There goes Mr. Humbug, there goes Mr. Grim

December 11, 2022 1:17 PM

On December 11th, 1992, The Muppet Christmas Carol was released. Gregory Wakeman finds out how grief and addiction helped shape a film that still has a huge following 30 years on. The Muppets reminisce with Brett Goldstein about making the movie.

Soundtrack playlist on YouTube and Spotify.

Streaming on Disney+ (with the extended cut including The Love is Gone included in the Extras section).

The Muppet Christmas Carol previously on the blue: bloopers, fake Michael Caine commentary on the film, one mefi's Christmas movie countdown circa 2013, Guardian interview with director Brian Henson and puppeteers/performers Steve Whitmire and Dave Goelz, the case that The Muppet Christmas Carol is the best adaptation of the Dickens classic (with the cases for many other versions in the comments), and Michael Caine loves The Muppet Christmas Carol as much as you do.

Also on Fanfare.

God bless us every one!

posted by the primroses were over (90 comments total)

Wait wait wait wait. THIRTY YEARS??? This is unpossible.

There was one year when mr hippybear and I watched something like 29 versions of A Christmas Carol within a month. They were just all on the satellite service and we kept watching them as they appeared. Mr hippybear is a major Dickens fan, so he's got his coffee table book of ACC out and is following along and commenting on where things are deviating or when original dialogue is being used...

We stand by our judgement that The Muppet Christmas Carol is the best version. He has to always watch the Alastair Sim version, because that's how he do, but TMCC is really the one that always brings the holiday (that we don't really observe much) home for us.

Honestly, I don't know why the brilliance of TMCC hasn't been more widely realized, and The Muppets aren't doing a whole giant run of adaptations of classics. The source material is time tested for quality, and people play endless games about casting various Muppets in different roles in different stories. With the exception of the 2011 film The Muppets, their last few efforts (Muppets Most Wanted, the tv series "the muppets.", they really haven't done anything that captures the real magic they had.

Anyway I have strong feelings about this. And now I have another strong feeling because there is NO WAY it's been three decades!
posted by hippybear at 1:38 PM on December 11, 2022 [27 favorites]

Love this movie! Last year, at the request of wenestvedt, I even wrote a mashup of "One More Sleep til Christmas" and "No Sleep Til Brooklyn" in honor of the Muppets (among other Muppet Christmas Carol parodies):

No sleep 'til
Christmas!

Magic in the air never ever false care
Beeker’s chillin’ distilling nog I swear
His nog's ain't just nog, it's liquid excitement
If the whole city’s smilin’ ain’t no indictment

On a world tour, singing ‘cause our heart’s pure
Electric Mayhem always a whirlwind
Meetin’ Sweetums, STOP!... to say “hello” to him
Ain’t no strangers on the way to Elohim

Ain't no B.S., the season to be joyous
Bringing gifts to Cratchit’s kids
And every girl and boy, yes
While you're in your night caps, Mayhem’s kickin' gift raps

No sleep 'til -
Another town - another roof
Another Christmas Carol spoof
Another star – it shines so bright
Another sleigh ride night

Our manager's Fozzie, he always jokes & busts
Animal pulls his own sleigh, Rowlf, he drives the bus
There's something in the wind tonight, from France to Fraggle Rock
Santa’s got a helper, Gonzo’s on the clock

We're rescuing Christmas like it's going out of style
Spreading joy along the way because it's worth your while
Four on the floor - Statler's out the door
Janice's in the back with Camilla packin’ Santa’s sack
We got Grover in the trunk with money in a stack
Scooter’s in the front and Big Bird's on the roof rack
‘Cause faith is in our hearts tonight

No sleep 'til
No sleep 'til
Christmas!
No sleep 'til
Christmas!

No sleep 'til
No sleep 'til
Christmas!
No sleep 'til
Christmas!
No sleep 'til
Christmas!
No sleep 'til
Christmas!
Yeahh!!

No sleep 'til
Christmas!
No sleep 'til
Christmas!
No sleep 'til
Christmas!
No sleep 'til
Christmas!
No sleep 'til
Christmas!
No sleep 'til
Christmas!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 1:52 PM on December 11, 2022 [17 favorites]

I had my heart broken when my sister and her kids visited for Christmas a few years ago. I asked them if they've seen my favorite Christmas movie (they had not) and put on the Muppets Christmas Carol projected large on the living room wall, and went back to kitchen prep. Fifteen minutes later I come back into the room and the kids had discovered some great new anime instead.
Fa la la.

