and if we looked out the window it would be all California
April 9, 2023 2:49 PM Subscribe
John Wick Is So Tired by Kyra Wilder [The Paris Review; ungated]
Making of a Poem: Kyra Wilder on “John Wick Is So Tired” [The Paris Review; ungated]
John Wick Marathon [The Paris Review; ungated]
Making of a Poem: Kyra Wilder on “John Wick Is So Tired” [The Paris Review; ungated]
John Wick Marathon [The Paris Review; ungated]
no mr bond i expect you to fry
posted by lalochezia at 3:45 PM on April 9, 2023 [43 favorites]
posted by lalochezia at 3:45 PM on April 9, 2023 [43 favorites]
Narrator : "And so it went, John was increasingly cavalier. Merry, moody, fey, unpredictable. He camouflaged his depressions and derangements with masquerades of extreme cordiality, courtesy, and goodwill towards others. But Even as he jested or tickled his boy in the ribs, John would look over at Bob with melancholy eyes as if the two were meshed in an intimate communication. Bob was certain that the man had unriddled him; had seen through his reasons for coming along; that John could forecast each of Bob's possible moves and inclinations and was only acting the innocent in order to lull Bob into a stupid tranquility and miscalculation."
posted by clavdivs at 3:51 PM on April 9, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by clavdivs at 3:51 PM on April 9, 2023 [5 favorites]
scrambled, not shirred
posted by Soap_and_Bathetic at 4:08 PM on April 9, 2023 [7 favorites]
posted by Soap_and_Bathetic at 4:08 PM on April 9, 2023 [7 favorites]
For Your Eggs Only
The Man with the Golden Egg
From Russia with Eggs
Eggfall
posted by nubs at 6:31 PM on April 9, 2023 [2 favorites]
The Man with the Golden Egg
From Russia with Eggs
Eggfall
posted by nubs at 6:31 PM on April 9, 2023 [2 favorites]
I want to drive cars like Vin Diesel
so I won't just be angry but angry and fast, like
angry with muscle cars that silhouette the horizon
angry where it looks like I don't have to pay for my own gas
I want to be angry but with a V-8 and
to pal around with the family and
eat leftover brisket while we watch F9
and Letty could whisper we are sisters in my ear
if only my family were
so fast and
so furious
posted by phooky at 6:55 PM on April 9, 2023 [16 favorites]
so I won't just be angry but angry and fast, like
angry with muscle cars that silhouette the horizon
angry where it looks like I don't have to pay for my own gas
I want to be angry but with a V-8 and
to pal around with the family and
eat leftover brisket while we watch F9
and Letty could whisper we are sisters in my ear
if only my family were
so fast and
so furious
posted by phooky at 6:55 PM on April 9, 2023 [16 favorites]
Eggtopussy
posted by under_petticoat_rule at 6:55 PM on April 9, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by under_petticoat_rule at 6:55 PM on April 9, 2023 [3 favorites]
From the Making link: "... the speaker wants to watch John Wick and tell the lost person historical asides about nuclear bomb testing sites. Of course they do, but that’s for a novel."
I think I need this novel.
posted by phooky at 7:01 PM on April 9, 2023 [3 favorites]
I think I need this novel.
posted by phooky at 7:01 PM on April 9, 2023 [3 favorites]
Casino Royale with cheese
posted by clavdivs at 7:46 PM on April 9, 2023 [7 favorites]
posted by clavdivs at 7:46 PM on April 9, 2023 [7 favorites]
how he gets so close to them and just holds them for a second
how he’s so tired but he knows he has to let them go
and I wish you would be here and
we could watch John Wick together
All the jokes are easy, but this poem is fantastic in how it turns the details of this stylized, performative violence into a wish, nearly a prayer, for a shared, visceral intimacy that is somehow that carefully detailed, somehow equally intense.
posted by mhoye at 8:02 PM on April 9, 2023 [11 favorites]
how he’s so tired but he knows he has to let them go
and I wish you would be here and
we could watch John Wick together
All the jokes are easy, but this poem is fantastic in how it turns the details of this stylized, performative violence into a wish, nearly a prayer, for a shared, visceral intimacy that is somehow that carefully detailed, somehow equally intense.
