Casting our vote is the ultimate way we go high when they go low
October 28, 2016 1:00 PM   Subscribe

Eleven days to go. Since last time, Donald announced his first 100 days of actions, but still dislikes Jeb and John, while Hillary considers Texas and (post-birthday) speaks with Michelle (post title from speech) in North Carolina, early voting is happening, and Barack has nice approval ratings (though not everywhere). In the polls, 538 reckons Donald needs a sweep of swing states, GOP "insiders" think there are secret Trump voters, another release shows ties in Georgia and Iowa, and in perhaps less reliable data, Donald has a huge lead. While social media rages and schools have concerns about being polling stations, Wikileaks continues to drip-feed mundane emails, the FBI writes a vague letter about other emails (rebuttal), Colin Powell declares for Hillary, a 'Victory Bus' tours (gallery), Evan and Mindy continue to draw support across Utah, and therapists and patients describe election stress.

Resources
* Ballotpedia has a mass of election resources.
* Plan your election day; again from Ballotpedia, state-by-state poll opening and closing times.
* Voter information by lampshade.
* The MeFites United team.
* How to vote in every state by NoxAeternum.

Voter suppression, access (links by Lexica on disability access), and possible intimidation continues to affect the election in a myriad of ways. In already contested North Carolina, greatly reducing the number of early voting locations has, not surprisingly, greatly reduced early voting. In Wisconsin, a request to open an early voting location in a student demographic area was turned down for questionable reasons. Elsewhere, the Los Angeles Times have tried to collate voter fraud allegations, and the Democratic party take the Republican party to court (also, Rachel Maddow).

Meanwhile, on MetaTalk and AskMeFi
- Get Yer Voting Stories Here!
- Mefite Election Volunteering
- Best post-debate Nasty Woman T shirt?
- How should I follow the 2016 US election result from the UK?
- What else could one know about their neighbors' voting habits?

A few Flickr pictures of early voting in Texas from Denton, El Paso, Harris County, Helotes, Longview and Plano. Elsewhere, a line in Washington D.C. and again, Las Vegas, and Tennessee, plus photos from Massachusetts (and another), North Carolina and what appears to be an arcade.

MetaFilter nostalgia: I coulda' been a contender (2016 Republican edition)
- Let the games begin! Er, continue! 17 GOP candidates enter ...
- President Scott Walker will not be a thing
- Election 2016: Rubio and Kasich's last stand: Rubio quits at this point.
- Crossing the Delaware: five primaries in the US election : Cruz quits at this point.
- Trump will be the Republican standard-bearer: Kasich quits at this point.
- Nevada and South Carolina: Jeb quits at this point.

From Twitter, a few election signs. Josh wants your vote, there is cynicism in Ohio, some alarm elsewhere, the dream team want your vote, or you can vote math.
posted by Wordshore (3643 comments total) 143 users marked this as a favorite
 
Thanks for all your effort and hard work that went into this post, Wordshore.
posted by INFJ at 1:04 PM on October 28, 2016 [76 favorites]


Dear Texas,

Please make the GOP lose their collective minds by going blue. It would redeem this trashfire.

Sincerely,

An Exhausted Mefite.
posted by stoneweaver at 1:04 PM on October 28, 2016 [176 favorites]


Is this the new thread? We left sanity in the old one.
posted by guiseroom at 1:04 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


The MetaFilter annotated coffee table book edition of this election is gonna be YUUUGE.
posted by wabbittwax at 1:05 PM on October 28, 2016 [59 favorites]


We left sanity in the old one.

nonono I'm here
posted by Namlit at 1:05 PM on October 28, 2016 [14 favorites]


Eleven days. Eleven days. Eleven days.

We can do this. Maybe we'll need alcohol and/or sleeping pills (NOT AT THE SAME TIME) but we can do this.
posted by cooker girl at 1:07 PM on October 28, 2016 [16 favorites]


Don't tell me about cynicism in Ohio. I went and voted early this morning in Cuyahoga County (aka You're Welcome, We Actually Enjoy Canceling Out The Votes Of The Orange Boehners To The Southwest), and it was PACKED SOLID with people voting. Now we just have to hope Anthony Weiner's penis doesn't RUIN EVERYTHING.
posted by bitter-girl.com at 1:07 PM on October 28, 2016 [54 favorites]


Let's just get this out of the way:

GOD DAMMIT, ANTHONY WEINER
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:09 PM on October 28, 2016 [160 favorites]


The MetaFilter annotated coffee table book edition of this election is gonna be YUUUGE.

No. It's just going to be a GIF of Neo dodging bullets on repeat.
posted by Talez at 1:09 PM on October 28, 2016 [14 favorites]


Thanks to Election 2016, I now know more about at least three penises than I ever cared to.
posted by theraflu at 1:10 PM on October 28, 2016 [36 favorites]


I just have to keep reminding myself that all the other stresses in my life do not magically go away on November 9th.
posted by steady-state strawberry at 1:10 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


Yeah the stories I'm hearing (and experiencing) here in Ohio point to long, long lines for early voting. I've said it before, but historically speaking, when there are lots of people voting it generally means the usually apathetic Dems are getting out and when the Dems show up and vote, it all goes blue.

Please god let it be true this time.
posted by cooker girl at 1:10 PM on October 28, 2016 [61 favorites]


I'm too exhausted by this whole thing to be rational. The letter from FBI director Comey today, being spun as re-opening the investigation into the Clinton emails, is frustrating. I got off Facebook in early July, do I now have to spend 11 days disconnected from the internet completely?
posted by pwinn at 1:10 PM on October 28, 2016 [9 favorites]


Can someone explain to me about this new FBI emails thing? I can't make heads or tails of it. It seems too conveniently timed to not be a political move by the (GOP controlled?) FBI. Like, what the fuck is going on?
posted by dis_integration at 1:10 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


For stress relief from helpless laughter, I can highly recommend the Vine RIP comments.
posted by Celsius1414 at 1:11 PM on October 28, 2016 [9 favorites]



The MetaFilter annotated coffee table book edition of this election is gonna be YUUUGE.


Isn't it sort of its own annotations?

Anyway, my husband is texting me asking what on earth Comey's agenda is here and I'm at a loss. And getting absolutely no work done. After Nov. 9 I think I am going to take a long, long news holiday. No more current events until 2017.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:11 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Voted for Hillary today, wished it could've been Bernie, saw email scandal, mentally checked out, hooray for new thread
posted by R.F.Simpson at 1:11 PM on October 28, 2016 [14 favorites]


Which song is that, Wordshore?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 1:11 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


I'm going on a last minute work trip to Seattle, so I went ahead and casted my vote—via absentee ballot—for Clinton/Kaine today (and other Dems down the line). I live in an area that will go blue regardless, but it felt great.
posted by defenestration at 1:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]




The MetaFilter annotated coffee table book edition of this election is gonna be YUUUGE.

Isn't it sort of its own annotations?


I'm okay with someone adding [WRONG] to all of the "Trump won't last" comments (including mine).
posted by Etrigan at 1:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Can someone explain to me about this new FBI emails thing? I can't make heads or tails of it. It seems too conveniently timed to not be a political move by the (GOP controlled?) FBI. Like, what the fuck is going on?

They found something on Weiner's phone and Comey decided to make a very tenuous link to the Clinton FBI investigation. Everyone assumes the worst and Twitter blows up for an hour and a half until it leaks out that [ITS FUCKING NOTHING.GIF].
posted by Talez at 1:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [23 favorites]


And other Republicans are still trying to run for the 'most brainless' title: first-term Illinois Senator Mark Kirk, behind in the race to retain his seat, mocked his Asian-American opponent's heritage as well as her family's history of military service. When she said that her family has '"served this nation in uniform going back to the Revolution", Kirk responded with saying he'd 'forgotten' her "parents came all the way from Thailand to serve George Washington".

Please note: Kirk's opponent is US Representative Tammy Duckworth, a West Point grad and Irag War veteran who lost both legs when the helicopter she was piloting was shot down in 2004. Duckworth's mother was born in Thailand and is a naturalized American, her father was a Marine who served in Vietnam and whose family has deep roots in this country. And this is the person whose service and family Kirk is mocking.
posted by easily confused at 1:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [135 favorites]


OK, so we're doin' this.
posted by merriment at 1:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [31 favorites]


Is this the new thread? We left sanity in the old one.

Ha-ha-ha-ha! You can't fool me, there ain't no sanity clause.
posted by delfin at 1:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [18 favorites]


dis_integration, My tin foil hat theory is that someone slipped Comey some money just to cause some waves close to the election.
posted by INFJ at 1:14 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


For the party that claims to love America so much, the GOP sure loves dumping on war vets like Cleland, Duckworth, and McCain.
posted by fifteen schnitzengruben is my limit at 1:14 PM on October 28, 2016 [40 favorites]


Although my state, GA, is reliably red, it has been encouraging to actually see ads for Hillary. And the incumbent Republicans usually ignore their Democratic opponents but this time our US senator feels he has to go negative on his opponent. When I voted earlier this week, though, I was still disappointed to see how many Republicans are unopposed, mainly at the state level. I really wish the Dems had listened to Howard Dean when he proposed a 50 state strategy. They could really capitalize on it this year.
posted by TedW at 1:14 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]


So now would be a really bad time to see what's happening on Twitter, I'm guessing?
posted by holborne at 1:14 PM on October 28, 2016


And this is the person whose service and family Kirk is mocking.

Kirk has lied at least 10 different times about his own service.
posted by Etrigan at 1:14 PM on October 28, 2016 [24 favorites]


Even odds that they'll tie this to Kevin Bacon before Hillary.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 1:14 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


"Trump will win the election and is more popular than Obama in 2008, AI system finds"

It analyzed youtube content. YOUTUBE (among other things). Youtube!
posted by drezdn at 1:14 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


The FBI handed the election to Trump over nothing. My stomach dropped I'm crying at my desk.
posted by chonus at 1:15 PM on October 28, 2016


It's felt over the last week that thingns were winding down. Trump's polls are collapsing. He stopped fundraising. Life was getting back to normal.

Which is why the breathless reporting on the email thing seems so silly. Headlines about what a shocker it is! A turning point in the election! Yada yada yada. The media is so desperate for a horse race that they'll turn any slight bit of news into "the biggest story ever! (this week)". It's about to make me cynical about the whole thing, which I'll fight off with my steely dagger of idealism of course, but I'm so ready for this to be over.
posted by downtohisturtles at 1:15 PM on October 28, 2016 [18 favorites]


So now would be a really bad time to see what's happening on Twitter, I'm guessing?

The answer is usually yes.
posted by drezdn at 1:15 PM on October 28, 2016 [14 favorites]


It analyzed youtube content. YOUTUBE (among other things). Youtube!

Do you want Skynet? Because that's how you get Skynet.
posted by entropicamericana at 1:15 PM on October 28, 2016 [31 favorites]


My tinfoil hat theory is that Comey planned this the whole time, Lucy, Charlie, and the football style. The previous announcement not to indict was just the setup for an October surprise punchline.

The question now is whether it'll have any teeth at this late date with Trump so deep in the weeds and with no ground game whatsoever.
posted by Sara C. at 1:16 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


It analyzed youtube content. YOUTUBE (among other things). Youtube!

I think you mean YUUUUGETUBE.
posted by AlonzoMosleyFBI at 1:16 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


Which song is that, Wordshore?

I so nearly went with a post title of "We're not just making promises that we know we'll never keep" but dropped it at the last minute. Explained in now-deleted post text...

+ + + + +

The post title is from the 1986 Genesis song Land of Confusion which seems befitting [1][2][3][4]. The video described, and the lyrics (of which several other lines could have titled this post).
posted by Wordshore at 1:16 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]


At least the press is so tired of being taken for a ride that Comey might have engaged in the political equivalent of shooting himself in the dick. The narrative is quickly changing to potential electioneering by him.
posted by Talez at 1:16 PM on October 28, 2016 [23 favorites]


The FBI handed the election to Trump over nothing. My stomach dropped I'm crying at my desk.

Let's not overreact.
posted by dis_integration at 1:17 PM on October 28, 2016 [124 favorites]


Since I have no shame I'll resubmit this from the tail of a previous post where I missed the “NEW POST” sign:
DJT, 1999
“People want me to [run for president] all the time … I don’t like it,” Trump said on CNBC’s “Hardball.”

“Can you imagine how controversial I’d be? You think about him [Clinton] and the women. How about me with the women? Can you imagine?
[real]
posted by farlukar at 1:17 PM on October 28, 2016 [36 favorites]


The FBI handed the election to Trump over nothing. My stomach dropped I'm crying at my desk.

Except that didn't just happen. Take a breath and walk away from "breaking news" for a while. It's gonna be okay.
posted by mcstayinskool at 1:18 PM on October 28, 2016 [105 favorites]


The post title is from the 1986 Genesis song...

DIBS ON #NEXTPOST
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 1:19 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


I highly doubt any large amount of people who were going to vote for Clinton after all the previous email bullshit will now change their mind and vote for Trump. This "scandal" cannot possibly shock anyone anymore, save desperate news agencies.
posted by defenestration at 1:19 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]


Nobody gave a shit about the emails a week ago. Nobody gives a shit today. So some previously unseen emails showed up on Weiner's phone and the FBI is looking to see if there is anything classified on it and don't know how long it will take to look through them.

If this is the October surprise, color me unsurprised.
posted by maxsparber at 1:19 PM on October 28, 2016 [22 favorites]


Lets see, do I have this right?

vote for Cheeto-coloured narcissistic trophy-wife-collecting, quadruple-bankrupt self-aggrandizing abusing bigot, with zero political experience or serious policy options, because his opponent used a personal email server when Secretary of State.
posted by Artful Codger at 1:20 PM on October 28, 2016 [30 favorites]


this will probably not be the last BOMBSHELL SCANDAL that the chuckleheads will drop before election day so it's a good idea now to remind yourself that voters are not brainless magnetic filings sweeping this way and that in response to every headline the CNN Breaking News app craps out
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:20 PM on October 28, 2016 [38 favorites]


Starting to get nervous about Clinton's numbers on 538. 80% isn't a remotely comfortable probability for me.

That's a 1-in-5 chance that Trump becomes president.
posted by schmod at 1:20 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


DIBS ON #NEXTPOST

So long as the lyrics aren't "She seems to have an invisible touch yeah. She takes control and your country tears itself apart."
posted by Talez at 1:20 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


This worse thing about the new email stuff is it is taking news time away from Trump's latest moronic statements and the collapse of his campaign.
posted by marxchivist at 1:21 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


Also, I'm RIDICULOUSLY MAD at the way that the media is handling the FBI story. The headlines being run are bordering on an outright lie.
posted by schmod at 1:21 PM on October 28, 2016 [22 favorites]




"Trump will win the election and is more popular than Obama in 2008, AI system finds"

It analyzed youtube content. YOUTUBE (among other things). Youtube!


Yeah, I was real curious until I got to this last paragraph:
"While most algorithms suffer from programmers/developer's biases, MoglA aims at learning from her environment, developing her own rules at the policy layer and develop expert systems without discarding any data," Rai said.
So it's sucking up dank memes and brigaded polls and declaring a winner based on that. Screw self driving cars, the real future is in Artificial Naivete!
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 1:21 PM on October 28, 2016 [14 favorites]




So it's sucking up dank memes and brigaded polls and declaring a winner based on that.

It's the Tay conjecture. Any AI that learns from the Internet will become a racist chucklefuck.
posted by Talez at 1:22 PM on October 28, 2016 [28 favorites]


Never underestimate the ability of the Democratic Party to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
posted by and for no one at 1:22 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


I'm still mad none of you quoted "Blood on the Rooftops" for any of the debate threads
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:23 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]




Although my state, GA, is reliably red, it has been encouraging to actually see ads for Hillary

May not be so reliable this year.
posted by craven_morhead at 1:25 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]




Yup. It's 3 emails on Wiener's seized phone that they opened and looked at. This is some serious shit posting by Comey at the end of the game. I just hope it smears even more dog shit on Utah Rep Chaffetz (not my rep to vote against) for jumping to post that it was a reopened case and here comes more BENGHAZIEMAILS.
posted by msbutah at 1:25 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


The JCPL has ticked up from its several weeks long flatline for the first time today. We all know this is almost certainly nothing but that doesn't mean it doesn't improve Trump's chances.
posted by Justinian at 1:26 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]


dis_integration: Can someone explain to me about this new FBI emails thing? I can't make heads or tails of it. It seems too conveniently timed to not be a political move by the (GOP controlled?) FBI. Like, what the fuck is going on?

Talez posted a series of tweets from Jared Yates Sexton ‏@JYSexton in the prior thread:
All right. Here's what's happening in this E-mail situation, from what I can surmise. Hold on. This is stupid. 1/

Comey has a duty to report anything new to committees. It's a requirement that he keep them abreast. 2/

There's a device that's been found. The E-mails are apparently not from HRC. They may have NOTHING to do with her, or they might 3/

Either way, he's forced to keep committees up to date. GOP saw this update as an opportunity to harm HRC and influence down ballot 4/

GOP knew media is currently starving for a story as Trump isn't competitive anymore. They found a story that will get hits/sell ads 5/

Meanwhile, something that might not have anything to do with HRC will follow her into office and continue concealing narrative 6/

It's not going to cost election. It might be absolutely nothing. But it's a headline people will click and retweet 7/7
Additional information, from the prior thread: the FBI investigation is into Anthony Weiner's sexting of an under-age girl across state lines, which lead them to seize electronic devices belonging to Huma Abedin, a top aide to Clinton. "The bureau told Congress on Friday that it had uncovered new emails related to the Clinton case — one federal official said they numbered in the thousands — potentially reigniting an issue that has weighed on the presidential campaign and offering a lifeline to Donald J. Trump less than two weeks before the election."

More from the NY Times.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:26 PM on October 28, 2016 [15 favorites]


"Trump will win the election and is more popular than Obama in 2008, AI system finds"

After the Bundys going scot-free, I believe anything's possible now.
posted by Thorzdad at 1:26 PM on October 28, 2016 [16 favorites]


James Comey kinda looks like John Ashcroft.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:26 PM on October 28, 2016


I'm still mad none of you quoted "Blood on the Rooftops" for any of the debate threads

THERE'S STILL TIME
posted by cooker girl at 1:26 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


vote for Cheeto-coloured narcissistic trophy-wife-collecting, quadruple-bankrupt self-aggrandizing abusing bigot, with zero political experience or serious policy options, because his opponent used a personal email server when Secretary of State.

She murdered all them Bengazians, too.

(Not really.)
posted by uraniumwilly at 1:26 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


via daily kos
"Already, we have seen characterizations that the FBI is 'reopening' an investigation but Comey's words do not match that characterization. Director Comey's letter refers to emails that have come to light in an unrelated case, but we have no idea what those emails are and the Director himself notes they may not even be significant.
"It is extraordinary that we would see something like this just 11 days out from a presidential election.
"The Director owes it to the American people to immediately provide the full details of what he is now examining. We are confident this will not produce any conclusions different from the one the FBI reached in July."

That sounds like a very polite way of saying Comey’s action looks a little political here. "
posted by Postroad at 1:26 PM on October 28, 2016 [15 favorites]


An undecided voter sits alone at home, trying to come to a decision:

"On one hand, Trump is a grotesquely unqualified, racist, sexist man who constantly displays poor judgement, impulse control and breathtaking levels of ignorance on virtually every possible subject, lies repeatedly and without remorse and has admitted to sexually assaulting women on several occasions. On the other, Clinton is a woman. Plus...something about emails? What to do, what to do...?"
posted by The Card Cheat at 1:27 PM on October 28, 2016 [112 favorites]


I just saw an AP tweet that says that the emails in question did not come from the private server.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 1:27 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


Trump is already 2 hrs late to his Maine rally and now is stuck on his plane at the airport because they can't find stairs tall enough to reach the exit door. [tweet]
posted by melissasaurus at 1:28 PM on October 28, 2016 [32 favorites]


(Breaks bottle of expired Snapple against monitor to christen thread)
posted by Senor Cardgage at 1:29 PM on October 28, 2016 [43 favorites]


Texas voter here. BF and I went to a local Hispanic market to vote this afternoon. The line wasn't too long but it was busy the whole time we were there. The vibe was really nice! Not to make assumptions, but it looked like a lot of Dem voters. Though the person in front of us asked for a paper ballot and seemed a little put out that they weren't available.

While I was in the booth I got a text that my nephew had been born - a health 7lbs 15oz. We got tortas from the lunch counter after.
posted by rabbitbookworm at 1:30 PM on October 28, 2016 [110 favorites]


"On one hand, Trump is a grotesquely unqualified, racist, sexist man who constantly displays poor judgement, impulse control and breathtaking levels of ignorance on virtually every possible subject, lies repeatedly and without remorse and has admitted to sexually assaulting women on several occasions. On the other, Clinton is a woman. Plus...something about emails? What to do, what to do...?"