I love this movie. My partner and I usually reference Gonzo's great line about Tiny Tim, "who did NOT die!" about once every few months.

I also go giddy over Rizzo's, "Light the lamp, not the rat! Light the lamp, not the rat!"
posted by inkytea at 2:04 PM on December 11, 2022 [9 favorites]

I asked them if they've seen my favorite Christmas movie (they had not) and put on the Muppets Christmas Carol projected large on the living room wall, and went back to kitchen prep. Fifteen minutes later I come back into the room and the kids had discovered some great new anime instead.

And you've never had them back for the holidays. Right? RIGHT????
posted by hippybear at 2:09 PM on December 11, 2022 [4 favorites]

I would watch the hell out of Muppet Sunset Boulevard.

hippybear, your story reminds me of the night I watched every adaptation of "The Fall of the House of Usher" I could get my hands on.
posted by The Underpants Monster at 2:10 PM on December 11, 2022

And you've never had them back for the holidays. Right? RIGHT????

Only incidentally, but yes. That's correct!
posted by inkytea at 2:16 PM on December 11, 2022 [1 favorite]

I think this is going to be my Muppet Christmas. In the queue as well: John Denver and The Muppets - A Christmas Together 1979, A Muppet Family Christmas (1987). Delightfully, the latter includes the ads that were broadcast with it.
posted by Nelson at 2:16 PM on December 11, 2022 [14 favorites]

I took my daughter to watch this earlier today at the Prince Charles Cinema, which is a great cinema in London that shows old and classic films. It’s the first time I’ve seen it on a big screen. We both cried over Christmas yet to come, the whole cinema clapped at the end. It was the best afternoon.

We put the tree and the lights up yesterday, but today was the proper start of the festive season for us.
posted by greycap at 2:23 PM on December 11, 2022 [9 favorites]

There's not a false note in the movie, and I love all of it, but there's a special place in my heart for the reveal that all the Cratchit boys are frogs while their sisters are pigs. Because of course.
posted by The Underpants Monster at 2:24 PM on December 11, 2022 [12 favorites]

I love this movie. My partner and I usually reference Gonzo's great line about Tiny Tim, "who did NOT die!" about once every few months.

The best part of that is that that's not Muppets, that's pure Dickens. Not is even in small caps, I think.
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 2:25 PM on December 11, 2022 [21 favorites]

Re "kids today" I've actually found that a lot of them just don't connect to the Muppets the same way as I did. I had to learn not to take that personally.

If they wanna watch anime, let 'em. Maybe their kids will rediscover a love of wacky felt creatures having nervous breakdowns.

I didn't imprint on this Muppet movie (too old when it came out) so my Christmas Carol love is still for the weird-ass musical 1970 version with Albert Finney. But it's a warm and cute version, and apparently the costumes are incredibly historically accurate, which is always going to appeal to the historical costume nerd in me.
posted by emjaybee at 2:26 PM on December 11, 2022 [4 favorites]

I remember a 6$ late fee for this movie, a movie I watch every year, nothing more to say then I love this and that's enough.
posted by clavdivs at 2:29 PM on December 11, 2022 [1 favorite]

Honestly, I don't know why the brilliance of TMCC hasn't been more widely realized, and The Muppets aren't doing a whole giant run of adaptations of classics.

I mean, hear me out: Muppet Dune.
posted by mhoye at 2:30 PM on December 11, 2022 [25 favorites]

I mean, hear me out: Muppet Dune.

I've got Gonzo as Paul.... Not sure where else to go with the casting. Piggy as Jessica? Camilla as Jessica?
posted by hippybear at 2:32 PM on December 11, 2022 [2 favorites]

The best part of that is that that's not Muppets, that's pure Dickens. Not is even in small caps, I think.

One of my favorite phrases in literature, a ringing, triumphant insistance that it's never to late to turn it all around. If not today, maybe tomorrow; if not tomorrow, well, maybe on Christmas.
posted by longtime_lurker at 2:35 PM on December 11, 2022 [8 favorites]

(Dune is sadly still under copyright, however... so I think Muppet Moby Dick is more likely.)
posted by hippybear at 2:37 PM on December 11, 2022 [1 favorite]

This is my family's special Christmas movie. We watch Rudolph and the Grinch and the Care Bears Nutcracker, but this is the special one.

