She's dead, Jim.

March 31, 2005 7:11 AM

Terry Schiavo has died.
posted by bshort (180 comments total)

God rest her soul.
posted by caddis at 7:14 AM on March 31, 2005

Terry Schiavo died eight years ago. They finally stopped animating her body.
posted by klangklangston at 7:15 AM on March 31, 2005

.

Maybe know everyone involved can find some closure and peace.
posted by jonmc at 7:15 AM on March 31, 2005

You didn't have to post this, except to benefit those who don't watch TV. I anticipate every damn media source to be vomiting the same information for at least the next week.
posted by sian at 7:15 AM on March 31, 2005

Now those kids can go back to school!
posted by sciurus at 7:16 AM on March 31, 2005

May she and her family find peace.
posted by unreason at 7:16 AM on March 31, 2005

anybody watch south park last night?
posted by y0bhgu0d at 7:17 AM on March 31, 2005

So now the TV coverage of the lawsuits over her body begins?
posted by R. Mutt at 7:20 AM on March 31, 2005

r.i.p.
posted by crunchland at 7:20 AM on March 31, 2005

Man, Drudge is so totally behind on this. No flashing siren or anything...

In all seriousness, maybe this country can get back to closer to normal now, although that's gonna take awhile with the endless barrage starting.... NOW!
posted by almostcool at 7:23 AM on March 31, 2005

Just noticed the title of this thread....
posted by kenaman at 7:23 AM on March 31, 2005

So many lessons to learn from her too brief life.
A sad day, but in many ways, a happy day as well.
posted by mischief at 7:24 AM on March 31, 2005

I feel smug and self-satisfied! I must be a liberal!
posted by fungible at 7:25 AM on March 31, 2005

Who's Terry Schiavo? I've been living in a cave with my fingers in my ears and my eyes covered up.
posted by clevershark at 7:26 AM on March 31, 2005

Which reminds me, I need groceries.
posted by HTuttle at 7:31 AM on March 31, 2005

What will the next media hysteria be?
posted by dov3 at 7:31 AM on March 31, 2005

There are innumerable tragedies like this going on all the time. While each of these are devastating in their own way...none of them are the best of the web.
posted by tpl1212 at 7:31 AM on March 31, 2005

Jeez. Can we all talk about something ELSE for a change?
posted by mds35 at 7:32 AM on March 31, 2005

Next Media hysteria.... Pope?
but, this one will last for weeks yet!
posted by HuronBob at 7:32 AM on March 31, 2005

.
posted by pyramid termite at 7:33 AM on March 31, 2005

*gurgle*

*croak*

I'll report from Heaven soon.

Current Mood: dead
posted by trinarian at 7:33 AM on March 31, 2005

Latest reports have a zombified Terri ripping the flesh off the doctor's arms with her undead jowls.
posted by adampsyche at 7:33 AM on March 31, 2005

People, hide your brains tonight, for Terri is on the prowl in her zombie robot deathmarch.
posted by naxosaxur at 7:34 AM on March 31, 2005

Everyday coma patients and similar unlucky people die. Old people get forgotten in their well paid nursing homes. Nobody gives a s***!!!
posted by homodigitalis at 7:34 AM on March 31, 2005

Thank goodness, now the nation can concentrate on important stuff like Michael Jackson and his pedophilia and utter disconnect with reality.
posted by fenriq at 7:34 AM on March 31, 2005

Will someone think about the poor TV news networks? What will they obsess over now?

On preview: HuronBob calls Pope.
posted by catachresoid at 7:34 AM on March 31, 2005

(...I'd like to request a countdown for Michael Schaivo's death now.)
posted by naxosaxur at 7:35 AM on March 31, 2005

Oddly enough, car accident.
posted by davelog at 7:39 AM on March 31, 2005

The trial of Michael Jackson is finally about to get the minute hourly attention it deserves.


(Beams for safe passage through the bardo for whatever was left of Ms. Schiavo.)
posted by digaman at 7:42 AM on March 31, 2005

Now the Pope needs to die within 24 hours so "Terri Schiavo - Pope - all holy goodness" religiogasm can happen!
posted by Hot Like Your 12V Wire at 7:43 AM on March 31, 2005

What will they obsess over now

Well maybe that Peterson guy can escape from prison, kidnap Michael Jackson, and hole up in Gary Condit's house which of course would cause that yelling lawyer woman on CNN to completely stroke out and go on life support, which would start the prayin' outside the hospice deal all over again.
posted by mss at 7:43 AM on March 31, 2005

I feel so bad for both parties involved... it will be difficult to go on. You have my condolences, politicians and the media.
posted by theFlyingSquirrel at 7:44 AM on March 31, 2005

naxosaxur writes " (...I'd like to request a countdown for Michael Schaivo's death now.)"


Too scary. Too true.
posted by OmieWise at 7:48 AM on March 31, 2005

Predictable? Check.

Tasteless? Check.

Redundant? Check.

Yep, this thread is moving along just as I thought it would when the time came...
posted by The Card Cheat at 7:49 AM on March 31, 2005

BBC News:

Her parents and their two other children were with her up to 15 minutes before she died.

A few minutes before she died, they were told to leave the room by Michael Schiavo, their spokesman said.

They were allowed back into the room after she died.

I still don't know how I feel about the case, but I know how I feel about that. Ugh.
posted by bwerdmuller at 7:51 AM on March 31, 2005

Is it too late to put the tube back in?
posted by badger_flammable at 7:54 AM on March 31, 2005

There's some joke to be made here involving Michael Jackson, Terri Schaivo, the Pope, a Walrus and Osama Bin Laden. I have to go to class however.
posted by gagglezoomer at 7:55 AM on March 31, 2005

Now we hear that the Pope will not want his feeding tube removed.
posted by caddis at 7:56 AM on March 31, 2005

Now the Pope needs to die within 24 hours so "Terri Schiavo - Pope - all holy goodness" religiogasm can happen!

Meh. I'm saddened to report that Jerry Falwell's condition as been upgraded, proving once and for all that even God misses golden opportunities to make the world a better place.
posted by clevershark at 7:57 AM on March 31, 2005

I do hope that this prompts people to write living wills, though "News story leads to useful action!" doesn't happen much.

Mine will specify that a) I don't want to be kept around like a paperweight for years on end and b) I want to be a crash test dummy when I die.
posted by grapefruitmoon at 7:58 AM on March 31, 2005

I don't feel particularly proud to be a MeFite today, after reading much of this thread.
posted by wolftrouble at 7:59 AM on March 31, 2005

Dear Tom DeLay,

go find another sucker....
posted by stevejensen at 7:59 AM on March 31, 2005

I still don't know how I feel about the case, but I know how I feel about that. Ugh.

Perhaps Mr. Schiavo wanted to be alone with his spouse when she passed.

