Herb is the healing of a nation
October 17, 2018 8:40 AM   Subscribe

Today is the day recreational cannabis becomes legal in Canada. Canada is the second country in the world to legalize recreational cannabis after Uruguay (it has been decriminalized but not legalized in Portugal). The rules around cannabis sales and consumption will vary from province to province and from municipality to municipality. In British Columbia, where there is a backlog of private business licences waiting to be processed, pot will be available immediately through the provincial government's BC Liquor Distribution Branch, for sale online or in one lone storefront in Kamloops. Meanwhile, the federal government has announced it will move quickly to pardon those with past convictions for simple possession.

For those wondering about the long term effects of legalization, the Globe and Mail urges us to think about what we can learn from the lifting of prohibition of alcohol.

Polls indicate Canadians are less interested in smoking (19%) than consuming edibles or beverages (25%). However, edibles will not become legal until Oct. 17, 2019.

The Canadian Medical Association has weighed in with concerns about the public health aspects of legalization.

Meanwhile, others, like Edward Keenan, say we should all celebrate pot's long overdue legalization.

Prime Minister Justin Trudeau, who included legalization in his election platform, has said this move will cut down on black market drug dealing, but drug dealers remain confident that won't be the case.
posted by hurdy gurdy girl (110 comments total) 21 users marked this as a favorite
 
Why the delay on edibles?
posted by Chrysostom at 8:45 AM on October 17, 2018 [4 favorites]


adjusts tie nervously
Cannadabis
ducks, leaves
posted by Going To Maine at 8:47 AM on October 17, 2018 [13 favorites]


Why the delay on edibles?

Yeah, if anything I would think the government would want to encourage edibles and discourage smoking, which is inherently dangerous to the user and people around them. It may be much safer than smoking tobacco for a variety of reasons, but it still involves inhaling particulates, carbon monoxide, etc and carries various respiratory risks.
posted by jedicus at 8:49 AM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


Congratulations!
posted by uncleozzy at 8:49 AM on October 17, 2018 [3 favorites]


Am i missing something or are edibles "legal" in the sense that you can make them yourself, they just arent going to be commercially available for another year?
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 8:50 AM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


I believe the problem with edibles is just lining up the regs. Quite a few places that have legalized pot have had problems with edibles lacking regulation/labelling w.r.t. strength and recommended dose.

Those two-bite brownies are damn addictive.
posted by Bovine Love at 8:53 AM on October 17, 2018 [2 favorites]


I think there's some big worry about sheltered first-time users who will eat a pot gummie and then go pick their kids up at school an hour later, feeling fine. Then on the way home the concern is that the gummie will kick in and the person will saw madly at the steering wheel and end up taking out an entire city block of pedestrians.
posted by some loser at 8:54 AM on October 17, 2018 [5 favorites]


Sorry, yes, Exceptional_Hubris, they're legal for you to make but not legally sold anywhere yet.

More info on edibles legalization.
posted by hurdy gurdy girl at 8:54 AM on October 17, 2018 [4 favorites]


Yes to dosage/regulations. For example when CA legalized recreational use earlier this year the law that did it put a strict 100mg/package limit on edibles, which forced a few companies to rework their product lines/packaging sizes. As i understand it super high dose edibles remain legal for people with demonstrable medical need, but you cant walk into a store and get a 400mg brownie anymore.
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 8:55 AM on October 17, 2018 [2 favorites]


Between provinces, municipalities, and employers all getting in on the opportunity to make up stupid new rules that will help keep the black market going it's not as large a step as one might've hoped for, but nonetheless it's a step in the right direction. Congratulations, Canada.
posted by sfenders at 9:00 AM on October 17, 2018


And, for further example, a 100mg will FUCK YOU UP SEVERELY if you eat the whole thing and don't know what's about to happen.

A reasonable edible dose is 5mg. 99% of people will get stoned from that. 5mg is a VERY small amount, and very difficult to dose correctly.. and that's why edibles are tough to regulate. It's not just a struggle between heady stoners and everyone else regarding dosing needs, it's also scientifically difficult to nail down exact dosing. It's possible, as Washington and Oregon and Colorado have shown, but it's not easy.
posted by juice boo at 9:02 AM on October 17, 2018 [10 favorites]


Taking an edible of unknown dosage with a highly-variable onset time is a recipe for a bad time for a lot of people. Prohibiting commercial edibles until regulations can be written is disappointing, but probably sensible.

As an infrequent user, I really appreciated the availability of low-dose edibles in California -- I tried a 2.5mg mint that was amazingly chill and functional (although 5mg turned out to be better, and still pretty functional, if I'm honest).
posted by uncleozzy at 9:02 AM on October 17, 2018 [3 favorites]


So, as an old, THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL I AM USING A CREDIT CARD TO BUY DRUGS FROM A GOVERNMENT WEBSITE. Hell, I enabled incognito mode before looking at the website. I fully expect to be laughed at by the youth.
posted by Keith Talent at 9:11 AM on October 17, 2018 [13 favorites]


However, edibles will not become legal until Oct. 17, 2019.

