think a distinction needs to be made between NSA sex and one-night stands. ONSs are a subset of NSAs that some might object to without necessary objecting to the overall "no-strings" concept. Some might not want to take the increased health and safety risk inherent to random sex with strangers, or the risk of extended morning-after issues with people who aren't strangers and that you may have to continue to have contact with.

I think there are plenty of women who don't object to NSAs as long as both parties have a clear and mutual understanding that that is what the situation is and that is what they both want and prefer. However, I also think, again largely because of the health risk, many women might not want to have NSAs with multiple people at the same time, or with people who are having NSAs with multiple people at the same time. Getting involved with those kind of women apparently feels to AMAL Guy like a "relationship" or some kind of exclusive albeit temporary commitment, and unless the woman meets his ridiculously lofty standards, he's not interested. Or he wants to be able to lie about his intentions, still get the NSA, and have the woman just go along with being used and lied to. Few people, men or women, probably want to be treated like that and can accept it without eventually displaying objection.

My read on this fellow is that he really doesn't like women and he's found a convenient way to get his base needs met without the usual "dating" pretense. He could find women who also prefer NSAs, they just might not meet his in-the-realm-of-fantasy standards. And the ones that would meet his standards probably know their value and don't want or need to settle for the likes of him. He's chosen an interesting way of trying to get what he wants, or at least the momentary appearance of what he wants. I imagine if he were to be stricken blind, all this nonsense would go flying out the window. Maybe AMAL Guy needs to stop lying to himself.

And finally, I have no problem with prostitution as long as it really is between mutually consenting adults and no kind of coersion or violence is involved (read "pimp"). The problem with this guy is that he seems to be saying, "See, women, look what you make me do."
posted by fuse theorem at 9:38 AM on August 4, 2007


I'm good for fifty bucks.

How much are you bad for?
posted by kirkaracha at 9:41 AM on August 4, 2007


Nods to all of the great song lyrics, Shakespeare excerpts and all, but our winning lyrics go to James Todd Smith III, aka LL Cool J, with a def(t) assist from Russell Simmons:

That's A Lie

[Russell Simmons]
Yo man, I got this def Rolex watch, man
$100'000 watch, man
I sell it to you for 400
- You got 80?
Dig - dig this, man
I got a rich, rich, rich, rich girl, man...

[ L.L. Cool J ]
I'm sick and tired of the stories that you always tell
Shakespeare couldn't tell a story that well
See, you're the largest liar that was ever created
You and Pinocchio are brotherly related
Full of criss-crossed fits, you lie all the time
Your tongue should be embarrassed, you're a treath to mankind
That's a lie

[ Simmons ]
You know what my records is about, man
You know how much money we get, man
Come on
(You're a liar)
Me and my man Rick got millions of gold albums
(That's a lie)
I'm gettin cold money every day
(You're a liar)
You'll need a wheel barrow for all that shit in my office

[ Cool J ]
You lied about the lies that you lied about
You even lied to your aunt when you went down south
You lied, and a body builder kicked your butt
If you was in Egypt you'd lie to King Tut
You claim to do things no one could achieve
You said you did things Ripley's wouldn't believe
That's a lie

[Simmons ]
I got this Japanese girl, man
Lee, man, takes good care of me
(You're a liar)
Yo, she's so def, man
Wipes my butt
(That's a lie)
Everybody be beefin, man, about what Rush doin
(You're a liar)
You seen my new Mercedes, man?

[Cool J ]
Giant Jabber-Jaw, biggest liar I ever saw
You said you got a mansion, you don't got half a floor
Professor of Super Lies, you can lecture at my school
You said you liked Felix Unger, sat down at the dinner table and drooled
Your story's so remarkable, it shouldn't be revealed
You said you had a Benz, you don't got four wheels
That's a lie

[Simmons ]
I got a Maserati, man, what are you talkin 'bout?
(You're a liar)
I traded my 1988 Mercedes for it
(That's a lie)
Man, don't front, you know what Rush is about, man
(You're a liar)
Yo, why you be illin, man?
You know what time - what time it is

[Cool J ]
Then you start to lie about things you don't have
You speak of limousines? You can't afford a cab
Said you slapped Rowdy Piper and didn't get a hassle
You promised your girl filet mignon, took her to White Castle
You said you have a lot of women, you don't even know a few
'There are 8 million stories' - and they're all made up by you
That's a lie

[Simmons ]
...Rush, man
Gives you the biggest medaillon you ever saw
(You're a liar)
It's gon' keep the bullets off your back
(That's a lie)
You know why stations play our records?
Cause the kids'll tear the station apart
Kids'll rip it down...