Considering the abuse the Schindlers have heaped on him I don't blame him for not wanting them around when Mrs. Schiavo died.
posted by smcniven at 8:00 AM on March 31, 2005

Please no more Schiavo threads.
posted by dhoyt at 8:00 AM on March 31, 2005

I still don't know how I feel about the case, but I know how I feel about that. Ugh.

Considering that the parent's little stage show outside the hospice prevented other children from seeing their family in their dying moments, you know what? Fuck 'em. Next time don't get an anti-abortion terrorist to accuse your son-in-law of murder on national television if you're so worried that he might not want to be in the same room as you.
posted by XQUZYPHYR at 8:01 AM on March 31, 2005

dhoyt writes "Please no more Schiavo threads."

Well, we should have on in three days, when she rolls the rock away from her tomb and rises in Glory.
posted by orthogonality at 8:02 AM on March 31, 2005

Awww, those loving, loving representatives of the Culture of Life at free republic have such sweet things to say...

"This is officially the "Reichstag Fire" incident for America as we know it."

"Happy now, Michael Schiavo? What goes around comes around -- I can't wait until you get yours."

"How can one contain the anger? Damn them all."

"It's the second darkest moment. The first was the passing of Roe vs. Wade."

"It is now time for the second American Revolution; as we revolted against the tyranny of the British crown, now it is time to also no longer accept the authority of the tyrannical court system."

"Now they can get back to killing babies."

"It is now time to exterminate the cockroaches and clean up the mess."

"The parents were not allowed to be with Terry at the moment she died!?...Michael Schiavo is EVIL incarnate."

"The eight years of Clinton have ruined this country even more than I once thought."

Yes, that's right. Somehow, this is all Clinton's fault.
posted by beth at 8:03 AM on March 31, 2005

" For the love of Pete bshort. What a crap post"

Yes, but there was going to be one. Might as well be this one.

" Next Media hysteria.... Pope?"

I'm very deficient in Catholic history and stuff. What happens when a pope becomes incapacitated enough that everyone pretty much agrees that he can't perform his duties? In my lifetime, it seems like we've only gotten new popes when one dies. How does it work otherwise? But this one doesn't have much time left, clearly. Here's hoping the next won't be as conservative.

The Jackson trial could be the next all-the-time media focus. I can't help but know when these things are happening because they happen in the print media and the Internet, too, but I'm so thankful at these times (which is much of the time) that I don't watch TV at all. Although I do sometimes think that this makes me uninformed about how persuasive the broadcast media's slant to a story really is. I've read a lot of things that say that broadcast media has been pretty slanted toward the pro-life side of the Schiavo debacle. The print media hasn't been so much, there haven't been that many stories that focus on the protesters and of course I don't see the videos that were made of her.
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 8:08 AM on March 31, 2005

Oddly enough the partisans of the "culture of life" also tend to be warmongering hawks who strongly back the death penalty. 'Cause a lethal injection is all about life, man.
posted by clevershark at 8:09 AM on March 31, 2005

that yelling lawyer woman on CNN to completely stroke out and go on life support, which would start the prayin' outside the hospice deal all over again.

Yeah, except nobody prays for a lawyers recovery.
posted by fenriq at 8:10 AM on March 31, 2005

Crappy thread, but davelog made me laugh.
posted by DrJohnEvans at 8:11 AM on March 31, 2005

fungible: You're using transferrence to insulsate yourself from the sour grapes you're feeling. Check again - you're a conservative!

For all the rhetoric that comes from conservatives about "the rule of law", now we see that they only consider the legal system a means to an end.

Justice Scalia even noted that the actions of congress and the president are out of line with the intentions of the founding fathers, the constitution, and the self rule of a free nation.

I'll point out that their one-shot, precedent avoiding law is a lot like the ruling handed down by the supremes regarding the florida recount case.

For the record, I'm not bitter (anymore) but letting the powers that be get away with this chicanery is never good for democracy OR the republic.
posted by modernerd at 8:13 AM on March 31, 2005

Please no more Schiavo threads.
You do know her husband is having an autopsy for finding more facts on her condition.This may result in another thread from now. The time it will take for a full report should exceed all the thread's commenting time line, fyi.
posted by thomcatspike at 8:14 AM on March 31, 2005

Well maybe that Peterson guy can escape from prison, kidnap Michael Jackson, and hole up in Gary Condit's house which of course would cause that yelling lawyer woman on CNN to completely stroke out and go on life support, which would start the prayin' outside the hospice deal all over again.

The girl's name is Nancy Grace. I can just picture her flipping right the fuck out.

Considering the abuse the Schindlers have heaped on him I don't blame him for not wanting them around when Mrs. Schiavo died.

Terri's Brother pretty much killed any sympathy I might have had for him on Larry King the other day:

King: "Well, what's the motivation for him to pull the plug?"
Bro: "Well, there is evidence that he abused her, and that he dosn't want her to get better so she can tell the world about it."

I'd heard that the "rumor" was out there, but that's just so sleazy. I almost wonder if they were more interested in promoting their 'cause' then the well-being of their daughter. That same bro also said he wanted live TV feeds into the hospital bed so we could all watch her die. How ghoulish is that? This is a woman who didn't even really like being photographed when she was fully alive.

It was funny seeing all the politicians go scurrying to their corners when the public opinion polls showed people wanted them to just STFU.
posted by delmoi at 8:18 AM on March 31, 2005

I'm so going to hell for finding this advertising placement amusing.
posted by adampsyche at 8:18 AM on March 31, 2005

Ouch. me too.
posted by dabitch at 8:18 AM on March 31, 2005

That ad made this entire thread worthwhile. Thanks, adampsyche.
posted by SeizeTheDay at 8:21 AM on March 31, 2005

davelog's was the best comment... until now. That bunny is too much!
This comment, posted retroactively [admin], refers to not-yet extant events involving [deleted party] and naxosaur (no pressure!). Delete this disclaimer. Destroy pertinent bits by any means necessary (1st lawof thermodynamics permitting) to prevent disclosure of chrono-fraud program re: Schaivo, and false memory/"temporal record" creation of schaivo media coverage
posted by sonofsamiam at 8:24 AM on March 31, 2005

you're all extremely slow. I scooped you all.

she's dead.
posted by matteo at 3:55 PM CET on March 31 [!]
posted by matteo at 8:24 AM on March 31, 2005

So now the TV coverage of the lawsuits over her body begins?

