New study finds octopus sleep similar to humans, and might even dream
July 4, 2023 10:29 PM Subscribe
New study finds octopus sleep similar to humans, and might even be dreaming. The study found the octopuses had a similar sleep pattern to REM which is when most mammals dream.
There are quite a few animals - mostly cetaceans and birds - which can sleep with just one brain hemisphere at a time . Since an octopus has nine brains, I wonder if they all fall asleep together?
posted by rongorongo at 2:42 AM on July 5, 2023
posted by rongorongo at 2:42 AM on July 5, 2023
This reminded me of Ben Lerner's novel 10:04 and that in turn reminded me of this: Why Not Eat Octopus?
posted by chavenet at 3:41 AM on July 5, 2023
posted by chavenet at 3:41 AM on July 5, 2023
Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn.
posted by kyrademon at 4:05 AM on July 5, 2023 [15 favorites]
posted by kyrademon at 4:05 AM on July 5, 2023 [15 favorites]
Octopus are so alien. It's fascinating if they have converged on the same type of sleep that vertebrates use.
How alien? When a freshly-fertilized embryo develops into a hollow blastocyst, the first real structural change that happens is when a pore develops connecting the inside of the blastocyst to the outside. In "protostomes," the first opening eventually develops into the mouth. In "deuterostomes," the first opening eventually becomes the anus, and the second opening eventually becomes the mouth. Octopus and insects are protostomes; vertebrates are deuterostomes.
(This also means there was a point in your life where your entire body was just an asshole. I'm sure you know adult humans who have somehow remained stuck at this stage of development.)
posted by fantabulous timewaster at 4:32 AM on July 5, 2023 [14 favorites]
How alien? When a freshly-fertilized embryo develops into a hollow blastocyst, the first real structural change that happens is when a pore develops connecting the inside of the blastocyst to the outside. In "protostomes," the first opening eventually develops into the mouth. In "deuterostomes," the first opening eventually becomes the anus, and the second opening eventually becomes the mouth. Octopus and insects are protostomes; vertebrates are deuterostomes.
(This also means there was a point in your life where your entire body was just an asshole. I'm sure you know adult humans who have somehow remained stuck at this stage of development.)
posted by fantabulous timewaster at 4:32 AM on July 5, 2023 [14 favorites]
do cephalopods dream of aquatic sheep?
posted by logicpunk at 5:05 AM on July 5, 2023 [8 favorites]
posted by logicpunk at 5:05 AM on July 5, 2023 [8 favorites]
My question is how has a creature evolved such a high level of intelligence despite being solitary and living such a short life? It seems so, I dunno, unfair.
posted by tommasz at 5:23 AM on July 5, 2023
posted by tommasz at 5:23 AM on July 5, 2023
This week's episode of the Nature podcast had this as the main story. Apparently there's a specific pattern of brain activity seen when octopuses eat which pops up often in their active sleeping phase. So maybe they're dreaming about snacking? Seems a nice life.
The researcher being interviewed also mentioned in passing some tentative data suggesting that spiders have 2-phase sleep, but didn't get into any detail.
posted by metaBugs at 5:27 AM on July 5, 2023
The researcher being interviewed also mentioned in passing some tentative data suggesting that spiders have 2-phase sleep, but didn't get into any detail.
posted by metaBugs at 5:27 AM on July 5, 2023
My question is how has a creature evolved such a high level of intelligence despite being solitary and living such a short life? It seems so, I dunno, unfair
I think the traditional explanation of why intelligence evolves has been to do with dealing with the complexities of social interaction. This video of a cuttlefish which is perfectly able to pass an adapted version of The Marshmallow Test is relevant: I think the theory here is that creatures which need to be both smart predators and careful about becoming prey themselves - can also have evolutionary pressure in this direction - even if they live more solitary lives.
posted by rongorongo at 5:49 AM on July 5, 2023 [2 favorites]
I think the traditional explanation of why intelligence evolves has been to do with dealing with the complexities of social interaction. This video of a cuttlefish which is perfectly able to pass an adapted version of The Marshmallow Test is relevant: I think the theory here is that creatures which need to be both smart predators and careful about becoming prey themselves - can also have evolutionary pressure in this direction - even if they live more solitary lives.
posted by rongorongo at 5:49 AM on July 5, 2023 [2 favorites]
Octopuses, orcas, dolphins rising up in intelligence and confront the "human" element of this biome we all occupy was not specifically on my bingo card, but here we are.
