"If he's happy, I'm happy"
October 25, 2010 12:45 PM Subscribe
No, just no. The kid is too young to care about gender roles. This isn't an acceptance movement, this is just a cash-in by mom and the kid's going to be mortified about this between ages 11 and 35.
posted by 2bucksplus at 12:52 PM on October 25, 2010 [10 favorites]
posted by 2bucksplus at 12:52 PM on October 25, 2010 [10 favorites]
We'll check back in five years from now and see how well he's getting on a typical high school filled with jocks and other preening teenagers. Sadly, I predict not well.
posted by Old'n'Busted at 12:54 PM on October 25, 2010
posted by Old'n'Busted at 12:54 PM on October 25, 2010
Dammit, got confused about the age. Make that 10 years, not five.
posted by Old'n'Busted at 12:55 PM on October 25, 2010
posted by Old'n'Busted at 12:55 PM on October 25, 2010
What a cool mum.
posted by Artw at 12:55 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
posted by Artw at 12:55 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
Yeah, I'm a jaded old curmudgeon, but I have a feeling 2bucksplus is right. I'm glad my mom didn't write a book about "her princess boy" when I was young; acceptance or not, that would've been an odd experience.
zzazazz has a point, however. At least his parents don't watch Top Gear. That's something.
posted by koeselitz at 12:55 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
zzazazz has a point, however. At least his parents don't watch Top Gear. That's something.
posted by koeselitz at 12:55 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
Writing a book about it? Reminds me of the Mr. Show "We Love Our Gay Son" sketch. First she names her kid after an expensive vacuum cleaner, then she writes a book about how he likes to dress up like a fairy princess?
I assume she's intentionally endangering him for some sort of sick insurance fraud.
posted by Mayor Curley at 12:55 PM on October 25, 2010 [11 favorites]
I assume she's intentionally endangering him for some sort of sick insurance fraud.
posted by Mayor Curley at 12:55 PM on October 25, 2010 [11 favorites]
If I ever meet a five year old boy who hasn't, at some time, liked dressing up in girl clothes I'll alert the presses. Anyone who thinks this is anything other than 100% completely normal (straight/gay/trans/whatever) child-growing-up behavior clearly has never spent any time in the company of a child.
posted by phunniemee at 12:55 PM on October 25, 2010 [8 favorites]
posted by phunniemee at 12:55 PM on October 25, 2010 [8 favorites]
It's not going to help in a few years that he's named after a vacuum cleaner company. Parental acceptance is one (great) thing, but sabotage is quite another.
posted by cmoj at 1:03 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by cmoj at 1:03 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
Cashing in on being normal- I like it. I'm gonna write a book about how it hurts getting out of bed in the morning and how my wife spends too much money.
posted by TheBones at 1:04 PM on October 25, 2010
posted by TheBones at 1:04 PM on October 25, 2010
If life was a Venture Brother's episode, this would be the backstory of a supervillian named Butch Hardflank.
posted by The Whelk at 1:05 PM on October 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
posted by The Whelk at 1:05 PM on October 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
Stay tuned for my new book: My Son Is Not A Moon, He's A Space Station.
posted by bondcliff at 1:06 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
posted by bondcliff at 1:06 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
I don't care if the kid dresses like a princess any other day of the year, but it's not OK on Halloween. Kids, your costume should be scary! At least dress up like a zombie princess or something. You and your friends dressed as pirates or superheroes are ruining what used to be the best holiday!
posted by Thoughtcrime at 1:10 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
posted by Thoughtcrime at 1:10 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
No, just no. The kid is too young to care about gender roles. This isn't an acceptance movement, this is just a cash-in by mom and the kid's going to be mortified about this between ages 11 and 35.
What?
Really - what?
This isn't about gender roles. This is a kid who likes to dress like a princess and a mom who wants to help make a world where he isn't made to feel like a deranged freak for wanting that, regardless of whether this is a sign of lifelong transvestism or just a phase he's going through or something he's done a couple times for shits and giggles.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 1:10 PM on October 25, 2010 [17 favorites]
What?
Really - what?