It started when my husband and I were just married? Dating? And we've watched it every year for ages, now with our kid. The current ritual is to bring the TV upstairs (it lives in the basement the rest of the time) so we can watch by the tree. We get pigs in a blanket, sausage balls, cookies, some cheese and crackers, and we have a little snack dinner while we watch. We only watch one per year, but by the kid's demand we listen to the soundtrack in the car a lot. I saw this post less than ten minutes after finishing "Scrooge" in the car on a trip back from the library.

It's such a perfect movie. Gonzo is great, Michael Caine is amazing, and there's so much unadulterated Dickens in it. You wouldn't expect an adaptation that adds a Bob Marley reference and singing lettuces to be so faithful to the original, but it really is.

Also I've mentioned this on Metafilter before, but every year I cry when Beaker gives Scrooge his little scarf. You'd think eventually I'd stop, but no. It'll happen this year I'm sure.
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 2:40 PM on December 11, 2022 [10 favorites]

Apologies if it's already linked somewhere in the previouslies, but "I don’t know if I can contain my 'The Muppet Christmas Carol has better costume design than most Oscar-nominated period dramas' rant […]"
posted by wreckingball at 2:41 PM on December 11, 2022 [31 favorites]

I can tell that no one's watched the delightful Brett Goldstein video (he genuinely loves MCC to the point that a few years ago pre Ted Lasso he did a live one man version). Because no one has mentioned the brilliant idea from that video - Muppet Pride and Prejudice, with Goldstein as Darcy and Miss Piggy as Elizabeth Bennet.
posted by Superilla at 2:46 PM on December 11, 2022 [15 favorites]

I can tell that no one's watched the delightful Brett Goldstein video (he genuinely loves MCC to the point that a few years ago pre Ted Lasso he did a live one man version ). Because no one has mentioned the brilliant idea from that video - Muppet Pride and Prejudice, with Goldstein as Darcy and Miss Piggy as Elizabeth Bennet.

The Goldstein interview is where I got "Muppet Sunset Boulevard," referenced in my comment above.
posted by The Underpants Monster at 2:50 PM on December 11, 2022 [1 favorite]

"Life is made up of meetings and partings. That is the way of it."

That is a great Kermit quote to drop when in need of finding the good people of the world nearby.
posted by NoThisIsPatrick at 2:53 PM on December 11, 2022 [14 favorites]

I've got Gonzo as Paul.... Not sure where else to go with the casting. Piggy as Jessica? Camilla as Jessica?

Get Dr. Teeth a baliset and I am in.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 3:08 PM on December 11, 2022 [5 favorites]

I mean, hear me out: Muppet Dune.

Ixnay -- Muppets Blue Velvet, Muppets Wild at Heart, Muppets Lost Highway!
posted by y2karl at 3:19 PM on December 11, 2022

Heck, Muppets Eraserhead, Muppets Mulholland Drive and Muppets Elephant Man, too.
posted by y2karl at 3:23 PM on December 11, 2022

Muppets Citizen Kane Muppets The Maltese Falcon
posted by BlunderingArtist at 3:34 PM on December 11, 2022 [1 favorite]

Muppets Big Lebowski.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:38 PM on December 11, 2022 [12 favorites]

Stephen King
@StephenKing
I would like to see the Muppets do LORD OF THE FLIES. That would be cool
posted by clavdivs at 3:41 PM on December 11, 2022 [4 favorites]

Muppets Twin Peaks? Could do things with Owls ...
posted by Richard Upton Pickman at 3:41 PM on December 11, 2022

Amuppcalypse Now
posted by clavdivs at 3:42 PM on December 11, 2022 [5 favorites]

Does Mr. Magoo make an appearance? No? Then it's OBVIOUSLY NOT the best version of A Christmas Carol! I'm taking no questions, at this time.
posted by evilDoug at 4:02 PM on December 11, 2022 [6 favorites]

Also, Kids these days! and in case I forgot to mention: GET OFFA MY LAWN!
posted by evilDoug at 4:03 PM on December 11, 2022

I'm going to commit my annual Christmas heresy and say that while I love all things Muppet and this film in particular...I think it would be better without the songs, which are far from Paul Williams's best work.

My stocking stands hung for coal deliveries.
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 4:03 PM on December 11, 2022 [3 favorites]

I adore this film, and it gets played every Christmas in our house.

