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Fascists in color
March 5, 2010 12:22 PM   Subscribe

Nazi's propaganda. My Granddad once told me that I didn't understand Nazi's, because the black and white film always made it look unreal. He said if the films were color, I'd see.
posted by Mblue (74 comments total) 9 users marked this as a favorite

 
huh
posted by Babblesort at 12:29 PM on March 5, 2010


Is this odd? All nations engage in propaganda, particularly in times of war, and it's always unsettling, viewed from a distance. I think I must be missing something.
posted by tigrefacile at 12:34 PM on March 5, 2010


I really enjoyed watching the first video although the YouTube comments are pretty fucking awful. I know, what else is new? However, lauding Hitler is not my favorite thing in the world.
posted by josher71 at 12:38 PM on March 5, 2010


The music (O Fortuna) is way over the top for that first one. Yeah, okay, it's Nazis. Evil Nazis. Got it. Thanks. Yeah, I know. Nazis, dude.
posted by echo target at 12:39 PM on March 5, 2010 [5 favorites]


I just spent two weeks watching the Olympics, so I've seen about enough colorful fascistic pageantry I can handle for a while, thanks.
posted by briank at 12:43 PM on March 5, 2010 [14 favorites]


I'm guessing the fascist's didn't choose the corny horror movie music in the first video.
posted by dunkadunc at 12:44 PM on March 5, 2010


You know who else liked O Fortuna?
posted by SouthCNorthNY at 12:45 PM on March 5, 2010 [2 favorites]


I understand the Nazis now.
posted by i_have_a_computer at 12:45 PM on March 5, 2010 [2 favorites]


In color it all looks so.... goofy to me. A bunch of middle-aged men dressing up in fancy and ill-fitting costumes and pretending to be badass.

In the early days, not many people outside of Germany took the Nazis seriously [1], even when they attained power. This is a pretty good illustration of why.

[1] There's a picture of my dad at five years of age in the prewar thirties, standing on the front doorstep of his Philly tenement in short pants with a shoe polish toothbrush moustache, crosseyed and sieg-heiling. Hitler was widely mocked and derided long before he was perceived as a threat
posted by xthlc at 12:47 PM on March 5, 2010 [5 favorites]


Nazi's: Fascist's, or Grocer's?
posted by rusty at 12:47 PM on March 5, 2010 [16 favorites]


Honestly, I'm shocked how much trouble I have accepting that the past happened in color. Really. The best I can manage in my mind is a sort of very low-intensity color, like a snapshot from 1970 that's been out in the sun.
posted by COBRA! at 12:48 PM on March 5, 2010 [18 favorites]


Apostrophe Nazi's are the worst kind
posted by rocket88 at 12:49 PM on March 5, 2010 [10 favorites]


"First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win lose*.
*sometimes
posted by echo target at 12:50 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


I understand the grocer's apostrophe now.
posted by fixedgear at 12:52 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


You're right. Before I'd only seen them in b&w and considered them maniacal thugs, representative of all that is wrong with humanity, but now that I've seen them in colour I'm sort of itching for Lebensraum. Funny isn't it?
posted by ob at 12:56 PM on March 5, 2010


This video is not available in your country due to terms of use violation.

Hmmm, irgendwie komisch.
posted by chillmost at 1:01 PM on March 5, 2010 [3 favorites]


I wasn't expecting this kind of response, but thanks all for correcting my apostrophe use, 'specially rocketeights'
posted by Mblue at 1:06 PM on March 5, 2010


Seeing this in color makes me think that the Nazis were just misunderstood
posted by republican at 1:08 PM on March 5, 2010


The videos could have used a little more Ark of the Covenant and Nazi face melting. And lose the Harry Potter trailer music.
In summary : People who post comments on Youtube like Hitler.
posted by Liquidwolf at 1:10 PM on March 5, 2010 [2 favorites]


Seeing this in color makes me think that the Nazis were just misunderstood
posted by republican


OK, now I'm starting to think that this thread might be performance art of some sort...
posted by ob at 1:10 PM on March 5, 2010 [2 favorites]


>: Nazi's: Fascist's, or Grocer's?

fyi my ' was ironic.
posted by dunkadunc at 1:11 PM on March 5, 2010


Also, I never realized Hitler's car was flourescent green. Makes you think.
posted by Liquidwolf at 1:11 PM on March 5, 2010


xthlc: "In color it all looks so.... goofy to me. A bunch of middle-aged men dressing up in fancy and ill-fitting costumes and pretending to be badass. "