This isn't about gender roles. This is a kid who likes to dress like a princess and a mom who wants to help make a world where he isn't made to feel like a deranged freak for wanting that, regardless of whether this is a sign of lifelong transvestism or just a phase he's going through or something he's done a couple times for shits and giggles.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 1:10 PM on October 25, 2010 [17 favorites]
meh, so much snark here! I'm at least happy that there are more kids books about these topics, regardless of the mom's motivations and impact.
posted by Theta States at 1:11 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by Theta States at 1:11 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
Thoughtcrime: we usually get nothing but boring stuff. Zombies would be a cut above the typical football tykes.
posted by Old'n'Busted at 1:11 PM on October 25, 2010
posted by Old'n'Busted at 1:11 PM on October 25, 2010
I'm glad the internets weren't around to forever record my parents "accepting" my (normal) weirdo kid behaviors.
posted by mrs. taters at 1:11 PM on October 25, 2010
posted by mrs. taters at 1:11 PM on October 25, 2010
Boy, this makes me uneasy. This kid is awfully young, and I can't help but think that the TV appearances and outside attention will be distorting. There's nothing unusual about 5-year-olds playing dress-up with no regard to gender roles. It's distressing that such a big deal is being made of it in this child's case.
This is a kid who likes to dress like a princess and a mom who wants to help make a world where he isn't made to feel like a deranged freak for wanting that....
I would suggest that she might consider going about this mission without the very public involvement of her five-year-old son. The child does not (cannot) appreciate the position he is being placed in.
posted by mr_roboto at 1:16 PM on October 25, 2010 [7 favorites]
This is a kid who likes to dress like a princess and a mom who wants to help make a world where he isn't made to feel like a deranged freak for wanting that....
I would suggest that she might consider going about this mission without the very public involvement of her five-year-old son. The child does not (cannot) appreciate the position he is being placed in.
posted by mr_roboto at 1:16 PM on October 25, 2010 [7 favorites]
I'm against this, but that's because I'm against feudalism.
posted by klangklangston at 1:16 PM on October 25, 2010 [18 favorites]
posted by klangklangston at 1:16 PM on October 25, 2010 [18 favorites]
A friend of mine has a son who's 16 and who has quite suddenly gotten very serious indeed about cross-dressing. Is he gay? Not even remotely (she had the "I'll always love and support you no matter who you are" talk, and the kid made it crystal clear that he has no doubts at all about his orientation). He's really into theater and taking on roles, but mainly he seems to have discovered by sheer accident that this gets him a hell of a lot of female attention and he's playing it for all it's worth.
posted by Naberius at 1:17 PM on October 25, 2010 [5 favorites]
posted by Naberius at 1:17 PM on October 25, 2010 [5 favorites]
No, just no. The kid is too young to care about gender roles. This isn't an acceptance movement, this is just a cash-in by mom and the kid's going to be mortified about this between ages 11 and 35.
She actually talks about how it's not
Direct quote from first 3 minutes of the video: "So the next day he greeted me in a yellow dress. So I knew then that this wasn't about gender specification for him, it was just about what he thought was really pretty and what he enjoyed to do."
So. Yeah.
posted by six-or-six-thirty at 1:23 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
She actually talks about how it's not
Direct quote from first 3 minutes of the video: "So the next day he greeted me in a yellow dress. So I knew then that this wasn't about gender specification for him, it was just about what he thought was really pretty and what he enjoyed to do."
So. Yeah.
posted by six-or-six-thirty at 1:23 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
I don't care if the kid dresses like a princess any other day of the year, but it's not OK on Halloween. Kids, your costume should be scary!
If you're not afraid of the royals, I don't know what to tell you.
posted by shakespeherian at 1:25 PM on October 25, 2010 [5 favorites]
If you're not afraid of the royals, I don't know what to tell you.
posted by shakespeherian at 1:25 PM on October 25, 2010 [5 favorites]
I would suggest that she might consider going about this mission without the very public involvement of her five-year-old son.
I do agree with this. A pseudonym would be nice, and maybe not having him interviewed and photographed and all that. I understand why she's doing it but it's not something I myself would do. I nevertheless have no trouble believing her heart is in the right place.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 1:28 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
I do agree with this. A pseudonym would be nice, and maybe not having him interviewed and photographed and all that. I understand why she's doing it but it's not something I myself would do. I nevertheless have no trouble believing her heart is in the right place.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 1:28 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
Yes. Nothing says "acceptance" like pseudonyms, anonymity, and a conviction that the child will suffer for this when he's older.
posted by Astro Zombie at 1:45 PM on October 25, 2010 [11 favorites]
posted by Astro Zombie at 1:45 PM on October 25, 2010 [11 favorites]
Males of Metafilter: Try to imagine that your mother had written a book about your 5-year-old cross-dressing habits, and that this was publicly accessible knowledge. Would your life have been better, or worse?
Why don't these people think through the consequences?
posted by rocket88 at 1:50 PM on October 25, 2010
Why don't these people think through the consequences?
posted by rocket88 at 1:50 PM on October 25, 2010
Why don't these people think through the consequences?
