The Corruption Of Lindsey Graham
August 16, 2023 11:48 AM Subscribe
Like many, I've surmised that the reason Lindsey Graham went from Never Trump to Trump's Biggest Champion was because Donny had some kompromat on him. But after listening to the podcast from The Bulwark's Will Saletan, The Corruption Of Lindsey Graham [Bulwark link, podcast overview, individual episode pages are full of ancillary material, no listening links], I'm not so sure. He might have just sold his soul on principle. Here's Episode 1 of 7 "Graham's Moral Clarity" on YouTube [26m], with the full YouTube Playlist [annoyingly not in order] and the PDF book The Corruption Of Lindsey Graham by Will Saletan, upon which the podcast is based. The rest of the episodes on YouTube are listed below the fold.
Episode 2 "A Trump's Best Friend" [28m]
Episode 3 "Power Shift" [35m]
Episode 4 "Domestic Enemies" [37m]
Episode 5 "The First Impeachment" [35m]
Episode 6 "Insurrection Day" [40m]
Episode 7 "Return Of The Orange God-King" [42m]
Episode 2 "A Trump's Best Friend" [28m]
Episode 3 "Power Shift" [35m]
Episode 4 "Domestic Enemies" [37m]
Episode 5 "The First Impeachment" [35m]
Episode 6 "Insurrection Day" [40m]
Episode 7 "Return Of The Orange God-King" [42m]
I haven't listened to the podcast series yet (but definitely interested) but I also thought this New York Times Magazine profile by Mark Leibovich was relevant in a "when a terrible person tells you who they are, believe them" sort of way. Relevant passages:
posted by bl1nk at 12:16 PM on August 16, 2023 [32 favorites]
“Well, O.K., from my point of view, if you know anything about me, it’d be odd not to do this,” he said.He is a politician who has long been motivated by a desire for relevance and being in the spotlight, preferably in the wake of another, more charismatic partner. In a prior age, that was McCain, and when McCain would choose bipartisanism to burnish his maverick image, Graham would follow. But after McCain passed away, that became Trump. Nevermind that Trump shat on the legacy of his friend. Nevermind that Trump would eventually discard Graham like a used tissue. Relevance, however fleeting, obscures everything else.
I asked what “this” was. “ ‘This,’ ” Graham said, “is to try to be relevant.”
...
Graham would shortly head over to the Capitol for Trump’s State of the Union address, about which the president called him a few hours earlier, seeking input. “Should I go conciliatory or to-hell-with-it?” Trump asked him, according to Graham. “What kind of tone should I take?” In recounting this latest exchange, Graham shook his head and half shrugged. “I have never been called this much by a president in my life,” he told me. His tone reflected a mixture of amazement and amusement, with perhaps a dash of awe. “It’s weird, and it’s flattering, and it creates some opportunity. It also creates some pressure.”
posted by bl1nk at 12:16 PM on August 16, 2023 [32 favorites]
He might have just sold his soul on principle.
Or it might just be that all his former huff and puff about the manifest awfulness of TFG was always predicated more on a misreading of the political winds than on any genuine ethic.
Conservatism is, at its core, a morally bankrupt ideology. Nobody should be surprised to observe people who self-identify as conservative displaying amoral behaviours.
posted by flabdablet at 12:31 PM on August 16, 2023 [37 favorites]
Or it might just be that all his former huff and puff about the manifest awfulness of TFG was always predicated more on a misreading of the political winds than on any genuine ethic.
