There is solace in the wrong type of food

June 11, 2023 7:44 AM

The meaty, the starchy, the battered - late night foods for the cold, the tired and the drunk There are national cuisines, there are regional dishes, and some foods really belong to one city. And then there are the hyperlocal chippy traditions of the UK - and doubtless equivalents around the world. Each is, as the article says, "local history on a polystyrene tray."

In my northern town in the 80s, the late night treat was "spicy potato wedges." Despite the name, these were just very chunky chips rolled in coarsely ground peppercorns. Cheap and tasty, a portion was just big enough to be finished on the walk back to the bus station.

posted by YoungStencil (67 comments total)

Also, apologies: I failed to mention that the article includes Ireland as well as the UK in the travelogue of "battered everything."
posted by YoungStencil at 7:54 AM on June 11, 2023

Just to clarify a couple of things in the article... Bolognese chips are definitely a thing in a few chippies in Scotland too, especially around Glasgow - presumably due Italian immigrants (the area's also home to a lot of ice cream shops). 'Salt and pepper' chips are found pretty much everywhere in the UK these days - they're not really as described, as the seasoning is really a mixture of chilies, salt, onion and garlic - the same mix you'd get with 'salt and pepper ribs'. Chips and gravy are pretty widespread, despite being claimed as a Yorkshire thing. I've found chippies serving gravy as far south as Cornwall. Maybe not widespread in London yet. Not mentioned was 'minted peas' - peas with mint sauce, often served with chips (or on its own) in the East Midlands.
posted by pipeski at 8:09 AM on June 11, 2023 [2 favorites]

My 13 y.o. son ordered a pizza at a chippie in Grantown-on-Spey in Scotland and was surprised to see one taken from the fridge and frisbeed into the boiling chip-oil = surprised-and-delighted.

But let's hear it for the Wexford Rissole - local only to the county town, really. They originated when the chipper had cooked too many chips, s/he would squidge them all up together with herbs&spices, squeeeze them into lumps the size of a child's fist, and re-fry them for sale the next day either breaded or battered.
posted by BobTheScientist at 8:36 AM on June 11, 2023 [10 favorites]

Orange Chips ─ The Black Country

OK found what I was waiting for, all done.

(Black Country here refers to an area outside of Birmingham, England. The name comes from the use of burning coal that would produce high levels of pollution, turning the air black.)
posted by Ms. Moonlight at 8:41 AM on June 11, 2023 [3 favorites]

(Was honestly expecting a wordshore byline.)
posted by Insert Clever Name Here at 8:45 AM on June 11, 2023 [11 favorites]

I'm not going specify exactly which felonies I would commit to get my hands on some salt and pepper chips but...well the page is not blank.
posted by East14thTaco at 8:47 AM on June 11, 2023 [4 favorites]

Heh. Just yesterday, I was having a conversation about corndogs with my 5-year-old granddaughter, and had to try to explain what a "guilty pleasure" was.
posted by Thorzdad at 8:52 AM on June 11, 2023

Drenched in flour and deep-fat-fried
And cooled on paper towels and then devoured
You know, I spent 15 years in a life raft
15 years in a life raft, and now I got something to say
Stay in your life boats people
Stay in your life boats people
It's murder out there, murder out there
Sharks patrol these waters
Sharks patrol these waters, hey!
posted by alex_skazat at 8:58 AM on June 11, 2023 [7 favorites]

Wrong type of food solace is the best solace! This article made me very hungry, and I'm especially coveting the imli chips; I love, love, love complementary tastes and textures like that. (I put shredded cabbage and carrot, a poached egg, feta cheese, and vinegar and sesame oil in my ramen. So wrong, so solacey.
posted by taz at 8:58 AM on June 11, 2023 [1 favorite]

My 13 y.o. son ordered a pizza at a chippie in Grantown-on-Spey in Scotland and was surprised to see one taken from the fridge and frisbeed into the boiling chip-oil = surprised-and-delighted.

When I first moved to the South East of England from Scotland, I went to a local chippy.

