Skiing in 1148" / 95' / 29m of Snow
December 16, 2023 8:19 AM Subscribe
During the 1998-99 snow season, [The] Mount Baker [Ski Area] received 95 feet of snow, setting the national and world record for the most snowfall in a year. The mark stands 25 years later. (ungated, archive)
People get to the ski resorts on regular roads. Places like that with consistent winter snowfall do have a serious fleet of snow plows to keep the roads clear, not just so people can ski, but also so local residents can do anything at all. But even so it's not that uncommon that it snows faster than they can keep up with it and the roads are closed for a week. And even when they're open but it's snowy on a sunday evening, a 3 hour drive home takes 8. When going on a ski weekend people look at the weather forecasts, and plan accordingly. Some people do leave enough buffer, other people get stranded for a while, and have to scramble to find petsitters or deal with an unexpected absence from work.
posted by aubilenon at 12:13 PM on December 16, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by aubilenon at 12:13 PM on December 16, 2023 [5 favorites]
I can't even imagine NINETY FIVE FEET of snow.
I think the deepest snow I've ever had to actually live in in my entire life is maybe 3-4 feet and it's practically a natural disaster and slow moving catastrophe, but this was very heavy, wet marine lowland snow in an area that doesn't get that kind of snow very often so it doesn't have a lot of infrastructure to deal with it.
And we basically got snowed in for almost two months because we couldn't find anyone to plow the steep, twisty half mile long driveway so we were having to hike out to the (barely) plowed roads where people were parking their cars and take expeditions to town for food, water and supplies and then haul everything in on foot, and luckily I was able to make a makeshift cargo sledge out of an old plastic toboggan I found in one of the sheds.
95 fucking feet of snow? That would have been nearly to the top of some of the tallest trees around there and would bury the rest of them. It would have flattened and crushed the main house that was just a large pre-built triple-wide kind of structure and totally smashed and buried the little shed and tiny house I was living in.
Hiking around would have been insanely dangerous due to the size of the snow wells and holes around all the trees. I mean, yeah, you could just ski, sled or roll down the hill to the main roads over the tops of the huge firs and maples but you'd surely fall into like a 40-60 foot deep tree hole and you would not be found until it melted. I've fallen into much smaller holes in the 4-5 foot deep range and even that can be dangerous and a lot of effort to get yourself out of it.
I legit can't even comprehend what living in 95 feet of snow is like. That's so deep that it could bury ski lift towers. Shoot, even with the towers and lines tall enough to stay open that means you could probably safely step off the lift almost anywhere you wanted to get off and might even be dragging your skis in places.
posted by loquacious at 12:57 PM on December 16, 2023 [5 favorites]
I think the deepest snow I've ever had to actually live in in my entire life is maybe 3-4 feet and it's practically a natural disaster and slow moving catastrophe, but this was very heavy, wet marine lowland snow in an area that doesn't get that kind of snow very often so it doesn't have a lot of infrastructure to deal with it.
And we basically got snowed in for almost two months because we couldn't find anyone to plow the steep, twisty half mile long driveway so we were having to hike out to the (barely) plowed roads where people were parking their cars and take expeditions to town for food, water and supplies and then haul everything in on foot, and luckily I was able to make a makeshift cargo sledge out of an old plastic toboggan I found in one of the sheds.
95 fucking feet of snow? That would have been nearly to the top of some of the tallest trees around there and would bury the rest of them. It would have flattened and crushed the main house that was just a large pre-built triple-wide kind of structure and totally smashed and buried the little shed and tiny house I was living in.
Hiking around would have been insanely dangerous due to the size of the snow wells and holes around all the trees. I mean, yeah, you could just ski, sled or roll down the hill to the main roads over the tops of the huge firs and maples but you'd surely fall into like a 40-60 foot deep tree hole and you would not be found until it melted. I've fallen into much smaller holes in the 4-5 foot deep range and even that can be dangerous and a lot of effort to get yourself out of it.
I legit can't even comprehend what living in 95 feet of snow is like. That's so deep that it could bury ski lift towers. Shoot, even with the towers and lines tall enough to stay open that means you could probably safely step off the lift almost anywhere you wanted to get off and might even be dragging your skis in places.
posted by loquacious at 12:57 PM on December 16, 2023 [5 favorites]
But how do you manage to drive in and out of these places?