Hmm...next Halloween is going to be interesting...
posted by sexyrobot at 9:11 AM on October 17, 2018 [4 favorites]


So does this mean you can drive over the border from Washington with pot and not get arrested?
posted by ananci at 9:15 AM on October 17, 2018


That would be a federal jurisdiction question, viz:

The Cannabis Act, legalizing and regulating cannabis (marijuana), creates a strict legal framework for controlling the production, distribution, sale and possession of cannabis in Canada.

Taking cannabis across the border without a permit or exemption authorized by Health Canada remains a serious criminal offence subject to arrest and prosecution, despite the legalization of cannabis in Canada.

source:Canada Customs
posted by Mogur at 9:18 AM on October 17, 2018 [3 favorites]


About Fucking Time
posted by philip-random at 9:19 AM on October 17, 2018


HERE IS NO WAY IN HELL I AM USING A CREDIT CARD TO BUY DRUGS FROM A GOVERNMENT WEBSITE

So - the consensus is to pickup a pre-paid Visa/MC from somewhere - because, until we know the Yanks aren't going to trawl through your device banking records/statements when you cross the border, it would be best to be safe.

you can drive over the border from Washington with pot and not get arrested?

Who knows (I doubt it's a great idea, but hey, if someone wants some free publicity and to participate in some sort of court-challenge, go nuts...) - going from BC to Washington with MJ would be a very bad idea, but the other way?
posted by jkaczor at 9:19 AM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


I'm curious how does this work from a tourist/travelling standpoint?

Can someone fly INTO Canada possessing pot? As in, will security checkpoints just not care? What about people crossing the border via car?

Also can someone leaving Canada by Air just legally carry a certain amount of Cannabis with them as long as they can prove they are only flying to another part of Canada?

Also are there restrictions on the forms of the Cannabis? For instance edibles has been discussed up-thread but what about Cannabis Oil?

I like legal puzzles and precedents so I'm interested.
posted by Faintdreams at 9:20 AM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


jkaczor, Faintdreams, see the link above to Canada Customs. It would be a Bad Idea to bring pot into Canada from abroad.
posted by Mogur at 9:25 AM on October 17, 2018 [4 favorites]


The Globe and Mail article in the OP has a good analysis of why cannabis legalization in Canada has so many limits on it, out of the gate.
posted by Mogur at 9:27 AM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


Why the delay on edibles?
They probably heard about loquacious' pancakes.
posted by MtDewd at 9:32 AM on October 17, 2018 [14 favorites]


as long as they can prove they are only flying to another part of Canada?

Flying within Canada is ok (within the legal limit) - they announced that awhile back - but, frankly I wouldn't attempt to do that if you are connecting through another city and then leaving Canada as part of a single trip.

Also are there restrictions on the forms of the Cannabis? For instance edibles has been discussed up-thread but what about Cannabis Oil?

The OCS.ca site (Ontario) has Oils and capsules available - so, you could make your own edibles.
posted by jkaczor at 9:34 AM on October 17, 2018


I'm curious how does this work from a tourist/travelling standpoint?

Well - in the provinces and territories that have online-only sales at the moment, how tourists would actually obtain "product" will be interesting - definitely losing out on some tax-revenue loonies there...
posted by jkaczor at 9:38 AM on October 17, 2018


Heh, and another fun thing... For online sales, delivery is only performed by Canada Post (due to the ID/age verification requirements)...

... however, Canada Post is threatening to go on strike starting as early as next week, with rolling (heh) walkouts...
posted by jkaczor at 9:40 AM on October 17, 2018


Why October 17th? Was it a certain number of days after the law passed, or is there some weird metric significance?
posted by Etrigan at 9:42 AM on October 17, 2018


It's not technically decriminalized in The Netherlands.
posted by humboldt32 at 9:42 AM on October 17, 2018


Why October 17th?

Just to taunt all the straight edge folks celebrating Edge Day.
posted by yellowbinder at 9:43 AM on October 17, 2018 [6 favorites]


Why October 17th?

Well, IIRC the original target date was July 1st... But, many provinces and territories were still working on their legislation into June, so... Heck, Ontario had a plan for retail outlets, but the election of a new government in June cancelled that...

So, now - in Ontario the only way you can now (or... heh, continue) to get your weed from "Ford" is online-only... (Guess you still have to visit them in-person to get your harder choices...)
posted by jkaczor at 9:48 AM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


Why October 17th
posted by sfenders at 9:48 AM on October 17, 2018 [9 favorites]


The Globe and Mail article in the OP has a good analysis of why cannabis legalization in Canada has so many limits on it, out of the gate.

It understates the extent to which post-prohibition liquour restrictions, which we would consider somewhat absurd today, continued afterwards, in Ontario at least. You had to apply in advance for a permit to buy beer until the 1960's.
posted by sfenders at 9:50 AM on October 17, 2018 [2 favorites]


One day I will eat an edible and get this crazy high everyone is talking about. I just never exerpeinced it, no matter where the edible came from: dispensary, vapor bar, homemade, etc... I'm always like "oh yeah that's right i ate that giant chocolate bar that said only eat 1 quarter about three hours ago, maybe I shouldn't be puffing this blunt right now." but no, i only ever get mild effects from ingested cannabis. sad really. I guess that's why I kinda scoff at the concern over edibles - my lived experience says they're NBD. But our experiences are not universal, so I guess I apologize for my flippant comment earlier. In my defense: I was sober when I wrote that.


