“Props to anyone who tries to be fashionable in ireland”
August 17, 2021 11:25 AM Subscribe
A lot of those seem like bullying intended to humiliate rather than good hearted teasing.
posted by Stoof at 11:41 AM on August 17, 2021 [29 favorites]
posted by Stoof at 11:41 AM on August 17, 2021 [29 favorites]
I'm very used to asshats screaming random, hurtful things out their car windows at me.
To break the negativity here, I was surprised the other day when the person calling out the window was a child, and all he had to say was "Happy Birthday!" which really made my day for some reason.
posted by deadaluspark at 11:47 AM on August 17, 2021 [22 favorites]
To break the negativity here, I was surprised the other day when the person calling out the window was a child, and all he had to say was "Happy Birthday!" which really made my day for some reason.
posted by deadaluspark at 11:47 AM on August 17, 2021 [22 favorites]
I feel like Reginald D. Hunter's I Speak Irish bit would be extremely helpful for the Americans in the room.
posted by cendawanita at 11:54 AM on August 17, 2021 [45 favorites]
posted by cendawanita at 11:54 AM on August 17, 2021 [45 favorites]
I can see how this is going to go down -which is fair, it’s literally people yelling at other peoples’ clothes- so am going to simply post this one that I enjoyed and will assume that all involved have recovered.
One my colleagues had an ankle-length dark green serge greatcoat, and when he burst through the office doors one day, another looked up and said: “What news of Stalingrad?”
posted by Going To Maine at 11:55 AM on August 17, 2021 [124 favorites]
One my colleagues had an ankle-length dark green serge greatcoat, and when he burst through the office doors one day, another looked up and said: “What news of Stalingrad?”
posted by Going To Maine at 11:55 AM on August 17, 2021 [124 favorites]
Maybe you have to grow up with an Irish parent to understand how to enjoy a cutting remark at your expense as long as it's fucking hilarious.
posted by bleep at 11:59 AM on August 17, 2021 [65 favorites]
posted by bleep at 11:59 AM on August 17, 2021 [65 favorites]
There's a fine line between abuse and hilarity and I hate to make blanket remarks about entire cultures but like it's a good line to familiarize yourself with because then you get to laugh a lot and we all need more of that.
posted by bleep at 12:00 PM on August 17, 2021 [12 favorites]
posted by bleep at 12:00 PM on August 17, 2021 [12 favorites]
To be fair, who hasn't spotted someone in a long black coat and sunglasses and had to suppress the urge to call them 'Neo'?
This is something specific to Irish culture that a friend of mine who grew up in rural Ireland does a lot - taking the piss out of anything to do with fashion or any sign that someone's taking themselves in any way seriously. It's not malicious, but it only really works in a place where everyone gives as good as they get (see cendawanita's link). Out of that context, of course it can be hurtful, etc. And any culture of knocking people who get 'above their station' is going to be problematic outside of this kind of cultural niche.
posted by pipeski at 12:14 PM on August 17, 2021 [24 favorites]
This is something specific to Irish culture that a friend of mine who grew up in rural Ireland does a lot - taking the piss out of anything to do with fashion or any sign that someone's taking themselves in any way seriously. It's not malicious, but it only really works in a place where everyone gives as good as they get (see cendawanita's link). Out of that context, of course it can be hurtful, etc. And any culture of knocking people who get 'above their station' is going to be problematic outside of this kind of cultural niche.
posted by pipeski at 12:14 PM on August 17, 2021 [24 favorites]
After a heavy rainstorm, walked into a bar in Dublin. Took off my (inadequate) baseball cap, to find that the rain and cap meant the top of my hair was squashed down, with some of it flattened forwards, while on either side it was sticking up and out.
Lady behind the bar glances at me for less than a second: "What'll you be having, Flock of Seagulls?" Cue general hilarity across the room.
We dated for nine months afterwards.
posted by Wordshore at 12:16 PM on August 17, 2021 [87 favorites]
Lady behind the bar glances at me for less than a second: "What'll you be having, Flock of Seagulls?" Cue general hilarity across the room.
We dated for nine months afterwards.
posted by Wordshore at 12:16 PM on August 17, 2021 [87 favorites]
A relative is married to an Irish dude, and he and another relative of mine take the piss out of each other constantly. It is moderately awkward in family settings (you can never know who’s rolling with the gag and who isn’t) but my general vibe is that they understand each other and so I will let it be. My uptightness is not their uptightness.
posted by Going To Maine at 12:21 PM on August 17, 2021 [5 favorites]
posted by Going To Maine at 12:21 PM on August 17, 2021 [5 favorites]
I feel like Reginald D. Hunter's I Speak Irish bit would be extremely helpful for the Americans in the room.
And Aisling Bea's dating bit.
It's a different culture, yo. Maybe don't be so quick to pass judgment.
posted by myotahapea at 12:25 PM on August 17, 2021 [34 favorites]
And Aisling Bea's dating bit.
It's a different culture, yo. Maybe don't be so quick to pass judgment.
posted by myotahapea at 12:25 PM on August 17, 2021 [34 favorites]
I have a friend who constantly takes the piss out of me and cracks me up while doing it.
1. He's actually a comedian, so his jokes are usually pretty fucking good.
2. I have known him for nearly twenty years, and our friendship and his kindness are absolutely big parts of why it makes me laugh when HE does it.
If it was some stranger on the street, it would have to be really fuckin funny to feel the same way about it. I totally think it's reasonable for people in close relationships to take the piss out of each other.
Some of these in the thread are genuinely funny, but a lot of it reminds me of the American thing where someone isn't trying to be funny, they're just a big shithead and the main thing that they dog on your clothing about is that it's not expensive/fancy enough, to try to shame you for being poorer than them.
posted by deadaluspark at 12:28 PM on August 17, 2021 [2 favorites]
1. He's actually a comedian, so his jokes are usually pretty fucking good.
2. I have known him for nearly twenty years, and our friendship and his kindness are absolutely big parts of why it makes me laugh when HE does it.
If it was some stranger on the street, it would have to be really fuckin funny to feel the same way about it. I totally think it's reasonable for people in close relationships to take the piss out of each other.
Some of these in the thread are genuinely funny, but a lot of it reminds me of the American thing where someone isn't trying to be funny, they're just a big shithead and the main thing that they dog on your clothing about is that it's not expensive/fancy enough, to try to shame you for being poorer than them.
posted by deadaluspark at 12:28 PM on August 17, 2021 [2 favorites]
Mod note: One comment removed. Please avoid American-centric comments in thread about non-American culture. Linking the microaggressions section for reference.
posted by loup (staff) at 12:34 PM on August 17, 2021 [25 favorites]
posted by loup (staff) at 12:34 PM on August 17, 2021 [25 favorites]
Judging from that thread, the only way to avoid snarky comments on your wardrobe in Ireland is to go around stark naked.
posted by adamrice at 12:36 PM on August 17, 2021 [3 favorites]
posted by adamrice at 12:36 PM on August 17, 2021 [3 favorites]
this is a thing I...did not know about Irish culture. I'll admit, it can be pretty fecking funny, but might have really thrown me for a loop without context.
