Malaysian Ninja Hijabi
January 7, 2017 2:29 AM Subscribe
Malaysian Muslim fashion brand Debellani promotes their newest jubah (long Muslim robe-like dress) line by asking: why be a lady when you can be a warrior?
The swordplay reminds me of this previously posted clothing ad.
posted by exogenous at 4:55 AM on January 7, 2017
posted by exogenous at 4:55 AM on January 7, 2017
and this ad has finally shown me the appeal of the niqab: ninja fantasies.
posted by jb at 6:38 AM on January 7, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by jb at 6:38 AM on January 7, 2017 [2 favorites]
Is this intended to make those women seem empowered? Because I'd think effective swordplay would be prevented by all that draped fabric--there'd be limited visibility and lots of opportunities to be snagged or tripped.
Trying to convince me, when I'm forced to obscure my body from head to foot, that doing so in a particular fabric is going to make me feel like a "warrior" feels wrong to me, but I lack cultural context. Maybe this ad plays well to observant Muslims. The women I see in surprisingly slinky burkinis at a nearby park every summer look like they're having a great time, don't seem particularly fettered and might love this concept.
To each warrior their own I suppose.
posted by kinnakeet at 8:18 AM on January 7, 2017 [1 favorite]
Trying to convince me, when I'm forced to obscure my body from head to foot, that doing so in a particular fabric is going to make me feel like a "warrior" feels wrong to me, but I lack cultural context. Maybe this ad plays well to observant Muslims. The women I see in surprisingly slinky burkinis at a nearby park every summer look like they're having a great time, don't seem particularly fettered and might love this concept.
To each warrior their own I suppose.
posted by kinnakeet at 8:18 AM on January 7, 2017 [1 favorite]
This is kind of beautiful. But yes, lady and warrior, right here.
posted by limeonaire at 8:26 AM on January 7, 2017
posted by limeonaire at 8:26 AM on January 7, 2017
Because blessed are the peace makers.
Leaving aside the Women Empowerment aspect - Did the Mad Men behind this ad not consider that semi-concealed swordplay is not the best example of PR image making for Islam in this day and age? If I were a moderate Muslim having to deal with non-Muslims' fears and suspicions, I would despair at this campaign.
I suspect this may go viral, and not in a good way.
FYI - Swords are illegal in Malaysia. Punishment: Imprisonment not more than 2 years and unspecified whipping.
posted by IndigoJones at 9:11 AM on January 7, 2017 [3 favorites]
Leaving aside the Women Empowerment aspect - Did the Mad Men behind this ad not consider that semi-concealed swordplay is not the best example of PR image making for Islam in this day and age? If I were a moderate Muslim having to deal with non-Muslims' fears and suspicions, I would despair at this campaign.
I suspect this may go viral, and not in a good way.
FYI - Swords are illegal in Malaysia. Punishment: Imprisonment not more than 2 years and unspecified whipping.
posted by IndigoJones at 9:11 AM on January 7, 2017 [3 favorites]
Why should they care what non-Muslims think? And why do they need a mandatory "do not try this at home" disclaimer, unless Malaysians are as predatorily litigious as Americans?
posted by at by at 9:34 AM on January 7, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by at by at 9:34 AM on January 7, 2017 [10 favorites]
This ad fascinates me. I take it the intended audience is Malaysian women? I feel like I have no idea how to respond to it. Neither does most of Metafilter, judging by the conversation so far.
What I think is most interesting is the visual language of making the woman seem powerful and attractive and, yes, sexy. While also wearing a head-to-toe body covering. The martial imagery seems weird to me but deliciously counter to the stereotype of a meek wife walking ten yards behind her husband.
posted by Nelson at 9:53 AM on January 7, 2017 [6 favorites]
What I think is most interesting is the visual language of making the woman seem powerful and attractive and, yes, sexy. While also wearing a head-to-toe body covering. The martial imagery seems weird to me but deliciously counter to the stereotype of a meek wife walking ten yards behind her husband.
posted by Nelson at 9:53 AM on January 7, 2017 [6 favorites]
I'd think effective swordplay would be prevented by all that draped fabric
You mean like with a hakama?
posted by heatherlogan at 10:05 AM on January 7, 2017 [5 favorites]
You mean like with a hakama?
posted by heatherlogan at 10:05 AM on January 7, 2017 [5 favorites]
Because I'd think effective swordplay would be prevented by all that draped fabric
Have you seen people practising kendo in hakama?