I'm kind of a mean sober.
posted by some loser at 9:50 AM on October 17, 2018


(I just asked the mods to correct that, thanks humboldt32)
posted by hurdy gurdy girl at 9:52 AM on October 17, 2018


Taking an edible of unknown dosage with a highly-variable onset time is a recipe for a bad time for a lot of people.

This best describes the edibles people will be producing at home. Although starting from buds with a known % of active substance will help control potency of the final product. And while I totally understand and support holding on edibles until proper norms are in place, those that are sold should be more reliable than home made, so I hope they don't delay.

A company did managed to screw up the sugary juice used for diabetes testing this year (how hard can that be? you're mixing water and sugar) so expect somebody to screw their edibles at some point.

Home province newly elected government is being a dick about it though. They're absolutely missing the point on the public health angle and are doing their best to screw it up with half-thought ideas like raising the age over that of alcohol consumption and banning use in all public spaces (I don't mind much for joints because smell can be an issue, but good luck for vapes and edibles). We just got rid of an unequally enforced set of rules that led to a lot of discrimination and are basically creating a new categories of offenses to replace them (at least those won't be criminal offenses).
posted by WaterAndPixels at 9:53 AM on October 17, 2018


Here in private retail sale Alberta, there appears to be a fair degree of demand.
posted by figurant at 9:54 AM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


Flying within Canada is ok (within the legal limit) - they announced that awhile back - but, frankly I wouldn't attempt to do that if you are connecting through another city and then leaving Canada as part of a single trip.

And the limit for flying is like 30g; you can toss an ounce in your carry-on and head for the airport.
posted by thelonius at 9:58 AM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


[Changed the wording of the post to drop the Netherlands, carry on.]
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 10:15 AM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


Well - in the provinces and territories that have online-only sales at the moment, how tourists would actually obtain "product" will be interesting - definitely losing out on some tax-revenue loonies there...

Here in Toronto at least there are plenty of grey-market (but highly visible) dispensaries where anyone can buy in person.
posted by Flashman at 10:18 AM on October 17, 2018


Edibles appear attractive to inexperienced users, but they’re really not what you want. They’re difficult to dose correctly, in part because they take so long to take effect. Also they can be a lot more trippy, and that can be unpleasant too.

For real, the way to go is a disposable vape pen. They’re easy to use, and because they take effect almost immediately you can easily titrate the dose by starting with a small puff and adding more if you want it.
posted by chrchr at 10:30 AM on October 17, 2018 [7 favorites]


Here in Toronto at least there are plenty of grey-market (but highly visible) dispensaries where anyone can buy in person.


That was the case until recently. Now, they're pretty much all shut down, in the hopes of applying for a legit license once next April rolls around. The few that remain open can probably expect to be raided pretty soon.
posted by Crane Shot at 10:32 AM on October 17, 2018


Between provinces, municipalities, and employers all getting in on the opportunity to make up stupid new rules that will help keep the black market going it's not as large a step as one might've hoped for, but nonetheless it's a step in the right direction. Congratulations, Canada.

Don't forget the cops - they need to figure out a way to keep their ever-increasing budgets in the face of an overall decline in crime rates in Canada over the last couple of decades. Therefore, expect the fear-mongering to continue unto perpetuity since it serves the purposes of law enforcement.

For non-Canadians: Justin Trudeau's point man on legalization, Bill Blair, is a police chief-turned-politician, so ideologically he's still very much of the WE MUST FIND A WAY TO DO MORE POLICING OF THINGS AND PEOPLE mindset. He's not and never was big on respecting the civil liberties of Canadians, let's put it that way.

The quantity and quality of saturation media coverage here in Canada has been ridiculous in the extreme. Yes, it's a major shift in drug policy (and one that's long, long overdue), but you'd swear to god the apocalypse was nigh based on yesterday's and this morning's TV and radio coverage.

Yet remarkably, the sky hasn't fallen.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 10:46 AM on October 17, 2018 [10 favorites]


Yeah I was thinking of walking round the three or four dispensaries within a couple blocks to see who wanted to be a legit business in six months and who wanted to get raided next week but ennhhh.... I expect they're all switching over to accessories for the meantime. It's not a good idea to eat that one marshmallow now when you will get the whole bag next year.
posted by seanmpuckett at 10:46 AM on October 17, 2018


God, the "computer controlled greenhouses" on sale now. $2K for a box that will light and water your single weed plant (you can only grow one at a time, expected yield 1-3oz), with a charcoal filter to cut down the smell. Oh, and they want you to buy $50 in "soil amendment" solutions per three month cycle. Like ... man. It's a WEED. I dunno. I seriously expect to see them growing in vacant lots, untended verges, and larger city parks next spring. I mean, why not?
posted by seanmpuckett at 10:51 AM on October 17, 2018 [3 favorites]


Yet remarkably, the sky hasn't fallen.