If I had one quibble (and it's tiny), it's that the designs of the two Miss Piggy daughters are not very expressive. They kind of weird me out a bit (especially when they nod and harumph at the same time).
posted by AlonzoMosleyFBI at 4:08 PM on December 11, 2022

Mr. Magoo's Christmas Carol
In my alternate universe, Hammer films made a couple of different versions of this: The Fall of the House of Scrooge, and of course the classic The Abominable Mr. Scrooge!
There is no truth to the rumor that they made and never released The Wicker Scrooge.
posted by evilDoug at 4:12 PM on December 11, 2022 [6 favorites]

From Tumblr:

Ebenezer Scrooge: *Goes outside*
500 Muppets: There goes Mr Asshole! There Goes Mr Bitch!
posted by tzikeh at 4:14 PM on December 11, 2022 [16 favorites]

I thought this was too bad to not share. "Write the script for Eraserhead starring The Muppets"

FADE IN:

EXT. OUTSIDE A SMALL, DINGY APARTMENT - DAY

We see a small, dingy apartment, surrounded by darkness and fog. The only sound is the sound of a small stream running nearby.

Suddenly, we hear a loud banging on the door. A deep voice shouts from the other side.

VOICE (O.S)

Open up! It's the Muppets!

The door flies open, and in come the Muppets. They are a motley crew of colorful characters: Kermit the Frog, Gonzo the Great, Fozzie Bear, Miss Piggy, and Animal.

KERMIT

We're here to help Henry Spencer erase his head!

The Muppets enter the apartment and find Henry Spencer, a nervous, disheveled man, sitting in a chair in the middle of the room.

KERMIT

(to Henry)

Hi, we're the Muppets. We heard you needed some help erasing your head.

Henry looks up at the Muppets, confused.

HENRY

Erasing my head? What are you talking about?

KERMIT

We heard that you were having trouble erasing your head, and we want to help.

GONZO

Yeah, we can help you erase your head with our special Muppet eraser!

The Muppets pull out a giant eraser, and Henry looks at them skeptically.

HENRY

I don't know about this...

KERMIT

Trust us, Henry. We know what we're doing.

Fozzie and Animal start to rub the eraser all over Henry's head, while Kermit and Miss Piggy sing a silly song.

KERMIT AND MISS PIGGY (singing)

Erase your head, erase your head, erase it until it's all gone!

Henry starts to chuckle, and eventually he is laughing hysterically. Finally, the erasing is complete, and Henry's head is clean and smooth.

The Muppets cheer in celebration.

HENRY

Thank you! I don't know what I would have done without you!

KERMIT

Anytime, Henry. Anytime.

The Muppets wave goodbye

posted by credulous at 4:14 PM on December 11, 2022 [12 favorites]

For those of you who worry Kids Today just don't get the Muppets, my offspring, aged 5 and 9, fucking love them some Muppet movies. Muppet Treasure Island is probably their favourite (and who can blame them?) but they'll watch Muppet Christmas Carol beginning to end.

And I'm extremely bored of P&P adaptations, but would quite happily go for a Muppets P&P. Exceptions for rules - I don't like most Dickens adaptations either. They tend to miss he was writing pulp, and try to make it super serious Licheratchure instead of just having fun with it. I think that's one of the reasons the Muppets Christmas Carol does so well, it understands that it's not Serious.
posted by Jilder at 4:39 PM on December 11, 2022 [6 favorites]

I mean, hear me out: Muppet Dune

Gonzo- Paul
Piggy - Gaius Mohiam
Kermit - Duke Leo
Janis - Lady Jessica
Rolf - Duncan Idaho
Dr Honeydew - Thufir Hawat
Sam Eagle - Gurney Halleck
Beaker - Piter De Vries
Scooter - Fayed
Fozzie - Rabban
Link (pig) - Shaddam
posted by djseafood at 4:43 PM on December 11, 2022 [2 favorites]

I think it would be better without the songs, which are far from Paul Williams's best work.