posted by mhoye at 8:02 PM on April 9, 2023 [11 favorites]
I felt that tension, mhoye, the first three-quarters maybe three-fourths of the way and had high hopes where it was taking me. But It relents in the last little bit when the speaker draws us close with “you” and I think that is recognized in the how it was written piece.
posted by notyou at 8:59 PM on April 9, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by notyou at 8:59 PM on April 9, 2023 [3 favorites]
It's funny how John Wick is firmly in the toxic male dorm room genre of stylish gun fight movies but it's got such broad appeal.
Is it just the Keanu factor?
posted by Reyturner at 9:04 PM on April 9, 2023 [3 favorites]
Is it just the Keanu factor?
posted by Reyturner at 9:04 PM on April 9, 2023 [3 favorites]
The premise of John Wick is tired.
posted by doctor_negative at 9:10 PM on April 9, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by doctor_negative at 9:10 PM on April 9, 2023 [3 favorites]
for any commenters joining us, I recommend reading the poem that the FPP link consists of
posted by DoctorFedora at 10:53 PM on April 9, 2023 [9 favorites]
posted by DoctorFedora at 10:53 PM on April 9, 2023 [9 favorites]
Having a Glock With You.
posted by herrdoktor at 11:49 PM on April 9, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by herrdoktor at 11:49 PM on April 9, 2023 [2 favorites]
If it's any measure of a poem, I woke up still thinking about this.
posted by phooky at 4:55 AM on April 10, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by phooky at 4:55 AM on April 10, 2023 [5 favorites]
Art of Manliness made the James Bond scrambled eggs. They sound a bit gloopy with all that cream.
posted by TheophileEscargot at 5:15 AM on April 10, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by TheophileEscargot at 5:15 AM on April 10, 2023 [1 favorite]
It's just the Keanu factor.
posted by AlSweigart at 5:45 AM on April 10, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by AlSweigart at 5:45 AM on April 10, 2023 [3 favorites]
The eggs are supposed to be cooked very low and slow, and be custard-like in texture. These are essentially the classic French style eggs. The Serious Eats version, which does add the traditional cream too, is closer to what Fleming would have been writing about.
posted by bonehead at 6:03 AM on April 10, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by bonehead at 6:03 AM on April 10, 2023 [2 favorites]
It's just the Keanu factor.
Well, yes, but part of that is what Keanu does with the role compared to what I would expect from a Statham or a Vin Diesel - Keanu brings a weariness and a vulnerability to Wick that makes him a different character from the traditional kickass male action movie star; Wick is grieving his wife and his dog while he cuts his way through this highly stylized world of never ending underground assassins. That sense of grief is what the poem picks up on really well, and I'm not sure a different actor would bring us that dimension.
posted by nubs at 7:17 AM on April 10, 2023 [9 favorites]
Well, yes, but part of that is what Keanu does with the role compared to what I would expect from a Statham or a Vin Diesel - Keanu brings a weariness and a vulnerability to Wick that makes him a different character from the traditional kickass male action movie star; Wick is grieving his wife and his dog while he cuts his way through this highly stylized world of never ending underground assassins. That sense of grief is what the poem picks up on really well, and I'm not sure a different actor would bring us that dimension.
posted by nubs at 7:17 AM on April 10, 2023 [9 favorites]
John Wick kills women like/
he’s read feminist theory
posted by doctornemo at 9:02 AM on April 10, 2023 [3 favorites]
he’s read feminist theory
posted by doctornemo at 9:02 AM on April 10, 2023 [3 favorites]
I don't know about 1-3, but I don't think John Wick kills a single woman in 4. This is less a function of feminist theory than of the redshirts being a no-girls-allowed club. The only human woman fighter in the film is in the role that, in the 70s, would have meant she would have inexplicably slept with Wick and then betrayed him, but we got to skip that, at least.