What news of Stalingrad? indeed...
posted by supermedusa at 12:45 PM on August 17, 2021
What news of Stalingrad? indeed...
posted by supermedusa at 12:45 PM on August 17, 2021
On the other hand, the biggest culture shock I ever experienced was when I spent a night in Paris after a semester in Dublin on my way home. It was really shocking.
Re adamrice: the only way to avoid snarky comments in Ireland is to wear GAA sport outfits everywhere.
posted by kmt at 12:49 PM on August 17, 2021 [4 favorites]
Re adamrice: the only way to avoid snarky comments in Ireland is to wear GAA sport outfits everywhere.
posted by kmt at 12:49 PM on August 17, 2021 [4 favorites]
Thanks for the link. There's a lot of great ones in that thread I can easily imagine in the bars, streets and shops of Ireland. I haven't been back for several years now, and it's scratching at that itch again. There's a couple of annual conferences in my academic subject domain in Ireland, so when it's safe to do the in-person thing again...
So far, this one is my favourite and it's easy to imagine:
@Bogiesalterego:
Early 90s Omagh, bloke comes into the bar wearing a puffa jacket, 120 notes it cost, everyone is mocking him, barman says 'not sure why you're mocking him I've one of those at home...' lad getting mocked "See?" Barman continues 'aye its round the immersion heater' uproar
posted by Wordshore at 12:51 PM on August 17, 2021 [27 favorites]
So far, this one is my favourite and it's easy to imagine:
@Bogiesalterego:
Early 90s Omagh, bloke comes into the bar wearing a puffa jacket, 120 notes it cost, everyone is mocking him, barman says 'not sure why you're mocking him I've one of those at home...' lad getting mocked "See?" Barman continues 'aye its round the immersion heater' uproar
posted by Wordshore at 12:51 PM on August 17, 2021 [27 favorites]
I don't know if this is in the Twitter thread:
"Irish Army private in 1991. When he caught sight of President Mary Robinson in her canary yellow feathery attire while waiting in line for military inspection, he quipped to his colleagues: "Here comes Big Bird." Unfortunately it was overheard, as was his colleagues' laughter. And he was duly fined £60."
posted by night_train at 12:54 PM on August 17, 2021 [5 favorites]
"Irish Army private in 1991. When he caught sight of President Mary Robinson in her canary yellow feathery attire while waiting in line for military inspection, he quipped to his colleagues: "Here comes Big Bird." Unfortunately it was overheard, as was his colleagues' laughter. And he was duly fined £60."
posted by night_train at 12:54 PM on August 17, 2021 [5 favorites]
My wife dyes her hair red. Not fire-engine red or anything particularly eye-catching, just a deep, pretty dark red. The first time she did this when she was doing a post-doc in Minnesota, she got a day full of clucking "Well aren't you... creative?" from everyone she interacted with. That kind of faux-nice passive-aggressive bullshit sounds way worse to me than someone at least trying for the joke.
posted by Navelgazer at 12:56 PM on August 17, 2021 [36 favorites]
posted by Navelgazer at 12:56 PM on August 17, 2021 [36 favorites]
I am an American, but I lived a year in Dublin while on fellowship at NCAD. I was very used to wearing sunglasses, because it's just... sunnier... in America, and pretty constantly got random shouts of " ' Ey Bono! " from young guys. I just thought it was funny and would occasionally nod back.
My favorite though was walking near NCAD once, I guess I looked too long at a young gentleman wearing the tough guy getup of the times (circa 2006), which was a zip up jacket and running pants, known as 'trackies,'* and these velcro tennis shoes.** He hopped off the stone wall and scowled at me, growling "Ya want yer teeth in a bag?!"
I was just kinda surprised and said "Uh... no?" in my of course American accent and his buds all cracked up laughing.
Having grown up with a pretty square-in-the-demographic Scots-Irish Kentucky family, though, the one liners weren't too different from any family get-togethers.
* - Irish MeFites should feel quite free to correct whether I am defining trackies right.
** - If I wanted to give some sarcasm about outfits, I would have asked one of these young lads if they had our shuffleboard times reserved for Saturday morning.
posted by Tchozz at 12:56 PM on August 17, 2021 [4 favorites]
My favorite though was walking near NCAD once, I guess I looked too long at a young gentleman wearing the tough guy getup of the times (circa 2006), which was a zip up jacket and running pants, known as 'trackies,'* and these velcro tennis shoes.** He hopped off the stone wall and scowled at me, growling "Ya want yer teeth in a bag?!"
I was just kinda surprised and said "Uh... no?" in my of course American accent and his buds all cracked up laughing.
Having grown up with a pretty square-in-the-demographic Scots-Irish Kentucky family, though, the one liners weren't too different from any family get-togethers.
* - Irish MeFites should feel quite free to correct whether I am defining trackies right.
** - If I wanted to give some sarcasm about outfits, I would have asked one of these young lads if they had our shuffleboard times reserved for Saturday morning.
posted by Tchozz at 12:56 PM on August 17, 2021 [4 favorites]
I would never, but these made me laugh my ass off.
posted by latkes at 1:05 PM on August 17, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by latkes at 1:05 PM on August 17, 2021 [1 favorite]
Kind of reminds me of this Bono quote:
"In the United States, you look at the guy that lives in the mansion on the hill, and you think, you know, one day, if I work really hard, I could live in that mansion. In Ireland, people look up at the guy in the mansion on the hill and go, one day, I'm going to get that bastard."
posted by The Card Cheat at 1:18 PM on August 17, 2021 [87 favorites]
"In the United States, you look at the guy that lives in the mansion on the hill, and you think, you know, one day, if I work really hard, I could live in that mansion. In Ireland, people look up at the guy in the mansion on the hill and go, one day, I'm going to get that bastard."
posted by The Card Cheat at 1:18 PM on August 17, 2021 [87 favorites]
pretty constantly got random shouts of " ' Ey Bono! " from young guys.
If you were anywhere near Dalkey, they probably thought you actually were him. He's a common sight around those parts.
posted by acb at 1:20 PM on August 17, 2021 [2 favorites]
If you were anywhere near Dalkey, they probably thought you actually were him. He's a common sight around those parts.
posted by acb at 1:20 PM on August 17, 2021 [2 favorites]
A lot of these seem pretty good natured to me and designed more to include rather than exclude: "A Scottish classic: Someone wearing Camoflauge Cargo Trousers and a High Vis Jacket at work, someone shouts at the boy "Fucks' sakes mate ye wanty be seen or no?"."
posted by jamjam at 1:20 PM on August 17, 2021 [54 favorites]
posted by jamjam at 1:20 PM on August 17, 2021 [54 favorites]
'Camouflage t-shirt once, "Oooooh it's a floating head" was the response in the pub.'
Well, made me laugh. :P
posted by kaibutsu at 1:38 PM on August 17, 2021 [25 favorites]
Well, made me laugh. :P
posted by kaibutsu at 1:38 PM on August 17, 2021 [25 favorites]
If you were anywhere near Dalkey, they probably thought you actually were him. He's a common sight around those parts.