Reading the menu above the counter I was surprised not to see pizza on the menu.

Me: “You don’t do pizza?”
Guy behind the counter: “No, we don’t have an oven”
Me: “What do you need an oven for?”

Genuinely had no idea that this was not a UK-wide standard menu item.
posted by toamouse at 9:10 AM on June 11, 2023 [10 favorites]

Justin Bieber Haggis Special.
posted by Halloween Jack at 9:32 AM on June 11, 2023 [2 favorites]

Yeah, you want a bready frozen ready-made pizza with a few shreds of cheese from the chipper (not chippie in Aberdeen!). Deep fried, it produces a luminous orange grease just right to spill down the front of your white shirt on the rushed walk back to school of a Friday lunchtime.

Thought I knew my way around deep-fried Scottish cuisine until last year on my first visit to Orkney got to experience a 'patty' which was deep fried mince and tatties (but not dyed pink!). Just as a wee light snack to go with my fish supper! Was sold to me as an Orkney thing - not Cumbria!
posted by sedimentary_deer at 9:35 AM on June 11, 2023 [1 favorite]

As a student in Scotland, the deep fried haggis supper (i.e. with chips) was my standby if I needed calories but lacked cash. I once ordered the deep fried pizza when they were out of haggis and was ill for days. A pizza base can absorb a lot of oil from the fryer. I thought I could handle it, but not that day.
posted by YoungStencil at 9:37 AM on June 11, 2023 [5 favorites]

Also, in Glasgow, you get TWO bits of fish in your fish supper. And if you get chips and cheese they ask you if you want mozzarella or cheddar or a MIX of both. Blew my wee mind - felt like I was really in the big city!
posted by sedimentary_deer at 9:43 AM on June 11, 2023 [3 favorites]

I kinda want to try minted peas. Receipt and/or recipe, anyone?
posted by humbug at 10:00 AM on June 11, 2023

The history the Justin Bieber Haggis Special speaks to is contested.
posted by Hypatia at 10:24 AM on June 11, 2023 [1 favorite]

This post also puts me in mind of the tandoori momo, another late night snack, which I believe was covered on the blue once before...but possibly not?
posted by Insert Clever Name Here at 10:44 AM on June 11, 2023

What is that high, whistling noise coming from inside my chest?
posted by jim in austin at 11:36 AM on June 11, 2023 [4 favorites]

I have lived 37 of my 44 years in and around Newcastle, but have never knowingly encountered Bolognese chips in that time. Google would appear to suggest it's isolated to one particular takeaway.
posted by anagrama at 11:37 AM on June 11, 2023

Reading about those salt and pepper chips reminded me of a sort of analogous Szechuan restaurant dish, five-spice french fries. The fries can be good, bad or indifferent - five spice and salt is a combination just made for potatoes. For a country where we eat a lot of fried stuff, the US really doesn't do much with fried stuff - five spice french fries ought to be a bar food available everywhere.

I would also eat tandoori momos if I had any.
posted by Frowner at 11:49 AM on June 11, 2023 [2 favorites]

the US really doesn't do much with fried stuff

You mean, other than glorping some melted artificial cheese over it?
posted by Greg_Ace at 11:57 AM on June 11, 2023

The history the Justin Bieber Haggis Special speaks to is contested.

Man does this take me back to The Locust. One of the best/strangest live shows I've ever seen.
posted by East14thTaco at 12:07 PM on June 11, 2023

Reading about those salt and pepper chips reminded me of a sort of analogous Szechuan restaurant dish, five-spice french fries.

There is actually a dish from, well I hear it's Qingdao (I think it's usually northern Chinese cooking that features potatoes) but honestly I wouldn't know, that's french fried potatoes with vinegar and chili.
posted by praemunire at 12:15 PM on June 11, 2023

I found the bolognese chips on at least one other menu in addition to the one there's a photo of at the very end of the article under discussion.