(by the way: the woman in the original ad has a horrible katana grip-- you hold the weight in your left hand which is placed with the pinky finger at the *very end* of the handle, the right hand is below the guard and directs the movement)
(on preview, what heatherlogan says)
posted by sukeban at 10:08 AM on January 7, 2017 [2 favorites]
Have you seen people practising kendo in hakama?
(by the way: the woman in the original ad has a horrible katana grip-- you hold the weight in your left hand which is placed with the pinky finger at the *very end* of the handle, the right hand is below the guard and directs the movement)
(on preview, what heatherlogan says)
posted by sukeban at 10:08 AM on January 7, 2017 [2 favorites]
Subversive in such a lovely subtle way. I can imagine that the more choices of self-image this particular group has, the more it may strain at the constrictions its society sets upon it. But as with anyone else here, I don't know.
posted by svenni at 10:14 AM on January 7, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by svenni at 10:14 AM on January 7, 2017 [1 favorite]
This ad fascinates me. I take it the intended audience is Malaysian women? I feel like I have no idea how to respond to it.
I'm not terribly surprised, the anime fandom in Singapore, Malaysia and Indonesia is huge and there's even a thriving community of hijabi cosplayers.
posted by sukeban at 10:21 AM on January 7, 2017 [8 favorites]
I'm not terribly surprised, the anime fandom in Singapore, Malaysia and Indonesia is huge and there's even a thriving community of hijabi cosplayers.
posted by sukeban at 10:21 AM on January 7, 2017 [8 favorites]
A lovely reminder that women like to feel bad-ass irrespective of culture.
posted by Anonymous at 11:22 AM on January 7, 2017
posted by Anonymous at 11:22 AM on January 7, 2017
A friend of mine, who is herself Muslim (Filipina-American, as it happens) managed to do her anthropology dissertation embedded in the highest-placed women's university in Iran, the school which ultimately crafts Iranian government policy related to women. She returned and gave talks on these women's sense of their own power. I sat in on a talk she gave, where a more-established researcher tore her down for ignoring her subjects' "false consciousness." Which struck me as bogus. As anthropologists, we look for what is actually there, and how people craft meaning and power on the ground -- not for Marx's sense of what the situation is. We strive to discard our a-priori assumptions. And the tear-down from this audience member gave me a sense that even the academic discourse on Muslim womanhood in the United States, which one might expect to be more open-minded, was mired in American perspectives on Iran and Islam. (And this is informed by Iranian refugees, which I believe the more-established researcher was.)
Anyway. Bringing that here to add more perspective to this discussion. These videos are marketing, but marketing speaks to the desires and self-image of prospective customers. And I dare you to tell me there's no self-image of power in the ninja video, or in this other ad (epilepsy warning) from the same company.
posted by gusandrews at 11:50 AM on January 7, 2017 [14 favorites]
Anyway. Bringing that here to add more perspective to this discussion. These videos are marketing, but marketing speaks to the desires and self-image of prospective customers. And I dare you to tell me there's no self-image of power in the ninja video, or in this other ad (epilepsy warning) from the same company.
posted by gusandrews at 11:50 AM on January 7, 2017 [14 favorites]
Backing up to sukeban's comment: if you haven't looked into hijabi cosplay, you've missed a lot.
posted by gusandrews at 11:52 AM on January 7, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by gusandrews at 11:52 AM on January 7, 2017 [4 favorites]
Trying to convince me, when I'm forced to obscure my body from head to foot, that doing so in a particular fabric is going to make me feel like a "warrior" feels wrong to me, but I lack cultural context.
I see this idea expressed a lot, usually by people who are not willing to acknowledge their lack of cultural context. Kudos for that.
So many people assume that, because they would not choose to dress as modestly as conservative Muslim women, Muslim women could not possibly choose to dress the way they do without being coerced. Some people even go so far as to assert that forcing Muslim women to show their faces and hair in public makes them more free! Since when has forcing anyone to do something made them more free?