You need better stuff.
posted by Etrigan at 10:53 AM on October 17, 2018 [5 favorites]


Edibles appear attractive to inexperienced users, but they’re really not what you want. They’re difficult to dose correctly, in part because they take so long to take effect. Also they can be a lot more trippy, and that can be unpleasant too.

Those familiar with the Canadian media landscape are counting down the days until Margaret Wente pulls a Maureen Dowd.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 10:53 AM on October 17, 2018 [12 favorites]


You can't take pot out of the country. I'm flying today and there are signs in the airport to that effect. They have disposal bins next to the signs and I want to know who gets to empty the bins.
posted by Mitheral at 10:56 AM on October 17, 2018 [7 favorites]


For real, the way to go is a disposable vape pen. They’re easy to use, and because they take effect almost immediately you can easily titrate the dose by starting with a small puff and adding more if you want it.

Also tried one of these in addition to the micro-dose edibles and I agree 100%. You can take super-tiny sips every so often and maintain a really great low-level buzz, if that's what you're after, or take a five-second hit and spend an hour trying to remember what comes after seventy-somplun.
posted by uncleozzy at 10:56 AM on October 17, 2018 [8 favorites]


THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL I AM USING A CREDIT CARD TO BUY DRUGS FROM A GOVERNMENT WEBSITE

Worse than that. I hear from a (perhaps overly) paranoid tech friend in Toronto that order confirmation emails come through in plain text with your name, address, phone number and brand names and quantities of what you've ordered. I'd hate to be an OCS customer who used Yahoo mail, since Oath is scanning people's email for information to sell to advertisers
posted by scruss at 11:15 AM on October 17, 2018


Why the delay on edibles?

I think there are also some decisions that need to be made about who enforces the sale of edibles.

Here in Victoria the sale of edibles in our many many pot shops (City of Victoria was the national leader in establishing "dispensaries", and Vancouver learned from and adopted our example) was shut down by the local healthy authority (which operates, administers or oversees the public health system) as you need to ensure edible products are prepared in a commercially licensed kitchen. The health authority also sets rules for food sales at street markets, and cannabis products were not included in those terms of reference.

I'm pretty sure cannabis edibles will be regulated like cosmetics are here in Canada. To make cosmetics you need a number of certifications from Health Canada (the regional health authority follows these prescriptions) that do create barriers to entry when trying to start a cosmetics business (my wife makes her own cosmetics and frequently buys caustic soda in bulk).
posted by JamesBay at 11:17 AM on October 17, 2018 [2 favorites]


As well, I find capsules to be a far better experience than edibles.
posted by JamesBay at 11:17 AM on October 17, 2018


They have disposal bins next to the signs and I want to know who gets to empty the bins.

very tangentially related but one of the best news clips i've ever seen was an interview many years ago with (iirc) a mexican federal police lieutenant, regarding an enormous weed bust in which the seized drugs were set ablaze immediately and left burning for hours. idk how long they'd been there "supervising" but the LT was visibly repressing giggles throughout the interview and his eyes looked like maraschino cherries.
posted by poffin boffin at 11:18 AM on October 17, 2018 [14 favorites]


If you are mail ordering better pay for next day shipping, Canada Post on strike on Monday.
posted by Mitheral at 11:30 AM on October 17, 2018


I get this sick feeling that pardoning drug offenders aspect of legalization will be an obstacle in legalization in the U.S. since so many powerful office holders and their pet capitalists stand to benefit from the mass incarceration of so many people. Very good news for Canada and another instance of feeling like Canada is the mirror-universe USA but we live on the side where everyone has an evil goatee.
posted by GoblinHoney at 11:31 AM on October 17, 2018 [6 favorites]


I live in a part of Canada where the combination of municipal bylaws as well as rental company and condo board regulations make it more or less de facto prohibited for anyone who doesn't live in a freehold detached home that they own to use recreational cannabis.

My property managers are prohibiting both medical and recreational use anywhere on our complex's property. Smoking I understand, but vaping is also banned. I'm not sure that vapes create the kind of issues that would affect other tenants, but it's not as though I'd bother trying to reason with my landlords who I suspect aren't the most sophisticated folks.

Rules like this only serve to make higher-density housing less attractive to people with choices, which is exactly the opposite of what this sprawly city needs.
posted by blerghamot at 11:34 AM on October 17, 2018 [5 favorites]


I was thinking of maaaybee checking out whether I could pick something up to test whether it helps me sleep (won't be doing it recreationally, don't have a lot of experience with it), but if edibles aren't available I'm not sure what I can try to get a very tiny dose. I quit smoking cigarettes last year so I definitely don't need smoking as a trigger. Plus, there's no way I want the other neighbourhood parents to know what I'm up to. Anyways, I'm about to head out to run errands and it will be neat to see what kind of mood the city is in and if I can spy any of the lineups. According to reddit, wait times ae ranging from 45 minutes to 3 hours here.
posted by kitcat at 11:39 AM on October 17, 2018


mg is a VERY small amount, and very difficult to dose correctly.. and that's why edibles are tough to regulate.