And it turns out both Lay's and Croky have a Bolognese crisp flavor, at least in the Netherlands.
posted by Insert Clever Name Here at 12:38 PM on June 11, 2023

I wonder how long my fascination with this particular kind of drunk food would last if I lived in England, Scotland or Ireland? Like, how many pie barms can one really eat in a lifetime (and once safely past prime clubbing age)?

I now live in a part of the US where I can readily get White Castle (all open 24 hours) and even after a year and a half of living here, I still find myself sitting in front of the occasional half dozen sliders w/ cheese.
posted by Insert Clever Name Here at 12:48 PM on June 11, 2023 [5 favorites]

Metafilter: as the cheese melts it coagulates into a homogenous stodgy unit.
posted by lalochezia at 12:56 PM on June 11, 2023 [3 favorites]

I wonder how long my fascination with this particular kind of drunk food would last if I lived in England, Scotland or Ireland? Like, how many pie barms can one really eat in a lifetime (and once safely past prime clubbing age)?

Kebabs are what I think of as drunk food. Specifically donner kebabs. I almost never eat them now. But chippy stuff in general, I don't think strictly needs to be drunk food. Pie barms, one could eat from time to time for a chippy tea I should think.
posted by plonkee at 1:11 PM on June 11, 2023 [3 favorites]

When drunk after midnight, it's always time to order from the deep fat fried food group.
posted by y2karl at 2:03 PM on June 11, 2023 [2 favorites]

This old post on the blue is a decent accounting of similar foods in the States.
posted by Halloween Jack at 2:07 PM on June 11, 2023 [1 favorite]

The garbage plate at Nick's (subject of the post linked to above by Halloween Jack) always makes me think more of a munchy box than the sorts of regional comfort snack choices the contributors to the linked post mention. Perhaps munchy boxes were a bit of a fad?
posted by Insert Clever Name Here at 2:18 PM on June 11, 2023

I wonder how long my fascination with this particular kind of drunk food would last if I lived in England, Scotland or Ireland? Like, how many pie barms can one really eat in a lifetime (and once safely past prime clubbing age)?

I live on a street with a lot of shawarma/kebab restaurants, and they are the local drunk food favorites, even to the degree that Mc Donalds had to give up their franchise here (but there are a couple of fancy burger places or three if you count the side streets). I don't think there are any fried food places left at all. But to get to the point, when we first moved here, we had either shawarma or falafel meals all the time. Now, it is almost never, though all of us still like them. Strange, isn't it? To be honest, there is a lot of choice, with pizzerias, chicken rotisseries, Thai, Japanese, Vietnamese, cafes that serve sandwiches and homemade cakes. Compared to other places I have lived in, and Copenhagen when our family moved here 50 years ago, there are very few Chinese and Indian places. I think it's the typical thing where the second generation are completely integrated and pursue careers with better pay, fewer hours.

When I was young, there were lots of places that served deep fried plaice with chips and remoulade, and they are still normal in other parts of the country, but there are none in my neighborhood. I don't remember much of what else one gets there, but the most similar to the food in the story is "pølsemix", chips mixed with a red sausage cut into bite size pieces.
posted by mumimor at 3:27 PM on June 11, 2023 [1 favorite]

Well now I have a craving for fish and chips with a dim sim that I won't be able to satisfy for a few years (sigh).
posted by EvaDestruction at 4:01 PM on June 11, 2023 [1 favorite]

Chicago has the "how to deep fry pizza" problem largely solved, in case anyone over there is looking for a way to improve the situation.
posted by misskaz at 4:03 PM on June 11, 2023 [2 favorites]

dim sims look delicious. I sometimes deep fry ravioli, they puff up and become crispy in a good way. Specially the bigger ones work as an elegant appetizer with some sort of dipping sauce. It's quite easy to do in a wok.
posted by mumimor at 4:29 PM on June 11, 2023

Perhaps munchy boxes were a bit of a fad?