Hey, those were fancy and ill-fitting Hugo Boss costumes.
posted by mullingitover at 1:13 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


In color it all looks so.... goofy
posted by CynicalKnight at 1:16 PM on March 5, 2010 [2 favorites]


is this thread where we invent the reverse-Godwin?
posted by ob at 1:18 PM on March 5, 2010 [2 favorites]


Those up-skirt shots in the second clip certainly show what they were fighting for. A "fine vintage" indeed.
posted by irisclara at 1:21 PM on March 5, 2010


What? Can you see vagina's?
posted by Mister_A at 1:22 PM on March 5, 2010 [6 favorites]


>: The music (O Fortuna) is way over the top for that first one. Yeah, okay, it's Nazis. Evil Nazis. Got it. Thanks. Yeah, I know. Nazis, dude.

Well, I think it's because everyone already knows that Nazis were the evilest of the evil and the baddest of the bad- they've been stock villains for pretty much ever. Given this, showing them in any context without effectively waving a big sign under them going HEY LOOK, EVIL NAZIS! DID I MENTION THEY'RE EVIL counts for a lot of people as going too soft on them- someone might even worry they'd be thought a nazi sympathizer for failing to do so.
And, really, I think that's what's so scary about the idea of Nazis in the first place- that we could become like that. Hence the scary music, as a hedge against people thinking you like Nazis.
posted by dunkadunc at 1:27 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


How was that first video made? Did they have color film stock? Was it colorized? I know those pre-color photos from WWI were done with a three plate process, but I don't see how you could do that with moving images.
posted by invitapriore at 1:29 PM on March 5, 2010


Your granddad had a point. You see the color stuff and it seems much more like "yeah, these were just ordinary, modern people, not characters out of an old monster movie. That's the monstrous part."
posted by edheil at 1:30 PM on March 5, 2010 [12 favorites]



Those up-skirt shots in the second clip certainly show what they were fighting for. A "fine vintage" indeed.

The point, as put, is age old /b/. Just verbs and apps (!) .
posted by Mblue at 1:31 PM on March 5, 2010


All I know is that skinny dudes with weak chins in Fascist Military uniforms end up looking pretty snappy. Most of the Nazi commanders would have looked like Herbert Kornfield in civvies.
posted by GuyZero at 1:32 PM on March 5, 2010


>: How was that first video made? Did they have color film stock? Was it colorized? I know those pre-color photos from WWI were done with a three plate process, but I don't see how you could do that with moving images.

1939? they had color film back then- Wizard of Oz came out in Technicolor that year. It was just really expensive.
posted by dunkadunc at 1:32 PM on March 5, 2010


Hence the scary music, as a hedge against people thinking you like Nazis.

That music could provide context in either direction, depending on your views on Nazi's.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 1:37 PM on March 5, 2010 [2 favorites]


Metafilter: My apostrophe was ironic.
posted by rusty at 1:38 PM on March 5, 2010 [7 favorites]


Well, at least we can rest comfortably in the knowledge that the Third Reich met its fiery fate soon thereafter, its leaders assassinated en masse in a movie theatre by a ragtag troupe of Nazi-scalp-collecting Jewish-American suicide bombers, right?

Right?
posted by Sys Rq at 1:38 PM on March 5, 2010 [4 favorites]


How did the Nazi's feel about bean's I wonder.
posted by Mister_A at 1:39 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


How did the Nazi's feel about bean's I wonder.

Bean's? It's their stance on tater's that I'm more worried about.
posted by ob at 1:44 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


Honestly, I'm shocked how much trouble I have accepting that the past happened in color.

I'm the same way, but only for the period lasting from about 1850 through the end of WWII. Everything before that was definitely in color. (I mean, you don't really imagine the Renaissance or biblical times in black-and-white, do you?)
posted by Atom Eyes at 1:46 PM on March 5, 2010 [6 favorites]


For the technicals: Three-strip Technicolor, first used (exclusively) in 1932 by another prominent antisemite, one Walt Disney.
posted by Sys Rq at 1:46 PM on March 5, 2010


Well, at least we can rest comfortably in the knowledge that the Third Reich met its fiery fate soon thereafter, its leaders assassinated en masse in a movie theatre by a ragtag troupe of Nazi-scalp-collecting Jewish-American suicide bombers, right?