No, but in a sick, sad coda to this whole sordid affair CNN is showing a helicopter shot chasing a white Ford van that is getting a police motorcycle escort. Presumably the van is carrying her body to the ME for the autopsy.
posted by fixedgear at 8:25 AM on March 31, 2005

my firefox extension gave me the news. anyone know if there's one for the pope?
posted by quonsar at 8:28 AM on March 31, 2005

I doubt we've seen the coda to this affair.
posted by sonofsamiam at 8:29 AM on March 31, 2005

In my lifetime, it seems like we've only gotten new popes when one dies. How does it work otherwise? But this one doesn't have much time left, clearly. Here's hoping the next won't be as conservative.

From what I'd heared, the next pope may be more conservative, John Paul II (or whatever) was actualy pretty liberal. I've also heard that hard-liners are pretty much controlling the inferm pope anyway. Not that it matters.

back OT: Did you also know that the shindlers are actualy selling their list of donors?
posted by delmoi at 8:30 AM on March 31, 2005

CNN is simultaneously interviewing self-righteous media whore Jesse Jackson and "Left Behind" wingnut Tim Lahaye. And the president is rushing to his press conference early so he can score political points with the red states (and soften the impact of this report) by offering his condolences to the Schiavo family. I think my head is going to explode.
posted by TBoneMcCool at 8:31 AM on March 31, 2005

At the risk of being the next plaigarist dragged across the bloggy coals, I must admit that the 'car accident' remark came from John Holmberg, morning dj on 98KUPD. I'm REAL glad, however, that I'm not the only one who gets all giggly thinking about it.
posted by davelog at 8:32 AM on March 31, 2005

Wouldn't it have been awesome if this thread hadn't been posted? Like, if every single Metafilter user had resisted the urge? That would have been awesome. I would have been so silently proud. Oh man.

All the hysterical asshattery surrounding that poor lady has really really disgusted me. It is my sincere hope that any upcoming Terri news, such as the results of her autopsy, can be entirely ignored by Metafilter, or at least restricted to comments in already existing posts. I like to come here to see new and interesting things, not news stories that are already plastered everywhere else I look.
posted by thirteenkiller at 8:41 AM on March 31, 2005

Anyone else think "Terry Schiavo has died" is a strangely worded headline?
posted by ORthey at 8:42 AM on March 31, 2005

w00t!!!!! YAYEE!!! SHe is teh ded!11!!! OMG where is her f33ding toob!!! I w4nt to buy it on EBay!11
posted by Debaser626 at 8:44 AM on March 31, 2005

WXRT in Chicago followed up the announcement with "Lay Down Sally" by Eric Clapton. I couldn't help sniggering.
posted by me3dia at 8:46 AM on March 31, 2005

I saw the same CNN coverage. I was absolutely stunned--it's truly a freak show. I can't believe that's considered "journalism" on any level.
posted by PuppyCat at 8:46 AM on March 31, 2005

It's a sad day indeed when CNN and 'journalism' are used in the same sentence.
posted by davelog at 8:47 AM on March 31, 2005

She's finally moved on to that better salad bar in the sky.
posted by HTuttle at 8:48 AM on March 31, 2005

I've stayed out of every Terry thread thus far, and will continue to do so. Continue? Isn't it over?

I have made this brief interruption in my avoidance of the the issue to make a single prognostication:

This Terry stuff is so fucking far from over you will look back on these pleasant, easy going days of civil discussion with nostalgia. Now matter what you think about it personally, she now plays the role of a martyr and the right has a subjectively valid reason to call everyone on the other side of the culture war a murderer. Have you not seen all the links to abortion issues? Have you not heard the militant murmurings? Do you not realize that everyone on either side was using her life as a weapon in their larger maneuverings - and that gets easier now she's actually officially died?

Of course you did, I just had to vent once. I'm done, thanks.
posted by freebird at 8:49 AM on March 31, 2005

terri is a gangsta!
posted by quonsar at 8:49 AM on March 31, 2005

And tomorrow will feature the culmination of Andy Kaufman's greatest performance ever when it is revealed that he had been laying in that bed all this time.
posted by robocop is bleeding at 8:50 AM on March 31, 2005

I'll throw this thread further into the gutter by quoting Howard Stern, as heard as the news broke, on my way into work: "I'm so religious I still want them to put the feeding tube back in."
posted by Peter H at 8:51 AM on March 31, 2005

"I like to come here to see new and interesting things, not news stories that are already plastered everywhere else I look."

Dude. It's called passing the thread without reading it. Nobody made you come in here. But nOooOooOoo you had to come in here and not only read it, but get so disgusted you posted about it. Why aren't you out cavorting in the many non-Terri Schiavo threads?
posted by beth at 8:53 AM on March 31, 2005

freebird, whatever you do, don't see Palindromes when it comes to your local arthouse.
posted by Peter H at 8:53 AM on March 31, 2005

There's some joke to be made here involving Michael Jackson, Terri Schaivo, the Pope, a Walrus and Osama Bin Laden.

Seeing as how this is a pretty lousy thread to begin with, I'm game:

So the Pope, Terri Schiavo, Osama Bin Laden and a full-grown Atlantic walrus all arrive at the gates of Heaven on the same day and step up to St. Peter's rostrum to receive the Lord's eternal judgment on their souls.

"I have some bad news," St. Peter tells them. "Only three of the four of you were supposed to be admitted into Heaven today. I'll just go have a quick chat with Jesus to figure out which one of you is damned to hell, and then I'll be back to welcome the other three."

As St. Peter walks off into Heaven, chatter ensues.

"I know I've got nothing to worry about," says the Pope. "I was the spiritual head of the Lord's most popular faith for most of my life."

"Well, I know I'm in," says Terri Schiavo. "I floated here on the millions of prayers of every Evangelical in America."

"Well, I still like my odds," says Osama Bin Laden. "That walrus was on the jury that acquitted Michael Jackson."

Thank you very much. I'm here all week. Try the veal.
posted by gompa at 8:54 AM on March 31, 2005

gompa, I didn't say any of that, thank you. ;)
posted by Peter H at 8:56 AM on March 31, 2005

Can't wait for all the merchandise like this:


posted by sharksandwich at 8:56 AM on March 31, 2005

you're all extremely slow. I scooped you all.

she's dead.
posted by matteo at 3:55 PM CET on March 31 [!]


You didn't scoop me, matteo.

Can I go to FARK now?
posted by trharlan at 9:01 AM on March 31, 2005

Ding Dong
posted by lacus at 9:07 AM on March 31, 2005

quonsar: Rumour has it the genius begind the firefox extension is working on a revision...
posted by docgonzo at 9:10 AM on March 31, 2005

Who?
posted by spilon at 9:12 AM on March 31, 2005

I'm probably going to hell for this statement....

But why are we concerned about one woman, who's been dead for several years (just kept animated on a tube) and Bush is running around intervening (shame on the republicans, I thought they wanted to keep the feds out of the states)

WHILE

There are tons of men and women dying in Iraq sentenced to go there by the same president?

