Operation Nanny Goat
March 2, 2017 4:14 AM Subscribe
Eh. Seems like a dude who read a couple of books on coups and decided to cosplay as a revolutionary for his computer buddies.
And he says that Clinton and Trump are "both lunatics", and he doesn't care which candidate hackers undermine. So there's that.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 4:58 AM on March 2, 2017 [8 favorites]
And he says that Clinton and Trump are "both lunatics", and he doesn't care which candidate hackers undermine. So there's that.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 4:58 AM on March 2, 2017 [8 favorites]
This SLYT could benefit from more explanation of why it's worth our time than simply "A must watch." I'm in the community this is targeted toward (and will add that I didn't find the video all that interesting), but what, hyram, do you feel this adds for people not of that particular stripe?
posted by mystyk at 4:58 AM on March 2, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by mystyk at 4:58 AM on March 2, 2017 [11 favorites]
I'm on the "put people hacking political campaigns in jail" team, these days
posted by thelonius at 5:22 AM on March 2, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by thelonius at 5:22 AM on March 2, 2017 [18 favorites]
Yeah, I didn't find this talk particularly enlightening or entertaining. Same Chris Rock's talk a year previous (I think) about birth/death certificates and 'fake people' is pretty awesome though.
posted by Dysk at 5:25 AM on March 2, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Dysk at 5:25 AM on March 2, 2017 [1 favorite]
Hell, I'd go further and say that hackers and their culture were a contributor to The Mess We're In. There's a solid, unbroken line from the 80s hacker scene to the alt-right, one that includes Actual Neo-Nazis like weev. I'd argue there's another line from hacker culture to Twitter and Facebook and their disinterest in cultivating their communities to the point where it might be poisoning discourse everywhere.
Hacker culture never really had a use for empathy. They're the last people you want rebuilding a republic.
posted by Merus at 5:29 AM on March 2, 2017 [29 favorites]
Hacker culture never really had a use for empathy. They're the last people you want rebuilding a republic.
posted by Merus at 5:29 AM on March 2, 2017 [29 favorites]
I've said it before on the blue and I will say it again: I left the 2600 scene when the group I was in Hooters with exploded in cheers after the Oklahoma City bombing news broke on the bar television. That entire scene, save one or two people, was engorged with future alt-right gamergate types. I haven't seen any indication that much has changed. Even if they disagree with Trump politically, they're gleefully eating popcorn over the Trump shaped bomb in the White House. Blow up the system by any means possible.
posted by xyzzy at 6:03 AM on March 2, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by xyzzy at 6:03 AM on March 2, 2017 [12 favorites]
They're the last people you want rebuilding a republic.
Blow up the system by any means possible.
Hooters. That's gross in and of itself, but cheering destruction is another level of juvenile angst I can't process as representative. I'm not social enough to survey the pluralities of the 2600 scene, but dismissing hacker culture is a mistake.
The outset of the talk mocks James Clapper's threat list to frame a model and narrative of political upheavals to address power-- that's the schtick, speaking truth to power.
In the first 1/3rd of the talk he addresses, in August of 2016, emails and WikiLeaks to effect (that's with an 'e') an election. And, yeah, he scoffs at any difference in terms of candidate and it's in an amoral frame of tools to manipulate.
posted by lazycomputerkids at 6:30 AM on March 2, 2017 [2 favorites]
Blow up the system by any means possible.
Hooters. That's gross in and of itself, but cheering destruction is another level of juvenile angst I can't process as representative. I'm not social enough to survey the pluralities of the 2600 scene, but dismissing hacker culture is a mistake.
The outset of the talk mocks James Clapper's threat list to frame a model and narrative of political upheavals to address power-- that's the schtick, speaking truth to power.