posted by praemunire at 9:11 AM on April 10, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by praemunire at 9:11 AM on April 10, 2023 [1 favorite]
The Spy Who Loved Eggs
Live and Egg Dye
Omelets Are Forever
On Her Majesty's Secret Soufflé
"Eggs. Scrambled, not shirred."
posted by kirkaracha at 9:43 AM on April 10, 2023 [2 favorites]
Live and Egg Dye
Omelets Are Forever
On Her Majesty's Secret Soufflé
"Eggs. Scrambled, not shirred."
posted by kirkaracha at 9:43 AM on April 10, 2023 [2 favorites]
based on the post title i thought it would be a link to this article by someone who sees their own struggles with chronic pain reflected in John Wick's lack of ever getting a chance to rest:
https://www.tor.com/2023/04/05/the-john-wick-series-and-chronic-pain/
posted by mrgoldenbrown at 9:53 AM on April 10, 2023 [3 favorites]
https://www.tor.com/2023/04/05/the-john-wick-series-and-chronic-pain/
posted by mrgoldenbrown at 9:53 AM on April 10, 2023 [3 favorites]
I don't know about 1-3, but I don't think John Wick kills a single woman in 4.
In both 1 & 2 there is one significant woman antagonist (Palicki and Ruby Rose, respectively) who is a peer of equal threat and not subjected to male gaze bullshit. In 3 there is a woman of color ally (Halle Berry) who is the only person outside John Wick himself to receive full protagonist PoV camera perspective in the series, and a woman antagonist (Dillon) who holds a position of enormous power but is not directly involved in any violence.
Similarly the series uses Russian and Italian mafias in the first two films to avoid white male mass-murdering people of darker skin color typical for the genre, and every black man is either a peer of equal professionalism (Common), an allied paragon of cool sophistication (Reddick), or holds a position of power (Fishburne). Asian portrayal in the third movie is a bit tropey but deliberately presented as an extended love letter to classic Hong Kong action cinema.
LGBT representation is virtually non-existent, but so is all human sexuality. I’d be curious to know if there is a right answer in the post-Pulse shooting era aside from bypassing the question entirely and hoping nobody notices.
So yeah, there’s a lot of Keanu factor, but it’s not just that: the writing is incredibly sparse and very, very deliberate in attempting to avoid the standard problematic aspects of the genre, outside of the fundamental performative male rage (which is minimized by coding it as grief, as nubs noted above).
Disclaimer: I have seen 1-3 but not 4, yet.
posted by Ryvar at 10:00 AM on April 10, 2023 [5 favorites]
In both 1 & 2 there is one significant woman antagonist (Palicki and Ruby Rose, respectively) who is a peer of equal threat and not subjected to male gaze bullshit. In 3 there is a woman of color ally (Halle Berry) who is the only person outside John Wick himself to receive full protagonist PoV camera perspective in the series, and a woman antagonist (Dillon) who holds a position of enormous power but is not directly involved in any violence.
Similarly the series uses Russian and Italian mafias in the first two films to avoid white male mass-murdering people of darker skin color typical for the genre, and every black man is either a peer of equal professionalism (Common), an allied paragon of cool sophistication (Reddick), or holds a position of power (Fishburne). Asian portrayal in the third movie is a bit tropey but deliberately presented as an extended love letter to classic Hong Kong action cinema.
LGBT representation is virtually non-existent, but so is all human sexuality. I’d be curious to know if there is a right answer in the post-Pulse shooting era aside from bypassing the question entirely and hoping nobody notices.
So yeah, there’s a lot of Keanu factor, but it’s not just that: the writing is incredibly sparse and very, very deliberate in attempting to avoid the standard problematic aspects of the genre, outside of the fundamental performative male rage (which is minimized by coding it as grief, as nubs noted above).