I'm not troll baiting (I know it sounds like it) but that's been sitting on my mind all week long.

FYI: I don't watch TV and mainly just go here (and a handful of other blogs) so I would have no idea about Terry until like, a week later. So I'm not all up on that this post is a "crap post." I figure someone's gotta post it.
posted by Hands of Manos at 9:13 AM on March 31, 2005

Dude. It's called passing the thread without reading it. Nobody made you come in here. But nOooOooOoo you had to come in here and not only read it, but get so disgusted you posted about it. Why aren't you out cavorting in the many non-Terri Schiavo threads?

What would Jesus do?
posted by thirteenkiller at 9:20 AM on March 31, 2005

So what's it going to be?

Regular? Or made for TV?

Think the Schindlers will donate the proceeds to the Hospice?
posted by notreally at 9:30 AM on March 31, 2005

Everyone talks about how the Bushies tried to keep her alive. But, she died just an hour before the WMD report was released and now it's Schiavo wall-to-wall on the news. Wake up people!!!!!11! Where's the post about the WMDs and Bush killing Schiavo?
posted by Arch Stanton at 9:30 AM on March 31, 2005

There are tons of men and women dying in Iraq sentenced to go there by the same president?

Yes our culture of life did indeed miss the continuing back door draft, which was another story that got snowed-under by the plight of TS.

on preview...

made for TV

Fox does make movies, too, and with the extra ad cash they've made off this thing (was that Hannity I saw down at the circus yesterday?), expect it to come through pretty quick.
posted by wah at 9:31 AM on March 31, 2005

Next media circus:

Prince Rainier is on his last ..er.. legs. And hey, he's royalty to boot!
posted by deborah at 9:32 AM on March 31, 2005

Regular? Or made for TV?

Dinner Theatre.
posted by Peter H at 9:32 AM on March 31, 2005

.

RIP

Now the Culture of Lies, err, Life, can rape what remains of her dignity and prop her up as a martyr...goody!

*crosses fingers in hope that Falwell is smote before the weekend.
posted by schyler523 at 9:33 AM on March 31, 2005

A few notes:

1. I wonder if there will be a wrongful death suit?
2. Anyone catch Judge Birch's slam against congress and the prez? This is one of the more conservative judges out there (11th circuit crt appeals), he favored Ala. banning the sale of sex toys and supported Fla. being able to prohibit adoption by same sex couples. Yet he lit into Congress for exceeding their authority, interesting.
3. I don't think Schivao will be a long term martyr, kinda like the Gonzales case a few years back, it inflamed some passions for awhile, but things will settle back to their seething point soon enough. When it comes right down to it Americans currently lack the ability to effect armed revolution, wether this is because of will or just the disparity of weapons, I leave for others to debate (I think both).
posted by edgeways at 9:34 AM on March 31, 2005

You didn't scoop me, matteo.

1 minute! damn!
posted by matteo at 9:35 AM on March 31, 2005

But why are we concerned about one woman, who's been dead for several years (just kept animated on a tube)...

WHILE

There are tons of men and women dying in Iraq sentenced to go there by the same president?

It's not an either-or. Her death has profound implications for the anti-abortion, disability-rights and right-to-die movements, and for how we define human life. And it's an extremely hard case; she needed only externally administered food and water, unlike many of these cases where the patient is being kept on a ventilator. Anyone who compares this to Condit or Peterson is missing the point entirely.
posted by transona5 at 9:36 AM on March 31, 2005

So the Pope, Terri Schiavo, Osama Bin Laden and a full-grown Atlantic walrus all arrive at the gates of Heaven on the same day and step up to St. Peter's rostrum to receive the Lord's eternal judgment on their souls.

Shouldn't the walrus be a baby seal?
posted by duck at 9:43 AM on March 31, 2005

I should add that, to me, all tasteless (no pun intended) jokes are aimed at the people who made this into another Jessica In The Well story, and not Terri herself, who I'm sure has been up in Heaven at an all-you-can-eat buffet for over a decade now and all that. I'm sorry for her heart attack some years ago, I'm also sorry she suffered from bulemia. (avoid ironic end joke) And I'm sorry her husband had to put up with her family, where, if you're known by who your friends are, well, suffice it say are no one I'd really want to share a meal with anyway.
posted by Peter H at 9:45 AM on March 31, 2005

Hate to bring this topic down to an even further low, but lookit what just popped up on the web: Terri Schiavo nudies [obviously, not safe for work, taste, or heaven]
posted by davelog at 9:45 AM on March 31, 2005

"...you're all extremely slow. I scooped you all."

This is a contest?

"CNN is simultaneously interviewing self-righteous media whore Jesse Jackson and "Left Behind" wingnut Tim Lahaye. And the president is rushing to his press conference early so he can score political points with the red states (and soften the impact of this report) by offering his condolences to the Schiavo family. I think my head is going to explode."

See, this is what I miss because I don't watch TV. I'm not saying to brag like that's a great thing (as so many people do), just that it does create a bling spot for me—which is significant because I read news, mostly online, almost like it were my full-time job so I'm pretty informed on all the various things in the media. But I don't get the whole TV circus atmosphere thing and am not as aware as I should be about how much it influences the way people think. Even so, every poll shows that a good majority of Americans, across the political spectrum, including a majority of self-described evangelicals, were against reinsertion of the tube and political intervention in this. So constant barrage of paying people, weepy Schinlders, and Terri video don't seem to have had that much effect persuading Americans to see this the pro-life way.

So I don't see the doom-and-gloom that some are predicting. It will be an important and symbloic moment in the culture wars, but it's a defeat and the majority of Americans, Dem and Repub, even evangelicals, don't support the pro-lifer's position on this. The freepers are not representative in any way of the majority of Americans. Demonstrating that this is true is a very good thing. It's also a major moment in the fracturing of the Republican party and the coalition of small-government conservatives and religious conservatives. There's serious talk that some of the GOP moderates in Congress might switch parties.

The religious right want to remake America into their image of a godly nation. This isn't what most Americans want. They tolerate and even support some of the things that religious conservatives do because they are a little nervous about the leftward cultural trend and don't mind the religious right acting as a brake on it. But when the religious right really begins to reshape American government, as it has recently, support for them dries up. I think they're going to destroy themselves politically, but remain a passionate minority voice we're going to have to tolerate.
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 9:47 AM on March 31, 2005

edgeways writes " Anyone catch Judge Birch's slam against congress and the prez? This is one of the more conservative judges out there (11th circuit crt appeals), he favored Ala. banning the sale of sex toys and supported Fla. being able to prohibit adoption by same sex couples. Yet he lit into Congress for exceeding their authority, interesting."

