WhyYyYyYyYyYyYyYyY????
April 13, 2020 11:02 AM Subscribe
What on earth is up with Lin Manuel Miranda's performance - is he deliberately trying to sound amateurish? Or am I missing something?
posted by Greg_Ace at 11:26 AM on April 13, 2020
posted by Greg_Ace at 11:26 AM on April 13, 2020
Why(YyYyYyYy) is Lin- Manuel Miranda wearing a yellow star? The obvious answer, that Jesus is Jewish, doesn't really get into whose bright idea it was to set Jesus Christ Superstar during the Holocaust.
posted by dannyboybell at 11:28 AM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by dannyboybell at 11:28 AM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
What on earth is up with Lin Manuel Miranda's performance - is he deliberately trying to sound amateurish?
He is literally an amateur in that video. I saw in the comments that it was shot while he was in undergrad.
I am very glad, for myself and for humanity, that no video exists of my mandolin solo from undergrad summer Shakespeare.
posted by justsomebodythatyouusedtoknow at 11:32 AM on April 13, 2020 [23 favorites]
He is literally an amateur in that video. I saw in the comments that it was shot while he was in undergrad.
I am very glad, for myself and for humanity, that no video exists of my mandolin solo from undergrad summer Shakespeare.
posted by justsomebodythatyouusedtoknow at 11:32 AM on April 13, 2020 [23 favorites]
[LMM} is literally an amateur in that video. I saw in the comments that it was shot while he was in undergrad.
Speaking from personal experience - there is no director quite so up-their-own-ass experimental than a student in an undergrad theater program.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 11:35 AM on April 13, 2020 [25 favorites]
Speaking from personal experience - there is no director quite so up-their-own-ass experimental than a student in an undergrad theater program.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 11:35 AM on April 13, 2020 [25 favorites]
I liked his version best tbh
posted by Mrs Potato at 11:37 AM on April 13, 2020
posted by Mrs Potato at 11:37 AM on April 13, 2020
My first exposure to "Gethsemane" was sung by one of the senior girls at our Catholic high school during the Good Friday school mass. She nailed it and that is the ur-version to which no other has quite measured up. Now that the John Legend version is back on Hulu I'm going to give that a go, he was the most tolerable in this video, at least of the half dozen or so before my ears started to bleed.
posted by Flannery Culp at 11:37 AM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by Flannery Culp at 11:37 AM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
Ted Neely's scream is just so rock-and-roll, even the pharisees love him (at 0:32). Many of the other high ones sound a little slow/polished, maybe that's easier on the vocal cords or something?
As I'm hoping for some Hamilton Thoughts from Ellis someday, her featuring LMM twice is promising.
posted by kwartel at 11:39 AM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
As I'm hoping for some Hamilton Thoughts from Ellis someday, her featuring LMM twice is promising.
posted by kwartel at 11:39 AM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
LMM's description from the his Youtube post:
I played Jesus in Jesus Christ Superstar my freshman year at Wesleyan.I was not yet done with puberty. Screaming ensues. Director: Dani Snyder. Music Director: Aaron Weiss.posted by zamboni at 11:40 AM on April 13, 2020 [8 favorites]
I don't know about Ted Neeley but for me only Ian Gillan can sing that song.
posted by night_train at 11:50 AM on April 13, 2020 [11 favorites]
posted by night_train at 11:50 AM on April 13, 2020 [11 favorites]
In this supercut, as in so many things in life, people fall into three categories:
1. Ted Neeley
He was almost 60 in 2006 which makes that video 100x more impressive
posted by fshgrl at 12:02 PM on April 13, 2020 [12 favorites]
1. Ted Neeley
He was almost 60 in 2006 which makes that video 100x more impressive
posted by fshgrl at 12:02 PM on April 13, 2020 [12 favorites]
Halfway through this I was thinking about Child In Time, then here comes Ian Gillan.
posted by shenkerism at 12:11 PM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by shenkerism at 12:11 PM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
yeah, I'd like to see everyone else shitting on LMM post YouTube videos of whatever they were up to at like 19.
posted by sideshow at 12:22 PM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
posted by sideshow at 12:22 PM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
Whoa, pull your claws back in, geez... I hadn't seen the "freshman year" comment and assumed it was more recent; once I learned when the video was from it made more sense. I freely admit my performance abilities were just as bad at that age.
posted by Greg_Ace at 12:29 PM on April 13, 2020 [2 favorites]
posted by Greg_Ace at 12:29 PM on April 13, 2020 [2 favorites]
In this supercut, as in so many things in life, people fall into three categories:
1. Ted Neeley.
2. People trying and failing to imitate Ted Neeley.
3. People with sufficient self-knowledge not to try imitating Ted Neeley.
Granted, I think Neeley's scream from the '73 movie is the perfect balance of musically pleasant / on pitch / actual rock, but this take ignores the fact that... he himself is copying Gillan from the 1970 concept album, right?
