Vets against war
May 21, 2006 7:17 PM Subscribe
A 20-minute video that will change your life!
Well, maybe not.
.
posted by fatbobsmith at 7:31 PM on May 21, 2006
posted by fatbobsmith at 7:31 PM on May 21, 2006
Jessie Macbeth is saying that Rangers executed civilian children as part of the interrogation of their parents. Maybe I have been living under a rock, but I have not heard of such an allegation before. Is anyone else saying this?
posted by bugmuncher at 7:52 PM on May 21, 2006
posted by bugmuncher at 7:52 PM on May 21, 2006
He also says Rangers infiltrated a mosque, waited for men, women, and children to pray, then slaughtered them and defiled the building...
...And he says he executed an unarmed woman and her three children, despite the woman's pleas for mercy, because that's what he had to do...
If the MSM jumped all over Abu Ghraib, wouldn't they also catch onto stories like these?
posted by bugmuncher at 8:07 PM on May 21, 2006
...And he says he executed an unarmed woman and her three children, despite the woman's pleas for mercy, because that's what he had to do...
If the MSM jumped all over Abu Ghraib, wouldn't they also catch onto stories like these?
posted by bugmuncher at 8:07 PM on May 21, 2006
broken
posted by Joseph Gurl at 8:15 PM on May 21, 2006 [1 favorite]
posted by Joseph Gurl at 8:15 PM on May 21, 2006 [1 favorite]
Jessie Macbeth is also called Jesse MacBeth and Jesse Macbeth in other online media. I'd like to hear more from him, but he's a hard man to google.
posted by bugmuncher at 8:24 PM on May 21, 2006
posted by bugmuncher at 8:24 PM on May 21, 2006
If the MSM jumped all over Abu Ghraib, wouldn't they also catch onto stories like these?
Haditha?
Even the Washington Post is on it now ... six months after the killings.
.
posted by Surfurrus at 8:29 PM on May 21, 2006
Haditha?
Even the Washington Post is on it now ... six months after the killings.
.
posted by Surfurrus at 8:29 PM on May 21, 2006
busted already?
broken
You mean the link? Seems to work fine for me. But here is the URL: www.peacefilms.org/menu.html
There are other clips that are worth watching. Especially about a young protester.
I'd like to hear more from him, but he's a hard man to google.
He sure is. The only other thing I could find about him is essentially the transcript of the video.
posted by c13 at 8:51 PM on May 21, 2006
broken
You mean the link? Seems to work fine for me. But here is the URL: www.peacefilms.org/menu.html
There are other clips that are worth watching. Especially about a young protester.
I'd like to hear more from him, but he's a hard man to google.
He sure is. The only other thing I could find about him is essentially the transcript of the video.
posted by c13 at 8:51 PM on May 21, 2006
Macbeth isn't talking about Haditha (he says he was a Ranger, while Haditha appears to be a Marines issue).
He says he personally killed roughly 200 unarmed civilians at close range. That's very alarming and sad. So is sneaking into a house of worship and massacring people in prayer.
Oh, c13, I did find an ASU student newspaper editorial about some anti-coffeehouse protests in Tempe that involved Macbeth. I didn't link it earlier because the editorial doesn't describe him in the best light. I'm not out to discunt the guy -- though I really would like to see his statements investigated. Removal of any war criminals from the Army is good for America.
posted by bugmuncher at 9:45 PM on May 21, 2006
He says he personally killed roughly 200 unarmed civilians at close range. That's very alarming and sad. So is sneaking into a house of worship and massacring people in prayer.
Oh, c13, I did find an ASU student newspaper editorial about some anti-coffeehouse protests in Tempe that involved Macbeth. I didn't link it earlier because the editorial doesn't describe him in the best light. I'm not out to discunt the guy -- though I really would like to see his statements investigated. Removal of any war criminals from the Army is good for America.
posted by bugmuncher at 9:45 PM on May 21, 2006
Pictures of Jesse Macbeth at a march and talk in Tacoma, Washington here.
posted by Chuckles at 9:51 PM on May 21, 2006
posted by Chuckles at 9:51 PM on May 21, 2006
Community media broadcast schedule for The Truth About Iraq, from Gresham, Oregon (broadcasts coming up on May 24th and 25th).
posted by Chuckles at 9:54 PM on May 21, 2006
posted by Chuckles at 9:54 PM on May 21, 2006
From c3's other link:
What medals did you get in Iraq?
I got a lot. I got a purple heart. Half of them, I don't remember. I got five or six medals just for landing. I got a bronze star.
What injuries did you get?
I got stabbed many times. I got shrapnel in my knee. I got shot in the back.