No this is bull. You can't even make fun of "undecided" voters because none of them think this way. They have no information and/or are completely unskilled in critical thinking. This is liberal ha-ha's to make us feel better about the giant SHITNOZZLE that just got opened up.
posted by chonus at 1:30 PM on October 28, 2016 [7 favorites]


The FBI handed the election to Trump over nothing. My stomach dropped I'm crying at my desk.

Look, October surprises actually have to have content - it's not like the mere fact of having some new info in late October magically throws the election. I cannot even overstate how no one cares. And how political this looks, and how it's going to dissipate pretty quick - if it doesn't actually have the opposite effect and rile up the Democratic voters because it's such nonsense.

Ask yourself: Are you less or more likely to go pull the lever for Clinton next month? I bet it's more, right? We are mostly fairly average on metafilter - we're not uniquely principled, uniquely brilliant citizens. Most likely Democratic voters are reacting mostly like us here.
posted by Frowner at 1:30 PM on October 28, 2016 [25 favorites]




A newly surfaced video shows Donald Trump grabbing and kissing a former Miss Universe onstage (note, I have no idea what the hell is going to happen in the video autoplay, so watch out)
posted by My Dad at 1:31 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Everybody has reason to pretend this is a horse race. The press wants to sell papers. The frontrunner wants to scare backers with the possibility of a loss, while the trailing candidate wants to encourage backers with the possibility of a win.

So nothingburders are going to get a lot of play right now. But we're in scandal fatigue, or the fact that sexual misconduct allegations against Trump keep rolling out, Bill Cosby-style, would be getting more play.
posted by maxsparber at 1:32 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


> Yup. It's 3 emails on Wiener's seized phone that they opened and looked at. This is some serious shit posting by Comey at the end of the game.

"The F.B.I. is investigating illicit text messages that Mr. Weiner sent to a 15-year-old girl in North Carolina. The bureau told Congress on Friday that it had uncovered new emails related to the Clinton case — one federal official said they numbered in the thousands — potentially reigniting an issue that has weighed on the presidential campaign and offering a lifeline to Donald J. Trump less than two weeks before the election."

From the NYT piece.

Where did you hear it was "3 emails"?

Claiming Comey is a Republican plant is deeply stupid.
posted by ugly at 1:32 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


"Watch Trump Sexually Humiliate A Woman Onstage In 2011"

Nah I'm good thanks though
posted by theodolite at 1:32 PM on October 28, 2016 [107 favorites]


btw if your reaction to that video is "oh this won't matter, none of Trump's supporters care how gross and awful he is" but you're freaking out about Comey's stupid email 'update,' maybe recalibrate your personal JCPL sensors?
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:32 PM on October 28, 2016 [30 favorites]


the breathless reporting on the email thing seems so silly. Headlines about what a shocker it is! A turning point in the election! Yada yada yada. The media is so desperate for a horse race that they'll turn any slight bit of news into "the biggest story ever! (this week)".

Exactly. It might fire up the people who just know Clinton is a crook, but they're already voting for Trump anyway (or just stinking up Facebook with their posts). As I said in the previous thread, as jonesed as the media are to report on a Clinton scandal, they can't explain in 25 words exactly what's supposed to be the issue here. The tell is the frequent use of the phrase "raises questions," which means the media has no clear evidence of wrongdoing but would like to imply it anyway.

Clinton has a bunch of early voting ballots in the bank anyway, and her operation is currently playing on Republican turf -- Georgia and Texas, for crying out loud. The Blue Wall of electoral votes won by Obama looks fairly well unassailable, and that's where I like to mention that Trump could in fact win Ohio or Florida or both and it wouldn't matter -- Clinton would still cruise to an easy electoral victory.
posted by Gelatin at 1:33 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


Also, for pete's sake, it's what, ten days out? With 24 hour news cycles, this breaking on a Friday ten days out is....well, do you even remember all the Trump garbage at this point? I sure don't, and it's a lot more gripping than "maybe some emails, maybe".
posted by Frowner at 1:33 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


remind yourself that voters are not brainless magnetic filings sweeping this way and that in response to every headline

Assumes facts not in evidence.
posted by Scoop at 1:33 PM on October 28, 2016 [20 favorites]


The FBI handed the election to Trump over nothing. My stomach dropped I'm crying at my desk.

This story was big for about five minutes, until it was overshadowed by live amateur video of a runway fire, then Trump getting stuck on his plane, and now a new sexual assault video.

The media will eventually calm down tonight about that Weiner shithead. The new Trump video, as terrible as it is, is a LOT easier to talk about. It's a video, FFS, not some arcane FBI procedure.
posted by My Dad at 1:33 PM on October 28, 2016 [9 favorites]


Frowner: "I cannot even overstate how no one cares."

Twitter, Google, CNN, FoxNews, MSNBC all disagree with you.

https://www.google.com/trends/explore?date=now%201-d&q=clinton%20fbi,trump%20women

This is huge.
posted by ugly at 1:34 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


I got the '3 emails' bit from twitter.
posted by msbutah at 1:34 PM on October 28, 2016


I know you worked super hard on this thread and it's chock full of links, for which I thank you, but there's no Hamilton title and I'm having a really bad day and this makes me extra sad and I'm just having a hard time dealing with this all and I don't ask for much but an appropriate lyric really shouldn't be too much to ask for because I'm just trying to cope here that's all.
posted by zachlipton at 1:35 PM on October 28, 2016 [34 favorites]


I'm pretty upset about this email bullshit. This seems to be a blatantly partisan act by the FBI Director and he should be ashamed of himself. It is completely outrageous.
posted by humanfont at 1:35 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


The New Yorker has somehow cartooned this MetaFilter thread right now.

Seriously; perhaps make a nice pot of tea and have a contemplative sit down, with an agreeable biscuit or two. Breathe.
posted by Wordshore at 1:36 PM on October 28, 2016 [7 favorites]




Twitter, Google, CNN, FoxNews, MSNBC all disagree with you.

They'll cover it for a hot second, then move on. Google's new thing is about Biden maybe getting a top foreign post.
posted by joyceanmachine at 1:36 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Texas poll worker checking in!

I've been working the 6am-1pm shift at a Travis County polling place, then going to my regular job afterward so I'm a little brain-fried at this point, but man, we're having fun. Our crew is hilarious, kind, and patient, and we've had some wonderful folks come through the line. We are lucky that all of our voters have been respectful of each other and that there hasn't been a whole lot of drama. We never have lines if anyone in south Austin wants to know where to vote! I kinda wonder if rabbitbookworm up there came to see me earlier.

We've had a few people ask about voting machines glitches, and one man who saw a "news report" about machines switching straight ticket R votes to Hillary actually come back and claim that it happened to him. We dutifully took an affidavit from him and reported it to the county elections office so they can look into it, but I would put money on the fact that it was user error.

I'll be out there all next week and election day too! Y'all keep those voters coming!
posted by marshmallow peep at 1:36 PM on October 28, 2016 [60 favorites]


Twitter, Google, CNN, FoxNews, MSNBC all disagree with you.

Eh, everyone is getting breaking news updates and trying to figure out what's going on. But the story is so empty of content it can't keep anyone's interest long. Either the FBI reopens and recommends prosecution, or this story dies out.
posted by dis_integration at 1:36 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


I'm pretty upset about this email bullshit. This seems to be a blatantly partisan act by the FBI Director and he should be ashamed of himself. It is completely outrageous.

You mean the same director that wouldn't pursue legal action against her in the first place?
posted by uraniumwilly at 1:37 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


https://www.google.com/trends/explore?date=now%201-d&q=clinton%20fbi,trump%20women

This is huge.


if you're gonna use some google trend graph to make your point, maybe look for one without a hilariously precipitous dropoff at the end
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:37 PM on October 28, 2016 [29 favorites]


Yes, I believe they did mean that same director, uraniumwilly. What's your point?
posted by defenestration at 1:38 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Paging Dr. Metaphor: "Stairs at Portland airport too short for Trump plane, currently trying to call in reserve stairs" --@NYTnickc
posted by zachlipton at 1:38 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


Eh, everyone is getting breaking news updates and trying to figure out what's going on. But the story is so empty of content it can't keep anyone's interest long. Either the FBI reopens and recommends prosecution, or this story dies out.

Right. But every hour matters between now and the close of polls. Every hour that is a good news cycle for Clinton improves her chances, and every hour that is a bad news cycle for Clinton improves Trump's chances. People are voting as we speak and the remaining undecideds are, er, deciding.
posted by Justinian at 1:38 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


> I'm pretty upset about this email bullshit. This seems to be a blatantly partisan act by the FBI Director and he should be ashamed of himself. It is completely outrageous.


Uh, I dunno if you have not been checking the big newspapers lately, or if you're referring to ALL the emails (there're a few completely separate leaks, all interlinked), but yesterday there was a tonne of reporting about emails leaked on Wikileaks revealing several crazy things. Primarily, Neera Tanden's emails confirmed that Clinton *was* deceptive and withheld emails during the Benghazi investigation ("They wanted to get away with it"), and as well some really sordid details about the Clinton Foundation and Bill's multimillion dollar compensation from a variety of states and corporate sponsors.

This is not all just some big right-wing conspiracy. There's a lot of meat on those bones.
posted by ugly at 1:39 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


This is not all just some big right-wing conspiracy. There's a lot of meat on those bones.

Well, no, that's not actually true. Though as I said the impact politically is separate from the lack of substance.
posted by Justinian at 1:41 PM on October 28, 2016 [28 favorites]


I kinda wonder if rabbitbookworm up there came to see me earlier.

I was at Fiesta Mart up north. Thanks so much for volunteering!
posted by rabbitbookworm at 1:43 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


But every hour matters between now and the close of polls.

Even in close races, there has never been a circumstance where the person behind in the polls won the presidency. Not since we started polling.

I mean, maybe this is the one that breaks the mold, but based on past evidence, there isn't going to be much impact in anything that happens this week, unless it is something unheard of. A non-scandal drummed up at the last second will barely make a splash.
posted by maxsparber at 1:44 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


This is not all just some big right-wing conspiracy. There's a lot of meat on those bones.
Got a source on Benghazi emails that isn't Breitbart, Judicial Watch, or The Daily Caller? That's all google is throwing at me atm.

As for the Bill stuff, there's no meat. There is an angry man explaining that he has solicited foundation money and gigs on Bill's behalf and should be allowed to trade on his name as a result. Chelsea's insistence that he not do so makes her a spoiled brat.
posted by xyzzy at 1:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [19 favorites]


This is not all just some big right-wing conspiracy. There's a lot of meat on those bones.

YES THANK YOU. These three emails that were not sent by Hillary and that were not on her server and that were already handed over ages ago shows that Clinton can't be trusted and is unfit for office.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 1:46 PM on October 28, 2016 [100 favorites]


And PS, this is not a close race.
posted by maxsparber at 1:46 PM on October 28, 2016 [9 favorites]


Yeah I feel like this is a bit of a "read the room" situation. Right this instant is really not one where a lot of people are inclined to start another discussion about something Neera Tanden said with someone who hasn't participated in previous such discussions.
posted by zachlipton at 1:46 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


All I'm saying is that this is a big deal. Pretending it isn't only hurts your candidate's chances.

Whether it's a big deal or not turns entirely on (a) whether the press actually reports on what the FBI is doing, rather than what Jason Chaffetz thinks they're doing because he has a brain the size of a walnut; and (b) whether anything new surfaces before the election as a result of the FBI reviewing these e-mails.

Right now all that's known for sure is that there are e-mails the FBI did not previously review, and which it now has and is reviewing. Comey decided he needed to inform the committees of this because he previously testified that the FBI had reviewed all the Clinton-related e-mails in its possession, and that stopped being true.

The existing review turned up exactly zero damning revelations, no matter how much the GOP wishes it had, and there is no reason to assume, absent other information or a belief that real life follows rules of dramatic irony, that a review of Weiner-adjacent documents will change that track record.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:46 PM on October 28, 2016 [12 favorites]


Also, I'm RIDICULOUSLY MAD at the way that the media is handling the FBI story. The headlines being run are bordering on an outright lie.

It helps to remember that the Republican complaints about the "liberal media" are an outright lie.
posted by Gelatin at 1:47 PM on October 28, 2016 [24 favorites]


I dunno, if I were a betting person, I would bet that this won't have significant effect - because Trump, if nothing else.

"Well, now that there's some more of the same, I am going to vote for Trump, or vote for a third party candidate, or stay home, because now - after some emails reveal that Hillary is pretty typical for a rich and powerful politician in that she sometimes schemes a little and is close to the banks - I am totally onboard with expelling Mexicans, interning Muslims, the jailing of Trump's political opponents, the Ryan budget, whatever shady stuff is going on with Putin and a global stock market crash. What's all that compared to something vague about the Clinton foundation?"

Or not, as the case may be.
posted by Frowner at 1:47 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


[A few comments removed; just because we've got a peppy new thread doesn't mean we have to go whole hog on "no YOU!" hijinks on a Friday afternoon. If you're finding yourself immediately getting into several comments of restating your position, go ahead and just take a breath and do something else for a bit.]
posted by cortex at 1:48 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]


Frowner: Ask yourself: Are you less or more likely to go pull the lever for Clinton next month? I bet it's more, right? We are mostly fairly average on metafilter - we're not uniquely principled, uniquely brilliant citizens. Most likely Democratic voters are reacting mostly like us here.

This is so far from true. We are way way more informed on the issues, and far more able to discern what is noise and what is not, than "average." That's not egotism--that comes from the years all of us have spent here with endless discussion and fact-finding and opinion and sourcing. We are not the average voter.

And I'm not worried about "likely Democratic voters." I'm worried about the idiot undecideds who have been unsure of WHO IS A BETTER CANDIDATE FOR PRESIDENT in the face of these two choices.
posted by chonus at 1:48 PM on October 28, 2016 [26 favorites]


Eleven days. Eleven days. Eleven days.

our long national nightmare will not end in 11 days. congress is still infested with screwballs and people who live in a reality that doesn't exist.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 1:49 PM on October 28, 2016 [54 favorites]


I think all the speculation that there is a bunch of hot October Surprise stuff to come out about Trump has been show to be false at this point. If it was out there we'd have seen it now. The Clinton camp would have dropped it to counter today's news.
posted by Justinian at 1:49 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


This whole email thing is actually the perfect example of people freaking out and accusing Hillary of being evil and corrupt with zero or even contra evidence. Like, you couldn't script it any stupider. And yet, even though this is the dumbest "scandal" of all time, Bernie supporters and other leaners very well may stay home because "I just know that she's not trustworthy."
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 1:49 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


The existing review turned up exactly zero damning revelations

This is part of the reason why I and probably others are feeling particularly anxious about this story, because there's no way of knowing whether or not there'll be damning revelations. Trump is a monster and I'd never vote for anyone but HRC, but I don't trust that those emails are clean.
posted by zeusianfog at 1:50 PM on October 28, 2016


our long national nightmare will not end in 11 days. congress is still infested with screwballs and people who live in a reality that doesn't exist.

The nightmare will become less vicious if the senate changes to democratic-controlled.
posted by uraniumwilly at 1:50 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


I do think there is still a real possibility that we will find out something extraordinary about Trump. Like, he once hunted humans for sport.
posted by maxsparber at 1:50 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]


What a great post! Such a pleasure to make this my 1000th favorite after more than 14 years on the blue. Mefi at its best.
posted by ouke at 1:51 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


Like, he once hunted humans for sport.

Once?
posted by Faint of Butt at 1:52 PM on October 28, 2016 [21 favorites]


The nightmare will become less vicious if the senate changes to democratic-controlled.
posted by uraniumwilly at 4:50 PM


agreed. has anyone got any figures on how many seats are in contention, i am ignorant on this matter. (and many others.)
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 1:53 PM on October 28, 2016


Eh, I am on a phone and can't be bothered to cut and paste unlinked URLs.
posted by xyzzy at 1:54 PM on October 28, 2016


I dunno, if I were a betting person, I would bet that this won't have significant effect - because Trump, if nothing else.

Lo and behold, when the story broke, Predictwise dropped from 90% probability of Clinton winning to 87%. It's now back to 88%. Link

I would say betting persons don't think it will have a significant effect.
posted by condour75 at 1:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


"The existing review turned up exactly zero damning revelations"

Absolutely false. In his testimony to congress, Comey condemned Clinton's behaviour harshly, but said there was no intent to break federal records laws and thus no prosecutor would reasonably be expected to indict.

Further, the files the FBI released about the investigation had at least one damning revelation, that of the offer between Clinton and FBI to unclassify an email, for which they'd bribe them with agreeing to place some agents the FBI wanted. The White House and FBI stated that such a deal did not happen, but that denial seems to imply that the deal was offered. That's damning.

Recently leaked emails of John Podesta's show that there's definitely a lot of evidence that the Clinton group *was* trying to hide emails from the investigators.
posted by ugly at 1:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


And yet, even though this is the dumbest "scandal" of all time, Bernie supporters and other leaners very well may stay home because "I just know that she's not trustworthy."

It feels really, really weird to be the one saying "I have more faith in ordinary Americans than that" about something.

Some people somewhere will vote stupidly for stupid reasons, yes. Some Bern-it-down types will vote for Trump or whatever because the revolution, man. Most people won't. Most people who are not already Trumpists have enough common sense to understand that Trump is a fuck of a lot worse than Hillary Clinton, even if she's not exactly Caesar's wife.

We are being political hypochondriacs here, like someone sitting at home convincing themselves that their twitchy eyelid means they have ALS.
posted by Frowner at 1:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [40 favorites]


Now is the time to leak that video of Trump throwing a banquet for the gods and serving the flesh of his own son
posted by theodolite at 1:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


Trump is already 2 hrs late to his Maine rally and now is stuck on his plane at the airport because they can't find stairs tall enough to reach the exit door.

Ooooo...alsoo...our plane refueling lines are like...rilly rilly short or something and don't like...reach your plane...Soreeeee!
posted by sexyrobot at 1:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [34 favorites]


has anyone got any figures on how many seats are in contention

Assuming Clinton wins, she needs 4 senate seats (Kaine breaks ties). Right now most people are saying she's likely to get 5-7.
posted by chris24 at 1:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


An undecided voter sits alone at home, trying to come to a decision:

"On one hand, Trump is a grotesquely unqualified, racist, sexist man who constantly displays poor judgement, impulse control and breathtaking levels of ignorance on virtually every possible subject, lies repeatedly and without remorse and has admitted to sexually assaulting women on several occasions. On the other, Clinton is a woman. Plus...something about emails? What to do, what to do...?"


"And she kills babies, and isn't a Christian, and more so will not make this One Nation Under Our Christian God but instead let Muslims and other nefarious folks into our country, and will open the borders to all the rapists and crooks, and she's crooked, and she's a liar, and she's part of the Elite Global Conspiracy and/or Big Government."

Let's not pretend that it's just reason and facts come into play for undecided people.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:56 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


Absolutely false. In his testimony to congress, Comey condemned Clinton's behaviour harshly, but said there was no intent to break federal records laws and thus no prosecutor would reasonably be expected to indict.

I think we have different standards on what constitutes "damning" in the context of an FBI-led criminal investigation.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:57 PM on October 28, 2016 [12 favorites]


Like, he once hunted humans for sport.

Sport? He's still got freezers full of those "Trump Steaks" he couldn't move.
posted by pracowity at 1:57 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]


Further, the files the FBI released about the investigation had at least one damning revelation, that of the offer between Clinton and FBI to unclassify an email, for which they'd bribe them with agreeing to place some agents the FBI wanted. The White House and FBI stated that such a deal did not happen, but that denial seems to imply that the deal was offered. That's damning.

That's a lie, Clinton was not involved in that.
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:58 PM on October 28, 2016 [52 favorites]


We are being political hypochondriacs here, like someone sitting at home convincing themselves that their twitchy eyelid means they have ALS.

Agreed. I've been refreshing Twitter and my news feeds like a Skinner Box Mouse since this morning, and I think it's time to unplug a while, maybe for the entire weekend.

Hugs to all of ya, and don't let the bastards grind you down.
posted by Mooski at 1:58 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


feel relatively confident that the smoking gun that reveals Hillary to be a monster is not somehow hidden

Oh, but one of those emails might imply something. And Comey might express further disappointment in Clinton.
posted by maxsparber at 1:58 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Further, the files the FBI released about the investigation had at least one damning revelation, that of the offer between Clinton and FBI to unclassify an email, for which they'd bribe them with agreeing to place some agents the FBI wanted. The White House and FBI stated that such a deal did not happen, but that denial seems to imply that the deal was offered. That's damning.

Bro, that was disproven as "damning" like, two weeks ago.

Recently leaked emails of John Podesta's show that there's definitely a lot of evidence that the Clinton group *was* trying to hide emails from the investigators.

This is the characterization from the Wingnutistan blogosphere, yes.
posted by zombieflanders at 1:58 PM on October 28, 2016 [62 favorites]


Further, the files the FBI released about the investigation had at least one damning revelation, that of the offer between Clinton and FBI to unclassify an email, for which they'd bribe them with agreeing to place some agents the FBI wanted. The White House and FBI stated that such a deal did not happen, but that denial seems to imply that the deal was offered. That's damning.