They had it coming:"But in a concurring opinion, Judge Stanley F. Birch Jr., appointed by the first President Bush in 1990, wrote that federal courts had no jurisdiction in the case and that the law enacted by Congress and President Bush allowing the Schindlers to seek a federal court review was unconstitutional.
..."legislative dictation of how a federal court should exercise its judicial functions," he wrote, it "invades the province of the judiciary and violates the separation of powers principle."""


Does anyone expected the Federal Courts would fall for that particular troll, something that would amount to collective juducial suicide?
posted by nkyad at 9:48 AM on March 31, 2005

I' just like to see a post about barnyard bondage.
posted by Photar at 9:50 AM on March 31, 2005

Everyone talks about how the Bushies tried to keep her alive. But, she died just an hour before the WMD report was released and now it's Schiavo wall-to-wall on the news. Wake up people!!!!!11! Where's the post about the WMDs and Bush killing Schiavo?

I think you've become your own strawman.
posted by bshort at 9:51 AM on March 31, 2005

transona5 - I think it is narrower then that. I think it has to do just about exclusively with right-to-die, and except for the legislative branch getting all hot and bothered, and the mind numbing amount of courts this went through this came down the way it should have. It was $ and PR that kept it afloat, but in the end a spouses right to make medical decisions was upheld.

I don't think it has much to do with disabled rights as the lady was pretty much beyond disabled (I work with people with disabilites all the time so I am can speak to disabled rights issues). And what would it have to do with anti-abortion issues?

It wasn't a hard case, it was a dragged out case. She needed an invasive medical procedure to administer nutrients, and apparently was kept alive against her wishes.
posted by edgeways at 9:54 AM on March 31, 2005

.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 10:03 AM on March 31, 2005

I read news, mostly online, almost like it were my full-time job so I'm pretty informed on all the various things in the media. But I don't get the whole TV circus atmosphere thing and am not as aware as I should be about how much it influences the way people think.
EB, Are you saying you learn more from an author's opinion than seeing and hearing it yourself? I hate watching the local news. Because unless the weather report is sunny, it's usually life's unpleasant side.

Point out your response was prompted by a member’s opinion.
Ps, I like your view on the religious right.
posted by thomcatspike at 10:18 AM on March 31, 2005

So what sort of dirty tricks did the Bush Administration get up to while Terry was capturing the media's full attention?

I'm damn sure they snuck something in.
posted by five fresh fish at 10:19 AM on March 31, 2005

Metafilter was way cooler when Kaycee Nicole died. You guys are not solving any amusing mysteries now. Just yakking. yak yak yak yak yak.
posted by thirteen at 10:31 AM on March 31, 2005

fff, I totally agree. I'm thinking...mmm...something about the draft, maybe.
posted by iconomy at 10:32 AM on March 31, 2005

EB writes: In my lifetime, it seems like we've only gotten new popes when one dies... Here's hoping the next won't be as conservative.

It's my understanding that John Paul II has packed the ranks of the cardinals with people as conservative as he to ensure that his successor will not enact a bunch of changes to Catholic doctrine. We're probably not going to see meaningful change under the next few Popes.

Worst-case scenario as far as the next papal appointment? This guy. As head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, he's one of the big enforcers of orthodoxy in the Vatican. A recent-ish position paper by Ratzinger titled Considerations Regarding Proposals to Give Legal Recognition to Unions Between Homosexual Persons contains such classy statements as, "Those who would move from tolerance to the legitimization of specific rights for cohabiting homosexual persons need to be reminded that the approval or legalization of evil is something far different from the toleration of evil."
posted by the_bone at 10:34 AM on March 31, 2005

So what sort of dirty tricks did the Bush Administration
Proven bomb shell about Bush, no WMD in Iraq, will be silenced by the news bombarding us with Terry Schiavo death. Then also flaking it with by recapping her previous over told misleading details. PDTB!
posted by thomcatspike at 10:38 AM on March 31, 2005

Metafilter was way cooler when Kaycee Nicole died. You guys are not solving any amusing mysteries now.

If someone can prove that the whole l'affaire Schiavo was a hoax and that she didn't exist, that would be pretty entertaining.

So what sort of dirty tricks did the Bush Administration get up to while Terry was capturing the media's full attention?

National Telecommunications and Information Administration disallows private registrations for .US domain names
posted by the_bone at 10:43 AM on March 31, 2005

"The eight years of Clinton have ruined this country even more than I once thought."

That is AWESOME!
posted by 2sheets at 10:55 AM on March 31, 2005

Ok, I will not say she looked hot before she went into a coma. No way. Not now, not ever. Damn you Mean Mr. Bucket!
posted by Dean Keaton at 11:07 AM on March 31, 2005

I was watching the coverage on CNN this morning and they had a long, gazing shot of a cross with a cloth draped over arms of the cross. Was the person that put that up trying to draw similarities between Terri and Jesus? Are the judges the Pharisees? I was really confused why that was worthy of television coverage, like much of what has been shown over the last month in this case.

I'm fairly sure that a vast majority of Americans are just happy that this whole situation is over and the snarky comments in this thread are just a reflection of that.
posted by Arch Stanton at 11:20 AM on March 31, 2005

What will the next media hysteria be?

Schiavo Case a Precursor to Battles Ahead.
posted by semmi at 11:22 AM on March 31, 2005

General Fransisco Franco is still dead!

(Remember when Bush was gonna fix Social Security? Then he had to back down because he faced stronger opposition than he thought? Then this Schiavo thing came out of nowhere, right? Right?)
posted by klangklangston at 11:25 AM on March 31, 2005

Oh, and as long as we're here, Billy/Bass Wolf (of Guitar Wolf) died today.
posted by klangklangston at 11:26 AM on March 31, 2005

the_bone writes "We're probably not going to see meaningful change under the next few Popes."
Arch Stanton writes "Was the person that put that up trying to draw similarities between Terri and Jesus?"

Given the hysterical climate created and nurtured around her, I'd not be surprised if in a few years she ascends to the ranks of sanctity. All you need is a couple of miracles near the hospice and there you are, Saint Terri of the Slaves or, more in tune with the Spanish prevalence among the American and Florida Catholic community, "Santa Theresa de Los Escravos". A nice story for the future children about the brainless girl who was thrown down the stairs, starved and then burned to ashes, but never lost her faith
posted by nkyad at 11:31 AM on March 31, 2005

I hesitate to call it my "favorite" part of all this, but there is a certain justice here. From the Wikipedia article on Terry Schiavo:

"On March 28, 2005, the New York Times reported that the Schindlers have compiled a list of people and organizations who have contributed financially to their legal fight, and they are selling this list to a direct-marketing organization that will solicit money from these people for a wide range of anti-abortion and conservative efforts."