[Cool J ]
Said your grandmother's 20 when your mother's 25
Said your father beat Joe Lewis, but homebody took a dive
You said you used tootpaste, your teeth are yellow like my gold
A brand new pair of Lee's, that's the skirt your sister stole
That's a lie

[Simmons ]
Yo man
All the girls everywhere talkin about Rush
(You're a liar)
Word man, Pretty Tony knocked a hoe down the other day
(That's a lie)
Talkin so much about 'Rush, Rush,' every time
(You're liar)
That hoes just be beefin, man
'Rush this and Rush that'
(That's a lie)
World's biggest thing, man
Rush is gettin all the money, man
(You're liar)
...wheel barrow full of money, ya understand me?
(That's a lie)
That they be rollin that shit in my office all day
(You're a liar)
Nothin but money, and it be green
(That's a lie)
Don't front, man, you know what Rush is about, man
Rush gets money, man
(You're liar)
My Maserati is bad, man, it's blue and green - and gold
(That's a lie)
I just bought this hoe this milllion dollar ring, man
(You're a liar)
I just wanna look good, man
So I got one
(That's a lie)
Like that, we be cold gettin money at Rush, man
Jewels be them thangs
(You're a liar)
Rings and things, man, all that type of stuff
(That's a lie)
Man, I got 900 pairs of Reeboks, man
...pair of...Adidas
(You're a liar)
I got every color of Adiddas they ever made, man
(That's a lie)
My man Steve, that's a porno star, man
And he be bringin them hoes to the house
(You're a liar)
Word man, they be over my house
(That's a lie)
Yo, that girl at my house, man
...Lee, man
She cleans up behind me, man
(You're a liar)
Yo, she cleans up behind me, does everything I say, man
(That's a lie)
Yo man, sweet little Japanese thing, man
Takin care of me, man
(You're a l-)
Yo, man...
(That's a lie)
posted by beelzbubba at 10:05 AM on August 4, 2007


What a loser. Though I must admit, there's something just a little bit charming about the set of men who all believe women are these naieve, delicate flowers whose feelings must never be hurt and honor never violated. The failure to distinguish between Hollywood and real life is perhaps the new Romanticism. Hopefully it will only last as long as the old one.
posted by nixerman at 10:35 AM on August 4, 2007


I, uh, don't think he wants to have sex as "masculine validation." You're ascribing additional motives to one of the most basic of instincts. A great deal of men don't need a reason to have sex [....] this guy wants to have it off with someone easy on the eyes, and then go home.

Except that he doesn't. He says he wants a romantic relationship, he just doesn't want to be celibate while he's finding the right person:

"Call it a gift, but I can tell within about two hours whether I could fall for a girl. Through weary experience, I estimate she comes along about every two years - and wears cool shoes.

That leaves a lot of time between drinks and 24-month bouts of celibacy don't really appeal to me while I have a full head of hair and abdominals."


At which point I want to say, jeez man, what's so hard about just jerking off? Why do you need some other person, whom you don't even really want, to dump your sexuality on? And the reference to "full head of hair and abdominals" implies that he needs women to find him attractive--that's where the validation part comes in. If it were really just about sex it wouldn't have anything to do with what he looks like. The whole point of sex workers is that it doesn't matter a whit whether they find you attractive or not.
posted by Violet Hour at 11:26 AM on August 4, 2007


Violet: Masturbation and sex with a partner are not the same thing. At all. Not even close.
posted by Justinian at 11:34 AM on August 4, 2007


It was difficult to determine whether the shoe comment was glib or part of an actual set of absurd expectations for attraction that this guy has. But is anyone here really going to make the claim that we control what we are attracted to (be careful of the path this logic leads down)?

In the meantime he's still capable of enjoying sexual experiences with people he's not attracted to, though the end of the article makes it clear he's torn about the whole process. He doesn't seem to enjoy visiting sex workers much but at the same time seems to despise lying more. It seems his ideal scenario is being able to be forthright that he's just interested in the sexual experience at that point.

So presume for a moment that he is fairly non-discriminatory in his dating habits but just not finding people with his interests and that he finds attractive very often. It's possible this is not true but certainly there are men for whom it is true for. In the meantime, he still both wants to and therefore is willing to have sexual encounters. He can choose to lie and pretend to love (or substitute various other power games) to get it, or he can defect from the game. He chose to defect and go to sex workers. Meanwhile the men who do not have a problem with lying will continue to play the game thus rewarding charlatans.

Are those who chastise him really convinced this is not a real problem and western culture is sexually healthy where people can have a reasonable amount of sexual satisfaction without sacrificing their mores? Or do you believe that sex without love is inherently wrong? Or do you prefer a culture that rewards liars and sycophants?
posted by kigpig at 12:29 PM on August 4, 2007


Violet Hour, you've almost got it. He wants a romantic relationship ... yes. He can't seem to find it easily ... yes. So he's settling for something not quite as wonderful, but still something he wants: sex.

