Samoa? Had enough, thanks.

May 2, 2012 10:39 PM

Earl Sweatshirt is back. He was gone. He is in Odd Future. They have a Tumblr. Prev 1 2
posted by msalt (49 comments total)

swagnificent. his verse on "oldie" is awesome and... dare i say... outshines tyler's.

they're still really talented, past the shock stuff. i can still see tyler really coming into his own as a very successful producer.
posted by raihan_ at 10:48 PM on May 2, 2012 [1 favorite]

People actually still pay attention to these misogynists?
posted by koeselitz at 10:57 PM on May 2, 2012 [3 favorites]

Yes koeselitz, yes we do. And now I'm very excited to see where Earl Sweatshirt is going to be going; I hope that his darkness has only matured, not been lost.
posted by special agent conrad uno at 11:23 PM on May 2, 2012 [1 favorite]

"People actually still pay attention to these misogynists?"

Grampa???
posted by bardic at 11:30 PM on May 2, 2012 [3 favorites]

Gotta love the token white dude in the video raihan_ linked.
posted by bardic at 11:36 PM on May 2, 2012

odd future
kendrick lamar
big krit
asap rocky
death grips
lil b

hello internet rappers
posted by philllip at 11:39 PM on May 2, 2012

Private school in Samoa wins the Award for best made up reason to drop out of rap. Metafilter needs more Frank Ocean.
posted by Ad hominem at 11:50 PM on May 2, 2012 [1 favorite]

if you absolutely hate O.F., you may like kendrick lamar. honestly. great rapper, comparatively SFW. here's (arguably) his most popular track, ADHD.


and imo you can never have enough samoas. SO GOOD.
but i'm sure that someone will complain that i'm exploiting young women by purchasing from the girl scouts or something. sigh
posted by raihan_ at 12:00 AM on May 3, 2012

Mod note: Comment deleted. It's fine to talk about the post subject, positive or negative, but if your complaint is that post exists at all, that needs to go to Metatalk.
posted by taz (staff) at 12:00 AM on May 3, 2012

Unsurprisingly, you forgot the previously that casts your subjects in the correct light.
posted by You Should See the Other Guy at 12:04 AM on May 3, 2012 [3 favorites]

I just hope the outrage this thread inevitably causes won't keep the Memphis Grizzlies from continuing to play Yonkers on their PA system.
posted by acidic at 12:12 AM on May 3, 2012

Frank Ocean, Novacane smartest R&B lyrics since What's Going On.

Artists need to remain true to their own experience, even if it makes us uncomfortable. As for Tyler and Earl, nobody ever calls Bruce Springsteen a misogynist even though one of his most famous sounds, Fire, is about date rape. It is an artist's job, and responsibility, to explore the areas most won't. It doesn't matter if the artist is a young black man or well respected. I obviously don't approve of beating people, or as Bruce suggests raping women in a car, but I respect their prerogative to express themselves.
posted by Ad hominem at 12:23 AM on May 3, 2012 [8 favorites]

"People actually still pay attention to these misogynists?"

Grampa???

Are seriously dismissing a comment that questions sexism in music by suggesting that such a view is old fashioned or un-cool? Because, if so, that is really awful.
posted by sendai sleep master at 12:23 AM on May 3, 2012 [6 favorites]

nobody ever calls Bruce Springsteen a misogynist even though one of his most famous sounds, Fire, is about date rape

You seem to have forgot the part where the song is not pro-date rape. Anymore than this one is pro-stalking. Are you ignorant or disingenuous?

And, what sendai sleep master said. If all one needs to ignore misogyny and homophobia is a good beat...
posted by You Should See the Other Guy at 12:33 AM on May 3, 2012 [3 favorites]

You seem to have forgot the part where the song is not pro-date rape

I'm not so sure, sounds like Bruce is saying "her lips say no but she means yes" to me. There is no evidence in the song that it is some anti date rape manifesto.

Anyway, I accept that some works by Tyler, Earl, et. Al. Are misogynistic just as I accept that works by Bruce Springsteen, and most male artists, are misoginsitic. That does not discount them as works of art, and true artistic expressions. We can know, and accept, that works may be objectionalble, they are not guides to life and we can appreciate them as expressions of a person's experience even if it is fucked up.
posted by Ad hominem at 12:49 AM on May 3, 2012 [4 favorites]

From the NYT article:

As part of the Coral Reef curriculum he also performed community service, spending time working at Samoa Victim Support Group, a center for survivors of sexual abuse, including children.

“That was a pivotal moment,” he said one afternoon at Bristol Farms, a supermarket near his manager’s office. One of the things Earl Sweatshirt had been prized for as a rapper was his extreme imagery, bordering on vile. “You can detach imagery from words,” he said, adding that he “never actually pictured” the things he rapped about...By the time he began working at the center, “I had already come to the conclusion that I was done talking about” that sort of subject matter, he said, but coming face to face with young people who had suffered in that way was overwhelming. “There’s nothing that you can — there’s no — you can’t evade the — there’s no defense for like — if you have any ounce of humanity,” he said, the feeling swallowing the words.