It's that, and it's also the fact that (according to an interview I heard in the last couple of days) producing edibles means you are producing a food product - which means a whole bunch of other regulations around food safety, etc., in addition to the regulations that are there from the health side of things. So there's just more that needs to be sorted out in terms of regulation on that side of things, so they are taking more time.
posted by nubs at 11:40 AM on October 17, 2018


I suspect there will be a bump in consumption as the stores open and the curious people try it out, but it'll likely soon level out and it'll be just another taxable vice.
posted by arcticseal at 11:44 AM on October 17, 2018


My hope is that it will supplant alcohol as the intoxicant of choice to some degree. We drink a lot of booze.
posted by figurant at 11:47 AM on October 17, 2018 [4 favorites]


My experience in Oregon is that legalization doesn’t appear to have had much of an effect on consumption. People who wanted to use marijuana were mostly not impeded by prohibition, and people who didn’t use it previously mostly still don’t.
posted by chrchr at 11:56 AM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


Here in private retail sale Alberta, there appears to be a fair degree of demand.

I don't know exactly why, but as of today, very few places have gotten approval to open in Alberta, and it's not been evenly distributed; there are 6 locations in Edmonton, with basically none in the south half of the city but two in the same strip mall. There are also 6 in various suburban towns in the Edmonton region, including two serving the 25K residents of Fort Saskatchewan.

Down here in Calgary -- where that picture was taken -- on the other hand, there are two shops in a metro area of 1.4 million or so, and they're located a 15 minute walk from each other in south Calgary, 10 km south of the downtown. So that particular store happens to be the closest store for roughly a million people.
posted by Homeboy Trouble at 12:03 PM on October 17, 2018


Between provinces, municipalities, and employers all getting in on the opportunity to make up stupid new rules

I probably shouldn't say this given my occupation, but: fuck cooperative federalism.

The black market will probably continue to flourish in towns and cities that haven't cracked down on public use but have few brick-and-mortar legal retailers available. Large Ontario cities that had a free-for-all handed to them by Doug Ford's interpretation of the Smoke Free Ontario act will probably see both their legal and black markets thrive and will benefit from the extra revenue.

Ass-backwards Alberta municipalities (save for Lethbridge which is being uncharacteristically chill about this) seem to be hell-bent on making it more difficult for anyone to use cannabis regardless of its provenance, though. I can't imagine this not having a chilling effect on both the black and legal market here. For a province that really needs all the bloody tax revenue we can get, we're pretty damn dumb.
posted by blerghamot at 12:10 PM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


you'd swear to god the apocalypse was nigh based on yesterday's and this morning's TV and radio coverage.

Strange, given how measured and judicious Canadian media reporting usually is.

Jane & Finch is still a literal battlefield right?
posted by Freelance Demiurge at 12:10 PM on October 17, 2018 [2 favorites]


My property managers are prohibiting both medical and recreational use anywhere on our complex's property.

With legalization, I would think that there is a Constitutional challenge in order...
posted by JamesBay at 12:23 PM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


Courtesy of reddit:

Can we talk about the amount of packaging cannabis is being sold with?

It's a pretty good point, actually.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 12:23 PM on October 17, 2018 [3 favorites]


Courtesy of reddit:

Can we talk about the amount of packaging cannabis is being sold with?

It's a pretty good point, actually.


Huh, all the flower (and now that I think about it, all the tinctures and oils) that I've had delivered comes in glass. It's not heavy, it's not particularly breakable when packaged properly, and it looks much nicer. If people can ship cosmetics in glass containers they can ship a few grams of weed.
posted by oneirodynia at 12:30 PM on October 17, 2018


If you're on Parliament Hill, in the middle of Ottawa, right on the border between Ontario and Quebec, the nearest place to legally buy the stuff is apparently in Mirabel, about a hundred miles away. Ontario has no nearby retail outlets because Doug Ford; Quebec has none because Quebec. There are obviously much more convenient places to buy weed, but it might make just enough of an excuse for a road trip. I'll probably think it's a good idea, later.
posted by sfenders at 12:31 PM on October 17, 2018




"My property managers are prohibiting both medical and recreational use anywhere on our complex's property."

I've never lived anywhere that expressly allowed any kind of smoking indoors, even where weed is legal. Didn't stop anyone from doing it, of course. Real question is will be how/if they enforce it.
posted by GoblinHoney at 1:07 PM on October 17, 2018


THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL I AM USING A CREDIT CARD TO BUY DRUGS FROM A GOVERNMENT WEBSITE

I'm of the opposite inclination: I want to wander into a police station and ask their advice on where to lawfully purchase marijuana, just because I can.
posted by justsomebodythatyouusedtoknow at 1:16 PM on October 17, 2018 [2 favorites]


I've never lived anywhere that expressly allowed any kind of smoking indoors, even where weed is legal. Didn't stop anyone from doing it, of course. Real question is will be how/if they enforce it.