My scale is a little reduced compared to the US given I live in Switzerland, but my answer would be that you check the forecast and be prepared. You make sure you're in a 4 wheel drive vehicle, have winter tyres, and carry chains. All resorts have serious snow clearing infrastructure so it's only a problem when there is exceptional snowfall. If it is exceptional then roads can be clear but closed due to avalanche risk - I've seen this a couple of times.
If the forecast is at all sketchy you make sure to carry food, warm clothes, flasks of hot drinks, and equipment to dig yourself out. If the forecast is especially bad you simply don't go because you risk being stuck and the resort is likely to be closed anyway due to avalance risk. It's simply not worth it. Ideally you go the day(s) after the storms when the snow is still relatively fresh but the skies (and roads) are clear.
It doesn't really apply to me, given I live in a ski resort. I moved here a decade ago, and I came from the UK where a couple of cm of snow brings the entire country to a standstill. My first season here was an eye-opener even though it's a low to mid level station (approx 2000m is the highest lift) - we had more snow in my first season than I'd seen before. Ever. Yet locals were calling it a poor season for snow (blog post from back then here). There was never a problem with the roads or access.
After a decade it's become routine. I'm used to seeing a bad storm drop up to 50cm in the village, which means twice as much on the pistes, but the roads are cleared frequently and things continue to function. The problems usually happen due to a poorly prepared visitor having an accident on the road up the mountain, or a sudden very heavy snowfall with freezing fog that means the roads are very slippy.
This season is especially good so far - we have had about 2m of snow here and it has remained cold. We have almost all lifts open and it's not even Xmas yet. The higher level stations are reporting 5m depths of snow on their pistes and lots of fresh powder in the last couple of weeks. We know if it's been a good season by counting the number of times we are woken up at 5am by the snowplows, so far this year the count is 4.
posted by lawrencium at 1:00 PM on December 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
My scale is a little reduced compared to the US given I live in Switzerland, but my answer would be that you check the forecast and be prepared. You make sure you're in a 4 wheel drive vehicle, have winter tyres, and carry chains. All resorts have serious snow clearing infrastructure so it's only a problem when there is exceptional snowfall. If it is exceptional then roads can be clear but closed due to avalanche risk - I've seen this a couple of times.
If the forecast is at all sketchy you make sure to carry food, warm clothes, flasks of hot drinks, and equipment to dig yourself out. If the forecast is especially bad you simply don't go because you risk being stuck and the resort is likely to be closed anyway due to avalance risk. It's simply not worth it. Ideally you go the day(s) after the storms when the snow is still relatively fresh but the skies (and roads) are clear.
It doesn't really apply to me, given I live in a ski resort. I moved here a decade ago, and I came from the UK where a couple of cm of snow brings the entire country to a standstill. My first season here was an eye-opener even though it's a low to mid level station (approx 2000m is the highest lift) - we had more snow in my first season than I'd seen before. Ever. Yet locals were calling it a poor season for snow (blog post from back then here). There was never a problem with the roads or access.
After a decade it's become routine. I'm used to seeing a bad storm drop up to 50cm in the village, which means twice as much on the pistes, but the roads are cleared frequently and things continue to function. The problems usually happen due to a poorly prepared visitor having an accident on the road up the mountain, or a sudden very heavy snowfall with freezing fog that means the roads are very slippy.
This season is especially good so far - we have had about 2m of snow here and it has remained cold. We have almost all lifts open and it's not even Xmas yet. The higher level stations are reporting 5m depths of snow on their pistes and lots of fresh powder in the last couple of weeks. We know if it's been a good season by counting the number of times we are woken up at 5am by the snowplows, so far this year the count is 4.
posted by lawrencium at 1:00 PM on December 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
I remember 30+ feet in Mammoth. Possibly the same season even. We would just strap in (snowboards) and jump off the lift wherever we wanted because it was at most a 10 or 12 ft drop, often less, into deep fluffy powder.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 1:08 PM on December 16, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by Hairy Lobster at 1:08 PM on December 16, 2023 [2 favorites]
95 fucking feet of snow? That would have been nearly to the top of some of the tallest trees around there and would bury the rest of them.
95 feet of snow is not 95 feet of snowpack, it's 95 feet of snow having fallen over the course of a season (of course, as more falls on top of it and snow ages, it gets compacted a lot from light fluffy stuff to dense, heavy snow). 95 feet of snowfall means they measured how much snow fell onto a flat surface once per day or more often and the total was 95 feet, not that you could actually measure snow depth of 95 feet anywhere.