We lived in an apartment on Dufferin Avenue and mostly were around the City Centre and St James Gate areas (where NCAD is). On rare occasions, our Irish friends would invite us to an afternoon seaside, which would take us down to Bray or Greystones, usually. My memory is that U2 built a building down in the Docklands around the time that we were there. I did have wraparound style shades, which was probably a big part of the Bono connection in the minds of young Irish lads.
As is remarked in the Twitter thread, I did not wear a standard Irish uniform for young men - a grey or navy tracksuit. IIRC, I was probably wearing a black wool jacket or a Dickey's work coat, plus jeans and bright yellow Chucks most of the time. I met plenty of Irish grad students and artists who had the same look, sans the bright yellow shoes. Of course my shoes got dulled by Dublin grime and slush pretty quickly, though.
Another memory comes to mind of meeting a friend's friend who was from Mayo or maybe even further Northwest. I yammered on for several minutes about who I was and why I was in Ireland. This new friend turned to our mutual friend and said "I can't understand a fookin werd he'z sayin."
posted by Tchozz at 1:45 PM on August 17, 2021 [2 favorites]
We lived in an apartment on Dufferin Avenue and mostly were around the City Centre and St James Gate areas (where NCAD is). On rare occasions, our Irish friends would invite us to an afternoon seaside, which would take us down to Bray or Greystones, usually. My memory is that U2 built a building down in the Docklands around the time that we were there. I did have wraparound style shades, which was probably a big part of the Bono connection in the minds of young Irish lads.
As is remarked in the Twitter thread, I did not wear a standard Irish uniform for young men - a grey or navy tracksuit. IIRC, I was probably wearing a black wool jacket or a Dickey's work coat, plus jeans and bright yellow Chucks most of the time. I met plenty of Irish grad students and artists who had the same look, sans the bright yellow shoes. Of course my shoes got dulled by Dublin grime and slush pretty quickly, though.
Another memory comes to mind of meeting a friend's friend who was from Mayo or maybe even further Northwest. I yammered on for several minutes about who I was and why I was in Ireland. This new friend turned to our mutual friend and said "I can't understand a fookin werd he'z sayin."
posted by Tchozz at 1:45 PM on August 17, 2021 [2 favorites]
Judging from that thread, the only way to avoid snarky comments on your wardrobe in Ireland is to go around stark naked.
Too good for clothes, are you?
posted by knapah at 2:00 PM on August 17, 2021 [107 favorites]
Too good for clothes, are you?
posted by knapah at 2:00 PM on August 17, 2021 [107 favorites]
Apart from the examples with outright insults, these do sound mostly good-natured to me too. But then I have some familiarity with the culture. Sometimes that level of commitment to piss-taking can get a bit much, but you have to admit it's entertaining. Mostly...
posted by bitteschoen at 2:03 PM on August 17, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by bitteschoen at 2:03 PM on August 17, 2021 [1 favorite]
"In the United States, you look at the guy that lives in the mansion on the hill, and you think, you know, one day, if I work really hard, I could live in that mansion. In Ireland, people look up at the guy in the mansion on the hill and go, one day, I'm going to get that bastard."
Wait, did Bono find the secret to saving politics, humanity, and the planet?
posted by trig at 2:04 PM on August 17, 2021 [5 favorites]
Wait, did Bono find the secret to saving politics, humanity, and the planet?
posted by trig at 2:04 PM on August 17, 2021 [5 favorites]
These jokes come from a good place (community, signaling a person's membership in that community) and a bad one (tall-poppy syndrome and occasional outright bullying). I would personally cherish some of these jokes. It is a kind of delight to hear a personally crafted burn. It is not a delight for, say, the woman who reported that her black-and-pink outfit got her called a slut.
One of the nested replies talks about a clerk in Amsterdam who told the person that he knew they were Americans because they "walk like they fucking own the place." This isn't nice, but it's valuable information. (I'm not sure what they mean, but I try not to amble and not to walk right into places unless I'm sure I belong there. Quick city-type walking is my practice when I don't know where I am.) Brutal honesty can be useful abroad sometimes.
posted by Countess Elena at 2:10 PM on August 17, 2021 [8 favorites]
One of the nested replies talks about a clerk in Amsterdam who told the person that he knew they were Americans because they "walk like they fucking own the place." This isn't nice, but it's valuable information. (I'm not sure what they mean, but I try not to amble and not to walk right into places unless I'm sure I belong there. Quick city-type walking is my practice when I don't know where I am.) Brutal honesty can be useful abroad sometimes.
posted by Countess Elena at 2:10 PM on August 17, 2021 [8 favorites]
One of the nested replies talks about a clerk in Amsterdam
posted by zamboni at 2:14 PM on August 17, 2021 [21 favorites]
Hey, guys, Jan Maas is not being rude. He’s just being Dutch.
posted by zamboni at 2:14 PM on August 17, 2021 [21 favorites]
(Incidentally, at the time I was last in Ireland, which sadly is about twenty years ago, all the young men seemed to have the same haircut, high and tight. It was perfectly nice looking, but I couldn't help noticing. Whether the possibility of getting made fun of kept it that way, I wonder now.)
posted by Countess Elena at 2:15 PM on August 17, 2021 [4 favorites]
posted by Countess Elena at 2:15 PM on August 17, 2021 [4 favorites]
To be fair, who hasn't spotted someone in a long black coat and sunglasses and had to suppress the urge to call them 'Neo'?
I was in SF on the opening day of the Matrix II, and a friend had scored tickets, and we were waiting for a friend of his to show up so we could go, and she arrived, and she was dressed in black jeans and a t, with a distressed black leather coat, sunglasses, and her black hair pulled severely back.
“Um” I said, “are we cosplaying?”
“No” she replied, “this is how I dress for work….” Looked down at herself and said “Jesus, do I have time to go home and change?”
posted by GenjiandProust at 2:21 PM on August 17, 2021 [41 favorites]
I was in SF on the opening day of the Matrix II, and a friend had scored tickets, and we were waiting for a friend of his to show up so we could go, and she arrived, and she was dressed in black jeans and a t, with a distressed black leather coat, sunglasses, and her black hair pulled severely back.
“Um” I said, “are we cosplaying?”
“No” she replied, “this is how I dress for work….” Looked down at herself and said “Jesus, do I have time to go home and change?”
posted by GenjiandProust at 2:21 PM on August 17, 2021 [41 favorites]
“No” she replied, “this is how I dress for work….”