If only she'd thought of the consequences! She might have done something more sensible like writing a book which tries to contributes towards eliminating the stigma, guilt and shame associated with wearing girls' things if you're a boy, so he maybe will live in a world where those consequences are not as dire as they'd have been otherwise.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 1:52 PM on October 25, 2010 [9 favorites]
If only she'd thought of the consequences! She might have done something more sensible like writing a book which tries to contributes towards eliminating the stigma, guilt and shame associated with wearing girls' things if you're a boy, so he maybe will live in a world where those consequences are not as dire as they'd have been otherwise.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 1:52 PM on October 25, 2010 [9 favorites]
I'm sure he'll take this into account when she's elderly and infirm and he's making decisions about which abusive nursing home to abandon her in for her remaining years.
posted by mullingitover at 1:54 PM on October 25, 2010
posted by mullingitover at 1:54 PM on October 25, 2010
Yes. Nothing says "acceptance" like pseudonyms, anonymity, and a conviction that the child will suffer for this when he's older.
I know, I know...I do think it helps the cause to show this happy little dude. I suppose there are just parts of me on the fence about using your kid's real name in terms of mass media exposure, regardless of context - again, it's not what I'd have done but I understand why she did it.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 1:54 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
I know, I know...I do think it helps the cause to show this happy little dude. I suppose there are just parts of me on the fence about using your kid's real name in terms of mass media exposure, regardless of context - again, it's not what I'd have done but I understand why she did it.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 1:54 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
What's wrong with you people? First, why are you picking on his name? Are you certain Dyson isn't a family name? Does it matter?
Second, seriously, to suggest that the kid doesn't "get" gender roles at age 5—have you ever seen a kid? Spoken with one? I spoke with a 4-year-old kid with ASD who insisted my daughter was a boy because she had "boy hair" (she was 3 months old at the time and actually had baby hair). They pick up on cues. They get it. They see more and know more than we do. Scary wee bastards!
Third, making this kid a cause celebre at school may actually avoid more ass-kickings than it will engender. Plus, he has a big brother who actually seems fond of him.
posted by Mister_A at 1:57 PM on October 25, 2010 [5 favorites]
Second, seriously, to suggest that the kid doesn't "get" gender roles at age 5—have you ever seen a kid? Spoken with one? I spoke with a 4-year-old kid with ASD who insisted my daughter was a boy because she had "boy hair" (she was 3 months old at the time and actually had baby hair). They pick up on cues. They get it. They see more and know more than we do. Scary wee bastards!
Third, making this kid a cause celebre at school may actually avoid more ass-kickings than it will engender. Plus, he has a big brother who actually seems fond of him.
posted by Mister_A at 1:57 PM on October 25, 2010 [5 favorites]
How is it going to be if he stops wearing dresses? He's five. Five year olds do stupid spontaneous shit every day and their passions change all the Rome. She's jumped on this and written a book about it branding him as a princess. Put me in the 'I don't like this' category. I predict awesome teenage problems.
posted by AzzaMcKazza at 1:58 PM on October 25, 2010
posted by AzzaMcKazza at 1:58 PM on October 25, 2010
How is it going to be if he stops wearing dresses?
Not wearing dresses will be just as okay as wearing dresses, if that's what he chooses to do, which is sort of the entire point.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 1:59 PM on October 25, 2010 [6 favorites]
Not wearing dresses will be just as okay as wearing dresses, if that's what he chooses to do, which is sort of the entire point.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 1:59 PM on October 25, 2010 [6 favorites]
Yeah, "everybodies kid does that! And should feel deep shame for it!" is a rather weird reaction.
You know what? He goes to a Seattle hippy school, he's got cool parents, he's going to be fine.
You know who this is great for? Kids who don't go Seattle hippy schools or maybe have less cool parents.
posted by Artw at 2:01 PM on October 25, 2010 [4 favorites]
You know what? He goes to a Seattle hippy school, he's got cool parents, he's going to be fine.
You know who this is great for? Kids who don't go Seattle hippy schools or maybe have less cool parents.
posted by Artw at 2:01 PM on October 25, 2010 [4 favorites]
The boy's name Dyson \d(y)-son\ is of Old English origin. Surname that is probably a short form of Dennison. Used as a given name in the 19th century.
