DeathPanels.org: The Disturbing Details Behind Health Care Reform!!1!!
August 30, 2009 10:25 PM Subscribe
People are starting to get a little worn out on Healthcare coverage, or at least, a little worn out on the way it's been covered. Thank god our own grrarrgh00 isn't listening. Because someone has to spread the truth about Obama's nazi socialist communist granny killing satanist witchcraft healthcare reform.
Might it have made more sense to link directly to his site rather than the project page?
I'm not sure if this is an improvement on the way it's been covered, though.
posted by crossoverman at 10:30 PM on August 30, 2009
I'm not sure if this is an improvement on the way it's been covered, though.
posted by crossoverman at 10:30 PM on August 30, 2009
Death Panel = Banhammer
This will make sense in the morning.
posted by joe lisboa at 10:53 PM on August 30, 2009
This will make sense in the morning.
posted by joe lisboa at 10:53 PM on August 30, 2009
Screw Death Panels. Why can't we get our Thunderdome Health Panels?
posted by Auden at 11:16 PM on August 30, 2009
posted by Auden at 11:16 PM on August 30, 2009
Didn't Jon Stewart cover this already?
posted by carfilhiot at 11:28 PM on August 30, 2009
posted by carfilhiot at 11:28 PM on August 30, 2009
I heard Obamacare calls for every bowling alley in Kentucky to be closed. And ugly babies will be fed to monkeys. And Al Franken will give creationists gynecological exams. Why doesn't the mainstream media talk about that?
posted by chasing at 11:45 PM on August 30, 2009 [4 favorites]
posted by chasing at 11:45 PM on August 30, 2009 [4 favorites]
Just came across this design, thought it'd be nice to share.
posted by _dario at 11:45 PM on August 30, 2009 [6 favorites]
posted by _dario at 11:45 PM on August 30, 2009 [6 favorites]
This bit is probably not so good:
<link rel="stylesheet" href="http://www.myspace.com/inleaguewithsatan666/theme.css">
posted by ryanrs at 11:51 PM on August 30, 2009
<link rel="stylesheet" href="http://www.myspace.com/inleaguewithsatan666/theme.css">
posted by ryanrs at 11:51 PM on August 30, 2009
People outside of the US are starting to get a little worn out on Healthcare coverage. Yes.
posted by the cuban at 12:02 AM on August 31, 2009 [2 favorites]
posted by the cuban at 12:02 AM on August 31, 2009 [2 favorites]
People outside of the US are starting to get a little worn out on Healthcare coverage. Yes.
We get tired of wondering how the hell Americans can be convinced that something that is so utterly necessary and such a benefit to them can be downright evil.
I'm not tired of the fight. Uninsured Americans need healthcare. Until that is won I'll support my American friends fighting the fight whether it be correcting misinformation about how much single payer systems in my country suck or just being another loud voice demanding that the most vulnerable members of society get looked after.
posted by Talez at 12:29 AM on August 31, 2009 [10 favorites]
We get tired of wondering how the hell Americans can be convinced that something that is so utterly necessary and such a benefit to them can be downright evil.
I'm not tired of the fight. Uninsured Americans need healthcare. Until that is won I'll support my American friends fighting the fight whether it be correcting misinformation about how much single payer systems in my country suck or just being another loud voice demanding that the most vulnerable members of society get looked after.
posted by Talez at 12:29 AM on August 31, 2009 [10 favorites]
chasing And ugly babies will be fed to monkeys.
That'd be a matter of disproportionate concern to Republican voters, particularly in view of the implicit cannibalism involved.
posted by aeschenkarnos at 12:33 AM on August 31, 2009
That'd be a matter of disproportionate concern to Republican voters, particularly in view of the implicit cannibalism involved.
posted by aeschenkarnos at 12:33 AM on August 31, 2009
"... Until that is won I'll support my American friends fighting the fight whether it be correcting misinformation about how much single payer systems in my country suck or just being another loud voice demanding that the most vulnerable members of society get looked after."
posted by Talez at 3:29 AM on August 31
This is my Person Sitting in [American] Darkness face.
posted by paulsc at 1:50 AM on August 31, 2009
posted by Talez at 3:29 AM on August 31
This is my Person Sitting in [American] Darkness face.
posted by paulsc at 1:50 AM on August 31, 2009
This stuff about cable news failing the American public by shielding it from nuance in the health care debate is exactly the thing that's been wrong with cable news for decades now.