Conservatism is, at its core, a morally bankrupt ideology. Nobody should be surprised to observe people who self-identify as conservative displaying amoral behaviours.
posted by flabdablet at 12:31 PM on August 16, 2023 [37 favorites]
He is the consummate toady
posted by mcstayinskool at 12:41 PM on August 16, 2023 [18 favorites]
posted by mcstayinskool at 12:41 PM on August 16, 2023 [18 favorites]
Yup. These are all horrible people. There is nothing complex or interesting about them. The Bulwark people spent their lives in service to this evil, and are only balking now because the machine they built was taken away by a reality TV host who is better at lying than they are.
posted by Balna Watya at 12:45 PM on August 16, 2023 [18 favorites]
posted by Balna Watya at 12:45 PM on August 16, 2023 [18 favorites]
I find listening to converted allies, no matter how shallow their alliance, to be somehow more informative than listening to the typical left-wing echo chamber. Something about insights from people who've had even a mild Road To Damascus moment feels more visceral.
posted by hippybear at 12:58 PM on August 16, 2023 [11 favorites]
posted by hippybear at 12:58 PM on August 16, 2023 [11 favorites]
Also, I guess the link to The Bulwark in the FPP, with the individual show pages, actually is the full text of the subsequent PDF link, only all the underlined words in the PDF actually turn into web links for sources for that bit of information. Also, those individual pages seem to be, I haven't really checked deeply, the text of the podcast.
So the podcast will have more embedded audio sources, but the individual show pages linked at The Bulwark directly have some optional audio embedded plus a much more rich ecosystem of background information. The book is probably the text of the podcast with a forward etc.
posted by hippybear at 1:00 PM on August 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
So the podcast will have more embedded audio sources, but the individual show pages linked at The Bulwark directly have some optional audio embedded plus a much more rich ecosystem of background information. The book is probably the text of the podcast with a forward etc.
posted by hippybear at 1:00 PM on August 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
I find listening to converted allies, no matter how shallow their alliance, to be somehow more informative than listening to the typical left-wing echo chamber.
Depends. There's an awful lot of zealots who don't much care which direction their zealotry is pointed, and who will switch sides for no better reason than not having had their old side stroke their ego enough to suit them.
I prefer to listen to people with a track record of doing actual work.
posted by flabdablet at 1:40 PM on August 16, 2023 [10 favorites]
Depends. There's an awful lot of zealots who don't much care which direction their zealotry is pointed, and who will switch sides for no better reason than not having had their old side stroke their ego enough to suit them.
I prefer to listen to people with a track record of doing actual work.
posted by flabdablet at 1:40 PM on August 16, 2023 [10 favorites]
There was a time when Graham wasn't corrupt?
posted by Saxon Kane at 1:47 PM on August 16, 2023 [9 favorites]
posted by Saxon Kane at 1:47 PM on August 16, 2023 [9 favorites]
On Countdown the other morning, K.O. described Graham as, "Desperate, skulking, venomous, treasonous, despicable, decayed, putrid Lindsay Graham…". I don't have a further point.
posted by ob1quixote at 1:59 PM on August 16, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by ob1quixote at 1:59 PM on August 16, 2023 [5 favorites]
He is the consummate toady
I mean... YEAH.
His whole deal is being The Top Dog's Best Boy. And so, when he used to be McCain's guy, he said all of the "voice of reason" things that went with that association, made a show of bipartisanship, etc. (though in the end, he was as disingenuous in those statements and as callously political as McCain was.)
Now he's Team Trump, so his public job is to back MAGA bullshit up. And that's what he does, shameless backup megaphone to TFG.
If Trump died of a stroke tomorrow, Graham would be on a podium in Florida inside of ten days talking about how the most important issue in America was taking Disney down a peg for being too woke.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 2:14 PM on August 16, 2023 [29 favorites]
I mean... YEAH.
His whole deal is being The Top Dog's Best Boy. And so, when he used to be McCain's guy, he said all of the "voice of reason" things that went with that association, made a show of bipartisanship, etc. (though in the end, he was as disingenuous in those statements and as callously political as McCain was.)
Now he's Team Trump, so his public job is to back MAGA bullshit up. And that's what he does, shameless backup megaphone to TFG.