In the first 1/3rd of the talk he addresses, in August of 2016, emails and WikiLeaks to effect (that's with an 'e') an election. And, yeah, he scoffs at any difference in terms of candidate and it's in an amoral frame of tools to manipulate.
posted by lazycomputerkids at 6:30 AM on March 2, 2017 [2 favorites]
It's the amorality that gets me. I have serious reservations about using deception, manipulation of elections, etc. to achieve political ends. But even if we put those reservations aside: this guy isn't working/arguing for any particular political end. He's just saying "here are some tactics that could be used to destabilize a government; go forth and use them against whoever".
It's a game to these guys. And I, for one, am sick of (invariably privileged, white, male) people treating our civic institutions, discourse, etc. as a game to be disrupted for the lulz, or so they can feel powerful/important/clever/badass, or whatever their motivation is.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 6:55 AM on March 2, 2017 [19 favorites]
It's a game to these guys. And I, for one, am sick of (invariably privileged, white, male) people treating our civic institutions, discourse, etc. as a game to be disrupted for the lulz, or so they can feel powerful/important/clever/badass, or whatever their motivation is.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 6:55 AM on March 2, 2017 [19 favorites]
Targeted forced transparency as a lever for change and the increasing burden of the secrecy tax was part of our discussion in the 90's, so this has been in the hacker zeitgeist for a long time. Of course, we all personally used PGP for every communication and fiercely guarded our own privacy.
posted by xyzzy at 7:08 AM on March 2, 2017
posted by xyzzy at 7:08 AM on March 2, 2017
The problem is that selective transparency is not truth, just more deception.
posted by Zalzidrax at 7:14 AM on March 2, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Zalzidrax at 7:14 AM on March 2, 2017 [2 favorites]
He's just saying "here are some tactics that could be used to destabilize a government; go forth and use them against whoever".
My interpretation: Here are tactics that have been used historically and are presently used to destabilize governments around the globe.
I don't view it as advocacy so much as identification presented by a hypothetical "plan".
posted by lazycomputerkids at 7:47 AM on March 2, 2017
My interpretation: Here are tactics that have been used historically and are presently used to destabilize governments around the globe.
I don't view it as advocacy so much as identification presented by a hypothetical "plan".
posted by lazycomputerkids at 7:47 AM on March 2, 2017
There's a solid, unbroken line from the 80s hacker scene to the alt-right, one that includes Actual Neo-Nazis like weev.
I imagine the hacker scene is like technology itself -- not exactly adhering to one particular tendency, but rather amplifying a whole bunch of tendencies, bad, ugly, good, even evolutionary. Some of the smartest, most thoughtful, most progressive, most effective humans I've ever known could be called hackers (though I doubt they'd be comfortable with being so labelled).
It's a game to these guys. And I, for one, am sick of (invariably privileged, white, male) people treating our civic institutions, discourse, etc. as a game to be disrupted for the lulz, or so they can feel powerful/important/clever/badass, or whatever their motivation is.
This, I guess, describes the worst of them. But, I'm with lazycomputerkids --
cheering destruction is another level of juvenile angst I can't process as representative. I'm not social enough to survey the pluralities of the 2600 scene, but dismissing hacker culture is a mistake.
posted by philip-random at 8:53 AM on March 2, 2017 [2 favorites]
I imagine the hacker scene is like technology itself -- not exactly adhering to one particular tendency, but rather amplifying a whole bunch of tendencies, bad, ugly, good, even evolutionary. Some of the smartest, most thoughtful, most progressive, most effective humans I've ever known could be called hackers (though I doubt they'd be comfortable with being so labelled).
It's a game to these guys. And I, for one, am sick of (invariably privileged, white, male) people treating our civic institutions, discourse, etc. as a game to be disrupted for the lulz, or so they can feel powerful/important/clever/badass, or whatever their motivation is.
This, I guess, describes the worst of them. But, I'm with lazycomputerkids --
cheering destruction is another level of juvenile angst I can't process as representative. I'm not social enough to survey the pluralities of the 2600 scene, but dismissing hacker culture is a mistake.
posted by philip-random at 8:53 AM on March 2, 2017 [2 favorites]
I think I'll switch to using George Clooney as my professional name.
posted by humboldt32 at 10:00 AM on March 2, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by humboldt32 at 10:00 AM on March 2, 2017 [1 favorite]
1. Elect a reality-tv star
2. ????