Most of the Odd Future crew are kids. Brilliant, funny, fucked up kids who are finding their way in an incomprehensible culture at a very strange point in human history. They are simultaneously so hyped and reviled it's sort of impossible to see the clear picture. It's still worth watching.
posted by melissa may at 12:50 AM on May 3, 2012 [19 favorites]

"His mother sent him to Samoa"
Can't beat that with a stick.
posted by From Bklyn at 2:23 AM on May 3, 2012

"Hey man, where you been?"
"My mom sent me to Samoa."
"Damn, again?"
posted by From Bklyn at 2:25 AM on May 3, 2012 [2 favorites]

Funny how the misogyny tag (which I admit fully applies to OFWGKTA) never stuck to white acts like, say, the Beastie Boys (who actually managed to earn feminist cred themselves, oddly enough) or any number of 80's and 90's rock acts.

To deny that Tyler and co. aren't misogynist is about as stupid as to try and wholly dismiss them purely on the grounds of said misogyny.

And this is coming from someone who was quite the hater at first. And they're hardly my favorite current act, but I think they deserve some benefit of the doubt as they grow as musicians. Earl is a case in point.
posted by bardic at 2:55 AM on May 3, 2012 [1 favorite]

A quote from an earlier thread, almost exactly one year ago: I doubt any of us will still give a shit about OFWGKTA in 8 months.

And here we are.
posted by cilantro at 3:03 AM on May 3, 2012

It is important that the internet know that I reject the themes chosen by these artists as well as the manner of their expression.
posted by R. Schlock at 4:27 AM on May 3, 2012

Can we talk about Ana Tijoux instead? Because she is super-awesome. You may know her song "1977" from an episode of Breaking Bad. Her rapid-fire flow and thought-provoking lyrics make Tyler and his crew look like the roach-eating twats they are.
posted by pxe2000 at 4:59 AM on May 3, 2012 [2 favorites]

This new Frank Ocean track rules... Whip Appeal

My favorite dude from the crew is Domo Genesis, at least beat-wise. Domo Genesis feat Wiz - Ground Up

Anyone dig Young L, he's got some tight production?
posted by cloeburner at 5:06 AM on May 3, 2012 [1 favorite]

That quote in melissa may's comment might've just redeemed earl sweatshirt for me. The rest of OFWGKTA, ehh. But he always struck me as the best and smartest of the crew.
posted by naju at 5:59 AM on May 3, 2012 [1 favorite]

Death Grips is holding my interest far more at the moment, though.
posted by naju at 5:59 AM on May 3, 2012 [2 favorites]

Death Grips +1. These are some indie hip hop salad days.
posted by melissa may at 6:23 AM on May 3, 2012 [1 favorite]

Man, if there ever was a post here on the blue that screams read the linked story before commenting this is it. The quote Melissa posted is just the tip of the iceberg.
posted by photoslob at 6:53 AM on May 3, 2012 [6 favorites]

reading the article first is really poor threadshitting technique
posted by Hoopo at 7:51 AM on May 3, 2012 [5 favorites]

naju: “That quote in melissa may's comment might've just redeemed earl sweatshirt for me. The rest of OFWGKTA, ehh. But he always struck me as the best and smartest of the crew.”

None of them are stupid, is the thing. Tyler has a lot of potential – a strong flow, a lot of smarts. They just waste it all on bullshit. I agree that this article puts an interesting spin on Earl, and he gives all these indications that he's seeing that he can't be like that anymore. Fair enough for him, and I think that's great and all, but I'll wait to see what he actually says about it lyrically, because he sure couldn't manage to be very direct in that interview. And when an OF kid isn't direct, well... something's off.
posted by koeselitz at 8:33 AM on May 3, 2012

This interview with Earl after his return does a pretty good job of showing how he's changed and how his relationship with Tyler and the rest of the Odd Future collective has gotten complicated.

Mark me down as someone who cannot wait to see what he does next.
posted by R. Schlock at 8:41 AM on May 3, 2012 [1 favorite]

melissa may: Most of the Odd Future crew are kids. Brilliant, funny, fucked up kids who are finding their way in an incomprehensible culture at a very strange point in human history. They are simultaneously so hyped and reviled it's sort of impossible to see the clear picture.

The first article linked really highlights this. Kids say stupid things, especially when they don't have any real-life experience with those things. When faced with a bit of what their words mean, most kids will apologize and change their ways. But faced with an audience, people who egg them on, kids will say more stupid shit.

Spend some time listening to kids at a high school, or talk to a high school teacher. You'll hear the same sort of stuff from some kids, and you'll see the same escalation of ridiculous behavior with peer support. This is not in support of Odd Future's misogynistic or violent lyrics, but to provide context.
posted by filthy light thief at 9:30 AM on May 3, 2012 [2 favorites]

♫ What do you call a crew who can rap like that? ♫
posted by porn in the woods at 9:34 AM on May 3, 2012

None of them are stupid, is the thing... They just waste it all on bullshit.