Auden: "Screw Death Panels. Why can't we get our Thunderdome Health Panels?"
Come on now, can't we just get beyond Thunderdome?
posted by JHarris at 2:30 AM on August 31, 2009 [15 favorites]
Auden: "Screw Death Panels. Why can't we get our Thunderdome Health Panels?"
Come on now, can't we just get beyond Thunderdome?
posted by JHarris at 2:30 AM on August 31, 2009 [15 favorites]
Come on now, can't we just get beyond Thunderdome?
We don't need another hero, JHarris.
posted by cloax at 3:42 AM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
We don't need another hero, JHarris.
posted by cloax at 3:42 AM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
I'm more disturbed that that Pew article says that 39% of Republicans think the "Birther" conspiracy hasn't been covered enough in the media. WTF
posted by fungible at 3:56 AM on August 31, 2009
posted by fungible at 3:56 AM on August 31, 2009
We get tired of wondering how the hell Americans can be convinced that something that is so utterly necessary and such a benefit to them can be downright evil.
Because the biggest health problem facing America is a epidemic shortage of critical thinking skills.
posted by rokusan at 4:08 AM on August 31, 2009 [11 favorites]
Because the biggest health problem facing America is a epidemic shortage of critical thinking skills.
posted by rokusan at 4:08 AM on August 31, 2009 [11 favorites]
I love the Make Up Your Mind image, because it's so very true... but there's zero chance that the people who believe those things will be capable of understanding it.
I very much doubt your average birther could even name all four symbols, or even define one of them properly.
And even if they could name them... well, I'd love to see a man in the street interview asking people under 40 (or so) what the difference is between, say, Communism and Nazism.
posted by rokusan at 4:14 AM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
I very much doubt your average birther could even name all four symbols, or even define one of them properly.
And even if they could name them... well, I'd love to see a man in the street interview asking people under 40 (or so) what the difference is between, say, Communism and Nazism.
posted by rokusan at 4:14 AM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
There's obviously a health care crisis going on right now. I mean, 40% of our population is brain damaged: they still vote Republican EVEN AFTER THE LAST EIGHT YEARS. They're poor and they vote to give more money to the rich. They're sick and they vote to deny themselves health care. They're eating mercury from China, watching California burn, and witnessing the melting of our polar caps but think humans have nothing to do with anything. They equate bringing health care to everyone to genocide. They decry government-run programs, but are overjoyed that the FDIC protects their bank accounts, and don't hesitate to sign up for Medicare the second they're eligible. Add all that up and one can only conclude: brain damage.
posted by jamstigator at 4:28 AM on August 31, 2009 [26 favorites]
posted by jamstigator at 4:28 AM on August 31, 2009 [26 favorites]
Nah, jamstigator. They're just authoritarian idiots. They believe whatever the right-wingers tell them just because they're right-wingers.
posted by kldickson at 4:55 AM on August 31, 2009
posted by kldickson at 4:55 AM on August 31, 2009
I'd like to see the more moderate Republicans tell the fringe to go fuck themselves.
posted by kldickson at 4:56 AM on August 31, 2009 [3 favorites]
posted by kldickson at 4:56 AM on August 31, 2009 [3 favorites]
Come on now, can't we just get beyond Thunderdome?
Oh my god.
You did it. You finally did it.
posted by Pope Guilty at 5:02 AM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
Oh my god.
You did it. You finally did it.
posted by Pope Guilty at 5:02 AM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
Come on now, can't we just get beyond Thunderdome?