I was in Garelochhead last week, home of Ali's Fish & Chips, Curry, Pizza, Burger and Kebab shop. Half of the side of the building was a big menu of munchy boxes. Sadly I was talked out of procuring one, and we ended up at a pub that served bad pies instead. They were selling munchy boxes up the road in Helensburgh as well, so they seem to be going strong.
posted by pipeski at 4:45 PM on June 11, 2023 [2 favorites]

Chips and gravy aren't just a Yorkshire thing. They are also pretty standard in Canada. Everyone knows about poutine (fries, gravy and cheese curds) but fries, dressing and gravy is a very, very common take out order in Newfoundland as well. Some places like to get fancy by adding peas as well.
posted by peppermind at 5:00 PM on June 11, 2023 [3 favorites]

Here on the Lancashire coast salt and pepper chips of the not-actually-salt-and-pepper kind are very common, as is cheesy chips and gravy, I'm not a fan of the former but the latter is my absolute favourite wrong type of food, closely followed by a donner meat and chip butty yum yum.
posted by daysocks at 6:09 PM on June 11, 2023

I was weirdly possessed to pick up a fish and chip dinner from the frozen food section last week. I never buy frozen diners or frozen French fries….it's sitting in my freezer now. It's 10:30pm.
posted by brachiopod at 7:29 PM on June 11, 2023

Chips and gravy aren't just a Yorkshire thing. They are also pretty standard in Canada. Everyone knows about poutine (fries, gravy and cheese curds)

Twenty years ago I drove from Halifax to Toronto in the company of an Acadian and an Englishman (I am from Ontario). The English guy was unfamiliar with poutine and when he asked about it we told him, but we told him too soon, somewhere around Moncton, New Brunswick and still many hours from the Quebec border.

At lunch at a roadside diner, he ordered poutine and received what appeared to be McCain frozen fries with microwaved Cheez Whiz and some gravy on them.

We clearly should have held off until we crossed to border.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 7:36 PM on June 11, 2023 [3 favorites]

Chips with gravy is commonplace in Australia too.

Japanese curry sauce on chips is the best though.
posted by the duck by the oboe at 8:50 PM on June 11, 2023

...but fries, dressing and gravy is a very, very common take out order in Newfoundland as well

If you're ever in Heart's Content I recommend upgrading your fish and chips at Legge's with fries dressing and gravy.
posted by monkeymike at 8:55 PM on June 11, 2023

Now I'm starving, so thanks for that!
posted by Space Kitty at 10:00 PM on June 11, 2023

A couple years ago, the outstanding YouTube channel Chinese Cooking Demystified did a sort of April Fool's "serious video on goofy topic" video that was about trying to make a Taco-Bell-style jianbing wrap, and he mentions in the video that, while Taco Bell has entered the Chinese market, they fundamentally misunderstood its market segment: the interior is done up kind of like a nice-ish bar, and they sell nice-ish beers.

In other words, in bringing Taco Bell to the Chinese market, the people in charge failed to understand that in the US, Taco Bell is not drinking food, but drunk food.

(Anyway I recommend watching the video and honestly every single other video on that channel because it's all fantastic)
posted by DoctorFedora at 10:01 PM on June 11, 2023 [2 favorites]

What is that high, whistling noise coming from inside my chest?

You put the kettle on? Yes, I'd love a cup.
posted by loquacious at 10:12 PM on June 11, 2023 [2 favorites]

I have learned many new words and food concepts from this post and delightful comments. Love this expression: "Blew my wee mind" (tip of the hat to sedimentary_deer). May adapt that saying to Texan, blew my wee mind, y'all!
posted by a humble nudibranch at 10:43 PM on June 11, 2023 [2 favorites]

a chippy tea

As euphonious as a crafty slash and a cheeky Nandos. There’s a villanelle here somewhere.
posted by clew at 10:43 PM on June 11, 2023 [2 favorites]