Yeah, if you're going to come in here with supposedly incriminating facts, try to get them right. The FBI agent said he was the one who started talk of a quid pro quo, not Kennedy at State. And once the email was found to be about Benghazi, it wan't pursued further.
posted by chris24 at 1:59 PM on October 28, 2016 [28 favorites]


Just to add to the giant pile of crap, Jared Kushner's Observer has this, which is now making the rounds: 2006 Audio Emerges of Hillary Clinton Proposing Rigging Palestine Election. It's a short snip from a decade old tape where Clinton met with the editorial board of the Jewish Press as part of her Senate campaign. She says:
Speaking to the Jewish Press about the January 25, 2006, election for the second Palestinian Legislative Council (the legislature of the Palestinian National Authority), Clinton weighed in about the result, which was a resounding victory for Hamas (74 seats) over the U.S.-preferred Fatah (45 seats).

“I do not think we should have pushed for an election in the Palestinian territories. I think that was a big mistake,” said Sen. Clinton. “And if we were going to push for an election, then we should have made sure that we did something to determine who was going to win.”
This is all interpreted in the most pro-Trump way possible of course, with a short snippet of the audio taken out of context, accusations that this relates to Trump's claim that the current US election is "rigged," a bunch of nonsense about the magic words "Islamic terrorism," and accusations of a Jewish Press coverup.

For starters, the headline is misleading. She spoke after the election, so the worst you could say is that she "proposed that we should have rigged" the election, not proposed doing so. There's also a far more charitable way to interpret her comments, which are presented without context, which is that she thinks the US should not have pushed for an election before doing the polls to determine whether Hamas would likely win, because it would have been better strategy not to argue in favor of such an election if that was the predicted outcome.

As usual, the article ends with the disclaimer: "Disclosure: Donald Trump is the father-in-law of Jared Kushner, publisher of Observer Media."
posted by zachlipton at 2:01 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


At least the press is so tired of being taken for a ride that Comey might have engaged in the political equivalent of shooting himself in the dick. The narrative is quickly changing to potential electioneering by him.

I'm in the middle of Boorstin's The Image, so I'm really getting a kick, etc.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 2:01 PM on October 28, 2016


Ball of Confusion ( Neville Bros. )
posted by mikelieman at 2:02 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]




"Weiner probe."

what's funny is, that's one of the anagrams of "Reince Priebus"
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:05 PM on October 28, 2016 [74 favorites]


there's no Hamilton title and I'm having a really bad day and this makes me extra sad and I'm just having a hard time dealing with this all and I don't ask for much but an appropriate lyric really shouldn't be too much to ask for because I'm just trying to cope here that's all.

Wait for it, wait for it....
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 2:06 PM on October 28, 2016 [25 favorites]


Just to add to the giant pile of crap, Jared Kushner's Observer has this, which is now making the rounds: 2006 Audio Emerges of Hillary Clinton Proposing Rigging Palestine Election. It's a short snip from a decade old tape where Clinton met with the editorial board of the Jewish Press as part of her Senate campaign.

Oh, so now everyone is going to pretend to care about Palestine. I see. I mean, for fuck's sake, if we're going to weaponize Clinton's/the US's attitude toward the Palestinian election process, could we please at least continue to care about Palestine after the election?

Nope? That's what I thought.
posted by Frowner at 2:07 PM on October 28, 2016 [42 favorites]


[Seriously, ugly, I don't know why you're coming in like a cannonball here but I need you to cut it out and give the thread a break starting immediately.]
posted by cortex at 2:07 PM on October 28, 2016 [62 favorites]


It feels really, really weird to be the one saying "I have more faith in ordinary Americans than that" about something.

After the Bundy group acquittal (IN PORTLAND OREGON) my faith in ordinary Americans just took yet another thundering hit.
posted by uraniumwilly at 2:07 PM on October 28, 2016 [18 favorites]


zachlipton: Just to add to the giant pile of crap, Jared Kushner's Observer has this, which is now making the rounds: 2006 Audio Emerges of Hillary Clinton Proposing Rigging Palestine Election.

It hasn't made the rounds to other major news outlets yet, FWIW, but it's just 4 hours old.
posted by filthy light thief at 2:08 PM on October 28, 2016


"Weiner probe."

what's funny is, that's one of the anagrams of "Reince Priebus"


Dammit, I was so ready to believe that.
posted by Surely This at 2:08 PM on October 28, 2016 [28 favorites]




So, for folks who are worried about what might be in these new emails that the FBI is reviewing, consider:
* Anthony Weiner sent them.
* He hasn't been a Congressional Representative since 2011.
* The thing that could be potentially illegal about Clinton keeping emails on a private server was if that resulted in improper handling of classified information.
* Do you think Weiner would have been emailing Clinton classified information? I mean, for reals, not in a "my penis is classified har har" sense?

In other words, chances are strong that she's no Maxime Bernier.
posted by eviemath at 2:10 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


The Observer article is where it started, and I've seen it making the rounds of right-wing Twitter.

Trump also tweeted "Just out: Neera Tanden, Hillary Clinton adviser said, “Israel is depressing.” I think Israel is inspiring!" today. So it seems he's trying to make this a thing (or was, before Comey lobbed a live grenade into the middle of everything). And I mean, is there anyone, including leaders of the Israeli government, who doesn't find Israel to be depressing at least occasionally if not all the time?
posted by zachlipton at 2:11 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


There is nothing there right now. When there is, we will take it seriously.

My standard is: For each specific law alleged to have been violated by Hillary Clinton, explicitly state the statute, and enumerate the elements required by it, and specify the overt acts which prove they were intentionally violated.

Claims made without evidence can be dismissed with without evidence.
posted by mikelieman at 2:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [33 favorites]


3 emails vs. thousands of emails

Eichenwald just sent out a tweet walking back the 3 emails figure:
Kurt Eichenwald ‏@kurteichenwald 9m9 minutes ago
Have to amend earlier tweet. Not sure if NBC report on # of emails is correct. However, Clinton withheld none of them & comey had to report.
Implicitly, it appears that "thousands of emails" refers to the total number of emails on Huma Abedin's device.

The 3 emails (and other stated limits, such as not from Hillary's server, not from Hillary, not withheld) would be those with some kind of connection to Hillary -- as recipient, cc:, or maybe just even mentioned in it.

eviemath: > Anthony Weiner sent them.

I don't think that's been established. One solid report said his wife Huma Abedin's devices were also seized, and since she's Hillary's top aide, I think it's much more likely that he was not involved.
posted by msalt at 2:13 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Agreed. I've been refreshing Twitter and my news feeds like a Skinner Box Mouse since this morning, and I think it's time to unplug a while, maybe for the entire weekend.

Daylight saving time ends this weekend in the UK, and next weekend in the US. After then, evenings are suddenly an hour plus earlier. So getting away from the non-work screen and keyboard for the next few days (if you can) and getting outside to enjoy these last few longer days of actual daylight, is a healthy - in body and mind - idea.
posted by Wordshore at 2:15 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


for trump supporters, i think today is what's known as the "hope spot" in their personal horror movie, that moment near the end where the sun is shining and things seem to finally be to be looking up for our remaining heroes. unfortunately for them, there's still a good fifteen minutes running time, and if hillary's proven anything it's that she has that michael-myers tenacity to resurrect herself no matter what roadblocks have been thrown up to stop her. and i don't think their final girl is going to make it to the credits.
posted by rotten at 2:15 PM on October 28, 2016 [41 favorites]


Yeah, more than 3 emails... From the NY Times. WASHINGTON — A new trove of emails that appear pertinent to the now-closed investigation into Hillary Clinton’s private email server was discovered after the F.B.I. seized at least one electronic device shared by Anthony D. Weiner and his estranged wife, Huma Abedin, a top aide to Mrs. Clinton, federal law enforcement officials said Friday.
posted by uraniumwilly at 2:16 PM on October 28, 2016


Hmm, that's a reasonable point, msalt. Though, would the FBI be allowed to search indiscriminantly through Abedin's email in an investigation of Weiner? Using the same computer to check their email is different from sharing an email account. Though I suppose a warrant could have been issued for all email and files on that computer, which could include any locally stored emails from Abedin's account.
posted by eviemath at 2:17 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


Will any future administration or campaign ever use email again?
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 2:18 PM on October 28, 2016 [9 favorites]


Mark Kirk issued a twitter apology to Tammy Duckworth:
Sincere apologies to an American hero, Tammy Duckworth, and gratitude for her family's service. #ilsen
posted by xyzzy at 2:18 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


Leslie Odom Jr.:
Sara Bareilles and This American Life asked me to sing a song Sara wrote about the election from the imagined perspective of POTUS. Check it out! Also early voting has begun! Let me know who you're voting for! #BurrWithHer #StrongerTogether
video.

Let the glorious tones of Leslie Odom Jr's Obama anger translator slowly help soothe you.
posted by zachlipton at 2:21 PM on October 28, 2016 [31 favorites]


This is not all just some big right-wing conspiracy. There's a lot of meat on those bones.

The FBI director says he has learned of emails which "may be pertinent to the investigation." He did not say they were pertinent, or who sent / received those emails, how many emails, or why he believes that those emails contain anything that might be pertinent. This is a nakedly partisans statement. It provides just enough information to raise suspicions, but not enough information for objective review. He deliberately left out important facts which we are now learning from "sources inside the Justice department." Specifically the the emails are from Anthony Weiner and Huma Abedin's personal electronic devices. That Hillary did not send the emails. And that the contents of the emails do not initially appear to be a game changer.

I am reminded of his unprofessional statements at the conclusion of the investigation this summer. He issued a statement that attacked Hillary, even while exonerating her. He overstated what evidence there was of classified materials on the private server. It wasn't until Democrats forced him to admit that there were only 3 emails, and that those emails were not marked classified according to the classification manuals of the US. That a reasonable person would have assumed the information was not classified.
posted by humanfont at 2:21 PM on October 28, 2016 [55 favorites]


I generally enjoy John Fugelsang's show on Sirius, but he is on this weird hand-wringing kick about how nasty and terrible things are going to be after Clinton is elected, because of how energized the Republicans will be and Fox News and so on, and it annoys me no end. Because it's kind of like he's being patronizing to women, warning us not to get too happy because Men Can Be Terrible! And this historic victory will probably not result in any kind of good thing happening! Don't get your little hearts broken, ladies!

I can't figure out why he thinks this is helpful; maybe he thinks it will help midterm voting in two years, although honestly it almost sounds like he's looking forward to it all going to shit.

And here's the deal; women know how nasty sexist asshole men can be. We really do! And those of us voting for Clinton want to do it anyway, because she is the best candidate and we need a woman to break that ceiling. I don't expect her to be God-Empress of the Matriarchy and banish all sexism, but I also think that guys (even allies like Fugelsang) are extremely prone to underestimating women in general, and Clinton in particular.

I am, in general, tired of dudes who see women achieving something and feel compelled to tell us why it doesn't really matter/isn't worth celebrating.
posted by emjaybee at 2:21 PM on October 28, 2016 [69 favorites]




The FBI director says he has learned of emails which "may be pertinent to the investigation." He did not say they were pertinent

To be accurate, he didn't say they "may be pertinent" he said they "appear to be pertinent". That's somewhat different.
posted by Justinian at 2:24 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Zzzzzz whoops I fell asleep when I heard "emails"
posted by agregoli at 2:25 PM on October 28, 2016 [22 favorites]


Zen teacher Brad Warner has a relevant blog post up: Resist Xenophobia!

I hope he's right that "the human collective might be smarter than any of us as individuals. We may be forcing ourselves into these head-on confrontations knowing unconsciously that it’s the only way things will ever get solved."
posted by Lexica at 2:25 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Mark Kirk issued a twitter apology to Tammy Duckworth:

Sincere apologies to an American hero, Tammy Duckworth, and gratitude for her family's service. #ilsen


John Scalzi ‏@scalzi
I'm sorry, that apology was hard to hear around the foot in your mouth.
posted by zakur at 2:25 PM on October 28, 2016 [56 favorites]


I'm basically banned from being political outside of MeFi for marital harmony's sake.

But I so want to go out for Halloween dressed as Donald Trump.

In an orange prison jumpsuit.

I'd be orange from head to toe.
posted by ocschwar at 2:26 PM on October 28, 2016 [18 favorites]


🐔 Clinton is down to 92% on The Upshot!
posted by beerperson at 2:26 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


unfortunately for them, there's still a good fifteen minutes running time, and if hillary's proven anything it's that she has that michael-myers tenacity to resurrect herself no matter what roadblocks have been thrown up to stop her. and i don't think their final girl is going to make it to the credits.

Ooh, this might be a fun game. Of all Trump's various boosters and surrogates, can we identify the Athlete, the Scholar, the Fool, the Slut, and the Virgin?
posted by Faint of Butt at 2:27 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


Zzzzzz whoops I fell asleep when I heard "emails"

You and 3/4 of the rest of the country, I think.

That said, it's pretty impressive how this story went from "Ugh, I guess this was the October Surprise, this is fucking terrible" to "Wait, that was it?" in the span of... maybe 30 minutes, to be very charitable.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:28 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


Ooh, this might be a fun game. Of all Trump's various boosters and surrogates, can we identify the Athlete, the Scholar, the Fool, the Slut, and the Virgin?

They're all the Fool. There's no such thing as a slut. And virginity is a fake concept invented by men.
posted by melissasaurus at 2:29 PM on October 28, 2016 [74 favorites]


Will any future administration or campaign ever use email again?
As I pointed out in, oh, 1994, the US government's war on strong encryption would turn around and bite them in the ass when they started using electronic communication as a matter of course. The time to normalize encryption was when email was new to most people. Retroactively changing how people view secure communication, especially for perfectly innocent activity, is a tough row to hoe.

I am reminded of the Casey Anthony case and how much was made of the google searches linked to the family computer. Anyone reviewing my google activity might wonder how long I've been a serial killer due to my habit of googling stuff while I watch true crime shows or documentaries.
posted by xyzzy at 2:29 PM on October 28, 2016 [17 favorites]


Dammit. The archetype is the Whore, not the Slut. Stupid brain.
posted by Faint of Butt at 2:33 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


Okay I have taken some deep breaths and, for my "positive image" mental work, imagined Donald Trump, stuck on his plane, in a total rage and jonesing for his phone, which his staff is playing Keep-Away with, and I don't want to be like him, so I am not going to freak out over this anymore (unless I am given actual hard-facts reasons to).

no but seriously imagine what Donald Trump is saying/doing right now trapped on a plane on a runway in Portland
posted by chonus at 2:34 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


Thanks for calming me down about the new emails story. I was very upset when I saw the initial stories.
Also, yay, new election thread!
posted by Gadgetenvy at 2:34 PM on October 28, 2016 [7 favorites]


I suspect that "chance of winning" in 538's model is an oversimplification of what those odds mean in Monte Carlo statistics, but I'm recovering from a kidney stone and it's not entirely my area of expertise.

Won't someone think of the poor exploited emails? Impounded, jailed, kidnapped across international borders for nefarious political plots.
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 2:34 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


OK, so just trying to summarize here if I understand the new email thing correctly:

-They surfaced as a result of the Weiner investigation;
-were likely on a device owned/used by Weiner's spouse, Huma Abedin
-were not on Hillary's private server;
-may or may not discuss anything about Hillary's private server;
-might not have anything to do with anything nefarious or criminal;
-and this information became public because the FBI director is obliged to let what seems an inordinate amount of Congressional committees know if he makes any move that has anything to do with the words "Hillary" and "email"
posted by nubs at 2:35 PM on October 28, 2016 [9 favorites]


The FBI handed the election to Trump over nothing. My stomach dropped I'm crying at my desk.

Not even freaking close. They could literally reopen the investigation completely. They could indict and charge her with high crimes. Hell, they could arrest her on live television as she collapses from some kind of rare alien neurological condition and flops around like a fish.

She. Would. Still. Win.

(Note that these things are not gonna happen, anyway. I am saying even-if, in some nightmarish worst-case world, it still would not matter. Trump is the very pinnacle of radioactive evil incarnate at this point. He will be crushed, regardless. Please, please relax, for your own sanity.)
posted by rokusan at 2:35 PM on October 28, 2016 [14 favorites]


Chuck Todd and MSNBC are pretty breathless about this.
posted by zutalors! at 2:35 PM on October 28, 2016


Chuck Todd and MSNBC are pretty breathless about this.

Something new to talk about! Innuendo! Both sides! Weiners!

yawn
posted by Existential Dread at 2:39 PM on October 28, 2016 [20 favorites]


holy shit my t shirt question was linked in an election post

*slowly turns bright red from neck to hairline*

*runs out of room*
posted by medusa at 2:39 PM on October 28, 2016 [17 favorites]


yeah it wasn't an expression of my own concern, CTodd gonna CTodd
posted by zutalors! at 2:39 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


If you're charged with investigating a possible crime, and you've gone through ten boxes of documents and you find nothing, and someone shows up with an eleventh box of documents, then that eleventh box of documents is probably pertinent to the investigation, and it's a good thing to take that seriously.

That is different from the general public looking at that and thinking, aha, clearly this eleventh box is going to contain the hard evidence of criminal activity, when the first ten yielded nothing.

The difference between these is probably why it is a bad idea for the FBI to go around announcing this sort of thing. But I'm not, honestly, feeling all that worried. Minor mistakes might get blown out of proportion, but Trump's in no position to exploit them right now. Major mistakes are things Clinton would already know about, and I have more faith in her ability to handle her own business than to think she ran for president on the assumption that some career-destroying secret would stay concealed.
posted by Sequence at 2:40 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


I so want to go out for Halloween dressed as Donald Trump. In an orange prison jumpsuit.

Given all the weird Hillary-for-prison memes out there, I don't think this is a good way to avoid conflict with strangers. Just saying you might not want to incite the crazies like this. Or maybe you do?
posted by rokusan at 2:40 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


Yeah, sorry, I meant to imply that Chuck Todd is looking for attention above all, not aspersions on your comment.
posted by Existential Dread at 2:41 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


Anyone who has already believed that Hill did something wrong with the emails has long ago cast their lot as a Trump voter; anyone who was convinced by the Biily bush oppo has long ago decided to vote Clinton. There are few folks out there who don't yet know for whom they will cast a vote, if they bother to vote.
The tightness of this election remains in the ground game, and only the Dems have one. The polls' only purpose at this late date are to give the cable news something to talk about.
Go about your day, encouraging those around you to vote, canvassing, donating, calling, but don't panic. Vote if you haven't, but rest easy. It's been over since the third debate, and the only thing left to decide is how long her coattails will be.
posted by OHenryPacey at 2:42 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]


Josh Marshall has some thoughts on the Comey letter. Pretty reasoned, I think? I don't know, I'm overtired and should probably not be trying to understand.
posted by nubs at 2:43 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Mark Kirk's apology falls flat. Casting doubt on Duckworth's American-ness based on her heritage is racist, and he did not apologize for that.

Fuck you, Kirk.

And fuck you twice as much with a rusty Santoku knife, Human Rights Campaign.
posted by qcubed at 2:44 PM on October 28, 2016 [17 favorites]


I am reminded of [Comey's] unprofessional statements at the conclusion of the investigation this summer. He issued a statement that attacked Hillary, even while exonerating her.

I don't know, that seems a little front-loaded. Watching Comey's statements then (and looking at it again now) all I see is stereotypical angry cop who very much believes his suspect did something but can't quite prove it, and he is seething about that. I mean, it's a trope, you know?

He might be wrong on the facts (I don't know; you don't know... I mean he must know better than any of us, right?), but whatever it is, I didn't and still don't see intellectual dishonesty there. He just comes across as Cranky Cop who doesn't get his big career-defining arrest. Poor Cranky Cop.

Now, today, my best disinterested guess on why he might want to at least pretend to re-open the case just a little is that it might appease those agents in the FBI who are allegedly fuming and unhappy that the investigation derailed prematurely in the first place... assuming rumors of those agents are legit.

Either way, this is way too little way too late to impact the election. It might have collateral ramifications later, though.
posted by rokusan at 2:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


The focus remains on the emails and will always remain on the emails because someone desperately wants to prove that Hillary's Kibo Number is 1.

Though it's hard to say whether "it is 1" or "it is not 1" should be more disqualifying.
posted by delfin at 2:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


Limbaugh: FBI Rekindled Email Investigation Just to Distract Attention From Wikileaks

So that's probably a bit of a bellwether about just how much "there" is there in all this meat on these bones.
posted by Drastic at 2:46 PM on October 28, 2016 [26 favorites]


The idea at least according to MSNBC is that the email thing will motivate Trump voters rather than swing undecideds to Trump. I think that has merit.
posted by zutalors! at 2:46 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Updates via tweets from Bradd Jaffy of NBC News, quoting Pete Williams about a half hour ago:

1) In looking at Weiner's laptop, investigators discovered Huma also used the laptop—which contained some Huma/Hillary emails

2) Investigators now have to look at those emails and decide whether there's classified info in them
posted by msalt at 2:48 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]




Goddamn Anthony Weiner. I can't even.

