This comes on the heels of a lengthy campaign to criminalize homosexuality in Uganda. Previously 123. posted by hippybear at 2:22 PM on January 27, 2011 [5 favorites]
This link is paywalled... posted by Hairy Lobster at 2:23 PM on January 27, 2011
Not paywalled, just login-walled. You can use bugmenot if you don't have an NYT account. posted by zvs at 2:24 PM on January 27, 2011
This is horrible. I heard an interview with a gay activist from Uganda on CBC's The Current a few weeks ago, and I wonder if this is the same person. When he was describing what was happening in Uganda (especially the role of the local "Rolling Stone" newspaper) it was breathtakingly revolting to listen to. Terrible. posted by KokuRyu at 2:24 PM on January 27, 2011
I'm not paying them anything and I can see it. posted by clarknova at 2:25 PM on January 27, 2011
This is just a reminder that the drive to criminalize homosexuality in Uganda has been stoked by US activists, men and women who will face no legal repercussions for helping to foster an atmosphere of hostility, violence, and hate.
In a sane world they'd be on trial for incitement to murder. Instead they will live comfortably and without fear or terror or doubt. posted by Pope Guilty at 2:29 PM on January 27, 2011 [54 favorites]
“David’s [Kato] death is a result of the hatred planted in Uganda by U.S evangelicals in 2009,” said Val Kalende, the chairwoman of one of Uganda’s gay rights groups. posted by Craig at 2:31 PM on January 27, 2011 [10 favorites]
Uganda’s minister of ethics and integrity, James Nsaba Buturo, a devout Christian, has said, “Homosexuals can forget about human rights.”
It's sad to see how often those who wave the banner of ethics, integrity, and Christianity hold views that are unethical, disgraceful, and un-Christian. posted by burnmp3s at 2:38 PM on January 27, 2011 [10 favorites]
“Naturally, I don’t want anyone killed, but I don’t feel I had anything to do with that,” said Mr. Schmierer, who added that in Uganda he had focused on parenting skills. He also said he had been a target of threats himself, recently receiving more than 600 pieces of hate mail related to his visit.
“I spoke to help people,” he said, “and I’m getting bludgeoned from one end to the other.”
Fuck. You. You don't know shit about "getting bludgeoned" - except maybe how to create an atmosphere which makes it possible to do it do someone like Kato. posted by rtha at 2:39 PM on January 27, 2011 [34 favorites]
The picture of that newspaper reads like a still from Idiocracy, and yet it's real life. The state of radical media in the Third World, as always, is a scary thing. posted by zvs at 2:39 PM on January 27, 2011
“David’s [Kato] death is a result of the hatred planted in Uganda by U.S evangelicals in 2009,” said Val Kalende, the chairwoman of one of Uganda’s gay rights groups.
If this is a verifiable fact, that I think the United States needs to step up and hold their own citizens responsible for their actions. The US has made a huge deal about not allowing terrorists to reside in our country - well, here they are - what are you going to do with them?! posted by garnetgirl at 2:40 PM on January 27, 2011 [1 favorite]
Meanwhile, "Ugandan lesbian awaits deportation" from the UK, is told by a Ugandan MP trying to make homosexuality a capital crime that she will have to repent or reform if forced to return. posted by biffa at 2:41 PM on January 27, 2011 [5 favorites]
The Americans involved said they had no intention of stoking a violent reaction.
And had they been warned in advance that promoting the idea that gay people are evil and regularly rape teenage boys just might to lead to violence against gays, I'm sure they would have heeded it instead of going forth to preach their bullshit. No doubt. posted by ignignokt at 2:42 PM on January 27, 2011 [8 favorites]
Man, the Ugandan edition of Rolling Stone is way to the right of the US version. posted by Strange Interlude at 2:43 PM on January 27, 2011 [2 favorites]
Funny how right-wingers are always "targets of threats" themselves, but never get killed. posted by klangklangston at 2:46 PM on January 27, 2011 [14 favorites]
Given that christianity ain't going away, I want it to be as abhorrent for christians ANYWHERE in the world to preach anti-gay sentiment as it is for them to currently preach against miscegenation (which they used to do with great, scripture-backed, glee). posted by lalochezia at 2:48 PM on January 27, 2011 [6 favorites]
Does anyone have any insight as to what the climate was like before those evangelist assholes came along? Their activities are pretty obviously part of the problem, but there's no way that they weren't capitalizing on an already widespread sentiment. I'm curious as to how much worse they made the problem. posted by invitapriore at 2:50 PM on January 27, 2011
I've been hoping for this to get some media attention especially because of the US evangelical connection. Wishful, I know.