I wonder of any of those people who paid to lengthen this already over-extended legal (and hence, media) circus knew that their money had bought them inclusion on a list that will open them up to a whole world of right wing beg cases?
posted by JHarris at 11:39 AM on March 31, 2005

Gompa:

Thank you!
posted by gagglezoomer at 11:39 AM on March 31, 2005

I wonder of any of those people who paid to lengthen this already over-extended legal (and hence, media) circus knew that their money had bought them inclusion on a list that will open them up to a whole world of right wing beg cases?

They deserve it. I attended a Bush rally (I'm a dem) and they took my name and address before they gave me a ticket. Within a few months I was receiving a whole bunch of mailings about anti-abortion causes. I got what I deserved as well.
posted by Arch Stanton at 11:43 AM on March 31, 2005

I believe in God; I'm a Christian; I believe in the human soul. I strongly suspect Terri's left this world 15 years ago.
posted by Doohickie at 11:47 AM on March 31, 2005

The religious right want to remake America into their image of a godly nation. This isn't what most Americans want. They tolerate and even support some of the things that religious conservatives do because they are a little nervous about the leftward cultural trend and don't mind the religious right acting as a brake on it. But when the religious right really begins to reshape American government, as it has recently, support for them dries up.

Well, I think you've seen that; every single poll I've seen suggests that not just a majority, but a large majority of Americans is disgusted with the way Congress overreached, the political opportunism of all of this.

I think this is a real turning point for the Republican Party, the moment at which the split between traditional conservatives and the radical wingers becomes impossible to paper over any longer. It might not prompt a wave of party switches, but the likes of Sullivan and Glenn Reynolds (Salon link) have suggested that it may well result in less money given to the party, less involvement, fewer votes.

Moderate Republicans need to realize that the wingers are trying to grab the wheel. You gonna let 'em?
posted by kgasmart at 12:14 PM on March 31, 2005

Schiavo's death just made it has the headliner on one of Germany's main evening news shows (ZDF Heute Journal). Almost as important were the six millions jobless people- they made headline 2. You are not alone.
posted by thehippe at 12:17 PM on March 31, 2005

Dookickie, I know folks who claim they witnessed the same. This was while watching the well known person to them leavening and responding to medics for the hospital where the person was later pronounced dead. Since I have experience the vegetable state (worst place to be -- no way of communicating clearly), the out of body view while hovering over yourself in the ER and also seeing the tunnel of light, I would not say you are wrong but w/o a full neurologist review ymmv. Heck, the neurologists educated guess on me fully recovering was wrong. It was not until I became conscious again could they fully make a prediction on my future which in itself is an impressing story.
posted by thomcatspike at 12:18 PM on March 31, 2005

Another funny, in a perverse way, bit from the Wikipedia article:

"On March 27, she was given the Anointing of the Sick ("Last Rites"). In accordance with Catholic tradition, a drop of wine was applied to her tongue, but a small piece of bread was unable to be offered. She had also been given Holy Communion through the feeding tube just before it was removed."

I understand that it's an important rite of Catholicism, but something about the idea of Christ's blood sliding down the feeding tube....
posted by JHarris at 12:34 PM on March 31, 2005

....is makin' me thirsty!
posted by exlotuseater at 12:44 PM on March 31, 2005

I mourn for the loss of any more Schiavo threads.
posted by strangeleftydoublethink at 12:55 PM on March 31, 2005

RIP_Terri
posted by swift at 1:25 PM on March 31, 2005

who's terry schiavo?
posted by mcsweetie at 1:37 PM on March 31, 2005

I understand that it's an important rite of Catholicism, but something about the idea of Christ's blood sliding down the feeding tube....

I thought it was a sort of a communion host smoothie.
posted by fixedgear at 1:45 PM on March 31, 2005

who's terry schiavo?

Second-string pitcher for the Mets 73-76. Southpaw. Not much of an arm, but his mullet was FANTASTIC.

For more statistics and exciting trivia, visit espn.com.
posted by cortex at 1:49 PM on March 31, 2005

Looks like the next media wave is about to make landfall: Pope Gets Last Rites

(Yeah, newsfilter, I know.)
posted by fredosan at 1:50 PM on March 31, 2005

You know what's worse than any, allegedly, tasteless jokes in this thread? The media*. The only reason this has been page one for weeks is to sell papers.

The media doesn't care about Ms. Schiavo, her husband, her parents, the right to die with dignity, etc. They only care about the bottom dollar.

The "legitimate" media has been on a long, slow slide into National Equirer territory. I shudder to think what's at the bottom of that slide.

*I'm sure there are members of the media that hate what's become of it. However, I believe they are few and far between and getting scarcer.
posted by deborah at 1:50 PM on March 31, 2005

I have never wanted someone dead so much in my entire life...well, except for the pope.
posted by crapulent at 1:55 PM on March 31, 2005

I attended a Bush rally (I'm a dem) and they took my name and address before they gave me a ticket

And you didn't live at 1060 West Addison, Chicago, IL 60613? For shame.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 1:59 PM on March 31, 2005

On the pope replacement angle I'm hoping for a big ol' shizm. We haven't had a good, viable, splitting of the Roman Catholic church in quite a while.
posted by Mitheral at 2:01 PM on March 31, 2005

I think you mean a schism. A "shizm" is what Snoop Dogg uses to square up his window frames.
posted by sonofsamiam at 2:04 PM on March 31, 2005

Weirdly, I checked Google News about 3:00 PM Eastern time and there was no mention of Schiavo's death, even though I see this thread started shortly after ten in the morning.
posted by alumshubby at 2:07 PM on March 31, 2005

" think you mean a schism. A "shizm" is what Snoop Dogg uses to square up his window frames."

No, that's a chamois.
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 2:08 PM on March 31, 2005

Did you also know that the shindlers are actualy selling their list of donors?

Schindlers' list?
posted by kirkaracha at 2:09 PM on March 31, 2005

Never imagined a Blues Brothers reference would be found in such a place. But then, DeLay did consider himself to be on a mission from God.
posted by john at 2:09 PM on March 31, 2005

Heck, the neurologists educated guess on me fully recovering was wrong.

Are you sure? I mean, this could all be a dream youre having at the moment of death...

Seriously, I was not trying to make an absolute statement; I was just throwing my gut feel out there (thus the weasel word "suspect").
posted by Doohickie at 2:10 PM on March 31, 2005

It wasn't the most brilliant thread, but the ensuing comments were tantamount to genius. I laughed, I cried...I want the t-shirt.
posted by laurenbove at 2:13 PM on March 31, 2005

Yes, schism.
posted by Mitheral at 2:13 PM on March 31, 2005

Oh, and as long as we're here, Billy/Bass Wolf (of Guitar Wolf) died today.

Are you serious?! If we had any priorities as a nation, we'd be mourning this loss instead. Man, that sucks. I missed them in Detroit because I was playing a show the night they were in town and told myself I'd see 'em next go 'round. Figures.