Now let us move on to the "Rangoon" version of this classic joke.
posted by Servo5678 at 5:51 AM on August 31, 2009
Now let us move on to the "Rangoon" version of this classic joke.
posted by Servo5678 at 5:51 AM on August 31, 2009
What's Thunderdome got to do got to do with it?
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 5:54 AM on August 31, 2009 [2 favorites]
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 5:54 AM on August 31, 2009 [2 favorites]
Pretty sleek site, nice (and simple) resource. I don't wander into MeFi Projects enough, apparently, so thanks for postin' this up on the main page. I may send it to a few people.
posted by six-or-six-thirty at 5:59 AM on August 31, 2009
posted by six-or-six-thirty at 5:59 AM on August 31, 2009
The "debate" about Health Care Reform really highlights the need for Education Reform, doesn't it?
posted by Sys Rq at 6:04 AM on August 31, 2009 [2 favorites]
posted by Sys Rq at 6:04 AM on August 31, 2009 [2 favorites]
Im your private health care
A health care for profit
Don't get procedures you want to do
Deutschmarks or dollars
American express will nicely thank you
Let me loosen up your collar
Tell me do you wanna see me do the shimmy again
posted by LouieLoco at 6:32 AM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
A health care for profit
Don't get procedures you want to do
Deutschmarks or dollars
American express will nicely thank you
Let me loosen up your collar
Tell me do you wanna see me do the shimmy again
posted by LouieLoco at 6:32 AM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
Where can we put up a people that these right-winger idiots can find to find out how many of them think he's all four at the same time?
posted by kldickson at 6:39 AM on August 31, 2009
posted by kldickson at 6:39 AM on August 31, 2009
Guys, guys, it is so not about the death panels anymore.
It's about circumcision.
"It is President Obama who wants [to] mandate circumcision ... And that means, if we need to save our penises from anybody, it's Obama." - Rush Limbaugh
I wish I were making this up.
posted by The Bellman at 6:57 AM on August 31, 2009 [3 favorites]
It's about circumcision.
"It is President Obama who wants [to] mandate circumcision ... And that means, if we need to save our penises from anybody, it's Obama." - Rush Limbaugh
I wish I were making this up.
posted by The Bellman at 6:57 AM on August 31, 2009 [3 favorites]
The Bellman,
1) Eponysterical
and
2) I'm glad I wasn't drinking soda, because I might have spit out my soda at that.
posted by kldickson at 7:13 AM on August 31, 2009
1) Eponysterical
and
2) I'm glad I wasn't drinking soda, because I might have spit out my soda at that.
posted by kldickson at 7:13 AM on August 31, 2009
^
That is an actual quote? Wow, has the far right fallen off the cliff yet?
posted by Mastercheddaar at 7:14 AM on August 31, 2009
That is an actual quote? Wow, has the far right fallen off the cliff yet?
posted by Mastercheddaar at 7:14 AM on August 31, 2009
Mastercheddar: Yup, it seems legit. Unfortunately, this may lead to a national discussion about Rush's penis, and we really don't what, do we? Just think of the visuals (or rather, don't).
It's also natural that Limbaugh is so concerned about circumcision, dickhead that he is.
posted by Skeptic at 7:21 AM on August 31, 2009
It's also natural that Limbaugh is so concerned about circumcision, dickhead that he is.
posted by Skeptic at 7:21 AM on August 31, 2009
Mastercheddaar: "Wow, has the far right fallen off the cliff yet?"
Haven't you learned? There is no cliff.
posted by Kadin2048 at 7:24 AM on August 31, 2009 [3 favorites]
Haven't you learned? There is no cliff.
posted by Kadin2048 at 7:24 AM on August 31, 2009 [3 favorites]
BABABOOEY BABABOOEY RUSH LIMBAUGH'S PENIS BABABOOEY
posted by Sys Rq at 7:26 AM on August 31, 2009 [3 favorites]
posted by Sys Rq at 7:26 AM on August 31, 2009 [3 favorites]
From The Bellman's link:
posted by me & my monkey at 7:27 AM on August 31, 2009 [5 favorites]
So now that we're talking about Limbaugh's penis, all of a sudden, we're in a world where the tiniest measure of government suggestion about sexual health equals a full onslaught against privacy.Nice.
posted by me & my monkey at 7:27 AM on August 31, 2009 [5 favorites]
The "debate" about Health Care Reform really highlights the need for Education Reform idea that Democracy is not the best form of government, doesn't it?
