Why he got fired from Apple.
September 24, 2005 5:13 PM   Subscribe

A former Apple customer service representative shows what he feels led to his dismissal. His previous hypothesis was that the performance led the company to find his occasionally customer-trashing blog. While it seems that more and more people have been fired from companies for blogging, is it likely that the blog had nothing to do with it? Seventy percent of companies have no policy on them, but surely a company as secretive as Apple is not among them. So was it the blog, or are all intracompany talent shows just an invitation for tragedy?
posted by motherfather (68 comments total)
It's like I've always said, don't blog write and perform godawful poetry about work-related topics unless you're being paid to.

I can't believe he has the gall to slag off the other acts.
posted by jack_mo at 5:24 PM on September 24, 2005

Hilarious video. I'd be amazingly surprised if that actually prompted his dismissal, however. What would the reason for dismissal have been? Keeping your customer on hold for five minutes, as he says he did? That's not worth firing someone over.
posted by voltairemodern at 5:27 PM on September 24, 2005

I can't believe he has the gall to slag off the other acts.

Yeah, if he had been fired after mixing a video like this one, the reason for dismissal would have been clear...
posted by voltairemodern at 5:28 PM on September 24, 2005

He probably thinks he made some grand artistic gesture against the corporate monolith and suffered the classic fate of the maverick too big for his day job. Oh well. He's obviously taking the attention whoring UP another notch thanks to the firing, so I'd say he looks pretty happy. Besides, he was on def poetry and was going to quit to tour *anyway*

Hey dude, quick clue: if your agency had placed you at HP no one would even glance over. I hope you realize that you are milking the Apple brand here.
posted by scarabic at 5:38 PM on September 24, 2005

Most wage slaves are dicks, this one just has a blog.
posted by The Jesse Helms at 5:55 PM on September 24, 2005

Could it be too much time spent blogging, not enough working?
posted by prodigalsun at 5:59 PM on September 24, 2005

Dooced ? Mark Jen-ned ? Anyone, Bueller, Bueller?
posted by ericb at 6:19 PM on September 24, 2005

Most wage slaves are dicks

I take it you are independently wealthy? Or perhaps living in an organic llama-breeding commune and using a methane-powered laptop?
posted by longsleeves at 6:26 PM on September 24, 2005

That poem was great.
posted by interrobang at 6:31 PM on September 24, 2005

Maybe they read this, from an earlier posting:
earlier this year, i quit my job as the overnight guy at kinko's in what could easily be categorized as "a snit," and i immediately starting booking a national poetry tour. two weeks later, i left austin, texas, with exactly $6 and a bus pass in my pocket and $200 worth of copies stolen from kinko's and stayed out for seven weeks.

Oh yeah, if there's one things companies love, it's their employees stealing the merchandise.
posted by Deathalicious at 6:32 PM on September 24, 2005

using a methane-powered laptop?

That would account for the smell, anyway.
posted by eustacescrubb at 6:33 PM on September 24, 2005

longsleeves writes " Most wage slaves are dicks

"I take it you are independently wealthy? Or perhaps living in an organic llama-breeding commune and using a methane-powered laptop?"

Or perhaps, from his experience a lot of people who choose to be in these jobs do so because they can't be bothered to take the initiative to find other work. From the other posts by this guy, it seems who could give less of a crap about the companies he works for and the customers he's supposed to be helping.

Basically, a lot of people take these jobs because they are mindless, easy, and don't require any level of emotional or mental commitment beyond some rote memorization. I think there's a difference between people who work in low paying jobs, and people who really are just working somewhere to pay the rent and couldn't give a shit about the work they're doing.

Oh, and his poetry is shit, too.
posted by Deathalicious at 6:51 PM on September 24, 2005

I got fired 3 years ago for my blog, and I never got a MeFi post for it.

posted by chickygrrl at 7:14 PM on September 24, 2005

Anyone here ever do tech support?

Has to be the most soul-deadening, ego-withering, maddeningly boring job in the developed world. You really have to experience it to appreciate fully the depths of ignorance, incompetence, and downright mean-ness that exists out there... and there's an endless supply... it's never done... think the punishment of Sysyphus.