Oh man, I'm learning so much about foreign comfort food; I can't believe I never thought of deep frying pizza before this.
posted by yangj08 at 4:50 AM on June 12, 2023

local history on a polystyrene tray

I mean the variances alone on how a chippy serves the food. I’ll take mine wrapped in food grade paper, that is tthen covered on the outside by whatever random newspaper the chippy uses old editions of. Then rip a small hole to steal a few glorious chips as you walk to the nearest park or beach to consume.
posted by inflatablekiwi at 5:32 AM on June 12, 2023 [2 favorites]

Thinking of all this, I wondered about the strange fact that in Denmark, what the Brits refer to as a Chippie or Chipper, or something, is called a Grill Bar. Why? There are no grills in there, only deep-fryers. So I have researched it on the internet, and it seems that once upon a time, when industrialized chickens first arrived here, a big poultry manufacturer opened grill-bars with rotisserie chickens and fries, and remoulade, to promote their products. When the industry was well established, they sold the shops, and the owners branched out to also include deep fried plaice filets in their menus. Some places you might also get a "beef sandwich", with soft onions and gravy, and "pork sandwich" with pickled red cabbage and gravy. Some places deep fried the hamburger patties and the slices of already roasted pork. Well actually, they still do. It's just me who doesn't go there.
These original grill-bars became a model for Grill Bars all over the country, but it was increasingly rare they bothered to have the chickens and the grills, and on the other hand, they expanded to include sausages, and if the owners were Chinese, some Danish-Chinese standards (in which case they were called a Kina Grill, still no grill). I think the pork industry delivered some very good package solutions to further this development.
As a final twist, some Middle Eastern immigrants are now opening new rotisserie chicken shops, but they are not called Grill Bars, because at this point, that is whole other, specific, thing.
posted by mumimor at 5:38 AM on June 12, 2023 [2 favorites]

Make space here for William Duguid Burns tribute "To a Macaroni Pie"

Fair fa’ your sharp, acidic tang
Great Chieftain o’ the Scotch Pie gang!
Ye staun aboon the whole shebang
Steak, Mince or Mutton
Sworn foe of every hunger pang
And strainin’ button!...
posted by rongorongo at 6:01 AM on June 12, 2023 [2 favorites]

As an American, I envy the European genius of businesses based on quick to-go food that tastes awesome when you're drunk. Crepe vans outside pubs: genius! Doner kebabs! (Don't ask who the donor is.) Genius!

My buddy and I ran up to a crepe van once as it was closing, and we really, really wanted crepes. We offered them £40 for one crepe and they turned us down. (We were very drunk.) I guess they really, really, really wanted to go home.
posted by kirkaracha at 9:48 AM on June 12, 2023 [1 favorite]

On my 50th birthday I had a whiskey flight at the Bushmill's distillery followed by a fried hamburger somewhere in town. It was like they knew I was coming.
posted by whuppy at 11:18 AM on June 12, 2023 [2 favorites]

The first rule of flight club is, you don't talk about flight club.
;)
posted by Greg_Ace at 1:09 PM on June 12, 2023

I spent a day in Glasgow and ordered a pizza slice in some food court and the thing was so greasy. Easily the worst pizza I've ever had. I don't think they deep fried the slice but maybe they were doing a shitty food court approximation of that. I think my thoughts ordering it were "pizza, how could they ruin that?" and I duly found out.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 1:33 PM on June 12, 2023

I find it interesting that fries and gravy (I'm assuming some sort of actual gravy) is a drunk food in Europe, but a fancy steakhouse food (though usually with white gravy instead of brown) in the US.
posted by The_Vegetables at 2:22 PM on June 12, 2023

What is white gravy?

I've always been confused by this thing, but here is the first place I feel comfortable to ask. I mean, I know bechamel and eat it more than I should, but I don't really see it as a gravy. Am I wrong?

The association of gravy with drunk food for me is very much that during holidays, when you get up out of your chair after the wonderful meal and then some sitting around drinking and shouting, you will find leftovers and pour gravy over them, and life will feel good.