Your friend was a sysadmin of some sort?
posted by acb at 2:24 PM on August 17, 2021 [24 favorites]
Your friend was a sysadmin of some sort?
posted by acb at 2:24 PM on August 17, 2021 [24 favorites]
Is there a way to view this without logging in to Twitter? I keep getting popups telling me to sign up/in when I try go read more replies.
posted by wemayfreeze at 3:14 PM on August 17, 2021 [4 favorites]
posted by wemayfreeze at 3:14 PM on August 17, 2021 [4 favorites]
Interesting, that doesn't happen for me. I had to enable javascript for twitter.com and twimg.com though (but nothing else for that site). I've never logged into Twitter on this computer.
posted by Greg_Ace at 3:33 PM on August 17, 2021
posted by Greg_Ace at 3:33 PM on August 17, 2021
It's one thing to good-naturedly tease a friend, but if you've ever said anything like this to a stranger please shut your awful mouth until you learn to be a better person.
posted by Ursula Hitler at 4:38 PM on August 17, 2021 [4 favorites]
posted by Ursula Hitler at 4:38 PM on August 17, 2021 [4 favorites]
"walk like they fucking own the place."
I've heard it put as 'some people take up more room than others.'
posted by Bee'sWing at 4:54 PM on August 17, 2021 [3 favorites]
I've heard it put as 'some people take up more room than others.'
posted by Bee'sWing at 4:54 PM on August 17, 2021 [3 favorites]
Is there a way to view this without logging in to Twitter? I keep getting popups telling me to sign up/in when I try go read more replies.
I found that if I changed "mobile.twitter.com" in the URL to just "twitter.com" I was able to read all the replies.
posted by clawsoon at 5:07 PM on August 17, 2021
I found that if I changed "mobile.twitter.com" in the URL to just "twitter.com" I was able to read all the replies.
posted by clawsoon at 5:07 PM on August 17, 2021
These are hilarious, and you can only confuse them with bad-natured insult if you've never experienced that from an Irish person
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 5:46 PM on August 17, 2021 [23 favorites]
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 5:46 PM on August 17, 2021 [23 favorites]
My mom followed me on the facebook for 5 years before posting a single comment on my page.
I had just posted that I had forgotten for several years that my toaster oven could do 4 toast at once (in fact that was the reason I had bought it!) and I had been toasting just 2 at a time while making 4 toasts each morning.
My mom's comment was "So proud".
Got all kinds of laughing face emojis from my friends.
And one from me. You've got to love a carefully timed sick burn.
My mom's from Irish stock.
posted by srboisvert at 6:21 PM on August 17, 2021 [34 favorites]
I had just posted that I had forgotten for several years that my toaster oven could do 4 toast at once (in fact that was the reason I had bought it!) and I had been toasting just 2 at a time while making 4 toasts each morning.
My mom's comment was "So proud".
Got all kinds of laughing face emojis from my friends.
And one from me. You've got to love a carefully timed sick burn.
My mom's from Irish stock.
posted by srboisvert at 6:21 PM on August 17, 2021 [34 favorites]
For some reason, this is much less of a thing in LGBT, mostly-female, and geeky friend groups in Ireland. It's pretty intense in bro/auld lad groups tho.
Also you can defo tell from the way they say it whether it's meant in good natured fun or as a sad, insecure dig by a complete dose. Either way worth a chuckle.
posted by gohabsgo at 7:12 PM on August 17, 2021 [5 favorites]
Also you can defo tell from the way they say it whether it's meant in good natured fun or as a sad, insecure dig by a complete dose. Either way worth a chuckle.
posted by gohabsgo at 7:12 PM on August 17, 2021 [5 favorites]
Judging from that thread, the only way to avoid snarky comments on your wardrobe in Ireland is to go around stark naked.
"Great, the emperor is back after visiting that damn tailor again."
(Edit: Words and regicide.)
posted by loquacious at 7:13 PM on August 17, 2021 [8 favorites]
"Great, the emperor is back after visiting that damn tailor again."
(Edit: Words and regicide.)
posted by loquacious at 7:13 PM on August 17, 2021 [8 favorites]
"Lost yer horse, Lady Godiva?"
posted by jenkinsEar at 7:56 PM on August 17, 2021 [14 favorites]
posted by jenkinsEar at 7:56 PM on August 17, 2021 [14 favorites]
It's one thing to good-naturedly tease a friend, but if you've ever said anything like this to a stranger please shut your awful mouth until you learn to be a better person.
Gosh, thanks!
posted by etherist at 8:18 PM on August 17, 2021 [5 favorites]
Gosh, thanks!
posted by etherist at 8:18 PM on August 17, 2021 [5 favorites]
Also for the uninitiated the key to this cultural thing is the most important thing, more than being funny’s is being first able to receive it with good grace. And there’s no worse character trait than dishing it out but not liking it when you get it back
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 8:21 PM on August 17, 2021 [17 favorites]
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 8:21 PM on August 17, 2021 [17 favorites]
This thread was a treasure. Thanks for sharing!
posted by fifteen schnitzengruben is my limit at 9:21 PM on August 17, 2021
posted by fifteen schnitzengruben is my limit at 9:21 PM on August 17, 2021
Loved like 99% of the jokes. Especially where they went on for years. Thanks for the link!
posted by Kosmob0t at 10:29 PM on August 17, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by Kosmob0t at 10:29 PM on August 17, 2021 [1 favorite]
The way I've had piss-taking explained to me by a queer coworker in Dublin is
1) it's def not just punching down, in the sense that you absolutely are licensed to take the piss out of your boss.
2) and he(*) is expected to take that gracefully and laugh like anybody else; to do otherwise is a major status loss.
3) and this structurally disfavors people for whom the piss-taking activates templates that really sting. Can they just be cool? No. Which hits non-bloke and/or non-bloke-passers.
Not my culture, but that's his take.
posted by away for regrooving at 12:27 AM on August 18, 2021 [18 favorites]
1) it's def not just punching down, in the sense that you absolutely are licensed to take the piss out of your boss.
2) and he(*) is expected to take that gracefully and laugh like anybody else; to do otherwise is a major status loss.
3) and this structurally disfavors people for whom the piss-taking activates templates that really sting. Can they just be cool? No. Which hits non-bloke and/or non-bloke-passers.
Not my culture, but that's his take.
posted by away for regrooving at 12:27 AM on August 18, 2021 [18 favorites]
That’s really good analysis by your coworker, away for regrooving.
Having grown up in a culture where piss-taking is very much the done thing, I will say that while you very soon get to know the difference between kidding around and verbal punching, one can drift into the other very easily, especially for people lower down the totem pole. When people are judged to be not able to take it, that can become a license for meanness.
On the other hand, things are never quite as dangerous as when the kidding stops.
posted by Kattullus at 12:58 AM on August 18, 2021 [5 favorites]
Having grown up in a culture where piss-taking is very much the done thing, I will say that while you very soon get to know the difference between kidding around and verbal punching, one can drift into the other very easily, especially for people lower down the totem pole. When people are judged to be not able to take it, that can become a license for meanness.
On the other hand, things are never quite as dangerous as when the kidding stops.
posted by Kattullus at 12:58 AM on August 18, 2021 [5 favorites]
Many years ago, when I was a teenager here in the UK, one of my friends had a summer job helping to shepherd foreign exchange students around. He was supervising a coach trip full of Spanish students on their trip somewhere or other and I tagged along in one of the unoccupied seats.