I'm surprised more of 'em don't snap. The term would have long since changed from 'going postal' to 'going tech supportal' if that had been linguistically more workable.
posted by scheptech at 7:16 PM on September 24, 2005

I won't go so far as to say that all wage slave are dicks, but this guy is a type I've seen before. Full of himself on some artistic kick and surfing a combination of his own delusions of grandeur and the anomie that comes from working a crappy job. I've always wondered why folks like this seem to deliberately gravitate toward work they hate. Perhaps if you need the freedom to pick up and leave at any time to pursue your art, then shit work is all you can get. On the other hand, there may be rewarding work that will make you more stable and happy and able to pursue your art (depending on what it is).

In any case, making "art" ABOUT the shitty job you love to hate because you're only in the shitty job so you can be a fancy artist - that's just pure, unadulterated, pants-shitting asshatery of the drunken-uncle variety.
posted by scarabic at 7:29 PM on September 24, 2005

Funnily enough, scheptech, it was whilst working techsupport for IBM that I began using the online handle "Sysiphus"*. You're completely correct -- the simple mindless tediousity of the work drove me just about totally batshit insane(tm).

Now, of course, working as a sysadmin I get.. exactly the same thing. Although I have managed to find that rarest of rare things -- a user who will, occaisionally and for no apparent reason, phone me to tell me that everything is working just fine. I'd like some more of those, please.

*Hrrm. How are you supposed to spell it, anyway?
posted by coriolisdave at 7:33 PM on September 24, 2005

Every time the "did s/he get fired for blogging?" thing comes up, I feel compelled to quote Anil Dash from earlier this year:

So, I assert that nobody's ever been fired for blogging. How can you test this hypothesis? Take a person's words, and guess what would happen if you took the exact same words or ideas and sent them to the public via letter to the editor, streetcorner soapbox, or pony express. Would they still get you canned? Then you weren't fired for blogging. I haven't seen a convincing example of a situation where this wasn't true yet. And believe me, in my line of work, I hear about every person that gets "fired for blogging".

(And yes, tech support is hell.)
posted by Remy at 7:36 PM on September 24, 2005

Does all def poetry stuff have this same rhythm and cadence? It all sounds the same to me.
posted by mullacc at 7:36 PM on September 24, 2005

If I were a temp, I'd be sure and decline any invitations to the company talent show – but that he didn't, and that he managed to piss off a VP, isn't a moral failure, it's a tactical one, so all this "wage slaves are dicks" sentiment is weird to me. For example:

making "art" ABOUT the shitty job you love to hate because you're only in the shitty job so you can be a fancy artist - that's just pure, unadulterated, pants-shitting asshatery of the drunken-uncle variety.

Why? Who cares? Is there anything going on with that besides a relationship of power? All it is is tactics. If he'd made art about the shitty job he had five years ago, who would mind as if it were a matter of principle? Is he supposed to be a samurai or something?

I mean, if you hate his poetry, that's another thing.
posted by furiousthought at 7:49 PM on September 24, 2005

Well, the bacon joke made me smile.
posted by artifarce at 7:53 PM on September 24, 2005

anyone who blogs about work or thier boss deserves to be fired for being an idiot.

a few years ago i wrote a list of rules on blogging. some people criticized them for just being plain commonsense and therefore useless, but when things like this come up i think theyre wrong.

anyway, heres the appropriate rule

25. dont use your real name. dont write about your work unless you dont care about getting fired.

{self link} heres the rest
posted by tsarfan at 7:58 PM on September 24, 2005

p.s. i liked his poem
posted by tsarfan at 8:05 PM on September 24, 2005

Gee, I just don't understand what all you non-call center types are so offended about. What? You are finally aware that the world doesn't rotate around your stupid fat asses? That the customer is *not* always right? That multinational corporations really don't give a flying fuck in a rolling donut about your complaints? Well, as Steve Martin used to say in 'A Wild and Craaaaazzzyy Guy' Exxxccccuuuuuuussssseee Meeeeee ! ! !
It's a shame this guy got fired, but I really do hope he's able to move into something far better and far better paying than the hell that he (and I,) and many, many, many of my co-workers have to go through every day.
Call center work is the modern contemporary sweatshop and it is a real and very stressful hell. Some of us make it out of that. Most of us don't. Those who don't end up on anti-depressant drugs to cope (sound familiar?), on stress related leave until job termination (sound familiar?) or slowing down productivity until we're terminated and our unemployment benefits are contested and denied and our wages garnished in our next call center job (sound familiar?). Or even suicide. . . (sound familiar?)
So for those who have no sympathy, here's a real big and sincere 'fuck you' from call center employess all across 'murica and the world to those who have the delusion they should be treated like little Kings or Queens every time they call in. You do not matter. You are not unique little snowflakes. You are just a financial resource to be tapped and exploited until you run dry and are tossed aside as non productive and unusable. And have a nice day. And so it goes. (Swimming With Sharks; Kevin Spacey)
posted by mk1gti at 8:09 PM on September 24, 2005