While I don't think that a property management agency or strata council could outright ban the consumption of cannabis, they can certainly ban smoking it, based on strong municipal by-laws against indoor smoke that are backed by guidelines by the chief medical officer of the local health authority.

By allowing or neglecting to enforce a smoking ban, a landlord is leaving themselves open to significant legal liability. I, for one, would aggressively seek to prevent neighbors from smoking cannabis in common areas, including outdoors on sundecks, patios or balconies.

It's really easy to call by-law enforcement. I've never done this, although I have asked the property manager to enforce the no-smoking by-law in our common courtyard, where kids play.

If you're smoking indoors you generally have to disclose this to your landlord and to your insurance company, anyway. You're setting yourself up for significant legal liability yourself if you covertly smoke tobacco or cannabis.

As for vaping, if you can do it in your own suite and nobody notices, it's probably going to be okay, especially if you live in a building where a lot of people smoke tobacco.

But cannabis does smell, and you will be detected. Seems unfair, but, then again, there are other ways to consume cannabis.
posted by JamesBay at 1:26 PM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


I don't know exactly why, but as of today, very few places have gotten approval to open in Alberta,

Dope is like the future; it’s here, just not evenly distributed.
posted by nubs at 1:32 PM on October 17, 2018 [6 favorites]


I've never lived anywhere that expressly allowed any kind of smoking indoors, even where weed is legal.

A handful of people I know across different provinces have said that their condo corps and strata councils have recently switched to smoke-inside-your-unit-only regulations so that people don't get unwanted contact highs from using their patios. So much facepalm there.
posted by blerghamot at 2:10 PM on October 17, 2018



So this was the best and weirdest day at work. I'm in a 'I never woulda thunk' mood and have been smiling and giggling for hours. (Going to have my first legal smoke after posting this).

I work in the industry so this is a big deal day for us. We had a happy legalization party at the end of the day. There were big cakes decorated to theme and a whole bunch of swag. The best was the letter from the CEO and GM, congratulating us on hard work, making history and oh by the way here are some tools to help enjoy it (if you so choose). So now I'm the proud owner of company branded rolling papers (really high end ones), branded lighters and a company branded grinder.

I love my job so much.
posted by Jalliah at 2:21 PM on October 17, 2018 [9 favorites]


I'm glad this didn't happen over the summer because all the parks would have stunk of weed even more than they already do. I'm naively hoping that cities will be able to sort things over the winter but even if they did say no smoking weed in city parks I highly doubt they'll be sending by-law inspectors to do anything about it. Happy weed is no longer illegal but either smoke that stuff in the comfort of your home or ingest it in a way that isn't going to stink everything up. Get off my lawn too.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 3:35 PM on October 17, 2018


All right! So last night at five past midnight I logged in to the government site (closest in person store for me is a day’s drive away) and bought some CBD oral spray. I tried to buy capsules too but the site warned they only had limited quantities and even though I put them in my cart, by the time I checked out at 12:20, they were gone—sold out.

I am interested in CBD for relief from arthritis pain and from the delightful middle of the night anxiety and insomnia perimenopause has now brought me. My doctor is very conservative and doesn’t think his patients should take anything more than ibuprofen or Tylenol. I can’t take ibuprofen, and Tylenol is not adequate. (I find him frustrating but there’s a doctor shortage here and it’s almost impossible to switch.)

So I thought, screw it. I’m just buying this stuff once it’s legal. So now the government site has my credit card info and someone probably has snagged my personal info and will spam me forever. And I didn’t pick the one-day shipping option because it didn’t seem available, so I guess I’m hooped if Canada Post goes on strike. But we will see!

As I said to mr. hgg last night, I find it hilarious that I can sit at my kitchen table and use my iPad to order pot from the government. Truly, we live in the future.
posted by hurdy gurdy girl at 4:49 PM on October 17, 2018 [4 favorites]


Dear god, is there no other story in the country or the world for the evening news to cover? FFS even the sports is leading with a story about how the hockey players feel about pot being legal.
posted by nubs at 4:52 PM on October 17, 2018


Dear god, is there no other story in the country or the world for the evening news to cover?

I mean Canada is the first major country to end (a major facet of) the misguided crusade against recreational drugs which has destroyed millions of lives around the world over the past century. It's sort of a big deal.
posted by showbiz_liz at 4:58 PM on October 17, 2018 [8 favorites]


It is a big deal! But there's only so many interviews with the people standing in line, discussions of what the police did or didn't do today, what every politician thinks, interviews with the vendors, government spokespeople, dire health warnings, explanations of the rules, reports on how much was sold, etc., that I can stand before I start to wonder what the news is ignoring in favour of chasing every possible angle on this. I swear, the only person who hasn't been asked about it so far is the weather guy, but he still has a segment or two left, so I'm sure they'll get around to it.