The difference between snowpack and snowfall seems to have been unclear to the illustrator who made the infographic in the article as well.
There's a whole field of study looking at how snow ages and compacts over time with changes in temperature, humidity, sunlight, weight from additional snow above, ground temperature and more, which is quite important for forecasting avalanches.
posted by ssg at 1:11 PM on December 16, 2023 [12 favorites]
95 feet of snow is not 95 feet of snowpack, it's 95 feet of snow having fallen over the course of a season (of course, as more falls on top of it and snow ages, it gets compacted a lot from light fluffy stuff to dense, heavy snow). 95 feet of snowfall means they measured how much snow fell onto a flat surface once per day or more often and the total was 95 feet, not that you could actually measure snow depth of 95 feet anywhere.
The difference between snowpack and snowfall seems to have been unclear to the illustrator who made the infographic in the article as well.
There's a whole field of study looking at how snow ages and compacts over time with changes in temperature, humidity, sunlight, weight from additional snow above, ground temperature and more, which is quite important for forecasting avalanches.
posted by ssg at 1:11 PM on December 16, 2023 [12 favorites]
We know if it's been a good season by counting the number of times we are woken up at 5am by the snowplows, so far this year the count is 4.
I just want to note that this is one of the best sounds, especially if you live somewhere that doesn't get a lot of snow and doesn't have many plows or infrastructure to deal with it and you just a locally heavy snowfall like I'm talking about in my last comment. You can hear that gloriously horrible scraping noise from miles away and you know it means you can at least get to town for supplies and fresh food soon.
Another thing I can note is that you know the local snowfall is relatively bad when you come back from a supply run and find a full sized snow plow upside down in a drainage ditch on your local rural street half a mile from your driveway and the remaining length of road left unplowed. That was bad news. Poor thing was stuck there for almost a month and considering my local area and county has maybe 3-4 actual full sized plows it was probably a huge clusterfuck for them and we had extra long hikes back to the house for a while.
posted by loquacious at 1:12 PM on December 16, 2023 [4 favorites]
I just want to note that this is one of the best sounds, especially if you live somewhere that doesn't get a lot of snow and doesn't have many plows or infrastructure to deal with it and you just a locally heavy snowfall like I'm talking about in my last comment. You can hear that gloriously horrible scraping noise from miles away and you know it means you can at least get to town for supplies and fresh food soon.
Another thing I can note is that you know the local snowfall is relatively bad when you come back from a supply run and find a full sized snow plow upside down in a drainage ditch on your local rural street half a mile from your driveway and the remaining length of road left unplowed. That was bad news. Poor thing was stuck there for almost a month and considering my local area and county has maybe 3-4 actual full sized plows it was probably a huge clusterfuck for them and we had extra long hikes back to the house for a while.
posted by loquacious at 1:12 PM on December 16, 2023 [4 favorites]
If you're ever skiing baker, the towers on chair 6 have marks for the snow levels from that season, they're completely absurd to look at. Even on a normal year, driving up there in the spring is insane: getting to heather meadows you drive through effectively a snow hallway with 20+' walls. Before you go planning trip though, I'd be wary -- baker is a great locals hill when you can time your visits with storms. Long high pressure ridges in the pacific or fluctuating freezing levels can outlast a normal vacation and baker is not known for its grooming....
Also, considering our current snowpack, this story hurts. Fuck el nino and global warming.
posted by yeahwhatever at 1:15 PM on December 16, 2023 [2 favorites]
Also, considering our current snowpack, this story hurts. Fuck el nino and global warming.
posted by yeahwhatever at 1:15 PM on December 16, 2023 [2 favorites]
The actual snowpack was 26.5 feet (still a huge depth).
posted by ssg at 1:18 PM on December 16, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by ssg at 1:18 PM on December 16, 2023 [4 favorites]
95 feet of snowfall means they measured how much snow fell onto a flat surface once per day or more often and the total was 95 feet, not that you could actually measure snow depth of 95 feet anywhere.
Oh, sure, I get this. But you could still probably measure some extreme depths in hollows or places where it builds up because of how snow moves and drifts. I know it's not 95 feet as a uniform blanket depth everywhere.
Even in the 3-4 foot totals for the week long snow event I experienced there were places where it was easily 12 feet deep due to drifting. I fell into some of these and ended up in it basically up to my head and neck.