Maybe it is flippant of me to suggest that perhaps he should have 2 or 3 purple hearts?
What Veteran's benefits have you gotten?
I ain't getting nothing. A card and that's it.
As a combat veteran, he should get free health care for 2 years after his release from active duty. So, either the VA screwed up and he isn't pursuing a remedy, or he is eligible for free health care and not using it.
posted by bugmuncher at 9:58 PM on May 21, 2006
What medals did you get in Iraq?
I got a lot. I got a purple heart. Half of them, I don't remember. I got five or six medals just for landing. I got a bronze star.
What injuries did you get?
I got stabbed many times. I got shrapnel in my knee. I got shot in the back.
Maybe it is flippant of me to suggest that perhaps he should have 2 or 3 purple hearts?
What Veteran's benefits have you gotten?
I ain't getting nothing. A card and that's it.
As a combat veteran, he should get free health care for 2 years after his release from active duty. So, either the VA screwed up and he isn't pursuing a remedy, or he is eligible for free health care and not using it.
posted by bugmuncher at 9:58 PM on May 21, 2006
Seems like he has been back in the USA since late 2003, so 2 years has run out. Denying it just because it recently ran out is a little misleading though..
Here is a letter by Jesse Macbeth (you'll need bugmenot) to the Arizona State University newspaper regarding that Plantation coffee shop issue. He says he is on the verge of being shipped out again, April 2004.
posted by Chuckles at 10:16 PM on May 21, 2006
Here is a letter by Jesse Macbeth (you'll need bugmenot) to the Arizona State University newspaper regarding that Plantation coffee shop issue. He says he is on the verge of being shipped out again, April 2004.
posted by Chuckles at 10:16 PM on May 21, 2006
That's all I've got..
Jesse Macbeth himself seems very credible, but the details he discusses seem too sensational to believe.
posted by Chuckles at 10:23 PM on May 21, 2006
Jesse Macbeth himself seems very credible, but the details he discusses seem too sensational to believe.
posted by Chuckles at 10:23 PM on May 21, 2006
He says he is on the verge of being shipped out again, April 2004.
Man, the army must really be hard up if that's the case -- the guy can barely speak!
posted by c13 at 10:30 PM on May 21, 2006
Man, the army must really be hard up if that's the case -- the guy can barely speak!
posted by c13 at 10:30 PM on May 21, 2006
You don't have to speak to kill people. Or be president. But I repeat myself.
posted by brundlefly at 11:00 PM on May 21, 2006
posted by brundlefly at 11:00 PM on May 21, 2006
STUTTERING AS A VARIANT OF POST TRAUMATIC STRESS DISORDER?
posted by shoepal at 11:03 PM on May 21, 2006
posted by shoepal at 11:03 PM on May 21, 2006
I just can't get over the comparison between what this video talks about, and the opinions being expressed one thread up.
posted by Chuckles at 11:30 PM on May 21, 2006
posted by Chuckles at 11:30 PM on May 21, 2006
Jesse's letter to the ASU paper says he was asked to leave the coffee shop because he was in uniform. If that's true, it's disgusting. I also think it's illegal, but for some reason I can't find that law anywhere. (Maybe because I am not a lawyer.)
posted by bugmuncher at 6:07 AM on May 22, 2006
posted by bugmuncher at 6:07 AM on May 22, 2006
"If we have to fight again, man, it would be to take that asshole out of office."
Seems fair. If the administration's argument is that it's okay to kill tens of thousands of random and innocent Iraqis in pursuit of freedom and democracy in Iraq, I imagine it's equally justifiable, if not more so, to advocate killing tens of very specific and guilty American politicians in pursuit of the same goal here. And I believe the evidence of guilt for these American politicians in their betrayal of the constitution is far greater than the pretext for invading Iraq, the USA PATRIOT Act, NSA warrantless wiretapping and data collection on American citizens, and whatever else they are probably doing that has yet to come to light.
Of course advocating the former is generally considered patriotism while advocating the latter is considered treason. The former might get you a free yellow ribbon sticker to put on your car; the latter might get you an indefinite stay at Gitmo.
And to be clear to my NSA case worker: I am neither advocating nor promoting the assassination of our glorious and divinely inspired leader.
posted by effwerd at 6:11 AM on May 22, 2006
Seems fair. If the administration's argument is that it's okay to kill tens of thousands of random and innocent Iraqis in pursuit of freedom and democracy in Iraq, I imagine it's equally justifiable, if not more so, to advocate killing tens of very specific and guilty American politicians in pursuit of the same goal here. And I believe the evidence of guilt for these American politicians in their betrayal of the constitution is far greater than the pretext for invading Iraq, the USA PATRIOT Act, NSA warrantless wiretapping and data collection on American citizens, and whatever else they are probably doing that has yet to come to light.