I showed up for the trip dressed head-to-toe in black, as was my affectation at the time. "Ah, the Franco look," my friend said. "Very appropriate."
posted by Paul Slade at 1:24 AM on August 18, 2021 [6 favorites]
I showed up for the trip dressed head-to-toe in black, as was my affectation at the time. "Ah, the Franco look," my friend said. "Very appropriate."
posted by Paul Slade at 1:24 AM on August 18, 2021 [6 favorites]
Yeah no Threadreader because Threadreader only does threads where each tweet is by the same user.
Here’s a small (! that thread is looong!) collection of some of the tweets in the thread I enjoyed and that I don’t find particularly mean or don’t require too much specific knowledge of cultural references that may not be well known:
posted by bitteschoen at 1:56 AM on August 18, 2021 [16 favorites]
Here’s a small (! that thread is looong!) collection of some of the tweets in the thread I enjoyed and that I don’t find particularly mean or don’t require too much specific knowledge of cultural references that may not be well known:
I once wore a silver jacket to college, turned up late for class, said 'sorry I'm late', lecturer said, 'that's ok' then waited til I was halfway across the front of the full class before following up with 'trouble with the spaceship again was it?'.And here’s a link to the video of Bono saying that thing about the difference in mentality between the US and Ireland
I wore a white, wool turtle-neck jumper to the match once and a fella in the pub said 'Where have you parked the U-boat?'.
Back in Dublin after travelling S. America, decked out in a visually assaulting combo of zebra print leggings and tiger pattern knee high boots. Queuing into well known Dublin nightclub that evening was asked "Did you get let out of Dublin zoo or make a break for it yourself?"
My mother wore a fur hat to her aunts funeral in December, she went to sympathise with her cousins to be greeted with "Patricia, how was Moscow?" The rest of the day she was introduced as Our Russian Cousin. At the time they were all in their 60s
My sister wore a brown leather satchel bag to school one day & she could hear her students saying “Jaysus here’s Indiana Jones” as she walked towards the classroom
Bought a brown faux suade jacket and wore it out once in Limerick. Went to the bathroom in Costello’s to encounter two guys who obviously were familiar with one another. “Get a load of this jacket, straight outta Eurovision.” “12 points to Moldova”. It has never been worn again
My Dad was in the pub a few years back when a local walked in. One of the men there hadn't seen this guy in a while and was surprised at how bald ur man had gotten and quipped "Be God Peter, ur getting very tall - ur growing up thro ur hair"!
Doesn’t even need to be clothing….back in the 80s one poor woman who had her hair permed and coiffured was shout/complimented with “Your hair’s lovely missus, did ya knit it yer self ?”
Wore a 60’s style red mini dress with stripes sleeves and a beehive bun back home in Kerry one night and some fella at the bar kept telling me the Beatles had broken up and that he’s sorry I missed them
I had a soft, furry pink jacket that I loved. It was like fake fur, but clearly fake.
Friend said to me, feigning genuine disgust, “Do you know how many muppets died to make that jacket?”
Wore a large silver disc necklace to local pub once to be greeted by a chorus of queries as to how many sallelite channels I was picking up!
Cringingly, I had a male friend over to the house when I was a teenager. We were in the garden and my mum knocked on the window and said ‘Bob! Are you staying for dinner?’ His name was Brian but he was wearing a Bob Dylan T-shirt with Bob Dylan written on it.
My daughter wore a floral dress to a family party and her grandmother said to her "I don't know whether to plant you or water you". Dress never worn again.
Knitted myself a striped scarf and wore it for my first day of college thinking I looked very Minnie Driver in circle of friends - someone shouted Dr Who at me the minute I got on the bus
I traveled from NYC to Rome for an Irish wedding. I wore a tan sports coat. Despite the temperature all the men were wearing that one suit Irish men seem to own. They kept calling me Miami Vice lol
I once wore a blouse that had some flowers embroidered on it. Also my watch strap had flowers on it. I paid no attention until a colleague fake sneezed in the middle of a meeting and said, “I got hay fever just looking at you!” The git.
posted by bitteschoen at 1:56 AM on August 18, 2021 [16 favorites]
Scottish counterpoint: this Thread from MemorialDevice on 50 "Bloody hell its ... x" quips that his dad would say when wearing or doing anything unusual. For example: Imelda Marcos if buying a new pair of shoes, or Arthur C Clark if acting mysteriously or Torvil and Dean if slipping on the kitchen floor. - Caution: many references very British and very, very dated.
posted by rongorongo at 2:11 AM on August 18, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by rongorongo at 2:11 AM on August 18, 2021 [2 favorites]
My daughter wore a floral dress to a family party and her grandmother said to her "I don't know whether to plant you or water you". Dress never worn again.
'Careful Grandma, or I might get one of my boyfriends to sting you!'
posted by jamjam at 3:03 AM on August 18, 2021 [1 favorite]
'Careful Grandma, or I might get one of my boyfriends to sting you!'
posted by jamjam at 3:03 AM on August 18, 2021 [1 favorite]
This one is my favourite, since it shows that the people involved could take a joke as well as dish them out:
My folks were in Ireland at a packed bar, stuck in the entry w/ some locals giving them crap for their new Irish sweaters. Eventually one announced he was cold and going home, so my Mom said, ”You oughta get one of these sweaters...”posted by Termite at 3:40 AM on August 18, 2021 [20 favorites]
They bought her drinks the rest of the night.
It's true that the kidding is harmless, and it's true that the people who were kidded never wore that piece of clothing again...?
posted by clawsoon at 6:18 AM on August 18, 2021 [9 favorites]
posted by clawsoon at 6:18 AM on August 18, 2021 [9 favorites]
I was really interested in that. But it seems twitter now requires you to have an account and to log in to view the whole thread. I really don't give a darn about twitter, but when did this start?
Edit:
Just read that I'm not the only one. For some strange reason I feel relived. ?
posted by james33 at 6:26 AM on August 18, 2021 [1 favorite]
Edit:
Just read that I'm not the only one. For some strange reason I feel relived. ?
posted by james33 at 6:26 AM on August 18, 2021 [1 favorite]
james33: Just change the URL from "mobile.twitter.com" to "twitter.com" and you should be able to see it all. Worked for me, anyway.
posted by clawsoon at 6:31 AM on August 18, 2021
posted by clawsoon at 6:31 AM on August 18, 2021
and it's true that the people who were kidded never wore that piece of clothing again...?
It really depends on the person IME. Leaning into it is just as much of a counter-joke as anything else. It is true though, it's one of those cultures that's optimized for either quick wit or brass ones. It might explain why most of the anecdotes in the thread isn't fully complete imo: it's not just the opening joke, what makes a great bit is what's the reply. A lot of l'esprit d'escalier in there.
posted by cendawanita at 6:31 AM on August 18, 2021 [3 favorites]
It really depends on the person IME. Leaning into it is just as much of a counter-joke as anything else. It is true though, it's one of those cultures that's optimized for either quick wit or brass ones. It might explain why most of the anecdotes in the thread isn't fully complete imo: it's not just the opening joke, what makes a great bit is what's the reply. A lot of l'esprit d'escalier in there.
posted by cendawanita at 6:31 AM on August 18, 2021 [3 favorites]
My favourite from an older Twitter thread linked in the comments:
Was wearing a jacket I loved and still have, about 20 years ago - white wool with a zip front and a hood trimmed with white fur. Barman in my old job asks me “Did the Abominable Snowman put up much of a fight?”posted by rory at 6:49 AM on August 18, 2021 [1 favorite]
and it's true that the people who were kidded never wore that piece of clothing again...?