He needs to go away.
posted by Justinian at 2:49 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


He is away. I don't know what else people want.
posted by zutalors! at 2:50 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


He needs to invent a time machine, go back in time, and remove himself from the timeline entirely. I am angry.
posted by Justinian at 2:52 PM on October 28, 2016 [58 favorites]


"Please stop talking about that caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaake!"
posted by FelliniBlank at 2:52 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]



I really hope the government has created some sort of IT safety and organization course (or something) that all people and staff should take. The most frustrating part about this thing for me is that none of it seems to come from a place of malicious intent but just general cluelessness about good and safer digital practices.
posted by Jalliah at 2:52 PM on October 28, 2016 [7 favorites]


Frowner: "I cannot even overstate how no one cares."

Twitter, Google, CNN, FoxNews, MSNBC all disagree with you.

https://www.google.com/trends/explore?date=now%201-d&q=clinton%20fbi,trump%20women


Counterpoint:
Additional counterpoint:
posted by penduluum at 2:53 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


He needs to invent a time machine, go back in time, and remove himself from the timeline entirely. I am angry.

ok, fair enough
posted by zutalors! at 2:54 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


this is way too little way too late to impact the election.

I'm not sure if we're there yet, and this news really has nothing substantial to it yet that's negative, but there is definitely a window right before an election where turbulence and noise makes even the biggest scandal toothless.

The best exampled is in 2000, when the drunk driving conviction that George W. Bush had successfully hushed up was revealed just 4 days before the election. There just wasn't enough time for people to digest it, and unbelievably, his campaign staff managed to spin it as "Democratic dirty tricks" even though they couldn't really deny it was true.

TL/DR: dump your oppo now before it's too late, Hillary.
posted by msalt at 2:54 PM on October 28, 2016 [12 favorites]


This is all such weak sauce. If this meant to damage Clinton in any way, I can't see how, except for the much-vaunted 'untrustworthy' accusation, which brings me to the point of this comment:

Untrustworthy? Seriously? So you'll vote for Donald Fucking Trump because Hillary Clinton is untrustworthy?

We have the fattest dossier ever of exaggerations, what-I-meants and 'misstatements', oopsies, and outright lies from this man going back nearly two decades, and the most we have from a candidate who has a long, and celebrated (by both D and R), career of public service is someone who ran a private email server because she fucked up, has apologized, and has made a concerted effort going forward to be more transparent, and yet that makes Trump more trustworthy? This is beyond nonsensical - this is asinine.

Ask all the people Trump has fucked over about his trustworthiness.
posted by eclectist at 2:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [31 favorites]


Republicans can ALWAYS deny that something is true.
posted by agregoli at 2:56 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


Goddamn Anthony Weiner. I can't even.
He needs to go away.


"Anthony Weiner's continued existence seems like proof that the Clintons don't actually go around killing people who pose a risk to them." David A. Graham (@GrahamDavidA)
posted by The Bellman at 2:56 PM on October 28, 2016 [43 favorites]


Has anyone thought about making and distributing oh, about 300 million paper bags for the country to hyperventilate into?
posted by zarq at 2:57 PM on October 28, 2016 [9 favorites]


My latest personal update on MeFites United phonebanking:

I had a great time calling voters in Indiana yesterday. I got a number of people who said they had voted already, and several others who were happy to confirm their plan to vote for Hillary on the 8th. I also had some great conversations calling Louisiana and Kentucky earlier in the week.

You know how everybody says "don't get complacent"? If you'd like to calm your nerves about the (barely) tightening polls, or just help confirm another likely voter or two, making calls from home is a great way to do it.

I, personally, will be complacent about Hillary for President in February 2025. In the meantime, I am ridiculously grateful that there's a way I can make calls on my schedule, without having to spend travel time getting to the campaign office, and do as much or as little as I feel like.

It feels really good to get involved. MeFites United welcomes you!
posted by kristi at 2:58 PM on October 28, 2016 [54 favorites]


Coming in late after seeing the "omg more emails bullshit" stuff, but for the record:
I went outside.
I turned around three times.
I spat.
I cursed.

Seems like we've had enough bad headlines in the last 24ish hours to merit such safety measures. Ugh.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 2:58 PM on October 28, 2016 [20 favorites]


The problem for Trump is that even if there is something tangible in the Weiner e-mails, he's been barking about Clinton's e-mails for so long and so unpersuasively that people have stopped listening to anything he says about e-mails, and he's also been shown to be a compulsive, collossal liar: The Boy Who Cried Wolf...And Also Lied About, Like, Everything
posted by Flashman at 2:59 PM on October 28, 2016 [14 favorites]


He needs to invent a time machine, go back in time, and remove himself from the timeline entirely. I am angry.

oowee have I got a Quantum Leap spec script to work on now
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:02 PM on October 28, 2016 [9 favorites]


I don't ask for much but an appropriate lyric really shouldn't be too much to ask for

"As we dance to the Masochism Tango"
posted by happyroach at 3:03 PM on October 28, 2016 [18 favorites]


Republicans can ALWAYS deny that something is true.


That's kinda their brand nowadays.
posted by Celsius1414 at 3:04 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Watching Comey's statements then (and looking at it again now) all I see is stereotypical angry cop who very much believes his suspect did something but can't quite prove it, and he is seething about that. [...]

He might be wrong on the facts (I don't know; you don't know... I mean he must know better than any of us, right?), but whatever it is, I didn't and still don't see intellectual dishonesty there.


Matthew Miller of the Washington Post disagrees. From a July 6th article:
When FBI Director James B. Comey stepped to the lectern to deliver his remarks about Hillary Clinton on Tuesday, he violated time-honored Justice Department practices for how such matters are to be handled, set a dangerous precedent for future investigations and committed a gross abuse of his own power.

Some have praised Comey’s remarks as much-needed truth-telling from a fearless, independent law-enforcement authority, an outcome Comey no doubt had in mind. But in fact, his willingness to reprimand publicly a figure against whom he believes there is no basis for criminal charges should trouble anyone who believes in the rule of law and fundamental principles of fairness.
posted by Atom Eyes at 3:06 PM on October 28, 2016 [105 favorites]


Where are all the other recordings of Trump making a fool of himself? Drop a new one now! There must be a hundred more out there. I thought the Democrats would be releasing these things weekly!
posted by Liquidwolf at 3:08 PM on October 28, 2016


Hillary's Kibo Number is 1.

Cool, just to attempt a derail, I must be a 1, I knew Jim briefly a number of years about, I know I gave him a ride home at least once, nice guy. Funny hobby.
posted by sammyo at 3:08 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


Seriously, you people who are cursing after spitting, how are you not spraying leftover spit on yourself when you curse?

VOTE CURSE-THEN-SPIT 2016
posted by FelliniBlank at 3:08 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


Matthew Miller has a 12-tweet chain starting here:
I wrote a piece in July on why Comey's public comments about Clinton were such an inappropriate abuse of power. 1/
He flagrantly violated DOJ rules with his press conference. Then went on to break new ground discussing details of the case to Congress...2/
Followed by quickly releasing FBI 302's, something they rarely do, and which I doubt they will do for future high-profile cases. 3/
Each time, he either violated or seriously stretched DOJ rule & precedent. Press conference was the original sin, & it begat the rest. 4/
But today's disclosure might be worst abuse yet. DOJ goes out of its way to avoid publicly discussing investigations close to election. 5/
Not just public discussion either. Often won't send subpoenas or take other steps that might leak until after an election is over...6/
Why? Because voters have no way to interpret FBI/DOJ activity in a neutral way. Who is the target of an investigation? What conduct? 7/
This might be totally benign & not even involve Clinton. But no way for press or voters to know that. Easy for opponent to make hay over. 8/
Which takes us back to the original rule: you don't comment on ongoing investigations. Then multiply that times ten close to an election. 9/
For whatever reason (& there are many theories), Comey continues to ignore that. But only for Clinton. 10/
FBI is undoubtedly investigating links between the Russian hack, Manafort, & the Trump campaign. But aren't commenting on it. Good! 11/
They shouldn't be commenting on investigations! But that should apply to all. Instead Clinton consistently treated differently/worse. 12/12
posted by Lexica at 3:09 PM on October 28, 2016 [117 favorites]


he is on this weird hand-wringing kick about how nasty and terrible things are going to be after Clinton is elected, because of how energized the Republicans will be and Fox News and so on...

Well, they will be nasty and terrible. Of course they will.

But so what? Someone has to be the Jackie Robinson here, putting up with mudslinging and hellish obstruction and the rest of the crap that will inevitably go along with being first.

Metaphor explained for non-baseball people, you heathens: Robinson didn't break baseball's color barrier because he was the best black baseball player of his time; he was chosen to break the barrier because he was seen as the toughest, and most likely to weather the hell due to whoever dared do it first. The stress wore him down fast, his career was short, but obviously extremely important. He cleared the way for the thousands of black players who followed, many of whom were younger, more talented, etc.

You need a tooth and nails sort of fighter to go first, because yes, it's going to be dirty all the way.
posted by rokusan at 3:09 PM on October 28, 2016 [73 favorites]


Where are all the other recordings of Trump making a fool of himself?

Suspense. They're embedded as sound files in the new e-mails [false].
posted by Namlit at 3:09 PM on October 28, 2016


I am also a Kibo Number 1 person.

Lock me up, I guess, for being old on the internet.
posted by rokusan at 3:10 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]



Where are all the other recordings of Trump making a fool of himself?

Suspense. They're embedded as sound files in the new e-mails [false]


That would be great if her hacked emails were just sound and video files of Trump talking offensive shit.
posted by Liquidwolf at 3:11 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


like honestly i don't even care if the emails are a direct threat to me personally as an individual, like hillary saying yo we're gonna go to her house and touch all her stuff, we're gonna log on to psn and fuck up all her save games, we're gonna swap out all the lactaid milk for fartfilled milk lol lol
posted by poffin boffin at 3:11 PM on October 28, 2016 [50 favorites]


oh i guess if they fucked up my ovw competitive ranking i might think about going third party for like, 5 minutes
posted by poffin boffin at 3:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [15 favorites]


People keep bringing up the Clinton power couple as evidence of American monarchy, which is unfair, but this FBI investigation being reinvigorated by a device belonging to Anthony Weiner, because he was married to Huma Abedin, is some American political aristocracy status.

I guess this year it's not just the Republicans who have turned politics into high-stakes reality TV.
posted by Apocryphon at 3:14 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Hey, so I'd love you to pass along some good vibes if you have them to spare.

I went and voted today (YAY), and it was a little depressing. The good stuff: the line was only about 25 minutes, and the election workers were very awesome. Some of them were walking the line outside the library, checking to make sure that everyone was in the right county and asking if anyone needed to come sit down in the shade (especially nice since it's sunny and in the upper 80s today) or fill out any paperwork. It was very efficient and friendly, so nice work on that end. Right now our county has the most votes of any in Texas, and I'm crossing my fingers for good things.

(Incidentally, thank you to everyone here who has served as a poll worker. You are very much appreciated.)

So that part was awesome. Still, I live in a very Republican suburb, and I missed out on the sense of celebration some of you have been reporting from the bluer areas. At our polling place the only people out to drum up support were for Republican candidates (including several people standing at the entrance of the parking lot waving "Trump" flags and playing recorded patriotic music, one of whom was dressed up like the Statue of Liberty, complete with fake torch).

So...yeah. But I pressed that goddamn button for Clinton/Kaine so hard and double-checked about eighteen times before casting my vote. It felt like a drop in the bucket, but hopefully all of these drops will become a flood.
posted by Salieri at 3:15 PM on October 28, 2016 [77 favorites]


Guys, there is really no reason to fear. At this point, she can't possibly lose this. At worst, she'll have a slightly less enormous margin of victory.
posted by corb at 3:15 PM on October 28, 2016 [17 favorites]


For whatever reason (& there are many theories), Comey continues to ignore that. But only for Clinton. 10/

The "whatever reason" appears to be an extension of the "Clinton Rules" beyond journalism and into the halls of government. This would not appear to be a good thing for our democracy.

On the other hand, perhaps this will get President Clinton to abandon this practice of selecting members of the opposite party for important cabinet-level positions. It's not like she'd have to go outside the Democratic party to build a "team of rivals" if that's her thing.
posted by tonycpsu at 3:16 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


we're gonna swap out all the lactaid milk for fartfilled milk lol lol

It's all pictures of whole milk in various states of drunken.
posted by Celsius1414 at 3:16 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


When they go low, I get high.

I'm not proud of that
posted by mazola at 3:17 PM on October 28, 2016 [41 favorites]


Guys, there is really no reason to fear. At this point, she can't possibly lose this. At worst, she'll have a slightly less enormous margin of victory.

I agree that it's very likely that she doesn't lose this but saying it's not possible seems like tempting fate. Like when the captain of the Titanic said the days of sinking ships was over.
posted by Justinian at 3:17 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


This is all very entertaining, but yeah, there's a ton of early votes out already, no one who was on the fence about voting for Clinton will really be swayed by this. It's just more FUD on top of FUD. More empty hype.
posted by Apocryphon at 3:18 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


Just what Jeb was saying for the first few primaries, "trump who?"
posted by sammyo at 3:19 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


As a counter thought to the Comey situation, consider this. Imagine if he sat on this information, and didn't reveal to Congress that there was potentially new evidence regarding Clinton's emails. Picture how Trump and the Republicans would have reacted to that reveal post-election, that the FBI hushed up the existence of potentially damning evidence that could have swayed the election. Everything is a conspiracy to them. Can you picture the howls of outrage that would be added to the piles of crap they're already going to foist on her first months in office?

So in a way it's better this bandage got ripped off now, so after she wins they can't point to this particular bit of theatre when they attack her.
posted by GhostintheMachine at 3:19 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


If we end up with Trump as President because Anthony Weiner has a compulsive need to share pictures of his dick, I am going to have so many words for the writers of this shitshow.
posted by zachlipton at 3:19 PM on October 28, 2016 [47 favorites]


Guys, there is really no reason to fear. At this point, she can't possibly lose this. At worst, she'll have a slightly less enormous margin of victory.

The greater the GOP voters believe the uselessness of voting, the higher the likelihood of Dems winning the senate, not to mention down ballet voting in general will be raised the greater her victory is.

We need the senate and as many house reps as we can win before H is demonized by the party of no and their hooplehead mad-dog contingent.
posted by uraniumwilly at 3:20 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]


Guys, there is really no reason to fear. At this point, she can't possibly lose this. At worst, she'll have a slightly less enormous margin of victory.

True, but when flipping the Senate (and, less likely but still slimly within the realm of possibility, the House) is less than a sure thing, surely we can allow ourselves a smidgen of reasonable and motivating fear?
posted by vverse23 at 3:21 PM on October 28, 2016 [7 favorites]


Right, the most likely result of this leak is not Clinton losing but rather part of Trump's base being more motivated to vote, and thus making it more difficult to win close downballot races.
posted by Justinian at 3:22 PM on October 28, 2016 [9 favorites]


Per Pete Williams (on MSNBC, video linked in tweet here), the FBI can't actually look at the emails until they get a new subpoena. So literally all they know is that they found a computer that Huma at some point used to send emails, likely to, among others, Hillary Clinton.

My first hope is that they find nothing. My second hope is that they find 33,000 emails about Chelsea's wedding.
posted by melissasaurus at 3:23 PM on October 28, 2016 [69 favorites]


Can you picture the howls of outrage that would be added to the piles of crap they're already going to foist on her first months in office?

Not that their howls of outrage need any connection to actual events, but even if they did, they have enough of a reservoir of bullshit scandals to keep their investigations going for at least the duration of her first term. It's hard to believe this particular wrinkle in emailgate would make much of a difference.
posted by tonycpsu at 3:26 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


So in a way it's better this bandage got ripped off now, so after she wins they can't point to this particular bit of theatre when they attack her.

Sure. I understand why Comey felt it necessary to notify Congress, because the whole FBI would be under attack for "why didn't you tell us?" if something came out later. But this situation where he releases an utterly cryptic statement with world-changing implications, a statement practically begging to be misread, and then sources leak the background on all this to Pete Williams is completely inappropriate. Lob a live grenade into the final 11 days of an election, say nothing when people ask "what the hell are you doing?", but make Pete Williams your anger translator is not an acceptable way for the FBI to conduct business.
posted by zachlipton at 3:27 PM on October 28, 2016 [48 favorites]


So...yeah. But I pressed that goddamn button for Clinton/Kaine so hard and double-checked about eighteen times before casting my vote. It felt like a drop in the bucket, but hopefully all of these drops will become a flood.

Courage, Salieri. You're there fighting the good fight.

With regard to the blue-ing of Texas—
It might not happen this year (although it might!), but everybody knows (TX Republicans most of all) that it will eventually happen, sooner rather than later, and when it does there's no turning back the clock.

Now just imagine how it will make you feel when the tide inevitably turns—the blanket of joy and happiness that will envelop and warm you on that day—and let the anticipation of that feeling sustain and strengthen you.
posted by Atom Eyes at 3:28 PM on October 28, 2016 [22 favorites]


When it said Trump has a huge lead, I wondered if it were Dixon or Ticonderoga?
posted by Oyéah at 3:30 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Oh, god- just let it be over.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 3:31 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


If we end up with Trump as President because Anthony Weiner has a compulsive need to share pictures of his dick, I am going to have so many words for the writers of this shitshow.

I'd really like The United States to end better than Dexter.
posted by condour75 at 3:33 PM on October 28, 2016 [16 favorites]


He needs to go away.

Not just him, but this whole election cycle has been way too dominated by politicians, former politicians, and general celebrities from or representing New York. And New Jersey for that matter. Cory Booker aside, can we have a moratorium on NY/NJ bigwigs in the next election, please
posted by Apocryphon at 3:33 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Where are all the other recordings of Trump making a fool of himself? Drop a new one now! There must be a hundred more out there. I thought the Democrats would be releasing these things weekly!

there's one linked upthread of him being absolutely gross and horrible to a woman who he felt slighted him; at the end of it he goes in for a surprise kiss that she seems not very okay with. but "Trump assaults woman" is firmly in dog bites man territory now so needless to say it mostly went unremarked-upon
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:33 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


Because I love you metafilter:


[Intro: Thomas Jefferson, (Ensemble)]
The Election of 2016!
Can we get back to politics?
Please?
Yo…

[Verse 1: Hillary]
Every action has its equal opposite reaction
Mr. Trump shat the bed; I hate the guy, but he’s in traction
Poor the People of America, they're is missing in action
So now I’m facing Mr Trump with his own faction

[Huff Po]
She's very attractive in the North, New Yorkers like her chances

[HILLARY]
He’s not very forthcoming on any particular stances

[MSNBC]
Ask him a question, it glances off, he obfuscates, he dances

[HILLARY]
And they say I share classified, at least they know I know what tech is

[Michelle]
Madame, that’s the problem; see, they see Trump as a less extreme you
You need to change course, a key endorsement might redeem you

[Hillary]
Who did you have in mind?

[MICHELLE]
Don’t laugh
posted by AlexiaSky at 3:34 PM on October 28, 2016 [22 favorites]


A Republican strategist on With All Due Respect: "KellyAnne should hood Trump like a falcon and let this play out."
posted by xyzzy at 3:34 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


I'd really like The United States to end better than Dexter.

C'mon, it won't be that bad. Tell you what, let's go to your favorite diner and get some onion rings. I'll even put your favorite Journey song on the jukebox
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:35 PM on October 28, 2016 [31 favorites]


Oy Vey.

Can't remember the last time I bothered watching primetime network news, but just flipped through and CBS, NBC and ABC are all playing this email shit to the hilt. All three had the EXACT same caption "Breaking News FBI Bombshell", "Clinton Campaign caught off guard" . . .

Jockeys, take out your whips . . .
posted by jeremias at 3:36 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


She's very attractive in the North, New Yorkers like her chances

Then go and re-form the Free City of Tri-Insula, why don't ya!
posted by Apocryphon at 3:37 PM on October 28, 2016


So, wait, this Anthony Weiner nothingness is somebody tinkering with the narrative, right, setting up shit to bleed and entertain the masses.

Yes I am watching Westworld.
posted by angrycat at 3:37 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


A conservative friend of mine is just beyond overjoyed by this Comey announcement and is certain that this will be the end of her. As a narrative device in a two hour thriller this would indeed be a juicy development, but as has been pointed out very astutely upthread, this has nothingburger stamped all over it. I tried to make the case to him, but he admitted that he's enjoying his fantasy too much to pay me any mind. I suppose we're just waving to each other from across the chasm at this point. The Divided States of America indeed.
posted by vverse23 at 3:38 PM on October 28, 2016 [7 favorites]


Worst Non-Conservative Opinion Piece of the Week
The odd sound you just heard was the corpse of David Broder issuing a sepulchral groan of pleasure after reading this godawful opinion piece by Catherine Rampell of The Washington Post: [...]