Tsarfan, I really liked your blogging rules- they definitely are common sense, but seeing as how the whole blogging thing is still new (ok, not to us nerds, but to plenty of people), there is lots of room for error. (Like people still writing shit about their jobs and being shocked! when they get fired- I say, only write stuff like, "Yay, my boss rocks, I love her".)
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 8:16 PM on September 24, 2005 [1 favorite]

mk1gti: Amen. If everyone could work tech support for one day, well, the world would be a better place. (So why is it that Fight Club rings so true among call center employees?)

So... do the people who blog about work use real names? I have in the past blogged about work; but always used code names and blocked works IP range. I always figured if they wanted to fire me over that, they couldn't say I was defaming the company or some such nonsense. Assuming they even found the site.
posted by [insert clever name here] at 8:25 PM on September 24, 2005

Just so you know he said he was in Sales Support, i.e. Customer Service (one of the many names you hear it called).

I think that's a lower ring of hell than Tech Support. I've done both.

I'll also give an amen to him that generally Canadian customers are 10,000 times more civil, realistic, polite and human than those from the US.
posted by jcking77 at 8:54 PM on September 24, 2005

I was all set to hate this guy, but the bit was kinda funny.

Okay, he didn't say he was fired for blogging, he said he was fired for his poem, in which he claimed he left someone on hold for a while, and that Americans are rude.

What is it with poetic tech supporters? ernie cline was in tech support as well.
posted by delmoi at 9:47 PM on September 24, 2005

Stupid is as stupid does.
posted by HTuttle at 10:07 PM on September 24, 2005

this guy was fucking funny. I most often hate slam poetry. But this was pretty damn good and did capture the whole carrot rope of dreaming of some other life while trodding along to pay the bills in the meantime. I work in a call center and despite what some of the posters above may posit, it's not because I lack the rugged individualistic nature required to succeed in our society.

My job is actually one of the better ones I have ever had, but its still a job and having a job still sucks some times. That's one of the reasons why this guy was funny, cause he was a good pressure valve; did you hear the laughing, those were Apple employees. They were laughing because it was funny and they could relate.

It's a shame that some manager type couldn't take a joke, or actually didn't get a joke. But thats the problem with hierarchy, the scum also rises. Unfortunately, we are all too dumb and unempathic to coexist peacefully, let alone in consensus. So yeah.. bring on the hierarchy, but jesus, let's all laugh about it every once and a while.
posted by bluevelvetelvis at 10:20 PM on September 24, 2005

Big Poppa E is pretty good. He has poetry slam MP3s on his site (find 'em yourself, because he has a pay-if-you-like policy I won't link directly). One of the best is the "Harry Potter Emo Love Song", but I like "Jesus in the Mosh Pit".

I discovered him through Last.fm, where he was -- for reasons I have yet to discern -- the "most similar" artist to The Blue Up?, a personal favorite.

Me, I tried slamming back in the 80s and it didn't suit me.
posted by dhartung at 10:24 PM on September 24, 2005

He's no John Giorno {huge mp3} (and who, besides JG, is?), but I thought his performance was good. I'd like to see all the other performances though--I laughed like hell at some of the snippets. Reminded me of Showboat: 1988, the Remake.
posted by You Should See the Other Guy at 10:38 PM on September 24, 2005

/patiently waiting for the Slam poetry to be swallowed into literary ignominy.
posted by ori at 10:48 PM on September 24, 2005

I know a ton of people that can get canned for smoking a joint over the weekend - and that has absolutely nothing to do with work. But I know, week is illegal and speech isn't free.
posted by j.p. Hung at 10:53 PM on September 24, 2005

tsarfan, I really don't like your blogging rules.