Sorry if I'm harshing the mellow, I guess.
posted by nubs at 5:10 PM on October 17, 2018 [1 favorite]


"The forecast is looking pretty... CLOUDY, if you know what I mean! Haha! Back to you, Marsha!"
posted by showbiz_liz at 5:43 PM on October 17, 2018




The forecast is looking pretty... CLOUDY,

Not joking - at the very end of the broadcast, he complained about being the only person who didn’t do a pot related story, so they asked him to work it into the forecast. And he went with “we should have expected CLOUDY, but...”
posted by nubs at 6:16 PM on October 17, 2018 [3 favorites]


1990 protest
posted by growabrain at 12:58 AM on October 18, 2018


Here in Manitoba the provincial laws are the harshest of all, and prices at around $12 a gram at retail. Brutal, and yet the stores all sold out on day one.

I only hope the additional taxes collected are well spent on, say, our massive Meth problem.

Our police force also happily tweeted their first $600+ ticket of the day.
posted by WinnipegDragon at 5:36 AM on October 18, 2018


Not being able to partake while operating a motor vehicle isn't something I've really got a problem with.
posted by Mitheral at 5:59 AM on October 18, 2018 [2 favorites]


I think WinnipegDragon was more objecting to the snarky attitude on display by the police, rather than endorsing the idea of someone operating a vehicle while high.
posted by nubs at 7:33 AM on October 18, 2018


From the article...

$237: Driver carrying cannabis in or on vehicle (ie: not in trunk; same fine for off-road vehicles)

This got my attention! So in Manitoba you have to carry opened containers of liquor in your trunk (sealed ones are ok) for it to be legal this is probably where this rule is coming from. Haven't found a mention yet of how mj is handled so take care if you're from Manitoba.

And yeah don't toke and drive, the blood THC level stuff is going to be iffy and contested to hell by lawyers but if they catch you in the act...
posted by WaterAndPixels at 7:34 AM on October 18, 2018


In BC alcohol can't be in reach of the driver.
posted by Mitheral at 12:58 PM on October 18, 2018



Change report: Today there was a free flowing convo in our open office about strains of weed, what people like to smoke and how they smoke etc. Basically the same sorts of convos that might occur around beer or wine. Just a general a casual banter. Even though I work at a weed company where these convos occur they're usually off to the side and not so open. And people joined in that weren't the usual people that discussed these things. A couple of those were somewhat surprising.

I found it so interesting that even in a super weed positive environment there was still a carefulness about personal use in the culture. It wasn't apparent to me until today until it wasn't there anymore.

Cool.
posted by Jalliah at 4:48 PM on October 18, 2018 [4 favorites]


CanLII (the free source for Canadian legal decisions) added this gem to the site this week, a sentencing decision from BC in 1937 for possession of cannabis with some highly colourful descriptors.
posted by lookoutbelow at 5:12 PM on October 18, 2018




That little girl is a genius!
posted by WaterAndPixels at 5:19 AM on October 19, 2018


... Well, the earth didn't stop turning, the sky didn't fall and Canada didn't collapse into a state of anarchy...
posted by jkaczor at 6:43 AM on October 19, 2018 [1 favorite]


That little girl is a genius!

Ross sells cookies to stoners: "That's when it occurred to me - the key to my success: the munchies! So I started hitting the NYU dorms around midnight. I am selling cookies by the case! They call me, 'Cookie Duuuuude!'"
posted by paleyellowwithorange at 1:30 AM on October 20, 2018




Wait, did someone say pancakes?

And what does this all mean for the Trailer Park Boys, eh? Does this mean Ricky finally has a legitimate career and job or does he get smoked by Big Cannabis?

No, really, I need to see a post legalization view of Sunnyvale where Ricky still grows the best dope in the province and Julian is managing a passably classy cannabis shop and they've all got plenty of smokes, chips and pepperonis and nice trailers. And everything is calm and boring, and the bottle kids stopped throwing bottles because they have a much nicer school from all the taxed revenue. And Bubbles has a kitty shelter.

I swear I smell pancakes.
posted by loquacious at 4:58 AM on October 20, 2018 [2 favorites]


Does this mean Ricky finally has a legitimate career and job or does he get smoked by Big Cannabis?

Not sure about what the future holds, but the whereabouts of Ricky on October 17 were accounted for by this particular Reddit user.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 2:10 PM on October 20, 2018 [1 favorite]




Canada running out of pot.
posted by Mitheral at 8:14 AM on October 21, 2018


I can only hope that demand drives supply and then supply brings the frigging prices down. I guess in about a year we'll see, when everyone who can is growing a few ounces. I actually do expect the black market to tank completely, and that's great news. I mean if you could only buy zucchini for $40 each but you could have four plants on your balcony and more than you could eat I THINK a lot of people would do that.
posted by seanmpuckett at 6:11 AM on October 22, 2018