I guess there are some Democrats who fit Rampell's stereotype -- who think the GOP is about to be crushed into dust, and who are thrilled at the prospect. I suppose I'd be delighted -- if I thought it was going to happen. But Republicans will almost certainly hold the House (and I'm more furious than happy when I learn that, once again, this might happen even if more voters overall choose Democratic House candidates). Republicans may also hold the Senate, and, of course, some polls show the presidential race tightening.

But even if Democrats score a big victory, who seriously believes Republicans are "paralyzed with dysfunction"? They're fighting one another now, but as soon as the election is over, they're going to go back to their usual scorched-earth campaign against Democratic governance. And we're supposed to be happy that "the GOP base is drifting further and further into crazyland"? Catherine, those people have guns.

[...]

So this horrific liberal agenda can't even be enacted, but Democrats are bad just for thinking about it. Just conceiving of a liberal agenda is as bad for Democrats as putting in place a genuinely terrible agenda was for Republicans:
Kansas has provided a useful illustration of what happens when (in this case, conservative) ideologues get their policy wish lists, because they’ve written off any objections from skeptics as unserious or motivated by ill intent. With the Republican Party’s wholesale intellectual implosion, we may see the same temptations take hold on the left.
No, we won't, for three reasons: Democrats are willing to compromise on most issues (even when no Republican will compromise back); Democratic ideas are not remotely as awful as Republican issues; and Republicans will block most of the Democratic agenda anyway, because their intransigence doesn't require intellectual underpinnings.
posted by tonycpsu at 3:41 PM on October 28, 2016 [12 favorites]


There is a guy on the corner immediately next to my office right now with a megaphone. The only words I can make out are "Hillary", "emails", "Podesta", and "devil", but I think it's safe to say he's not voting for her. You should be proud that I successfully resisted the urge to kick him in the shin and run.

Or possibly disappointed. Not sure.
posted by skycrashesdown at 3:41 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


A moment of levity: The guy that wrote this Bloomberg piece tells Ana Marie Cox that the Trump campaign has two autopens signing MAGA hats all day long.

I hope at least one person in the Trump campaign dies and gets reincarnated as a hat-signing autopen.
posted by zeusianfog at 3:42 PM on October 28, 2016 [21 favorites]


On the other hand, perhaps this will get President Clinton to abandon this practice of selecting members of the opposite party for important cabinet-level positions.

Time to break out the really nice tin-foil hats, the ones you use for guests: Maybe Comey is poisoning the well so that Clinton can't fire him without it looking like payback for being a thorn in her side during the election.

(I highly, highly doubt this is the case. But if this were Scandal or something, that would totally be the play.)
posted by tobascodagama at 3:43 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


I hope at least one person in the Trump campaign dies and gets reincarnated as a hat-signing autopen.

I hope Giuliani comes back as a Sharpie owned by a 4chan user
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [52 favorites]


there's one [video] linked upthread of him being absolutely gross and horrible to a woman who he felt slighted him; at the end of it he goes in for a surprise kiss that she seems not very okay with. but "Trump assaults woman" is firmly in dog bites man territory now so needless to say it mostly went unremarked-upon

Videos are different, and I would encourage people to share this on Facebook, Twitter, etc.
Especially with sexual allegations, supporters grab onto any shred of deniability, and all of the previous 12 are he said/she said situations that Trump has denied.

Video is devastating because it's right there, undeniable. Even if no genitals were grabbed, I think this (and any video) is 100x more powerful. You can see Trump being that grabby coercive guy.
posted by msalt at 3:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


If Comey had no choice but to provide the congressional chairs with this update to his testimony, he could have and I think should have gone about it quite differently. The email is quite cryptic. Law enforcement always wants to be circumspect and hedged. Indeed, it is the normal policy of the FBI not to discuss anything about an investigation unless there's an indictment. But in this case, Comey has made a totally open-ended statement which is open to a maximal interpretation even though the actual import seems to be quite a bit more minimal. Is Comey doing this because he's a Republican and wants Trump to win? Again, that's just not my read of the guy, though I could certainly be wrong.

But if you're going to depart so dramatically from normal procedure, you can't do it in some ways and not others. In this case, he owes the public and the country a clearer read about whether this new information is simply another batch of emails to review or whether this is a real reason to believe it may change the outcome of the investigation. Normally, no FBI director of prosecutor would get into anything like that. But again, not a normal situation.
posted by tonycpsu at 3:51 PM on October 28, 2016 [17 favorites]


OK, whichever one of you is holding the Trump tax files, Monday would be a good day to drop them, m'kay?
posted by madamjujujive at 3:54 PM on October 28, 2016 [16 favorites]


Just now on PBS Newshour, both Shields and Brooks thought the emails are a very serious problem that might result in a few improved percentage points for Trump, a loss of momentum for the Dems, and the possibility of losing the Senate fight. The interviewer, Judy Woodruff, spent 90% of the time of the weekly political wrap on this issue and then jumped to the world series.
posted by uraniumwilly at 3:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


They found something on Weiner's phone and Comey decided to make a very tenuous link to the Clinton FBI investigation.

I'm hoping for a short-ribs recipe. Podesta's emails were illuminating but man does not live on risotto alone.
posted by jackbishop at 3:57 PM on October 28, 2016 [29 favorites]


I actually have faith in HRC myself. I think it was boneheaded to try to protect her privacy by routing emails through her private server, but as Comey himself said, at worst that was reckless. I just don't expect anything at all to come of this latest stash of emails. I also think that this election has been notable for ridiculous hyping of every story, followed by quick media forgetfulness of even the most significant (Trump sexual assaults, Trump frauds, Trump open racism, Trump promoting violence, Trump threatening jail for political opponents and denying the validity of our election system and so forth.)

I also have faith that the people who decide elections, the great middle, won't see this "bombshell" as anything that should move their vote one way or another. There just isn't anything there right now, and I for one don't think there ever will be.
posted by bearwife at 3:58 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


via playwright John Patrick Shanley: If this election doesn't come soon, we should all just check into a monastery. It's a wrenching, heaving mess, terrorizing the population. (real)
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 4:02 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


Clinton press conference incoming.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 4:02 PM on October 28, 2016


I hope Giuliani comes back as a Sharpie owned by a 4chan user

I was thinking fleshlight, but okay.
posted by Behemoth at 4:04 PM on October 28, 2016 [7 favorites]


Spoiler: Clinton to attend press conference wearing mirrored sunglasses and answering all questions with "I'm too drunk to remember."
posted by delfin at 4:05 PM on October 28, 2016 [14 favorites]


Clinton is being badass, telling people to go vote and demanding Comey tell her what the problem is, if there is any problem to be had.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 4:07 PM on October 28, 2016 [52 favorites]


Shorter Hillary: Put up or shut up, James.
posted by tonycpsu at 4:07 PM on October 28, 2016 [52 favorites]



A Republican strategist on With All Due Respect: "KellyAnne should hood Trump like a falcon and let this play out."


Wow. With all the trouble he's been causing them, at least one Republican has no idea how Trump works.
posted by Halloween Jack at 4:08 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


Here's Clinton's press conference.
posted by zachlipton at 4:08 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]




I know you worked super hard on this thread and it's chock full of links, for which I thank you, but there's no Hamilton title and I'm having a really bad day and this makes me extra sad and I'm just having a hard time dealing with this all and I don't ask for much but an appropriate lyric really shouldn't be too much to ask for because I'm just trying to cope here that's all.

This thread needs more hamilcrap like Hamilton needs another hole in the head
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:10 PM on October 28, 2016 [31 favorites]




[A few comments removed, please be sure to reload. ugly, I've given you about as much warning as I know how; at this point, it's a day off, because I can't keep coming back to this thread and cleaning up another round of digging in.]
posted by cortex at 4:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [29 favorites]


This thread needs more hamilcrap like Hamilton needs another hole in the head

Too soon!
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 4:13 PM on October 28, 2016 [18 favorites]


So what happened with Trump and the stairs and the plane?!? Inquiring minds need to know!
posted by easily confused at 4:13 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


This thread needs more hamilcrap like Hamilton needs another hole in the head

We're non-stop.

And he was shot in the lower abdomen.
posted by zachlipton at 4:14 PM on October 28, 2016 [58 favorites]


Seriously, you people who are cursing after spitting, how are you not spraying leftover spit on yourself when you curse?

VOTE CURSE-THEN-SPIT 2016


You're allowed a mouth wipe between the spitting and cursing. DON'T FUCKING CHANGE THE ORDER! WRATH! ATOP! THING!
posted by numaner at 4:14 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]




That was a good presser. She's right. Tell us what you are talking about, Comey. Voters are entitled to know.
posted by bearwife at 4:15 PM on October 28, 2016 [7 favorites]


When they go low, I get high.

I'm not proud of that
posted by mazola


It's not at all a unique thought, so be proud of it all you want. My friend runs the "High On Hillary" blog - on Facebook as well.
posted by agregoli at 4:19 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


I love the 'come at me bro' attitude. She knows it's a nothingburger.
posted by chris24 at 4:19 PM on October 28, 2016 [16 favorites]


So what happened with Trump and the stairs and the plane?!? Inquiring minds need to know!

Per @AdvanceGuyNotes, that "happens more than you'd expect." I do wish we had footage of him going down an evacuation slide in glee over Comey's letter though.
posted by zachlipton at 4:20 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


-Texan, Voted
posted by svenvog at 4:20 PM on October 28, 2016 [29 favorites]


HuffPost making their opinion clear on the homepage.

WTF FBI
posted by chris24 at 4:21 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


I'm still stressed and kinda crazy about the election, but it's just a little less intense since i voted yesterday. Early voting remains the best, and I feel so lucky to be able to do it. And even with the line, it was nice to see so many different people eager to vote the first day. Yay, democracy!
posted by Akhu at 4:22 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


Yeah, shopping lists and little odd details. Howie Carr, who is a first rate asshole, was crowing about an email from Huma to Podesta that used the phrase "sober her up" in reference to HRC, and it was clear Huma meant "talk her off the ledge" about some finer point of policy or strat. You know, advise her. But Carr and his fans (forgive me I have been tuning in right wing radio in the car to feast on the sadness and conspiracy ideas) are sure it means she started boozing at noon.

Steady my friends, this is tempest in teapot.
posted by vrakatar at 4:23 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


Guys, I think she was amazingly presidential at her conference. Take a few deep breaths.
posted by annsunny at 4:24 PM on October 28, 2016


God. Billy Bush and Anthony Wiener. I'm in a coma right? This can not possibly be real life-- it is just too insane. This will go down in those informal wacky history books as a "Didja know?" side section. " Didja know that the election of the first Woman President in the USA involved people named Bush and Weiner?!"
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:24 PM on October 28, 2016 [31 favorites]


Just watched the press conference. I think Director Comey can go ahead and pencil in an Oval Office meeting on January 23rd for a frank exchange of ideas.
Inauguration Day's on a Friday.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:24 PM on October 28, 2016 [30 favorites]


I really hope the government has created some sort of IT safety and organization course (or something) that all people and staff should take.

There is rigorous, mandatory training for military, government, and contractors. It covers email, acceptable use, various common attacks like spear-fishing.

As far as running email servers - there are detailed guidelines from DISA on minimal security implementations - Standard Technical Implementation Guides (STIG). Also, there are a ton of additional instructions at each agency.

Trying to support an unapproved mobile device (hrc's blackberry) - mobile devices have there own security requirements - by end-running all of that is pretty brazen, and there is no way anyone involved did not know how sketchy it was.

That it even got to the point of 'was any of it classified?' is really miles beyond. But, it seems like the laxness is an intentional part of the culture - easy for executives to ignore and hard for juniors to enforce. This is evident from Powell and Rice commentary.

It's the culture. For executives, convenience outweighs IA guidance. Same as everywhere.
posted by j_curiouser at 4:25 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


This can not possibly be real life

It's just a fantasy. And Trump will be caught in a landslide with no escape from reality.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:25 PM on October 28, 2016 [49 favorites]


@ABCPolitics
NEW: White House was informed of FBI Director's letter to Congress on Clinton email investigation through media reports @alex_mallin
posted by chris24 at 4:27 PM on October 28, 2016 [19 favorites]






NEW: White House was informed of FBI Director's letter to Congress on Clinton email investigation through media reports @alex_mallin

Jesus. Comey should be removed from office immediately, for his amazing lack of transparency and accountability. This is just unacceptable.
posted by Existential Dread at 4:28 PM on October 28, 2016 [38 favorites]


And other Republicans are still trying to run for the 'most brainless' title:

Never heard of him before now.

From what I can gather, he sounds like the kind of Republican most mefites could actually stand. (And also an Iraq war vet who is understandably interested in veteran affairs.)

Apparently Ms Duckworth before heading to congress had some problems as Director of the Illinois Department of Veterans Affairs under Blagovich. Ironically, she credits her decision ot get into public service to fellow wounded war vet - Robert Dole.

Tangled thing, politics. Everyone has their ups and downs.
posted by IndigoJones at 4:29 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


It's just a fantasy. And Trump will be caught in a landslide with no escape from reality.

I see a little fingered yahoo of a man

SCARAMOUCHE
SCARAMOUCHE
DID YOU EMAIL FANDANGO
posted by delfin at 4:30 PM on October 28, 2016 [42 favorites]


Such a douche
Such a douche
With the complexion of a mango
posted by tonycpsu at 4:32 PM on October 28, 2016 [121 favorites]


Kirk did not serve in Iraq, if I recall correctly. He was in the reserves and was not deployed.
posted by qcubed at 4:35 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Will any future administration or campaign ever use email again?
Yes -- with end-to-end encryption.
posted by Coventry at 4:35 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]




And also an Iraq war vet

Yeah, about that...
posted by tonycpsu at 4:35 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


And also an Iraq war vet who is understandably interested in veteran affairs.

As mentioned above, Kirk has embellished lied about his military service record multiple times.
posted by zakur at 4:38 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


would the FBI be allowed to search indiscriminantly through Abedin's email in an investigation of Weiner?
If the email is on any device they were allowed to seize, then yes. Just like any evidence regarding an unrelated case is fair game if it's found while executing a valid search warrant.
posted by Coventry at 4:38 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


Fuck yeah. I know Reid said he'd laid the groundwork, but Schumer seemed iffy.

Tim Kaine: Democrats Will Nuke Filibuster For Supreme Court Nominees If GOP Won’t Cooperate
posted by chris24 at 4:38 PM on October 28, 2016 [25 favorites]


Can the FBI Sway an Election?
In other words, Comey faces an impossible choice. If he refused to tell Congress, officials could claim he knowingly withheld information that was important to the American people. But in disclosing the investigation, he’s potentially shaping the outcome of the election; it’s unclear how the public will interpret the announcement, but the stock market has already taken a dive. As Benjamin Wittes argued on the website Lawfare, “Comey and the FBI are in a terrible position here, one in which they would be accused of playing politics whatever they ended up doing.”
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 4:39 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


Reps. Cummings and Conyers Request Full Disclosure from DOJ and FBI on Email Investigation [tweet w/ image of letter they sent to FBI]
posted by melissasaurus at 4:43 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


they would be accused of playing politics whatever they ended up doing

If he feels he must disclose this to Congress, which I won't dispute, it's how he did it that's the issue, not the disclosure.
a) Didn't notify the White House
b) Allowed Chaffetz to release it to the press and inaccurately frame the coverage
c) Phrased the letter in a seemingly deliberate way to imply wrongdoing
d) Withheld mitigating info that they later leaked to the press.
posted by chris24 at 4:44 PM on October 28, 2016 [68 favorites]


I live in Oregon, where we vote exclusively by mail. I filled out my ballot a few days ago, blackening the spot next to Clinton/Kaine so completely that no light will ever escape its grasp. I found myself longing for a pen that dispensed Vantablack, but made due with an uncommonly dark ballpoint. I then dropped my ballot off at the official county election office's box, and stood there for several seconds, waiting for....what? I don't know. A little brass band to start playing a happy tune from inside the box, maybe, or cheers from the middle distance.

Man, the nation needs a fricken break, and I, a large adult beverage.
posted by but no cigar at 4:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [70 favorites]


By the way, the new tape with Trump humiliating and groping Miss Australia on stage might not get much traction, as it has poor video/audio quality and a very long set-up, but in my opinion it's even worse than the Billy Bush tape.

Not only does he humiliate and basically assault the woman in front of a full audience of onlookers because of some imagined slight to his ego, but he does so after very calmly and deliberately explaining to the audience exactly what it is he's about to do. And then calling (ordering, really) her to come up to the stage so that he can enact her "punishment". It is loathsome. It is pathological.

And in a sane election, it would almost certainly be a campaign killer. But this fucking year....
posted by Atom Eyes at 4:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [95 favorites]


Police state indeed
posted by Apocryphon at 4:46 PM on October 28, 2016


I suspect that "chance of winning" in 538's model is an oversimplification of what those odds mean in Monte Carlo statistics
The probability they're giving has a precise mathematical definition, but not much relationship to reality. It's not quite useless, but it's close. An honest treatment would involve a probability distribution over the probability of winning, and a wide range of probabilities would be roughly equally plausible under that distribution. Even that distribution would be unrealistic, as it would only incorporate uncertainty which the model explicitly represents. But compared to a single number all that would be hard to explain to people.
posted by Coventry at 4:48 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


Hillary does herself no favors when she states that only Republican legislators got this update from Comey. Just stop with the persecution complex already, no matter how accurate it may be. It just makes her look vindictive and defensive.
posted by xyzzy at 4:52 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


"i'm just an orange nobody loves me"

"he's just an orange from north new jersey
spare him this loss of the presidency"
posted by pyramid termite at 4:53 PM on October 28, 2016 [17 favorites]




The FBI needs a new headquarters, and I'm pretty sure that the search for a suitable piece of real estate just shifted from Prince George's County, MD to Alaska.
posted by schmod at 4:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


Just stop with the persecution complex already, no matter how accurate it may be. It just makes her look vindictive and defensive.

Buh?
posted by Atom Eyes at 4:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [15 favorites]


@TVietor08
The FBI is teaching us all an important lesson about protecting sensitive info by putting out their letter and then leaking all the details
posted by chris24 at 4:56 PM on October 28, 2016 [33 favorites]


It just makes her look vindictive

Vindictiveness is in the eye of the beholder.
posted by melissasaurus at 4:56 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


the worst part is that when clinton wins, we're going to have 4 more goddamned years of this goddamned shit at a time when our country is going to be faced with some very serious situations and decisions
posted by pyramid termite at 4:57 PM on October 28, 2016 [22 favorites]


Hillary does herself no favors when she states that only Republican legislators got this update from Comey. Just stop with the persecution complex already, no matter how accurate it may be. It just makes her look vindictive and defensive.
On the contrary, if it's true, it seems fairly damning.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 4:58 PM on October 28, 2016 [38 favorites]


It's not vindictive and defensive IF IT'S TRUE.
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:00 PM on October 28, 2016 [23 favorites]


Just stop with the persecution complex already, no matter how accurate it may be.

"Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't after you."
posted by tonycpsu at 5:00 PM on October 28, 2016 [7 favorites]


I think it might have been a simple mistake. It looks like the letter had the Republicans listed on the first page and Democrats on a second page. The crazy thing is how much importance everyone is giving to this one detail. "Hillary Lied!!!" is what I'm seeing reporters saying about her press conference.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:02 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


Good on the native protesters that want Hillary to stand with them or, at least quit, with the fog machine.

Just... Let them stand.
posted by RolandOfEld at 5:03 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


So Rubio came after Murphy based on this:
"Since the FBI announced they were re-opening an investigation into Hillary Clinton’s use of her private server, Patrick Murphy will need to let Floridians know if he still trusts Hillary Clinton 100 percent, as he has said in the past."
Murphy came right back:
Murphy spox: "Patrick trusts Hillary Clinton with the nuclear codes, which is more than Marco Rubio can say about his preferred candidate."
posted by chris24 at 5:04 PM on October 28, 2016 [76 favorites]


This copy of the letter has a second page that seems to indicate that it was sent to Diane Feinstein at least. It's possible that it was addressed to the committee chairs (Republicans) and sent to their Democratic counterparts as well.
posted by zachlipton at 5:04 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


Nerdwriter: Facebook Could Reveal Your Voting Record

Title is confusing until you finish it. We use some of the techniques mentioned, particularly getting people to declare a particular date and time to volunteer.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:04 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]




I've lurked in just about every election thread thus far, and have thought repeatedly that I'd drop in to share my appreciation for all of my fellow MeFites here—these threads are my primary source of election coverage, with all other spigots more or less turned off, in the interests of maintaining my sanity.

I came into this one because I really needed you guys today. The FBI story set me off spinning, until I thought, "I need to go to Metafilter right now and get some perspective." And my blood pressure dropped after five minutes of measured commentary on the Blue.

I'll never get through all of these threads, and my contributions are likely to be minimal. But it doesn't change the fact that they've been hugely (I'm serious, so I'm not going there) impactful to me, as an antidote to the most insane election cycle of my entire life.

