"how it will be allowed to be interpreted"
August 25, 2023 9:20 AM Subscribe
Fred Clark of Slacktivist (previously) quotes Biblical scriptures on honest weights and measures while critiquing corporate survey metrics and their dishonest usage by bosses to punish individual workers. "Your job is simply to give all 5s. To everyone, everywhere, every time. This is your task because it is the only honest answer available to an honest person. Because 4≠0. Because differing weights are an abomination and false scales are not good. Because your wealthy are full of violence with tongues of deceit in their mouths and bags full of dishonest weights." From June 2019.
Fred Clark is an internet national treasure and has been forever.
I'm reminded of an old tweet that described the Uber driver rating system as a control panel where the button on the right is labelled "a ride occurred" and the other four say "I want to destroy this person's life this much."
posted by mhoye at 9:45 AM on August 25, 2023 [72 favorites]
I'm reminded of an old tweet that described the Uber driver rating system as a control panel where the button on the right is labelled "a ride occurred" and the other four say "I want to destroy this person's life this much."
posted by mhoye at 9:45 AM on August 25, 2023 [72 favorites]
fred clark is an Internet treasure and also one of the key "oooohhhh shiiiit" moments i had in the long process of realizing that the world inevitably punishes the good, rewards the bad, and hates when people do fulfilling things that make the world tangibly better was when he got laid off from his newspaper job and had to start working as a stocker at a big box store.
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 9:53 AM on August 25, 2023 [17 favorites]
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 9:53 AM on August 25, 2023 [17 favorites]
There was a comedian with a stand up routine about the Uber ride from hell. A tall tale with things like the driver was late, the car was disgusting, the driver stopped to buy drugs, got into an argument with his girlfriend, and so on. Comedian says: "I was afraid for my life and not at all happy."
"I gave him four stars."
Audience laughs, and beat later he admits:
"I made that up. Of course I gave him five stars, I'm not a psychopath!"
posted by mark k at 10:00 AM on August 25, 2023 [46 favorites]
"I gave him four stars."
Audience laughs, and beat later he admits:
"I made that up. Of course I gave him five stars, I'm not a psychopath!"
posted by mark k at 10:00 AM on August 25, 2023 [46 favorites]
But yeah, going back to the OP: People pretend they are doing metric driven management on these systems by firing people who dip below 4.8 stars or whatever. This makes no sense! One of the core challenges of actual management is getting information, and by having a system where everyone is rated at five stars these surveys give them nothing to differentiate drivers and trips. It is low Shannon entropy, to use a buzzword many of them know but apparently few understand.
posted by mark k at 10:05 AM on August 25, 2023 [13 favorites]
posted by mark k at 10:05 AM on August 25, 2023 [13 favorites]
The worst example of this is with auto manufacturers and dealers. If you talk to a salesman or read /r/askcarsales, anything that is not perfect 10s in the customer post-sale survey instantly pulls away a huge part of the bonus or commissions the salesman would get on the sale from the factory. And, sometimes, disciplinary measures. So everyone everywhere thinks the system is perfect, when it could certainly use improvement.
My other beef is with the emails I get after a purchase that have a simple "how did we do?" button on it. I'm happy to press it and give my Target cashier a good rating, they deserve the kudo. But when the fake button launches me into a 47-part survey with essay questions? Forget that! And that sucks.
posted by JoeZydeco at 10:13 AM on August 25, 2023 [9 favorites]
My other beef is with the emails I get after a purchase that have a simple "how did we do?" button on it. I'm happy to press it and give my Target cashier a good rating, they deserve the kudo. But when the fake button launches me into a 47-part survey with essay questions? Forget that! And that sucks.
posted by JoeZydeco at 10:13 AM on August 25, 2023 [9 favorites]
If, on the other hand, the metrics are being collected in the Cardinal Richelieu sense (“If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him.”), then the metrics are doing their job exactly.
posted by notoriety public at 10:15 AM on August 25, 2023 [22 favorites]
posted by notoriety public at 10:15 AM on August 25, 2023 [22 favorites]
> But when the fake button launches me into a 47-part survey with essay questions? Forget that! And that sucks.
Yes, exactly, 10 questions each about the bathrooms, cafe, fitting rooms, shopping cart rack, and how the staff answered my questions when all I did was walk in and buy a pack of crew socks.
posted by smelendez at 10:18 AM on August 25, 2023 [6 favorites]
Yes, exactly, 10 questions each about the bathrooms, cafe, fitting rooms, shopping cart rack, and how the staff answered my questions when all I did was walk in and buy a pack of crew socks.
posted by smelendez at 10:18 AM on August 25, 2023 [6 favorites]
Also: Why are the questions always framed in a future tense: "would you recommend Target crew socks to your family and friends?"
Yes? No? I don't know. Can't I just tell you about today's visit?
posted by JoeZydeco at 10:20 AM on August 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
Yes? No? I don't know. Can't I just tell you about today's visit?
posted by JoeZydeco at 10:20 AM on August 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
And they never have "n/a" or "don't know" as options
posted by bifurcated at 10:21 AM on August 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by bifurcated at 10:21 AM on August 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
I used to do gig work, though not delivery or driving, that was rated by stars, and a 3 or below made my life hell until it could be proven that the rating was unjustified. But I wish I had known before that how important it was to give 5 stars if at all. Now I do so compulsively. The worst I have done since was to not rate a driver because he was blaring ultra-right-wing talk radio and I didn't feel safe enough to speak up about it. (But I tipped him. I'm not a monster.)
posted by Countess Elena at 10:21 AM on August 25, 2023 [14 favorites]
posted by Countess Elena at 10:21 AM on August 25, 2023 [14 favorites]
I'm worried that by just generally refusing surveys and review prompts (NOT ON RIDESHARE, OF COURSE I ONLY GIVE FIVE STARS ON RIDESHARE) I am somehow screwing tons of people all the time.
But everything on the planet demands a fucking review! And now a little prompt to "buy X a coffee if you enjoyed X's service!" or some other shit. "Review your hairstylist publicly on Google!" Well, okay, fine, I really liked the color I got... "Review the person who shampooed your hair! Review the receptionist! Review the driver who got you to the appointment. Review the person who brewed the coffee you bought on the way and then review the coffee itself and then the coffee shop. Review the shirt you wore, review the pants, review the sunglasses you bought, review the driver who delivered the sunglasses, review the property management company who owns the building you live in after they changed your heating filters..."
It was too much! It's bad enough that any time you buy anything anywhere, they email you a hundred times a day forever. I cannot.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 10:23 AM on August 25, 2023 [26 favorites]
But everything on the planet demands a fucking review! And now a little prompt to "buy X a coffee if you enjoyed X's service!" or some other shit. "Review your hairstylist publicly on Google!" Well, okay, fine, I really liked the color I got... "Review the person who shampooed your hair! Review the receptionist! Review the driver who got you to the appointment. Review the person who brewed the coffee you bought on the way and then review the coffee itself and then the coffee shop. Review the shirt you wore, review the pants, review the sunglasses you bought, review the driver who delivered the sunglasses, review the property management company who owns the building you live in after they changed your heating filters..."
It was too much! It's bad enough that any time you buy anything anywhere, they email you a hundred times a day forever. I cannot.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 10:23 AM on August 25, 2023 [26 favorites]
My pet peeve these days is people who insist on 5-starring truly mediocre things on google. No, this fast-food restaurant in midtown manhattan is not a 5. It's just a Wendy's.
posted by anhedonic at 10:25 AM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by anhedonic at 10:25 AM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
On the scale of Wendy's, though, there are absolutely 1-star Wendy's experiences and 5-star Wendy's experiences. It seems to be a misunderstanding of how people rate things to assume that they're rating the Wendy's compared to a Michelin-starred fine dining place.
posted by sagc at 10:33 AM on August 25, 2023 [15 favorites]
posted by sagc at 10:33 AM on August 25, 2023 [15 favorites]
I recently had to ask for our cleaning service to fix a minor problem (we have a king sized bed and the cleaning service, which changes the sheets if we leave fresh sheets out, was consistently putting the fitted sheet on sideways) and I felt so guilty for having to say something when the service I was getting was actually incorrect.
They fixed it and I thanked them profusely and extra tipped, which I figured was the least I could do. That's inflated rating culture for you.
posted by gentlyepigrams at 10:34 AM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
They fixed it and I thanked them profusely and extra tipped, which I figured was the least I could do. That's inflated rating culture for you.
posted by gentlyepigrams at 10:34 AM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
I am in a corporate environment where surveys are part of life, and so I spend an inordinate amount of time thinking about the dishonesty of them. There's someone who persistently gives me an 8 out of 10, for instance; in her perspective, that is a good, honest score--not so high as to suggest perfection, because only God is perfect--but a solid, sociable B+. And I'm not allowed to tell her, no, you're wrong, that's not a B+. Anything lower than 10 is an accusation of the worst customer service you've ever encountered. Not only did I not help you, but I also poisoned your dog. It does something really bad to the soul, when someone tries to give you a compliment you are not allowed to accept, and you must instead view it as a failure.
posted by mittens at 10:35 AM on August 25, 2023 [36 favorites]
posted by mittens at 10:35 AM on August 25, 2023 [36 favorites]
No, this fast-food restaurant in midtown manhattan is not a 5. It's just a Wendy's.