On one hand you are encouraging people to write copiously only for themselves, and then on the other you're recommending Blogger because it will somehow magically garner more hits, since apparently gaining a readership is the whole point. Pick a purpose and go with it, please.

A good blog does not need to be updated twice a freaking day.

If a person is afraid of posting something, perhaps it's best for them to sit on it instead of publishing it for the world to see. "Do what you're afraid of" sounds like some sort of motivational speaker schtick, not a blogging guideline.

There is nothing intrinsically good about an anonymous blog. In fact, most anonymous blogs are lame. If you want to stand up and say something, at least have the balls to attach your name to it. If you don't want anyone to know you said it, you probably shouldn't be publishing it. If you want to write something no one will ever see, put it on paper. And then burn it. There is no such thing as "privacy" on the internets.

Random pointless profanity does not a good blog make.

What do the pictures in this post even mean?

"out yourself. tell your secrets. you can always delete them later." Have you heard of RSS? The way back machine? How about cut and paste? Publish something online, and it's pretty much out there in the public eye forever. This is like saying, "tell everyone your masturbatory fantasies in gory detail, and then afterward say, oh, forget I said that. They'll totally forget all about it." Yeah. Uh huh. Great advice.

If you talk about your friends online, and talk about yourself once a day or more, just how long do you think this blog will stay anonymous?

I could go on, but this is probably enough for a mefi comment.
posted by Hildegarde at 10:53 PM on September 24, 2005

"out yourself. tell your secrets. you can always delete them later." Have you heard of RSS? The way back machine? How about cut and paste? Publish something online, and it's pretty much out there in the public eye forever.

who gives a shit
posted by nervousfritz at 11:37 PM on September 24, 2005

this post sucks
posted by angry modem at 11:38 PM on September 24, 2005

nervousfritz and angry modem for the win.
posted by nonmerci at 11:40 PM on September 24, 2005

mk1gti: Call center work is the modern contemporary sweatshop

Actually, I think the modern contemporary sweatshop is an an actual fucking 16-hour-day less-than-living-wage sweatshop. Yeah, tech support sucks, but get over yourself, please.
posted by Espy Gillespie at 11:57 PM on September 24, 2005

Anyone here ever do tech support?

Did tech support and the top tier which involved tech, customer service and billing support. It was hell.

For anyone who hasn't dealt with people on the phone, try a job where you do. People tend be extremely rude and obnoxious as a rule, moreso than in your average New York summer. Think intranets flamewars with a voice.

I have no doubt that blogs are bad for business and that someone may get fired if they were identified as sharing "customer support" stories from a blog. Exposing the ugly underside of anything usually upsets management.
posted by ryoshu at 12:19 AM on September 25, 2005

MetaFilter: just pure, unadulterated, pants-shitting asshatery of the drunken-uncle variety

/somebody had to do it
posted by al_fresco at 12:19 AM on September 25, 2005

Does all def poetry stuff have this same rhythm and cadence? It all sounds the same to me.

Around here--yes.
posted by sourwookie at 12:40 AM on September 25, 2005


Thanks for this great word, scarabic!
posted by grouse at 6:48 AM on September 25, 2005

Alright, his poem was awesome, and this comes from a poetry-hating jerk like myself.

And for anyone else with a sense of humour that wants a little more like this, you want to check out Ernie Cline.
posted by Imperfect at 7:41 AM on September 25, 2005


my rules are more about big-picture. tips on how to write better and attract and keep an audience.

sure cussing for the sake of cussing isnt going to make a better blog post - but the point is to not self-edit. if you mean to say "fuck i had a shitty day", say "fuck i had a shitty day." dont sit there at the computer and waste time trying to say it "properly".

similarily, yes, a good blog doesnt need to be updated twice a day... but i never said that. i said if you think youre a great writer, write twice a day. im challenging cocky writers to actually write instead of just being cocky.

