And the Lord said, "Defraud people using cryptocurrency."

January 23, 2024 6:04 PM

A Denver Pastor who runs Victorious Grace Church has been civily indicted on fraud for selling INDXcoin which cannot be cashed out. “One of two things have happened,” Mr. Regalado said, “One: Either I misheard God and every one of you who prayed and came in, you as well, or two: God is still not done with this project and he’s going to do a new thing.” Gift link via NYTimes.
posted by Word_Salad (64 comments total)

Ah, the old "misheard God" defense. Of course, if god is omniscient it wouldn't be possible to misunderstand, would it?
posted by Literaryhero at 6:05 PM on January 23 [7 favorites]

Can God create a currency system so complex that even He cannot understand how it works?
posted by dannyboybell at 6:11 PM on January 23 [79 favorites]

They didn't even bother to find out. Just threw some code together and started preaching. Grifters gotta grift, one way or another...
posted by Windopaene at 6:13 PM on January 23 [2 favorites]

God is so good to provide cover for shit heels.
posted by drewbage1847 at 6:18 PM on January 23 [3 favorites]

"Render unto [INDXcoin] that which belongs to [INDXcoin]."
posted by abraxasaxarba at 6:20 PM on January 23 [5 favorites]

It violates my sincerely held religious beliefs to question why God told me to rob that bank. Therefore you may not question it, your honor.
posted by allegedly at 6:21 PM on January 23 [13 favorites]

And yet, no criminal charges.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 6:29 PM on January 23 [7 favorites]

if i recall correctly some critic, i forget who, said that the pardoner is the only character in chaucer's canterbury tales who is a genuine lost soul, irredeemable, someone who has done things from which one can never come back. what did the pardoner do? well, he went from place to place and town to town selling fake indulgences ("hey peasants! if you buy one of these pieces of paper that i totally 100% got from the pope like the actual pope in rome and everything then your sins will be forgiven) and random bits and pieces of bones as relics of saints. the pardoner is, at least in the company of travelers he doesn't know and won't ever see again after the pilgrimage, utterly open about what he's doing and why. if i recall correctly, in the prologue to his tale the pardoner says something like:

for myn entente is nat but for to wynne
and nothyng for correcioun of sinne
i rekke never, whan that they been beryed
though that hir soules goon a'blackberyed

which is to say he just wants money and it doesn't what happens to the people he scams, they can die and go to hell for all he cares. needless to say, it is immediately apparent that it is the pardoner's own soul that's out there a'blackberying.
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 6:32 PM on January 23 [20 favorites]

“[The prosecutors] have to do this,” he said. “I mean, if you think about this: We sold a cryptocurrency with no clear exit. We did. We took God at his word and sold a cryptocurrency with no clear exit.”

Is he blaming God?
posted by qxntpqbbbqxl at 6:36 PM on January 23 [21 favorites]

anyway this guy should be denied access to the communion token, because doing ecclesiastical rugpulls is the ne plus ultra of sins against the holy ghost
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 6:37 PM on January 23 [6 favorites]

dear god I hate the prosperity gospel with every fiber of my being
posted by cnidaria at 6:41 PM on January 23 [39 favorites]

To be fair, "God told me that people who buy crypto deserve to be ripped off" passes the sniff test.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:41 PM on January 23 [24 favorites]

Should’ve called it INRI instead.
posted by aramaic at 6:41 PM on January 23 [40 favorites]

Goobers and grifts, an endless source of amusement...
posted by jim in austin at 6:43 PM on January 23 [2 favorites]

Mammon mia, let me go
Beelzebub has a coin put aside for me, for me, for me....
posted by clavdivs at 6:43 PM on January 23 [11 favorites]

People turn to religion for comfort and clarity, and it really pisses me off when someone decides to leverage that vulnerability for their private gain.
posted by wenestvedt at 6:52 PM on January 23 [23 favorites]

Wondering how Jesus would upend the virtual merchants' tables in the temple of cryptocurrency. It's the very definition of a "den of thieves".
posted by vverse23 at 7:03 PM on January 23 [11 favorites]

this dude blinks a lot
posted by clawsoon at 7:03 PM on January 23 [5 favorites]

Is he blaming God?