Sorry. I've just been feeling a bit fed up with the whole "government by the people" thing since the election; the prop 8 fiasco came as a complete shock to this Californian native.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:28 AM on August 31, 2009
Sorry. I've just been feeling a bit fed up with the whole "government by the people" thing since the election; the prop 8 fiasco came as a complete shock to this Californian native.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:28 AM on August 31, 2009
I routinely help out an elderly lady who is a Democrat and a Jew, so you can imagine she's not a huge supporter of the Right — but somehow, that "death panel" thing has gotten into her mind. As much as we might laugh at it, it's an incredibly powerful meme. I was thinking about this as I drove past a car with white lettering across its rear window: HISTORY OF SOCIALISM, DEATH AND DESTRUCTION. It's the freakin' Ringu of memes, and it has penetrated further than some right-wing pigeons (from outer space, sent here to destroy the human race ...) that we'd like to believe are the only ones susceptible to infection.
posted by adipocere at 7:30 AM on August 31, 2009
posted by adipocere at 7:30 AM on August 31, 2009
The message to Obama from the American people is crystal clear on this issue: We don't need another hero.
posted by kaseijin at 7:31 AM on August 31, 2009
posted by kaseijin at 7:31 AM on August 31, 2009
The "debate" about Health Care Reform really highlights the idea that Democracy is not the best form of government, doesn't it?
You mean because the losers win by whining?
posted by Sys Rq at 7:32 AM on August 31, 2009
You mean because the losers win by whining?
posted by Sys Rq at 7:32 AM on August 31, 2009
Man, the Zombie Apocalypse sure is different than the books.
posted by The Whelk at 7:52 AM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by The Whelk at 7:52 AM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
So now that we're talking about Limbaugh's penis,
Could we please, please not talk about that? Ever?
posted by blucevalo at 8:29 AM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
Could we please, please not talk about that? Ever?
posted by blucevalo at 8:29 AM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
Now it becomes evident why the Bush crew locked down their townhalls with such hyper-security and screening of participants. It's because they were preemptively defending against the tactic they were planning to use against Democratic townhalls!
posted by JHarris at 9:06 AM on August 31, 2009
posted by JHarris at 9:06 AM on August 31, 2009
JHarris: "Now it becomes evident why the Bush crew locked down their townhalls with such hyper-security and screening of participants. It's because they were preemptively defending against the tactic they were planning to use against Democratic townhalls!"
Rush Limbaugh covering for Pat Sajak on late 80's talk show.
posted by boo_radley at 9:17 AM on August 31, 2009
37% of people can identify what the Public Option is from a selection of three definitions, a result not very different to random guessing.
Care to guess how many people can interpret what "The President wants to kill your grandmother" means? More than 37% I expect.
The pornography of hate is going to define the next election, and the next. Without the concrete failures of George W. Bush to depend on, how can the Democrats hope to defeat it? Dramatic changes in messaging are going to be required.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:23 AM on August 31, 2009
Care to guess how many people can interpret what "The President wants to kill your grandmother" means? More than 37% I expect.
The pornography of hate is going to define the next election, and the next. Without the concrete failures of George W. Bush to depend on, how can the Democrats hope to defeat it? Dramatic changes in messaging are going to be required.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:23 AM on August 31, 2009
This is great...for those of us that read details, it's a great summary of the need for and purposes of reform.