What I find particularly baffling is that these same people apparently see no problem with laws in Western countries that require women to hide their chests, nor do they have trouble accepting that most Western women hide their chests voluntarily, or that many Western women would find it downright traumatic to be forced to go topless in public. If a woman can feel so strongly about covering her chest, why can she not feel the same way about covering her hair or face?
I find this attitude extremely culturally insensitive, because it's rooted in the assumption that the Western concept of modesty is inherently superior to the Muslim version. I also find it misogynistic both in theory (because it presumes Muslim women can't be responsible for their own clothing choices), and in practice (because it leads to Muslim women being forced to expose themselves in ways that violate their personal standards of modesty).
posted by shponglespore at 1:29 PM on January 7, 2017 [27 favorites]
I see this idea expressed a lot, usually by people who are not willing to acknowledge their lack of cultural context. Kudos for that.
So many people assume that, because they would not choose to dress as modestly as conservative Muslim women, Muslim women could not possibly choose to dress the way they do without being coerced. Some people even go so far as to assert that forcing Muslim women to show their faces and hair in public makes them more free! Since when has forcing anyone to do something made them more free?
What I find particularly baffling is that these same people apparently see no problem with laws in Western countries that require women to hide their chests, nor do they have trouble accepting that most Western women hide their chests voluntarily, or that many Western women would find it downright traumatic to be forced to go topless in public. If a woman can feel so strongly about covering her chest, why can she not feel the same way about covering her hair or face?
I find this attitude extremely culturally insensitive, because it's rooted in the assumption that the Western concept of modesty is inherently superior to the Muslim version. I also find it misogynistic both in theory (because it presumes Muslim women can't be responsible for their own clothing choices), and in practice (because it leads to Muslim women being forced to expose themselves in ways that violate their personal standards of modesty).
posted by shponglespore at 1:29 PM on January 7, 2017 [27 favorites]
Malaysian Muslims get in an uproar about a lot, but this ad isn't one of them. And I never got the impression that they particularly cared about the impression they made on the West because hey, not like those heathens respect Islam anyway.
posted by divabat at 1:55 PM on January 7, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by divabat at 1:55 PM on January 7, 2017 [4 favorites]
If you read work produced by feminists who are Muslim, wear the hijab, and/or come from cultures where non-Western dress is common there's a lot of resentment of the idea that unless a woman is dressed in Western-style clothing then she's oppressed and less free. A number of them point to the pressures Western women face to dress in skimpy clothing, whether they feel comfortable doing so or not. I've also seen women make the argument that they feel more empowered by more conservative clothing, not less, because it reduces the likelihood that they're being judged for their bodies rather than for what they say.
posted by Anonymous at 2:49 PM on January 7, 2017
posted by Anonymous at 2:49 PM on January 7, 2017
<3 <3 thank you for posting this. I found it beautiful.
posted by hilaryjade at 3:49 PM on January 7, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by hilaryjade at 3:49 PM on January 7, 2017 [2 favorites]
The store produces really gorgeous clothes too. Those long cardigans!
posted by corb at 4:29 PM on January 7, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by corb at 4:29 PM on January 7, 2017 [2 favorites]
TBQQH, having been a woman in New York City for the advent of warm weather (and less clothing) for some 15 years, I have also yearned for garments that tell the male gaze (and associated catcalls) to fuck right off.
posted by gusandrews at 5:07 PM on January 7, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by gusandrews at 5:07 PM on January 7, 2017 [3 favorites]
by the way: the woman in the original ad has a horrible katana grip
But she makes up for it by her deadly way of frisbeeing her star knife (at 0:45) as if she were tossing away a banana peel.
posted by UbuRoivas at 6:08 PM on January 7, 2017
But she makes up for it by her deadly way of frisbeeing her star knife (at 0:45) as if she were tossing away a banana peel.
posted by UbuRoivas at 6:08 PM on January 7, 2017
If you read work produced by feminists who are Muslim, wear the hijab, and/or come from cultures where non-Western dress is common there's a lot of resentment of the idea that unless a woman is dressed in Western-style clothing then she's oppressed and less free.
I'll always remember a conversation with some inquisitive young men on a bus from Tehran to Esfahan.
They: "Why are women so horribly oppressed in the West?"
"What do you mean?"