I'm with you, but also to the article's point: Did the people working that midtown Manhattan Wendy's do a poor enough job that they should be fired, the shame of their failures to hang around their head if they attempt to seek employment at some wayward McDonald's?
posted by CrystalDave at 10:38 AM on August 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
I'm with you, but also to the article's point: Did the people working that midtown Manhattan Wendy's do a poor enough job that they should be fired, the shame of their failures to hang around their head if they attempt to seek employment at some wayward McDonald's?
posted by CrystalDave at 10:38 AM on August 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
... have you considered the possibility that you did, presumably unwittingly, poison her dog?
posted by Flunkie at 10:42 AM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by Flunkie at 10:42 AM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
I felt so guilty for having to say something when the service I was getting was actually incorrect.
I do this all the time because it's just my expectation that everyone is overworked and underpaid and because of that I'm already exploiting them by default.
posted by RonButNotStupid at 10:45 AM on August 25, 2023 [5 favorites]
I do this all the time because it's just my expectation that everyone is overworked and underpaid and because of that I'm already exploiting them by default.
posted by RonButNotStupid at 10:45 AM on August 25, 2023 [5 favorites]
My personal policy is that I am happy to do freelance supervisory work any time I am paid an appropriate wage to do so, and decline all job offers that pay nothing. Which I hope isn't too unfortunate for the workers, but I hope reduces the pressure for management at companies to offload their jobs onto their customers.
Except rideshare, because if I used rideshare I'd be complicit in the exploitation of the workers and the public commons, so I just find other ways of getting around.
posted by Superilla at 10:49 AM on August 25, 2023 [7 favorites]
Except rideshare, because if I used rideshare I'd be complicit in the exploitation of the workers and the public commons, so I just find other ways of getting around.
posted by Superilla at 10:49 AM on August 25, 2023 [7 favorites]
Yes? No? I don't know. Can't I just tell you about today's visit?
The people using these metrics aren't using them for the improvement of the company or the health or growth of the people who run it. That's too expensive. They're using it to put a gun to the heads of their employees and everyone knows it.
Rating systems are designed to enable a sort of stochastic job-security terrorism against employees, and they work like a charm.
posted by mhoye at 10:52 AM on August 25, 2023 [36 favorites]
The people using these metrics aren't using them for the improvement of the company or the health or growth of the people who run it. That's too expensive. They're using it to put a gun to the heads of their employees and everyone knows it.
Rating systems are designed to enable a sort of stochastic job-security terrorism against employees, and they work like a charm.
posted by mhoye at 10:52 AM on August 25, 2023 [36 favorites]
Also: Why are the questions always framed in a future tense: "would you recommend Target crew socks to your family and friends?"
Yes? No? I don't know. Can't I just tell you about today's visit?
posted by JoeZydeco
I actually know the answer to this one! The measurement this question is trying to gather is Net Promoter Score, which, according to English Wikipedia, owes its origin to a 2003 piece on customer loyalty in the Harvard Business Review:
* long and complicated surveys are bad and not very useful
* focus on rewarding high performers, not on punishing median performers
* a simple one-question survey is so simple that consulting/research firms don't want their clients to switch to it, because then the clients wouldn't need their services to interpret the data
and it seems like many orgs use the question but don't follow the rest of the advice.
posted by brainwane at 10:54 AM on August 25, 2023 [32 favorites]
Yes? No? I don't know. Can't I just tell you about today's visit?
posted by JoeZydeco
I actually know the answer to this one! The measurement this question is trying to gather is Net Promoter Score, which, according to English Wikipedia, owes its origin to a 2003 piece on customer loyalty in the Harvard Business Review:
Surprisingly, the most effective question wasn’t about customer satisfaction or even loyalty per se. In most of the industries studied, the percentage of customers enthusiastic enough about a company to refer it to a friend or colleague directly correlated with growth rates among competitors.This article, "The One Number You Need to Grow," is interesting to read also because the author says:
Willingness to talk up a company or product to friends, family, and colleagues is one of the best indicators of loyalty because of the customer’s sacrifice in making the recommendation. When customers act as references, they do more than indicate they’ve received good economic value from a company; they put their own reputations on the line. And they will risk their reputations only if they feel intense loyalty.
* long and complicated surveys are bad and not very useful
* focus on rewarding high performers, not on punishing median performers
* a simple one-question survey is so simple that consulting/research firms don't want their clients to switch to it, because then the clients wouldn't need their services to interpret the data
and it seems like many orgs use the question but don't follow the rest of the advice.
posted by brainwane at 10:54 AM on August 25, 2023 [32 favorites]
Thank you for purchasing Pounded In The Butt By My Book "Pounded In The Butt By My Book 'Pounded In The Butt By My Book "Pounded In The Butt By My Book 'Pounded In The Butt By My Book "Pounded In The Butt By My Own Butt"'"'! Would you recommend this book to your friends and family?
... yes I would.
posted by Flunkie at 11:03 AM on August 25, 2023 [18 favorites]
... yes I would.
posted by Flunkie at 11:03 AM on August 25, 2023 [18 favorites]
The One Number You Need to Grow
is a headline that communicates exactly the wrong message. There is no single number that any business "needs to grow" because a number can be either be a useful measure or a good goal, never both, and optimizing a number that no longer actually means anything is stupid and pointless.
posted by flabdablet at 11:04 AM on August 25, 2023 [9 favorites]
is a headline that communicates exactly the wrong message. There is no single number that any business "needs to grow" because a number can be either be a useful measure or a good goal, never both, and optimizing a number that no longer actually means anything is stupid and pointless.
posted by flabdablet at 11:04 AM on August 25, 2023 [9 favorites]
Oh man... NPS is everywhere. Anytime you hear one of those surveys that says something along the lines of "How Likely Would You Recommend Blah Blah Blah" - it's calculating NPS and if you don't want to tank someone, you have to be 8+.
Work does this for our customers, our service and interestingly as a measure of employee satisfaction as well. (Doesn't that seem particularly likely not to net you an honest answer)
posted by drewbage1847 at 11:05 AM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
Work does this for our customers, our service and interestingly as a measure of employee satisfaction as well. (Doesn't that seem particularly likely not to net you an honest answer)
posted by drewbage1847 at 11:05 AM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
Came here to make a reference to Nosedive, the Black Mirror episode that keeps edging closer to documentary than science fiction.
Please save this comment as a favorite!
posted by gimonca at 11:08 AM on August 25, 2023 [16 favorites]
Please save this comment as a favorite!
posted by gimonca at 11:08 AM on August 25, 2023 [16 favorites]
No, this fast-food restaurant in midtown manhattan is not a 5. It's just a Wendy's.
If I go to a Wendy's I have my expectations calibrated appropriately. If I get a juicy burger, hot fries, and a nice shake, then I have had a 5 star Wendy's experience.
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 11:11 AM on August 25, 2023 [6 favorites]
If I go to a Wendy's I have my expectations calibrated appropriately. If I get a juicy burger, hot fries, and a nice shake, then I have had a 5 star Wendy's experience.
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 11:11 AM on August 25, 2023 [6 favorites]
⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ TFA exactly as described, fast replies, no fighty comments, recommended poster.
posted by flabdablet at 11:12 AM on August 25, 2023 [24 favorites]
posted by flabdablet at 11:12 AM on August 25, 2023 [24 favorites]
One problem I have with these rating systems is that I'm not interested in distinguishing between levels of bad, but there is a wide range of good and the difference between "The Uber driver got me there on time and safely. That's all I want" and "OMG, she was the absolute best. Plus, she gave my dad CPR after he had a heart attack on the way to the airport. She also had snacks" is worth commenting on.
I'd like 1 to be "this sucked" and 2-5 to range from "good" to "great".
It's like movie ratings. Do I need to know if you think this movie is one star vs. one and half stars? No. The movie is crap. That's all I need to know. The rating system should look like:
No. Just... no
Eh, if you like this sort thing, sure
This is good. Definitely see if it's your thing
This is really good. See it even if it's not your thing
Move over Citizen Kane. The King has arrived
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 11:23 AM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
I'd like 1 to be "this sucked" and 2-5 to range from "good" to "great".
It's like movie ratings. Do I need to know if you think this movie is one star vs. one and half stars? No. The movie is crap. That's all I need to know. The rating system should look like:
No. Just... no
Eh, if you like this sort thing, sure
This is good. Definitely see if it's your thing
This is really good. See it even if it's not your thing
Move over Citizen Kane. The King has arrived
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 11:23 AM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
Hence my policy on all self assessments to give myself and evaluations of subordinates / coworkers nothing but the top scores.
posted by interogative mood at 11:31 AM on August 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by interogative mood at 11:31 AM on August 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
⭐⭐⭐
The article was informative and the discussion has been high quality. But I can only give three stars because the sun was shining on my monitor and made it hard to read. Come on Metafilter do better
posted by hangashore at 11:43 AM on August 25, 2023 [32 favorites]
The article was informative and the discussion has been high quality. But I can only give three stars because the sun was shining on my monitor and made it hard to read. Come on Metafilter do better
posted by hangashore at 11:43 AM on August 25, 2023 [32 favorites]
I had an Uber driver explain to me that the algorithm purposely pairs low ranking drivers with low ranking riders in an effort to get both off the platform. Not sure how that works in practice, but it’s an interesting idea.
posted by dr_dank at 11:57 AM on August 25, 2023 [13 favorites]
posted by dr_dank at 11:57 AM on August 25, 2023 [13 favorites]
That is so Nosedive.
posted by flabdablet at 12:01 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by flabdablet at 12:01 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
What about workplace software ratings? Like MS Teams is constantly demanding that I rate how likely I am to recommend their hellproduct. Zero likely, of course. Who would recommend lifewrecking corporateoverlord tools of production to fellow serfs? Insane. They invariably follow that up with the absolutely illogical and infuriating, "Why did you choose that number to rate the likelihood that you would recommend our software to others?" Because that number is the most accurate number, you AAAAAAAASSSSSFLAAAAAPS! I know what they're trying to ask; why don't they take the forty seconds it would take to think the question through and phrase it right or at least less enragingly? That question can eat shit and die. As can all the other ones they go on to ask. Because all corporate "how we doin', friend?" questions asked of people who didn't ask to interact with their abusive products need to not be asked, IMO.