Of course advocating the former is generally considered patriotism while advocating the latter is considered treason. The former might get you a free yellow ribbon sticker to put on your car; the latter might get you an indefinite stay at Gitmo.
And to be clear to my NSA case worker: I am neither advocating nor promoting the assassination of our glorious and divinely inspired leader.
posted by effwerd at 6:11 AM on May 22, 2006
I also think it's illegal, but for some reason I can't find that law anywhere. I think it is legal , because it is private property. If the host decides one guest isn't welcome then the would-be guest can't enter even if the place is generally open to public. Is it disgusting ? Depends..discrimination on the basis of just wearing a military uniform seems superficial to me, but so are people in uniform who discriminate people because they don't wear any.
posted by elpapacito at 6:27 AM on May 22, 2006
posted by elpapacito at 6:27 AM on May 22, 2006
I think it is legal , because it is private property.
Ordinarily I would take this position, as well, but I do recall reading (and currently can't find) some federal law (probably unenforceable) that protects servicemembers from discrimination based on wearing their uniform.
posted by bugmuncher at 7:32 AM on May 22, 2006
Ordinarily I would take this position, as well, but I do recall reading (and currently can't find) some federal law (probably unenforceable) that protects servicemembers from discrimination based on wearing their uniform.
posted by bugmuncher at 7:32 AM on May 22, 2006
Word is the guy's a phony. People who actually know how the rangers operate say details of his story are clearly bogus. Even his trophy photograph in uniform is wrong.
This has happened before, you know.
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 9:30 AM on May 22, 2006
This has happened before, you know.
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 9:30 AM on May 22, 2006
Thanks, Steven C. Den Beste. Much appreciated. How embarassing.
posted by shoepal at 11:26 AM on May 22, 2006
posted by shoepal at 11:26 AM on May 22, 2006
Yes, Thanks Steven C. Den Beste!
You can actually see his story evolving over time, come to think about it. The video makes no mention of Afghanistan, but one of the earlier articles does (from 'a couple of articles about Jesse Mcbeth'):
I wonder what his real story is..
posted by Chuckles at 12:02 PM on May 22, 2006
You can actually see his story evolving over time, come to think about it. The video makes no mention of Afghanistan, but one of the earlier articles does (from 'a couple of articles about Jesse Mcbeth'):
MacBeth, a ranger in the U.S. Army, returned to the states two-and-a-half months ago after sustaining an injury in his back. He spent 14 months serving in the Middle East -- first in Afghanistan and then in Baghdad.Quite different from the story in the video.
I wonder what his real story is..
posted by Chuckles at 12:02 PM on May 22, 2006
As a journalist, I might want to interject that journalists make mistakes too. Maybe he told the story the same way in Arizona, but reporters heard him differently.
But in this case, it is more likely that he is changing his story over time.
posted by bugmuncher at 12:16 PM on May 22, 2006
But in this case, it is more likely that he is changing his story over time.
posted by bugmuncher at 12:16 PM on May 22, 2006
One more, and then I'll stop:
He has claimed he was home in April of 2004 after 16 months in Iraq. Not possible. (The invasion took place in March of 2003.)
But he's also claimed he was involved in the Fallujah siege, which took place in April of 2004.
The only problem is that it was the Marines who did that, not the Rangers.
This post has a list of things which are wrong in that trophy photograph of MacBeth in his uniform.
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 4:03 PM on May 22, 2006
He has claimed he was home in April of 2004 after 16 months in Iraq. Not possible. (The invasion took place in March of 2003.)
But he's also claimed he was involved in the Fallujah siege, which took place in April of 2004.
The only problem is that it was the Marines who did that, not the Rangers.
This post has a list of things which are wrong in that trophy photograph of MacBeth in his uniform.
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 4:03 PM on May 22, 2006
I'm glad he's a fraud. Most of the things he was claiming were just way over the top. I want this war to end but I'd rather not have it happen because of backlash from the type of things he was claiming.
posted by effwerd at 5:03 PM on May 22, 2006
posted by effwerd at 5:03 PM on May 22, 2006
Of course, it's not a phenomenon until it appears on wikipedia.
posted by bugmuncher at 10:06 PM on May 22, 2006
posted by bugmuncher at 10:06 PM on May 22, 2006
The US Army says that Jesse MacBeth was not a Ranger and was not in the Special Forces.
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 9:04 AM on May 23, 2006
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 9:04 AM on May 23, 2006
Now it turns out that at some of the times he claimed he was in Iraq, he was actually in Arizona having trouble with the law.
