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Hitler's French son.
February 17, 2012 9:15 AM   Subscribe


 
Mr Loret recently began investigating his past in great detail, employing scientists to prove that he has the same blood type as Hitler, and that they even have similar handwriting.

I TOLD YOU MAURY JUST LOOK AT HIS NOSE THEY HAVE THE SAME NOSE
posted by griphus at 9:17 AM on February 17, 2012 [13 favorites]


Worst. Family reunion. Ever.
posted by Dasein at 9:19 AM on February 17, 2012 [5 favorites]


He slipped one past the maginot line?
posted by condour75 at 9:20 AM on February 17, 2012 [6 favorites]


Mr Gibault said that Mr Loret's own children might now be in a position to claim royalties from Mien Kampf ('My Struggle'), Hitler's famous book which has sold millions of copies around the world.

They had to ruin this story somehow, didn't they?
posted by Dasein at 9:21 AM on February 17, 2012 [7 favorites]


Somewhere in the History Channel's cold brick headquarters, a network executive pops his first unassisted erection since the first Bush administration.
posted by 2bucksplus at 9:22 AM on February 17, 2012 [64 favorites]


Jean-Marie Loret, who died in 1985 aged 67, never met his father, but went on to fight Nazi forces during the Second World War.

Mr Loret recently began investigating his past in great detail, employing scientists to prove that he has the same blood type as Hitler, and that they even have similar handwriting.

???
posted by kmz at 9:22 AM on February 17, 2012 [13 favorites]


Dasein: Worst. Family reunion. Ever.

Because they're all dead?
posted by filthy light thief at 9:22 AM on February 17, 2012 [4 favorites]


If they can claim royalties, then perhaps the estate is also open to being sued for liability. Go ahead, open that can of worms.
posted by Kadin2048 at 9:23 AM on February 17, 2012 [9 favorites]


So he grows up adopted, fights against a tyrannical empire, joins up with a resistance movement, then finds out who is father is...

Well, I guess someone has to say it.
posted by chambers at 9:25 AM on February 17, 2012 [31 favorites]


Damn, mom. Couldn't you have held on to that secret just a little longer so you could've died without telling your son that he's spawn of Hitler?
posted by Burhanistan at 9:25 AM on February 17, 2012 [5 favorites]


He may have only had one ball but he managed to play it in another field entirely, it seems.
posted by ardgedee at 9:26 AM on February 17, 2012 [1 favorite]


[citation needed]
posted by designbot at 9:26 AM on February 17, 2012 [3 favorites]


Wiki seems to say that this is mere conjecture of a few, and other historians think it's highly unlikely...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Loret
posted by symbioid at 9:27 AM on February 17, 2012


DAMNIT DESIGNBOT!
posted by symbioid at 9:27 AM on February 17, 2012 [1 favorite]


Apparently since this has been kicked around since the seventies. Wikipedia indicates that DNA tests in 2008 comparing the Lorets and the surviving members of the Hitler family came up negative.
posted by Iridic at 9:27 AM on February 17, 2012 [4 favorites]


DAMN IT SYMBIOID AND ALSO DESIGNBOT!
posted by Iridic at 9:28 AM on February 17, 2012 [5 favorites]


And then there's this poor guy.
posted by kmz at 9:28 AM on February 17, 2012


It is is a good thing that royalties can be collected on Mein Kampf. Otherwise we might be discouraging future Hitlers who see no profit in being meglomanical genocidal racist politicians.
posted by srboisvert at 9:28 AM on February 17, 2012 [5 favorites]


Just wait 'til your dad comes home.
posted by Benny Andajetz at 9:28 AM on February 17, 2012 [6 favorites]


The bit about the handwriting being the same is kind of odd. Who has handwriting that looks like their father's, unless they are actively trying to mimic it?
posted by Burhanistan at 9:28 AM on February 17, 2012 [3 favorites]


kmz: " Mr Loret recently began investigating his past in great detail, employing scientists to prove that he has the same blood type as Hitler, and that they even have similar handwriting."