.

Also: is this "Terri Schiavo" something I'd need an IV to know about?
posted by joe lisboa at 2:25 PM on March 31, 2005

sian writes: "You didn't have to post this, except to benefit those who don't watch TV."

And we don't deserve that benefit?
Threads like this is the reason I read MeFi instead of watching the dull TV news.
posted by spazzm at 2:41 PM on March 31, 2005

Michael Jackson, Terri Schaivo, the Pope, a Walrus and Osama Bin Laden

So, MJ, Terri, OBL and the Pope are all at the zoo, looking at a walrus in an enclosure. MJ says "I bet that walrus is a Jehovah's Witness - just waiting for the day when the kingdom of heaven arrives on earth so he can play in the ocean with the little children." The Pope says "No, Michael, the walrus is a catholic and serves the lord by serving as entertainment for us here in the zoo - for man was given dominion over all beasts." OBL curses the Pope and says "Foolish old man, that Walrus is a muslim, and were it not for that cage he would tear open your chest and eat your heart in righteous anger." They all turn to look at Terri, to see what she has to say, and she smiles and says "Buhbuuhlala"
posted by Sparx at 2:42 PM on March 31, 2005

Hahaha! That thing she said about the walrus and pickles was hilarious!
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 2:45 PM on March 31, 2005

Although the name is vaguely familiar, I cannot recall a single detail about who Kaycee Nicole was. Get back to me in a year or two with the name Terri Schiavo.
posted by mischief at 2:47 PM on March 31, 2005

So Michael Jackson, Terri Schiavo, the Pope, a Walrus and Osama bin Laden walk into a bar. The bartender says, "What is this, a joke?" And the Pope says, "Well, not really, there's no punchline."

So Michael Jackson, Terri Schiavo, the Pope, a Walrus and Osama bin Laden walk into a bar. And the bartender goes,
"I don't know for sure if bugs are warm." And the Pope says, "Be careful with that Ctrl-V, sonofsamiam. You already screwed up the joke."

So Michael Jackson, Terri Schiavo, the Pope, a Walrus and Osama bin Laden walk into a bar, and the bartender says, "Why the long faces?" And the pope goes, "well, i'm on my deathbed." Schiavo says, "They pulled the plug on me despite the wishes of baby jesus." Michael Jackson says, "I can't get a moment alone with.... my...self," the walrus says, "I'm being hunted to extinction," and bin Laden says, "The CIA just fired me!" And the bartender says... "I was trying to tell a different joke."

So Michael Jackson, Terri Schiavo, the Pope, a Walrus and Osama bin Laden walk into a bar, and order a vodka tonic. The bartender slips some roofies in there and [NEVER YOU MIND.]
So they come in the next day, and the bartender says, "Some more vodka tonics?" And they all (except the walrus and Jackson) go, "No way, those things make my feeding tube holes hurt!"

So Michael Jackson, the Pope, a Walrus and Osama bin Laden walk into a bar... Schiavo's gurney rolled right under it.
posted by sonofsamiam at 3:03 PM on March 31, 2005

What, this is a bar on stilts?
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 3:05 PM on March 31, 2005

the Schindlers have compiled a list of people and... are selling this list to a direct-marketing organization that will solicit [them]...

This is not a bit of unimportant fluff.

The evangelist right will now organize these supporters for other causes. They will be used to demonstrate against anything else their controllers deem worthy of protest.

This shows great media and political sophistication, and there is no counter-organization to provide voice for the majority of America, which only wants to be left alone to do its own thing.

You will see another manufactured evangelist crisis. Most telling will be if this crisis appears at the same time the government is looking for a way to distract attention away from itself.
posted by five fresh fish at 3:22 PM on March 31, 2005

How did she die?
posted by hoborg at 3:44 PM on March 31, 2005

To refute the "Why did you need to post this? We all have TVs!" claim : some people who have been following this for no reason live in countries that could give a shit about Terri Schiavo. I live in one of those countries and was glad to have Metafilter alert me that she finally bit it.

I was also happy to have Metafilter around to make jokes about Terri Schiavo and a walrus. I've been making a lot of Terri Schiavo jokes myself, but they've mostly been limited to zucchini.
posted by grapefruitmoon at 3:59 PM on March 31, 2005

I would not say you are wrong
(thus the weasel word "suspect").

Doohickie, I liked hearing your gut feeling as it may be correct. Outside of my circle I have never heard the opinion expressed.
posted by thomcatspike at 4:16 PM on March 31, 2005

How did she die?
W/o an autopsy report we won’t know. Betting dehydration, excuse the pun if it is looked that way.
posted by thomcatspike at 4:19 PM on March 31, 2005

"Why did you need to post this? We all have TVs!"

I missed that. And, no, I don't have a TV. I learned of her death right here on MeFi.
posted by mischief at 4:20 PM on March 31, 2005

The amazing part? Right before she died, she revealed that she had been dreaming the entire run of St. Elsewhere.

JoeLisboa: Yep. And I heard about it from Box, of The Avatars and Powertrane (I know you know who that is, since I know who you are).
posted by klangklangston at 4:22 PM on March 31, 2005

mischief: I missed that. And, no, I don't have a TV. I learned of her death right here on MeFi.

There seems to be an interesting bit of amnesia on the part of a large number of TV watchers. It's a facinating psychological experiment.

"Did you see that commercial where..."

"Actually, no, I don't watch television."

"Oh, right, well it..."

Then of course you try to steer the topic to more interesting mutual ground, and then a few minutes later...

"Say, have you seen any episodes from this season of..."

"Actually, no, I don't watch television."

"Ohh, that's right. Well on it there is this guy who..."

And then soon it comes back around to...

"Have you seen that commercial where..."

I've come to the conclusion that exposure to too much cable television produces the same kind of cognitive disability that afflicted my poor dear Great Aunt, who could be quite happy with a 2-hour conversation in which she asked me about High School every 10 minutes, living in blissfull ignorance of the previous 8 years of family history.
posted by KirkJobSluder at 4:37 PM on March 31, 2005

Kirk, you forgot the sports zealots, especially at bars.

"Whatta ya think about Georgia Tech?"
"Great school! I loved the time I spent there."
"No, I mean their basketball team."
"Tech has a basketball team?"

Or:

The day after a big win on the road:
"How about them Braves?"
"What about 'em?"
"They won last night."
"I don't own a TV."

Even the female bartenders who only know sports from what they hear over the bar get floored by that one.

heheh. ;-P
posted by mischief at 4:48 PM on March 31, 2005

klangklangston writes "The amazing part? Right before she died, she revealed that she had been dreaming the entire run of St. Elsewhere."

Excellent. (And why do we have Dr. "Cat Killer" Frist and not Dr. Westphall or Dr. Auschlander in the Senate?)
posted by orthogonality at 4:51 PM on March 31, 2005

She died years ago.