(When given the opportunity, I do describe in real language when I have identified an actual problem they could actually fix and actually improve the product--because, sure, it would be helpful to fellow serfs if it sucked a little less. I'm not going to rate them a "2" or whatever, though. Because there is no 2. there is only 0. Or 1 if there is no 0.)
That has been my MO, but now I'm wondering: am I ruining some developer's life, though? Should I be rating "Word" and "Teams" and "Workfront" and whatever other terrible horseshit all fives? If so, I will just stop filling the shit out; I was only doing it to take a tiny break from being ground in their bloodsoaked gears for a moment or two, anyway.
posted by Don Pepino at 12:04 PM on August 25, 2023 [11 favorites]
(When given the opportunity, I do describe in real language when I have identified an actual problem they could actually fix and actually improve the product--because, sure, it would be helpful to fellow serfs if it sucked a little less. I'm not going to rate them a "2" or whatever, though. Because there is no 2. there is only 0. Or 1 if there is no 0.)
That has been my MO, but now I'm wondering: am I ruining some developer's life, though? Should I be rating "Word" and "Teams" and "Workfront" and whatever other terrible horseshit all fives? If so, I will just stop filling the shit out; I was only doing it to take a tiny break from being ground in their bloodsoaked gears for a moment or two, anyway.
posted by Don Pepino at 12:04 PM on August 25, 2023 [11 favorites]
I had an Ebay seller contact me to ask why I wasn't happy. My review was something like, "Shipped quickly, packaged securely, no problems." Apparently, the lack of "A+++++++++++++++++++++++++ seller, would buy again" was off-putting. My lesson from that was to stop leaving Ebay reviews.
posted by COD at 12:06 PM on August 25, 2023 [9 favorites]
posted by COD at 12:06 PM on August 25, 2023 [9 favorites]
Also, this got me thinking. It was an accepted fact when I was in business school that for every complaint, 10 people didn't bother and that happy customers don't complete surveys. This was back when a survey was usually a postcard, and customer complaints came via USPS.
I wonder how rating culture has changed that?
posted by COD at 12:12 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
I wonder how rating culture has changed that?
posted by COD at 12:12 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
> Rating systems are designed to enable a sort of stochastic job-security terrorism against employees, and they work like a charm.
Definitely. And not even just employees—look at any forum for Airbnb hosts, and you can see they're terrified of getting bad reviews even for calling out a guest for doing something against the rules.
I suspect it also provides a way for some of the gig work platforms to effectively do layoffs when they get overstaffed without running afoul of independent contractor rules. Just tweak the minimum rating formula and throw out the bottom tier when you have too many drivers chasing not enough work, like Depression-era farmers pouring milk down the drain.
posted by smelendez at 12:26 PM on August 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
Definitely. And not even just employees—look at any forum for Airbnb hosts, and you can see they're terrified of getting bad reviews even for calling out a guest for doing something against the rules.
I suspect it also provides a way for some of the gig work platforms to effectively do layoffs when they get overstaffed without running afoul of independent contractor rules. Just tweak the minimum rating formula and throw out the bottom tier when you have too many drivers chasing not enough work, like Depression-era farmers pouring milk down the drain.
posted by smelendez at 12:26 PM on August 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
It's not always binary. Sometimes there's something called "net promoter score" - basically they ask you to rate on a 0 to 10 scale, but then this gets collapsed to the percent of "promoters" (9 or 10) minus the percent of "detractors" (0 to 6). 7 and 8 are neutral.
My employer does an "employee net promoter score" (eNPS), which they tabulate down to the individual manager level. I remember an old boss pointing out in a staff meeting, after the surveys came back, that he suspected his eNPS was low because we'd all rated him like a bunch of engineers and thought 7 or 8 was a pretty good score. (He was right, we basically liked him and most of us probably would have given a positive score.)
We also do surveys of call center agents, on a 1-5 scale, and we do consider 3 neutral. The metric we report is (% 4 and 5) - (% 1 and 2) - so effectively 4 is equal to 5. I figure this "5 star is the only good rating" thing might be a "gig economy" thing - so of course I'm rating my Uber driver five stars, I'm not a monster.
posted by madcaptenor at 12:27 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
My employer does an "employee net promoter score" (eNPS), which they tabulate down to the individual manager level. I remember an old boss pointing out in a staff meeting, after the surveys came back, that he suspected his eNPS was low because we'd all rated him like a bunch of engineers and thought 7 or 8 was a pretty good score. (He was right, we basically liked him and most of us probably would have given a positive score.)
We also do surveys of call center agents, on a 1-5 scale, and we do consider 3 neutral. The metric we report is (% 4 and 5) - (% 1 and 2) - so effectively 4 is equal to 5. I figure this "5 star is the only good rating" thing might be a "gig economy" thing - so of course I'm rating my Uber driver five stars, I'm not a monster.
posted by madcaptenor at 12:27 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
They invariably follow that up with the absolutely illogical and infuriating, "Why did you choose that number to rate the likelihood that you would recommend our software to others?" Because that number is the most accurate number, you AAAAAAAASSSSSFLAAAAAPS!
The only answer I ever give to that kind of question these days is this URL.
posted by flabdablet at 12:28 PM on August 25, 2023 [11 favorites]
The only answer I ever give to that kind of question these days is this URL.
posted by flabdablet at 12:28 PM on August 25, 2023 [11 favorites]
It always ends up with some bullshit stacked ranking system where some fresh faced MBA/Consultant decides to cull the bottom 10% of performers every year. So inevitably work becomes a popularity contest / game of thrones scenario and the place goes to shit.
posted by interogative mood at 12:48 PM on August 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by interogative mood at 12:48 PM on August 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
I generally just ignore the "rate X from 1 to 5," but I do provide feedback when I think it would be useful to a decent manager. For example, earlier this year I went to a midrange motel chain where things were generally good and the staff were helpful and pleasant, but a bunch of little things were off. In response to the survey, I listed 8 solvable or improvable issues, such as setting the clock correctly and adjusting the door to the room I stayed in so it wasn't hard to close. I don't know what they did, but that's the kind of feedback I'd appreciate if I were running the hotel.
posted by Mr.Know-it-some at 12:54 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by Mr.Know-it-some at 12:54 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
One time in a store I paid for a purchase and the lady said "I emailed you the receipt." I replied, "This is a Christmas gift for my wife and you sent the receipt to her, so you can just return it all now since the surprise is ruined."
Only later did I reflect that her manager watched the whole thing, aghast...and I didn't really care because ASK FIRST, DON'T ASSUME.
No need for a one-star review that time.
posted by wenestvedt at 12:59 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
Only later did I reflect that her manager watched the whole thing, aghast...and I didn't really care because ASK FIRST, DON'T ASSUME.
No need for a one-star review that time.
posted by wenestvedt at 12:59 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
If you give 4 stars then yours will be among the first backs against the wall come the revolution. You monster. You sniveling coward.
posted by AlSweigart at 1:00 PM on August 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by AlSweigart at 1:00 PM on August 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
They fixed it and I thanked them profusely and extra tipped, which I figured was the least I could do. That's inflated rating culture for you.
You don't need to extra tip someone if they fix a mistake! Maybe you don't dock the tip, but if you go too far down that road you're going to get upset when inevitably you don't get your own flowers just for doing things normally.
posted by kingdead at 1:02 PM on August 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
You don't need to extra tip someone if they fix a mistake! Maybe you don't dock the tip, but if you go too far down that road you're going to get upset when inevitably you don't get your own flowers just for doing things normally.
posted by kingdead at 1:02 PM on August 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
If you see someone shoplifting food performing at fewer than five stars, no you didn't.
posted by davel at 1:06 PM on August 25, 2023 [10 favorites]
posted by davel at 1:06 PM on August 25, 2023 [10 favorites]
It's bad enough that any time you buy anything anywhere, they email you a hundred times a day forever
Agreed. I doubt that even the Sultan of Brunei needs new furniture on a daily basis.
posted by tangerine at 1:11 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
Agreed. I doubt that even the Sultan of Brunei needs new furniture on a daily basis.
posted by tangerine at 1:11 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
I had an Uber driver explain to me that the algorithm purposely pairs low ranking drivers with low ranking riders in an effort to get both off the platform. Not sure how that works in practice, but it’s an interesting idea.