I'm not Irish, just some guy who's been there a couple of times and lived there for awhile. From the outside looking in, and from a US perspective at that, I think something to keep in mind is that the whole country has experienced massive change in many ways, but in some ways maybe not much at all. So, in the span of about forty years (or perhaps less), Ireland went from the poorest country in the EU, to a moderately wealth country that is the youngest in the EU.
But, it's also an island, so change happens slowly. But then you can say, it's an island that still only has half of its peak population (population peak happened in the 1800s, I believe) due to famine, occupation, and emigration. So, people are frequently leaving and coming back. Quite a few people you meet in Ireland have relatives in the States or Australia or... or the people you meet have left and come back themselves. I believe Ireland was the first country, or one of the first, to legalize gay marriage by referendum rather than by legislative or judicial action. Abortion is now legal, which is absolutely shocking if you visited there when I did, given the presence of Catholic culture. Ireland is changing rapidly and slowly becoming less homogeneous.
Just wanted to chime in and gently defend the auld sod!
posted by Tchozz at 6:54 AM on August 18, 2021 [2 favorites]
I'm not Irish, just some guy who's been there a couple of times and lived there for awhile. From the outside looking in, and from a US perspective at that, I think something to keep in mind is that the whole country has experienced massive change in many ways, but in some ways maybe not much at all. So, in the span of about forty years (or perhaps less), Ireland went from the poorest country in the EU, to a moderately wealth country that is the youngest in the EU.
But, it's also an island, so change happens slowly. But then you can say, it's an island that still only has half of its peak population (population peak happened in the 1800s, I believe) due to famine, occupation, and emigration. So, people are frequently leaving and coming back. Quite a few people you meet in Ireland have relatives in the States or Australia or... or the people you meet have left and come back themselves. I believe Ireland was the first country, or one of the first, to legalize gay marriage by referendum rather than by legislative or judicial action. Abortion is now legal, which is absolutely shocking if you visited there when I did, given the presence of Catholic culture. Ireland is changing rapidly and slowly becoming less homogeneous.
Just wanted to chime in and gently defend the auld sod!
posted by Tchozz at 6:54 AM on August 18, 2021 [2 favorites]
It's interesting how ribbing and ridicule can signal inclusion and affirmation. A lot of these jokes/stories seem to happen in bars, which are themselves interesting places that straddle the divide between the public and the private as well as ridicule and respect. I'm reminded of a paper I once read about the social mores of the German Stammtisch, i.e. a table or spot in a bar or cafe reserved for regulars (I think the research was from the 1980's/90's (perhaps even 70s?) and describes a rural/small-town dynamic, but I forget who authored it.).
The exclusivity of the Stammtisch is semi-porous, in that it is possible for outsiders to join and participate, but to really become a Stammgast you have to demonstrate dedication over time. As I remember from the paper, one of the most important ways of demonstrating dedication (apart from the endless reciprocation of endless rounds of Pils) is to express an Opinion on a Topic and to defend that Opinion vociferously against criticism, even as — especially as — that criticism renders the Opinion increasingly indefensible. It's important to be forceful, but not to the point of anger, as becoming too emotional is an instant disqualification.
I think the paper theorized it as a behavior by which the speaker solicits group acceptance in a way that allows them to save face. The speaker places themselves in a vulnerable position, to which the group responds by pretending to (harshly) reject the speaker's position. The speaker then ups the ante by pretending to (loudly) reject the group's objections. Over time this establishes the honorability (independence) of the speaker and the group, which may build into a mutual respect, on the basis of which the speaker may finally be accepted as part of the group. The rationale for this oblique trust exercise is to hedge against the possibility of failure, in which case both speaker and group get to save face, since both can pretend there was never any interest to begin with. In small communities this is especially important, since you can never totally avoid dealing with one another in some capacity. (And, yes, the Stammtisch is an almost exclusively male environment).
posted by dmh at 6:55 AM on August 18, 2021 [47 favorites]
The exclusivity of the Stammtisch is semi-porous, in that it is possible for outsiders to join and participate, but to really become a Stammgast you have to demonstrate dedication over time. As I remember from the paper, one of the most important ways of demonstrating dedication (apart from the endless reciprocation of endless rounds of Pils) is to express an Opinion on a Topic and to defend that Opinion vociferously against criticism, even as — especially as — that criticism renders the Opinion increasingly indefensible. It's important to be forceful, but not to the point of anger, as becoming too emotional is an instant disqualification.
I think the paper theorized it as a behavior by which the speaker solicits group acceptance in a way that allows them to save face. The speaker places themselves in a vulnerable position, to which the group responds by pretending to (harshly) reject the speaker's position. The speaker then ups the ante by pretending to (loudly) reject the group's objections. Over time this establishes the honorability (independence) of the speaker and the group, which may build into a mutual respect, on the basis of which the speaker may finally be accepted as part of the group. The rationale for this oblique trust exercise is to hedge against the possibility of failure, in which case both speaker and group get to save face, since both can pretend there was never any interest to begin with. In small communities this is especially important, since you can never totally avoid dealing with one another in some capacity. (And, yes, the Stammtisch is an almost exclusively male environment).
posted by dmh at 6:55 AM on August 18, 2021 [47 favorites]
Holy shit dmh, you just explained my 15yo son's entire friend group.
posted by selfmedicating at 7:31 AM on August 18, 2021 [7 favorites]
posted by selfmedicating at 7:31 AM on August 18, 2021 [7 favorites]
Anyone who's lived in Dublin's north inner city knows that young kids from there are some of the most vicious put down artists in the world.
And yeah, sometimes it can go too far, but in general it's taken on the chin or returned with a quick comeback.
My uncle: "You speak awful French"
My dad: "You speak fluent bullshit"
My friend (a fisherman) to me (a science PhD) when I missed a round in a bar: "You can split the atom, but you can't split the bill"
and so on. There's no one style of Irish humour though, it's more sardonic the further you go north, and more surreal the further you go south.
Surprised nobody's mentioned the escalating ways a Dub says they're so embarrassed by you they're red in the face:
"Scarlet for ya"
"Scarlet for your ma for having ya"
"Scarlet for your da for doing your ma for having ya"
posted by kersplunk at 7:35 AM on August 18, 2021 [12 favorites]
And yeah, sometimes it can go too far, but in general it's taken on the chin or returned with a quick comeback.