There are tons of men and women dying in Iraq sentenced to go there by the same president?

That statement would be correct if we had the draft active. As it stands, your statement is senseless rhetoric.

But you knew that already.
posted by justgary at 7:26 PM on March 31, 2005

How the hell should I know we never spoke about this, my God I was only 25 years old. How the hell should I know? We were young. We never spoke of this. ~ Michael Schiavo to girlfriend Cindy Shook

How did they know she would want this? How did they know she wouldn't want to go on? ~ Terri Schaivo's comment to Diane Meyer about removing a respirator from Karen Ann Quinlan

To enter the room of Terri Schiavo is nothing like entering the room of a patient who is comatose or brain-dead or in some neurological sense no longer there. ~ Dr. William Polk Cheshire Jr.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/Commentary/com-3_26_05_OSC.html
http://www.slate.com/id/2115208/


If you establish and apply the principle that you can kill 'unproductive' fellow human beings then woe betide us all when we become old and frail! If one is allowed to kill the unproductive people then woe betide the invalids who have used up, sacrificed and lost their health and strength in the productive process. If one is allowed forcibly to remove one's unproductive fellow human beings then woe betide loyal soldiers who return to the homeland seriously disabled, as cripples, as invalids. If it is once accepted that people have the right to kill 'unproductive' fellow humans--and even if initially it only affects the poor defenseless mentally ill--then as a matter of principle murder is permitted for all unproductive people, in other words for the incurably sick, the people who have become invalids through labor and war, for us all when we become old, frail and therefore unproductive.

Then, it is only necessary for some secret edict to order that the method developed for the mentally ill should be extended to other 'unproductive' people, that it should be applied to those suffering from incurable lung disease, to the elderly who are frail or invalids, to the severely disabled soldiers. Then none of our lives will be safe any more. Some commission can put us on the list of the 'unproductive,' who in their opinion have become worthless life. And no police force will protect us and no court will investigate our murder and give the murderer the punishment he deserves. ~ Clemens von Galen
posted by bevets at 9:16 PM on March 31, 2005

So, who won the pot?

I feel for her and her family; but oh what passes for news...serves best as warped adult comedy.
posted by buzzman at 9:23 PM on March 31, 2005

So Michael Jackson, Terri Schiavo, the Pope, Osama bin Laden, and the walrus go up to st peter's gate ...

st peter - "who are you?"

"i'm michael jackson"

"you're going to have to go to the adults-only section of purgatory, first ... you've been naughty"

"and you?"

"i'm terri schiavo"

"wait ... didn't you come in here 15 years ago? ... never mind, go on in"

"and you ... oh, yes, you're the pope ... come on in, innocent iii's looking for a fourth guy on the bowling team"

"and you?"

"i'm osama bin laden"

st peter throws him 72 grapes and opens the trap door to hell under him

"and you are?"

"i'm the walrus"

"you can't be"

"but i have tusks and everything"

"come on ... everybody knows the walrus is paul"
posted by pyramid termite at 9:25 PM on March 31, 2005

bevets writes "If you establish and apply the principle that you can kill 'unproductive' fellow human beings then woe betide us all when we become old and frail!"

The issue was never that she was "unproductive".

If you want to argue actual issues, then I'll respectfully argue with you, even though I don't agree with you. (This is generally my position with dhoyt: on most things, I very much disagree with him, but more often than not, he argues fairly).

if you just want to set up strawmen, then I'm just going to ignore you, because by setting up strawmen, you're just arguing with yourself. (This is generally my position on Steve_at_Linnwood: Steve rarely or never makes substantive arguments, preferring instead to snark at strawmen. This makes Steve too predictable to waste much time on.)

bevets, with full knowledge of your reputation at fark.com, I've nevertheless given you the benefit of the doubt, and even argued against those who would call you a troll or who have asked that you be banned. But if all you can do is erect strawmen and then "prove" you've knocked them down, there's no point in even reading what you write, much less responding to it.

bevets, if you want anyone to listen to what you have to say, you can't make up arguments and then attribute those made-up arguments to your opponents. If you want to argue like a grown-up, I welcome you at metafilter, even though I doubt I'll ever agree with you. But if you insist on arguing like a child, I'm just going to have to write you off.

It's your choice. Be a man or be a child.
posted by orthogonality at 9:32 PM on March 31, 2005

How did she die?

I heard she got hit by a bus.
posted by hellbient at 10:42 PM on March 31, 2005

Well, here's my third Wikipedia article factoid of this discussion...

Did anyone notice that both the ABC News and CBS News polls about what Americans thought about this whole Schiavo fracas were very negative? That approval ratings of Congress dropped to 31%? That between 63 to 82% of people (depending on the precise opinion being measured) polled thought it was a political ploy and not founded out of honest concern for Ms. Schiavo?

These weren't web polls either. Check it out, it's towards the bottom of the Public Opinion section.

Or... follow these to go directly to the article's linked-to polls:
ABC News: Poll: No Role For Government In Schiavo Case
CBS News: Political Fallout Over Schiavo
posted by JHarris at 10:43 PM on March 31, 2005

may I have my five dollars back?
posted by nanojath at 11:05 PM on March 31, 2005

may I have my five dollars back?

My vote would be yes, but if we could remove your feeding tube instead, I'd go for that.
posted by Eekacat at 11:27 PM on March 31, 2005

"Did anyone notice that both the ABC News and CBS News polls about what Americans thought about this whole Schiavo fracas were very negative?"

No! Really? I guess I should check Wikipedia on current events more often.
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 12:21 AM on April 1, 2005

So we've all done our advance directives, our DNRs, and our power of attorneys. And e-mailed our representatives and senators as to why we were prompted to do this.
posted by goofyfoot at 12:52 AM on April 1, 2005

bevets, you're late. after this you're just pissing in the wind.
posted by mek at 5:05 AM on April 1, 2005

mek

bevets, you're late.

While the moderator(s) on MetaFilter is more tolerant than some, he will not allow me to post early in a Schiavo thread. Perhaps this is to perserve bandwidth.
posted by bevets at 5:37 AM on April 1, 2005

ok, bevets ... NOW you're trolling
posted by pyramid termite at 6:26 AM on April 1, 2005

If you establish and apply the principle that you can kill 'unproductive' fellow human beings then woe betide us all when we become old and frail!

agreed.

fortunately, that has about nothing to do with terri schiavo!
posted by mcsweetie at 10:21 AM on April 1, 2005

Let this thread die with Terry.
posted by foreverycomplexproblemthereisasolutionthatiswrong at 3:09 PM on April 4, 2005

But wait, there's still time to make a little money on the side.
posted by rafter at 4:03 PM on April 5, 2005