Unfortunately, the rest will just see skulls and Nazi lettering and figure it's true, Obama DOES want death panels. >sigh<
posted by Mental Wimp at 10:01 AM on August 31, 2009
Unfortunately, the rest will just see skulls and Nazi lettering and figure it's true, Obama DOES want death panels. >sigh<
posted by Mental Wimp at 10:01 AM on August 31, 2009
I just found this - Socialism: Any country powerful enough to give you anything you need is also powerful enough to take away everything you have.
That is some spectacular mental gymnastics.
posted by knapah at 11:18 AM on August 31, 2009
That is some spectacular mental gymnastics.
posted by knapah at 11:18 AM on August 31, 2009
You just don't get it.
When I first landed in California back in the 80's, and my photo gig was over, I started looking for some quick short term work. I answered an ad in the paper for a telemarketing job. I had no idea what telemarketing stood for. I was handed a script. It was so stupid, I kept saying "but nobody would believe this!". The manager of the place told me: "you don't get it". It took me a few days, and then I got it. The whole point was to make the script stupid. Any person with half a brain could write a more intelligent script, but they specifically wanted a stupid one. Why? Well, of course, because it was a filter mechanism. If a customer was stupid enough to fall for the obvious lies and impossibilities in the script - well, that's the kind of doofus you wanted for a customer since they are easy to separate from their money. Soon, I quit the place.
Since that very valuable lesson, I have observed the same phenomenon everywhere. The ads on papers plastered to utility poles "I need 30 people to lose 30 pounds!!!". In back of magazines: "The sure fire method to become rich in less than 1 year". TV ads: "How to buy and sell houses and become extremely rich - free seminar!".
If you scoff at how stupid the advertising is - then it is YOU who doesn't get it. The advertising is perfectly clever. It is a filter. A carefully constructed, researched, smart filter.
What makes you think it is any different in politics? You may scoff at the stupidity of "death panels". You may laugh and criticize in a thousand ways the stupid idiotic memes propagated by the right wing forces. But it is you who is missing the point. You are not getting it. Of course the memes are stupid - but that is the point. You get no brownie points for spotting the obvious absurdities. You are missing the point.
The point is to so flood the political discourse with stupidity, that it lowers the IQ of the debate across the board. THAT IS INTENTIONAL. Why?
It bogs down the thinkers - by depriving the thinker - of the very tools which give him/her an edge. When even simple facts are in dispute, when the absurdity of the claims is so huge, it reaches a critical mass - and intelligent discourse is impossible. All the intelligence in the world won't help, because the discourse is not amenable to the tools of intelligence. Notable example: the Barney Frank controversy re: "dining room table". People here were crowing on behalf of BF. I took a different view - you are missing the point. Barney Frank lost. How? He was sidetracked. His intelligence was beside the point, because the discourse did not lend itself to intelligent debate - and he was reduced to snark, reduced to the level of insult - exactly what was wanted. He lost. Time was wasted, energy was drained, progress was stopped. Instead of discussing details of implementation, he had to address a dining table. A sick and dying patient was waiting - do you think he'd be more gratified to hear about the dining table, or details about how to pay for his treatment?
It is like flooding the system with bad data in such massive amounts that you cannot generate an algorithm for a solution. There is too much junk floating around.
We need to re-think our tactics. The other side is ahead of the game. We are exactly where they want us - getting bogged down in criticizing the utter absurdities... and as soon as one is shot down, another pops up, and then another and another, and then suddenly the first one comes back to life like a zombie and needs to be shot down again. You may as well fight the see. A change of tactics is necessary. And a deeper re-thinking of strategy. Because the other side is far more clever than you give them credit for. You don't get it, yet, but you better wake up, and fast.
posted by VikingSword at 11:53 AM on August 31, 2009 [73 favorites]
When I first landed in California back in the 80's, and my photo gig was over, I started looking for some quick short term work. I answered an ad in the paper for a telemarketing job. I had no idea what telemarketing stood for. I was handed a script. It was so stupid, I kept saying "but nobody would believe this!". The manager of the place told me: "you don't get it". It took me a few days, and then I got it. The whole point was to make the script stupid. Any person with half a brain could write a more intelligent script, but they specifically wanted a stupid one. Why? Well, of course, because it was a filter mechanism. If a customer was stupid enough to fall for the obvious lies and impossibilities in the script - well, that's the kind of doofus you wanted for a customer since they are easy to separate from their money. Soon, I quit the place.