It's God's Fault We Lost The Game
posted by clawsoon at 7:06 PM on January 23 [4 favorites]

Selling a cryptocurrency with no clear exit is just selling coupons of investment that hold the bearer zero benefit, right?

It's like selling a pretty decorated coupon to raise money. You sell the thing, you get the money, there is no chance that the thing you've sold can be exchanged back for money.

Is the problem with this that they were promising that it could be turned back into money? If that's the problem, then that's fraud and is easy to prosecute.

If they weren't promising the money could come back out, then there is no fraud and the sheep were well fleeced. And that's a shame, but is not against the law.

I read the article and cannot tell if there was a promise of return in any way.

I will say, raising over 3 million dollars off of around 300 people is one fucking hell of a fleece, and at that point I'd just change my name and disappear into central america.
posted by hippybear at 7:07 PM on January 23 [9 favorites]

It's God's Fault We Lost The Game

How many out there just lost The Game?
posted by hippybear at 7:07 PM on January 23 [15 favorites]

> I will say, raising over 3 million dollars off of around 300 people is one fucking hell of a fleece, and at that point I'd just change my name and disappear into central america.

there are worse places for one's soul to go a'blackberrying in but i don't think i'd feel terribly comfortable with my wealth were it obtained by those means and i don't think you would either
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 7:23 PM on January 23 [3 favorites]

> How many out there just lost The Game?

you talking about losing the game has resulted in my brain following a series of tangents and tl;dr as a result i just had to reset my "it has been ____ days since i've thought about the roman empire" sign again
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 7:25 PM on January 23 [6 favorites]

i don't think i'd feel terribly comfortable with my wealth were it obtained by those means and i don't think you would either

Neither of us are the subject of this thread, so we're both safe.
posted by hippybear at 7:27 PM on January 23 [3 favorites]

dogecoin = eGodCoin
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 7:29 PM on January 23 [19 favorites]

He said that God had once come to him a dream and asked him to do so

was much younger than this Regalado fellow when i learned that many things seen in dreams are not to be acted upon

i wanted to screw some of those things; this guy just wanted to screw his parishioners
posted by armoir from antproof case at 7:30 PM on January 23

And yet, no criminal charges.

We make these gangsters tax-exempt. As it ever was.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 7:30 PM on January 23 [7 favorites]

he and his wife spent the funds in “a home remodel that the Lord told us to do.”

Well this is huge if true! Probably should install a Ring in the new home theater in case that's where He decides to make his second coming.
posted by credulous at 7:46 PM on January 23 [2 favorites]

I am playing a game as the Roman Empire, Carthage is kicking my ass. Other than that, I am not thinking about the Roman Empire. Can't afford more legions...
posted by Windopaene at 7:47 PM on January 23 [1 favorite]

If you're Trump's age, you can't afford any more lesions.
posted by hippybear at 7:51 PM on January 23 [3 favorites]

I am not yet TFG's age, thank you very much.

Yet, I have many lesions. "Senior tattoos" my dermatologist said...
posted by Windopaene at 8:17 PM on January 23 [1 favorite]

Wait you mean to tell me a ‘man of God’ LIED??
posted by chronkite at 8:24 PM on January 23 [5 favorites]

Depends what you mean by "lie". It's possible that he truly believes that everything that makes him feel good is the voice of God.
posted by clawsoon at 8:27 PM on January 23 [1 favorite]

Somewhere at the intersection of distributed consensus transaction algorithms and throwing the merchants and money changers out of the Temple there is an amazing doctoral thesis on the intersection of computing and religion.