Even as a child, when you woke up at normal time and all the adults were still sleeping after a night of indulgence, there would still be leftovers, and a bit of gravy that you could heat up and life would be perfect. (Thanks granny <3)
posted by mumimor at 2:35 PM on June 12, 2023 [2 favorites]

Fries and gravy has been a New Jersey diner staple for decades, so fries and gravy aren't exclusively limited steakhouses in the US.
posted by mollweide at 3:05 PM on June 12, 2023 [1 favorite]

mumimor: What is white gravy?

I've always been confused by this thing, but here is the first place I feel comfortable to ask. I mean, I know bechamel and eat it more than I should, but I don't really see it as a gravy. Am I wrong?

From Alpha Foodie: "Though very similar, the key difference in making white gravy vs bechamel is texture and seasoning. White gravy is much thicker than bechamel and will often be served with only black pepper. Bechamel often contains nutmeg and onion."

In my own experience, and as a fan of both bechamel and white gravies, here are a few variations on white gravy throughout the U.S., and in particular the South. Often times these are made from a cold milk and flour mixture, rather than a roux, and are usually thicker than bechamel. Country gravy or sawmill gravy are usually--but not always--meat-free, and seasoned heavily with black pepper. Sausage gravy (or bacon) usually uses sausage grease and/or butter as the fat, added to the milk and flour mixture and seasoned with salt and pepper. Red eye gravy is ham based, and usually substitutes coffee for the liquid instead of milk.
posted by indexy at 3:24 PM on June 12, 2023 [4 favorites]

And per mollweide's comment on New Jersey gravy fries, one thing I really miss about living in New Orleans is getting gravy fries with the roast beef based debris gravy in po-boy sandwich shops. Best gravy fries I've ever had.
posted by indexy at 3:27 PM on June 12, 2023 [2 favorites]

like a taste bud defibrillator for drunk people
My taste buds are salivating at the thought and I'm not even drunk.
posted by dg at 4:09 PM on June 12, 2023 [1 favorite]

I know bechamel and eat it more than I should, but I don't really see it as a gravy. Am I wrong?

'Gravy' the word has so many different food meanings that it's a cultural thing to call different loosely related food toppings 'gravy' or not.
posted by The_Vegetables at 5:02 PM on June 12, 2023 [1 favorite]

According to half a dozen articles I found via a quick'n'dirty Google search, gravy is a subset of sauce - i.e. all gravies are sauces, but not all sauces are gravies. Both are based on either pan drippings from cooking meat or some other fat such as butter, but what makes it "gravy" is using flour or cornstarch as a thickening agent.

That said, I'm not 100% certain that's a be-all-end-all definition...
posted by Greg_Ace at 5:32 PM on June 12, 2023 [1 favorite]

imli chips sound fucking amazing
posted by dusty potato at 7:39 PM on June 12, 2023

That said, I'm not 100% certain that's a be-all-end-all definition...

The base sauces used in restaurant curries in the UK are often called 'gravy'. They're not thickened with flour, but tend to use onions or tomatoes, so they're self-thickening.
posted by pipeski at 4:34 AM on June 13, 2023 [1 favorite]

Meanwhile Béchamel, one of the original "mother sauces", uses flour.... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
posted by Greg_Ace at 8:21 AM on June 13, 2023 [2 favorites]

I just came back from a whirlwind tour of Ireland and the UK and in this wonderful pub in the Grassmarket in Edinburgh I ordered Scotsman's fries with an order of wings. As you may guess, these were fries with haggis and gravy and it competes with poutine now as one of my favorite foods. An argument could be made that it is, in fact poutine. Not being Canadian, however, I'll leave that fight to those with dogs.
posted by evilDoug at 8:39 AM on June 13, 2023 [1 favorite]

I spent many of my formative years in the North-West, and so was exposed to the hyper-local (Preston/Chorley area) order g "butter pie, chips, and gravy". Butter pie is the descendant of a dish consumed by (poor, persecuted) Catholics in ages gone by, and would actually be better described as a /potato and onion/ pie.

Anyway, slather that thing in gravy and serve it on a pile of thick cut chips and I feel like I'm a teenager again.
posted by avapoet at 1:58 PM on June 19, 2023