And even total accumulated packed depths of, say, 20 feet is a fuckton of snow. That would easily flatten structures that aren't built for it.
posted by loquacious at 1:18 PM on December 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
Oh, sure, I get this. But you could still probably measure some extreme depths in hollows or places where it builds up because of how snow moves and drifts. I know it's not 95 feet as a uniform blanket depth everywhere.
Even in the 3-4 foot totals for the week long snow event I experienced there were places where it was easily 12 feet deep due to drifting. I fell into some of these and ended up in it basically up to my head and neck.
And even total accumulated packed depths of, say, 20 feet is a fuckton of snow. That would easily flatten structures that aren't built for it.
posted by loquacious at 1:18 PM on December 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
I get that these are wealthy places with a giant budget for snow management. But even with big robust snow plows... can that really be enough to keep the roads safe enough for visitors (and workers) to get in and out?
Do an image search for Toyama snow canyon
posted by GCU Sweet and Full of Grace at 1:24 PM on December 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
Do an image search for Toyama snow canyon
posted by GCU Sweet and Full of Grace at 1:24 PM on December 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
Yay it’s ski post metafilter time! (northern season edition). My favorite time iof the year
So Alta / Snowbird in Utah each got around 75 feet last year. How did they deal with that? Well, welcome to the phrase of the day - Interlodge . But yeah it was a shit show some days - avalanches were a major problem - and some days the roads didn’t open at all so you were interlodged and what they call a country club day (they still ran lifts and you got an epic day). I only got 35 feet at my house - and only got swept down my driveway in a mini avalanche once when a nine foot snow wall gave way behind me at 6am as I tried to get out for first tracks…..
This season is less than epic in the US (outside Alaska and a few one hit days at Grand Targhee / Ski Santa Fe / LCC & BCC etc)) so far. But here in Utah - the faithful amongst us in the PDS (Church of the Powder Day Saints) are praying hard for snow. Possibly writing this from a chair lift…Blessed are December storms - for they cover over thy rock sharks, and provide entertainment to thine children on winter break.
posted by inflatablekiwi at 1:29 PM on December 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
So Alta / Snowbird in Utah each got around 75 feet last year. How did they deal with that? Well, welcome to the phrase of the day - Interlodge . But yeah it was a shit show some days - avalanches were a major problem - and some days the roads didn’t open at all so you were interlodged and what they call a country club day (they still ran lifts and you got an epic day). I only got 35 feet at my house - and only got swept down my driveway in a mini avalanche once when a nine foot snow wall gave way behind me at 6am as I tried to get out for first tracks…..
This season is less than epic in the US (outside Alaska and a few one hit days at Grand Targhee / Ski Santa Fe / LCC & BCC etc)) so far. But here in Utah - the faithful amongst us in the PDS (Church of the Powder Day Saints) are praying hard for snow. Possibly writing this from a chair lift…Blessed are December storms - for they cover over thy rock sharks, and provide entertainment to thine children on winter break.
posted by inflatablekiwi at 1:29 PM on December 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
Haha, I remember this. I didn't get to take advantage at the time but I remember others losing their minds. The images of the pack piled up where they'd plowed little canyons through it are seared into my brain. 95 feet of snow may not be 95 feet straight up, but it was definitely a significant fraction!!
Thanks for this trip down memory lane. Memory snow canyon.
Incidentally, the infographic measuring the snowfall in units of stacked Subarus is the most Seattle thing ever. I love it.
posted by BlackLeotardFront at 2:29 PM on December 16, 2023
Thanks for this trip down memory lane. Memory snow canyon.
Incidentally, the infographic measuring the snowfall in units of stacked Subarus is the most Seattle thing ever. I love it.
posted by BlackLeotardFront at 2:29 PM on December 16, 2023
From Jerry of the Day last year in deep Tahoe Powder - when it’s too deep for beginners / Saving Private Jerry
posted by inflatablekiwi at 6:17 PM on December 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by inflatablekiwi at 6:17 PM on December 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
But how do you manage to drive in and out of these places?
I’ve been up to the Mt Baker ski area quite a few times, and I remember looking at the edges of the road littered with derailed cars, the answer is sometimes you don’t .
posted by Jon Mitchell at 7:23 PM on December 16, 2023
I’ve been up to the Mt Baker ski area quite a few times, and I remember looking at the edges of the road littered with derailed cars, the answer is sometimes you don’t .
posted by Jon Mitchell at 7:23 PM on December 16, 2023
Last year was a very prolific year in Sierra Nevada's. Last year Palisades Tahoe got north of 60 feet of snow. Lots of buried things on their website. I was there in February and there was just extraordinary amounts of snow. The main roads and sidewalks were ploughed good but everything else was a mess. When walking on a non-main sidewalk it was common to have to step down a foot or more to get onto the main sidewalk. Our drive the first day was just 36 miles but took us over two hours. Part of that drive took us real close to the Donner Pass. It really puts things in perspective.