I'm also a huge fan of Balsamo's take. It lacks the rock grit that Neeley's has, but that itself is pretty amazing in a way; the note comes through so pure and clear without sounding weak (sorry Forster, Seibert, LaVigne, Carter...)
posted by Expecto Cilantro at 12:39 PM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
1. Ted Neeley.
2. People trying and failing to imitate Ted Neeley.
3. People with sufficient self-knowledge not to try imitating Ted Neeley.
Granted, I think Neeley's scream from the '73 movie is the perfect balance of musically pleasant / on pitch / actual rock, but this take ignores the fact that... he himself is copying Gillan from the 1970 concept album, right?
I'm also a huge fan of Balsamo's take. It lacks the rock grit that Neeley's has, but that itself is pretty amazing in a way; the note comes through so pure and clear without sounding weak (sorry Forster, Seibert, LaVigne, Carter...)
posted by Expecto Cilantro at 12:39 PM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
some of these have a real "you're a crook, captain hook" vibe
posted by dismas at 12:40 PM on April 13, 2020 [2 favorites]
posted by dismas at 12:40 PM on April 13, 2020 [2 favorites]
TO be fair- Lin is very young looking as an adult- so that he was 19 in that was not immediately apparent.
posted by Homo neanderthalensis at 12:46 PM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
posted by Homo neanderthalensis at 12:46 PM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
I dunno much about Andrew Lloyd Webber but I know metal singers and I'm not surprised that Ian Gillen is the originator here.
posted by atoxyl at 12:52 PM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
posted by atoxyl at 12:52 PM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
It's a quick, grainy clip, cut quickly with no context. I guessed LMM was about 30 in that clip at first glance. He kinda has an old/young/ageless face in general. Until I read in the comments here that he was 19... well, I never woulda guessed!
Anyone who's been on camera and recorded as much as he has been— is bound to have a few clinker clips.
And I liked this post. WHY? I'm not sure, exactly.
posted by SoberHighland at 1:00 PM on April 13, 2020 [2 favorites]
Anyone who's been on camera and recorded as much as he has been— is bound to have a few clinker clips.
And I liked this post. WHY? I'm not sure, exactly.
posted by SoberHighland at 1:00 PM on April 13, 2020 [2 favorites]
Michael Crawford sounding exactly like ... Michael Crawford cracked me up.
posted by kimberussell at 1:23 PM on April 13, 2020 [6 favorites]
posted by kimberussell at 1:23 PM on April 13, 2020 [6 favorites]
Considering the high notes he hit in Bring Him Home, I was a little surprised Colm WIlkinson didn't go for it.
posted by pykrete jungle at 2:19 PM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by pykrete jungle at 2:19 PM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
Still waiting for someone to properly nail the other Why, the one in What's the Buzz? That sudden stop, that WHY SHOULD YOU WANT TO KNOW, should be explosive. Angry. It's usually not.
posted by bartleby at 2:23 PM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by bartleby at 2:23 PM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
He was almost 60 in 200
He was born in 1943. he was 62 or 63.
I saw him on tour in JCS, 2007, opposite Corey Glover as Judas. Ted’s pipes were not in tip top shape, and the tour did this unfortunate thing where they stage-flew him off the cross, dramatically undercutting the whole point of the show, which is literally to NOT SHOW THE RESURRECTION.
The little old church ladies two rows up ate that shit up with a spoon, though, they loved it.
posted by mwhybark at 2:27 PM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
He was born in 1943. he was 62 or 63.
I saw him on tour in JCS, 2007, opposite Corey Glover as Judas. Ted’s pipes were not in tip top shape, and the tour did this unfortunate thing where they stage-flew him off the cross, dramatically undercutting the whole point of the show, which is literally to NOT SHOW THE RESURRECTION.
The little old church ladies two rows up ate that shit up with a spoon, though, they loved it.
posted by mwhybark at 2:27 PM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
He was almost 60 in 200
He was born in 1943. he was 62 or 63.