If Trump died of a stroke tomorrow, Graham would be on a podium in Florida inside of ten days talking about how the most important issue in America was taking Disney down a peg for being too woke.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 2:14 PM on August 16, 2023 [29 favorites]
In 2015, while covering Graham's longshot presidential bid in the New Hampshire primary, I was chatting with a local party official who was helping lead Graham around the state and he mentioned they'd be getting lunch soon. I asked what kind of places they usually went on this campaign swing, and the guy said they usually just stop at fast food places. Graham wasn't too particular, he said, and often wouldn't get food for himself at wherever they stopped...mostly he just eats "diet coke and pork rinds," the guy told me.
Later in the campaign he brought John McCain to as many campaign stops as he could (including a memorable stop at a Vietnamese community center where McCain was revered and Graham was just trying to glean some of McCain's charm and character). At one really hot parade with 4 or 5 major candidates marching down the streets, Graham was sweating through his shirt, grabbed a water bottle from a supporter, and muttered to no one in particular, "I feel like I'm back in Iraq." (you can see that moment about a 1/4 way through this gallery; maroon shirt surrounded by people holding signs)
posted by msbrauer at 2:37 PM on August 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
Later in the campaign he brought John McCain to as many campaign stops as he could (including a memorable stop at a Vietnamese community center where McCain was revered and Graham was just trying to glean some of McCain's charm and character). At one really hot parade with 4 or 5 major candidates marching down the streets, Graham was sweating through his shirt, grabbed a water bottle from a supporter, and muttered to no one in particular, "I feel like I'm back in Iraq." (you can see that moment about a 1/4 way through this gallery; maroon shirt surrounded by people holding signs)
posted by msbrauer at 2:37 PM on August 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
it’s just so weird that a person can simultaneously have the supreme and unshakeable self-confidence/self-importance required to get elected to high office, while also being extremely uncomfortable when not following someone else’s orders.
like, it’s a thing, it’s totally a thing, it makes sense that it’s a thing, but i for one could not ever fit that combination of features into my own personal brain, not in a million years.
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 2:41 PM on August 16, 2023 [6 favorites]
like, it’s a thing, it’s totally a thing, it makes sense that it’s a thing, but i for one could not ever fit that combination of features into my own personal brain, not in a million years.
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 2:41 PM on August 16, 2023 [6 favorites]
Here's a perspective on why Graham supported Trump - and, for comparison purposes, why Romney did not - from Anne Applebaum writing in The Atlantic in August 2020. (Archive link) Same kinda topic. A thoughtful attempt to answer the age-old question "Who goes Nazi?"
posted by Pickman's Next Top Model at 2:44 PM on August 16, 2023 [12 favorites]
posted by Pickman's Next Top Model at 2:44 PM on August 16, 2023 [12 favorites]
Ive been wondering about another scenario:
Did people like: Bill Barr, Lindsey Graham, Mark Miley and others sign up for the Trump team to help keep Putin and others from allowing Trump completely off the road.
Dick and Liz Cheney, Pence, McConnell all put their necks on the line (some literally) on and prior to Jan 6. Is there another force to work on the conservative/republican side doing its best to keep the proverbial moth from flying all the way into the flame?
posted by specialk420 at 2:51 PM on August 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
Did people like: Bill Barr, Lindsey Graham, Mark Miley and others sign up for the Trump team to help keep Putin and others from allowing Trump completely off the road.
Dick and Liz Cheney, Pence, McConnell all put their necks on the line (some literally) on and prior to Jan 6. Is there another force to work on the conservative/republican side doing its best to keep the proverbial moth from flying all the way into the flame?
posted by specialk420 at 2:51 PM on August 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
On March 24, the Senate ethics committee slapped Sen. Graham's wrist for soliciting campaign contributions for Herschel Walker from inside a federal building "five separate times" in a single Fox News interview on Nov. 30, 2022 -- thus bludgeoning (criminal law) 18 U.S.C. § 607. (Graham had campaigned on his own behalf in a federal building in Oct. 2020, also while chatting with reporters.) On May 29, Russia issued a warrant for Graham's arrest following "an edited video of his meeting on Friday with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy that was released by Zelenskyy’s office [in which] Graham, a Republican from South Carolina, noted that 'the Russians are dying' and described the U.S. military assistance to the country as 'the best money we’ve ever spent'".
