'The idea for Truth Social started with the duo from the “Apprentice”'
June 28, 2022 6:14 AM Subscribe
Trump's Truth Reuters dives into Truth Social, the Trump-backed social network that, as of this writing, has 2.8 million downloads.
This account of the company’s early challenges is based on interviews with 16 people with knowledge of its operations, all of whom spoke on condition of anonymity, and public filings by DWAC.
The company also faces serious challenges on the legal and financial fronts. DWAC disclosed on Monday that a federal grand jury convened by the Department of Justice (DOJ) in New York has issued subpoenas to all of its directors. The DOJ investigation dovetails with a probe by the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) that the investment company first disclosed in December.
SPAC-tacular.
“The question is whether or not the product has a unique invention,” Ginn said. TMTG, he said, needs to generate differentiated content that users “can’t get on Twitter.”
If by "unique invention" they mean "fascism," that doesn't seem terribly unique. Just terrible.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 7:34 AM on June 28, 2022 [3 favorites]
The company also faces serious challenges on the legal and financial fronts. DWAC disclosed on Monday that a federal grand jury convened by the Department of Justice (DOJ) in New York has issued subpoenas to all of its directors. The DOJ investigation dovetails with a probe by the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) that the investment company first disclosed in December.
SPAC-tacular.
“The question is whether or not the product has a unique invention,” Ginn said. TMTG, he said, needs to generate differentiated content that users “can’t get on Twitter.”
If by "unique invention" they mean "fascism," that doesn't seem terribly unique. Just terrible.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 7:34 AM on June 28, 2022 [3 favorites]
That sure is a lot of people who did not respond for a request for comment.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 7:34 AM on June 28, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by ricochet biscuit at 7:34 AM on June 28, 2022 [2 favorites]
(Not to thread-sit, but I'm kind of hung up on the 2.8 million downloads. There aren't nearly as many hardcore Trumpists as we think.)
posted by box at 7:43 AM on June 28, 2022 [7 favorites]
posted by box at 7:43 AM on June 28, 2022 [7 favorites]
Interestingly enough I can back up this point from the article:
Trump Media & Technology Group (TMTG) has struggled to develop its social media platform since its February 2021 founding because its managers have sought to avoid potential corporate partners and employees perceived as politically liberal in a Silicon Valley-based industry that skews left, said three people with knowledge of its operations.
I said it in the Dobbs thread, but - a high school friend works in HR as a recruiter; he works remotely, recruiting nationwide for people who are also hiring remote workers nationwide. On Friday he had an interview with a middle-aged dude about a position, and the guy asked him what the "company culture" was. My friend says he really doesn't like those questions, because it's a total judgement-call thing, so he just said something like, "well...it's a tech firm, based in San Francisco, that's working on making medical testing more accessible and more affordable. So...I guess assume from that what you like."
The guy withdrew his application, saying that he was bummed about having to walk away from "what sounded like a cool job" because he "didn't want to work with Biden-lovers".
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:50 AM on June 28, 2022 [14 favorites]
Trump Media & Technology Group (TMTG) has struggled to develop its social media platform since its February 2021 founding because its managers have sought to avoid potential corporate partners and employees perceived as politically liberal in a Silicon Valley-based industry that skews left, said three people with knowledge of its operations.
I said it in the Dobbs thread, but - a high school friend works in HR as a recruiter; he works remotely, recruiting nationwide for people who are also hiring remote workers nationwide. On Friday he had an interview with a middle-aged dude about a position, and the guy asked him what the "company culture" was. My friend says he really doesn't like those questions, because it's a total judgement-call thing, so he just said something like, "well...it's a tech firm, based in San Francisco, that's working on making medical testing more accessible and more affordable. So...I guess assume from that what you like."
The guy withdrew his application, saying that he was bummed about having to walk away from "what sounded like a cool job" because he "didn't want to work with Biden-lovers".
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:50 AM on June 28, 2022 [14 favorites]
I'm kind of hung up on the 2.8 million downloads. There aren't nearly as many hardcore Trumpists as we think.