I saw Billy Connolly onstage once —
Connolly: “I recently turned sixty...”
Audience; [cheers]
Connolly: “Thanks so much. Even more recently, I turned sixty-two.”
posted by ricochet biscuit at 2:48 PM on April 13, 2020 [21 favorites]
He was born in 1943. he was 62 or 63.
I saw Billy Connolly onstage once —
Connolly: “I recently turned sixty...”
Audience; [cheers]
Connolly: “Thanks so much. Even more recently, I turned sixty-two.”
posted by ricochet biscuit at 2:48 PM on April 13, 2020 [21 favorites]
kwartel - Ellis mentions Hamilton parenthetically in her video about why she thinks RENT falls into the trap of glorifying poverty without confronting it in any way that would threaten the ruling class. She's said she likes Hamilton on twitter, and also has said she finds being asked to do a "take down of the popular thing!" kind of icky and cynical.
posted by Wretch729 at 2:52 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by Wretch729 at 2:52 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
I used to get razzed about having that double-CD in regular rotation at work in the late 90's. Lots of pretty amazing vocals throughout. I got so accustomed to the LP that when I saw the movie again, it was just as visually/symbolically amazing, but the music seemed...off.
This was fun to watch. Glad to know there are other JCS nerds lurking about.
posted by Chuffy at 3:18 PM on April 13, 2020
This was fun to watch. Glad to know there are other JCS nerds lurking about.
posted by Chuffy at 3:18 PM on April 13, 2020
Considering the high notes he hit in Bring Him Home, I was a little surprised Colm WIlkinson didn't go for it.
Disregarding optional riffs, "Bring Him Home" usually only goes to an A, which is only a half step above the Ab that he hits in the video here. The G5 falsetto / mix scream is nearly a full octave higher. This isn't to say that Colm couldn't hit that if he wanted -- I have no doubt he could -- but I think he assumes that people know him best for, and would want to hear, his full voice.
posted by Expecto Cilantro at 3:19 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
Disregarding optional riffs, "Bring Him Home" usually only goes to an A, which is only a half step above the Ab that he hits in the video here. The G5 falsetto / mix scream is nearly a full octave higher. This isn't to say that Colm couldn't hit that if he wanted -- I have no doubt he could -- but I think he assumes that people know him best for, and would want to hear, his full voice.
posted by Expecto Cilantro at 3:19 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
Now you've sent me down the "listening to Ian Gillan scream like a banshee" rabbit hole...again.
Thank you.
posted by blurker at 3:28 PM on April 13, 2020 [2 favorites]
Thank you.
posted by blurker at 3:28 PM on April 13, 2020 [2 favorites]
I had no idea about Ian Gillan! I've never seen/heard JCS, but Gillan totally makes sense for this kind of vocal.
posted by rhizome at 3:31 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by rhizome at 3:31 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
I knew there was another YT video of this. I remember seeing it last year.
Type in: Who Sang The "Gethsemane" High Note Best?
I really need to learn how to link.
Anyway, it's more high notes for your enjoyment.
posted by sundrop at 3:57 PM on April 13, 2020
Type in: Who Sang The "Gethsemane" High Note Best?
I really need to learn how to link.
Anyway, it's more high notes for your enjoyment.
posted by sundrop at 3:57 PM on April 13, 2020
Chuffy: I used to get razzed about having that double-CD in regular rotation at work
I love JCS as much as the next guy, but... at work?
I'm surprised that all you got was some razzing.
posted by clawsoon at 5:36 PM on April 13, 2020 [2 favorites]
I love JCS as much as the next guy, but... at work?
I'm surprised that all you got was some razzing.
posted by clawsoon at 5:36 PM on April 13, 2020 [2 favorites]
sundrop: I really need to learn how to link.
There might be a better way, but I do it like this:
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfHt2YfRdSs">Who Sang The "Gethsemane" High Note Best?</a>
...which results in this:
Who Sang The "Gethsemane" High Note Best?
posted by clawsoon at 5:39 PM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
There might be a better way, but I do it like this:
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfHt2YfRdSs">Who Sang The "Gethsemane" High Note Best?</a>
...which results in this:
Who Sang The "Gethsemane" High Note Best?
posted by clawsoon at 5:39 PM on April 13, 2020 [3 favorites]
Who Sang The "Gethsemane" High Note Best?
A "Why-off" if you will.