Right?


Only the ones who didn't get courted by the US and set up here with high paying govt jobs. Justice.
posted by Liquidwolf at 1:47 PM on March 5, 2010


You didn't understand the Nazi's what? Language? Art?
posted by Justinian at 1:52 PM on March 5, 2010


There is plenty of color footage from the WWII era, including in germany.

How was that first video made? Did they have color film stock?

Yes, they had color film stock.

I know those pre-color photos from WWI were done with a three plate process, but I don't see how you could do that with moving images.

WWI, not WWII. And actually, they had color photos in WWI as well. The Autochrome process was invented in 1903 and was on the general market in '1907. Kodachrome motion picture film came out in 1935. Here's more on the history


Also, check out the comments on youtube.
posted by delmoi at 1:54 PM on March 5, 2010


You know who else loved O Fortuna? Remixers.

You know who didn't love remixers all that much? Carl Orff's estate.
posted by quin at 1:59 PM on March 5, 2010



Also, check out the comments on youtube.


Like I said earlier. "In summary : People who post comments on Youtube like Hitler."
posted by Liquidwolf at 2:00 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


I thought color was invented in the 1970s when a scientist nearly blew up the sun.
posted by blue_beetle at 2:01 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


echo target: “The music (O Fortuna) is way over the top for that first one. Yeah, okay, it's Nazis. Evil Nazis. Got it. Thanks. Yeah, I know. Nazis, dude.”

SouthCNorthNY: “You know who else liked O Fortuna?”

dunkadunc: “Well, I think it's because everyone already knows that Nazis were the evilest of the evil and the baddest of the bad- they've been stock villains for pretty much ever. Given this, showing them in any context without effectively waving a big sign under them going HEY LOOK, EVIL NAZIS! DID I MENTION THEY'RE EVIL counts for a lot of people as going too soft on them- someone might even worry they'd be thought a nazi sympathizer for failing to do so. ¶ And, really, I think that's what's so scary about the idea of Nazis in the first place- that we could become like that. Hence the scary music, as a hedge against people thinking you like Nazis.”

Well, it's funny, because Carmina Burana was indeed hugely popular amongst the Nazis, as SouthCNorthNY already (obliquely) pointed out. But given the fact that roughly 85% of the videos on Youtube seem to be required to have "O Fortuna" as their soundtrack, I have a feeling that it was just included here for the purposes dunkadunc describes - to show that the poster does indeed believe these Nazis are evil. So I'll bet that it's just coincidence that we see images of these guys with a soundtrack of some of their favorite music. Kinda weird, eh?
posted by koeselitz at 2:09 PM on March 5, 2010


Also, as a sidenote, I despise "O Fortuna" with the ire and fury of a billion dying suns, and hate all of Carmina Burana just as much. Utter tripe, playing to the self-indulgence of masses of conflict- and drama-addicted goose-steppers. No wonder it's so popular now.
posted by koeselitz at 2:12 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


Black & white is still pretty useful for understanding how to kill Nazis.
posted by Pirate-Bartender-Zombie-Monkey at 2:21 PM on March 5, 2010 [2 favorites]


For the technicals: Three-strip Technicolor, first used (exclusively) in 1932 by another prominent antisemite, one Walt Disney.

Brings to mind Disney's Hitler's Children Education For Death* and the other propaganda productions (such as Donald Duck as a Nazi - 'Der Fuehrer's Face') he produced for the U.S. government during World War II.
posted by ericb at 2:23 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


republican: "Seeing this in color makes me think that the Nazis were just misunderstood"

Why am I now picturing Pink-Shirts???
posted by symbioid at 2:41 PM on March 5, 2010


This week's best youtube comment:

Cooleemee43 (1 week ago) +1 Reply
Love em or hate em, one thing you can't deny is that the Nazi's loved flags and parades.


Good point, thank's bro! :-/
posted by Potomac Avenue at 2:49 PM on March 5, 2010


All you ironic apostraphe-abusers are killing the English language, d'you realize that?
posted by BigLankyBastard at 2:57 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


I'ven't thought about 'postrophe abuse 'fore, but this thread sure had me pond'rin' the topic.
posted by symbioid at 3:08 PM on March 5, 2010 [3 favorites]


I'm reasonably sure I grokked the horrors of fascism and nazism, even when presented in monochrome.
posted by clvrmnky at 3:12 PM on March 5, 2010


O proper use of apostrophe, why art thou so elusive?
posted by Atom Eyes at 3:14 PM on March 5, 2010 [2 favorites]


You didn't understand the Nazi's what? Language? Art?