Blogger: two years ago when i wrote that post the promise of the Google/Blogger merger was that the marriage would be better for Blogger users because Google would spider thier pages faster. it didn't come true. sue me.

what do the pictures in the post mean? it means that if people come to your blog by accident, they may stay if you have interesting pictures, and they might actually read what you write if you have really interesting pictures. on the web people skim like crazy, therefore if you have something that makes them stop for a second it give your brilliant text a chance.

if a person is afraid to say something, i disagree with you, it's not a good idea to sit on it because most people who sit on things don't come back and write it. it gets sat on and later forgotten. fear is the greatest cause of writer's block. writing and posting is the greatest cure. if you wrote for a month about things that were truly scary for you to write about, i bet you those posts would be better and have a sharper edge than your safe posts. one reason i liked this apple dude's poem was because he was saying things that were contrary to what youre supposed to think as an Apple employee (aka "our customers sometimes suck").

therefore im encouraging people to set thier fears aside when they write, and just write, and not let the naysayers in thier head talk them out of writing what's on thier mind. i dont see a problem with that advice.

out yourself, tell your secrets, you can always delete them later... yes ive heard of RSS and the wayback. but lets get real, there are 18 million blogs. most of them dont have anyone subscribing to them. and seriously, when was the last time you used the wayback machine on a random blog because you had the sneaking suspicion that they deleted a particular post?

im trying to fight the negative thoughts in people's heads about writing interesting things down. if you ask bloggers why they don't write the interesting parts of thier day down they will give you the lamest excuses - and then later they will wonder why they have no readership and no comments. then they'll quit blogging.

i dont know about you, but i stop reading blogs that arent interesting, that dont tell me the real parts of thier lives, who dont take risks - simply because theres more than enough bloggers who do.

i think if people look at the big picture of these "rules" they'll see that it's all about writing in a way that might be uncomfortable at first, but will get them writing and keep them writing, and will create a blog that people will want to read every day.

and yes, if it helps them to write anonymously, then they should stay anonymous. someone's name is the least important part of the story. ask most of the mefites here.
posted by tsarfan at 11:18 AM on September 25, 2005

From his blog and comments, he was obviously a horrible support rep anyway. Reflexively blaming the Big Mean Corporation for firing a crappy employee doesn't make sense.

Whenever I'm in one of those more-than-one-call situations over anything, with any company, I make a habit out of escalating and talking to a rep's supervisor when it's resolved, whether I do it to complain about awful support, or commend someone one great support. It's about 80:20, but then again, what isn't?

If a support guy talked to me like that, I'd do my best to get him canned, too. It would save thousands of other people from dealing with his "cleverness".

Be clever and sarcastic in your own time, please, not when you're getting paid to be professionally helpful.
posted by j-dub at 12:26 PM on September 25, 2005

Espy Gillespie
As far as the whole 'get over yourself' bit,

Until you've walked ten years of tech support;

Go Fuck Your Self. Really. Just go do it. I won't mind. Neither will anyone else on this thread that's had to go through the kind of hell that is unique to that experience. So again, just go fuck yourself.
posted by mk1gti at 12:43 PM on September 25, 2005

This guy needs an iWhaaaambulance.
posted by mkultra at 2:27 PM on September 25, 2005

Whenever I'm in one of those more-than-one-call situations over anything, with any company, I make a habit out of escalating and talking to a rep's supervisor when it's resolved

In the real world tech support people don't get fired because a customer complains about their attitude. They get fired because they don't move enough calls or they pass along too many complainers to their managers. Whether a rep has a lousy attitude or not you as a customer already have a strike against you when speaking to a manager because the majority of people who insist on escalating up the management chain (not the technical chain) are assumed to be problem customers. Being on a "I'm going to get this guy fired" power trip just reinforces the perception. The corporate rhethoric may be that they care about you as a customer but the goal of tech support is to move calls.
posted by rdr at 2:46 PM on September 25, 2005

I'll go along with rdr on that one, as much as we all appreciate customer compliments and everything, just saying 'thanks' and concluding your call with us is the best thing you can do. By asking to speak to a supervisor, even to compliment someone just impairs my ability to take the next call and solve someone's problem.
And despite the 'attitude' I have generated on this thread, in the call centers I've worked in I've always been at tops in productivity and customer satisfaction. That's because I know how to 'control the call' (cut to the chase and keep the customer focused on the task at hand) and produce short call after short call after short call. One more thing, I'm not required to say this at work, but at the end of just about every call I tell the customer to 'have a really good day'. And I mean it. It's just my way of 'spreading the love' and making everyone who calls in feel a bit better about their transaction.
posted by mk1gti at 4:04 PM on September 25, 2005