"Well, to find a husband, we are told they need to dress like prostitutes, and then go to bars where men evaluate their bodies, get them drunk or drug them, take them home for sex, and then usually discard them, after a night or a week or a month, once they grow tired of them and want a different woman.
"And if a woman refuses to have sex or dress like a prostitute, she will find it almost impossible to find a husband. Many are raped, and if a man uses a woman and gets her pregnant, often he will just leave and not take care of her or the baby...women are forced by your society to behave in this degrading way, and nobody is looking out for their welfare. Why don't the families force the men to behave honourably and respectfully?"
(me thinking "It's not always like that, or it depends on the person, or at least women have a choice in their mating strategies"...these all seemed like weak cop-out excuses for what was essentially quite a strong feminist argument, other than the part where Iranian women didn't have a whole lot of choice in how to go about things)
posted by UbuRoivas at 6:18 PM on January 7, 2017 [10 favorites]
I'll always remember a conversation with some inquisitive young men on a bus from Tehran to Esfahan.
They: "Why are women so horribly oppressed in the West?"
"What do you mean?"
"Well, to find a husband, we are told they need to dress like prostitutes, and then go to bars where men evaluate their bodies, get them drunk or drug them, take them home for sex, and then usually discard them, after a night or a week or a month, once they grow tired of them and want a different woman.
"And if a woman refuses to have sex or dress like a prostitute, she will find it almost impossible to find a husband. Many are raped, and if a man uses a woman and gets her pregnant, often he will just leave and not take care of her or the baby...women are forced by your society to behave in this degrading way, and nobody is looking out for their welfare. Why don't the families force the men to behave honourably and respectfully?"
(me thinking "It's not always like that, or it depends on the person, or at least women have a choice in their mating strategies"...these all seemed like weak cop-out excuses for what was essentially quite a strong feminist argument, other than the part where Iranian women didn't have a whole lot of choice in how to go about things)
posted by UbuRoivas at 6:18 PM on January 7, 2017 [10 favorites]
gusandrews and sukeban, those cosplayers are awesome. Thank you for making me aware of them.
posted by Songdog at 8:40 PM on January 7, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Songdog at 8:40 PM on January 7, 2017 [1 favorite]
I practice martial arts at an academy with a number of Muslim students and I am thinking right now of three teen sisters who are really bad-ass amazing and actually harassed our lead instructor into having a breaking class so they could break things. They are fierce and strong and their dad signed them up intending that they all go through to black belt, and their mum comes to class herself lately. And they wear hijab. I bet they'd be a target audience for this ad.
They pretty obviously feel bad for me cause I don't progress at their rate, and treat me a bit like a dottering aunt and cutely assume I don't know what Snapchat is. So many cultural assumptions.
posted by warriorqueen at 8:46 PM on January 7, 2017 [7 favorites]
They pretty obviously feel bad for me cause I don't progress at their rate, and treat me a bit like a dottering aunt and cutely assume I don't know what Snapchat is. So many cultural assumptions.
posted by warriorqueen at 8:46 PM on January 7, 2017 [7 favorites]
This suggests that in France ninjas are liable to be stopped and told they must strip down to a bikini.
posted by Segundus at 9:08 PM on January 7, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Segundus at 9:08 PM on January 7, 2017 [2 favorites]
I enjoyed watching this - thanks for posting it here! I also liked the music. Does anyone know what song that is?
posted by daisyk at 8:53 AM on January 8, 2017
posted by daisyk at 8:53 AM on January 8, 2017
I have a problem with religious expectations and limitations that are different for men vs. women, but I also trust women to make their own decisions (and I'm trying to respect people's right to make decisions I think are bad, which as a know-it-all is hard to get used to) so other people's garment choices = not my business until someone makes it my business.
It is cool to learn about different products and marketing, but I'm someone who has read the U-Line catalog cover to cover to learn about packaging I'll never use. I just like to know about people's lives that are different from mine.
posted by blnkfrnk at 11:08 AM on January 8, 2017
It is cool to learn about different products and marketing, but I'm someone who has read the U-Line catalog cover to cover to learn about packaging I'll never use. I just like to know about people's lives that are different from mine.
posted by blnkfrnk at 11:08 AM on January 8, 2017
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I can be - and often am - BOTH.
posted by Faintdreams at 3:04 AM on January 7, 2017 [14 favorites]