It's exactly my cheeseburger scenario. It's tough to arrange a fancy restaurant meal with sparkling conversation, but while he's waiting for the right thing to come along, he'd like a cheeseburger. To further illuminate, jerking off would be the Ritz cracker. You can get by on Ritz crackers for a long time, but sometimes you still want a cheeseburger. You might as well be saying, "Look, you, it's nothing but Ritz crackers until you find the perfect restaurant, once every two years."

The reference to his looks says "I'm not a complete troll, so it isn't like this should be that hard." It's not a cry for validation, sorry. Besides, you don't get to shift up like that - your original point was that, for him, having sex was validation. Now you're trying to move it to looks. It has nothing to do with validation. The whole blah blah men blah blah sex blah blah insecurity thing has been beaten to death. There's no deeper agenda to be analyzed: sex is the goal, he doesn't want to lie to get it.
posted by adipocere at 12:40 PM on August 4, 2007


I like the implication that every two years, he finds a women, falls madly in love with her, and she dumps him.
posted by L. Fitzgerald Sjoberg at 4:58 PM on August 4, 2007


misandry articles can be written by guys also. Just like anti-feminist articles can be written by a woman. But wow, lots of articles hitting both genders on that site....
posted by IronWolve at 9:04 PM on August 4, 2007


You might as well be saying, "Look, you, it's nothing but Ritz crackers until you find the perfect restaurant, once every two years."

Heh. No, that's not what I'm saying. I don't have any moral qualms against prostitution or pretty much anything with consenting adults. It's just that, if he doesn't need *something* other than sex from these women I (really truly) don't see how it's somehow "better" than masturbation. Your hierarchy of foods makes no sense to me. (Also, while I understand it's convenient to compare sex and food, I don't really think it works: if you believe Maslow, sex is farther up the pyramid.) The article makes it clear he's not really enjoying NSA sex or sex with prostitutes--it's like he's doing it to prove a point.

My only problem with him is that he seems to be blaming women for his situation, which is pretty baffling. It's not his fault he's not genuinely interested in more women, but it's not anyone else's fault either.
posted by Violet Hour at 10:22 PM on August 4, 2007


Are you pretending not to get it? I almost hope you are, because, otherwise, well ... you're missing out on a big spectrum of life. If you genuinely do not understand that most people prefer to have an occasional cheeseburger rather than only Ritz crackers, and if you also honestly don't get that some men would select no-strings-attached sex over masturbation, then I cannot help you, and, moreover, you have absolutely no business commenting on this guy's choices. You'd be the very image of Helen Keller as a film critic.

Also, you've now shifted strategems again. Validation, validation, now it's that he's blaming. Seriously, if you want to look for hidden agendas, it seems like you need to go no further than a mirror, as new motives of yours surface at each response.
posted by adipocere at 11:09 PM on August 4, 2007


Chill, dude. Maybe go eat something, since you seem to be into that. Sex isn't food.
posted by Violet Hour at 5:42 AM on August 5, 2007


Helen Keller as a film critic

Brillo!
posted by five fresh fish at 9:29 AM on August 5, 2007


Chill, dude. Maybe go eat something, since you seem to be into that. Sex isn't food.
Oh come on, though. Are you really saying you can't see why someone who can only eat Ritz Crackers for two years would prefer a cheeseburger now and then? Sex isn't food, but the analogy isn't bad.
posted by bonaldi at 9:47 AM on August 5, 2007


Yes we are. We are proud too. (see that? it is a lie!).
posted by lslutsky at 2:48 PM on August 5, 2007


Some of his more interesting blogs include:

And by "blogs" I take it you mean "posts"?
posted by Hildegarde at 12:15 PM on August 4 [+] [!]

Blogs, posts, comments, fpp's, blah fucking blah.
posted by liquorice at 12:19 PM on August 4 [1 favorite +] [!]


Unimportant, but the community revolving around the SMH blogs has developed its own idiosyncratic definitions. It's as if a whole bunch of people otherwise unaware of the blogosphere has wandered into these things just because they hang off the city's flagship newspaper. Commenters regularly refer to themselves & each other as "bloggers", for example, and it's not unlikely that what we call a post is actually referred to as a "blog".
posted by UbuRoivas at 4:56 PM on August 5, 2007


Sex isn't food.

What, never had a spit-roast?
posted by UbuRoivas at 5:07 PM on August 5, 2007


Chill, dude. Maybe go eat something, since you seem to be into that. Sex isn't food.

For christ's sake, it's a metaphor. Are you being purposefully dense?
posted by jckll at 9:05 AM on August 7, 2007


Sounds like s/he can't accept that meaningless sex is any better (or even any different) than masturbation -- and universally so -- and is really attached to that idea.

Fucking your own hand vs. fucking another person. Yeah, that's not *quite* the same thing there...

The metaphor is fine.
posted by LordSludge at 9:30 AM on August 7, 2007


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