Speaking of "not their best work", I really enjoyed the concept and script and acting in the ACC spinoff "Spirited" that is now on Apple+, but goddamn the songs in that feel like they were all written in one weekend with no revision at all. Pretty much ruined the thing for me even while I found much of it delightful.
posted by hippybear at 4:46 PM on December 11, 2022

I mean, hear me out: Muppet Dune

Gonzo- Paul
Piggy - Gaius Mohiam
Kermit - Duke Leo
Janis - Lady Jessica
Rolf - Duncan Idaho
Dr Honeydew - Thufir Hawat
Sam Eagle - Gurney Halleck
Beaker - Piter De Vries
Scooter - Fayed
Fozzie - Rabban
Link (pig) - Shaddam

Statler And Waldorf as The Brothers Harkonnen.
posted by hippybear at 4:47 PM on December 11, 2022 [4 favorites]

A therapist and a film maker's take on Scrooge in TMCC.
posted by kathrynm at 5:02 PM on December 11, 2022 [1 favorite]

Every time this film comes up on the blue I try to find a video link but can't. I have a clear memory of at release time, there was an interview of Gonzo on (I think it was) CNN and amongst it all he says "The movie has humans and muppets, and I have to say the humans are very lifelike."
posted by hearthpig at 5:08 PM on December 11, 2022 [10 favorites]

Eraserhead more or less is Muppet Eraserhead. There's the baby, and the chickens ...

Apropos of nothing I thought of the Muppets' I Feel Pretty today and started to sing it. It always makes me feel pretty, too.
posted by Countess Elena at 5:35 PM on December 11, 2022 [2 favorites]

Pepe the King Prawn as Colonel Walter E. Kurtz

Kermit the Frog as Captain Benjamin L. Willard

Animal as Lieutenant Colonel Bill Kilgore

The Swedish Chef as Jay 'Chef' Hicks

Fozie Bear as Lance B. Johnson

Clifford as Tyrone 'Clean' Miller

Dr. Bunsen Honeydew as Chief Phillips

Beaker as " photo journalist"

Harrison Ford as Colonel Lucas (reprise)

Sam Eagle is General Corman
posted by clavdivs at 5:45 PM on December 11, 2022 [2 favorites]

This movie is the best movie.
posted by seanmpuckett at 5:54 PM on December 11, 2022 [2 favorites]

I just got around to reading the link about the costumes and I have to say I would buy the vest Fred wears to bring Scrooge the wreath at work immediately for almost any price.
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 6:45 PM on December 11, 2022 [2 favorites]

My friend Alasha came up with Muppet Robin Hood, starring Adam Driver as Sheriff Nottingham, with Kermit as Robin Hood, Piggy as Maid Marian, and Gonzo as… Gonzo of Gisborne.
posted by pxe2000 at 6:46 PM on December 11, 2022 [6 favorites]

Muppet Pride and Prejudice, with Goldstein as Darcy and Miss Piggy as Elizabeth Bennet.

Nah, Miss Piggy is the Mrs. Bennet that would give 1995's Alison Steadman a run for her money (come to think of it, Steadman basically played Mrs. B as a neurotic Muppet). And Kermit as long-suffering Mr. Bennet.

The sisters would all be chickens, with Camilla as Lizzy and Gonzo as Darcy. Rizzo can be Mr. Bingley? Lady Catherine de Bourgh becomes Lord Fozzie de Bear (woka woka woka!)

Man, I'm getting into this.
posted by basalganglia at 6:47 PM on December 11, 2022 [6 favorites]

Of Muppet Bondage with Kermit as Philip and Miss Piggy as Mildred.
posted by Rash at 6:52 PM on December 11, 2022

The depressing thing about trying to cast P&P is that there really aren't enough strong character female Muppets. Piggy can only do so much! You'd either have to invent new ones or bring in human actors. Or do more gender swaps. You could skip Jane, Mary (poor Mary) and Kitty and just have Lydia. Played by..Janet? She does like to party.

Speaking of gender swaps, Sam the Eagle is clearly Lady Catherine, I can't believe I have to spell THAT out.

I do like the idea of Piggy as Lizzie, snubbed by Kermit (maybe after she hi-ya'd him for insulting her family) and then nearly seduced by a villainous human Wickham.
posted by emjaybee at 7:14 PM on December 11, 2022 [10 favorites]

Muppet Parks & Rec. It would be lovely to see Kermit as Leslie Knope.
posted by amtho at 7:15 PM on December 11, 2022 [4 favorites]

Fozzie as Casaubon, Piggy as Dorothea, Kermit as Ladislaw.

I don't know, too on-the-nose?
posted by humbug at 7:15 PM on December 11, 2022 [1 favorite]

Kermit as Moses
Fozzie as Aaron
Sam the Eagle as Pharaoh
Piggy as Miriam
Gonzo as the Angel of Death
posted by saturday_morning at 7:26 PM on December 11, 2022 [4 favorites]

Now, are you talking about Muppet Life of Brian?