I guess if the kid can't even have a name that's been in use for more than a century without being mocked by adults, he really doesn't have much of a chance for wearing pretty clothes.
posted by Astro Zombie at 2:03 PM on October 25, 2010 [4 favorites]
I guess if the kid can't even have a name that's been in use for more than a century without being mocked by adults, he really doesn't have much of a chance for wearing pretty clothes.
posted by Astro Zombie at 2:03 PM on October 25, 2010 [4 favorites]
TBH, my wife, Hortense Cockburger, agrees with youse who think "Dyson" is a funny name.
posted by Mister_A at 2:06 PM on October 25, 2010
posted by Mister_A at 2:06 PM on October 25, 2010
Children learn gender bias from an early age.....and they learn to hide behaviors that others find unacceptable. If more parents were embracing of behaviors that explore outside the boundaries of the strictly drawn lines of "what boys do/wear/act/say" and "what girls do/wear/act/say", the horrendous gay teen suicide rate would undoubtably be lessened. Acceptance begins in the home. Children should all know that their parents love their authentic selves -- and that their parents will 'go to the mats' for them. If you love your children, you put nurturing their authentic selves above pacifying the bigotry of the greater culture they inhabit. Proud of you Seattle!
posted by smart75 at 2:07 PM on October 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
posted by smart75 at 2:07 PM on October 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
I'll add that most transgender and gay adults report knowing they were transgender/gay from a very early age. If this child remains within an accepting community, this won't "come back to haunt him" -- it may very well be chalked up to childhood roleplaying and he can move on -- gay or straight. Whatever you do, don't justify the bigotry by predicting his future humiliation as a foregone conclusion.....
posted by smart75 at 2:11 PM on October 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
posted by smart75 at 2:11 PM on October 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
Jeez, sounds like a lot of you people should check out this book I just read, it's called My Princess Boy and it's about how to be accepting of other people even if they refuse to stop liking things that you don't like.
posted by Baby_Balrog at 2:26 PM on October 25, 2010 [5 favorites]
posted by Baby_Balrog at 2:26 PM on October 25, 2010 [5 favorites]
Okay, I'm only gonna add one more thing and then I need to work. At our child's preschool of ~100 kids, I can think of 3 cross-dressers off the top of my head. It's remarkably common in settings where adults don't shame or beat the behavior out of kids....These kids have the right to make choices and figure it out for themselves.
Oh, and the other kids think it's normal. It's totally a non-topic.
And we live in Seattle.
posted by smart75 at 2:28 PM on October 25, 2010
Oh, and the other kids think it's normal. It's totally a non-topic.
And we live in Seattle.
posted by smart75 at 2:28 PM on October 25, 2010
FAMOUS MONSTER- of course it is, but he now has a book about it to remind him of it for the rest of his life. He's a 'princess boy'and known as such on a global stage. My point is- wait till he's a litle older and you know it's not some 5 year old fad before you comopt him into a crusade. I ate cat food when I was five.
posted by AzzaMcKazza at 2:33 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by AzzaMcKazza at 2:33 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
For me, the video was preceded by a washer and dryer commercial featuring "Mom."
posted by longsleeves at 2:38 PM on October 25, 2010
posted by longsleeves at 2:38 PM on October 25, 2010
I'm kinda getting this feeling that a few Mefites are just squicked out by the idea of a boy wearing girl clothes, and that disgust is manifesting itself as "concern for the child".
Also, he might have been named for Freeman Dyson.
posted by Avenger at 2:48 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
Also, he might have been named for Freeman Dyson.
posted by Avenger at 2:48 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
"Yeah, "everybodies kid does that! And should feel deep shame for it!" is a rather weird reaction. "
Hey, everybody's kid gets a stupid haircut, and yeah, we should and all do feel great shame for it!
(I'd be mortified if my mother made a book based on how I dressed when I was five, and I wore pretty gender normal clothes.)
posted by klangklangston at 2:50 PM on October 25, 2010
Hey, everybody's kid gets a stupid haircut, and yeah, we should and all do feel great shame for it!
(I'd be mortified if my mother made a book based on how I dressed when I was five, and I wore pretty gender normal clothes.)
posted by klangklangston at 2:50 PM on October 25, 2010
1. Five is not too young to understand something about gender roles. I have a five-year-old son whose favorite color is pink. He has a pink bike helmet and a pink bike with pink streamers on the handlebars. He is definitely aware that pink is associated with girls, and I've seen other kids make comments to him about it. But he doesn't care. (And the comments are always innocent and curious, not mean. 5-year olds are really into figuring out what the rules are.)
I mean, I'm not going to write a book about it or anything, but I see nothing wrong with promoting the point of view that you don't need to depinkify your 5-year-old son.