Does anyone have any insight as to what the climate was like before those evangelist assholes came along?
African Christian churches tend to veer socially to the right - witness the Nigerian Anglican church threatening to split over gay and women priests. I think they're still grumbling about it. posted by PenDevil at 2:57 PM on January 27, 2011
Incidentally, there's a documentary about Kato and 3 other Ugandan LGBT activists currently in post-production, Call Me Kuchu. posted by elizardbits at 3:04 PM on January 27, 2011
They try to distance themselves from this murder, but Evangelical churches in the United States have blood on their hands today. That includes President Obama's good friend Rick Warren. posted by Blazecock Pileon at 3:19 PM on January 27, 2011 [5 favorites]
The commandment against taking God's name in vain is not simply an admonishment not to swear. It's also saying it is a sin to claim that God has condoned the violent, hateful actions that you are taking under the guise of morality. posted by soelo at 3:34 PM on January 27, 2011 [9 favorites]
Evangelicals are, at best, pathetic busybodies not the godly people they imagine themselves to be. And people like David Kato, methodical hate mongers, are very much responsible for the results of the hatred they spawn. Too bad that instead of facing consequences, he will simply continue to spread his disease elsewhere. posted by chance at 3:40 PM on January 27, 2011
And people like David Kato, methodical hate mongers, are very much responsible for the results of the hatred they spawn. Too bad that instead of facing consequences, he will simply continue to spread his disease elsewhere.
Either you have your names mixed up here, or you think that Kato will be somehow spreading hate (?) from the afterlife. Clarify? posted by hippybear at 3:41 PM on January 27, 2011 [1 favorite]
Correction: I meant to say Scott Lively, not David Kato. posted by chance at 3:42 PM on January 27, 2011
The evangelical right, in its current incarnation, needs to understand that the fucking ship they sail cuts a wake in which violent extremists are pulled along. These hateful adherents can cherry-pick excerpts from a Holy Book that contains passages justifying physical punishment and torture for perceived violations of their faith, and feel absolutely justified and suffer no consequence when someone carries out their ideology to the extreme.
I have nothing against and greatly admire Christians who take the message of unity, compassion, and understanding from the Bible, who live this way and would preach the same. These are the Christians who need to publicly denounce and excommunicate the denominations that nominally worship the same Christian God yet choose to preach division and abet any violence that results. They should not be allowed to call themselves Christians at all, and called out as such - these extremist evangelical groups should be reclassified as hate groups and heretics, and the collateral damage they foment should carry consequences: legal and spiritual.
There is no place for them in a civilized society that yearns for progress, peace, and justice. I wish they'd take a cue from the Mennonites and Amish, separate themselves from a culture they obviously resent and contain their hateful little circle-jerk to some dusty fringe of the continent. posted by krippledkonscious at 3:55 PM on January 27, 2011 [2 favorites]
President Obama's statement on the killing of David Kato
Secretary of State Hillary Clinton's statement. posted by Craig at 3:56 PM on January 27, 2011
Whats appalling is that the only thing evangelicals use the Bible for these days is to deny gays the very respect that the New Testament entreats them to give to everyone.
Oh and to enrich themselves but hey thats religion right? posted by Max Power at 3:57 PM on January 27, 2011 [1 favorite]
A few months ago I was looking for video footage from neighboring Kenya, and came across the YouTube channel for NTV, one of the country's main broadcast stations. They had a lot of news clips uploaded, which were very similar to local news in the US: voiceover narration, man-on-the-street interviews, even shots of people walking from the neck down.
The familiar format just made reports like this and this all the more disturbing. posted by Rhaomi at 4:19 PM on January 27, 2011
I've been hoping for this to get some media attention especially because of the US evangelical connection. Wishful, I know.
Well, it was on BBC World News America tonight, complete with connecting the dots to the US evangelical interference in Ugandan politics. I don't know how other news outlets are covering it, but that's something. posted by hippybear at 4:25 PM on January 27, 2011
garnetgirl: If this is a verifiable fact, that I think the United States needs to step up and hold their own citizens responsible for their actions. The US has made a huge deal about not allowing terrorists to reside in our country - well, here they are - what are you going to do with them?!
So crazy. They basically published a 'hit list,' of people who haven't committed a violent crime (or any crime really, though I am sure homosexuality is outlawed).
This is one of those few moments where I wish that the UN or another extra-government entity could indict these fucks. posted by rosswald at 4:26 PM on January 27, 2011
That link is to wikipedia, but Jeff Sharlet's book C Street: The Fundamentalist Threat to American Democracy is a must-read for anybody who wants to double check the assertion for themselves.