Disclaimer: I have seen 1-3 but not 4, yet.
posted by Ryvar at 10:00 AM on April 10, 2023 [5 favorites]
I think the real life experience of Keanu losing his loved one in a car accident lends authenticity to his performance. He really lived that grief and it's not just gratuitous violence. Yes, there is vengeance and other stuff that other people could speak more eloquently to, but the core of it for me is that grief is complicated and each person experiences it differently. His character works it out in some ways as throwing himself deep into his work, like most people would, except his work just happens to be an assassin.
posted by VyanSelei at 10:55 AM on April 10, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by VyanSelei at 10:55 AM on April 10, 2023 [2 favorites]
wait, look now, John Wick is riding
that black horse like he knows just what grief is
like he knows sometimes its killing and killing and
sometimes it's just slipping in your shoes and
The John Wick movies are lots of fun, but am I the only one who noticed they are Commando but with a dead dog instead of a kidnapped Alyssa Milano? John Wick pushes the concept to its ultimate conclusion though. In both movies the axis of the world is an obscure screw that can only be greased with blood and tightened with murder. But Keanu achieved Commando's nirvana, the male fantasy of total competence: he entirely submerged his self and was reforged as the ultimate everyday carry. Arnold failed by actually rescuing his daughter and refusing the call to perpetual slaughter. Not John Wick. He lived the dream, to have all your attachments become fulcrums that increase the force of your blows... love and friendship mean the world to him, because when his lovers and friends are murdered it allows him to visit a thousandfold violence upon said world, and fulfill his destiny as the most complete tool in history.
posted by lefty lucky cat at 8:40 AM on April 11, 2023 [3 favorites]
that black horse like he knows just what grief is
like he knows sometimes its killing and killing and
sometimes it's just slipping in your shoes and
The John Wick movies are lots of fun, but am I the only one who noticed they are Commando but with a dead dog instead of a kidnapped Alyssa Milano? John Wick pushes the concept to its ultimate conclusion though. In both movies the axis of the world is an obscure screw that can only be greased with blood and tightened with murder. But Keanu achieved Commando's nirvana, the male fantasy of total competence: he entirely submerged his self and was reforged as the ultimate everyday carry. Arnold failed by actually rescuing his daughter and refusing the call to perpetual slaughter. Not John Wick. He lived the dream, to have all your attachments become fulcrums that increase the force of your blows... love and friendship mean the world to him, because when his lovers and friends are murdered it allows him to visit a thousandfold violence upon said world, and fulfill his destiny as the most complete tool in history.
posted by lefty lucky cat at 8:40 AM on April 11, 2023 [3 favorites]
From Mr. GoldenBrown's earlier post:
The Suffering Is The Point: Negotiating Pain With John Wick
The thing that sets Wick apart from other action movies is the relentlessness. In the first few films especially, John Wick walks into each new battle the way I used to walk into a 9-hour shift on my feet at a deli—it’s gonna hurt, sure, but we’ll get through it one goon/customer at a time. (Maybe you think I’m being absurd with this comparison, but I’ll say this: I also ended each day smelling of meat and blood, and at least John Wick never had to endure the horror of slicing pre-packaged deli headcheese.)
Other than a few brief moments of rage or sorrow, the primary emotional tone is weariness. Exhaustion, determination, compartmentalizing. Each new assassin is another micro-task – if I just get through this guy I can get to the end of the hall. If I just snap this violinist’s neck, I’m almost clear of the train station. If I can just shoot these three guys, I can take their clips, reload, and make it to the next modern art gallery.
posted by mecran01 at 11:53 AM on April 11, 2023 [1 favorite]
The Suffering Is The Point: Negotiating Pain With John Wick
The thing that sets Wick apart from other action movies is the relentlessness. In the first few films especially, John Wick walks into each new battle the way I used to walk into a 9-hour shift on my feet at a deli—it’s gonna hurt, sure, but we’ll get through it one goon/customer at a time. (Maybe you think I’m being absurd with this comparison, but I’ll say this: I also ended each day smelling of meat and blood, and at least John Wick never had to endure the horror of slicing pre-packaged deli headcheese.)
Other than a few brief moments of rage or sorrow, the primary emotional tone is weariness. Exhaustion, determination, compartmentalizing. Each new assassin is another micro-task – if I just get through this guy I can get to the end of the hall. If I just snap this violinist’s neck, I’m almost clear of the train station. If I can just shoot these three guys, I can take their clips, reload, and make it to the next modern art gallery.
posted by mecran01 at 11:53 AM on April 11, 2023 [1 favorite]
am I the only one who noticed they are Commando but with a dead dog instead of a kidnapped Alyssa Milano?