2. Stop by any kindergarten class of 30 kids and you'll find that "Dyson" is only about the 10th weirdest name.
posted by escabeche at 3:01 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
I mean, I'm not going to write a book about it or anything, but I see nothing wrong with promoting the point of view that you don't need to depinkify your 5-year-old son.
2. Stop by any kindergarten class of 30 kids and you'll find that "Dyson" is only about the 10th weirdest name.
posted by escabeche at 3:01 PM on October 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
His parents did the opposite of shaming him and discouraging him - they celebrated him. Maybe he won't enjoy any future publicity, but to be honest, it's not likely to attract that much attention.....unless you are a crazy fucked-up bigot. I guess if I were his parents, my worst fear would be that the right-wing press picks this up and beats the drum. So, I probably would not have written the book....but his parents are trying to let the community know that they are proud of their son and expect him to be treated with dignity. Hopefully, that message is what prevails for this kid....
posted by smart75 at 3:06 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by smart75 at 3:06 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
I'm kinda getting this feeling that a few Mefites are just squicked out by the idea of a boy wearing girl clothes, and that disgust is manifesting itself as "concern for the child".
Yeah, I'm late to this party, too, but I'd already seen the vid and read an article on the topic - and there's a whole lotta "doth protest too much" going on. Does it not occur to everybody that maybe in five years the kid won't give a shit what other people think of him, because he had parents who just let him be whatever he wanted to be and is, therefore, unconcerned with the idiotic opinions of others?
posted by OneMonkeysUncle at 3:08 PM on October 25, 2010 [5 favorites]
Yeah, I'm late to this party, too, but I'd already seen the vid and read an article on the topic - and there's a whole lotta "doth protest too much" going on. Does it not occur to everybody that maybe in five years the kid won't give a shit what other people think of him, because he had parents who just let him be whatever he wanted to be and is, therefore, unconcerned with the idiotic opinions of others?
posted by OneMonkeysUncle at 3:08 PM on October 25, 2010 [5 favorites]
This kid is awfully young, and I can't help but think that the TV appearances and outside attention will be distorting.
Yeah, there's a line between supporting him passively and actively (all good!) and putting him into the kind of environment where lots of well-adjusted kids who came before him have gotten f'd up. But then, my kids got a modeling contract, and we pulled the plug after the first casting call because we didn't want our kids around those kids of adults (who were obsessing over every hair out of place and such.) So I might just be sensitive to that.
posted by davejay at 3:29 PM on October 25, 2010
Yeah, there's a line between supporting him passively and actively (all good!) and putting him into the kind of environment where lots of well-adjusted kids who came before him have gotten f'd up. But then, my kids got a modeling contract, and we pulled the plug after the first casting call because we didn't want our kids around those kids of adults (who were obsessing over every hair out of place and such.) So I might just be sensitive to that.
posted by davejay at 3:29 PM on October 25, 2010
I get that we are part of the problem if we act like being a "princess boy" is a thing to fret about and hide. But I also think we need to acknowledge that this project might not be good for this kid. Kilodavis is very publicly writing her son into a role - and a stigmatised role at that, sadly - at an age when he might not yet be committed to any part of his identity, let alone his fashion sense, and when he almost certainly isn't capable of understanding what it means to declare that he likes wearing dresses to millions of people. Just look at the interview - Dyson is young; he doesn't even seem quite alert to what's going on in that room, let alone aware of what's going on outside it.
In a few weeks most of us will have forgotten about this, and it will seem like it didn't really matter - but this kid might end up living with his days as the Princess Boy forever. I certainly hope that all this turns out to have been a force for good in his life, and either way it's wonderful that other children will have his example. But it's very easy for me to imagine how he might end up, when he's a little older, and depending on how he's treated and simply who he is, embarrassed, or unhappy, or angry with having been used this way. And I really think it's wrong of his mother to risk that. You don't need to have a book published about you to be accepted for you are; would it have been so hard to wait a few years until Dyson could participate more meaningfully and consensually in this project?
posted by two or three cars parked under the stars at 4:22 PM on October 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
In a few weeks most of us will have forgotten about this, and it will seem like it didn't really matter - but this kid might end up living with his days as the Princess Boy forever. I certainly hope that all this turns out to have been a force for good in his life, and either way it's wonderful that other children will have his example. But it's very easy for me to imagine how he might end up, when he's a little older, and depending on how he's treated and simply who he is, embarrassed, or unhappy, or angry with having been used this way. And I really think it's wrong of his mother to risk that. You don't need to have a book published about you to be accepted for you are; would it have been so hard to wait a few years until Dyson could participate more meaningfully and consensually in this project?