This guy isn’t mentioned in it though.
posted by mhoye at 8:29 PM on January 23 [2 favorites]

Oh, the old "god is real" ploy.
posted by metametamind at 8:46 PM on January 23 [4 favorites]

i don't think i'd feel terribly comfortable with my wealth were it obtained by those means and i don't think you would either

...I dunno, how many of them were god-bothering Trumpies? If that were the main target, I might actually feel good about ripping them off. I'd claim it is a mitzvah to deprive Evil of money.

Shiiiiiiiiit, maybe I should make an INRI coin. Or you can. Either way is fine with me.
posted by aramaic at 9:14 PM on January 23 [2 favorites]

If I were God, I wouldn't much appreciate the way this guy is trying to throw me under the bus.
posted by angrynerd at 9:19 PM on January 23 [9 favorites]

I'm not really a Pascal's wager kinda guy, but if I was, I'd think "blaming God for investment performance" is a sure way to lose
posted by credulous at 9:25 PM on January 23 [7 favorites]

I'm surprised that this particular crypto scam wasn't Miami-based. Before FTX went boom you could hardly walk a block anywhere in town without someone trying to get you to buy some rando coin and it ain't like there's no prosperity gospel fucks skulking around the county.
posted by wierdo at 9:57 PM on January 23 [1 favorite]

If they weren't promising the money could come back out, then there is no fraud and the sheep were well fleeced.

From the article: "Mr. Regalado said that because of problems with the cryptocurrency exchange, investors could not take their money out."

Well, that's straightforwardly a lie. The money isn't "in" the currency, or "in" the exchange. It's in his wallet, and his home remodel. It's the same model as pig butchering scams except he used a real exchange and a fake currency, rather than a fake exchange with pretend Bitcoin.
posted by BungaDunga at 10:32 PM on January 23 [1 favorite]

dear god I hate the prosperity gospel with every fiber of my being

God wouldn't appear to be a great fan of it either: Matthew 6:11.
posted by Cardinal Fang at 1:13 AM on January 24 [2 favorites]

words of advice for young people
posted by flabdablet at 1:31 AM on January 24 [1 favorite]

Functionally how is this any different than all those other preachers who live in lavish luxury funded by the donations/tithes/etc of their congregants?
posted by star gentle uterus at 2:30 AM on January 24 [3 favorites]

Functionally how is this any different than all those other preachers who live in lavish luxury funded by the donations/tithes/etc of their congregants?

Those congregants were giving their money away. They might have been defrauded, because they thought the money was going to a better cause, but they intended to donate the funds.

The victims in this case were making an investment with hope of financial returns. Meaning this was money they didn't intend and likely can't afford to simply lose.
posted by The Manwich Horror at 4:17 AM on January 24 [7 favorites]

With the whole water-into-wine thing under his belt, you’d think Jesus would be good at creating liquidity.
posted by dr_dank at 4:32 AM on January 24 [10 favorites]

The thing about this story that eludes me is whether Regalado started this as a pure rugpull or whether he had the usual raft of delusional ideas about crypto, that he could raise a couple of million dollars, skim out 2/3 of it but that it would still generate enough income to pay investors. I mean, it ends up in the same place, but the broad and easy path has slightly different scenery.
posted by GenjiandProust at 4:36 AM on January 24 [3 favorites]

Is he blaming God?

He certainly seems to be admitting, publicly, that he did what the prosecutors say he did.
posted by Gelatin at 4:43 AM on January 24 [3 favorites]

I will say, raising over 3 million dollars off of around 300 people is one fucking hell of a fleece, and at that point I'd just change my name and disappear into central america.

Why bother uprooting your life? If you flee the country, there's still a pretty decent chance you get caught and extradited, with the added complication of "fleeing to a country without an extradition treaty is not a good look for the jury." Whereas if you just take the $3 million from the parish, there's a better-than-even chance that you can just sit on the witness stand and, with a straight face, tell the judge that the sky wizard told you to do it, and they'll drop the charges.
posted by Mayor West at 5:12 AM on January 24 [2 favorites]

Re: the whole "misheard God" thing.