You say that like it's not an incredibly awesome thing.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:30 PM on April 11, 2023 [2 favorites]
You say that like it's not an incredibly awesome thing.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:30 PM on April 11, 2023 [2 favorites]
The thing that sets Wick apart from other action movies is the relentlessness.
Eh. It's like a video game in movie form. The relentlessness is part of the video game setup. Sure you fell a tiny bit of accomplishment, but mostly by the end, just weariness.
posted by The_Vegetables at 1:38 PM on April 11, 2023 [1 favorite]
Eh. It's like a video game in movie form. The relentlessness is part of the video game setup. Sure you fell a tiny bit of accomplishment, but mostly by the end, just weariness.
posted by The_Vegetables at 1:38 PM on April 11, 2023 [1 favorite]
fulfill his destiny as the most complete tool in history.
I don't think the ultimate tool destroys itself just to put itself out of service.
posted by praemunire at 1:39 PM on April 11, 2023 [1 favorite]
I don't think the ultimate tool destroys itself just to put itself out of service.
posted by praemunire at 1:39 PM on April 11, 2023 [1 favorite]
Let there be no doubt: I am a fan of both Commando AND John Wick.
posted by lefty lucky cat at 2:52 PM on April 11, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by lefty lucky cat at 2:52 PM on April 11, 2023 [1 favorite]
That's good. Because I eat lefty lucky cats for breakfast, and right now, I'm very hungry.
posted by TheophileEscargot at 2:10 AM on April 12, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by TheophileEscargot at 2:10 AM on April 12, 2023 [2 favorites]
Let there be no doubt: I am a fan of both Commando AND John Wick.
Man, Commando is only good because Arnold is a great comedic actor. We need a higher quality action hero who can actually act, and no, Chris Pratt and Ryan Reynolds aren't cutting it. Despite being pretty good in comedy and action flicks, Keanu has never really combined the two.
posted by The_Vegetables at 8:31 AM on April 12, 2023 [1 favorite]
Man, Commando is only good because Arnold is a great comedic actor. We need a higher quality action hero who can actually act, and no, Chris Pratt and Ryan Reynolds aren't cutting it. Despite being pretty good in comedy and action flicks, Keanu has never really combined the two.
posted by The_Vegetables at 8:31 AM on April 12, 2023 [1 favorite]
It's funny how John Wick is firmly in the toxic male dorm room genre of stylish gun fight movies but it's got such broad appeal.
Maybe it's the very refusal to dress it up in anything more than the thinnest veneer of story and justification? Like somehow something like Equilibrium (a favourite stylish gun fight movie of my own youth) is actually made dumber and more ludicrous by its attempt to graft a ridiculous wider point onto what is basically just a stylish gun and martial arts flick. See also the entire unwatchable Marvel universe where potentially amusing films are made to groan under the most awful, turgid "philosophical" ideas. These films are the equivalent of Nigel Tufnel's ludicrous Lick my Love Pump where the juxtaposition of form and message makes the whole comic except that unlike This is Spinal Tap, most action movies are humourless and take themselves seriously.
posted by atrazine at 7:43 AM on April 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
Maybe it's the very refusal to dress it up in anything more than the thinnest veneer of story and justification? Like somehow something like Equilibrium (a favourite stylish gun fight movie of my own youth) is actually made dumber and more ludicrous by its attempt to graft a ridiculous wider point onto what is basically just a stylish gun and martial arts flick. See also the entire unwatchable Marvel universe where potentially amusing films are made to groan under the most awful, turgid "philosophical" ideas. These films are the equivalent of Nigel Tufnel's ludicrous Lick my Love Pump where the juxtaposition of form and message makes the whole comic except that unlike This is Spinal Tap, most action movies are humourless and take themselves seriously.
posted by atrazine at 7:43 AM on April 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
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Ok, I’m in.
posted by mhoye at 3:08 PM on April 9, 2023 [5 favorites]