posted by two or three cars parked under the stars at 4:22 PM on October 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
Well, I don't think the subject of the book is an issue. But making a "celebrity" out of any child is, I think. It's not like they have any choice in the matter. Irrelevant what the subject of the book is. I'd be embarassed to have anything about my 5-year-old self get so much attention and be in the Googles forever. Of course, other people would _love_ to have that attention (see all the reality show people). But at his age no way to know if he's going to be a private person or not.
posted by wildcrdj at 4:23 PM on October 25, 2010
posted by wildcrdj at 4:23 PM on October 25, 2010
What two or three parked car said. Much more eloquently than I could
posted by AzzaMcKazza at 4:26 PM on October 25, 2010
posted by AzzaMcKazza at 4:26 PM on October 25, 2010
Agree with "two or three cars". Book has a great message, but the publicity for her specific child is unnecessary. The outreach to child's community - teachers, friends, etc. is separate effort from publication of book. Nevertheless, if the greater culture can be chilled about this, all will be well. As a parent I wouldn't have risked that.
posted by smart75 at 4:32 PM on October 25, 2010
posted by smart75 at 4:32 PM on October 25, 2010
"Does it not occur to everybody that maybe in five years the kid won't give a shit what other people think of him, because he had parents who just let him be whatever he wanted to be and is, therefore, unconcerned with the idiotic opinions of others?"
Maybe he won't give a shit.
I certainly went through a similar phase when I was around his age. I grew up as the middle child and only son, with two sisters. I know of at least one photo of me, taken after my aunt did me all up in makeup, holding a purse and batting my eyelashes, which were/are long and curly anyway, even without the copious amount of mascara my aunt applied.
It's sitting in a photo album somewhere, and it reemerges every now and then, when my mom or my sister feel like leafing through old albums, or as part of the "let me show your girlfriend all the embarrassing photos of you when you were little" tradition most mothers have, along with photos of me running around bare-assed in the yard, or getting a bath in the kitchen sink.
And that's fine. I don't mind my family members seeing these photos, I don't mind my girlfriend or my friends seeing them. I don't mind friends/family/the internet knowing I used to wear girls' clothing and paraded around my backyard in heavy makeup in a dress while holding a purse at least once in my life. I steal some of my girlfriend's foundation if we're going out and my face is so shiny it's signaling passing ships, and I don't think there's anything especially weird about it (though my girlfriend is less convinced).
But I'm also an adult now, so my self esteem is not based almost entirely on what others think of me. Like it was when I was a kid.
As a kid, I'd have definitely given a shit. I'd have been mortified if those pictures got around. Especially since it ended up not being part of my identity, not something I continued to do, not something that continued to make me happy; it was just a phase. Mortified. I would have cried, I would have refused to go to school, I would have yelled at my mother causing the whole mess and why did you do this to me you are the worst mom ever and you didn't even get me a gameboy for my birthday like I wanted and now EVERYONE LAUGHS AT ME MOM I can't go.
I'm a straight, white male, and I still have some very unhappy memories from when I was growing up. Other kids could be absolutely merciless, vicious, and relentless in their teasing and bullying, and I wasn't even part of any sort of social minority group, I didn't attract much attention.
My parents always told me that what others thought of me didn't matter, don't listen to the other kids, who cares what they think? But I still did. Their words still hurt my feelings. They still made me feel bad about myself. They made me self conscious. Because I was a kid, I was immature, I was awkward and unsure of myself, and so were they.
I can't even imagine if my cross-dressing phase had been public knowledge during all this. If it had been documented on the internet, recorded on video, written in a book. If kids in my school had been able to send it to one another, stream the video in-class on their phones (10-year-olds have/will have cell phones, right?).
I don't know. Whether or not he's still wearing girls' clothing, I'd LOVE for him to not give a shit about what other kids think of him five years from now. I'd love it even more if the other kids didn't give a shit whether he wears girls clothing or not. I'd love it if this kind of thing weren't news.
And to some degree I feel like it isn't, or shouldn't be. Like others have said, the majority of young children do this kind of thing all the time.
But I can't help but think of how things went down when I was a kid, and how suddenly finding my 5-year-old self's cross-dressing behavior in the public eye and permanently documented could have affected things. And I can't help but see it making things worse.
Who knows. Maybe he won't give a shit. I hope he won't.
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 4:38 PM on October 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
Maybe he won't give a shit.
I certainly went through a similar phase when I was around his age. I grew up as the middle child and only son, with two sisters. I know of at least one photo of me, taken after my aunt did me all up in makeup, holding a purse and batting my eyelashes, which were/are long and curly anyway, even without the copious amount of mascara my aunt applied.