This idea born in online shooters, it's called hellbanning. In an FPS, cheating detection doesn't ban people from playing, it just flags their account so when they join up they always end up on servers where everyone else is cheating too. Of course Uber - quelle surprise - decided that the right thing to do to apply that to real people's livelihoods, because they're the worst company run by the worst people.
posted by mhoye at 1:13 PM on August 25, 2023 [10 favorites]
This idea born in online shooters, it's called hellbanning. In an FPS, cheating detection doesn't ban people from playing, it just flags their account so when they join up they always end up on servers where everyone else is cheating too. Of course Uber - quelle surprise - decided that the right thing to do to apply that to real people's livelihoods, because they're the worst company run by the worst people.
posted by mhoye at 1:13 PM on August 25, 2023 [10 favorites]
Well the American workplace has certainly become a dystopian nightmare hellscape, hasn't it?
posted by MrVisible at 1:14 PM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by MrVisible at 1:14 PM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
When I became a manager of other people some years back, I had to start doing reviews. My first year doing it, we had a whole 1-5 rating system, with HR itself saying 1 was "underperforming" and 5 was "exceeds expectations". Well, I took it at face value and used 3 as my starting point for all ratings for my employees.
Friends, let me tell you it did not go over well. Not only were my employees baffled why I was rating them so poorly, the management above me was also asking why my team was rated so terribly. We cleared it all up, in the end, and ever since I save myself a lot of time and just rate everyone 5 on everything unless they are doing a truly terrible job.
posted by Zargon X at 1:18 PM on August 25, 2023 [10 favorites]
Friends, let me tell you it did not go over well. Not only were my employees baffled why I was rating them so poorly, the management above me was also asking why my team was rated so terribly. We cleared it all up, in the end, and ever since I save myself a lot of time and just rate everyone 5 on everything unless they are doing a truly terrible job.
posted by Zargon X at 1:18 PM on August 25, 2023 [10 favorites]
This seems to carry over to certain forms of product that can be tied to an individual creator, as well. For example, I've been told by author friends that book ratings much lower than a perfect 5 will tank their position in search results and have a measurable impact on their sales, and thus livelihoods.
As someone who does data analysis at work (nothing related to people or scores!), I find it tremendously frustrating. My current model is a binary score of, "non-horrible => 5 starts", "completely unacceptable => skip the rating prompt".
posted by learning from frequent failure at 1:21 PM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
As someone who does data analysis at work (nothing related to people or scores!), I find it tremendously frustrating. My current model is a binary score of, "non-horrible => 5 starts", "completely unacceptable => skip the rating prompt".
posted by learning from frequent failure at 1:21 PM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
I have used a 1 star rating exactly once, in response to work that was actively unsafe and a threat to the lives of bystanders. But only for that.
posted by learning from frequent failure at 1:22 PM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by learning from frequent failure at 1:22 PM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
Alright this is veering off course a little bit but about 15 years ago I was a nonchalant college student reselling textbooks on ebay or something similar. I sold a book listed as "good" quality because I had bought it that way and barely looked at it. The buyer messaged me, upset because it had writing in it which I guess made it "fair" quality. I wrote back and said, "sorry, I didn't realize there was writing in it but there's nothing I can do. Leave me a bad review if you don't like it. I'm not planning to sell much stuff on here." So they left me a bad review that said "I contacted the seller about the quality and she said "Leave me a bad review if you don't like it!""
Still makes me laugh. I feel it was a highly honest interaction where we all said what we meant.
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:33 PM on August 25, 2023 [10 favorites]
Still makes me laugh. I feel it was a highly honest interaction where we all said what we meant.
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:33 PM on August 25, 2023 [10 favorites]
I have several direct reports, and they all always get all five stars on their reviews because AYFKM? I even put a unique, effusive comment in every single comment field for each of them because you just never know if someone might actually read the things.
I have been asked by superiors in the past about this, and I only reply, "Yeah, they're awesome, aren't they? Really amazing colleagues -- I am grateful to work with them."
posted by wenestvedt at 1:42 PM on August 25, 2023 [5 favorites]
I have been asked by superiors in the past about this, and I only reply, "Yeah, they're awesome, aren't they? Really amazing colleagues -- I am grateful to work with them."
posted by wenestvedt at 1:42 PM on August 25, 2023 [5 favorites]
I have used a 1 star rating exactly once, in response to work that was actively unsafe and a threat to the lives of bystanders. But only for that.
Yeah, I once gave a 1 star rating to a Lyft driver whose driving was so terrifyingly bad that I felt I would be complicit in vehicular manslaughter if I didn't at least make an effort to keep her from driving as little as possible.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 1:43 PM on August 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
Yeah, I once gave a 1 star rating to a Lyft driver whose driving was so terrifyingly bad that I felt I would be complicit in vehicular manslaughter if I didn't at least make an effort to keep her from driving as little as possible.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 1:43 PM on August 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
Of course Uber - quelle surprise - decided that the right thing to do to apply that to real people's livelihoods, because they're the worst company run by the worst people.Not that it would surprise me, but is there any evidence that they did? I mean, beyond "Somebody quasi-anonymous on the internet told me that someone with a vested interest in making them believe it's true told them it's true"?
posted by Flunkie at 1:46 PM on August 25, 2023
I've seen a physical version of this in an airport restroom, with a green smiley face button for a good rating, and a red frowny face button for a bad rating. It occurred to me that if the restroom cleaning was that bad...no way was I going to touch any button, green or red.
posted by gimonca at 1:46 PM on August 25, 2023 [10 favorites]
posted by gimonca at 1:46 PM on August 25, 2023 [10 favorites]
The measurement this question is trying to gather is Net Promoter Score, which, according to English Wikipedia, owes its origin to a 2003 piece on customer loyalty in the Harvard Business ReviewHow many of the worst things in our lives can be traced back to goddamned Harvard?
posted by wenestvedt at 1:46 PM on August 25, 2023 [21 favorites]
There's someone who persistently gives me an 8 out of 10, for instance; in her perspective, that is a good, honest score--not so high as to suggest perfection, because only God is perfect--but a solid, sociable B+
My boss thinks like this. Our annual review consisted of numerous categories scored on a 1-5 scale, and it is difficult to get anything above a 3 (which means "as expected") from her because, well, you're expected to do an amazing job. It's almost impossible to get a 4 or 5 for going "above and beyond" because... you're expected to go above and beyond! Our jobs were not in jeopardy from an all-3 rating, and they decoupled the performance review from the salary increase a while back, and it wasn't a big deal from the perspective of me thinking I must be doing a bad job. I knew her thinking on it so it didn't offend me. It did bother me a bit that our reviews ultimately get signed by the CEO, and who knows if he understands the real reason I got 3s across the board when I'm sure most other departments were scored much more generously.
Meanwhile, the person who worked for me is the sort of person who would give herself all 5s in her self-review, because she believes she does her very best 100% of the time (and I'm sure she does.) It took a lot of explaining why I couldn't give her 5s, but I did agree she was doing a terrific job and gave her several 4s. So my assistant wound up with a much better review than I got, even though I was her supervisor for a reason.
Thankfully they did away with this system last year because the employee survey overwhelmingly indicated that the majority of people considered it to be unfair and arbitrary.
posted by Serene Empress Dork at 1:50 PM on August 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
My boss thinks like this. Our annual review consisted of numerous categories scored on a 1-5 scale, and it is difficult to get anything above a 3 (which means "as expected") from her because, well, you're expected to do an amazing job. It's almost impossible to get a 4 or 5 for going "above and beyond" because... you're expected to go above and beyond! Our jobs were not in jeopardy from an all-3 rating, and they decoupled the performance review from the salary increase a while back, and it wasn't a big deal from the perspective of me thinking I must be doing a bad job. I knew her thinking on it so it didn't offend me. It did bother me a bit that our reviews ultimately get signed by the CEO, and who knows if he understands the real reason I got 3s across the board when I'm sure most other departments were scored much more generously.
Meanwhile, the person who worked for me is the sort of person who would give herself all 5s in her self-review, because she believes she does her very best 100% of the time (and I'm sure she does.) It took a lot of explaining why I couldn't give her 5s, but I did agree she was doing a terrific job and gave her several 4s. So my assistant wound up with a much better review than I got, even though I was her supervisor for a reason.
Thankfully they did away with this system last year because the employee survey overwhelmingly indicated that the majority of people considered it to be unfair and arbitrary.
posted by Serene Empress Dork at 1:50 PM on August 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
Definitely the frustrating part for me is like in the article, there's no allowance that I can have a poor experience because of a failure of the business rather than a specific employee.
posted by RobotHero at 1:56 PM on August 25, 2023 [15 favorites]
posted by RobotHero at 1:56 PM on August 25, 2023 [15 favorites]
Our annual review consisted of numerous categories scored on a 1-5 scale, and it is difficult to get anything above a 3 (which means "as expected") from her because, well, you're expected to do an amazing job. It's almost impossible to get a 4 or 5 for going "above and beyond" because... you're expected to go above and beyond!
Yeah, that's the other thing: It is generally just wrong to average or compare star ratings from multiple people because they're probably not on the same scale. It may work for products, movies, etc. with thousands of reviews drawn from generally similar populations but certainly not in small numbers. It's like ordering a "level 3 out of 5 spicy" meal from a flea market nacho stand in rural Wisconsin and a Thai restaurant in Queens and assuming they'll be equivalent.