But there are still 2.8 million too many.
posted by xedrik at 7:51 AM on June 28, 2022 [4 favorites]
But there are still 2.8 million too many.
posted by xedrik at 7:51 AM on June 28, 2022 [4 favorites]
(Not to thread-sit, but I'm kind of hung up on the 2.8 million downloads. There aren't nearly as many hardcore Trumpists as we think.)
And how many of those downloads are just from people who, you know, want to keep track of what they're up to over there?
posted by Halloween Jack at 7:53 AM on June 28, 2022 [7 favorites]
And how many of those downloads are just from people who, you know, want to keep track of what they're up to over there?
posted by Halloween Jack at 7:53 AM on June 28, 2022 [7 favorites]
And how many are bots?
posted by slater at 7:59 AM on June 28, 2022 [16 favorites]
posted by slater at 7:59 AM on June 28, 2022 [16 favorites]
Seen in the context other Trump-connected business ventures, the goal likely never was the platform. If that was a byproduct by virtue of happy accident, fine, but...
...the grift is to scrape up financing with something that appeals to Trump supporters, strip the money out in the form of salaries and/or payments to Trump-connected companies, and let the thing collapse. The alleged product or service being flogged is just the premise for the grift.
Fastly, a content-delivery network provider, told Reuters it rejected a request to provide services for Truth Social. The company, which provides a system allowing for fast and reliable web access, said someone signed up online with a personal email address in September and “ultimately tried to configure service with a truthsocial domain on our system.” The company said it shut the account down for violating its terms of service but declined to comment on the specific violation.
There's also the risk of any provider not getting paid for services it's rendered when the thing tanks by design. See also: bust out.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 7:59 AM on June 28, 2022 [27 favorites]
...the grift is to scrape up financing with something that appeals to Trump supporters, strip the money out in the form of salaries and/or payments to Trump-connected companies, and let the thing collapse. The alleged product or service being flogged is just the premise for the grift.
Fastly, a content-delivery network provider, told Reuters it rejected a request to provide services for Truth Social. The company, which provides a system allowing for fast and reliable web access, said someone signed up online with a personal email address in September and “ultimately tried to configure service with a truthsocial domain on our system.” The company said it shut the account down for violating its terms of service but declined to comment on the specific violation.
There's also the risk of any provider not getting paid for services it's rendered when the thing tanks by design. See also: bust out.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 7:59 AM on June 28, 2022 [27 favorites]
I'm not surprised it's only 2.8 million downloads.
There are no libs to own on Truth, and anything Trump posts is dutifully transcribed to Fox News immediately, so why join?
posted by The Monster at the End of this Thread at 8:02 AM on June 28, 2022 [3 favorites]
There are no libs to own on Truth, and anything Trump posts is dutifully transcribed to Fox News immediately, so why join?
posted by The Monster at the End of this Thread at 8:02 AM on June 28, 2022 [3 favorites]
The identities of two key TMTG executives – Chief Product Officer Billy Boozer, and the company’s second of three chief technology officers, Josh Adams – were not publicly known until Reuters exclusively reported in April that they had resigned after a brief and tumultuous tenure.
Boozer and Adams did not respond to requests for comment.
"Boozer and Adams" sounds like a reboot of "Turner and Hooch" for the MAGA set.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:06 AM on June 28, 2022 [8 favorites]
Boozer and Adams did not respond to requests for comment.
"Boozer and Adams" sounds like a reboot of "Turner and Hooch" for the MAGA set.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:06 AM on June 28, 2022 [8 favorites]
Boozer and Adams. You don't want a criminal lawyer...you want a criminal lawyer.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:08 AM on June 28, 2022 [16 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 8:08 AM on June 28, 2022 [16 favorites]
The hilarious thing about the "2.8 million downloads" stat is they are counting downloads. Like it's some 1997 shareware app. No one cares how many copies of the client were downloaded. The important statistics are registered users, monthly active users, and other usage metrics that are standard for publicly traded social media companies.