It's sitting in a photo album somewhere, and it reemerges every now and then, when my mom or my sister feel like leafing through old albums, or as part of the "let me show your girlfriend all the embarrassing photos of you when you were little" tradition most mothers have, along with photos of me running around bare-assed in the yard, or getting a bath in the kitchen sink.
And that's fine. I don't mind my family members seeing these photos, I don't mind my girlfriend or my friends seeing them. I don't mind friends/family/the internet knowing I used to wear girls' clothing and paraded around my backyard in heavy makeup in a dress while holding a purse at least once in my life. I steal some of my girlfriend's foundation if we're going out and my face is so shiny it's signaling passing ships, and I don't think there's anything especially weird about it (though my girlfriend is less convinced).
But I'm also an adult now, so my self esteem is not based almost entirely on what others think of me. Like it was when I was a kid.
As a kid, I'd have definitely given a shit. I'd have been mortified if those pictures got around. Especially since it ended up not being part of my identity, not something I continued to do, not something that continued to make me happy; it was just a phase. Mortified. I would have cried, I would have refused to go to school, I would have yelled at my mother causing the whole mess and why did you do this to me you are the worst mom ever and you didn't even get me a gameboy for my birthday like I wanted and now EVERYONE LAUGHS AT ME MOM I can't go.
I'm a straight, white male, and I still have some very unhappy memories from when I was growing up. Other kids could be absolutely merciless, vicious, and relentless in their teasing and bullying, and I wasn't even part of any sort of social minority group, I didn't attract much attention.
My parents always told me that what others thought of me didn't matter, don't listen to the other kids, who cares what they think? But I still did. Their words still hurt my feelings. They still made me feel bad about myself. They made me self conscious. Because I was a kid, I was immature, I was awkward and unsure of myself, and so were they.
I can't even imagine if my cross-dressing phase had been public knowledge during all this. If it had been documented on the internet, recorded on video, written in a book. If kids in my school had been able to send it to one another, stream the video in-class on their phones (10-year-olds have/will have cell phones, right?).
I don't know. Whether or not he's still wearing girls' clothing, I'd LOVE for him to not give a shit about what other kids think of him five years from now. I'd love it even more if the other kids didn't give a shit whether he wears girls clothing or not. I'd love it if this kind of thing weren't news.
And to some degree I feel like it isn't, or shouldn't be. Like others have said, the majority of young children do this kind of thing all the time.
But I can't help but think of how things went down when I was a kid, and how suddenly finding my 5-year-old self's cross-dressing behavior in the public eye and permanently documented could have affected things. And I can't help but see it making things worse.
Who knows. Maybe he won't give a shit. I hope he won't.
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 4:38 PM on October 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
At five, I decided I was going to be a horse. I didn't find horse acceptance so I never felt comfortable with my horse-ness.
posted by Foam Pants at 4:40 PM on October 25, 2010
posted by Foam Pants at 4:40 PM on October 25, 2010
At five, I decided I was going to be a horse.
At five, I wanted to marry my mum. Which is to say that five-year-olds don't know much about how the world works.
posted by binturong at 4:56 PM on October 25, 2010
At five, I wanted to marry my mum. Which is to say that five-year-olds don't know much about how the world works.
posted by binturong at 4:56 PM on October 25, 2010
I was super into pink when I was 5. I still am, I have a pink sweater on right now. But a lot of that comes from my being "Ah, fuck it" to what other people thought. My Mom making an INTERNET SENSATION out of my choice would have been mortifying.
posted by GilloD at 5:03 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by GilloD at 5:03 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
Not quite in the same league, but my wife hand-made super hero capes for our 12, 7, and 5 year old sons. The 12 year old's cape has an "awesome face" on the back. They all wear them to school regularly. When kids would ask my 12 year old, "Why are you wearing a cape?" His response was always, "Why aren't you wearing a cape?"
It seems the perfect response to all such admonishments.
My wife has since made 3 capes for 3 of his friends. Are they Geek Squad? Yup. Fortunately they realize something about Geek Squad that I never did at that age. Geek Squad is fun.
posted by Brocktoon at 5:15 PM on October 25, 2010 [4 favorites]
It seems the perfect response to all such admonishments.
My wife has since made 3 capes for 3 of his friends. Are they Geek Squad? Yup. Fortunately they realize something about Geek Squad that I never did at that age. Geek Squad is fun.
posted by Brocktoon at 5:15 PM on October 25, 2010 [4 favorites]
Brocktoon, I take it your kids haven't seen The Incredibles?
posted by sneebler at 7:42 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by sneebler at 7:42 PM on October 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
I have a 3 year old son who, when it's time to go inside, often says "hang on dad, I have to go hug this tree.". And then he goes and gives a tree a big hug. Not directly relevant, but I hope he never grows out of it.