Not only that...
Mr Loret wrote a book called 'Your Father's Name Was Hitler' in 981, and it is now set to be re-published with all the new evidence.

posted by zarq at 9:30 AM on February 17, 2012 [3 favorites]


The bit about the handwriting being the same is kind of odd. Who has handwriting that looks like their father's, unless they are actively trying to mimic it?

My handwriting looks a lot like my father's, but oddly not at all like my mothers.
posted by 2bucksplus at 9:31 AM on February 17, 2012


...981...

Well obviously if Loret was a time traveller he not only was Hitler's son but also his grandfather! IT GOES DEEPER
posted by Wretch729 at 9:32 AM on February 17, 2012 [7 favorites]


Well, I guess someone has to say it.

No.

Or, rather: noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!
posted by yoink at 9:32 AM on February 17, 2012 [5 favorites]


Your Father's Name Was Hitlericus.
posted by spicynuts at 9:33 AM on February 17, 2012


Aha, so Mr. Loret was a time traveler!

Also, the related articles on the Telegraph are just... something:
Hitler's secret photos reveal Nazi leader's vanity 09 Feb 2012
For rent: Hitler's Wolf's Lair 18 Jan 2012
Images of Adolf Hitler celebrating Christmas 27 Dec 2011
Hitler cat fails to find home 29 Jul 2011
posted by kmz at 9:33 AM on February 17, 2012 [1 favorite]


There's a picture of him (via this article).

He does have that mustache thing.
posted by twoleftfeet at 9:33 AM on February 17, 2012 [2 favorites]


Wasn't this a Denis Johnson book?
posted by KokuRyu at 9:35 AM on February 17, 2012


Mr Gibault said that Mr Loret's own children might now be in a position to claim royalties from Mien Kampf ('My Struggle'), Hitler's famous book which has sold millions of copies around the world.

First question that popped into my mind: so who has been making money off Mein Kampf? It's public domain by now, given that Hitler has been dead for nearly 67 years, and (at least under Canadian law) a book enters the public domain 50 years after the death of its author, but who got the royalties prior to 1995? Or was it just tacitly understood to be public domain all along?
posted by orange swan at 9:36 AM on February 17, 2012 [3 favorites]


How do they know it isn't Charlie Chaplin's son?
posted by clvrmnky at 9:39 AM on February 17, 2012 [9 favorites]


Public domain in the U.S. is now life of the author + 70 years, so works from authors who died before 1942 are public domain. Hitler didn't die until 1983, in a small village in Argentina.
posted by twoleftfeet at 9:39 AM on February 17, 2012 [11 favorites]


Hasn't this been definitively debunked?
posted by John Cohen at 9:41 AM on February 17, 2012 [1 favorite]


You know who else had an illegitimate son conceived during wartime with a........ahh,forget it.
posted by BozoBurgerBonanza at 9:41 AM on February 17, 2012 [2 favorites]


First question that popped into my mind: so who has been making money off Mein Kampf?
During the Second World War, the US government made more than $20,000 from royalties on Mein Kampf, having seized the copyright as part of the Trading with the Enemy Act (Hitler's book was one of the first assets gained under this law). By l979, the Justice Department had collected more than $139,000 in royalties. Eventually, the monies were paid on a pro-rata basis to claimants, many of them American ex-POWs. In l979, Houghton Mifflin, the US publisher of the book, paid the government more than $35,000 for the rights. Selling more than 15,000 copies a year, Houghton Mifflin made substantial profits. When questioned about the ethics of this, the publishers reassigned the profits to charity.
(Source)
posted by griphus at 9:43 AM on February 17, 2012 [2 favorites]


Public domain in the U.S. is now life of the author + 70 years, so works from authors who died before 1942 are public domain. Hitler didn't die until 1983, in a small village in Argentina.

Also, you know, which Hitler? A DNA test would be useless since most of the boys were genetically identical.
posted by 2bucksplus at 9:44 AM on February 17, 2012 [4 favorites]


so who has been making money off Mein Kampf?