To add some details to what inflatablekiwi shared...Alta and Snowbird are at the end of a narrow box canyon (i.e. there is only 1 way in and out). The Utah government has this to say about avalanches in that canyon:
A perhaps even more hair raising road is Loveland Pass, west of Denver. At nearly 12,000 feet above sea level it is the highest road in the world that is kept open to vehicular traffic year round (Interstate 70 follows a similar path but has tunnels which makes it unsuitable for large trucks or hazardous materials).
posted by mmascolino at 8:51 PM on December 16, 2023 [4 favorites]
To add some details to what inflatablekiwi shared...Alta and Snowbird are at the end of a narrow box canyon (i.e. there is only 1 way in and out). The Utah government has this to say about avalanches in that canyon:
There are 64 slide paths in Little Cottonwood Canyon alone, with over half of SR-210 threatened by avalanches. Over 50 buildings and 76% of the road passing through Snowbird and the Town of Alta are in avalanche paths. The road is fully closed to the public when avalanche mitigation is in progress.The snow can and will slide onto the road blocking entrance and exit. Also anytime there is any amount of significant snow, the authorities need to close the only road so that they can mitigate the danger (mostly by exploding stashes of snow while they are small so they don't get big and slide).
A perhaps even more hair raising road is Loveland Pass, west of Denver. At nearly 12,000 feet above sea level it is the highest road in the world that is kept open to vehicular traffic year round (Interstate 70 follows a similar path but has tunnels which makes it unsuitable for large trucks or hazardous materials).
posted by mmascolino at 8:51 PM on December 16, 2023 [4 favorites]
When I lived in the mountains, there were occasional rumors of snorkel skiing in deep powder a few valleys over. It was said that the skiers used a snorkel so they could take advantage of the entire 3D powder environment, diving deep and then blasting back up through the surface.
I'm still not sure if it was only a mountain legend.
posted by fairmettle at 11:08 PM on December 16, 2023
I'm still not sure if it was only a mountain legend.
posted by fairmettle at 11:08 PM on December 16, 2023
As a skier in CO, I think it’s worth noting that the depth of the snow pack is not important so long as it is covering the rocks. 3 feet, 300 feet, it skis pretty much the same.
The fun thing about 95 feet of snow would be all the powder days!
posted by teece303 at 9:16 AM on December 17, 2023
The fun thing about 95 feet of snow would be all the powder days!
posted by teece303 at 9:16 AM on December 17, 2023
Unfortunately, not too much powder in the Northwest - there’s the Cascade Concrete.
posted by ShooBoo at 12:23 PM on December 17, 2023
posted by ShooBoo at 12:23 PM on December 17, 2023
Weirdly enough (I have lived in the Bay Area all my life) I was there that season over the Christmas break, but I was a very, very beginning snowboarder and the amount of snow meant nothing to me. I really only remember having a snowboard lesson in which I was, among a group of twelve: one of three adult-ish people; one of three goofy-footed boarders; the only girl. I learned nothing because the teenage instructor was not goofy-footed and basically just ignored anyone who was. It sucked.
posted by oneirodynia at 6:02 PM on December 18, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by oneirodynia at 6:02 PM on December 18, 2023 [1 favorite]
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I understand being at a ski resort and wanting tons of fresh powdery snow every day you are there! Great skiing conditions! But how do you manage to drive in and out of these places? Do the roads in/out routinely get closed due to treacherous weather, potential avalanches, or low visibility conditions? Do you have to make a travel itinerary with built in buffer time in case you get snowed in a day or two? Do people routinely miss flights home from these places?
I get that these are wealthy places with a giant budget for snow management. But even with big robust snow plows... can that really be enough to keep the roads safe enough for visitors (and workers) to get in and out? I'm not even talking about record snow falls, just routine big amounts with a few doozie blizzards mixed in, year after year... How does that work?
(OK I'm gonna RTFA now)
posted by SoberHighland at 11:44 AM on December 16, 2023 [1 favorite]