In addition, in most call center environments the representative 'is individually empowered'. What that means is they can make exactly the same decisions as a manager can make. I escalate very few calls, but when someone does make the mistake to escalate (and it is a mistake) the supervisor will ask what I've done, at which point I'll recap everything that's happened, the supe will then ask what my suggestion for resolution is, the customer will then come on the phone expecting to have smoke blown up their ass only to be told that the rep they've spoken to has done everything the manager could do and that there is nothing else to be done. If they have multiple situations where they've called in frequently to complain, they're encouraged to take their business elsewhere. No matter what their 'revenue value'. This has been the same scenario at four different call centers I've worked at over a ten year period, all who have very high customer satisfaction ratings (as do I).
posted by mk1gti at 4:12 PM on September 25, 2005

meh, the poem didn't do much for me, maybe because I hate the Poetry Voice, where you exageratedly pronounce the iambs wherever they happen to occur in an attempt to prove that a bunch of prose you're reading is really poetry. Or maybe it's like a sly postmodern attempt to mock the accidental poeticism of carefully pre-deconstructed non-prose/non-prosody. Whatever, it's annoying.
posted by lastobelus at 4:16 PM on September 25, 2005

mk1gti: You are being absurd. I am not claiming tech support is not a terrible job. I understand that it sucks and can seem like a "kind of hell." Hell, it could be one of the worst job in all of America. But claiming that it is equivalent (or worse) than an actual sweatshop demonstrates a complete lack of perpective on your part. I suggest doing some reading on the subject.

And again, get over yourself.
posted by Espy Gillespie at 8:40 PM on September 25, 2005

Espy, I've read about sweatshops over a several year period and I have every idea of what a sweatshop is and was (and still is in this country and around the world). Perhaps you can relate your own personal experience working in a sweatshop environment to throw some perspective on things? If not, my previous offer stands. Working in a call center is not the only 'sweatshop' experience I've had. Try working in an office building as a janitor for several years where for the first month you are very near to passing out at the end of your shift from exhaustion. Where at the 'peak' of your 'experience' you are more than in good shape to climb Mt. Rainier without breaking the proverbial sweat.
A Mountaineers training climb to ready oneself for Mt. Rainier was to make it from the bottom to the top of Mt. Si near Issiquah, WA in two hours and thirty minutes. I did it regularly in one hour fifty three minutes and fifty three seconds. That was my best time from bottom to top. Let's see some corporate pantywaists best that time. Until that happens, again my original offer stands: Put up or shut up.
If you can't walk in my shoes or show equivalent experience of having done so, shut the fuck up and piss off.
Until you can do that or admit you're just a wanker, bugger off you insignificant wanking pissant.
posted by mk1gti at 10:01 PM on September 25, 2005

Espy, don't get me wrong here, as I said before I know very well indeed what working in a sweatshop environment is like both from reading about it and actually working in it until I was no longer physically capable of doing so. That's what led to the 'modern' sweatshop environment I am in now. Would I rather do something else? Hell yes, but unfortunately as things are 'those options are not available to me'. Have some heart for those who really do work 'in the trenches' and appreciate the sacrifice we make both physically and mentally and give us some encouragement, not belittle us. We are doing the best we can with what we have. Measured against real trails and tribulations throughout world history what call center employees, janitors, physical laborers and a lot of corporate employees experience out there is a truly heroic struggle and deserves acknowledgement as such. I have said my piece and now I am going to bed so that I may gather up the strength to face yet another week of thankless aggravation, boredom and from time to time, to damn much excitement for what I'm paid to do.
To all those out there who have to face similar or worse experiences, here's hoping our struggle is not in vain or without some hope of eternal peace and resolution.
posted by mk1gti at 10:18 PM on September 25, 2005

mk1gti, you've clearly established yourself as the physical, mental, and moral superior of the rest of the Mefi community. Now, do us a favor and shut up.