As a pastor creeping up on two decades in full-time church leadership. At least four times per year I have a full-blown failure in ministry. Something like, I plan a reading/public lecture series with a field trip at the end, or a recovery group, or a novel worship service or whatever. I invest hours or days in prep.
And *nobody shows up.*

This is when my process theology kicks in. Frustrated, I tearfully cry out to Hashem. "Why did you ask me to do this? Why did you put this upon my heart, O Lord? I thought it would work?!"

And the Lord God replies, "Um. Yeah, me too little buddy. Damn. People, huh? I totally thought that would be a hit, sorry about that."

And I respond, "Fuck, dude. Like seriously just a heads-up that we're flying blind on this stuff next time, okay?"

And Adonai is usually like, "Cool cool, 10-4."
posted by Baby_Balrog at 5:36 AM on January 24 [29 favorites]

In the Book of Exodus, the narrator says that the plagues of Egypt we're necessary because "The LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart" so he would not let the Israelite slaves leave Egypt.

So what I hope this means is that God is still working up to the kill-all-the-firstborn stage of utterly humiliating and destroying every form of cryptocurrency until it makes one final comeback attempt and God drowns all of the blockchain's horses and chariots and chariot drivers in the Red Sea.

Somebody ask Pope Francis if I'm interpreting all this correctly.
posted by straight at 8:13 AM on January 24

Mammon mia, let me go
Beelzebub has a coin put aside for me, for me, for me....

Oh Lord, heal this blockchain.

anyway this guy should be denied access to the communion token

Looks like he's one of them Protestant heretics so that dog won't hunt, b.l.p.
posted by The Ardship of Cambry at 9:10 AM on January 24 [2 favorites]

I am playing a game as the Roman Empire, Carthage is kicking my ass. Other than that, I am not thinking about the Roman Empire. Can't afford more legions...

What game??? Civilization? Cause by far the best game I ever played on that was as Carthage kicking ever loving hell out of the Romans and taking over nearly all the world.

Can God create a currency system so complex that even He cannot understand how it works?. This is so so very good... top one hundred humor comments on the blue?

Prosperity preachers = the Righteous Gemstones all the way down...
posted by WatTylerJr at 9:54 AM on January 24

No not Civ. A deck-building wargame about the First Punic war, Hands in the Sea.

And my opponent conceded, even though he was winning. I'm doing better this game.
posted by Windopaene at 10:12 AM on January 24 [1 favorite]

Is he blaming God?

No, he's celebrating both God's mysteriousness and his own faith, however humble and imperfect, in the unknowable loving majesty of the Lord.

Like Noah, he heeds the call of God to create those things which God demands be created; INDXcoin, like the Ark, is a vehicle meant to carry His faithful though they can not make sense of it themselves and though its meaning and purpose may be unclear. Like Noah's passengers, INDXcoin hodl-ers may question their faith as they float on an endless sea after all they've known before has been drowned and washed away by strange waters God himself called down. But a dove will fly, a rainbow will shine, and they must have faith that one day the waters of financial uncertainty will recede and their ship will set down at the dry and blessed summit of Mt. Gox.

Like Job, he is a faithful man being tested; like Job's family, his investors are, if stricken by the will of the Lord, all the more uplifted in His light for being the vehicle of this grand demonstration of faith.

Which is why, Your Honor, my client would like to be granted the same grace and clemency that God Himself would ask us to extend to one another in all things. Furthermore, the defense will show that—
posted by cortex at 10:35 AM on January 24 [7 favorites]

Functionally how is this any different than all those other preachers who live in lavish luxury funded by the donations/tithes/etc of their congregants?

