As God is my witness, he is broken in half!
June 28, 2023 6:09 AM Subscribe
Twenty-five years ago today, The Undertaker damn near killed Mankind. Twice. It was one of the most memorable matches in the history of professional wrestling, and now Mark Calaway and Mick Foley are far enough removed to laugh at it as they rewatch the infamous Hell In A Cell match that redefined each of their careers in an instant. (CW: premeditated violence that resulted in real injury to both participants, blood, teeth, thumbtacks)
And which gave birth to the greatest Reddit novelty account of them all.
posted by Naberius at 6:17 AM on June 28, 2023 [21 favorites]
posted by Naberius at 6:17 AM on June 28, 2023 [21 favorites]
Arguably the greatest match ever
As I said about Con Air, anyone who says this was a good match is trying to start an argument, but anyone who says it was not a great match is trying to start a fight.
posted by Etrigan at 6:19 AM on June 28, 2023 [9 favorites]
As I said about Con Air, anyone who says this was a good match is trying to start an argument, but anyone who says it was not a great match is trying to start a fight.
posted by Etrigan at 6:19 AM on June 28, 2023 [9 favorites]
the greatest Reddit novelty account of them all
This is the only context where I know Hell In A Cell from, and whenever I get tricked into reading shittymorph's posts I am pleased to do so, it's sort of anti-rickrolling, you're glad to see how they got you, like when back in nineteen ninety eight the undertaker threw mankind off hell in a cell and plummeted sixteen feet through an announcer's table.
posted by AzraelBrown at 6:47 AM on June 28, 2023 [20 favorites]
This is the only context where I know Hell In A Cell from, and whenever I get tricked into reading shittymorph's posts I am pleased to do so, it's sort of anti-rickrolling, you're glad to see how they got you, like when back in nineteen ninety eight the undertaker threw mankind off hell in a cell and plummeted sixteen feet through an announcer's table.
posted by AzraelBrown at 6:47 AM on June 28, 2023 [20 favorites]
Mick Foley is my favorite professional wrestler and I can say without hyperbole that if I had not discovered him at exactly the right time in my life I almost certainly would have killed myself. I adore that man both as a performer and as a human being.
The Mankind-Undertaker Hell in a Cell match is basically a snuff film. Every wrestling fan who can stomach it should watch it exactly once. I watched my last WWE show in October 2018 and I've since moved on to AEW. AEW has a reputation for being bloody and a bit reckless and in my opinion that reputation is not undeserved but nothing they've done scares me as much as this match.
It's shocking to think that as horrifying as this match it still might not be the most irresponsible thing Mick went through in WWE (his "I Quit" match versus The Rock at the Royal Rumble is somehow even more worrisome).
posted by Parasite Unseen at 7:02 AM on June 28, 2023 [6 favorites]
The Mankind-Undertaker Hell in a Cell match is basically a snuff film. Every wrestling fan who can stomach it should watch it exactly once. I watched my last WWE show in October 2018 and I've since moved on to AEW. AEW has a reputation for being bloody and a bit reckless and in my opinion that reputation is not undeserved but nothing they've done scares me as much as this match.
It's shocking to think that as horrifying as this match it still might not be the most irresponsible thing Mick went through in WWE (his "I Quit" match versus The Rock at the Royal Rumble is somehow even more worrisome).
posted by Parasite Unseen at 7:02 AM on June 28, 2023 [6 favorites]
"[Mankind] plummeted sixteen feet through an announcer's table"
... would be perfect as a summary of the 21st century so far.
posted by Paul Slade at 7:04 AM on June 28, 2023 [10 favorites]
... would be perfect as a summary of the 21st century so far.
posted by Paul Slade at 7:04 AM on June 28, 2023 [10 favorites]
This match is so legendary even non-wrestling fans have heard of it. Poor Mick has no first-hand memory of much of the match, from what I've read, so every time he watches it he's watching himself do things he can't remember doing.
It's amazing either of them are still alive. But what an astonishing duel.
posted by hippybear at 7:13 AM on June 28, 2023
It's amazing either of them are still alive. But what an astonishing duel.
posted by hippybear at 7:13 AM on June 28, 2023
Mick Foley is the name of a friend of mine and he nicely demonstrates that a great way to be completely invisible on the internet is to share a name with someone famous.
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 7:20 AM on June 28, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 7:20 AM on June 28, 2023 [5 favorites]
Dammit AzraelBrown!
posted by mpark at 7:41 AM on June 28, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by mpark at 7:41 AM on June 28, 2023 [2 favorites]
> Mick Foley is the name of a friend of mine and he nicely demonstrates that a great way to be completely invisible on the internet is to share a name with someone famous.
<office_space>why should i change my name? he's the one who</office-space> the undertaker threw off hell in a cell and plummeted sixteen feet through an announcer's table.
