The court system creates a conflict over money
December 3, 2014 9:14 AM Subscribe
Why is the end of a short-term American marriage a mad litigated grab for kids, cash, and long-term financial support for apparently healthy working-age adults?...No society in the history of humanity has ever devoted as high a proportion of its resources to custody litigation and wealth transfers via child support. Professor Philip Greenspun (previously) makes some notes on the Divorce Corp. Family Law Reform conference.
This post was deleted for the following reason: This is kinda lead-ballooning; there's probably better inroads for a post about family law in the US than a personal monologue about a conference on somebody's blog. -- cortex
There is thus a system built on the assumption that women cannot or will not work embedded in a society where women, at least those who are not alimony and child support recipients, do generally work.
Women have lower salaries in part because they often are the primary care-giver of children and take more time off to do so, and have less spare time for after-work skills improvement and so on. I don't think it's unreasonable for alimony to be paid when she's sacrificed life-long earning potential for the sake of their children.
posted by empath at 9:34 AM on December 3, 2014
Women have lower salaries in part because they often are the primary care-giver of children and take more time off to do so, and have less spare time for after-work skills improvement and so on. I don't think it's unreasonable for alimony to be paid when she's sacrificed life-long earning potential for the sake of their children.
posted by empath at 9:34 AM on December 3, 2014
Interesting there are so many comparisons to Sweden there. In Sweden a child's current and future welfare is less tied to their parents. For example, there is no worry about a college fund or college payment (a main source of angst in my parent's divorce) because people go to college for free there. Another thing is it's less acceptable there to be a stay at home mother and American divorces involving a stay at home parent have to account for the fact that this parent often either won't be able to enter the workforce at all or will be set back in their career and significantly underemployed.
posted by melissam at 9:34 AM on December 3, 2014 [3 favorites]
posted by melissam at 9:34 AM on December 3, 2014 [3 favorites]
she hadn’t known anything about the U.S. system before coming to speak and was amazed that a society would set things up the way that we had.
I am constantly amazed by this, and I have lived here all my life. It helps to realize that nothing about America was put in place to benefit the American people in general.
posted by Steely-eyed Missile Man at 9:34 AM on December 3, 2014 [3 favorites]
I am constantly amazed by this, and I have lived here all my life. It helps to realize that nothing about America was put in place to benefit the American people in general.
posted by Steely-eyed Missile Man at 9:34 AM on December 3, 2014 [3 favorites]
Sorge, whose own former partner collected assets worth about $14 million from him in her first lawsuit against him, had to keep defending additional actions (seeking more money) for a 12-year period.
If you have that much in assets people are going to look for any reason to sue your ass. In the ancient world people paid close attention to the Evil Eye.
Have you ever heard that hypothetical question about which superpower you would choose, flying or invisibility? I always thought that was a stupid question because with flying you would attract the glaring evil eyes of far more than half the people who saw you doing it. There is almost no way for that scenario to possibly work out well for you.
posted by bukvich at 9:35 AM on December 3, 2014 [1 favorite]
If you have that much in assets people are going to look for any reason to sue your ass. In the ancient world people paid close attention to the Evil Eye.
Have you ever heard that hypothetical question about which superpower you would choose, flying or invisibility? I always thought that was a stupid question because with flying you would attract the glaring evil eyes of far more than half the people who saw you doing it. There is almost no way for that scenario to possibly work out well for you.
posted by bukvich at 9:35 AM on December 3, 2014 [1 favorite]
[in Sweden] you can’t get rich having a child with a high-income co-parent.
Gross.
Yes, I'm sure this is all very confusing to you if you start from the premise that both partners in a heterosexual marriage have equal access to money, resources, and opportunities.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 9:36 AM on December 3, 2014 [1 favorite]
Gross.
Yes, I'm sure this is all very confusing to you if you start from the premise that both partners in a heterosexual marriage have equal access to money, resources, and opportunities.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 9:36 AM on December 3, 2014 [1 favorite]
[in Sweden] you can’t get rich having a child with a high-income co-parent.
No really, won't someone think of the millionaires? There aren't enough people looking out for the best interests of rich white dudes.
posted by empath at 9:39 AM on December 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
No really, won't someone think of the millionaires? There aren't enough people looking out for the best interests of rich white dudes.
posted by empath at 9:39 AM on December 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
In Sweden a child's current and future welfare is less tied to their parents.
Yet another illustration of the fact that, in America, choosing the right parents when you're born is likely the most important decision you'll make in your life.
posted by clawsoon at 9:39 AM on December 3, 2014 [1 favorite]
Yet another illustration of the fact that, in America, choosing the right parents when you're born is likely the most important decision you'll make in your life.
posted by clawsoon at 9:39 AM on December 3, 2014 [1 favorite]
This is ignoring the fact that in the US, the custodial parent can easily end up paying over 100% of the cost of food and board if, for instance, the child becomes seriously ill and the non-custodial parent decides not to pay a dime.
(Going back the reading the article, but the beginning is already pissing me off)
posted by Hactar at 9:41 AM on December 3, 2014
(Going back the reading the article, but the beginning is already pissing me off)
posted by Hactar at 9:41 AM on December 3, 2014
For example, there is no worry about a college fund or college payment (a main source of angst in my parent's divorce) because people go to college for free there.
Uh, no.
posted by Ironmouth at 9:47 AM on December 3, 2014
Uh, no.
85% of Swedish students graduate with debt, versus only 50% in the US. Worst of all, new Swedish graduates have the highest debt-to-income ratios of any group of students in the developed world (according to estimates of what they're expected to earn once they get out of school)--somewhere in the neighborhood of 80%. The US, where we're constantly being told that student debt is hitting crisis proportions, the average is more like 60%.The American assumption of the European paradise is far from the reality.
posted by Ironmouth at 9:47 AM on December 3, 2014
The article is written by a computer engineer, not a lawyer, who appears to be quite wealthy based on his website bragging about that fact, and has an axe to grind with women receiving child support, an axe I assume he acquired via his own divorce.
This is a bad post for metafilter because the writer is ignorant about the law and the data on divorce in the US, and is pushing a very particular, personal agenda.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 9:48 AM on December 3, 2014 [7 favorites]
This is a bad post for metafilter because the writer is ignorant about the law and the data on divorce in the US, and is pushing a very particular, personal agenda.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 9:48 AM on December 3, 2014 [7 favorites]
>>For example, there is no worry about a college fund or college payment (a main source of angst in my parent's divorce) because people go to college for free there.
>Uh, no.: 85% of Swedish students graduate with debt
Actually, you're both right - college is free in Sweden, yet students do graduate with a great deal of debt.
posted by dialetheia at 9:51 AM on December 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
>Uh, no.: 85% of Swedish students graduate with debt
Actually, you're both right - college is free in Sweden, yet students do graduate with a great deal of debt.
posted by dialetheia at 9:51 AM on December 3, 2014 [2 favorites]
"Married couples with one kid don't spend more on housing than married couples with zero kids" -- presumably because, in the aggregate, these married couples intended to have a kid before the child appeared, so chose their housing with that in mind so that they are not forced to suddenly move the second they get pregnant.
posted by jeather at 9:56 AM on December 3, 2014
posted by jeather at 9:56 AM on December 3, 2014
« Older People are still having sex and nothing seems to... | Out at Home Newer »
This thread has been archived and is closed to new comments
posted by designbot at 9:31 AM on December 3, 2014 [9 favorites]