Equating janitor and tech support work with real, bona fide, sweatshops insults those who have to work in those conditions.
posted by mkultra at 9:49 AM on September 26, 2005

perhaps you could illustrate similar jobs you've worked, mkultra? Please enlighten us. If a job physically wears you out and you are treated like crap and you are forced to work long hours doing it, it sounds like the definition of sweatshop to me. Now why don't you shut up, you nit.
I've never claimed to be better than anyone else on this thread, just illustrating my experience.
As far as getting me to 'shut up', stop encouraging the lad!
posted by mk1gti at 1:02 PM on September 26, 2005

mk1gti, you really don't get it.

One does not have to have worked in either a sweatshop or a tech support center in order to say that one is worse than the other. Does your job routinely feature severe verbal intimidation and physical beatings from your superiors? Sexual harrasment and abuse with zero available recourse? Will you be "disappeared" if you attempt to organize your fellow workers? Are you so physically exhausted by the end of the day that you are barely able to eat, let alone post a bunch of supercilious bullshit on the internet?

If you answer "no" to the above, then your job is not as bad as a real sweatshop. As mkultra said above, claiming otherwise is an insult to a very large number of people being actively oppressed.
posted by Espy Gillespie at 1:48 PM on September 26, 2005

the point is to not self-edit

If you're not self-editing, then nobody is editing. And that's bad.
posted by kindall at 1:55 PM on September 26, 2005

Espy Gillespie
You're wrong Espy, I get it all too well. It's you who aren't getting it. Verbal intimidation? Check. Physical beatings? Nope. Depression so severe you have to make a physical effort to breathe in and out. Check. Zero resources available? Check. You're fired for no cause. Your employer contests your benefits and wins. You have no financial resources, no friends or family you can depend on, you're days away from getting kicked out of your home and out on the street losing everything. Sounds pretty desperate to me. That was from the janitorial days. Also some of it from my last call center job.
Don't think for a moment I am not aware of the suffering of persons in 3rd world countries around the world, I used to live in some of those places and witness it first hand. So again, screw off you self-righteous dipstick.
posted by mk1gti at 2:19 PM on September 26, 2005

Here, watch a real film about sweatshops: Half of my current housemates are Jamaican and believe me, they *know* sweatshops. . . .
posted by mk1gti at 2:47 PM on September 26, 2005

Allrighty, champ.

At any rate, I'm done. Believe what you want to believe.
posted by Espy Gillespie at 9:04 PM on September 26, 2005

You never started. . . That's your problem, you think you started something then finished it. You just showed yourself being a priggish ass, nothing more. Presented with a first peron account of someone who had worked in a real sweatshop environment here in this country all you could do is try to belittle them. You care nothing for those outside of this country, or within this country who suffer from harsh work environments. You're just a hypocrit. Here's hoping you experience life in the trenches someday, you could use a good dose of humility.
posted by mk1gti at 9:28 PM on September 26, 2005

Half of my current housemates are Jamaican and believe me, they *know* sweatshops. . . .

Perhaps they could teach you something about them.

And some manners, while they're at it.

posted by mkultra at 6:41 AM on September 27, 2005

Get stuffed. Last word. My manners are not in question, yours however. . .
posted by mk1gti at 2:17 PM on September 27, 2005

Ooooooh, burn! So how's "I know you are, but what am I?" working out for you?
posted by mkultra at 3:43 PM on September 27, 2005

man, what is it with you? this is getting obsessive. So cough up a lung for me, what's the most traumatic work or life experience you've had that you can compare to mine. Seriously man, I'm not trying to bust your balls here but this is getting pretty sad. . .
posted by mk1gti at 4:34 PM on September 27, 2005

this is getting obsessive.

Says the guy who's posted over a dozen times in this thread.

So cough up a lung for me, what's the most traumatic work or life experience you've had that you can compare to mine.

OK, to begin with, I've worked in tech support. Not in the ninth pit of hell that you apparently did, but yeah, it sucks. I'm not sure what that has to do with anything, though. This isn't a contest. Your pathetic attempts to seem "real" about this, with your "I've worked some really shitty jobs" and "I've got Jamaican friends" are just lame.

Have you actually ever SEEN a legitimate sweatshop? Next time you're in NYC, look me up, and we'll take a stroll down to Chinatown to see some real sweatshops. Anyone working there would kill to have the shittiest job you've ever had. Just leave your Che t-shirt at home.
posted by mkultra at 7:52 AM on September 28, 2005

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