My uncle: "You speak awful French"
My dad: "You speak fluent bullshit"
My friend (a fisherman) to me (a science PhD) when I missed a round in a bar: "You can split the atom, but you can't split the bill"
and so on. There's no one style of Irish humour though, it's more sardonic the further you go north, and more surreal the further you go south.
Surprised nobody's mentioned the escalating ways a Dub says they're so embarrassed by you they're red in the face:
"Scarlet for ya"
"Scarlet for your ma for having ya"
"Scarlet for your da for doing your ma for having ya"
posted by kersplunk at 7:35 AM on August 18, 2021 [12 favorites]
@vincekearney
Halloween, Derry 1990. Wearing jeans, casual shirt, coat. Taxi driver - in full Bugs Bunny outfit - “catch yerself on, you can’t go into town like that you’ll look like an eedjit”. Stopped at stall for me to buy curly wig, giant glasses + big water pistol to “fit in”.
posted by doctornemo at 8:03 AM on August 18, 2021 [11 favorites]
Halloween, Derry 1990. Wearing jeans, casual shirt, coat. Taxi driver - in full Bugs Bunny outfit - “catch yerself on, you can’t go into town like that you’ll look like an eedjit”. Stopped at stall for me to buy curly wig, giant glasses + big water pistol to “fit in”.
posted by doctornemo at 8:03 AM on August 18, 2021 [11 favorites]
Honestly, this craic mentality reminds me of how every time I'm in Chicago, I have to re-learn that they insult you and each other and strangers as a form of small talk. I'm always taken aback at first, and then I remember. And I only live a couple hundred miles from Chicago!
posted by Occula at 8:13 AM on August 18, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by Occula at 8:13 AM on August 18, 2021 [2 favorites]
Something I've observed playing disc golf with a group of friends is the way we all laugh and have comments throughout, all pretty good-natured. But I don't know if it's cultural, one of the guys (from southern France) tends to have a sharper tongue, and his jokes were unlike anything any of us (born-in-Canada types) would think of saying.. the owner of the course (Canadian, German last name) would play a few rounds with us and the French guy chirped him soundly about how he ran ("like a German") and endless jabs about how they lost the war.. It was a bit much, really. The other thing I noticed is the special attention he gives to bugging this one member of the group (US born but has lived in Canada most of his adult life).. they are both Jewish, not sure if that has anything to do with it.. but just a merciless commentary throughout the game, and the other guy plays right into it, it's like a routine they have. But then the other guy seems to get a little heated at times also.
Maybe it's nothing, but I think some cultural/historic things soften over a couple of generations (removed to Canada) whereas in Europe the memory of the war/s goes more deeply, then add the layer of personality and it is what it is.
posted by elkevelvet at 8:48 AM on August 18, 2021
Maybe it's nothing, but I think some cultural/historic things soften over a couple of generations (removed to Canada) whereas in Europe the memory of the war/s goes more deeply, then add the layer of personality and it is what it is.
posted by elkevelvet at 8:48 AM on August 18, 2021
In conclusion, all around the world, allistics find different ways to be confusing.
posted by LouCPurr at 8:49 AM on August 18, 2021 [5 favorites]
posted by LouCPurr at 8:49 AM on August 18, 2021 [5 favorites]
But I mean the key component is that it must be funny. I have a friend group who likes to just say mean things to each other that just never quite land that they all pretend laugh at and they've been doing this for like 20 years and I can't with that.
posted by bleep at 10:05 AM on August 18, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by bleep at 10:05 AM on August 18, 2021 [2 favorites]
Reminds me of: Area Man Unsure If He's Male-Bonding Or Being Bullied
posted by clawsoon at 10:15 AM on August 18, 2021 [4 favorites]
posted by clawsoon at 10:15 AM on August 18, 2021 [4 favorites]
express an Opinion on a Topic and to defend that Opinion vociferously against criticism, even as — especially as — that criticism renders the Opinion increasingly indefensible.
That reminds me of the author of the "smooth lions" cartoon unflaggingly declaring (BoredPanda link) that sharks had smooth skin in the face of all the Twitter comments to the contrary (some folks were in on the joke, but many were not).
posted by Greg_Ace at 10:46 AM on August 18, 2021 [4 favorites]
That reminds me of the author of the "smooth lions" cartoon unflaggingly declaring (BoredPanda link) that sharks had smooth skin in the face of all the Twitter comments to the contrary (some folks were in on the joke, but many were not).
posted by Greg_Ace at 10:46 AM on August 18, 2021 [4 favorites]
But I mean the key component is that it must be funny.
Funny for the butt of the joke. If it's not funny to them, and they're so shamed and self-conscious that they dress differently, then you're being an ass.
I was raised in this kind of culture. My family in particular can be vicious. I bought red sneakers once and my sister drew comics making fun of them for A YEAR. She won a speech competition as a kid and most of her speech centered on making fun of me, in front of hundreds of people. I currently run a group dedicated to badly photoshopped closeups of my sister's face. That's our dynamic and we're careful not to hurt each other. But I have seen countless incidents of someone using the excuse of "oh it's just how we are; you have to give as good as you get" to get away with mobbing whoever they deem isn't ok - and it's usually people who already have to deal with a lot of shit on the daily just for being themselves. And when you are someone who is picked on constantly, the 30th iteration that day of "you're weird and ugly and not wanted here" is not funny.
There is also a sort of a defensive romanticism of this behaviour and whatever particular culture it comes from (in this case Ireland, in my case the Canadian Maritimes), without an examination of when it's ok and what the lines are, and an unwillingness to back down and apologise (all traits of a skilled shit talker). Calling a strange woman a slut? Not ok. Following a stranger and screaming insults at them? Not ok.
posted by Stoof at 11:06 AM on August 18, 2021 [10 favorites]
Funny for the butt of the joke. If it's not funny to them, and they're so shamed and self-conscious that they dress differently, then you're being an ass.
I was raised in this kind of culture. My family in particular can be vicious. I bought red sneakers once and my sister drew comics making fun of them for A YEAR. She won a speech competition as a kid and most of her speech centered on making fun of me, in front of hundreds of people. I currently run a group dedicated to badly photoshopped closeups of my sister's face. That's our dynamic and we're careful not to hurt each other. But I have seen countless incidents of someone using the excuse of "oh it's just how we are; you have to give as good as you get" to get away with mobbing whoever they deem isn't ok - and it's usually people who already have to deal with a lot of shit on the daily just for being themselves. And when you are someone who is picked on constantly, the 30th iteration that day of "you're weird and ugly and not wanted here" is not funny.