Since that very valuable lesson, I have observed the same phenomenon everywhere. The ads on papers plastered to utility poles "I need 30 people to lose 30 pounds!!!". In back of magazines: "The sure fire method to become rich in less than 1 year". TV ads: "How to buy and sell houses and become extremely rich - free seminar!".
If you scoff at how stupid the advertising is - then it is YOU who doesn't get it. The advertising is perfectly clever. It is a filter. A carefully constructed, researched, smart filter.
What makes you think it is any different in politics? You may scoff at the stupidity of "death panels". You may laugh and criticize in a thousand ways the stupid idiotic memes propagated by the right wing forces. But it is you who is missing the point. You are not getting it. Of course the memes are stupid - but that is the point. You get no brownie points for spotting the obvious absurdities. You are missing the point.
The point is to so flood the political discourse with stupidity, that it lowers the IQ of the debate across the board. THAT IS INTENTIONAL. Why?
It bogs down the thinkers - by depriving the thinker - of the very tools which give him/her an edge. When even simple facts are in dispute, when the absurdity of the claims is so huge, it reaches a critical mass - and intelligent discourse is impossible. All the intelligence in the world won't help, because the discourse is not amenable to the tools of intelligence. Notable example: the Barney Frank controversy re: "dining room table". People here were crowing on behalf of BF. I took a different view - you are missing the point. Barney Frank lost. How? He was sidetracked. His intelligence was beside the point, because the discourse did not lend itself to intelligent debate - and he was reduced to snark, reduced to the level of insult - exactly what was wanted. He lost. Time was wasted, energy was drained, progress was stopped. Instead of discussing details of implementation, he had to address a dining table. A sick and dying patient was waiting - do you think he'd be more gratified to hear about the dining table, or details about how to pay for his treatment?
It is like flooding the system with bad data in such massive amounts that you cannot generate an algorithm for a solution. There is too much junk floating around.
We need to re-think our tactics. The other side is ahead of the game. We are exactly where they want us - getting bogged down in criticizing the utter absurdities... and as soon as one is shot down, another pops up, and then another and another, and then suddenly the first one comes back to life like a zombie and needs to be shot down again. You may as well fight the see. A change of tactics is necessary. And a deeper re-thinking of strategy. Because the other side is far more clever than you give them credit for. You don't get it, yet, but you better wake up, and fast.
posted by VikingSword at 11:53 AM on August 31, 2009 [73 favorites]
I think it's brilliant, actually. I hope people looking for info on "death panels" find this site and learn something.
posted by Mister_A at 11:53 AM on August 31, 2009
posted by Mister_A at 11:53 AM on August 31, 2009
Unfortunately, this may lead to a national discussion about Rush's penis, and we really don't what, do we? Just think of the visuals (or rather, don't).
TOO LATE. TOO.... late. *shudder, puke*
I prefer not to think of Rush Limbaugh as being anatomically correct, and don't appreciate being reminded... *hurk* excuse me...
posted by louche mustachio at 11:56 AM on August 31, 2009
TOO LATE. TOO.... late. *shudder, puke*
I prefer not to think of Rush Limbaugh as being anatomically correct, and don't appreciate being reminded... *hurk* excuse me...
posted by louche mustachio at 11:56 AM on August 31, 2009
VikingSword, you're right, the whole mess that is the healthcare reform debate is a lot like a DDOS attack.
posted by Mister_A at 11:56 AM on August 31, 2009
posted by Mister_A at 11:56 AM on August 31, 2009
I'd like to see the more moderate Republicans tell the fringe to go fuck themselves.