The people called Nazi's, they go, the house?
posted by anazgnos at 3:34 PM on March 5, 2010 [3 favorites]


This thread is a success if only because now I know why to hate Orff. Nazis and Youtube comment leavers, I knew why they sucked already.
posted by norm at 3:54 PM on March 5, 2010


Leben's Raum's: Eine Geschichte der feinkostlichen Apostrophen
Jetzt in Technicolor!

posted by Blazecock Pileon at 3:57 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


I took an undergrad History of German Film class many years ago. It was mostly filled with folks with no interest in cinema who were taking it as a "blow-off" class. After we watched Triumph of the Will, the class was unified (me excluded) in thinking that the German people must have been pretty thick to fall for Nazi symbolism and propaganda. The professor tried to explain what should have been obvious, about the Germans upbringing and the global situation, but no, the class was sure: they wouldn't have fallen for it.

"I wouldn't have been a Nazi" is a profoundly stupid thought.
posted by Bookhouse at 4:04 PM on March 5, 2010 [4 favorites]


It can't happen here.

No, wait. It can't happen here.

No, one more time. It Can't Happen Here.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 4:11 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


O Fortuna has a long and colorful association with, um, despots.
posted by condour75 at 4:46 PM on March 5, 2010


"Say what you want about the tenant of national socialism dude, at least its an ethos"
posted by jpdoane at 4:51 PM on March 5, 2010


And again from the top:

It can't happen here.

posted by koeselitz at 4:53 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


Say what you want about the tenant of national socialism dude, at least he pays the rent.
posted by koeselitz at 4:56 PM on March 5, 2010 [2 favorites]


The music (O Fortuna) is way over the top for that first one. Yeah, okay, it's Nazis. Evil Nazis. Got it. Thanks. Yeah, I know. Nazis, dude.

Hurley, is that you?
posted by bwg at 4:57 PM on March 5, 2010


It Happened Here
posted by Abiezer at 5:54 PM on March 5, 2010 [1 favorite]


People who post comments on Youtube like Hitler.

Whereas fruit flies like Mussolini.
posted by DU at 7:04 PM on March 5, 2010 [2 favorites]


I thought color was invented in the 1970s when a scientist nearly blew up the sun.

that was charles manson's mad scientist brother, casper - the beatles told him to do it, man
posted by pyramid termite at 8:39 PM on March 5, 2010


"I wouldn't have been a Nazi" is a profoundly stupid thought.

Agreed. I not only would have been an enthusiastic Nazi, and one who probably would have committed suicide after the war, but I actually kind of wish I had been. I mean, they probably still would have lost even with me, so it's not too terrible to say that, right?
posted by Xezlec at 11:22 PM on March 5, 2010


The professor tried to explain what should have been obvious, about the Germans upbringing and the global situation, but no, the class was sure: they wouldn't have fallen for it. Just like none of us fell for Gorge W Bush's Iraq war. BTW, know how Hitler tied his shoes? In little nazis.
posted by Daddy-O at 3:05 AM on March 6, 2010


i would have gone with 'what a wonderful world' :P or 'the wall'! but yea, colour does kinda take the edge off and gives it a different dimension... as do downfall parodies :P

cheers!
posted by kliuless at 8:32 AM on March 7, 2010


I think you have an astute granddad. The first clip is especially effective in conveying that these were real, contemporary(ish) people -- everything I'd seen before was either washed out color or jerky black and white. For me the, choice of music "worked", in that it conveyed that the civilians were robust, and the military was strong (this despite this big imprinting for O Fortuna).

I don't know quite what to make of the class's response to Triumph of the Will. Maybe they're just really dense; maybe it's the ubiquitous power of self-denial; maybe it's the detachment they have with events so long ago that they know few people who were touched by it - events so long ago that most of the images are B&W. (As an illustration of how strong and effective a piece of propaganda that film is/was, in the 1970s Jack Anderson reported that after seeing it, G. Gordon Liddy stood up and started speaking German).
posted by Tuesday After Lunch at 7:39 PM on March 7, 2010


ps. Anderson told this story to illustrate characteristics of G. Gordon Liddy, not of Triumph of the Will
posted by Tuesday After Lunch at 6:19 AM on March 8, 2010


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