The original US publisher of the English translation made money off it for a long time but now donates them to charity. The German government owns the rights to the original, but uses them to keep anyone else from republishing it.
posted by DecemberBoy at 9:44 AM on February 17, 2012


If DNA evidence completely debunks this, but the rest of Loret's story is true, can you imagine what a nasty mother he must have had. "Come here, Jean-Marie... come closer. I have something to tell you before I die, my son. I never really loved you. And your father was Hitler."
posted by twoleftfeet at 9:46 AM on February 17, 2012 [16 favorites]


Interesting. It's one of those things it doesn't really occur to one to consider until something like this comes up. But I'm glad to know no one is profiting from Mein Kampf.
posted by orange swan at 9:46 AM on February 17, 2012


Germany's Institute for Contemporary History is going to publish an annotated edition in 2015, when the government patent expires.
posted by griphus at 9:48 AM on February 17, 2012


(Copyright, not patent)
posted by griphus at 9:49 AM on February 17, 2012


Mr Loret's own children might now be in a position to claim royalties from Mien Kampf

Given his assertion that Hitler fathered him on the downlow, Loret should have titled his own book Lo Mein Kampf.
posted by octobersurprise at 9:49 AM on February 17, 2012


The bit about the handwriting being the same is kind of odd. Who has handwriting that looks like their father's, unless they are actively trying to mimic it?

I have no idea why since I've never mimicked it but bits of my handwriting are almost exactly like dad's while other bits are like mom's.
posted by infini at 9:51 AM on February 17, 2012


Everyone I know is tied in to Davros in some way, but neither I nor the others can say we're directly related to him.

If it had been the case, we would've kept it to ourselves.

As for seeking closure and gaining royalties, that's what we have weapons and spacecraft for.
posted by Smart Dalek at 9:55 AM on February 17, 2012 [5 favorites]


"Come here, Jean-Marie... come closer. I have something to tell you before I die, my son. I never really loved you. And your father was Hitler."

"Whew, I thought for a second you were going to say Pétain. Close call!"
posted by Jehan at 9:56 AM on February 17, 2012 [1 favorite]


Couldn't you have held on to that secret just a little longer so you could've died without telling your son that he's spawn of Hitler?

There is a decently amusing dark Australian comedy that addresses a similar question, albeit the father in this story is Stalin. Children of the Revolution - note the American-audience trailer is god awful; it gets the tone all wrong and makes the movie look nigh unwatchable, but actually it's pretty good.

Some of the other known relatives of Hitler actually made a pact to never have children to stop any chance of either actually sending some part of what made Hitler 'Hitler' or that some idiot down the line starts claiming lineage and being able to prove it and appeal to neo-nazis. Until science fully understands the whole nature/nurture thing, in this specific case I think that their choice is a perhaps a understandable one; even if it's driven by guilt and a healthy dash of paranoia, if only just to be on the safe side.
posted by chambers at 10:00 AM on February 17, 2012 [3 favorites]


So...the mother who (claimed to have) shagged Hitler after a tipsy evening didn't speak German, and he didn't speak French...did they talk at all? Hitler must have had charisma in mind-blowing quantities to have young French women bed him and follow him around the countryside as he ranted in a tongue they couldn't comprehend.

It would be interesting to know what he was ranting about. "That cow there...we would never allow cattle with dark markings in the homeland!"

(Shouldn't this story go into the thread about "I knew it was over when..."?)
posted by maxwelton at 10:01 AM on February 17, 2012


Also...I think "accomplished artist" is stretching it a bit, isn't it?
posted by maxwelton at 10:02 AM on February 17, 2012


If they can claim royalties, then perhaps the estate is also open to being sued for liability.