And he's also in trouble with the law in Washington. There's a warrant out for his arrest on a charge of assault. (As one wag put it, he may soon be telling his stories to a captive audience.)
And just for the record, his legal name is "Jesse Adam MacBeth". It was legally changed by his parents when he was 2 years old from "Jesse Adam Al-Zaid".
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 4:39 PM on May 23, 2006
And he's also in trouble with the law in Washington. There's a warrant out for his arrest on a charge of assault. (As one wag put it, he may soon be telling his stories to a captive audience.)
And just for the record, his legal name is "Jesse Adam MacBeth". It was legally changed by his parents when he was 2 years old from "Jesse Adam Al-Zaid".
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 4:39 PM on May 23, 2006
Jesse Mac Bride is *also* Jesse Al-Zaid?
Looks like Jesse MacBride has a bench warrant handed down today for failure to appear on an assault in the first degree/violation of protection order rap.
http://www.sweetness-light.com/archive/warrant-out-for-ranger-macbeth-for-assault/
But that's not the real mess here, folks...THIS is:
In other news, seems his original name (*sigh*) was originally [b]Jesse Al-Zaid[/b]...changed when he was at two years of age:
"The Pima County AZ records also show that Jesse Adama Al-Zaid’s parents are named Alrahman Al-Zaid and Leisha Campbell."
http://www.sweetness-light.com/archive/jesse-adam-macbeth-was-born-jesse-adam-al-zaid/
I just have to wonder if this is one boot-leather stupid half-homeless con-artist that found some sort of free lunch with IVAW, and milked it until he was in over his head...or, some real piece-of-work con-artist that decided he was "in solidarity" with the Iraqis and went all "Micky Mouse mujahadeen" and suckered the IVAW on a nut-case agenda.
Maybe he's even a Manchurian Mujahadeen candidate or ringer to discredit IVAW.
The epitome of the "Tangled Web."
Whatever...this is ALL BAD for EVERYONE on EVERY SIDE of this total Charlie Foxtrot.
posted by Dunvegan at 10:32 PM on May 23, 2006
Looks like Jesse MacBride has a bench warrant handed down today for failure to appear on an assault in the first degree/violation of protection order rap.
http://www.sweetness-light.com/archive/warrant-out-for-ranger-macbeth-for-assault/
But that's not the real mess here, folks...THIS is:
In other news, seems his original name (*sigh*) was originally [b]Jesse Al-Zaid[/b]...changed when he was at two years of age:
"The Pima County AZ records also show that Jesse Adama Al-Zaid’s parents are named Alrahman Al-Zaid and Leisha Campbell."
http://www.sweetness-light.com/archive/jesse-adam-macbeth-was-born-jesse-adam-al-zaid/
I just have to wonder if this is one boot-leather stupid half-homeless con-artist that found some sort of free lunch with IVAW, and milked it until he was in over his head...or, some real piece-of-work con-artist that decided he was "in solidarity" with the Iraqis and went all "Micky Mouse mujahadeen" and suckered the IVAW on a nut-case agenda.
Maybe he's even a Manchurian Mujahadeen candidate or ringer to discredit IVAW.
The epitome of the "Tangled Web."
Whatever...this is ALL BAD for EVERYONE on EVERY SIDE of this total Charlie Foxtrot.
posted by Dunvegan at 10:32 PM on May 23, 2006
I'm afraid this keeps getting more pathetic. Jesse MacBeth posted a scan of his form DD-214, the discharge form he got after Army service. He seems to have forged parts of it (mismatched fonts, incorrect terminology, and where have we heard that before?) but the parts he didn't change indicate that he was kicked out of the Army during basic training.
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 8:06 PM on May 26, 2006
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 8:06 PM on May 26, 2006
This internet thing seems to be working pretty well..
I find it really amazing that he has been riding this "I'm a veteran" thing for 2 years now.. There is probably still more to discover about his backstory, at least we need to know how he flunked out of basic (if that is what happened).
posted by Chuckles at 9:54 PM on May 26, 2006
I find it really amazing that he has been riding this "I'm a veteran" thing for 2 years now.. There is probably still more to discover about his backstory, at least we need to know how he flunked out of basic (if that is what happened).
posted by Chuckles at 9:54 PM on May 26, 2006
Jesse MacBeth tried to use his changed DD-214 to file for veterans benefits. (He's not entitled to them because he didn't serve long enough.) The VA is going to put out a federal warrant and he'll be prosecuted for it.
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 3:32 PM on May 31, 2006
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 3:32 PM on May 31, 2006
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posted by stenseng at 7:20 PM on May 21, 2006