There are moderate Republican politicians, but moderate Republican voters have already left the party. So the pols have to pander to the crazies in order to stay in office. It's a downward spiral of the entire Republican Party, ensuring Democratic majority for years to come.
(Yes, I'm a fiscal conservative, but have never voted Republican and at this rate never will.)
posted by coolguymichael at 11:59 AM on August 31, 2009
There are moderate Republican politicians, but moderate Republican voters have already left the party. So the pols have to pander to the crazies in order to stay in office. It's a downward spiral of the entire Republican Party, ensuring Democratic majority for years to come.
(Yes, I'm a fiscal conservative, but have never voted Republican and at this rate never will.)
posted by coolguymichael at 11:59 AM on August 31, 2009
VikingSword, great comment. To me the other obvious thing that is not talked about is that the Democrats have the votes, at least technically. Is this not a matter of "physician heal thyself," rather than expending so much negative energy on "the other side?"
posted by wallstreet1929 at 4:29 PM on August 31, 2009
posted by wallstreet1929 at 4:29 PM on August 31, 2009
This is great...for those of us that read details, it's a great summary of the need for and purposes of reform.
Unfortunately, the rest will just see skulls and Nazi lettering and figure it's true, Obama DOES want death panels. >sigh<>
So, I put the link up on Facebook today, and then had a conversation with a very smart, very progressive, and politically active friend of mine. It went a little something like this:
Him: That website makes me angry
Me: Did you see what happens when you click the links though? I thought it was funny
Him:
Me: The humor is perhaps a little subtle
Him: A little too subtle. And I actually don't get where this site comes down on the issue
Me: Pro. It's sort of a bait and switch?
Him: If it is mocking the death panel people, it does a pretty bad job
Me: My notion of what is funny is possibly skewed right now
Maybe it's just that liberals are feeling super on edge about this issue (I know I am), but if even the "good guys" don't get it, I'm not sure other people will either. I liked it though. Hmm.
posted by naoko at 5:23 PM on August 31, 2009
Unfortunately, the rest will just see skulls and Nazi lettering and figure it's true, Obama DOES want death panels. >sigh<>
So, I put the link up on Facebook today, and then had a conversation with a very smart, very progressive, and politically active friend of mine. It went a little something like this:
Him: That website makes me angry
Me: Did you see what happens when you click the links though? I thought it was funny
Him:
Me: The humor is perhaps a little subtle
Him: A little too subtle. And I actually don't get where this site comes down on the issue
Me: Pro. It's sort of a bait and switch?
Him: If it is mocking the death panel people, it does a pretty bad job
Me: My notion of what is funny is possibly skewed right now
Maybe it's just that liberals are feeling super on edge about this issue (I know I am), but if even the "good guys" don't get it, I'm not sure other people will either. I liked it though. Hmm.
posted by naoko at 5:23 PM on August 31, 2009
Ugh, italics fail - pretend they stopped after the first paragraph.
posted by naoko at 5:24 PM on August 31, 2009
posted by naoko at 5:24 PM on August 31, 2009
I think you nailed it VikingSword - this type of tactic is known as a 'Gish Gallop' in anti-creationist circles - named after it's inventor Duane Gish who's debating style consisted of spouting inane lies at a phenomenal rate without interruption.
The fact that it takes at least ten times as long too refute even the most obvious of lies as it does to repeat them, coupled with a... flexible attitude to the ethics of intententional lying makes this technique annoyingly successful in persuading all but the most informed of people that the 'galloper' is onto something
posted by JustAsItSounds at 7:35 PM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
The fact that it takes at least ten times as long too refute even the most obvious of lies as it does to repeat them, coupled with a... flexible attitude to the ethics of intententional lying makes this technique annoyingly successful in persuading all but the most informed of people that the 'galloper' is onto something
posted by JustAsItSounds at 7:35 PM on August 31, 2009 [1 favorite]
VikingSword: "A change of tactics is necessary. And a deeper re-thinking of strategy. Because the other side is far more clever than you give them credit for. You don't get it, yet, but you better wake up, and fast."