Rachel Maddow also did a lot of reporting on both The Family and the Ugandan death-to-homosexuals law, but her website is pretty opaque to doing good searches, so I won't be posting any links here at the moment. posted by hippybear at 4:33 PM on January 27, 2011 [1 favorite]
This is Rachel Maddow's interview with the author of the "Kill the Gays" bill, David Bahati. posted by Craig at 4:39 PM on January 27, 2011
I was pretty upset after reading this article today. The US has exported a lot of good ideas over the years, but this is an example of the very worst aspects of our culture amplifying the worst aspects of Uganda's, and tragedy resulting. Very, very sad. posted by Forktine at 4:48 PM on January 27, 2011 [1 favorite]
>Meanwhile, "Ugandan lesbian awaits deportation" from the UK, is told by a Ugandan MP trying to make homosexuality a capital crime that she will have to repent or reform if forced to return.
What the hell? From the link: "Her asylum claim was turned down partly on the basis that the judge did not believe there was any evidence that she was homosexual."
She's already been mobbed, beaten bloody and had her house burned down because people in Uganda believed she was gay. She fled for her life, she claims to in fact be gay, and who the hell is this judge to declare otherwise when sending her back could be the equivalent of a death sentence? Jesus H. Christ. posted by Marla Singer at 5:18 PM on January 27, 2011 [2 favorites]
""Her asylum claim was turned down partly on the basis that the judge did not believe there was any evidence that she was homosexual.""
Maybe she didn't want to make out with another chick in front of him.
(Alternate snark: Way to hold her to the Vietnam Draft sexuality standard.) posted by klangklangston at 6:02 PM on January 27, 2011
Hey hippybear, you can use Google with the "site:" modifier to target a specific site's pages. Here's a sample search on that site, with the search term uganda, for example...hope it helps. posted by dubitable at 6:05 PM on January 27, 2011
This is just a reminder that the drive to criminalize homosexuality in Uganda has been stoked by US activists, men and women who will face no legal repercussions for helping to foster an atmosphere of hostility, violence, and hate.
Actually, there might be grounds for bringing suit under the Alien Tort Claims Act. I'm not a lawyer and can't say how practical such a course of action would be, but if it were feasible then it would be worth establishing a fund to meet the legal expenses. Shining a spotlight on the the pattern of bigotry through testimony would be a good thing, even if the outcome were uncertain. posted by anigbrowl at 6:08 PM on January 27, 2011
Oopse - that first statement should have been in italics, as it was quoting another comment upthread. posted by anigbrowl at 6:09 PM on January 27, 2011
The evangelical right, in its current incarnation, needs to understand that the fucking ship they sail cuts a wake in which violent extremists are pulled along.
What makes you think they don't understand that? Not only do they understand, that's the design. Have we not had enough gay people killed, and teenagers committing suicide, as a result of the relentless hate preaching from these 'men of god'? posted by VikingSword at 6:20 PM on January 27, 2011 [3 favorites]
Just got this info from GetEqual with an update about Brenda Namigadde, the Ugandan lesbian they are trying to deport from the UK. There's a petition being sent to the U.K. Home Secretary Theresa May and copied to Secretary Hillary Clinton asking that she be given asylum.
There was an illuminating episode of the show Vanguard called "Missionaries of Hate" that looked at Uganda's anti-gay bill; it used to be on Hulu, but I can't find it now. It's worth watching.
To be a gay person in Uganda and then refuse to hide, refuse merely to survive, but instead stand up and speak out--that's courage. That's love. We are all poorer for losing a man like David Kato.
Please contact the prayer team at Saddleback Church and request prayers for the family and friends of David Kato. Here's the link.
"Requesting prayers for the family and friends of David Kato - brutally murdered by individuals inspired by the so-called overseas ministries of Rick Warren." posted by Baby_Balrog at 9:44 PM on January 27, 2011 [1 favorite]
Yeah, Rolling Stone should stick with less incendiary list issues. The "Top 500 Albums of All Time" was okay. posted by jeremy b at 10:56 PM on January 27, 2011
A brave man. He doubtless knew this was coming, yet stayed true to himself.
krippledconscious has already articulated my thoughts on the subject more clearly than I could have myself, as my mind is clouded with frustration and anger. I can only add
That is a really tough article to read. RIP David Kato. posted by Craig at 12:05 PM on January 28, 2011
Scuffles at funeral of Uganda gay activist
Holy shit. The pastor was denouncing homosexuality from the pulpit during Kato's funeral? That's really horrible. posted by hippybear at 12:20 PM on January 28, 2011
posted by orville sash at 2:21 PM on January 27, 2011