In the pantheon of Christmases Carol, I submit A Carol for Another Christmas, a TV movie written by Rod Serling and directed by Joseph "All About Eve, Guys and Dolls, and Cleopatra" Mankiewicz, and starring a whole bunch of people you've heard of. It's on YouTube and archive.org!
posted by rhizome at 7:46 PM on December 11, 2022 [3 favorites]

Kermit as Raoul Duke, Fozzie as Dr. Gonzo, Gonzo as Dr. Fozzie.
posted by credulous at 7:46 PM on December 11, 2022 [3 favorites]

The Muppet Tempest.
posted by JHarris at 7:47 PM on December 11, 2022 [4 favorites]

Early film adaptations of Pride and Prejudice cut and/or combined the three younger sisters with reckless abandon.

My favorite fact about P&P adaptations that I wish I never knew was that Peter Cushing played Darcy on live TV in the 1950s and it was never recorded.
posted by The Underpants Monster at 7:48 PM on December 11, 2022 [3 favorites]

The Muppet Tempest.

Calibanimal?
posted by The Underpants Monster at 7:48 PM on December 11, 2022 [11 favorites]

This movie ruled. I'm a bit confused by the discussion of the "When Love is Gone" being cut, though, because I swear I remember the scene and can hear the melody in my head. I know I saw the movie in theatres as a little kid and then again on home video. Am I just imagining things?
posted by eagles123 at 7:50 PM on December 11, 2022 [1 favorite]

Am I just imagining things?

No, the song has been there and then gone and also was a reprise which made no sense without the original to refer back to. Wikipedia outlines all the details.
posted by hippybear at 7:54 PM on December 11, 2022 [4 favorites]

Fifteen minutes later I come back into the room and the kids had discovered some great new anime instead.

Was it Toradora? There's a pretty great Christmas arc towards the end. (Ep. 17-19, I believe.)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:58 PM on December 11, 2022

Love the interview. Why make TMCC as your first non-original screenplay?

GONZO: Well, I think it was a good fit because of two words: public domain.

Gold.
posted by Mchelly at 8:12 PM on December 11, 2022 [8 favorites]

The whole Dickens-rhymes-with-chickens bit was gold, too. Gonzo's on fire in that interview.

Watching the movie now. I had forgotten Lew Zealand selling his boomerang fish in the market.
posted by The Underpants Monster at 8:33 PM on December 11, 2022 [2 favorites]

Eraserhead more or less is Muppet Eraserhead. There's the baby, and the chickens ...

Nope nope nope: must be made of dry terrycloth with slime drops represented by yarn tufts only.
posted by y2karl at 9:04 PM on December 11, 2022

Gah, Statler and Waldorf playing ghosts always gets me right in the old ticker, because they had been played on The Muppet Show by the (then) recently-deceased Jim Henson and Richard Hunt.
posted by The Underpants Monster at 9:07 PM on December 11, 2022 [10 favorites]

I think it’s more Piggy as Casaubon, Kermit as Dorothea, Gonzo as Ladislaw, though.
posted by clew at 10:28 PM on December 11, 2022

A friend had her tweets blow up around this time with something like what we're doing here. Round our way it's seasonal to play:
Pick a movie.
Keep one actor.
The rest are played by muppets.
posted by k3ninho at 12:37 AM on December 12, 2022 [5 favorites]

The song is included on all of the 1993 VHS and LaserDisc releases of the film

Aha, there it is. Thank you eagles123 and hippybear. I was so confused.
posted by pjenks at 4:28 AM on December 12, 2022

I live for the horses in the first song, "Don't ask him for a FAY-ver!"
posted by Fleebnork at 4:58 AM on December 12, 2022 [1 favorite]

Die Hard, with Bruce Willis as the human and Count von Count as Hans Gruber.
posted by hearthpig at 5:04 AM on December 12, 2022 [4 favorites]

The only technical criticism I can make is that the stop-motion shot of the ice skating penguins is slightly stop-motiony, and the rest of the ice skating sequence's overly-convenient at-ice-level camera bothers me every time. This is more than made up for by The Ghost of Christmas Past being seemingly indescribable and this incredible overhead shot of some pigeons that I can not explain.

It is pretty much the perfect movie.
posted by timdiggerm at 5:48 AM on December 12, 2022 [2 favorites]

One of the things that really slays is in the first song where there's a bit about "he must be so angry he must be so sad to spend so much time convinced that he's bad" or something and then "look closely there must be a sweet man inside" and everyone goes NAAAAHHHHH

But.....