Thank you all, from the bottom of my heart.
posted by Brak at 5:05 PM on October 28, 2016 [126 favorites]


It's not vindictive and defensive IF IT'S TRUE.
Literally it was cc'ed to Elijah Cummings and Diane Feinstein.
posted by xyzzy at 5:06 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Jack Tapper made the quip that this proves if you see a gun in the first act it goes off in the third. And by gun he meant dick pic.
posted by humanfont at 5:07 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


HI YOUR NAME IS BRAK!
posted by vrakatar at 5:08 PM on October 28, 2016 [23 favorites]


and that dick pic grew up to be Albert Einstein
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 5:09 PM on October 28, 2016 [18 favorites]


Literally it was cc'ed to Elijah Cummings and Diane Feinstein.

Literally the ccs on the second page weren't shown until Frank Thorp posted that tweet. Customarily letters to committee chairs would go to the ranking minority members, but since she's in the dark, how was she to know?
posted by holgate at 5:10 PM on October 28, 2016 [9 favorites]


weiner is in the dark - he is likely to be eaten by a grue
posted by pyramid termite at 5:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [18 favorites]


An honest treatment would involve a probability distribution over the probability of winning, and a wide range of probabilities would be roughly equally plausible under that distribution. Even that distribution would be unrealistic, as it would only incorporate uncertainty which the model explicitly represents. But compared to a single number all that would be hard to explain to people.

Many of these words do appear in a statistics textbook.
posted by one_bean at 5:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [16 favorites]


Some early voting updates:

@Redistrict
About 17.9 million Americans have already voted, per @ElectProject. That's ~13% of expected electorate. http://www.electproject.org/early_2016

@Redistrict
However, none of the counts updated for today or ballots currently in the mail. True total likely closer to 20% of total electorate.

@ShaneGoldmacher
About 25-30% of the expected electorate in Florida has already voted
posted by chris24 at 5:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [7 favorites]


The probability they're giving has a precise mathematical definition, but not much relationship to reality. It's not quite useless, but it's close. An honest treatment would involve a probability distribution over the probability of winning, and a wide range of probabilities would be roughly equally plausible under that distribution.

It's super simple. Clinton having an 85\% (or whatever, I'm not looking) probability of winning means that they simulated a shitload of elections using state and national polling, assumptions about correlations between states, and maybe some basic electoral fundamentals, and Clinton won 85\% of those simulated elections.

Unless they've changed recently, 538 actually shows you either a histogram or kernel density of the simulated outcomes.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 5:13 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


Literally the ccs on the second page weren't shown until Frank Thorp posted that tweet.
I read Politico's transcript posted 5 hours ago, which included the ccs on page two.
posted by xyzzy at 5:16 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


So here's a weird question: why did the FBI not look at Huma Abedin's emails as part of their original investigation into the Clinton emails? Surely, if you're investigating improper emails, and some of them have been deleted from the server, you'd want to check out the likely recipients of those emails to see if they still have copies, right?
posted by zachlipton at 5:18 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


About 25-30% of the expected electorate in Florida has already voted
My (safely blue) state is tracking to be about 40% early voting.

They're going to have to rebrand it "September Surprise."
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:18 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


November 9th is going to be a stressful day for Comey. Hope he enjoys Alaska.
posted by Yowser at 5:19 PM on October 28, 2016


Well, this settles it. I won't vote for Comey or Weiner.
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:19 PM on October 28, 2016 [28 favorites]


It just makes her look vindictive

Just looking vindictive, hell. All goes well, come 1/21 I kinda want her to be vindictive. I mean, I'm not proud of it, but I kinda want her to go all Hillsa: She-Wolf of the DNC.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 5:19 PM on October 28, 2016 [49 favorites]


I can't help but think that Comey's resignation letter is going to be on either the AG's or HRC's desk by February. This shit will not abide. Nasty women get it done.
posted by Ber at 5:21 PM on October 28, 2016 [7 favorites]


This thread needs more hamilcrap like Hamilton needs another hole in the head

We're non-stop.


♫U know there ain't no other♫

posted by fuse theorem at 5:21 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Goddammit, I hate this fucking election, not least of reasons that it is ruining the most wonderful time of the year. 🎃
posted by Sophie1 at 5:21 PM on October 28, 2016 [16 favorites]


In other news, I am hoping that Clinton starts her first term as "give no fucks" Clinton instead of waiting until she's 7.5 years into her terms. That's my fan fiction moment. No fucks from day one.
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:22 PM on October 28, 2016 [97 favorites]


So here's a weird question: why did the FBI not look at Huma Abedin's emails as part of their original investigation into the Clinton emails? Surely, if you're investigating improper emails, and some of them have been deleted from the server, you'd want to check out the likely recipients of those emails to see if they still have copies, right?

Because they now have a reason to get access to Huma's personal devices -- they're looking at every device Anthony Weiner might have used. Huma would sometimes forward emails to her personal email account so that she could print them out for HRC more easily. (And this was ok! You're allowed to use your personal email address, and all of these emails would have been expected to be FOIA-able!) So what they're likely to find is... copies of emails they already have. Really boring ones, most likely.
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 5:23 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


Goddammit, I hate this fucking election, not least of reasons that it is ruining the most wonderful time of the year. 🎃

Amen to that. Halloween deserves better than the horror show we got.
posted by tobascodagama at 5:23 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


Tim Kaine: Democrats Will Nuke Filibuster For Supreme Court Nominees If GOP Won’t Cooperate

While drinking a beer.
posted by kirkaracha at 5:28 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


Jesus. Comey should be removed from office immediately, for his amazing lack of transparency and accountability. This is just unacceptable.

I cannot see any downside or fallout from a Democratic president removing the head of the FBI 11 days before an election on a day when said director of the FBI sent a letter to Congress saying the FBI had found more information that may or may not be relevant to a previous investigation. Removing him would clearly be a win-win!
posted by Justinian at 5:28 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


Tim Kaine: Democrats Will Nuke Filibuster For Supreme Court Nominees If GOP Won’t Cooperate

It's the 'if' that worries me. Why are we trusting these people for a moment? Take them at their word: They're actively trying to destroy government, and I see no reason to believe they won't just claim they'll cooperate and then fail to.
posted by steady-state strawberry at 5:29 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


Amen to that. Halloween deserves better than the horror show we got.

It's not Phantasm, but it's pretty terrifying.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:30 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Yesterday I was deep in the heart of deep red Mississippi, working with two of the most deeply red conservative voters I know. They have both contributed heavily to hard right causes and neither has ever voted for a Democrat at any point in their lives. So after we concluded businesses, at lunch over sandwiches one of them leaned forward knowing I was their secret window into the dark world of liberal thought, and asked, "Okay, so why would it be a bad idea to vote for Trump?"

So I leaned in to things I figured they would take seriously. He's a terrible businessman, he managed to bankrupt with a casino empire which is like going bankrupt running the fucking mint, he has fucked over every business partner he's ever had and people from the caterer of his daughter's wedding to princes in Saudi Arabia say he has no honor and simply lives to steal what he can. And the ghostwriter of The Art of the Deal says he has no attention span, no desire or capacity to learn, is a pathological liar, cheat, and fraud, and does not seem to care that other people have feelings.

"What concerns us," my other coworker said, "is that he seems completely ignorant of Christianity."

Well, I went on, that's because he is. He wasn't raised to believe, and has no inclination to now. He is no more Christian than Chairman Mao, and he never will be since he only says what he thinks he needs to to schmooze people but has no interest in in learning or studying anything new, and no inclination at all toward humility.

Solemn nods...! "I find it very hard to vote for someone who has no belief in Christ at all."

You just said that to an atheist, I said with a bit of a grin.

And this was when I realized what was going on. "Oh no, I really think you're an agnostic, whether you admit it or not," I was told. Infuriating as it was I realized that this was really a "you will know them by their works" moment. They know that for all my D-voting flaws I am a stand up guy they can rely on when work needs to be done to do it competently and honestly and without causing problems. They do not see this about Trump. They see Trump as the empty vessel he is, drifting and unreliable and claiming a faith he clearly doesn't even slightly understand, obviously because he wants to schmooze them. And they aren't buying it.

"But the alternative is Hillary, and she's so crooked," he went on. "I don't think the country will survive her."

The Clintons are career politicians, I said, and you don't have a successful career at that unless you accumulate a pile of skeletons in your closet. They are really no worse than anyone else and Hillary will do just fine. You may not agree with everything just as I didn't agree with a lot of what George W did, as you know, but there will be a USA when she goes. I'm less sure of that with Trump because he is exactly the kind of narcissistic never-grown-up six year old who might really start a nuclear war in a fit of pique.

I'm pretty sure they won't be able to make themselves punch the ticket for Hillary, but I got a strong impression they were seriously considering leaving the Presidential race blank. And if these guys are thinking like this, a lot of supposedly reliable R's are thinking it. And what's more I don't think they would admit it either to any of their other deep red R friends or to a pollster. They could only tell me because they knew I would not shame them for being less than 100% on board with their ticket.
posted by Bringer Tom at 5:35 PM on October 28, 2016 [156 favorites]


Justinian: I cannot see any downside or fallout from a Democratic president removing the head of the FBI 11 days before an election on a day when said director of the FBI sent a letter to Congress saying the FBI had found more information that may or may not be relevant to a previous investigation. Removing him would clearly be a win-win!

The people who would be angry would mostly be people who were always suspicious and hostile of the Obama and Clinton. Kicking him out immediately while being very public about the reason (attempting to influence the election) can be taken as corrupt... but can also be taken as evidence that his behavior was completely outside the norm and unacceptable. I don't know how much damage it would do, but I doubt it could do more than leaving him in.

In any case, his ass and any upper-tiers that support him should be out the door on Nov. 9th. It looks cleaner if done after the election, but before Clinton is in charge.
posted by Mitrovarr at 5:36 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


All of this unconfirmed, obviously, but apparently a guy on a flight out of Reagan International today was next to an FBI guy ranting on the phone about Comey and the letters. If true, it's insight into the power struggle within the FBI. Start reading here or I'll dethread it here:


Jeremy Dickey
‏@JeremyDDickey

@FBI official on my plane openly saying how crazy Comey's letter was.

Update he now is talking about how the NY FBI office pressed to have the A. Weiner info leaked

He's now saying that the NY @FBI office and DC office are openly feuding due to the #EricGarner case takeover

Same @FBI official says it's reckless and crazy to have released this letter now but it ultimately shows the inner agency struggle

He ended the conversation with saying "it doesn't matter Clinton will win and Comey needs to be out"

He just called someone else to vent about the letter–now saying that he's shocked that "straight shooter Comey" would pull this stunt

Now saying "You know how the run things out of NY office, they would have leaked the email connection with Weiner"

posted by bluecore at 5:37 PM on October 28, 2016 [36 favorites]


@Hadas_Gold Fox news is going all live tonight and tomorrow, with a special Saturday editions of a bunch of their shows.

Live? To talk about what? I mean how many times can they say Hillary Email? There is nothing to this story and I'm trying to imagine how they are going to pump it up enough to have special Saturday editions. I know they will have Kellyann Conway and other Trump surrogates-- heck maybe even the big boy himself-- but they will be filling the airways with fluff because there is no there there.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:38 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


Breaking: Anthony Weiner invented a time machine, went back in time to stop himself from sending that first dick pic. After succeeding, he realized he had some extra time so he sent a few more dick pics.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 5:39 PM on October 28, 2016 [93 favorites]


Solemn nods...! "I find it very hard to vote for someone who has no belief in Christ at all."

"But the alternative is Hillary, and she's so crooked," he went on. "I don't think the country will survive her."


Never mind that Hillary is (not that religion should matter, but still) infinity times the Christian that Trump will ever be.
posted by vverse23 at 5:39 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


the justification for the Clinton home email server, that she wanted to keep using her BlackBerry, is extremely thin, given the difficulty and risk of running your own email., especially when classified info is an issue. the only explanation that makes sense to me goes back to the way the Clinton Foundation was run and their cozy ties with wealthy foreign parties, tycoons, and states: she was trying to continue to use the foundation as a sort of secondary or shadow state department and maintain those close and lucrative ties with foreign leaders through various foundation employees of the Clintons, like Huma Abedin.

The Doug Band emails show exactly how the Clintons used the foundation to make over 150 million dollars in ten years by cultivating consulting contacts and speeches for the very rich people making donations.

but none of you want to hear this.
posted by ennui.bz at 5:40 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


but none of you want to hear this.

We know it and it's not really productive to wring our hands over it at this point in time. There's a difference.
posted by Talez at 5:43 PM on October 28, 2016 [32 favorites]


I mean how many times can they say Hillary Email?

For a first cut, you can probably just substitute "emails" for "Benghazi" in this report.
posted by tonycpsu at 5:43 PM on October 28, 2016


I mean yeah, we can talk about how shady everything looks and then I could go slit my wrists from the thought of Breitbart & Co. running the fucking country.
posted by Talez at 5:44 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]


the justification for the Clinton home email server, that she wanted to keep using her BlackBerry, is extremely thin

She wanted two accounts on one device. Trivial today, but the NSA wouldn't provide that for the SoS at the time.

Side note: having a beef with the NSA is a plus in my book.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:44 PM on October 28, 2016 [53 favorites]


> Amen to that. Halloween deserves better than the horror show we got.
This election season needs less Mango Unchained and more David S. Pumpkins.
posted by Fiberoptic Zebroid and The Hypnagogic Jerks at 5:44 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


150 million dollars in ten years

15 million a year doing book tours and speeches! I'm shocked!
posted by vrakatar at 5:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [18 favorites]


I couldnt have two accounts on my device (and had to carry a blackberry and an iPhone) until like 2011. Something something enterprise outlook not supported something something. Her explanation makes perfect sense to me.
posted by melissasaurus at 5:47 PM on October 28, 2016 [52 favorites]


Never mind that Hillary is ... infinity times the Christian that Trump will ever be.

We know that, but these guys have a lung and a half full of Kool-Aid and I knew they wouldn't actually believe that. Just as they have never actually admitted to themselves that Obama had some career experience beyond being a community organizer before he ran for President. They have been programmed to reject as simply unbelievable the idea that any of these reviled people have any positive qualities at all. I thought it would be more productive to try to defuse the "America won't survive" idea by pointing out that yes, she obviously does have this negative quality but so does anyone else who might ever manage to seem viable for the job. So this negative quality isn't really the end of the world you guys think it is... but on the other hand, what were you thinking about Trump again?
posted by Bringer Tom at 5:49 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


I dunno. I figured the real reason was to keep the NSA and GOP snoops out of her emails to stop them from reporting flaming nothingburgers like the ones we're seeing now and consequently iceberging her 2016 presidential bid before it started. And I kind of wouldn't blame her.

btw, flaming nothingburgers is not yet taken as a username. get it while it's hot.
posted by mochapickle at 5:50 PM on October 28, 2016 [12 favorites]


the justification for the Clinton home email server, that she wanted to keep using her BlackBerry, is extremely thin

She wanted two accounts on one device. Trivial today, but the NSA wouldn't provide that for the SoS at the time.


Yep, ennui.bz, your whole argument kinda breaks down when Clinton specifically asked for a secure Blackberry from the NSA that would have meant no private server if they'd been willing to set up one for her.
posted by chris24 at 5:50 PM on October 28, 2016 [83 favorites]


the justification for the Clinton home email server, that she wanted to keep using her BlackBerry, is extremely thin, given the difficulty and risk of running your own email., especially when classified info is an issue.

The fact that you think classified info was an issue for the Secretary of State's regular email shows how little you understand about this story.
posted by one_bean at 5:50 PM on October 28, 2016 [46 favorites]


but none of you want to hear this.

*grind grind grind*

You offer speculation about using the Clinton Foundation as a shadow state department. Yawn. Occam's razor says that the normal channels were being a pain in the ass and she circumvented them -- a dumb idea, and a needless risk. Your argument indicates that she would otherwise have difficulty maintaining those "lucrative ties" as though she wouldn't have been able to with gmail.
posted by tclark at 5:51 PM on October 28, 2016 [18 favorites]


There are CEOs of large companies that get paid $100,000-$400,000 a day, 365 days a year, for their "services." It's horrible and stupid, but that's what happens right now. In that world, is it really so surprising that people would pay Bill Clinton $500K for a speech? A big drug company CEO makes close to that on a Sunday golf day.
posted by zachlipton at 5:52 PM on October 28, 2016 [29 favorites]


An FBI agent talking openly about his job loudly in a public place? Sorry but that story seems like bullshit.
posted by dilaudid at 5:52 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


I for one am appalled and outraged that these latest email releases PROVE that Hillary Clinton was doing a play-by-email of Changeling using the old WoD rules. [fake]
posted by winna at 5:54 PM on October 28, 2016 [20 favorites]


dilaudid: An FBI agent talking openly about his job loudly in a public place? Sorry but that story seems like bullshit.

I noted it wasn't confirmed. Yet, it does happen from time to time.
posted by bluecore at 5:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


But despite his partisan leanings, Comey has a pretty good track record of acting fairly. He stood up to Alberto Gonzales' attempt to ram extra-illegal surveillance through on Ashcroft's sickbed,

I just want to come back to this, because Comey gets a reputation for "doing the right thing" here, and it's not entirely deserved. Here's what happened, filled in with knowledge we only learned from the Snowden documents:
In the confrontation that ensued, Ashcroft supported Comey both formally (because Comey was legally the attorney general while Ashcroft was incapacitated) and on the legal substance. Bush reauthorized the program despite the Justice Department’s conclusion that it was unlawful. Comey then threatened to resign—with Ashcroft, FBI director Robert Mueller, and other top officials reportedly ready to join him. Bush ultimately backed down, and the troublesome program was briefly suspended until it could be renewed under a different legal authority.
So the NSA was gobbling up massive amounts of data based solely on a letter John Yoo wrote on "inherent presidential authority," basically the legal theory of "he's the President and we're at war, so nothing, even the Constitution, limits his surveillance power." Eventually, people realized that was a load of crap, so they came up with an argument nearly as ridiculous: the Authorization for the Use of Military Force against terrorists somehow grants an exemption to FISA, even though FISA is supposed to be the "exclusive means" for, well, foreign intelligence surveillance. Government lawyers, including Comey, had trouble stretching this to cover bulk internet metadata, which generally had no inherent connection to the war on terror, and Comey refused to sign off on it. Then the NSA went to the FISA court and got a blanket warrant to collect all the same data they were collecting all along ("though the Court apparently imposed stricter limits than the NSA’s own lawyers did"), until 2011 when that part of the program was stopped.

So yes, Comey refused to sign off on surveillance he believed to be illegal. But the surveillance continued, under other legal authorities, unabated. Comey made no effort, that we know of, to blow the whistle, going to Congress or the IG or anyone to report that the government had been, for years, conducting surveillance he considered to be unlawful. He also saw no problem with the FISA court issuing a blanket warrant for essentially "the internet's metadata." And he's emerged as an enemy of encryption.

Sure, Comey stood his ground in that hospital room and that's a good thing, but he did absolutely nothing about the invasion of privacy that was occurring, and actively worked to facilitate a way for the NSA to keep doing the same thing it was doing all along.
posted by zachlipton at 5:56 PM on October 28, 2016 [20 favorites]


He's now saying that the NY @FBI office and DC office are openly feuding due to the #EricGarner case takeover

Apparently, all politics is local even at the FBI. If this is true, I kind of hate-love that this Comey move might be a result of a territorial pissing match between FBI branches.
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:56 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Anyone else in NYC see a camo-bedecked pickup truck driving around the city today with massive TRUMP signs on top? I'm trying to figure out what the hell they were up to.

Anyway I flipped it a double-bird on all of your behalf
posted by gusandrews at 5:56 PM on October 28, 2016 [36 favorites]


An FBI agent talking openly about his job loudly in a public place? Sorry but that story seems like bullshit.
I agree, but I am reminded of the time the FBI raided an acquaintance of mine for allegedly hacking a community college and took his Nintendo but not his laptop.
posted by xyzzy at 5:57 PM on October 28, 2016 [40 favorites]


@ThePlumLineGS
"Pete Williams just confirmed on @allinwithchris that "many" of the newly found emails could be "duplicates." As I suggested earlier."

Seems that a lot of people are starting to think the emails are just dupes of stuff already known about. So she logged into an IMAP email account from the computer and some emails were downloaded to it?
posted by chris24 at 5:58 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]


Apparently an Iowa Trump supporter was so worried about the vote being rigged that she decided to vote twice.

Don't do that, dumb-ass Trump supporters. I know that you think that it's easy to commit voter fraud, but you will get caught.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:03 PM on October 28, 2016 [27 favorites]


Anyone else in NYC see a camo-bedecked pickup truck driving around the city today with massive TRUMP signs on top? I'm trying to figure out what the hell they were up to.

Sacha Baron Cohen filming a new movie?
posted by nathan_teske at 6:05 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Odd, this FBI thing. The first thought I had was when Bobby Kennedy was cooking hamburgers in his office fireplace which was across from Hoovers...I'll gladly pay you Election Day for a fury of WTF today. But I'll add this, ignore it because I'm willing to bet that's when another announcement come Monday and ignore it but Hilliary is all show me the beef when the beef may be with her staff. To me, that's the ringer; HRC is involved but not centered upon in the investigation.
No, yeah, put JPM at defcon 2.
posted by clavdivs at 6:06 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


but none of you want to hear this.