Late 80s/early 90s hair metal note: Contains Gary Cherone and Sebastian Bach.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 6:29 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
A "Why-off" if you will.
Late 80s/early 90s hair metal note: Contains Gary Cherone and Sebastian Bach.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 6:29 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
I had no idea about Ian Gillan! I've never seen/heard JCS, but Gillan totally makes sense for this kind of vocal.
The fact that rhizome could live to be the same age as I am and never have encountered JCS in any form before feels utterly alien to me. I've had the show memorized since basically the 1970s concept album came out. Yellow/brown forever!
posted by hippybear at 6:53 PM on April 13, 2020 [7 favorites]
The fact that rhizome could live to be the same age as I am and never have encountered JCS in any form before feels utterly alien to me. I've had the show memorized since basically the 1970s concept album came out. Yellow/brown forever!
posted by hippybear at 6:53 PM on April 13, 2020 [7 favorites]
Team hippybear here.
posted by blurker at 7:25 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by blurker at 7:25 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
philip-random: "I prefer his moment at the end of The Temple ."
That's "MYYYYYYYYY."
posted by Chrysostom at 8:57 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
That's "MYYYYYYYYY."
posted by Chrysostom at 8:57 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
Who Sang The "Gethsemane" High Note Best?
Gethsemane High Note would be a good name for a the right kind of band.
posted by philip-random at 9:14 PM on April 13, 2020 [2 favorites]
Gethsemane High Note would be a good name for a the right kind of band.
posted by philip-random at 9:14 PM on April 13, 2020 [2 favorites]
There might be a better way, but I do it like this:
< a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfHt2YfRdSs">Who Sang The "Gethsemane" High Note Best?
There is a better way! Write your comment, copy the link to your clipboard, highlight the text in your comment you would like to serve as the linked text, and tap or click on the "link" button just under the comment window. It will as you to paste the link in a little text field. Done!
posted by tzikeh at 9:14 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
< a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfHt2YfRdSs">Who Sang The "Gethsemane" High Note Best?
There is a better way! Write your comment, copy the link to your clipboard, highlight the text in your comment you would like to serve as the linked text, and tap or click on the "link" button just under the comment window. It will as you to paste the link in a little text field. Done!
posted by tzikeh at 9:14 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
The amount of talent it must take to turn that high note into an emotionally built-up-to appropriately cri du coeur that contains all the pent-up frustration of that Whyyyyyyyyy while remaining on key and still expressing anguish and yet not just becoming a shriek must be mammoth.
I bet there is a small league of vocal coaches who have worked with JCS Jesuses and who have various philosophies and coaching approaches to getting this to work for their clients. I wonder if there is a best one.
Like, okay... IMO... that moment, it should be the peak of a wolf's lonesome howl. It should not be a shriek of panic, it should not be a call out in pain, it should not be a shout of fear... it should be the top note that a lonely wolf is calling into the universe asking for an answer.
The vowel makes this problematic, but finding the soul at the core of it, and finding the expression of it, they are not problematic. The pitch makes it problematic. So, finding the pitch and finding the right expression of the vowel to allow it to work, and then finding the soul and the core, and allowing all that to flow up through you into the note you are reaching for....
And then doing that 8 performances a week... (well, back when we did that kind of thing)
posted by hippybear at 9:28 PM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
I bet there is a small league of vocal coaches who have worked with JCS Jesuses and who have various philosophies and coaching approaches to getting this to work for their clients. I wonder if there is a best one.
Like, okay... IMO... that moment, it should be the peak of a wolf's lonesome howl. It should not be a shriek of panic, it should not be a call out in pain, it should not be a shout of fear... it should be the top note that a lonely wolf is calling into the universe asking for an answer.
The vowel makes this problematic, but finding the soul at the core of it, and finding the expression of it, they are not problematic. The pitch makes it problematic. So, finding the pitch and finding the right expression of the vowel to allow it to work, and then finding the soul and the core, and allowing all that to flow up through you into the note you are reaching for....
And then doing that 8 performances a week... (well, back when we did that kind of thing)
posted by hippybear at 9:28 PM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
When I first saw this I was thinking "Yeah no one does it like Ted Neely" but then Billy Porter! Whoa! It's not the same, but the high note is super clean then he goes straight into screamy despair. I'd love to see that entire production sometime.
posted by rhiannonstone at 10:12 PM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
posted by rhiannonstone at 10:12 PM on April 13, 2020 [4 favorites]
It was available for free across Easter Weekend, now is no longer.