I assume the reporters are talking about downloads because it's a publicly available statistic they can collect themselves. And that Truth Social isn't reporting meaningful metrics. (Which brings us back to the founding fraud in the SPAC, being investigated.) Some reporting cites this April 30 Forbes blog post with a claim of "2 million active users" but AFAICT the author just pulls that number out of a hat. MarketWatch published "513,000 daily active users" on April 4, 2022 but again it's unclear how reliable that number is. Or what it is now, three months later.
Bottom line: Truth Social is still very small. Also they're not telling anyone how small they are. Since launch on Feb 21 $DWAC is down 65%; compare 19% for NASDAQ.
posted by Nelson at 8:24 AM on June 28, 2022 [19 favorites]
I assume the reporters are talking about downloads because it's a publicly available statistic they can collect themselves. And that Truth Social isn't reporting meaningful metrics. (Which brings us back to the founding fraud in the SPAC, being investigated.) Some reporting cites this April 30 Forbes blog post with a claim of "2 million active users" but AFAICT the author just pulls that number out of a hat. MarketWatch published "513,000 daily active users" on April 4, 2022 but again it's unclear how reliable that number is. Or what it is now, three months later.
Bottom line: Truth Social is still very small. Also they're not telling anyone how small they are. Since launch on Feb 21 $DWAC is down 65%; compare 19% for NASDAQ.
posted by Nelson at 8:24 AM on June 28, 2022 [19 favorites]
Ok, I know it's grift and success is not really one of their aspirations, but it's also a libertarians and bears story. They say they're going to start a social media site with free speech absolutism and no moderation tools? It's going to burn down and get eaten by pitchforks.
This is also how I feel about Elon and Twitter. Like, ok, buy that millstone and put it around your own neck. And tie your own arms behind your back while you're at it, why not?
posted by Horkus at 8:37 AM on June 28, 2022 [1 favorite]
This is also how I feel about Elon and Twitter. Like, ok, buy that millstone and put it around your own neck. And tie your own arms behind your back while you're at it, why not?
posted by Horkus at 8:37 AM on June 28, 2022 [1 favorite]
Bottom line: Truth Social is still very small.
I think this past Friday's SCOTUS ruling is a warning about the dangers of assuming that a force might be too small to cause an impact.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:38 AM on June 28, 2022 [11 favorites]
I think this past Friday's SCOTUS ruling is a warning about the dangers of assuming that a force might be too small to cause an impact.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:38 AM on June 28, 2022 [11 favorites]
There's also the risk of any provider not getting paid for services
Surely a mega-billionaire who has legendary success in the business world is not going to... oh wait
posted by ricochet biscuit at 8:39 AM on June 28, 2022 [1 favorite]
Surely a mega-billionaire who has legendary success in the business world is not going to... oh wait
posted by ricochet biscuit at 8:39 AM on June 28, 2022 [1 favorite]
As the article notes they don't have a functioning android app...so that's 40% of smartphone users right there. And their web portal only just came online in may.
But still. If this pathetic stale-piss-filled sandbox can keep the Trumpoids in their echo chamber - especially while prosecutions mount - it's not a bad solution.
posted by lalochezia at 9:27 AM on June 28, 2022 [2 favorites]
But still. If this pathetic stale-piss-filled sandbox can keep the Trumpoids in their echo chamber - especially while prosecutions mount - it's not a bad solution.
posted by lalochezia at 9:27 AM on June 28, 2022 [2 favorites]
Many engineers and tech firms won’t consider working with a Trump company… like everyone else who knows they won't be payed.
[edit]
(what ricochet biscuit said)
posted by farlukar at 9:53 AM on June 28, 2022 [2 favorites]
nelson: Bottom line: Truth Social is still very small. Also they're not telling anyone how small they are. Since launch on Feb 21 $DWAC is down 65%; compare 19% for NASDAQ.