Actually, at least that bit of the article is nonsense. The coyright is held by the state of Bavaria, which so far has blocked legal publication. It's about to expire too.
posted by Skeptic at 10:03 AM on February 17, 2012 [2 favorites]


So what's worse - being Hitler's son? Or going to your grave incorrectly believing that you're Hitler's son?
posted by Iridic at 10:04 AM on February 17, 2012 [4 favorites]


Do I have to stop hating this song now? It would be a relief actually, since I like all her others. Yes, all.
posted by Infinity_8 at 10:05 AM on February 17, 2012


So...the mother who (claimed to have) shagged Hitler after a tipsy evening didn't speak German, and he didn't speak French...did they talk at all? Hitler must have had charisma in mind-blowing quantities

If you think that's incredible, you might want to look at his other "accomplishments". I don't think anyone can deny Hitler had.....something about him.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 10:19 AM on February 17, 2012


No! It's not true! It's impossible!!
posted by run"monty at 10:26 AM on February 17, 2012 [1 favorite]


This Hitler bit is just a ruse as the boy tries to hide his Targaryen lineage.
posted by TheRedArmy at 10:26 AM on February 17, 2012 [2 favorites]


twoleftfeet: "Hitler didn't die until 1983, in a small village in Argentina."

Now you're just indulging in Krespi Kreme Konspiracy Theories.
posted by zarq at 10:30 AM on February 17, 2012


Search your feelings...
posted by run"monty at 10:33 AM on February 17, 2012 [1 favorite]


You know it to be true!
posted by zarq at 10:36 AM on February 17, 2012 [1 favorite]


Highly doubtful. This is one of the most historically studied figures. There's no evidence and apparently the DNA doesn't match.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:38 AM on February 17, 2012


"Uh, zo Jean-Marie... Ve know you have worked all your life out of guilt from being ze Son of Hitler... Well... Funny story... turns out your are the son of Adolf Hilter, a German soldier who relocated to Minehead, England after ze War.."
posted by robocop is bleeding at 10:48 AM on February 17, 2012 [2 favorites]


Didn't anyone see The Boys from Brazil, there's at least a few of these guys floating around.
posted by doctor_negative at 10:50 AM on February 17, 2012


You know who else was the son of a Hitler?
posted by yeti at 10:54 AM on February 17, 2012 [3 favorites]


So...the mother who (claimed to have) shagged Hitler after a tipsy evening didn't speak German, and he didn't speak French...did they talk at all? Hitler must have had charisma in mind-blowing quantities.

I once had a French-Portuguese girlfriend who was in the States as an au pair. She spoke very little broken English & I spoke absolutely no French or Portuguese. But somehow we managed anyhow. I never fathered a son with her though. That I know of, anyway. Sometimes I wonder.
posted by scalefree at 10:57 AM on February 17, 2012 [1 favorite]


I remember reading years ago, a nephew of Hitler was interviewed about his life. All of Hitler's nephews and nieces had agreed, amongst themselves, never to have children so that Hitler's genes would go extinct.

The nephew applied to join the United States Navy. His application was rejected, apparently, on the grounds that his uncle had invaded Poland.
posted by veedubya at 11:09 AM on February 17, 2012 [1 favorite]


And... a simple google shows me to wrong. The nephew did join the US Navy after being rejected from the US Army.
posted by veedubya at 11:19 AM on February 17, 2012 [2 favorites]


The relevant paragraph of design bot's link:

In 2008, the Belgian journalist Jean-Paul Mulders found the definitive solution to this enigma. He traveled to Germany, Austria, France and the United States to collect DNA of the Lorets and of the last living relatives of Hitler in Austria and on Long Island. By comparing this, Mulders could prove that Jean-Marie Loret was not the son of Adolf Hitler.
posted by IAmBroom at 11:30 AM on February 17, 2012


Je veux croire.
posted by griphus at 11:33 AM on February 17, 2012 [1 favorite]


If they can claim royalties, then perhaps the estate is also open to being sued for liability

I once asked if Hitler's estate could be sued over WWII, and jedicus or another lawyer stepped in to answer. I wish I could find that thread...
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 11:37 AM on February 17, 2012


Jean-Paul Mulders knew la vérité est là-bas!
posted by Biblio at 11:42 AM on February 17, 2012 [1 favorite]


I thought Hitler lived in Liverpool. [Warning: Daily Heil].