The senator's headline for August 2 involved his appearance on Hannity, slandering U.S. District Judge Tanya Chutkan (presiding over Trump's DC case); in 2014, Graham voted to confirm Chutkan (recipient of 95 yeas; there were five abstentions). Bit of a letdown; let's see what he gets up to the first weekend in October.
posted by Iris Gambol at 3:22 PM on August 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
The senator's headline for August 2 involved his appearance on Hannity, slandering U.S. District Judge Tanya Chutkan (presiding over Trump's DC case); in 2014, Graham voted to confirm Chutkan (recipient of 95 yeas; there were five abstentions). Bit of a letdown; let's see what he gets up to the first weekend in October.
posted by Iris Gambol at 3:22 PM on August 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
Is there another force to work on the conservative/republican side doing its best to keep the proverbial moth from flying all the way into the flame?
Sometimes being an enabler and not allowing someone to hit rock bottom does them a disservice.
Sometimes being an enabler and not allowing someone to finally go a bridge too far for anyone with a conscience does a disservice to an entire nation. We're where we are in no small part because Donald's enablers kept him from going too far all at once even for most GOP people and just let the pot slowly boil until they were committed to the cult. Fuck every one of his enablers -- especially the ones who keep quiet now like Kelly and Tillerson.
posted by tclark at 4:36 PM on August 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
Sometimes being an enabler and not allowing someone to hit rock bottom does them a disservice.
Sometimes being an enabler and not allowing someone to finally go a bridge too far for anyone with a conscience does a disservice to an entire nation. We're where we are in no small part because Donald's enablers kept him from going too far all at once even for most GOP people and just let the pot slowly boil until they were committed to the cult. Fuck every one of his enablers -- especially the ones who keep quiet now like Kelly and Tillerson.
posted by tclark at 4:36 PM on August 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
“ Did people like: Bill Barr, Lindsey Graham, Mark Miley and others sign up for the Trump team to help keep Putin and others from allowing Trump completely off the road.”
Dude LOL come on now, this is not a serious take, brain worms are not only a republican disease
posted by youthenrage at 4:57 PM on August 16, 2023 [7 favorites]
Dude LOL come on now, this is not a serious take, brain worms are not only a republican disease
posted by youthenrage at 4:57 PM on August 16, 2023 [7 favorites]
In the latest thumbs on YouTube, Graham looks like he hasn’t slept for a week.
Since we don’t know when those pictures were taken, any implication drawn from them is necessarily weak, but in general when one of Trump's criminal schemes publicly collapses, his accomplices show visible signs of extreme stress, while Trump himself rants and carries on with undiminished vigor.
If any further proof were needed that Trump is a true sociopath with virtually no conscience, who simply does not feel the weight of any crime he has committed or will commit, there you have it.
posted by jamjam at 5:32 PM on August 16, 2023 [7 favorites]
Since we don’t know when those pictures were taken, any implication drawn from them is necessarily weak, but in general when one of Trump's criminal schemes publicly collapses, his accomplices show visible signs of extreme stress, while Trump himself rants and carries on with undiminished vigor.
If any further proof were needed that Trump is a true sociopath with virtually no conscience, who simply does not feel the weight of any crime he has committed or will commit, there you have it.
posted by jamjam at 5:32 PM on August 16, 2023 [7 favorites]
I am moving across the river to South Carolina sometime in the next several months. I’m not saying the move is just so I can vote against Graham, but it certainly is a nice little bonus.
posted by TedW at 6:49 PM on August 16, 2023 [9 favorites]
posted by TedW at 6:49 PM on August 16, 2023 [9 favorites]
Hillary Clinton: It’s like he had a brain snatch.
posted by bz at 9:45 PM on August 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by bz at 9:45 PM on August 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
I've never bought the idea that Trump or anyone had kompromat on Graham. I used to think he had principles, but when he switched over to being a Trump toady, I never got the sense it was insincere. It revealed the insincerity of those earlier principles.