Which is kind of a gut punch because, yes, in many many cases, it's a lack of human connection that makes a man a monster, which then becomes a self-perpetuating prophecy.

You got people at the beginning of the movie saying "this guy's beyond hope" and absolutely rage-laughing at him, and yet... and yet....

It's also like Paul Williams is saying "wow, I was some hot garbage that everyone laughed at for like a decade but here are these Muppet people who reached out and helped me sort my shit." it's like, right there in the song.

If only the real world had more ghostly interventions to shake the stupid out of fucked up folks.
posted by seanmpuckett at 6:02 AM on December 12, 2022 [8 favorites]

Why The Muppet Christmas Carol Is the Best Scrooge Story
posted by jenfullmoon at 6:08 AM on December 12, 2022 [2 favorites]

Not only is this the first Muppet movie I got to see in the theater, it also landed at a particularly formative moment in my life. December '92 was a weird watershed because I was old enough to experience it firsthand and develop vivid memories of what I was thinking and how I felt while also being young enough to still be absolutely convinced that the holidays were 100% magic. It's the earliest Christmas for which I have a complete memory of having been there and it's an important link to the earlier, more mythical Christmases of my childhood which preceded it.
posted by RonButNotStupid at 6:21 AM on December 12, 2022 [2 favorites]

Thanks to IRFH for linking to the previously I missed in the post - there are 2 threads on Ethan Warren's case for TMCC being the best adaptation, and I'd missed linking to the most recent.

‘You’ll never see Michael Caine blink’: An oral history of The Muppet Christmas Carol at 30:

Meredith Braun (Belle): I was playing Éponine in Les Miserables at the time. It was a weird juxtaposition of delightful fun with the Muppets during the day and dying with blood and dirt all over me every night.

posted by the primroses were over at 6:36 AM on December 12, 2022 [2 favorites]

Thanks for that oral history article. It's great! Although...

Nobody’s ever going to wink at the camera and say, “This is a movie, this isn’t real.” Kermit is going to be Bob Cratchit and nobody’s going to accidentally call him Kermit. Nobody’s going to wink at the camera and say, “Making movies is hard!” We’re just not going to do that.

They definitely do this with Sam the Eagle and "The British Way!"
posted by timdiggerm at 7:16 AM on December 12, 2022

Apologies if it's already linked somewhere in the previouslies, but "I don’t know if I can contain my 'The Muppet Christmas Carol has better costume design than most Oscar-nominated period dramas' rant […]"

One thing that I've never appreciated until reading the link about costumes is what time periods A Christmas Carol is set in. I've always thought it of it as a generic "Victorian" setting, but if the novel is set in 1843 (the year it was actually published) then the part with young Scrooge is all the way back during the Regency and coincident with the American Revolution!
posted by RonButNotStupid at 7:30 AM on December 12, 2022 [10 favorites]

This movie is a yearly Christmas Eve tradition at the family house, and we can all, literally, sing along at this point.
posted by zbaco at 8:26 AM on December 12, 2022 [1 favorite]

This movie is the closest thing my family have to a holiday tradition, and the only one my dad managed not to shit all over. I was just too young to see it in at the cinema when it came out (Aladdin was my first cinema movie, I believe), but we had the VHS as soon as it was released. As a small kid I definitely found the poached egg Ghost of Christmas Past scarier than the Ghost of Yet to Come (and as an introverted adult I now find the Ghost of Christmas Present the scariest, boy does that guy need a lot of interaction).

Christmas is a fairly sparse time in our household (spouse doesn't care at all, I have enough family & holiday trauma that it's probably never going to be an uncomplicatedly good time), but watching this is probably the closest I get as an adult to feeling however much child-like holiday magic I was ever actually capable of experiencing as a neurodivergent child growing up in a house of persistently bad vibes.

Also, 86 minutes is such a good length for a movie. Christopher Nolan should take notes.
posted by terretu at 8:38 AM on December 12, 2022 [6 favorites]

I watched this on Saturday with a friend who's insistent about doing it every year, and I was delighted to realise afterwards that we'd done it on the film's actual 30th birthday.