And then there is this guy.

"Interesting. It's one of those things it doesn't really occur to one to consider until something like this comes up. But I'm glad to know no one is profiting from Mein Kampf."
posted by orange swan

Absolutely sums it up in re: royalties/rights
posted by marienbad at 12:25 PM on February 17, 2012


Who has handwriting that looks like their father's, unless they are actively trying to mimic it?

-Raises hand.-

And if you saw our handwriting, believe me, you would not think it something worth mimicking.

My daughter has it as well, and boy, is she annoyed.
posted by IndigoJones at 1:56 PM on February 17, 2012 [1 favorite]


Yeah, the Loret story is well-debunked.

The new hot theory is that one of the infamous Mitford sisters, Unity, may have had a love child with Hitler who was put up for adoption in the late 1930s. This seems untestable.

The state of Bavaria holds the German copyright to Mein Kampf, I believe. Apparently some lawyer came up with the idea that the descendants of Hitler's older sister Angela could sue for royalties, an idea which they found less than appealing.

chambers: The Daily Fail link is a little suspicious to me:

Marc Vermeeren, 51, said the Hitler relatives living in lower Austria try to hide their lineage by changing their names to Hüttler, Hietler, Hiedler or Hütler.

This seems wrong: Adolf Hitler's father Alois actually adopted the "Hitler" form of the name (his father was likely either Johann Georg Hiedler or Johann Georg's brother, Johann Nepomuk Hiedler/Hüttler). Any stories of Hitler's grandfather being Jewish are almost certainly untrue.

The American relatives have agreed not to have children to extinguish the saga of Hitler
I've also read that they just didn't happen to have children.
posted by dhens at 1:58 PM on February 17, 2012


Mr Loret wrote a book called 'Your Father's Name Was Hitler' in 981

I KNEW THE LOST TIME HYPOTHESIS WAS TRUE
posted by threeants at 2:43 PM on February 17, 2012


PHANTOM TIME WHATEVER
posted by threeants at 2:43 PM on February 17, 2012


HITLER
posted by threeants at 2:43 PM on February 17, 2012


Je veux croire.

I credunt.
posted by Sutekh at 3:28 PM on February 17, 2012


They fuck you up, your mum and dad.
They may not mean to, but they do.
They fill you with the faults they had
And add some extra, just for you.

But they were fucked up in their turn
By fools in old-style hats and coats,
Who half the time were soppy-stern
And half at one another's throats.

Man hands on misery to man.
It deepens like a coastal shelf.
Get out as early as you can,
And don't have any kids yourself.
posted by idiomatika at 5:08 PM on February 17, 2012


idiomatika: "They fuck you up, your mum and dad.
They may not mean to, but they do.
They fill you with the faults they had
And add some extra, just for you.

But they were fucked up in their turn
By fools in old-style hats and coats,
Who half the time were soppy-stern
And half at one another's throats.

Man hands on misery to man.
It deepens like a coastal shelf.
Get out as early as you can,
And don't have any kids yourself.
"
by Philip Larkin
early 1970s I think

posted by dancestoblue at 10:10 PM on February 17, 2012


Hitler must have had charisma in mind-blowing quantities to have young French women bed him and follow him around the countryside as he ranted in a tongue they couldn't comprehend

This happens *all the time* when young people go traveling. Have you ever listened to young people talk? They have nothing important to say anyway.

Hormones are nature's Esperanto.
posted by dgaicun at 7:08 AM on February 18, 2012 [3 favorites]


by Philip Larkin
early 1970s I think


After 1963 at least.
posted by MartinWisse at 7:29 AM on February 18, 2012 [3 favorites]


The poem is called This Be The Verse

"It was written around April 1971, first published in the August 1971 issue of New Humanist, and appeared in the 1974 collection High Windows." [wiki]
posted by marienbad at 8:14 AM on February 20, 2012


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