No, it's just that it's the only thing you come here to say, over and over again.
posted by holgate at 6:09 PM on October 28, 2016 [74 favorites]


, especially when classified info is an issue

Classified information is NEVER supposed to be sent over email, even State Department email. And in fact Hillary did not send classified information. She received that information; but it was not marked as classified. She had no reason to think it was classified for that reason. There was no law about private email servers. The previous administration used them extensively and lost 22 million emails as a result.
posted by humanfont at 6:09 PM on October 28, 2016 [85 favorites]


Maddow making the excellent point of Hillary Clinton's political life, once again, being turned upside down by the sexual misbehavior of someone who is NOT HER.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:11 PM on October 28, 2016 [96 favorites]


Anyone else in NYC see a camo-bedecked pickup truck driving around the city today with massive TRUMP signs

Anecdotally: I saw my first Trump pins today here in NYC, two in the span of about an hour. There was a woman on the D train at Bryant Park in midtown wearing a red MAGA hat and a pin on her backpack, and then, over by Hudson Yards on 34th St., a fellow walking down the sidewalk wearing a big TRUMP PENCE pin on the lapel of his tweed jacket.
posted by Oxydude at 6:12 PM on October 28, 2016


My mom, who is a lawyer, just told me that she attended the training be a voters' rights protection volunteer, assigned to a polling place on election day. Because she lives in one of the cities in Ohio that has been mentioned as a possible target for voter intimidation by open-carry Trump supporters, the stakes are very high.

I'm often very proud of my mom, a lefty liberal who went into corporate law in the '80s to support her family, instead of legal aid, like she wanted. I have never been prouder of her than I am today.
posted by merriment at 6:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [116 favorites]


I like Rachel Madow as much (or more!) as the next person, but eight minutes -- including a detour into who has the naughtiest name, Weiner or Boehner -- to get to the latest email story is seven minutes too much.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


I like Rachel Madow as much (or more!) as the next person, but eight minutes -- including a detour into who has the naughtiest name, Weiner or Boehner -- to get to the latest email story is seven minutes too much.

It's been a long day. I give her a little bit of a break.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:14 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


Politico: Comey's disclosure shocks former prosecutors: FBI director's announcement of new evidence in the Clinton probe compounds criticism of his earlier willingness to discuss the case.
posted by chris24 at 6:15 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


Human Rights Campaign maintains Mark Kirk Endorsement, despite his racist remarks

Despite the fact that Duckworth has a better record on LGBTQ rights. This tells me everything I need to know about the organization's priorities and views on intersectionality.

There were a lot of things that bummed me out about this whole thing as an asian american who constantly has to explain that yes I am also a real american. I mean if an American who can trace her lineage back to the american revolution, lose both legs fighting in the Iraq war and then has a long history of public service but dares to have a drop of asian blood in her can also have her american credibility questioned, where does that put me?

What I despair about this HRC thing is that as more orgs continue to get the rights we all fought so hard for, the "fuck you got mine" mentality will continue to weaken it for the rest of us.
posted by Karaage at 6:19 PM on October 28, 2016 [87 favorites]


but none of you want to hear this.

You know they found the email from Colin Powell recommending Clinton use a private server right? You know several other high level officials also had private servers right?
posted by xammerboy at 6:20 PM on October 28, 2016 [32 favorites]


It's super simple. Clinton having an 85\% (or whatever, I'm not looking) probability of winning means...
Yes, it's too simple. That number is the marginal posterior probability of a win. They should at least show the posterior distribution on the probability of a win, and even that would not reflect the full uncertainty.
posted by Coventry at 6:25 PM on October 28, 2016


Classified information is NEVER supposed to be sent over email
this is incorrect. here is a public release about SIPR email
but it was not marked as classified
it was not *properly marked*, but there were elements with classification symbols
She had no reason to think it was classified for that reason
see above
There was no law about private email servers
there was and is: Federal Records Act
The previous administration used them extensively and lost 22 million
they also were in violation of the records laws. they did not lose those, they deleted them at rove's instruction.
posted by j_curiouser at 6:25 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


I like Rachel Madow as much (or more!) as the next person, but eight minutes -- including a detour into who has the naughtiest name, Weiner or Boehner -- to get to the latest email story is seven minutes too much.

That's Maddow, though. She'll never take three minutes when twelve will do.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:25 PM on October 28, 2016 [14 favorites]


Anthony Weiner is challenging the Watergate break-in as the most problems a tricky Dick has ever caused for a Democratic Presidential campaign.
posted by andoatnp at 6:26 PM on October 28, 2016 [23 favorites]


there was and is: Federal Records Act

I am seriously getting tired of this.

From the very first paragraph of that link:

The Presidential and Federal Records Act Amendments of 2014 (H.R. 1233) is a United States federal statute which amended the Presidential Records Act and Federal Records Act. Introduced as H.R. 1233, it was signed into law by President Barack Obama on November 26, 2014.

Hilary Clinton was Secretary of State until February 2013.
posted by Zalzidrax at 6:29 PM on October 28, 2016 [79 favorites]


good lord, zalzidrax, have you spent any time in government. that link is for the amendment that clarifies many things; the records act goes back to like 1950.

and in all the training everywhere by everyone: email is a Record.

cf HHS
posted by j_curiouser at 6:41 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


Just for not-fun, imagine what the election would be like if our choices were Trump vs. Weiner. And we'd have to vote for the guy who sexts teenagers and who literally can't keep his hands off his namesake because THAT is the least of bad options.

they're looking at every device Anthony Weiner might have used

Ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww.

After succeeding, he realized he had some extra time so he sent a few more dick pics.

This reminds me of a story someone told me one time about some idiot who managed to delete the entire company's files while he was deleting his work porn collection....and then while that was going on, he downloaded some more porn until literally, nothing was left of the company except the guy's porn downloads.

"Imagine if he sat on this information, and didn't reveal to Congress that there was potentially new evidence regarding Clinton's emails."

Gene Weingarten has brought this up periodically in his chats over the last year: what happens if someone becomes aware of something awful about Hillary, what are the ethics of bringing this up. NOW WE GET TO FIND OUT. Whee. Can't wait for his next chat.

they have enough of a reservoir of bullshit scandals to keep their investigations going for at least the duration of her first term.
the worst part is that when clinton wins, we're going to have 4 more goddamned years of this goddamned shit at a time when our country is going to be faced with some very serious situations and decisions

I'm reasonably assuming Hillary will get impeached. Sad but most likely true. And probably a one-termer unless they manage to find someone worse than Trump.

I think it was boneheaded to try to protect her privacy by routing emails through her private server,

Given how everyone snoops through the woman's EVERYTHING, I honestly can't blame her for wanting to try to keep something, anything, private, even anything that was innocuous shit.
posted by jenfullmoon at 6:43 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


I even think Hillary Clinton committed a lot of security violations and I am still tired of us arguing about the damn email.
posted by corb at 6:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [77 favorites]


I hope and pray the next eleven days contain zero extra needless bullshit. 8 Nov won't put an end to the negativity, but I'm hoping that with the end of the unceasing horse-race coverage and drummed-up drama, we as fellow citizens can just chill a necessary minute.

Personally, I'm at peak cynicism and it's not healthy. Can't wait for the end of this surreal national experience. IT WILL BE THE BEST QUONSMAS EVER!
posted by chaoticgood at 6:47 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


That's Maddow, though. She'll never take three minutes when twelve will do.

I call it the shaggy dog politics hour with Rachel Maddow.
posted by peeedro at 6:47 PM on October 28, 2016 [9 favorites]


sorry, corb
posted by j_curiouser at 6:48 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


good lord, zalzidrax, have you spent any time in government. that link is for the amendment that clarifies many things; the records act goes back to like 1950.

If I'm reading it right, one of the things it clarifies is, in fact, preventing private e-mail accounts. That directive had apparently not existed before 2014.
posted by zombieflanders at 6:48 PM on October 28, 2016 [28 favorites]


I have a friend I respect, is on the right side of many issues (like the Dakota pipeline stuff) AND YET is spreading around the Wikileaks email crap on social media, linking specifically to this site. I don't know how to help persuade him to stop buying into the Wikileaks / Drudge Report / alt-right crap, and it's making me feel angry and helpless.
posted by lazaruslong at 6:53 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


There was no law that required Clinton to use a government server for her emails. There also wasn't one that required Powell to use a government server for his emails, or all the Bushies that used a GOP server for their emails. If there was such a law, the FBI and Congressional Republicans surely would have noted it at some point during this fiasco. Clinton had her lawyers go through her emails, separate out the government-related ones, and gave the to the State Department, where it's been treated like any other government record (those would be the tens of thousands of emails that were publicly released, plus those withheld for the usual FOIA exemption reasons). In contrast, the Bush Administration officials had all their government-related emails on private servers deleted, millions of them.

Now, should there be a law that requires officials to use government servers for government email? Quite possibly yes. A change along those lines was made in 2014, as you noted, but even that allows for private servers as long as emails are copied to a government system within 20 days (this raises some interesting questions with regard to, say, text messages, but an "official email only" policy would essentially ban text messages). Are there things Clinton should have done better or differently with regard to her emails? Damn straight. But you're implying that she violated records laws by using a private server, and I'd like to see evidence of that.
posted by zachlipton at 6:53 PM on October 28, 2016 [39 favorites]


That's Maddow, though. She'll never take three minutes when twelve will do.

I know, the Boehner detour just seemed like the perfect excuse to finally vent about it.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:53 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


@MarlowNYC
George W. Bush Administration:

60 embassy deaths
Secretary of State uses private server
Iraq War
22M deleted emails
0 FBI investigations
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [174 favorites]


I have a friend I respect, is on the right side of many issues (like the Dakota pipeline stuff) AND YET is spreading around the Wikileaks email crap on social media, linking specifically to this site. I don't know how to help persuade him to stop buying into the Wikileaks / Drudge Report / alt-right crap, and it's making me feel angry and helpless.

Seriously, unfollow them or hide them or do whatever you need to not to see them during the election...

...but keep in mind that we're looking at four years of smears on Clinton so maybe just keep their name/handle in your kill file.
posted by Joey Michaels at 6:56 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


I seriously want to know where some people are getting their information, though. One of my relatives is posting, sincerely, that Hillary has accepted a deal to step down in exchange for a plea bargain. This is so patently false I can't even begin to contradict it without twitching. But he believes it, so he had to have gotten it from /somewhere/. Who is putting this crap out?
posted by corb at 6:56 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


SIPR email is a separate system on SIPRNET. It has nothing to do with ordinary @state.gov or Clinton's server.
posted by humanfont at 6:57 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Who is putting this crap out?

Ed Klein?
posted by Joey Michaels at 7:02 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


always amazing to me that while people are debating about emails Congress continues to skirt under the radar and remain free of requirements of the federal records act and FOIA.
posted by Karaage at 7:03 PM on October 28, 2016 [20 favorites]


In this ever changing world in which we live in, it's nice to know that certain things are still constant, like the "Human Rights Campaign" going out of their way to be giant douchebags.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:03 PM on October 28, 2016 [24 favorites]


This is so patently false I can't even begin to contradict it without twitching. But he believes it, so he had to have gotten it from /somewhere/.

Its your relative? Maybe ask him?
posted by cashman at 7:05 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


Not to sound flippant, and I do love a good search, but if it was my cousin saying something about Donald Trump has agreed to bite Mike Pence's head off while Ozzy watches, my first action would be to ask "uh, and just where did you hear that??"
posted by cashman at 7:06 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


I did, but it's fucking crickets all the way down because my family knows I hate Trump so are carefully not engaging me on politics in election season.
posted by corb at 7:08 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


I even think Hillary Clinton committed a lot of security violations and I am still tired of us arguing about the damn email.

This is the GOP running on autopilot. "Hey! October Surprise! Let's revisit a bureaucratic snafu a week and change before election day!"

This is the Clinton Campaign. "Hey! We're surprised and shocked. Really. Here's a video of The Donald groping someone as punishment, on tape. Back atcha. This isn't the worst or last of these. Stay. Down."

And that's where we are in 2016. War of the Oppo Drops. Ideas, track record of said ideas, track record of said candidates to put ideas into action...

Nope. Oppo Drop.

The hell of it is, Clinton is a policy wonk with a proven track record. She's utter crap at communicating it outside our echo chamber. Even the debates were all about oppo drop.

USA Today or someone did a poll I can't find at the moment... but Pence/Trump would be demolishing Hillary/Kaine. At the same time, Sanders/Anyone would demolish without blinking Pence/Trump.

On the other hand, the next presidential election cycle will be dominated by the race between the incumbent, and the Governor from Rhode Island... also a deomocrat, in the primary. The GOP is going to present a professional-wrestler and Nazi-Fur cosplay hobbyist as a credible candidate.
posted by Slap*Happy at 7:09 PM on October 28, 2016 [7 favorites]


The lesson here is, guys, do not send unsolicited dick pics, or you might get a fascist elected. NOT HYPERBOLE.
posted by krinklyfig at 7:10 PM on October 28, 2016 [101 favorites]


The thing which annoys me right now is that the HRC voters are voting for her-- in part-- because they care about content. So if a story like this breaks, they really feel they need to understand it and agonise about it and work it through. Trump can literally have 12 corruption stories a day and none of his voters care at all.
posted by frumiousb at 7:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [56 favorites]


I'm guessing President Hillary Clinton never uses email at all. Right?
posted by dnash at 7:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


The lesson here is, guys, do not send unsolicited dick pics, or you might get a fascist elected. NOT HYPERBOLE.

That reminds me, a friend on his way out of Minneapolis checked into Facebook from the "Senator Larry Craig Memorial Restroom." today.
posted by mikelieman at 7:13 PM on October 28, 2016 [20 favorites]


Not sure if the World Series is a national ad buy or not, but I got a Trump ad. In Texas.
posted by hoyland at 7:14 PM on October 28, 2016


I may never use email again. Can any of you imagine what we'd look like to the world if all of our private emails were released as searchable online? If Wikileaks publishes this crap about her, then what's to stop them from publishing anyone's private email? When is it okay to invade privacy?
posted by frumiousb at 7:14 PM on October 28, 2016 [20 favorites]


USA Today or someone did a poll I can't find at the moment... but Pence/Trump would be demolishing Hillary/Kaine. At the same time, Sanders/Anyone would demolish without blinking Pence/Trump.

On the gripping hand Sanders has never faced a decent oppo drop. It's easy to be a knight in shining armour when you've never been in a serious fight. Clinton also demolishes Ted Cruz for what it's worth.
posted by Francis at 7:16 PM on October 28, 2016 [47 favorites]


The backstory here -- with the WaPo reprinting Comey's staff memo and other top-tier reporting on internal conflict -- seems to coalesce around that reported phone convo from Jeremy Dickey: that Comey suspected (or was told) the NYC FBI office would leak details of the shared laptop if he didn't go public to Chaffetz and the permanent investigation gang.

Yeah, model of best practices there at the FBI.

I wish Sarah Kendzior's experience covering authoritarianism weren't so apposite (and so does she), but she was getting twitchy today about the behaviour of security services -- cop unions, border guard/ICE unions, perhaps some FBI agents -- and the attitude towards the acquittal of the Bundy Gang. There's a tension between "serve the public" and "gloves off, kick ass and get shit done" that requires strong elected leadership, and also not having a fucking fascist on the ballot.

I'm guessing President Hillary Clinton never uses email at all.

Obama talked about his custom iPhone on Jimmy Kimmel's show: it has no cellular components, so no SMS, and no camera and no music, but it does have email. But I imagine Hillary will happily be done with it for the duration -- just as GWB stopped sending emails when he became president.
posted by holgate at 7:22 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]


USA Today or someone did a poll I can't find at the moment... but Pence/Trump would be demolishing Hillary/Kaine. At the same time, Sanders/Anyone would demolish without blinking Pence/Trump.

Those hypotheticals are worse than meaningless IMO. They've never faced oppo, never ran a national GE campaign, never successfully done the million things you need to do to win a national primary and an election. But hey, they have lower unfavorables. Yeah, so did everybody else who got crushed by the candidate with the high unfavorables.

The idea that Pence would be beating Clinton is so ridiculous it's offensive. He wasn't even going to win reelection in fucking red Indiana.
posted by chris24 at 7:22 PM on October 28, 2016 [86 favorites]


Wait why doesn't Obama get music? No wonder he's going gray, lack of a good soundtrack!
posted by corb at 7:23 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


Comey sent FBI employees a letter:
To all:

This morning I sent a letter to Congress in connection with the Secretary Clinton email investigation. Yesterday, the investigative team briefed me on their recommendation with respect to seeking access to emails that have recently been found in an unrelated case. Because those emails appear to be pertinent to our investigation, I agreed that we should take appropriate steps to obtain and review them.

Of course, we don’t ordinarily tell Congress about ongoing investigations, but here I feel an obligation to do so given that I testified repeatedly in recent months that our investigation was completed. I also think it would be misleading to the American people were we not to supplement the record. At the same time, however, given that we don’t know the significance of this newly discovered collection of emails, I don’t want to create a misleading impression. In trying to strike that balance, in a brief letter and in the middle of an election season, there is significant risk of being misunderstood, but I wanted you to hear directly from me about it.

Jim Comey
"Significant risk of being misunderstood???" That's the understatement of 2016. Maybe if you have something to say 11 days before the election, you should avoid saying things that have a significant risk of being misunderstood. And then speak up if people are misunderstanding them.
posted by zachlipton at 7:24 PM on October 28, 2016 [52 favorites]


Pence/Trump would feature Trump demolishing Pence and ignoring the actual opposition.
posted by Artw at 7:24 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


The lesson here is, guys, do not send unsolicited dick pics, or you might get a fascist elected. NOT HYPERBOLE.

Also, that all of America revolves around whether or not a guy gets to shove his (overly photographed/tweeted) dick into some (grabbed) pussy. More or less.

When is it okay to invade privacy?

We don't have any any more. Now that everyone has the ability to snoop on everyone in every way forever, it's gone.
posted by jenfullmoon at 7:26 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


I am nothing but committed to factual accuracy, so, much like James Comey, I feel compelled to offer this update to my previous statements. According to a Trump campaign official, the airplane stairs fit fine for Trump's plane, but were being repositioned. Reports that they were running two hours late at the time still persist.
posted by zachlipton at 7:34 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


I'm pretty sure a Venn diagram of the unsolicited dick pics crowd and the want to get a fascist elected crowd is very nearly circular.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 7:35 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]


Wait why doesn't Obama get music?

I'd guess it's a blanket "no outside files" policy. No third-party apps, either, and many default apps disabled, since he was joking that at least the weather app worked. I think he has (or had) a non-networked iPod for music and workout playlists at some point -- maybe a Shuffle?
posted by holgate at 7:35 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


The probability they're giving has a precise mathematical definition

"Math is a common democrat lie. It can't make the budget great. I'll have the best economy."
posted by effbot at 7:42 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]




> 'What a Crock': Clinton Breaks DAPL Silence With Statement That Says 'Literally Nothing'.

Meanwhile, Bernie released his own statement: Sanders in Open Letter to President Obama: Take a Bold Stand Against DAPL
posted by homunculus at 7:47 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


Newsweek has a story Hillary Clinton's Emails: The Real Reason the FBI Is Reviewing More of Them, with some background on Abedin's use of emails from, you guessed it, "an official with knowledge of the investigation." It's Eichenwald, so apply all the usual filters you do to his stuff, and recognize that the sourcing is rather ambiguous as to what comes from "government records" (I presume this is the stuff the FBI released about its investigation a few months ago) what's from the anonymous official.
Because Clinton preferred to read documents on paper rather than on a screen, emails and other files were often printed out and provided to her either at her office or home, where they were delivered in a diplomatic pouch by a security agent. Abedin, like many State Department officials, found the government network technology to be cumbersome, and she had great trouble printing documents there, investigative records show. As a result, she sometimes transferred emails from her unclassified State Department account to either her Yahoo account or her account on Clinton’s server, and printed the emails from there. It is not clear whether she ever transferred official emails to the account she used for her husband’s campaign.

Abedin would use this procedure for printing documents when she received emails she believed Clinton needed to see and when the Secretary forwarded emails to her for printing. Abedin told the FBI she would often print these emails without reading them. Abedin printed a large number of emails this way, in part because, investigative records show, other staff members considered her Clinton’s “gatekeeper” and often sent Abedin electronic communications they wanted the Secretary to see.

This procedure for printing documents, the government official says, appears to be how the newly discovered emails ended up on the laptop shared by Abedin and her husband. It is unclear whether any of those documents were downloaded onto the laptop off of her personal email accounts or were saved on an external storage device, such as a flash drive, and then transferred to the shared computer. There is also evidence that the laptop was used to send emails from Abedin to Clinton; however, unless she was told by Abedin in every instance, Clinton could not have known what device her aide was using to transmit electronic information to her.
posted by zachlipton at 7:47 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


These! E! Mails!
*they will not let them go*
Let them go!

These! E! Mails!
*they will not let them go*
Let them go!