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 7:56 AM on June 28, 2023 [12 favorites]
<office_space>why should i change my name? he's the one who</office-space> the undertaker threw off hell in a cell and plummeted sixteen feet through an announcer's table.
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 7:56 AM on June 28, 2023 [12 favorites]
The Undertaker has had one of the GOAT WWE careers--to take what started out as a kinda goofy zombie-Old-West-mortician gimmick from this all the way to this short film about violence, with things like Hell in a Cell in between, over a span of 33 years, is quite an arc.
posted by box at 8:18 AM on June 28, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by box at 8:18 AM on June 28, 2023 [1 favorite]
For me this match and the infamous Montreal Screwjob both essentially capped the end of my relationship with wrestling as a viewer and fan. They are different things I know, an honestly great and unpredictable match vs a bizarre behind the curtain conflict disrupting the careful staging I had grown accustomed to as a kid, but they are oddly coupled in my mind. The wrestling promotions and style that followed both of these could never compare to that high and low.
posted by Ashwagandha at 8:26 AM on June 28, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by Ashwagandha at 8:26 AM on June 28, 2023 [4 favorites]
Is there a term for people who don't watch wrestling itself but really dig the non-kayfabe parts? Because I'm one of those people. It's like, I'm never gonna play Eve Online but I love the stories.
posted by mmcg at 10:20 AM on June 28, 2023 [8 favorites]
posted by mmcg at 10:20 AM on June 28, 2023 [8 favorites]
Is there a term for people who don't watch wrestling itself but really dig the non-kayfabe parts? Because I'm one of those people. It's like, I'm never gonna play Eve Online but I love the stories.
I don't know a term but I can recommend Super Eyepatch Wolf's wresting vids since they're sort of designed with non-wrestling fans in mind.
posted by charred husk at 10:34 AM on June 28, 2023 [2 favorites]
I don't know a term but I can recommend Super Eyepatch Wolf's wresting vids since they're sort of designed with non-wrestling fans in mind.
posted by charred husk at 10:34 AM on June 28, 2023 [2 favorites]
If you like the narrator/host/YouTube person, I don't know what you call one of those, you might also enjoy Wrestling With Wregret.
posted by box at 10:38 AM on June 28, 2023
posted by box at 10:38 AM on June 28, 2023
Thanks for the nostalgia. I hadn’t watched this match start to finish since it happened. Agreed that the commentary of the match makes it extra nostalgic, but I do miss hearing JR.
posted by sdrawkcab at 8:33 PM on June 28, 2023
posted by sdrawkcab at 8:33 PM on June 28, 2023
Arguably the greatest match ever and one that that can never be topped for very good reasons.
The thing is: it really isn't "the greatest match ever." It's honestly kind of a terrible match to watch, because it's three big spots chained together by a lot of waiting and shuffling around. There are so, so many better wrestling matches.
However, when Undertaker throws Mankind off the top of the cage, it's arguably the greatest wrestling moment ever. I say "arguably" because there have been bigger and more dramatic falls-from-a-high-place since, but on the other hand those have all been done with gimmicked tables and hidden padding to make them safer and as fans we know that and are comforted by it, but that means the drama is comparatively lessened from what happened at Hell In A Cell, when it was fresh and new and clearly much more dangerous.
And to be clear: Undertaker throwing Mankind off the cage is the iconic moment, but it's not even the most dangerous moment of the match. That throw was planned. The chokeslam through the cage ceiling that ends the match was an accident - Foley wasn't supposed to go through the cage, it just collapsed under the impact because Vince McMahon wasn't even remotely serious about wrestler safety then. Foley's on record as saying he took much more injury from the cage chokeslam than he did from the throw through the table, because he was prepared for the latter.
posted by mightygodking at 7:24 AM on June 29, 2023
The thing is: it really isn't "the greatest match ever." It's honestly kind of a terrible match to watch, because it's three big spots chained together by a lot of waiting and shuffling around. There are so, so many better wrestling matches.
However, when Undertaker throws Mankind off the top of the cage, it's arguably the greatest wrestling moment ever. I say "arguably" because there have been bigger and more dramatic falls-from-a-high-place since, but on the other hand those have all been done with gimmicked tables and hidden padding to make them safer and as fans we know that and are comforted by it, but that means the drama is comparatively lessened from what happened at Hell In A Cell, when it was fresh and new and clearly much more dangerous.
And to be clear: Undertaker throwing Mankind off the cage is the iconic moment, but it's not even the most dangerous moment of the match. That throw was planned. The chokeslam through the cage ceiling that ends the match was an accident - Foley wasn't supposed to go through the cage, it just collapsed under the impact because Vince McMahon wasn't even remotely serious about wrestler safety then. Foley's on record as saying he took much more injury from the cage chokeslam than he did from the throw through the table, because he was prepared for the latter.
posted by mightygodking at 7:24 AM on June 29, 2023
I do miss hearing JR.