Not to mention that “DWAC” is an arcane inside baseball back office function in the US securities market that makes for an interesting choice of ticker symbol. I’m certain that there is a non-zero number of trades executed for DWAC when they intended to carry out this function instead.
posted by dr_dank at 10:07 AM on June 28, 2022 [2 favorites]
Not to mention that “DWAC” is an arcane inside baseball back office function in the US securities market that makes for an interesting choice of ticker symbol. I’m certain that there is a non-zero number of trades executed for DWAC when they intended to carry out this function instead.
posted by dr_dank at 10:07 AM on June 28, 2022 [2 favorites]
As the article notes they don't have a functioning android app...so that's 40% of smartphone users right there.
Maybe more in their target demo. I've never seen a reliable breakdown of smartphone OS vs. political affiliation, but it seems anecdotally like the conservatives I (have to) interact with are more likely than average to have Android phones.
The whole project is just clown shoes. If only they were this incompetent when it came to completely fucking up the country.
posted by Kadin2048 at 11:29 AM on June 28, 2022 [1 favorite]
Maybe more in their target demo. I've never seen a reliable breakdown of smartphone OS vs. political affiliation, but it seems anecdotally like the conservatives I (have to) interact with are more likely than average to have Android phones.
The whole project is just clown shoes. If only they were this incompetent when it came to completely fucking up the country.
posted by Kadin2048 at 11:29 AM on June 28, 2022 [1 favorite]
The hilarious thing about the "2.8 million downloads" stat is they are counting downloads. Like it's some 1997 shareware app.
Shhh...I'm waiting for Napster to download.
posted by kirkaracha at 12:38 PM on June 28, 2022 [2 favorites]
Shhh...I'm waiting for Napster to download.
posted by kirkaracha at 12:38 PM on June 28, 2022 [2 favorites]
If it DWACs like a duck...
posted by kirkaracha at 12:38 PM on June 28, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 12:38 PM on June 28, 2022 [2 favorites]
They ripped off mastodon code? Honestly wouldn't be surprised if the entire back end was ircd.
Remember when someone scraped the entirety of parlour? The magic trick was realizing that every post was numbered sequentially, so you could take the whole thing with three lines of python.
They're bad at this. And the ones that are good probably prefer to get paid.
posted by adept256 at 5:03 PM on June 28, 2022 [4 favorites]
Remember when someone scraped the entirety of parlour? The magic trick was realizing that every post was numbered sequentially, so you could take the whole thing with three lines of python.
They're bad at this. And the ones that are good probably prefer to get paid.
posted by adept256 at 5:03 PM on June 28, 2022 [4 favorites]
How do the # of users of this social media compare to Gab and Parlor and related social media sites?
posted by Grandysaur at 8:38 PM on June 28, 2022
posted by Grandysaur at 8:38 PM on June 28, 2022
Ummm, hate to piss on the parade here, but I don't think the number of downloads for this piece of crap is in any way indicative of a low number of true believers.
I drove from Minneapolis to Denver today and was constantly subjected to Trump shit plastered all over the side of the road ("Trump / DeSantis 2024" being the most terrifying). I also passed a couple of confederate flags being proudly flown in front of houses in central Nebraska (remember folks--it's not racism. It's southern heritage!).
Wishful thinking isn't making them go away.
posted by Ickster at 12:26 AM on June 29, 2022 [2 favorites]
I drove from Minneapolis to Denver today and was constantly subjected to Trump shit plastered all over the side of the road ("Trump / DeSantis 2024" being the most terrifying). I also passed a couple of confederate flags being proudly flown in front of houses in central Nebraska (remember folks--it's not racism. It's southern heritage!).
Wishful thinking isn't making them go away.
posted by Ickster at 12:26 AM on June 29, 2022 [2 favorites]
Those measures are extremely vulnerable to that great problem of the age, selection bias. The right is very loud and argumentative, and knows how to manipulate perceptions.
You notice houses with Confederate flags a lot more than the ones that don't. You could counter that they represent the tip of an iceberg, but that still doesn't tell us how large the iceberg is.
