“What a pity that we cannot do the right thing.”

December 15, 2023 8:47 AM

Behind the Scenes at the Dismantling of Roe v. Wade (slNYT)
posted by box (18 comments total)

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posted by Rumple at 9:11 AM on December 15, 2023 [2 favorites]

This has the possibility of being a huge decision. Not just mifepristone is at risk - not just used for medication abortions, but also post-miscarriage treatment and arthritis treatment - but would allow nearly any group to sue for a change to the FDA approval status of any medication. And not for a good reason - the Fifth Circuit decision this is appealing was from some quacksdoctors who said they might need to deal with the effects.

Birth control? Gone.
Transgender hormone replacement therapy? Gone as fast as some Republicans can shit out the application , probably in Texas to the same stain on the 5th.
Vaccines? Get the antivaxxers in full power in the right place and boom.

This is a dangerous case and needs to go down in absolute flames with no weaseling whatsoever by the Supremes. The answer needs to be “no, you can’t do that”.

I am uncertain it will be, and that may mean I need to leave this country sooner than expected.
posted by mephron at 9:37 AM on December 15, 2023 [27 favorites]

Blaming Bernie bros is the left wing cicular firing squad in effect. It’s not the fault of a consistent, powerful lobby of right-wing activists, who have manoeuvred to this point for years - it was those soy boys! Never mind that the republican groups were already blocking court appointments - it was the woke mindset!
posted by The River Ivel at 11:06 AM on December 15, 2023 [47 favorites]

One empowered the other
posted by torokunai at 11:11 AM on December 15, 2023 [2 favorites]

Awesome! Three comments in and an explicitly right-wing project is being blamed on the left. Not quite a Metafilter record but you're getting there!
posted by riotnrrd at 11:39 AM on December 15, 2023 [51 favorites]

Big historical moments are always dependent on many things. Roe repeal needed a committed decades-long campaign by pro-lifers and purist left-wingers abstaining in 2016 and Hilary Clinton's campaign's sloppy overconfidence and some more things to boot.

And, of course, history continues not to behave itself. I don't think the pro-lifers celebrating repeal expected that it would end up doing nothing more than adding the price of a plane ticket to the cost of abortions in states without initiative laws, while abortion remains legal not only in every pro-choice state but in many states (with initiatives) that they would have thought to be pro-life.
posted by MattD at 11:43 AM on December 15, 2023 [4 favorites]

I'm SO HAPPY for the berniebots and other misogynists who "just couldn't bring themselves" to vote for Clinton in 2016. Good job on not compromising your ideals, dude. Thanks for those Supreme Court justices.

At this point we know, about as conclusively as possible, that A) Bernie voters overwhelmingly voted for Clinton and B) the ones who didn't were almost entirely crossover voters who never would have voted for her anyway, so can we just let this end already
posted by mightygodking at 11:47 AM on December 15, 2023 [45 favorites]

Non-Americans have been watching you guys careen drunkenly down the path to Christian fascism for more than fifty years. Fascists should be losing these elections by landslides, but you're less interested in solving that problem than in policing and ostracizing the few thousand voters who prefer third candidates.

I mean, imagine looking at Hillary Clinton's history and thinking, "this lady would have solved all of America's problems!" Yeah, as if the president is the main problem with your doomed country.

Focus, people.
posted by klanawa at 11:48 AM on December 15, 2023 [36 favorites]

1. I lay the problem solemnly at the feet of the Murdoch family and their media 'empire.'

2. the Fifth Circuit decision this is appealing was from some quacksdoctors who said they might need to deal with the effects. That is some truly wild bullshit - I heard mention of this on (?) a Lawfare Podcast and couldn't believe my ears. There isn't even an actual, real case but a hypothetical? Sorry but this should be roundly and vigorously abused. OK, maybe that's not a good idea but loading the court with more justices is - there's precedent and in an effort to represent all people equally, it is only just.
posted by From Bklyn at 11:54 AM on December 15, 2023 [7 favorites]

Mod note: One comment deleted. Please avoid relitigating the 2016 elections. This is a thread about the Roe v. Wade so, please stick to the actual context of the conversation.
posted by loup (staff) at 12:22 PM on December 15, 2023 [7 favorites]

From Bklyn: from this summary of what's going on here on Vox:

The Alliance plaintiffs are doctors who oppose abortion, and organizations representing doctors who oppose abortion. They claim that they are injured by the fact that mifepristone is legal because a patient who takes that drug might experience a complication that might require follow-up treatment (serious complications from mifepristone are quite rare).

Rather then returning to their abortion provider for follow-up care, this patient then might seek care instead from one of the plaintiff doctors or a member of one of the plaintiff organizations. That might require that doctor to divert attention from other patients. Or the plaintiff doctor might have to provide care to this patient that the doctor finds morally objectionable.

That’s a whole lot of mights. And it is far too many mights to allow this lawsuit to proceed. The Supreme Court held in Clapper v. Amnesty Int’l USA (2013) that a plaintiff can sometimes file a federal lawsuit because they fear they will experience some kind of injury in the future, but only if “the threatened injury is certainly impending.” But there is no certainty here, just a long chain of speculative events that could, possibly, lead to some unidentified doctor doing something they find objectionable at some point in the future.

(Bolding mine.)

This is another case , like the original anti-abortion case, where someone pearlclutched about what might be and they're setting us up for a fucking of immense proportions.
posted by mephron at 2:31 PM on December 15, 2023 [13 favorites]

For anyone else for whom this article is just too long and depressing to face right now, the NYT has a shorter summary too: 5 Takeaways From Inside the Overturning of Roe v. Wade.

• Barrett opposed taking up the case.
• The court created distance from R.B.G.’s death.
• Roberts and Breyer tried to save part of Roe.
• The leak rendered those efforts hopeless.
• A Ginsburg tradition (oral dissents) came under threat.

posted by Nelson at 2:46 PM on December 15, 2023 [12 favorites]

The leak rendered those efforts hopeless

Alito totally leaked it.
posted by Artw at 4:21 PM on December 15, 2023 [23 favorites]

Yeah, the conservative bullshitting about finding the leaker always reminded me of Begbie after chucking the glass.
posted by Ickster at 8:20 PM on December 15, 2023 [6 favorites]

I mean, there are plenty of people to blame for this....

We might be entering a phase where there will be a black market for important drugs. I'm going to be working on making that black market as safe and fair as possible. I have some ideas, and I'm trying to build up a network.
posted by mr_roboto at 9:52 PM on December 15, 2023 [6 favorites]

Mod note: A couple removed; please see loup's note.
posted by taz (staff) at 11:27 PM on December 15, 2023 [1 favorite]

what might be and they're setting us up for a fucking of immense proportions.
… but walking down the street in Anytown, USA I might get shot so I should whip up a case to bring to the Supreme Court ? It’s perverse.
posted by From Bklyn at 11:48 PM on December 15, 2023 [7 favorites]

Mod note: Hi, several more comments removed for debating the mod actions and causing a derail. If folks have issues with the actions, please use the contact form or submit a MetaTalk post, thank you.
posted by Brandon Blatcher (staff) at 8:56 AM on December 16, 2023 [1 favorite]