In my town they raided the weed stores on the morning of legalization

how does that work?
posted by thelonius at 6:15 AM on October 22, 2018


Thelonius, it was the pre-existing dispensaries (operating in a somewhat grey area) that were raided since they hadn't received their permits yet. It will take a while for things to settle down, there's a huge spike in demand right now, regulations about cannabis are all over the place at the municipal level and medicinal cannabis access will be affected by all that for a while too.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 7:13 AM on October 22, 2018 [2 favorites]


there are, of course, all kinds of cops and lawmakers out there and unfortunately a significant percentage of them are throwbacks when it comes to the marijuana thing. I expect a fair measure of stupid (and ensuing legal battles and whatnot) before all of this settles. Organized crime, of course, will happily cheer on all attempts at enforcement. Already in Quebec which has a legal drinking of eighteen you've got a Premier talking about upping the legal age for marijuana possession and consumption to twenty-one. The Prime Minister, to this credit, has been quick to point out that this will aid and abet the criminalization of young people.
posted by philip-random at 8:41 AM on October 22, 2018 [2 favorites]


I'm no cheerleader for the cops, but this strikes me as a reasonable and fair bit of law enforcement under the new legislation:

York Region police laid charges when they they found a vehicle in Markham with smoke coming from under the hood — but not from engine trouble.

Police say they smelled cannabis, and when they approached the car it began to drive away, so they pulled it over. The driver said he was having engine trouble, police say, and opened the hood to show them.

When officers looked inside, they found more than 1.5 kilograms of dried cannabis stuffed inside a “burnt pillow case,” as well as various accessories including scales, vaccuum sealers, welding masks, butane canisters, fungicide and 32 grams of cannabis resin. It led to charges under the new federal Cannabis Act.

Police laid charges of possession for the purpose of distribution of cannabis, and possession related to the production or distribution. Const. Laura Nicolle said these weren’t the first cannabis charges York police have laid under the new act, but they’re among the most significant.

posted by mandolin conspiracy at 7:06 PM on October 22, 2018


For posterity: My package arrived! It came two days ago but I wasn't able to pick it up from the postal outlet until today. Not bad--it only took two business days to arrive. (Postal strike is rotating and didn't affect my city.)

It came in a rather large box, considering how small the actual product is. Wasteful and not so environmentally friendly, though the packaging was all paper, not plastic. There was red tamper-evident security tape around the box, and I had to sign for it and provide proof I am over 19. The woman at the postal outlet said, completely guilelessly, "There have been a lot of these boxes lately, with security tape, that people have to sign for!"

On the actual product box, there is an elegant, official looking little paper label sealing one end that says "CANNABIS BC--DUTY PAID." There are also a LOT of Health Canada warnings in English and French, highlighted in bright yellow, telling me "WARNING: Regular use of cannabis can increase the risk of psychosis and schizophrenia."

The actual product itself (CBD oil spray) is reeeeeeally ugly; normally when sold through the manufacturer's site it is quite an attractive looking, nicely designed bottle in light blue and white--it sort of looks like something you might buy at a high end spa. The BC Cannabis version is quite hideous, with a cheap looking matte paper label in flat royal blue and white, with a small red "THC" and cannabis leaf stop sign motif. It looks for all the world like a Pritt glue stick. There is another bright yellow Health Canada warning label, this time telling me in English and French that "Cannabis can be addictive. 1 in 11 people who use cannabis will become addicted." The funny thing is there is zero dosing information, which...I mean, it's CBD so probably people would want to use it for medical reasons? Is it odd that I expected it to have instructions? I went to the manufacturer's site to see what they had to say and I learned a lot more, like how many sprays the bottle contains (150) and how long it should take for the effects to set in (30-45 minutes) and to "start slow and low" and wait 2 hours before increasing the dose. It does taste really pleasant though.

I dunno. I guess we will see how it works! I'm hoping it works well for my insomnia and anxiety.
posted by hurdy gurdy girl at 11:02 PM on October 24, 2018 [1 favorite]


You're not the first person I've seen to note the excessive packaging, hopefully they get themselves sorted in that regard.
posted by arcticseal at 6:08 AM on October 25, 2018 [1 favorite]


Media Indigena has a pretty informative look at how legalization is being handled from a First Nations perspective:

Cannabis count: Who’s in and who’s not in Indigenous country?

If you're a podcast person, Episode 137 is a live roundtable discussion recorded live in Winnipeg. They've got Tim Fontaine from Walking Eagle News on the panel so there's some pretty good satire worked into it as well.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 10:47 AM on October 25, 2018


OCS (always a mediocre band, I thought) have gone radio-silence because I hear most of their first day orders haven't even been picked and packed yet.
posted by scruss at 12:10 PM on October 26, 2018


4:20, time to go pick up my government weed from the post office. SQDC is apparently doing better than OCS.
posted by sfenders at 1:26 PM on October 26, 2018


Meanwhile, in Calgary, the Co-op - one of the bigger grocery chains in the area - has opened up it's first weed outlet.
posted by nubs at 1:45 PM on October 26, 2018 [1 favorite]


In predictable OCS data breach news: In a letter sent to the customers on Wednesday, the OCS said it was notified by Canada Post on Nov. 1 that the data for two per cent of customer orders, or about 4,500 orders, had been accessed by an individual.

See what Doug Ford did in closing down the brick and mortar stores?

In happier news, last night we saw two young people getting (joyfully, legally) absolutely miraculous outside our local Vietnamese restaurant in clouds of fragrant smoke.
posted by scruss at 6:05 AM on November 8, 2018 [1 favorite]


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