I am by no means an expert, but I believe there's a technique to correct for this in social science research called "anchoring vignettes," where in addition to asking someone to rate something from their experience on, say, a 1 to 5 scale, you also ask them to rank various hypothetical scenarios on the same scale. I don't claim to know if this would work in the workplace review scenario, but it seems clear that you can't just blindly equate a score from Boss A with a score from Boss B.
posted by smelendez at 2:07 PM on August 25, 2023 [8 favorites]
Yeah, that's the other thing: It is generally just wrong to average or compare star ratings from multiple people because they're probably not on the same scale. It may work for products, movies, etc. with thousands of reviews drawn from generally similar populations but certainly not in small numbers. It's like ordering a "level 3 out of 5 spicy" meal from a flea market nacho stand in rural Wisconsin and a Thai restaurant in Queens and assuming they'll be equivalent.
I am by no means an expert, but I believe there's a technique to correct for this in social science research called "anchoring vignettes," where in addition to asking someone to rate something from their experience on, say, a 1 to 5 scale, you also ask them to rank various hypothetical scenarios on the same scale. I don't claim to know if this would work in the workplace review scenario, but it seems clear that you can't just blindly equate a score from Boss A with a score from Boss B.
posted by smelendez at 2:07 PM on August 25, 2023 [8 favorites]
Definitely the frustrating part for me is like in the article, there's no allowance that I can have a poor experience because of a failure of the business rather than a specific employee.
Right, like I can't start giving Wendy's a shitty rating because they downgraded their beef quality, because somehow that will become specifically the fault of Stuart at the 10:30 pm drive-thru. Asinine.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 2:17 PM on August 25, 2023 [12 favorites]
Right, like I can't start giving Wendy's a shitty rating because they downgraded their beef quality, because somehow that will become specifically the fault of Stuart at the 10:30 pm drive-thru. Asinine.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 2:17 PM on August 25, 2023 [12 favorites]
I work in a massive liquor warehouse for the provincial government of BC. In 2018 we moved to a new warehouse where everything was going to be more efficient. It's been a disaster; not a single employee at the old warehouse was asked for any input whatsoever. It was all metrics, and some sort of failed attempt at automation, which has been chaotic. From automatic pallet wrappers that consistently break down to chronic space shortages because the warehouse was filled with as much racking for storage as possible, it's been horrible. The thing is, it all looks good on paper and in a spreadsheet, but in real life not so much, because human beings were ignored at every decision.
The production manager hired the year before we moved is obsessed with numbers; how many cases picked by the order pickers, how much downtime in a shift, etc. People get called up by supervisors for being 1 minute late coming back from break. On average that takes 20 minutes; to address 1 minute of downtime, but reports have to be filled out and a certain amount of people have to be called up every day for low case count and downtime.
It's insane, and extremely dehumanizing, to be understood as only a number. The production manager jettisoned all sorts of things that made for a safer work environment, such as pallets getting lifted onto stacks of empty pallets when the case count gets low on that particular pallet. Workmans compensation claims have exploded, but you see, there's no place in his spread sheet for employee safety measures.
Once a year we are asked to fill out an online survey for employee satisfaction and there numbers were so low that even the upper bureaucrats in government took notice and hired an outside consultant to do 90 minute interviews with select employees. I had one of the later interviews and the consultant said that the single dominant theme so far was this production manager, and his pathological insistence on his version of metrics, had to go.
I referred to him as Robert McNamara's MiniMe. It's insane
Anyways, a wee bit of venting from an employee dealing with this horseshit on a daily basis. I stay because of the small pension plan awaiting.
posted by Phlegmco(tm) at 2:47 PM on August 25, 2023 [30 favorites]
The production manager hired the year before we moved is obsessed with numbers; how many cases picked by the order pickers, how much downtime in a shift, etc. People get called up by supervisors for being 1 minute late coming back from break. On average that takes 20 minutes; to address 1 minute of downtime, but reports have to be filled out and a certain amount of people have to be called up every day for low case count and downtime.
It's insane, and extremely dehumanizing, to be understood as only a number. The production manager jettisoned all sorts of things that made for a safer work environment, such as pallets getting lifted onto stacks of empty pallets when the case count gets low on that particular pallet. Workmans compensation claims have exploded, but you see, there's no place in his spread sheet for employee safety measures.
Once a year we are asked to fill out an online survey for employee satisfaction and there numbers were so low that even the upper bureaucrats in government took notice and hired an outside consultant to do 90 minute interviews with select employees. I had one of the later interviews and the consultant said that the single dominant theme so far was this production manager, and his pathological insistence on his version of metrics, had to go.
I referred to him as Robert McNamara's MiniMe. It's insane
Anyways, a wee bit of venting from an employee dealing with this horseshit on a daily basis. I stay because of the small pension plan awaiting.
posted by Phlegmco(tm) at 2:47 PM on August 25, 2023 [30 favorites]
Hmmm, this thread is making me think about "grade inflation" in a totally new way. Not that I was a big proponent of the concept before, but of course grades are everyone's introduction to bullshit metrics based management where no scores are comparable and nothing really means what it's supposed to mean.
posted by derrinyet at 2:55 PM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by derrinyet at 2:55 PM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
My pet peeve these days is people who insist on 5-starring truly mediocre things on google.
We prefer local restaurants when traveling the interstates, and we used to be able to rely on google reviews for finding such. This summer's trip was a complete failure though in this regard (even with filters!) to the point that several times we decided to save our energy and just go to the nearest fast food place.
posted by beaning at 2:59 PM on August 25, 2023
We prefer local restaurants when traveling the interstates, and we used to be able to rely on google reviews for finding such. This summer's trip was a complete failure though in this regard (even with filters!) to the point that several times we decided to save our energy and just go to the nearest fast food place.
posted by beaning at 2:59 PM on August 25, 2023
grades are everyone's introduction to bullshit metrics based management where no scores are comparable and nothing really means what it's supposed to mean
Yep! Like how in law school, a B, which is a perfectly respectable grade elsewhere, is leading my classmates to absolute despair because it brands them the lowest of the low.
posted by corb at 3:32 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
Yep! Like how in law school, a B, which is a perfectly respectable grade elsewhere, is leading my classmates to absolute despair because it brands them the lowest of the low.
posted by corb at 3:32 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
I've seen those airport bathroom raters as well, gimonca. They seem relatively clear, and sometimes positioned to be hard to avoid.
posted by doctornemo at 3:57 PM on August 25, 2023
posted by doctornemo at 3:57 PM on August 25, 2023
This tightly fits into: The professor’s great fear about AI? That it becomes the boss from hell
posted by ovvl at 3:58 PM on August 25, 2023
posted by ovvl at 3:58 PM on August 25, 2023
there's no allowance that I can have a poor experience because of a failure of the business rather than a specific employee.
My favs when I read reviews are product one stars that have nothing to do with the product or even with the producer. "The widget not only solved the exact problem I had, it also waxed my car and made me a good meal but I'm giving it a 1* review because the delivery company said they'd be at my house between noon and two and didn't arrive till two ten."
posted by Mitheral at 4:00 PM on August 25, 2023 [6 favorites]
My favs when I read reviews are product one stars that have nothing to do with the product or even with the producer. "The widget not only solved the exact problem I had, it also waxed my car and made me a good meal but I'm giving it a 1* review because the delivery company said they'd be at my house between noon and two and didn't arrive till two ten."
posted by Mitheral at 4:00 PM on August 25, 2023 [6 favorites]
I had a full career in customer service, and while my managers always had some 'numbers' they collected on me, my rating was more based on what my manager saw and heard when he was personally talking to my customers. He actually had to go out and work. This was in the '70s and early 80's, at least.
By the '90s, it was all surveys. I consider it lazy.
The numbers have no defined meaning. Like when the nurse asks your pain level on a scale of 1 to 10. I don't know. I don't know what a 6 feels like.
In IBM, I was rated on a 1-5 scale the whole time I was there, but those numbers were well defined, and relating to one's assigned duties. (Which were also well defined)
1- Did not meet expectations
2- Met expectations
3- Met and exceeded expectations at times
4- Met and exceeded expectations most times
5- Met and exceeded expectations 24/7, including on Christmas
A 3 here is considered respectable. I got a few 4's, but mostly was quite happy with 3's. And almost nobody got 5's. (nicknamed 'Walks on water')
So after doing that for 30 years, that's my ingrained scale. I would be happy with a 1-5 scale if the numbers were defined as above, with a 2 meaning 'OK, fine'. And that should be OK.
But I refuse to answer surveys with more than 5 stars/numbers. (Well, I've actually pretty much given up on all surveys) I think it was in Dave Eggers' book The Circle, where the CSR's had to call back their customers who gave them less than [something like] a 96%, to beg the customer up to a 97 or 98. I had to stop reading that book.
posted by MtDewd at 5:49 PM on August 25, 2023 [5 favorites]
By the '90s, it was all surveys. I consider it lazy.
The numbers have no defined meaning. Like when the nurse asks your pain level on a scale of 1 to 10. I don't know. I don't know what a 6 feels like.
In IBM, I was rated on a 1-5 scale the whole time I was there, but those numbers were well defined, and relating to one's assigned duties. (Which were also well defined)
1- Did not meet expectations
2- Met expectations
3- Met and exceeded expectations at times
4- Met and exceeded expectations most times
5- Met and exceeded expectations 24/7, including on Christmas
A 3 here is considered respectable. I got a few 4's, but mostly was quite happy with 3's. And almost nobody got 5's. (nicknamed 'Walks on water')
So after doing that for 30 years, that's my ingrained scale. I would be happy with a 1-5 scale if the numbers were defined as above, with a 2 meaning 'OK, fine'. And that should be OK.