There is also a sort of a defensive romanticism of this behaviour and whatever particular culture it comes from (in this case Ireland, in my case the Canadian Maritimes), without an examination of when it's ok and what the lines are, and an unwillingness to back down and apologise (all traits of a skilled shit talker). Calling a strange woman a slut? Not ok. Following a stranger and screaming insults at them? Not ok.
posted by Stoof at 11:06 AM on August 18, 2021 [10 favorites]
the only way to avoid snarky comments on your wardrobe in Ireland is to go around stark naked
Or to go normcore, or whatever the mall-ninja term is for the tactical variant of normcore where the aim is to look utterly unmemorable and yet completely unfrivolous in a way that suggests that one could only be be a highly-trained assassin or something. Though I wouldn't put it past the black belts in Irish banter to be able to dispatch those either.
posted by acb at 11:35 AM on August 18, 2021
Or to go normcore, or whatever the mall-ninja term is for the tactical variant of normcore where the aim is to look utterly unmemorable and yet completely unfrivolous in a way that suggests that one could only be be a highly-trained assassin or something. Though I wouldn't put it past the black belts in Irish banter to be able to dispatch those either.
posted by acb at 11:35 AM on August 18, 2021
Though I wouldn't put it past the black belts in Irish banter to be able to dispatch those either.
Did the Waterford Greenway with some friends a couple of years ago and we got so soaked on the way back we had to buy (cheap) clothes in Penneys (normcore as it comes) to get dry and we had no problem coming up with endless insults for each other's choices. I got called a buntús biatch at one point.
posted by kersplunk at 3:53 PM on August 18, 2021 [2 favorites]
Did the Waterford Greenway with some friends a couple of years ago and we got so soaked on the way back we had to buy (cheap) clothes in Penneys (normcore as it comes) to get dry and we had no problem coming up with endless insults for each other's choices. I got called a buntús biatch at one point.
posted by kersplunk at 3:53 PM on August 18, 2021 [2 favorites]
These jokes come from a good place (community, signaling a person's membership in that community) and a bad one (tall-poppy syndrome and occasional outright bullying).
Coming from a culture that absolutely has tall poppy syndrome/jantelov, but having lived the majority of my life in cultures that don't, I cannot agree with this assessment of it as an unalloyed negative, nevermind standing it alongside outright bullying. I get that it may look ruthless to outsiders, but it has a whole bunch of positive effects on community and culture as well.
posted by Dysk at 4:18 PM on August 18, 2021 [9 favorites]
Coming from a culture that absolutely has tall poppy syndrome/jantelov, but having lived the majority of my life in cultures that don't, I cannot agree with this assessment of it as an unalloyed negative, nevermind standing it alongside outright bullying. I get that it may look ruthless to outsiders, but it has a whole bunch of positive effects on community and culture as well.
posted by Dysk at 4:18 PM on August 18, 2021 [9 favorites]
Also thank you so much for this post, the twitter thread kept me entertained during the downtime of my last two overnight shifts. Far too many sensible chuckles to pick favourites.
posted by Dysk at 10:23 PM on August 18, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by Dysk at 10:23 PM on August 18, 2021 [2 favorites]
Foil Arms and Hogg have tuned into this thread and are working hard on toning down the slaggin' from the football terraces [3 mins]. cw: stereotypical Brit accents
posted by BobTheScientist at 5:57 AM on August 19, 2021
posted by BobTheScientist at 5:57 AM on August 19, 2021
Funny for the butt of the joke. If it's not funny to them, and they're so shamed and self-conscious that they dress differently, then you're being an ass
One of the replies somewhere in the thread (which I unfortunately didn't bookmark) defined it as "Something which makes you say "How dare you!" at the time, but crack up laughing later when you're retelling it to friends or family" which sounds about right to me. Knowing Irish people too, I'd say about half of the "I never wore it again" were hyperbole, and most of the rest were the realisation that they had missed a bit with their effort, and that looking like the guy from the Milk Tray ad, or whatever wasn't really what they had been aiming for.
I'll admit it's not always good-natured, and particularly in certain work contexts (but not just them) it can cross the line into mean and exclusionary. I would be a bit wary of any situation dominated by "lads" who attended rugby-playing schools, for example. It very easily slides into punching down in that case, but it's still covered by the fact that they're "only taking the piss", and the victim obviously can't take a joke.
Most of the time, though, it is about a sense of community and the fact that it's important in Irish culture that people don't give themselves airs or make themselves out to be more important than are. (For example, any listicle about the current President (Michael D. Higgins) will have at least one approving item featuring a photo of him in the queue for an ATM.) So it's unsurprising that a number of comments were from people who'd gone back to their home town after moving to Dublin or another city / larger town to study - *someone* will make a comment about you being all fancy now that you're up in the big city. (Especially as everyone in the town will know you, even if it's just as "Áine O'Sullivan's youngest, you know, the one who's up studying science (or was it Celtic studies?) in Maynooth".)
posted by scorbet at 8:11 AM on August 19, 2021 [6 favorites]
One of the replies somewhere in the thread (which I unfortunately didn't bookmark) defined it as "Something which makes you say "How dare you!" at the time, but crack up laughing later when you're retelling it to friends or family" which sounds about right to me. Knowing Irish people too, I'd say about half of the "I never wore it again" were hyperbole, and most of the rest were the realisation that they had missed a bit with their effort, and that looking like the guy from the Milk Tray ad, or whatever wasn't really what they had been aiming for.
I'll admit it's not always good-natured, and particularly in certain work contexts (but not just them) it can cross the line into mean and exclusionary. I would be a bit wary of any situation dominated by "lads" who attended rugby-playing schools, for example. It very easily slides into punching down in that case, but it's still covered by the fact that they're "only taking the piss", and the victim obviously can't take a joke.
Most of the time, though, it is about a sense of community and the fact that it's important in Irish culture that people don't give themselves airs or make themselves out to be more important than are. (For example, any listicle about the current President (Michael D. Higgins) will have at least one approving item featuring a photo of him in the queue for an ATM.) So it's unsurprising that a number of comments were from people who'd gone back to their home town after moving to Dublin or another city / larger town to study - *someone* will make a comment about you being all fancy now that you're up in the big city. (Especially as everyone in the town will know you, even if it's just as "Áine O'Sullivan's youngest, you know, the one who's up studying science (or was it Celtic studies?) in Maynooth".)
posted by scorbet at 8:11 AM on August 19, 2021 [6 favorites]
I went to law school with a guy who, for some reason, thought it would be a good idea to wear a bandanna as a headband on the first day of classes. Someone called him "the Boss" in reference to Bruce Springsteen, and I never actually learned the guy's name. Just called him "Boss" the rest of the year.
posted by kevinbelt at 8:58 AM on August 19, 2021 [3 favorites]
posted by kevinbelt at 8:58 AM on August 19, 2021 [3 favorites]
I caught the new Foil Arms & Hog video mentioned above (every Thursday!), but when I saw this thread the first videos I thought of were the ones about lads slaggin' each other.
posted by myotahapea at 9:49 AM on August 19, 2021
posted by myotahapea at 9:49 AM on August 19, 2021
These are fab.
"Also wore out a pink fake fur collar on a jacket one time and my friend told me I looked like I was being born"
Screaming.
posted by turbid dahlia at 7:29 PM on August 22, 2021 [2 favorites]
"Also wore out a pink fake fur collar on a jacket one time and my friend told me I looked like I was being born"
Screaming.
posted by turbid dahlia at 7:29 PM on August 22, 2021 [2 favorites]
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posted by Going To Maine at 11:27 AM on August 17, 2021 [7 favorites]