Billboards are not erected due to popular acclaim, but by whoever pays for them. There was a prominent billboard by the road on I-95 outside our town with a picture of an eagle and the message "Deplorables, you know what to do!" before the 2020 election, but Georgia went to Biden. There was another such billboard against, I believe it was, Warnock for Senate, instead saying we should vote for a "Georgia Peach" in the form of Kelly Loeffler, who in fact comes from Illinois.
The right has become very good at taking advantage of selection bias. They regularly get the most bullshit things up on the Twitter trending sidebar with their army of shills and bots, things like #ImpeachBiden, even though there wasn't any true groundswell for that term even among Republicans. They do this all the time.
posted by JHarris at 4:21 AM on June 29, 2022 [5 favorites]
You notice houses with Confederate flags a lot more than the ones that don't. You could counter that they represent the tip of an iceberg, but that still doesn't tell us how large the iceberg is.
Billboards are not erected due to popular acclaim, but by whoever pays for them. There was a prominent billboard by the road on I-95 outside our town with a picture of an eagle and the message "Deplorables, you know what to do!" before the 2020 election, but Georgia went to Biden. There was another such billboard against, I believe it was, Warnock for Senate, instead saying we should vote for a "Georgia Peach" in the form of Kelly Loeffler, who in fact comes from Illinois.
The right has become very good at taking advantage of selection bias. They regularly get the most bullshit things up on the Twitter trending sidebar with their army of shills and bots, things like #ImpeachBiden, even though there wasn't any true groundswell for that term even among Republicans. They do this all the time.
posted by JHarris at 4:21 AM on June 29, 2022 [5 favorites]
Billboards are not erected due to popular acclaim, but by whoever pays for them.
The Democrats would be well advised to remind people of this. The Kochs, the Waltons, the DeVos clan, Peter Theil, etc. are buying political power for their agendas and personal benefit.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 6:31 AM on June 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
The Democrats would be well advised to remind people of this. The Kochs, the Waltons, the DeVos clan, Peter Theil, etc. are buying political power for their agendas and personal benefit.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 6:31 AM on June 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
The Democrats would be well advised to remind people of this.
Or maybe to rent some billboards? i40 is just the same with endless numbers of Obama as Hitler, Trump flags, and Biden is the devil billboards.
posted by The_Vegetables at 8:08 AM on June 29, 2022 [2 favorites]
Or maybe to rent some billboards? i40 is just the same with endless numbers of Obama as Hitler, Trump flags, and Biden is the devil billboards.
posted by The_Vegetables at 8:08 AM on June 29, 2022 [2 favorites]
FWIW, I was talking about yards and personal vehicles, not billboards.
posted by Ickster at 8:24 AM on June 29, 2022
posted by Ickster at 8:24 AM on June 29, 2022
FWIW, I was talking about yards and personal vehicles, not billboards.
Same thing though - I mean all that personal yard signs tells you is that Trump people are likely to live adjacent to highways. My point is that they also understand the value of regular signs keeping their issues at the front of your mind and that even if Democrats can't match them in yard signs, they could in billboards.
posted by The_Vegetables at 8:48 AM on June 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
Same thing though - I mean all that personal yard signs tells you is that Trump people are likely to live adjacent to highways. My point is that they also understand the value of regular signs keeping their issues at the front of your mind and that even if Democrats can't match them in yard signs, they could in billboards.
posted by The_Vegetables at 8:48 AM on June 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
I think TRUMP WON'T PAY would make a good yard sign. Pick a suitable typeface and color scheme and the magahats could probably be persuaded to read it as a defiant prediction about the results of the Jan 6th hearings and amplify it.
posted by flabdablet at 9:38 PM on June 29, 2022
posted by flabdablet at 9:38 PM on June 29, 2022
And at some point it could probably be morphed into TRUMP DOESN'T PAY, which apart from being totally factual has some nice cliche resonances to help associate the name a little more strongly with crime.
That should work quite well on magahats, a group I see as particularly susceptible to caring what weighs the same as a duck.
posted by flabdablet at 10:11 PM on June 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
That should work quite well on magahats, a group I see as particularly susceptible to caring what weighs the same as a duck.
posted by flabdablet at 10:11 PM on June 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
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