But I refuse to answer surveys with more than 5 stars/numbers. (Well, I've actually pretty much given up on all surveys) I think it was in Dave Eggers' book The Circle, where the CSR's had to call back their customers who gave them less than [something like] a 96%, to beg the customer up to a 97 or 98. I had to stop reading that book.
posted by MtDewd at 5:49 PM on August 25, 2023 [5 favorites]
Like when the nurse asks your pain level on a scale of 1 to 10.Oh god, I hate that so much.
"What's your pain level on a scale of 1 to 10?"
"I don't know, it's unignorable and thoroughly unenjoyable, but it's not really awful...."
"One to ten."
Ugh. So what's that? A three? Would that lead to them believing I'm basically fine? An eight? Would that lead to a forced emergency room visit? I have no idea. How the hell am I supposed to know?
posted by Flunkie at 6:05 PM on August 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
Pain should be rated on a Michelin scale. If it hurts enough that a nurse has to be involved, that's zero stars. One star is excruciating. Two stars you would drive to another city for treatment. Three stars is so excruciating that you would make a special trip to France to have it dealt with.
posted by surlyben at 6:20 PM on August 25, 2023 [28 favorites]
posted by surlyben at 6:20 PM on August 25, 2023 [28 favorites]
The worst example of this is with auto manufacturers and dealers. If you talk to a salesman or read /r/askcarsales, anything that is not perfect 10s in the customer post-sale survey instantly pulls away a huge part of the bonus or commissions the salesman would get on the sale from the factory.
Are you sure about that? The post-sale survey I got from Subaru clearly labelled 4/10 as "average" which I took to mean "even we know dealerships are predatory scum we would happily dispense with if they hadnt bought their state legislature and made it illegal to not use a dealer."
posted by pwnguin at 6:32 PM on August 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
Are you sure about that? The post-sale survey I got from Subaru clearly labelled 4/10 as "average" which I took to mean "even we know dealerships are predatory scum we would happily dispense with if they hadnt bought their state legislature and made it illegal to not use a dealer."
posted by pwnguin at 6:32 PM on August 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
Bosses are cowards if they don't face the challenge of knowing their staff's performance. But modern corporate structure selects for Dumpster Fire companies. Probably because fire grows out of control.
posted by rebent at 7:37 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by rebent at 7:37 PM on August 25, 2023 [2 favorites]
Telephone customer service: I never do the surveys because they don’t ask about my complete experience, like how the ridiculous voice prompt tree doesn’t work and you have to start repeating “speak to an associate speak to an associate speak to an associate speak to an associate” until it gives up and put you on hold for 30 minutes. Noooooo! It’s always about “was the associate knowledgeable/friendly/helpful/whatev,” like that’s where any of the pain was. The call was recorded, so *obviously* the associate was spectacularly professional. Looking at you, IRS, Healthcare.gov, etc
posted by toodleydoodley at 7:48 PM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by toodleydoodley at 7:48 PM on August 25, 2023 [3 favorites]
My pet peeve these days is people who insist on 5-starring truly mediocre things on google
I do like to post one star reviews of my local petrochemical refineries, and post pictures of their latest Clean Air Act violations. It s petty, but it s the small joys in life.
*One Star* Childhood Leukemia rate too high near the Exxon plant. Marathon has a buyback program for the kid-sized mobility scooters, why can't Exxon?! Louts.
They usually relocate the refinery address deeper into the swamp in response, so people can't Google it. Lol
posted by eustatic at 7:56 PM on August 25, 2023 [17 favorites]
I do like to post one star reviews of my local petrochemical refineries, and post pictures of their latest Clean Air Act violations. It s petty, but it s the small joys in life.
*One Star* Childhood Leukemia rate too high near the Exxon plant. Marathon has a buyback program for the kid-sized mobility scooters, why can't Exxon?! Louts.
They usually relocate the refinery address deeper into the swamp in response, so people can't Google it. Lol
posted by eustatic at 7:56 PM on August 25, 2023 [17 favorites]
Surprisingly, the most effective question wasn’t about customer satisfaction or even loyalty per se. In most of the industries studied, the percentage of customers enthusiastic enough about a company to refer it to a friend or colleague directly correlated with growth rates among competitors.
So NPS rather popular, in part because "I think other people will like this, and am willing to stake my reputation on it" is a much higher bar than "I would buy it, and if it impresses you I will buy ten!" scores you get from focus panels. And it's probably not suitable for individual use, for a variety of reasons both technical and ethical.
However, lately I've come across some questionable approaches that filter out anyone who primarily uses a competitor's product. If your survey only captures people who like it enough to not switch to a competitor, the instrument more or less becomes a mixed measure of market monopolization and customer IQ -- if you are in the "detractor" category but haven't switched, why?
Other fun stories:
- How Not To Sort By Average Rating (a single 5 star review should not outrank a 4.5 average with 50 reviews behind it)
- Netflix Replacing Star Ratings With Thumbs Ups and Thumbs Downs (the more work you ask people to do for free, the less they do it and the marginal gains are Not Worth It)
- The Case Of The Mysterious Amazon Packages (amazon reviews favor verified purchases, so scammers make purchases in the name of random people and addresses so they can submit a fake 5 star "verified purchase" review).
- New Apple Podcasts Rating Prompt Artificially Boosts App Store Score (Apple's Podcast app jumps from 1.8(!) to 4.6 stars because listeners believed they were reviewing the podcast not the app)
In the software-as-a-service ecosystem, many have moved towards Task Completion / Time-on-Task as a metric to optimize. The Netflix recommender algo is tracking whether you watch the film it showed and how much. Google tracks whether you click on a search result or instead immediately run another query. eCommerce has long known to track every step of the sales funnel, but even websites like Metafilter can track bounce rate -- how likely is a visitor to spend time reading the site, click around etc. I assume Outlook 365 and Gmail are measuring how long people spend writing replies, and that is why the eerie "write my reply for me" buttons came to be.
Uber certainly has strong data on whether you made it to your destination, and probably also has enough data to measure which drivers are causing regular customers to "churn" away from the app, and how strongly causal (or not) the driver is as a factor. What I find far less certain is whether the rando data scientist did the job correctly or whether management cares or even wants the data.
posted by pwnguin at 9:32 PM on August 25, 2023 [5 favorites]
So NPS rather popular, in part because "I think other people will like this, and am willing to stake my reputation on it" is a much higher bar than "I would buy it, and if it impresses you I will buy ten!" scores you get from focus panels. And it's probably not suitable for individual use, for a variety of reasons both technical and ethical.
However, lately I've come across some questionable approaches that filter out anyone who primarily uses a competitor's product. If your survey only captures people who like it enough to not switch to a competitor, the instrument more or less becomes a mixed measure of market monopolization and customer IQ -- if you are in the "detractor" category but haven't switched, why?
Other fun stories:
- How Not To Sort By Average Rating (a single 5 star review should not outrank a 4.5 average with 50 reviews behind it)
- Netflix Replacing Star Ratings With Thumbs Ups and Thumbs Downs (the more work you ask people to do for free, the less they do it and the marginal gains are Not Worth It)
- The Case Of The Mysterious Amazon Packages (amazon reviews favor verified purchases, so scammers make purchases in the name of random people and addresses so they can submit a fake 5 star "verified purchase" review).
- New Apple Podcasts Rating Prompt Artificially Boosts App Store Score (Apple's Podcast app jumps from 1.8(!) to 4.6 stars because listeners believed they were reviewing the podcast not the app)
In the software-as-a-service ecosystem, many have moved towards Task Completion / Time-on-Task as a metric to optimize. The Netflix recommender algo is tracking whether you watch the film it showed and how much. Google tracks whether you click on a search result or instead immediately run another query. eCommerce has long known to track every step of the sales funnel, but even websites like Metafilter can track bounce rate -- how likely is a visitor to spend time reading the site, click around etc. I assume Outlook 365 and Gmail are measuring how long people spend writing replies, and that is why the eerie "write my reply for me" buttons came to be.
Uber certainly has strong data on whether you made it to your destination, and probably also has enough data to measure which drivers are causing regular customers to "churn" away from the app, and how strongly causal (or not) the driver is as a factor. What I find far less certain is whether the rando data scientist did the job correctly or whether management cares or even wants the data.
posted by pwnguin at 9:32 PM on August 25, 2023 [5 favorites]
Having worked in the hotel business for twenty years, I'll be fucking shot before I fill out any goddamned survey.
posted by oldnumberseven at 3:54 AM on August 26, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by oldnumberseven at 3:54 AM on August 26, 2023 [3 favorites]
This is exactly the way Mussolini got the trains to run "on time," isn't it?
posted by Western Infidels at 6:21 AM on August 26, 2023
posted by Western Infidels at 6:21 AM on August 26, 2023
I learned all about the 4 == 0 rule when it was explained to me that in our (large corporation) annual survey of management, anything less than the top mark was essentially the lowest mark. This would greatly increase the chances your manager would be sent to "Charm School". So unless you wished your manager to be replaced by someone potentially worse, you gave them all top marks.