A new ALW musical filming will be available for a weekend again this coming weekend. Etc across the calendar.
posted by hippybear at 10:15 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
A new ALW musical filming will be available for a weekend again this coming weekend. Etc across the calendar.
posted by hippybear at 10:15 PM on April 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
In this supercut, as in so many things in life, people fall into three categories:
1. Ted Neeley.
2. People trying and failing to imitate Ted Neeley.
3. People with sufficient self-knowledge not to try imitating Ted Neeley.
Ted Neeley: "Well, that's a wrap. Nobody else should even bother."
Ian Gillan: "Hold my beer."
posted by Chuffy at 9:02 AM on April 15, 2020 [1 favorite]
1. Ted Neeley.
2. People trying and failing to imitate Ted Neeley.
3. People with sufficient self-knowledge not to try imitating Ted Neeley.
Ted Neeley: "Well, that's a wrap. Nobody else should even bother."
Ian Gillan: "Hold my beer."
posted by Chuffy at 9:02 AM on April 15, 2020 [1 favorite]
I love JCS as much as the next guy, but... at work?
I'm surprised that all you got was some razzing.
The invention of stereophonic headphones and various portable media players enabled millions of people to listen to music while they worked. I wasn't blasting it to the rest of the office, if that's what you're implying. I wasn't the only one, btw, a co-worker was reading some blog or newsgroup, and there was a "Music to code by" post that had JCS on it.
It's not the only album I listened to, of the hundreds of CDs I had at the time...
posted by Chuffy at 9:11 AM on April 15, 2020 [3 favorites]
I'm surprised that all you got was some razzing.
The invention of stereophonic headphones and various portable media players enabled millions of people to listen to music while they worked. I wasn't blasting it to the rest of the office, if that's what you're implying. I wasn't the only one, btw, a co-worker was reading some blog or newsgroup, and there was a "Music to code by" post that had JCS on it.
It's not the only album I listened to, of the hundreds of CDs I had at the time...
posted by Chuffy at 9:11 AM on April 15, 2020 [3 favorites]
my first experience of workplace music was way back when in 1976, a remote camp that had one cassette player and maybe six tapes. The four I still remember are greatest hits comps from Elvis, Three Dog Night and Moody Blues, and one half of Neil Diamond's Hot August Night. I would gladly have had Jesus Christ Superstar added to that thin mix.
posted by philip-random at 9:54 AM on April 15, 2020
posted by philip-random at 9:54 AM on April 15, 2020
I heard the album a *lot* when I was a very small rmd - I would have been around 5 or 6 when the album came out and it got heavy rotation around me. And then I didn't hear most of it for about a decade. And then when I was like 14-16, I encountered it as background music at a party and was confused because what was this thing that I knew by heart but couldn't recognize?
posted by rmd1023 at 2:05 PM on April 15, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by rmd1023 at 2:05 PM on April 15, 2020 [3 favorites]
Chuffy: The invention of stereophonic headphones and various portable media players enabled millions of people to listen to music while they worked. I wasn't blasting it to the rest of the office, if that's what you're implying.
Ahh, that makes more sense. I was picturing you playing JCS over and over through speakers at work and somehow not getting bludgeoned.
Earphones make much more sense, and I've endless-looped JCS a couple of times myself.
posted by clawsoon at 3:25 PM on April 15, 2020
Ahh, that makes more sense. I was picturing you playing JCS over and over through speakers at work and somehow not getting bludgeoned.
Earphones make much more sense, and I've endless-looped JCS a couple of times myself.
posted by clawsoon at 3:25 PM on April 15, 2020
but then Billy Porter!
Always good.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 6:58 PM on April 15, 2020 [1 favorite]
Always good.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 6:58 PM on April 15, 2020 [1 favorite]
A new ALW musical filming will be available for a weekend again this coming weekend. Etc across the calendar.
Yes! This weekend is Phantom of the Opera for those so inclined.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 7:01 PM on April 15, 2020
Yes! This weekend is Phantom of the Opera for those so inclined.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 7:01 PM on April 15, 2020
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This thread has been archived and is closed to new comments
1. Ted Neeley.
2. People trying and failing to imitate Ted Neeley.
3. People with sufficient self-knowledge not to try imitating Ted Neeley.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 11:09 AM on April 13, 2020 [31 favorites]