A few years ago I went to a Sh!t Theatre singalonga Muppet Christmas Carol screening and so we have now adopted their rules for watching:

* A large bowl of cotton wool balls must be available at all times - maybe one central bowl, or individual bowls for each viewer. Every time a Muppet falls off the screen into the snow and a bunch of snow flies up into the screen from the impact, everyone must throw handfuls of cotton wool into the air.
* Every time the clock chimes, a shot of whisky (ideally Bells) must be taken.
* Optional: Every time Michael Caine is really acting as hard as he can, hamming it up for all he's worth, you must shout: "Go on, Michael!" in your best cockney accent, in the manner of someone cheering on a footballer.

We followed up with our first-ever viewings of Muppet Family Christmas (OMG how I cheered when the entire cast of Sesame Street appeared over the hill carol singing!) and then John Denver's Muppet Christmas, which we only got partway through before deciding it was a John Denver show with added Muppets and really needed the proportions reversed to be truly a thing of wonder.

I kind of have the reverse feeling about TMCC from those of you saying "How can it be 30 years?" - for me, it feels as if it's always been there. So much so that I suddenly reeled last night to think how Steven Macintosh* (Fred) has lived most of his adult life able to say that he was in the Muppet Christmas Carol and how mindblowing that is. A bit like finding out your next door neighbour was on the first ever train ride or something.

*SM will always, always for me be Nigel in Adrian Mole, but I'm happy to lend him the TMCC as it's such a good cause.
posted by penguin pie at 8:58 AM on December 12, 2022 [4 favorites]

Muppet Mad Max: Furry Road.....
posted by Pendragon at 11:56 AM on December 12, 2022 [6 favorites]

Nobody’s ever going to wink at the camera and say, “This is a movie, this isn’t real.”

This is kinda funny to me, 'cause if you watch most of the Muppet filmography (and in particular the ones Jim Henson was involved with), they lean on or break the fourth wall plenty of times. (The Muppet Movie has, as a major plot point that the Electric Mayhem were able to find Kermit and the gang when their car broke down because they read the script of the The Muppet Movie that Fozzie had given them earlier in the movie.) They definitely do it a lot less in Muppet Christmas Carol, and I think only Gonzo and Rizzo ever really do it, and they're the narrators already.
posted by Aleyn at 1:20 PM on December 12, 2022 [6 favorites]

No one is here for Muppets Les Miserables?
posted by kat518 at 2:48 PM on December 12, 2022 [2 favorites]

A Very Muppet Les Miserables is one of my favorite dumb Internet things.
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 3:01 PM on December 12, 2022 [4 favorites]

(The Muppet Movie has, as a major plot point that the Electric Mayhem were able to find Kermit and the gang when their car broke down because they read the script of the The Muppet Movie that Fozzie had given them earlier in the movie.)

That was a gag used several times in the Monkees' TV series, many episodes of which were directed by The Muppet Movie's director James Frawley.
posted by The Underpants Monster at 3:11 PM on December 12, 2022 [10 favorites]

the Electric Mayhem were able to find Kermit and the gang when their car broke down

Great, now I am going to have "Can't You Picture That" in my head for the next 48 hours or so...
posted by hearthpig at 4:05 PM on December 12, 2022 [3 favorites]

I wasn't until you had to name the song. *shakes fist at the skies*

I somehow had assumed Henson or Oz directed The Muppet Movie. Interesting they share a director with The Monkees, as that was one of the most meta series to come along until that time. And the original The Muppet Show was VERY meta, literally being a show about a theater troupe trying to put on a theater show every single week.

Also, am I the only one who sees that Miss Piggy's originating inspiration is Barbra Streisand? Because it's right there in her eyes and her attitude and her focus on a skinny guy she probably won't be with long term.
posted by hippybear at 4:25 PM on December 12, 2022 [4 favorites]

the Electric Mayhem were able to find Kermit and the gang when their car broke down

I say "They don't look like Presbyterians to me" at least once a week, and nobody knows what the hell I'm talking about.

Also, am I the only one who sees that Miss Piggy's originating inspiration is Barbra Streisand?

Peggy Lee. Her original name was Miss Piggy Lee.
posted by Ben Trismegistus at 12:35 PM on December 13, 2022 [6 favorites]

Great, now I am going to have "Can't You Picture That" in my head for the next 48 hours or so...

AURORA BOREALIS
SHININ' DOWN IN DALLAS
CAN YOU PICTURE THAT?
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 2:34 PM on December 13, 2022 [3 favorites]

Just watched it for the first time because of this thread. Michael Caine is wonderful.
posted by Peach at 5:41 PM on December 13, 2022 [8 favorites]