They're teenagers. I predict at least some of them will be monsters, in the next five years or so.
posted by rusty at 9:56 AM on May 3, 2012

Earl is still talented. Tyler is still interesting. Left Brain is still good at what he does. Contrary to what some people said when I made an OF thread, they're still pretty relevant.

On another note, I don't believe that anyone, anywhere, actually listens to Death Grips for pleasure.
posted by broadway bill at 10:01 AM on May 3, 2012 [1 favorite]

If all one needs to ignore misogyny and homophobia is a good beat...

Then you must be a terrible person, right? I think this is for you
posted by Hoopo at 10:04 AM on May 3, 2012 [1 favorite]

I don't believe that anyone, anywhere, actually listens to Death Grips for pleasure.

I prescribe you an hour of listening to "Lost Boys" on repeat until it clicks how totally irresistible and chaotically fun these guys are.
posted by naju at 10:21 AM on May 3, 2012

...any number of 80's and 90's rock acts.

It's not the '80s or '90s anymore. On the other hand, I seriously doubt 2Live Crew would be arrested in the modern day - artists have more freedom, but with that freedom comes more responsibility.
posted by Slap*Happy at 10:30 AM on May 3, 2012

Yes Ad Hominem, yes.

Frank Ocean may not get the pub as Tyler and Earl and even Hodgy Beats, but he is the most talented of the group and Novacaine is just brilliant all the way around.
posted by holdkris99 at 10:39 AM on May 3, 2012 [1 favorite]

What it's like being the "token" white guy in OFWGKTA.
posted by holdkris99 at 10:42 AM on May 3, 2012

Whatever.
posted by Liquidwolf at 11:19 AM on May 3, 2012

And Ad hominem , you're huffing too much paper cement if you think Springteen wrote, and had a hit, with a pro date rape song. It's not hard to decipher where that song is coming from.
posted by Liquidwolf at 11:23 AM on May 3, 2012

I thought the same thing about "Run For Your Life" by the Beatles, Liquidwolf. Turns out I was wrong. I have no idea about the Springsteen song, but looking at the lyrics now I'm not sure it's even about date rape at all, pro or con.
posted by Hoopo at 11:56 AM on May 3, 2012

Run for Your Life was lennon paying homage to Elvis, but it does kind of sit there at the end of Rubber Soul uncomfortably to say the least
posted by holdkris99 at 12:08 PM on May 3, 2012

On another note, I don't believe that anyone, anywhere, actually listens to Death Grips for pleasure.

I can't believe the things a lot of people do for pleasure and those exact same people often refuse to believe me either. Wouldn't it be a crazy thing to have enough empathy to imagine someone else's pleasure in a thing you despise? This isn't secret sarcasm or code. I've actually given this a lot of thought because condemnation and shame are powerful weapons, but terrible teaching tools. At least they were when aimed at me as a kid, and in every kid I've ever closely known.

All I wanted at their age was for someone to explain the disconnect between every social dogma I'd ever been taught to adhere to and the way adults actually behaved. I am still grateful to the few adults I knew who modeled the values they espoused, and who listened, and gave me good music and books and art because they knew I was so hungry for them. Even at my most rebellious, obnoxious, and crude they somehow knew how to listen without endorsing, and to offer wisdom without preaching. As an adult, I've been able to have a few relationships like this with kids and it's lovely from that side too. It's the kind of thing that can save your life.

Basically, I wish I could invite all the kids to stand on my lawn. Then I remember the vileness that is a multi-day concert with festival seating and I calm right back down again. Logistics are hell on wishes.
posted by melissa may at 2:30 PM on May 3, 2012

You Should See the Other Guy: Unsurprisingly, you forgot the previously that casts your subjects in the correct light.

Unsurprisingly, snark-face, that topic didn't come up in searches because the only tags are "music" and "homophobia."
posted by msalt at 3:55 PM on May 3, 2012

Not gonna deny that Odd Future can be kind of gross, and not really a huge fan, but people always seem to miss when calling them misogynistic homophobes that one of their members (Syd the Kyd) is an out lesbian.
posted by DecemberBoy at 5:57 PM on May 3, 2012

Melissa May: no idea what you're on about there really. I'm not sure how you got around to anything having to do with condemnation and shame from my comment, or how/why you got to a "get off my lawn" thing.

Others: Frank Ocean is quite obviously the best thing OF has going right now. I don't think he's at all slept on, though; around me, every 14-21 old fan of radio R&B knows and loves him, and none of them could care less about an Earl or a Tyler. I actually think the fact that he's less involved in OF helps him appeal more to his target market.
posted by broadway bill at 8:05 AM on May 4, 2012

Also, previously. I, for one, welcome back our Earl Sweatshirt overlord.
posted by knile at 11:25 AM on May 10, 2012

On another note, I don't believe that anyone, anywhere, actually listens to Death Grips for pleasure.

slow hand raise
posted by cashman at 9:02 AM on May 15, 2012