He’s still announcing fairly regularly over at All Elite Wrestling if you’re ever jonesing to hear his voice. They have assembled probably my favorite team of announcers ever.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 7:34 AM on June 29, 2023
He’s still announcing fairly regularly over at All Elite Wrestling if you’re ever jonesing to hear his voice. They have assembled probably my favorite team of announcers ever.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 7:34 AM on June 29, 2023
The chokeslam through the cage ceiling that ends the match was an accident - Foley wasn't supposed to go through the cage,
It has been claimed that the roof was supposed to slowly detach and sort of let him slide through the hole and prepare for the landing better, and no one really thought Wait, there's no way that could actually work, is there... I don't know whether that's apocryphal, but they had to get back into the ring somehow, soi maybe.
They didn't anticipate the chair following him down and hitting Mick in the mouth either.
posted by Etrigan at 7:37 AM on June 29, 2023
It has been claimed that the roof was supposed to slowly detach and sort of let him slide through the hole and prepare for the landing better, and no one really thought Wait, there's no way that could actually work, is there... I don't know whether that's apocryphal, but they had to get back into the ring somehow, soi maybe.
They didn't anticipate the chair following him down and hitting Mick in the mouth either.
posted by Etrigan at 7:37 AM on June 29, 2023
It's honestly kind of a terrible match to watch,
A friend of mine long ago described this sort of match (back in the ECW days) as garbaggio, meaning yes, we know there aren't dazzling technical wrestling hold-counterhold-countercounterhold chains or even your classic three-act match structure, but it still grabs you by the eyes and demands your attention with a quality all its own.
posted by Etrigan at 7:40 AM on June 29, 2023 [1 favorite]
A friend of mine long ago described this sort of match (back in the ECW days) as garbaggio, meaning yes, we know there aren't dazzling technical wrestling hold-counterhold-countercounterhold chains or even your classic three-act match structure, but it still grabs you by the eyes and demands your attention with a quality all its own.
posted by Etrigan at 7:40 AM on June 29, 2023 [1 favorite]
A friend of mine long ago described this sort of match (back in the ECW days) as garbaggio, meaning yes, we know there aren't dazzling technical wrestling hold-counterhold-countercounterhold chains or even your classic three-act match structure, but it still grabs you by the eyes and demands your attention with a quality all its own.
It isn't even that, honestly. There are wonderful crazy brawl matches out there all the time, brawls where the action just never seems to let up or one-on-one street fights where the wrestlers are so good at making you feel like they viscerally hate each other you get lost in the magnificent carnage of it all. Great wrestling doesn't have to have fancy technical chains or adhere to a specific story thread; it just has to tell a story well.
Undertaker/Mankind is literally just three terrifying spots (throw off the cage, chokeslam through the cage, multiple moves onto bed of thumbtacks). I watched it live when it first aired and until that first insane spot, it's genuinely kind of meh. And then it's just waiting to see if Mick is still alive. There's barely any story to speak of except "is Mick dead?"
posted by mightygodking at 9:46 AM on June 29, 2023
It isn't even that, honestly. There are wonderful crazy brawl matches out there all the time, brawls where the action just never seems to let up or one-on-one street fights where the wrestlers are so good at making you feel like they viscerally hate each other you get lost in the magnificent carnage of it all. Great wrestling doesn't have to have fancy technical chains or adhere to a specific story thread; it just has to tell a story well.
Undertaker/Mankind is literally just three terrifying spots (throw off the cage, chokeslam through the cage, multiple moves onto bed of thumbtacks). I watched it live when it first aired and until that first insane spot, it's genuinely kind of meh. And then it's just waiting to see if Mick is still alive. There's barely any story to speak of except "is Mick dead?"
posted by mightygodking at 9:46 AM on June 29, 2023
It isn't even that, honestly.
I've had four separate friends (who are only vaguely aware of wrestling) mention that they happened upon the fuss of this anniversary via TikTok or Twitter, and they were all transfixed by the match, and three of them were watching the Mark-Mick Watchalong, so they didn't even get JR's commentary. I get that the True Wrestling Fan has to roll their eyes at it twenty-five years later, but don't discount how compelling the match can be in and of itself.
posted by Etrigan at 10:39 AM on June 29, 2023 [1 favorite]
I've had four separate friends (who are only vaguely aware of wrestling) mention that they happened upon the fuss of this anniversary via TikTok or Twitter, and they were all transfixed by the match, and three of them were watching the Mark-Mick Watchalong, so they didn't even get JR's commentary. I get that the True Wrestling Fan has to roll their eyes at it twenty-five years later, but don't discount how compelling the match can be in and of itself.
posted by Etrigan at 10:39 AM on June 29, 2023 [1 favorite]
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posted by East14thTaco at 6:15 AM on June 28, 2023 [3 favorites]