A little more number theory
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 10:35 AM on January 24

*searches for Oral Roberts and doesn't find a mention*

I guess crypto is the new "give me money or god will kill me"?
posted by luckynerd at 11:24 AM on January 24 [1 favorite]

I was reading the article before going to sleep last night and had to read some of Regalado's quotes to my wife because they were too good.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 12:16 PM on January 24

Matt Levine adds his 2 cts.: Pastor Got His Crypto Scam Audited
posted by chavenet at 12:23 PM on January 24 [3 favorites]

> Looks like he's one of them Protestant heretics so that dog won't hunt, b.l.p.

yeah probably i should have went with a joke about, i don't know, the practice of shunning? in order to be more schismatically accurate it's just i think it's super funny to talk about communion wafers as if they were dao governance tokens
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 3:28 PM on January 24 [1 favorite]

a dove will fly, a rainbow will shine, and they must have faith that one day the waters of financial uncertainty will recede and their ship will set down at the dry and blessed summit of Mt. Gox.

After years of bureaucratic fuckaboutery, MtGox has finally paid out my cut of what the administrators managed to recover from the Karpeles rugpull.

Way back when, I had set up a Bitcoin client and wallet on my own laptop, signed up for a MtGox account, and used it to buy 10BTC for AU$600. Bitcoin struck me as an interesting design exercise, I wanted to play with it to see how well it actually functioned both as a working currency and as a store of value, and $600 was an amount I could easily afford to lose.

Which is of course exactly what happened. The 8BTC in my laptop wallet were rendered inaccessible by my failure to keep my Bitcoin peer in working order over OS rebuilds and Bitcoin protocol changes, the piddling little fraction of a Bitcoin I'd left in MtGox's hands got stolen, and that was that.

Or so I thought. But as it turns out, the recovered fraction of that piddling little fraction has recently landed in my bank account in the form of about AU$850. So I have no complaints - that's roughly what the original $600 would have been worth if I'd just put it in a term deposit to begin with.

Buying cryptocurrency in recent years, though, does not count as boarding the Ark before the Flood; that ship has sailed. The only tickets remaining on offer are for unseaworthy decommissioned fishing boats already overloaded with desperate financial refugees.
posted by flabdablet at 4:50 PM on January 24 [3 favorites]

Should’ve called it INRI instead.

That would've required some basic level of familiarity with the not-the-Prosperity-Gospel version of Christianity.
posted by Flunkie at 8:47 PM on January 25 [4 favorites]

If I were God, I wouldn't much appreciate the way this guy is trying to throw me under the bus.

Well then You probably should've thought of that before You decided to tell him to defraud his parishioners.
posted by Flunkie at 8:53 PM on January 25 [2 favorites]

God doesn't do before, that's for humans.
posted by clavdivs at 9:16 PM on January 25 [1 favorite]

When you are a greedy awful person, a classic Bad Guy in other words, God has no problem giving you plenty of leeway to freely sin as much as you are inclined to.

It's part of the whole deal of being Onstage - ie, a living human being on Earth. Everything is a test.

Plus there are lots of liars, especially in the Bad Christians department, especially in the leadership department, especially when money is involved.

It's all good, for this guy's Judgment when he gets backstage, God's going to do the literal facepalm to him in person so he feels like shit about his stupid suppositions about what God wanted him to do. Then all the Angels in God's Gallery will laugh at what an idiot this guy was, and how obvious it is that God's true messages are about caring for the least among you and the poor. God will stamp his file "UNCLEAR ON THE CONCEPT" and send him to a suitable Simulation for his After.

Honestly, seeing God personally facepalm at you during your (very public) Judgment has *got* to be worse than the Hellfire idea (which is not actually a thing, just a nightmarish rumor). Dude might want to petition for a Great Forgetting so he can overcome the sheer amount of shame the consequences for his idiocy entailed so he can move forward as space dust or something suitable for such a person.

I don't know, I have some recommendations for God.
posted by cats are weird at 4:09 AM on January 26