Who knew David Brin's Sundiver & Startide Rising would pan out.
posted by Fizz at 6:03 AM on July 5, 2023
Who knew David Brin's Sundiver & Startide Rising would pan out.
posted by Fizz at 6:03 AM on July 5, 2023
/spiders have 2-phase sleep,
Previously on MeFi
posted by dhruva at 7:46 AM on July 5, 2023 [1 favorite]
Previously on MeFi
posted by dhruva at 7:46 AM on July 5, 2023 [1 favorite]
I just read the linked article and want to quote this one passage, because wow, I can imagine this and would dearly love to actually observe it, and, umm, just wow...
The study focused on nocturnal octopuses (Octopus Laqueus) who would close their eyes during daylight in a resting posture and have a white skin pattern — understood to be the quiet sleep. About every 60 minutes they would have rapid transitions of skin colours along with bursts of frenzied activity where their arms and eyes twitch, their breathing rate quickens; the active sleep stage.posted by martin q blank at 8:19 AM on July 5, 2023 [6 favorites]
Do they dream of eight-legged sheep?
posted by slogger at 9:24 AM on July 5, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by slogger at 9:24 AM on July 5, 2023 [1 favorite]
Where is the Octopus's Garden at?
In the shade.
posted by hippybear at 9:40 AM on July 5, 2023 [1 favorite]
In the shade.
posted by hippybear at 9:40 AM on July 5, 2023 [1 favorite]
Octopuses, orcas, dolphins rising up in intelligence and confront the "human" element of this biome we all occupy was not specifically on my bingo card, but here we are.
And obviously all those UFOs are being flown by highly intelligent octopus scouts as a prelude to the coming conflict with the ocean population. Alien intelligence indeed.
posted by Pryde at 10:07 AM on July 5, 2023
And obviously all those UFOs are being flown by highly intelligent octopus scouts as a prelude to the coming conflict with the ocean population. Alien intelligence indeed.
posted by Pryde at 10:07 AM on July 5, 2023
> My question is how has a creature evolved such a high level of intelligence despite being solitary and living such a short life? It seems so, I dunno, unfair.
I know, and it may be even worse for octopuses
posted by kleinsteradikaleminderheit at 1:37 PM on July 5, 2023 [1 favorite]
I know, and it may be even worse for octopuses
posted by kleinsteradikaleminderheit at 1:37 PM on July 5, 2023 [1 favorite]
I’m glad I no longer eat animals.
posted by rhymedirective at 7:09 PM on July 5, 2023
posted by rhymedirective at 7:09 PM on July 5, 2023
I’m glad I no longer eat animals.
Here's a report from the LSE on research into sentience in cephalopods which concludes that "They should be counted as “animals” for the purposes of the Animal Welfare Act 2006 and included in the scope of any future legislation relating to animal sentience." So I guess until then, in the UK, they are yum - YMMV.
posted by BobTheScientist at 12:16 AM on July 6, 2023
Here's a report from the LSE on research into sentience in cephalopods which concludes that "They should be counted as “animals” for the purposes of the Animal Welfare Act 2006 and included in the scope of any future legislation relating to animal sentience." So I guess until then, in the UK, they are yum - YMMV.
posted by BobTheScientist at 12:16 AM on July 6, 2023
I wish I could sleep like a human.
posted by srboisvert at 5:47 AM on July 6, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by srboisvert at 5:47 AM on July 6, 2023 [1 favorite]
Nobody has mentioned the Japanese poet Basho and one of his best-known haikus?
蛸壺やはかなき夢を夏の月
trapped octopus
ephemeral dream under
the summer moon
posted by vacapinta at 6:33 AM on July 11, 2023 [1 favorite]
蛸壺やはかなき夢を夏の月
trapped octopus
ephemeral dream under
the summer moon
posted by vacapinta at 6:33 AM on July 11, 2023 [1 favorite]
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- definitely not an octopus
posted by potrzebie at 11:10 PM on July 4, 2023 [17 favorites]