3. Sit in the ashes of civilization.
posted by blue_beetle at 10:49 AM on March 2, 2017
2. ????
3. Sit in the ashes of civilization.
posted by blue_beetle at 10:49 AM on March 2, 2017
lol no dismissing hacker culture is brilliant. hacker culture is fucked and covers for so much whiny manbaby grotesquerie
my eyeballs protected me from wanting to watch this cat so i can't speak to the video but i get the tee-hees watching people rush to defend glorious hacker culture
fuck hacker culture
posted by nixon's meatloaf at 11:10 AM on March 2, 2017
my eyeballs protected me from wanting to watch this cat so i can't speak to the video but i get the tee-hees watching people rush to defend glorious hacker culture
fuck hacker culture
posted by nixon's meatloaf at 11:10 AM on March 2, 2017
DefCon: Seems like a dude who read a couple of books on _____ and decided to cosplay as a _____ for his computer buddies.
posted by Ogre Lawless at 11:31 AM on March 2, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Ogre Lawless at 11:31 AM on March 2, 2017 [3 favorites]
I watched the entire video. The last 5 minutes puts it all together, if you don't have time. My summary/overview:
The speaker asserts that a non-government-aligned team of hackers were directly involved in the takedown of Kuwait's prime minister in 2011.
The assertion is that a coordinated team broke into the isp's, banks, and media outlets, and the municipal water system.
They moved money out of government accounts into accounts that the PM controlled, created a paper trail back to the PM, sent bribes, and to bring about civil unrest they shut off the city's water supply to make the public unhappy. And paid protestors to protest, and to dress as police to beat up the paid protestors. The tools used to exploit the varied systems involved are discussed, and there are a number of screencaps of things that plausibly could be backend systems for .kw sites.
If this is true, this is not hackers cosplaying. This had a real world impact. Maybe it is just a story, and storytellers make for good fiction, and good conference presentations. But if part of this actually happened? Yipe. I'm both awed and afraid.
posted by enfa at 2:27 PM on March 2, 2017 [3 favorites]
The speaker asserts that a non-government-aligned team of hackers were directly involved in the takedown of Kuwait's prime minister in 2011.
The assertion is that a coordinated team broke into the isp's, banks, and media outlets, and the municipal water system.
They moved money out of government accounts into accounts that the PM controlled, created a paper trail back to the PM, sent bribes, and to bring about civil unrest they shut off the city's water supply to make the public unhappy. And paid protestors to protest, and to dress as police to beat up the paid protestors. The tools used to exploit the varied systems involved are discussed, and there are a number of screencaps of things that plausibly could be backend systems for .kw sites.
If this is true, this is not hackers cosplaying. This had a real world impact. Maybe it is just a story, and storytellers make for good fiction, and good conference presentations. But if part of this actually happened? Yipe. I'm both awed and afraid.
posted by enfa at 2:27 PM on March 2, 2017 [3 favorites]
Hacker culture never really had a use for empathy.
Too often I hear this talk like more empathy would solve all problems.
One use of empathy is to figure out better ways to inflict psychological torment.
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 6:38 PM on March 2, 2017 [2 favorites]
Too often I hear this talk like more empathy would solve all problems.
One use of empathy is to figure out better ways to inflict psychological torment.
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 6:38 PM on March 2, 2017 [2 favorites]
If you watched the entire video, Chris Rock pulled off the resignation of the Kuwait prime minister by planting fake news, fake financial transactions , and more. Funded on kickstarter as Operation Nanny Goat. They just did it by following mercenaries handbooks and easy hacker access to everything. That's why it is a must see, IMHO.
posted by hyram at 2:03 AM on March 3, 2017
posted by hyram at 2:03 AM on March 3, 2017
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posted by dr_dank at 4:55 AM on March 2, 2017 [19 favorites]