The survey was eventually dropped, partially because they stopped caring what employees thought about anything and partially because the results were useless. But mostly the former.
posted by tommasz at 7:01 AM on August 26, 2023 [1 favorite]
The survey was eventually dropped, partially because they stopped caring what employees thought about anything and partially because the results were useless. But mostly the former.
posted by tommasz at 7:01 AM on August 26, 2023 [1 favorite]
I even put a unique, effusive comment in every single comment field for each of them because you just never know if someone might actually read the things.
This is vaguely apropos of my experience as a semi-perennial member of my university department's personnel committee (they keep tapping me because it's a ton of work and I'm a sap who never says "no"). Our annual merit review is a memo which is a distillation of the candidate's (self-reported) activities that year. It is mostly a matter of putting the numbers they submitted into a fairly formulaic letter (e.g. "Professor Z had three independent study students in two courses. They submitted four papers to peer-reviewed journals, two of which were accepted in the period under review"). There are two places where we can/do express our opinion, as a rule. One is in a conclusory note, at least one sentence, between the listing of accomplishments and the numeric merit rating. The other is the merit rating itself (more on that below).
Anyways, some of my colleagues on the committee don't bother with the conclusory note, which irks me, because, dude, other than that and the merit rating (and maybe not the merit rating either) the job of writing these letters could be done by an intelligent mail-merge program. I always try to come up with something nice or at least interesting to say. Fortunately there are no colleagues I actively dislike, so I don't have to ever tie myself in knots to be nice, but there are some I just don't know all that well. Like, I've exchanged maybe a dozen words with them in the past decade and they're in a research area far from my own. I have to look at their own brag sheet and try to come up with a distillation of the things they describe there that would reflect their value to the department in a unique way that I couldn't say about anyone else. I'm not sure anyone ever reads these notes, but writing them feels like a significant part of the job.
So, about that merit rating. We have a scale from 0 to 3 associated with specific names ("nonproficient", "proficient", "highly proficient", and "expectional"). I've heard rumors that there are departments which, taking a page from the 5-star system, just give everyone a 3. In my department we at least try to differentiate. In my whole career, I've never seen anyone get a zero. A zero is a bonafide call for disciplinary action, as I understand it, and even when we've been unhappy with someone's performance we do not, as a rule, want to involve higher administration. Concerns are usually raised via a "1" and a caution in the conclusory-note field. For most members of the personnel committee, however, the range from 1 to 3 has been almost entirely a matter of paper productivity, with grad-student advising as a secondary consideration. Have lots of papers and students? 3. Have none? 1. This incidentally means that historically adjunct and instructional faculty have gotten a "1" no matter what (including the adjunct who did publish just because they liked doing research; if it's not on your workplan, you don't get credit). This has changed somewhat: we have an instructor who is absolutely instrumental to our general education courses, who puts in huge investments of time to manage a number of educational grants, without whose service absolutely none of us would be able to manage the assessments, courseware, and other administrative duties associated with low-level, large-lecture classes, and the personnel committee seems to have recognized that, hey, that's "2" work, right?
Anyways, rating systems are bad but I'm not sure what's less bad. It's well established that pretty much anything you use to measure subjective quality eventually becomes meaningless by virtue of being measured (and the subject's awareness of it being measured), so it's hard to get really angry about the terrible state of quality metrics so much as disappointed.
posted by jackbishop at 7:42 AM on August 26, 2023 [3 favorites]
This is vaguely apropos of my experience as a semi-perennial member of my university department's personnel committee (they keep tapping me because it's a ton of work and I'm a sap who never says "no"). Our annual merit review is a memo which is a distillation of the candidate's (self-reported) activities that year. It is mostly a matter of putting the numbers they submitted into a fairly formulaic letter (e.g. "Professor Z had three independent study students in two courses. They submitted four papers to peer-reviewed journals, two of which were accepted in the period under review"). There are two places where we can/do express our opinion, as a rule. One is in a conclusory note, at least one sentence, between the listing of accomplishments and the numeric merit rating. The other is the merit rating itself (more on that below).
Anyways, some of my colleagues on the committee don't bother with the conclusory note, which irks me, because, dude, other than that and the merit rating (and maybe not the merit rating either) the job of writing these letters could be done by an intelligent mail-merge program. I always try to come up with something nice or at least interesting to say. Fortunately there are no colleagues I actively dislike, so I don't have to ever tie myself in knots to be nice, but there are some I just don't know all that well. Like, I've exchanged maybe a dozen words with them in the past decade and they're in a research area far from my own. I have to look at their own brag sheet and try to come up with a distillation of the things they describe there that would reflect their value to the department in a unique way that I couldn't say about anyone else. I'm not sure anyone ever reads these notes, but writing them feels like a significant part of the job.
So, about that merit rating. We have a scale from 0 to 3 associated with specific names ("nonproficient", "proficient", "highly proficient", and "expectional"). I've heard rumors that there are departments which, taking a page from the 5-star system, just give everyone a 3. In my department we at least try to differentiate. In my whole career, I've never seen anyone get a zero. A zero is a bonafide call for disciplinary action, as I understand it, and even when we've been unhappy with someone's performance we do not, as a rule, want to involve higher administration. Concerns are usually raised via a "1" and a caution in the conclusory-note field. For most members of the personnel committee, however, the range from 1 to 3 has been almost entirely a matter of paper productivity, with grad-student advising as a secondary consideration. Have lots of papers and students? 3. Have none? 1. This incidentally means that historically adjunct and instructional faculty have gotten a "1" no matter what (including the adjunct who did publish just because they liked doing research; if it's not on your workplan, you don't get credit). This has changed somewhat: we have an instructor who is absolutely instrumental to our general education courses, who puts in huge investments of time to manage a number of educational grants, without whose service absolutely none of us would be able to manage the assessments, courseware, and other administrative duties associated with low-level, large-lecture classes, and the personnel committee seems to have recognized that, hey, that's "2" work, right?
Anyways, rating systems are bad but I'm not sure what's less bad. It's well established that pretty much anything you use to measure subjective quality eventually becomes meaningless by virtue of being measured (and the subject's awareness of it being measured), so it's hard to get really angry about the terrible state of quality metrics so much as disappointed.
posted by jackbishop at 7:42 AM on August 26, 2023 [3 favorites]
Oh, a followup on the annual-review bit. I mentioned it could be done by mail-merge, and I actually set up a fairly sophisticated LaTeX* template where you insert numbers and, poof, annual review. I have placeholder values so that the template compiles, and the placeholder I have for the conclusory note is "Professor \profname is awesome and we love them." because I'm silly and that's the sort of tone (albeit more specific) that I want to be reaching for.
As mentioned previously, the conclusory notes are the really hard part of the review, so I leave them for last after completing everything else. At this point a lot of you are probably already seeing that this story ends with me forgetting to go back and come up with a heartfelt comment to replace it, resulting in a mildly bewildered colleague calling me up and asking why their merit review contained a confession of love.
*No, we don't do a lot of equations in our annual reviews, but we're a math department. We use LaTeX for everything.
posted by jackbishop at 7:51 AM on August 26, 2023 [4 favorites]
As mentioned previously, the conclusory notes are the really hard part of the review, so I leave them for last after completing everything else. At this point a lot of you are probably already seeing that this story ends with me forgetting to go back and come up with a heartfelt comment to replace it, resulting in a mildly bewildered colleague calling me up and asking why their merit review contained a confession of love.
*No, we don't do a lot of equations in our annual reviews, but we're a math department. We use LaTeX for everything.
posted by jackbishop at 7:51 AM on August 26, 2023 [4 favorites]
I spent the last half of my career in Quality Management and my primary line on this is that processes fail, not people, and invariably 'managers' using these metrics are more focused on using them to measure people instead of the performance of their processes.
Anecdote: Last week my meal service box was delivered a day late by UPS and by that time the contents had warmed up enough that I was uncomfortable eating some of them. I called the HelloFresh and they credited me for the whole box. I figured (and told the agent) that the box probably just got loaded on the wrong truck and my food spent the day in a hot truck. The shipping label has some scribbling on it that I'm pretty sure would be interesting for the UPS depot to look at if they honestly wanted to examine their processes, but I'm afraid if I give them the info that they need to really investigate it what will end up happening is that the loaders and driver might get a ding and living in the boonies I depend on these folks and don't want them punished for a process problem. So I didn't send any additional info.
After reading TFA I'm in the "Everybody earns top score" camp.
Bonus: Like when the nurse asks your pain level on a scale of 1 to 10.
Everywhere I've seen that question asked there's a graphic around that explains what they are using. They use faces and/or qualitative descriptors to guide your choice. This article explains a number of them.
posted by achrise at 8:31 AM on August 26, 2023 [2 favorites]
Anecdote: Last week my meal service box was delivered a day late by UPS and by that time the contents had warmed up enough that I was uncomfortable eating some of them. I called the HelloFresh and they credited me for the whole box. I figured (and told the agent) that the box probably just got loaded on the wrong truck and my food spent the day in a hot truck. The shipping label has some scribbling on it that I'm pretty sure would be interesting for the UPS depot to look at if they honestly wanted to examine their processes, but I'm afraid if I give them the info that they need to really investigate it what will end up happening is that the loaders and driver might get a ding and living in the boonies I depend on these folks and don't want them punished for a process problem. So I didn't send any additional info.
After reading TFA I'm in the "Everybody earns top score" camp.