A. "You (just) don't get it (,do you)" is a poor phrase to use when trying to convince anyone of anything.
B. We know this, oh how we know it. The proper response to this idiocy is to edit it out, which is necessarily elitist. What could Barney Frank have done? Snark IS the acceptable response to idiocy, because it's an attempt to shame the questioner for being stupid. But the media then took that and filled the airwaves with it, as if the question were worthy of defense!
That, IMO, is the problem. The media, covering stupidity as if it deserved a seat at the table. As if Orly Taitz, "Lawyer, Realtor, Dentist," deserved to be on the air coast to coast on cable news.
posted by JHarris at 3:25 AM on September 1, 2009
A. "You (just) don't get it (,do you)" is a poor phrase to use when trying to convince anyone of anything.
B. We know this, oh how we know it. The proper response to this idiocy is to edit it out, which is necessarily elitist. What could Barney Frank have done? Snark IS the acceptable response to idiocy, because it's an attempt to shame the questioner for being stupid. But the media then took that and filled the airwaves with it, as if the question were worthy of defense!
That, IMO, is the problem. The media, covering stupidity as if it deserved a seat at the table. As if Orly Taitz, "Lawyer, Realtor, Dentist," deserved to be on the air coast to coast on cable news.
posted by JHarris at 3:25 AM on September 1, 2009
Socialism: Any country powerful enough to give you anything you need is also powerful enough to take away everything you have.
Yeah, some of the zipperheads who subscribe to this notion also support the death penalty. LOL...erk!!!
posted by Mental Wimp at 10:38 AM on September 1, 2009
Yeah, some of the zipperheads who subscribe to this notion also support the death penalty. LOL...erk!!!
posted by Mental Wimp at 10:38 AM on September 1, 2009
That, IMO, is the problem. The media, covering stupidity as if it deserved a seat at the table.
That's just journalistic narcissism. Journos notice bloggers are blogging in their blogs about them, and there's just no stopping whatever warranted that attention. Ohmigawd, they ran my clip on The Daily Show! I'm a superstar! In TV, where the only thing that matters is ratings, all publicity really is good publicity: Look at Glenn Beck—everyone else is. Why? Because everyone's talking about Glenn Beck. Fox News would be insane to get rid of him, or to tell him to tone it down a little, or to offer him psychiatric counseling. Hell, I'd be shocked if they weren't encouraging him to take it up a notch, or dexing his decaf or something. Crazy is ratings gold.
It really will go away if we all ignore it. That's how the TV business works. Maybe there'll still be a big ol' stain on the American sofa, but it's still worth paper training the dog, y'know?
posted by Sys Rq at 11:18 AM on September 1, 2009 [1 favorite]
That's just journalistic narcissism. Journos notice bloggers are blogging in their blogs about them, and there's just no stopping whatever warranted that attention. Ohmigawd, they ran my clip on The Daily Show! I'm a superstar! In TV, where the only thing that matters is ratings, all publicity really is good publicity: Look at Glenn Beck—everyone else is. Why? Because everyone's talking about Glenn Beck. Fox News would be insane to get rid of him, or to tell him to tone it down a little, or to offer him psychiatric counseling. Hell, I'd be shocked if they weren't encouraging him to take it up a notch, or dexing his decaf or something. Crazy is ratings gold.
It really will go away if we all ignore it. That's how the TV business works. Maybe there'll still be a big ol' stain on the American sofa, but it's still worth paper training the dog, y'know?
posted by Sys Rq at 11:18 AM on September 1, 2009 [1 favorite]
Man's Finger Bitten Off in Scuffle at Health Care Rally
posted by armage at 12:13 AM on September 4, 2009
posted by armage at 12:13 AM on September 4, 2009
California's Real Death Panels: Insurers Deny 21% of Claims
posted by homunculus at 6:28 PM on September 4, 2009
posted by homunculus at 6:28 PM on September 4, 2009
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posted by nola at 10:30 PM on August 30, 2009 [2 favorites]