My Son The Tree-Hugger
posted by freecellwizard at 8:01 PM on October 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
My Son The Tree-Hugger
posted by freecellwizard at 8:01 PM on October 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
I have a five-year-old son whose favorite color is pink. He has a pink bike helmet and a pink bike with pink streamers on the handlebars. He is definitely aware that pink is associated with girls, and I've seen other kids make comments to him about it. But he doesn't care.
Neither does pink t-shirt wearer Pauly D from Jersey Shore, or the Stade Français rugby team.
posted by iviken at 1:03 AM on October 26, 2010
Neither does pink t-shirt wearer Pauly D from Jersey Shore, or the Stade Français rugby team.
posted by iviken at 1:03 AM on October 26, 2010
Neither does pink t-shirt wearer Pauly D from Jersey Shore, or the Stade Français rugby team.
NO SON OF MINE IS GOING TO BECOME PAULY D
posted by GilloD at 7:27 PM on October 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
NO SON OF MINE IS GOING TO BECOME PAULY D
posted by GilloD at 7:27 PM on October 26, 2010 [1 favorite]
You know, you're just going to have to accept you might raise a little Pauly D or The Situation.
And you'll have to love them regardless.
posted by Theta States at 6:54 AM on October 27, 2010 [1 favorite]
And you'll have to love them regardless.
posted by Theta States at 6:54 AM on October 27, 2010 [1 favorite]
My child is, of course, trained from birth to accept the awesomeness of Batman as a fact of the universe. Other DC heroes she is aware of but doesn't have the same bond with.
So, on a rare occasion on which we'd gone out to breakfast I was tasked with taking her out and walking her around a bit, as sitting down waiting for food or enduring post food chatter is completel. Her 4 year old nature.
For whatever reason we ended up at Bartels, and she picked out a Wonder Woman and a Batman coloring book and took them up to the older lady behind the counter.
There was some chit chat, because for whatever reason older ladies behind counters tend to find my Englishness and the childs 4ness quite, quite fascinating, and it's not really a bother if you've got the time for it, and then the older lady looks at the Batman book and asks "is this for your brother?"
Quick as a flash the child responds "it's for my cousin, [boy cousin who we hardly ever see]."
Ack! I'm shocked! It's a fundamental betrayal of Batman and all the family values that we hold deal! That Batman book is 100% for her and the Wonder Woman one the older lady thinks is hers is, TBH, and afterthought that I think she's ignored since.
Weirder still she's told this lie in response to the gender-based expectations of a complete stranger! where is she getting this stuff from? Certainly not from the anti-bias hippy school we attend. Damn you society!
On another note, when [ boy cousin who seldom visits] actually visited recently he really wanted to try on some of our childs princess dress-up and his dad was quite weird and huffy about it. I guess that's a family that could do with a copy of The Princess Boy.
posted by Artw at 7:15 AM on October 27, 2010 [7 favorites]
So, on a rare occasion on which we'd gone out to breakfast I was tasked with taking her out and walking her around a bit, as sitting down waiting for food or enduring post food chatter is completel. Her 4 year old nature.
For whatever reason we ended up at Bartels, and she picked out a Wonder Woman and a Batman coloring book and took them up to the older lady behind the counter.
There was some chit chat, because for whatever reason older ladies behind counters tend to find my Englishness and the childs 4ness quite, quite fascinating, and it's not really a bother if you've got the time for it, and then the older lady looks at the Batman book and asks "is this for your brother?"
Quick as a flash the child responds "it's for my cousin, [boy cousin who we hardly ever see]."
Ack! I'm shocked! It's a fundamental betrayal of Batman and all the family values that we hold deal! That Batman book is 100% for her and the Wonder Woman one the older lady thinks is hers is, TBH, and afterthought that I think she's ignored since.
Weirder still she's told this lie in response to the gender-based expectations of a complete stranger! where is she getting this stuff from? Certainly not from the anti-bias hippy school we attend. Damn you society!
On another note, when [ boy cousin who seldom visits] actually visited recently he really wanted to try on some of our childs princess dress-up and his dad was quite weird and huffy about it. I guess that's a family that could do with a copy of The Princess Boy.
posted by Artw at 7:15 AM on October 27, 2010 [7 favorites]
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posted by zzazazz at 12:50 PM on October 25, 2010