Bonus: Like when the nurse asks your pain level on a scale of 1 to 10.
Everywhere I've seen that question asked there's a graphic around that explains what they are using. They use faces and/or qualitative descriptors to guide your choice. This article explains a number of them.
posted by achrise at 8:31 AM on August 26, 2023 [2 favorites]
Like when the nurse asks your pain level on a scale of 1 to 10.
Wittgenstein at the Doctor!
posted by jackbishop at 8:34 AM on August 26, 2023 [7 favorites]
Wittgenstein at the Doctor!
posted by jackbishop at 8:34 AM on August 26, 2023 [7 favorites]
80-some comments, so it's probably not bad if I jump in impulsively without looking at TFA or even scanning the thread.
Just musing on the pull quote in OP while making tea, I was struck by what is lost to English-speakers by our Taliban tradition of Biblical interpretation that wants to make of the whole Bible a personal message from God to Us, about how we ought to live our private lives. Which completely elides the Hebrew Bible's role as "accumulated cultural wisdom of a whole society" and ignores its value as advice to rulers about how to run things.
Because we would be in much less bad shape as a society, if that last part got more attention of the sort that wants to emulate wise behavior.
posted by Aardvark Cheeselog at 9:09 AM on August 26, 2023
Just musing on the pull quote in OP while making tea, I was struck by what is lost to English-speakers by our Taliban tradition of Biblical interpretation that wants to make of the whole Bible a personal message from God to Us, about how we ought to live our private lives. Which completely elides the Hebrew Bible's role as "accumulated cultural wisdom of a whole society" and ignores its value as advice to rulers about how to run things.
Because we would be in much less bad shape as a society, if that last part got more attention of the sort that wants to emulate wise behavior.
posted by Aardvark Cheeselog at 9:09 AM on August 26, 2023
[ insert "the only winning move" quote here ]
The only time I fill out a survey or rate a product is if it was a seriously bad experience worthy of honest ire, a specific deficiency such as a product that broke/wore out too soon/didn't do what it was supposed to, or a seriously unpleasant meal. You'll get 1 star from me or nothing at all. (But I'll tip normally unless the waiter was specifically bad; I won't punish them for things outside their personal control.)
The first time I encountered a little device at the exit of a small convenience store in an airport petitioning me to rate the experience of purchasing a single carbonated beverage - on a scale of a frowny face to a smiley face, no less - I physically recoiled. I don't believe it registered my single-finger sentiment.
Any email from a business relating to feedback or additional offers immediately gets Google Mail's "mark as spam and unsubscribe" button. God I love that thing.
All the above is very different from favoriting comments and posts on Metafilter. I'm happy to give a Warm Fuzzy to any individual that makes me laugh or makes a cogent point (or both)!
None of this is bragging - just an observation that my life is better and happier for avoiding the whole rating thing. And because fuck the bastards, let 'em figure their business out on their own or fail, I don't really care.
posted by Greg_Ace at 1:19 PM on August 26, 2023
The only time I fill out a survey or rate a product is if it was a seriously bad experience worthy of honest ire, a specific deficiency such as a product that broke/wore out too soon/didn't do what it was supposed to, or a seriously unpleasant meal. You'll get 1 star from me or nothing at all. (But I'll tip normally unless the waiter was specifically bad; I won't punish them for things outside their personal control.)
The first time I encountered a little device at the exit of a small convenience store in an airport petitioning me to rate the experience of purchasing a single carbonated beverage - on a scale of a frowny face to a smiley face, no less - I physically recoiled. I don't believe it registered my single-finger sentiment.
Any email from a business relating to feedback or additional offers immediately gets Google Mail's "mark as spam and unsubscribe" button. God I love that thing.
All the above is very different from favoriting comments and posts on Metafilter. I'm happy to give a Warm Fuzzy to any individual that makes me laugh or makes a cogent point (or both)!
None of this is bragging - just an observation that my life is better and happier for avoiding the whole rating thing. And because fuck the bastards, let 'em figure their business out on their own or fail, I don't really care.
posted by Greg_Ace at 1:19 PM on August 26, 2023
A previous time on task based job had daily surveys about the work environment and such. Invariably, each and every time the 'everything is perfect ' answer was on top, in the same place, and quickest to hit. But I guess that's what happens when you want to trumpet a number and not get actual feedback...
And oh god, the number of designs from Above that had no bearing on reality on the floor. "On paper this works!" Yeah, great, but I do this shit daily. Either someone is doing things differently, or your math is terrible or highly optimistic, or forgot to account for things like distance. It doesn't*&$# work most of the time! I'd be thrilled to say it works! I'm not complaining about the New Method just because I don't like change!
posted by Jacen at 3:51 PM on August 26, 2023
And oh god, the number of designs from Above that had no bearing on reality on the floor. "On paper this works!" Yeah, great, but I do this shit daily. Either someone is doing things differently, or your math is terrible or highly optimistic, or forgot to account for things like distance. It doesn't*&$# work most of the time! I'd be thrilled to say it works! I'm not complaining about the New Method just because I don't like change!
posted by Jacen at 3:51 PM on August 26, 2023
I've got enough trips to ER now that I can describe pain relative to past events. Like "this hurts more than the time I sliced my hand open and needed 7 stitches but not as much as the time I gave my self a loonie sized second degree burn". Probably none of that stuff rates more than a six though on the standard scale.
posted by Mitheral at 5:38 PM on August 26, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by Mitheral at 5:38 PM on August 26, 2023 [2 favorites]
I think the 1-5 ratings scale (where 3 is allegedly 'average') collapsing into a de facto 3-5 rating scale, where 3 is in reality "unspeakably dangerous, a hazard to themselves and others, quite possibly an actual serial killer using our workplace to stalk their victims", is not as American or even related to US business culture as some people seem to assume.
The most damning-with-faint-praise stuff I've ever read has been in German reference letters, aka Arbeitszeugnis. At least in most of (??) Germany, employers are required to produce an Arbeitszeugnis on request, and there's a fair amount of legal exposure involved if they say anything negative. So even if your job performance was absolutely abysmal and you set the CEO's car on fire, your Arbeitszeugnis will probably just say that you "made an effort to meet [our] requirements". This terminology effectively conveys to a knowledgable reader all they need to know, but skirts around the liability that might be created by saying flat-out "this person should be in Brazil apologizing to the rainforest for the oxygen they have misused", even if that's what's being said.
Within large companies in the US there are often similar rules. An evaluation of 3/5 that notes than an employee is "competent" and has "good relationships with their peers" might be enough to end their career.
More often though, it seems to lead to well-meaning managers who want to see their subordinates succeed resort to increasingly florid descriptions for their good conduct. When you know that 3 of 5 is "absolute failure", 4 is "adequate, do not fire today", and 5 is "consider for 3% raise", the question then becomes how you actually call out those employees who are actually doing more than average? If your manager isn't good at making it sound like you're the Second Coming in a polo shirt come to deliver the world from sin via your Microsoft Excel skills, well, you're career is going to suffer.
And so the very processes put in place to make performance-measurement more "objective" actually turn out to make your career path depend terrifyingly on your immediate manager's English composition and creative writing skills.
posted by Kadin2048 at 10:45 PM on August 26, 2023 [5 favorites]
The most damning-with-faint-praise stuff I've ever read has been in German reference letters, aka Arbeitszeugnis. At least in most of (??) Germany, employers are required to produce an Arbeitszeugnis on request, and there's a fair amount of legal exposure involved if they say anything negative. So even if your job performance was absolutely abysmal and you set the CEO's car on fire, your Arbeitszeugnis will probably just say that you "made an effort to meet [our] requirements". This terminology effectively conveys to a knowledgable reader all they need to know, but skirts around the liability that might be created by saying flat-out "this person should be in Brazil apologizing to the rainforest for the oxygen they have misused", even if that's what's being said.
Within large companies in the US there are often similar rules. An evaluation of 3/5 that notes than an employee is "competent" and has "good relationships with their peers" might be enough to end their career.
More often though, it seems to lead to well-meaning managers who want to see their subordinates succeed resort to increasingly florid descriptions for their good conduct. When you know that 3 of 5 is "absolute failure", 4 is "adequate, do not fire today", and 5 is "consider for 3% raise", the question then becomes how you actually call out those employees who are actually doing more than average? If your manager isn't good at making it sound like you're the Second Coming in a polo shirt come to deliver the world from sin via your Microsoft Excel skills, well, you're career is going to suffer.
And so the very processes put in place to make performance-measurement more "objective" actually turn out to make your career path depend terrifyingly on your immediate manager's English composition and creative writing skills.
posted by Kadin2048 at 10:45 PM on August 26, 2023 [5 favorites]
I wonder how true the claim that five stars is the only thing that protects the driver. I had a Lyft driver who drove the wrong way on a one way street to avoid a long detour.
I gave him a 3 star rating and told Lyft there was a safety issue and explained about the one way street. Lyft didn't say they fired him (who knows what they actually did), they just said they wouldn't pair me with him again.
posted by Nancy Lebovitz at 8:27 PM on September 6, 2023
I gave him a 3 star rating and told Lyft there was a safety issue and explained about the one way street. Lyft didn't say they fired him (who knows what they actually did), they just said they wouldn't pair me with him again.
posted by Nancy Lebovitz at 8:27 PM on September 6, 2023
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posted by not_on_display at 9:34 AM on August 25, 2023