This is who he is. This is who he has always been. The Graham we thought we knew before Trump was the act.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 10:18 PM on August 16, 2023 [7 favorites]
This is who he is. This is who he has always been. The Graham we thought we knew before Trump was the act.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 10:18 PM on August 16, 2023 [7 favorites]
Podcast links:
Apple Podcasts: ep 1, ep 2, ep 3, ep 4, ep 5, ep 6, ep 7
Overcast: ep 1, ep 2, ep 3, ep 4, ep 5, ep 6, ep 7
posted by Pronoiac at 1:01 AM on August 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
Apple Podcasts: ep 1, ep 2, ep 3, ep 4, ep 5, ep 6, ep 7
Overcast: ep 1, ep 2, ep 3, ep 4, ep 5, ep 6, ep 7
posted by Pronoiac at 1:01 AM on August 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
Leave space in sordid human history for another Bad Gay.
Yes, These Gays Are Trying to Murder You (NYT; gift link)
Translation: Gay people know how to play the long game because we have to know; we’re tough, we’re smart and we’re sly because that’s how we endure.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 10:47 AM on August 17, 2023 [1 favorite]
Yes, These Gays Are Trying to Murder You (NYT; gift link)
Translation: Gay people know how to play the long game because we have to know; we’re tough, we’re smart and we’re sly because that’s how we endure.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 10:47 AM on August 17, 2023 [1 favorite]
There's an old politician's joke about a pol seeing a march and frantically trying to figure out where they're going so he can run to the front and "lead his people."
I don't find behavior like Graham's mysterious and certainly didn't see the need to speculate that he was being blackmailed. He wants to be in the front of the crowd. He gambled on "leading" the Republican opposition to Trump when it was possible Trump would go down in humiliating failure, then he worked hard to change direction but still be a leader when it was clear Trump was going to keep getting away with it all.
Because Trump actually is a danger to the republic, I think there's an assumption among the left and rational center to assume Graham "realized" this (to take the phrasing from the Bulwark link) when he said it. When it was just something convenient to say. Now it's not convenient to say and he says something else. He is in fact completely consistent and his "true self" is merely the absence of substance.
Now, it's a little unusual even among politicians to see someone so devoid of dignity that they're willing to do such a public pivot; most people, on realizing that they misjudged so badly, wouldn't about-face so quickly. They would fade out and accept a few board of directors appointments or run a lobbying group.
posted by mark k at 11:14 AM on August 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
I don't find behavior like Graham's mysterious and certainly didn't see the need to speculate that he was being blackmailed. He wants to be in the front of the crowd. He gambled on "leading" the Republican opposition to Trump when it was possible Trump would go down in humiliating failure, then he worked hard to change direction but still be a leader when it was clear Trump was going to keep getting away with it all.
Because Trump actually is a danger to the republic, I think there's an assumption among the left and rational center to assume Graham "realized" this (to take the phrasing from the Bulwark link) when he said it. When it was just something convenient to say. Now it's not convenient to say and he says something else. He is in fact completely consistent and his "true self" is merely the absence of substance.
Now, it's a little unusual even among politicians to see someone so devoid of dignity that they're willing to do such a public pivot; most people, on realizing that they misjudged so badly, wouldn't about-face so quickly. They would fade out and accept a few board of directors appointments or run a lobbying group.
posted by mark k at 11:14 AM on August 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
No one will ever go broke by over-estimating the depths to which Lindsay Graham can sink when betting how low Lindsay Graham can sink. There simply is no bottom there.
posted by y2karl at 11:41 AM on August 17, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by y2karl at 11:41 AM on August 17, 2023 [3 favorites]
Welp, he's certainly a guy who picks the most expedient route in life.
posted by jenfullmoon at 3:43 PM on August 17, 2023
posted by jenfullmoon at 3:43 PM on August 17, 2023
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