These! E! Mails!
*they will not let them go*
Never never never never

*will not let them go*
*O let them GO*
Oooooooooooooo

No! No! No! No! No! No! No!
Obama mi-Obama-mio
O NBC-oh let them go!

It's Hillary! We're writing on the site! of! Hillstory-
Of You and Me
On MetaFEEEEEEEEEE!!!


*flam*
*headbang*
posted by petebest at 7:50 PM on October 28, 2016 [30 favorites]


"As a result, she sometimes transferred emails from her unclassified State Department account"

There is also evidence that the laptop was used to send emails from Abedin to Clinton;

What?!

Unclassified. Emails.
posted by mikelieman at 7:52 PM on October 28, 2016 [6 favorites]


( read that in your best Raiders of the Lost Ark "Top. Men." tone for best effect. )
posted by mikelieman at 7:53 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


Well I'm sorry that I voted already because finding out Clinton liked to print out emails makes me reconsider everything. [all the fake]
posted by winna at 7:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [18 favorites]


WaPo: This. Cannot. Be. Happening. Somewhat of a dark comedy piece, perhaps more of a despair piece, from Hillary's perspective upon being told about the letter today. A small sample:
“No,” Hillary says.

The stock market gets confused and plummets 150 points.

Bill Clinton’s entire left arm goes numb. An entire foot of snow falls at once.

“No,” Hillary repeats. “This cannot be happening. We are too close. This cannot be. I will not—” She twitches. The ground outside is entirely blanketed with white. Some of it begins to coalesce into a gigantic snow-dragon. “Is this to be my whole life?” she asks. “Is it always going to come back to the ruinous acts of idiot wieners?”
posted by zachlipton at 7:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [27 favorites]


Well I'm sorry that I voted already because finding out Clinton liked to print out emails makes me reconsider everything.

The real question: Underlining or Highlighting.
posted by mikelieman at 7:56 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]


So it sounds like the only thing new here is that Abedin sometimes used Wiener's computer?
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 7:57 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


Remember when scandals could be described in textbooks for young students? The Teapot Dome Scandal! Watergate! The Pentagon Papers! Iran-Contra!
posted by xyzzy at 8:00 PM on October 28, 2016 [9 favorites]



You know how different concepts can get associated in your mind? It just happens whether you want it to or not. Now every time I have to do something with email or think about emails I need to send I just get this gross, stressed, squidy feeling because of it's association in this really gross election and Trump in general. And now it's even worse because oh guess what now we get to add dick pics to the association mess.

It will go away once the election is over. Or at least I hope it does.
posted by Jalliah at 8:00 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


So it sounds like the only thing new here is that Abedin sometimes used Wiener's computer?

It's not about whether this will lead to legal repercussions for Clinton; it is a virtual certainty that it won't. It's about the fact that this is all we're going to hear about for the next 11 days until and unless something new and terrible about Trump comes up. It's Trump so we can hope that will be the case. Because Trump.

But it means we'll know with dead certainty whether anyone was holding back Trump oppo. Because if they were, they'll drop it in the next 3 days. If nothing comes out it means nobody has anything and we're in for a rocky ride.
posted by Justinian at 8:01 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


Someone up thread said something about even the debates being nothing but "oppo drops" and not about policy. Which no. Just no. Even when Clinton referred to one of Trump's many scandals during debates, she *always* turned it back around to either specific policy areas she had in a related area or aspirational ideas about the kind of America she believes in. She excelled at taking negative bullshit and talking about both policy and emotion during the debates. It's so frustrating that we (meaning the press, people who don't like Clinton, etc.) pretend like there hasn't been any policy in this race when there's been lots. Sigh.
posted by R343L at 8:05 PM on October 28, 2016 [46 favorites]


@Nate_Cohn:
Florida's registered voters, now final:
2016: White 64.2, Hispanic 15.7, Black 13.4
2012: White 66.5, Hispanic 13.9, Black 13.6

An electorate 2.3% less white is not good for Trump.
posted by chris24 at 8:05 PM on October 28, 2016 [12 favorites]


I have much love for the Freddie Mercury riffs. But Hillary is totally "We Are The Champions."
"And we'll keep on fighting 'til the end... no time for losers... 'cause we are the champions...."

Meanwhile I've been considering early voting, but parking in downtown OKC is a nightmare, so I think the local church is a more relaxing alternative. I look forward to seeing the next president take office. Question:
Pantsuit or a stately red dress, a la Queen Elizabeth II?
posted by TrishaU at 8:06 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


"Math is a common democrat lie. It can't make the budget great. I'll have the best economy."
FWIW, I believe a Clinton win is exceedingly likely. It seemed worthwhile to point out that the 538 probability estimates are only marginally more precise than a personal opinion, because some people got in a tizzy about a change of two or three points.
posted by Coventry at 8:06 PM on October 28, 2016


Pantsuit or a stately red dress, a la Queen Elizabeth II?

Definitely pantsuit. It's iconic.
posted by Itaxpica at 8:08 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


Sanders/Anyone would demolish without blinking Pence/Trump

I don't believe that. While I believe Sanders would beat either Trump or Pence (not that Pence would ever have picked Trump as a running mate - I don't think anyone would have, so flipping the ballot like that is nonsensical), he didn't have to endure the scrutiny that Clinton's gone through in the last few months. His skeletons haven't been long-aired and well-explained, and he'd be facing heat for them. Also, his implication that all the nations ills are class-based would start to get serious attention from the left, and Republicans would be perfectly happy to jump on any implication that he fails to be sensitive to matters of race - never mind what their own candidates do.

I don't think Hillary would lose to Pence, either; Pence's anti-LGBT policies have barely been noted in the media since he was selected as a running mate, and his claim that "we'd never punish the woman for an abortion" is directly contradicted by Purvi Patel, who is currently serving 20 years in Indiana for exactly that.

And Pence's dodging of Trump's positions wouldn't work when it's his own policies in question, which, unlike Trump, he actually has a track record of implementing. Racist immigration, the law requiring death certificates for miscarriages, the "Religious Freedom Restoration Act" that cost Indiana 60 million dollars as tourists and companies decided to take their business elsewhere. We'd have a more standard election process with Pence at the head, but he also has very little ability to reach outside of his core constituency. It's just a bit broader than Trump's core, and is less prone to the Three! Word! Chant! form of political commentary.

Can any of you imagine what we'd look like to the world if all of our private emails were released as searchable online?

There are topics I don't discuss online, at all, ever, even with close friends in emails or locked blog posts. I don't hint at them, don't even name the topics; the closest I get is posts like this where I mention "there are things I don't say online." (Not that my emails don't contain enough to potentially lose me my job, or keep me from ever being elected--but the things I know could truly destroy my life, are not on disc anywhere.) But I know that a lot of people younger than me grew up thinking "of course you put everything on the computer; it's easier to manage that way."

The 2024 election (I'm gonna be hopeful that 2020 is Hillary neatly stomping on the remnants of this year's Repub lineup) could include candidates born in 1988, whose entire middle-school & up life is documented online. I think we're seeing the last wave of the "pre-internet" candidates, which is why they're mostly older. I suspect that sometime soon we'll get a "jump down" in average age of serious contenders for many levels of office, as Millennials change the shape of politics.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 8:10 PM on October 28, 2016 [22 favorites]


Remember when scandals could be described in textbooks for young students?

Just because they don't put them in text books doesn't mean there weren't sex scandals back then.
posted by dilaudid at 8:10 PM on October 28, 2016 [29 favorites]


Remember when scandals could be described in textbooks for young students?

Just because they don't put them in text books doesn't mean there weren't sex scandals back then.


Something something Reynolds Pamphlet
posted by Itaxpica at 8:12 PM on October 28, 2016 [29 favorites]


Pantsuit or a stately red dress

Definitely the pantsuit: it gets butt-busting cold and windy in DC most Januarys, and a dress would be very drafty.

Also, for dilaudid:
Ma, Ma, where's my Pa?
Gone to the White House, ha ha ha!

posted by easily confused at 8:18 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


NGL I kinda hope she already has her Victory Pantsuit picked out.
posted by Itaxpica at 8:19 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


Does Hamilton have a song about clothing? Something cheerful to think about between the election and the inauguration.
Nobody obsesses about what the men wear. But it's a thing, so we might as well lend our thoughts to sartorial splendor, instead of thatotherstuffthatmakesnodifference ... I vote a nice solid red dress, knee-length, with a simple jacket and red-white-blue scarf (tucked in because wind happens). No hat. No gloves. Knock-out red lips.
posted by TrishaU at 8:22 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Does Hamilton have a song about clothing?

[MULLIGAN]
Yo, I’m a tailor’s apprentice
And I got y’all knuckleheads in loco parentis
I’m joining the rebellion cuz I know it’s my chance
To socially advance, instead of sewin’ some pants!
I’m gonna take a—
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:24 PM on October 28, 2016 [15 favorites]


The part of this that I find hardest to believe is that Abedin and Weiner shared a laptop. Why would professionals at this level have any need to share a laptop? We are way less important and have way less money and have never in almost 30 years shared a laptop despite sharing a business.
posted by HotToddy at 8:25 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


Nobody obsesses about what the men wear.

As a dude interested in male fashion, especially of the classic-suits variety, I seriously wish they did. Nobody ever asks, and if it ever does come up its always just like "uhh... Marty Greenfield?"
posted by Itaxpica at 8:27 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Is it really clear how much they shared the laptop? Perhaps it's just occasionally. I can completely imagine they might both have laptops (possibly more than one) but while on a trip or at an event, it just turns out occasionally that the other's laptop was more convenient.
posted by R343L at 8:28 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


New episode of Hillary's podcast: Episode 8: You need to vote in this election. Marlon Marshall, Hillary Clinton's director of state campaigns, reassures Max about the campaign's ground game. [16:05]
posted by cashman at 8:28 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


It's probably the house laptop that they use for random bullshit -- looking up recipes, Google mapping an address, printing out boring-ass unclassified emails for work when it's too much hassle to go fire up a different machine in another room, et cetera.
posted by palomar at 8:29 PM on October 28, 2016 [14 favorites]


Well, apparently Hamilton "dresses like the pits of fashion," so Hillary shouldn't take any tips from him.
posted by TwoStride at 8:30 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


Those of you who had "Anthony Weiner's hog" as the Chekov's gun of the 2016 election, please see the cashier to collect your winnings.
posted by [expletive deleted] at 8:31 PM on October 28, 2016 [22 favorites]


Just because they don't put them in text books doesn't mean there weren't sex scandals back then.

As my [experienced journalist] mom said, a conspiracy of male privilege kept most of those scandals out of the news. But they happened.
posted by Miko at 8:31 PM on October 28, 2016 [20 favorites]


Just because they don't put them in text books doesn't mean there weren't sex scandals back then.
I know. I was just being silly. I find myself in a weird place where I long for arms for hostage scandals over shit that's only coming to light because Anthony allegedly couldn't control himself with a minor.
Is it really clear how much they shared the laptop? Perhaps it's just occasionally.
According to reporting on The 11th Hour, it's another 30,000 emails. So this investigation will be months at least.
posted by xyzzy at 8:33 PM on October 28, 2016


The way most thick mail clients work, all she had to do was setup the account once locally and let it run for a while (limited by network speeds and server limits) and it could download as much email as she had in that account. Most mail clients by default will try to download basically everything.
posted by R343L at 8:37 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


30,000? Where did the number 3 come from? Did someone drop four zeros?
posted by Coventry at 8:40 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Does Hamilton have a song about clothing?

HAMILTON: Well it's time to wear a shirt, it's time to wear a shirt,
And if you get mad I'll give ya a whole world of hurt,
'Cause I gotta wear a shirt or else my chest'll be cold moreso,
I gotta get a nice and fluffy shirt here on my torso

CHORUS: (he's gotta wear a shirt, he's gotta wear a shirt)

WASHINGTON: Hamilton I see you've got a real nice shirt
(HAMILTON: that's right)
WASHINGTON: It's stripey and it's wide like a windswept yurt
(HAMILTON: oh yes)
WASHINGTON: So if you wanna wear it, ya better learn to share it
Or else I'm gonna steal your nice shirt!

JOHN ADAMS: Well I'm Pres Number Two and I've got a hairdo,
a wig on my head that's big enough for two,
But I'm still very jealous of the Hamilton fellas
'Cause he's got a hella benevolent SHIRT!

HAMILTON: Hey, John, take a seat, take a chill pill, man,
My shirt is too big for a tiny little man;
A man named dan? well that sounds like a plan,
To buy a nice shirt for a man
posted by Greg Nog at 8:42 PM on October 28, 2016 [24 favorites]


Human Rights Campaign maintains Mark Kirk Endorsement, despite his racist remarks

Despite the fact that Duckworth has a better record on LGBTQ rights. This tells me everything I need to know about the organization's priorities and views on intersectionality.


I've always thought of HRC as being the organization for people who wanted to show their support of equality by putting the world's smallest bumper sticker on their car.

corb: I seriously want to know where some people are getting their information, though. One of my relatives is posting, sincerely, that Hillary has accepted a deal to step down in exchange for a plea bargain. This is so patently false I can't even begin to contradict it without twitching. But he believes it, so he had to have gotten it from /somewhere/. Who is putting this crap out?

I think that you're seriously underestimating the ability of many people to pull crap out of their ass--or to believe the crap that others pull out, as odoriferous as it is--when they're really desperate.
posted by Halloween Jack at 8:46 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


The email thing is really bad. No, it's not technically illegal. But the leader of an organization should follow that organization's own rules, and if anyone other than Hillary in the state department was using a private email server, they'd be fired (and in fact it did get an ambassador in quite a bit of trouble). Government email is usually encrypted (I don't know about the state department specifically), and for pretty good reasons -- even emails that seem mundane could give other countries big hints about upcoming decisions. And, of course, the emails are retained in case they're needed in a lawsuit. Hillary's staff blatantly failed to do either of these things.

Is it the worst thing ever? Is she the only politician to ever have done it? No. But she made the State Department look really bad when her job was to make it look good. If she were running against a serious opponent, it would be a major liability.
posted by miyabo at 8:50 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


corb: I seriously want to know where some people are getting their information, though. One of my relatives is posting, sincerely, that Hillary has accepted a deal to step down in exchange for a plea bargain. This is so patently false I can't even begin to contradict it without twitching. But he believes it, so he had to have gotten it from /somewhere/. Who is putting this crap out?

/r/the_dolan. /pol/. Alt-right. The latest one is the draft our daughters fake-conscription "ready to die for Hillary's war in Syria" bullshit. That one came out of /pol/ two nights ago I believe and people have been running with it.
posted by Talez at 8:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


I think that you're seriously underestimating the ability of many people to pull crap out of their ass--or to believe the crap that others pull out, as odoriferous as it is--when they're really desperate.

One thing that's also become more and more evident over the election cycle is that there are just a lot of trolls. There are plenty of people knowingly generating false but tasty information just to see how far they can get it to go. Searching #MAGA on Twitter gets you plenty of this pure throw-it-at-the-wall disinformation, and the only motivation I can possibly imagine is the enjoyment of making everyone jump when you throw a new piece of rotting garbage at them. It's a pastime.
posted by Miko at 8:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


In Paul Ryan's statement on the "reopening" of the FBI case, he calls for Clinton to stop receiving national security briefings because she "has nobody but herself to blame".

This seems wrong in all parts, and disproportionate.
posted by lazugod at 8:56 PM on October 28, 2016 [12 favorites]


Press should just keep asking Ryan what he thinks about Trump's positions and attitudes on women, non-white people, immigrants, Muslims, the disabled, veterans, trade policy, Russia, ISIS, etc. The options Nov 8th are Clinton is elected or Trump is and it'd be nice for Ryan to go on record that he really thinks Clinton's mistakes with email are worse than everything Trump has said. After all, if a candidate shouldn't be receiving national security briefings then they hardly should become president.
posted by R343L at 8:59 PM on October 28, 2016 [16 favorites]


>Classified information is NEVER supposed to be sent over email
>this is incorrect. here is a public release about SIPR email

SIPRNET is a completely separate system used exclusively for classified information. These are a small number of secured terminals guarded by security staff 24/7. It has nothing to do with daily, routine email transferred over .GOV or private email accounts. And by the way, your citation refers to a process put into place a year after Clinton left office.

>but it was not marked as classified
>it was not *properly marked*, but there were elements with classification symbols

Comey was forced to admit under cross examination and under oath:
Question: If Secretary Clinton really were an expert at what’s classified and what’s not classified and we’re following the manual, the absence of a header would tell her immediately that those three documents were not classified. Am I correct in that?
Comey: That would be a reasonable inference.

>There was no law about private email servers
>there was and is: Federal Records Act

This is totally false. This has never been a law prohibiting use of private email servers and there still is not. The Federal Records Act was amended in 2014, a year after Clinton left office, to require that if private email is used, it must be copied to the government archives within 20 days. This new rule doesn't take effect until 2017, four years after Clinton left office. In any event, Clinton did send copies of her emails to the archives in compliance with the Federal Records Act.

Look, we went through all of this months ago. Jumping in here at this late date with a bunch of misinformation without making even a minimal effort at educating yourself just makes you look foolish.
posted by JackFlash at 9:00 PM on October 28, 2016 [136 favorites]


Gotta love that half the responses to Ryan's tweet are from Trump supporters yelling that they want to drain the swamp.
posted by gatorae at 9:02 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


The LA Times has an anonymous official who said (emphasis added):
The emails were not to or from Clinton, and contained information that appeared to be more of what agents had already uncovered, the official said, but in an abundance of caution, they felt they needed to further scrutinize them.
Putting all this together, the picture I'm starting to see looks something like:

Various people emailed Huma Abedin stuff that should be printed out and given to Clinton to read.
She printed the stuff, sometimes without reading it herself, but often had trouble printing from State Department computers/accounts, because reasons.
To successfully print stuff, sometimes she'd forward the emails to her personal account or her account on the Clinton server and then print them from that account.
This sometimes involved a laptop she shared with her husband.
FBI is going through the laptop as part of the sexting investigation, finds such emails and thinks "oh, Clinton-related emails. I should tell the people investigating that stuff about this."
Agents realize they need a new warrant to proceed further with those emails, since they aren't related to the sexting investigation. They tell Comey this.
Comey sends his letter to Congress, wanting to protect his reputation and the FBI's reputation so nobody can claim he mislead Congress earlier when he said the investigation was over in case anything comes up now. He is perhaps deliberately vague out of malice, vague because he doesn't feel he should say more in the middle of an investigation, or vague because he somehow failed to anticipate the response to his letter, even though previously available evidence points to him not being that utterly incompetent at life.
[The world seems to burn]
Clinton tells Comey to put up or shut up.
Comey perhaps feels weird about what he's done and writes a note to everyone at the FBI, explaining that he felt he had to say something publicly, but also wanted to "strike that balance" between disclosure and being misleading.
posted by zachlipton at 9:04 PM on October 28, 2016 [43 favorites]


if anyone other than Hillary in the state department was using a private email server, they'd be fired
Anne-Marie Slaughter, a former State employee under Clinton, wrote to Thomas Friedman:
“OTR, EVERYONE I knew at State used our private email (I used Princeton) when we were out of the office except for our blackberries, which were State issued) because it was so incredibly clunky and difficult to get onto the State system when we were not in the office."
posted by xyzzy at 9:04 PM on October 28, 2016 [33 favorites]


(and in fact it did get an ambassador in quite a bit of trouble)

A fact which is not mentioned in that link. Don't link things unless you read them first and make sure they actually say what you think they do. Because you are wasting my time having me read them.
posted by Zalzidrax at 9:07 PM on October 28, 2016 [17 favorites]


To recap this fast moving story:
- The emails were not sent by or to Hillary
- They may be duplicates of emails already examined
- Comey and others have yet to look at or examine the emails
- There is no expectation that these will result in any change to the findings of the investigation

This is rapidly turning into one more nothing burger.
posted by humanfont at 9:08 PM on October 28, 2016 [22 favorites]


Seriously? I can't believe we're still rehashing the email shit. Call me if anything new turns up. Seems like it won't.

Huma Abedin must be so profoundly hating her life choices about now.
posted by Miko at 9:09 PM on October 28, 2016 [30 favorites]




- The emails were not sent by or to Hillary

I've got to sort of walk this back a bit. Different publications are reporting very different things here, from not sent to/from Clinton to yes sent to/from Clinton. This, of course, is the problem with the FBI director sending smoke signals and his agency then leaking to high hell: nobody has a clue.
posted by zachlipton at 9:14 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Seriously? I can't believe we're still rehashing the email shit.

The thing is, if we weren't rehashing the email shit, we'd be rehashing some other stupid shit. Those are the Clinton rules. We're in for 8 years of this. And I'll be honest, I'm looking forward to it. Because it's better than the alternative.
posted by great_radio at 9:15 PM on October 28, 2016 [10 favorites]




A fact which is not mentioned in that link. Don't link things unless you read them first and make sure they actually say what you think they do. Because you are wasting my time having me read them.

I apologize, after reading again, it looks like one of the last of a number of charges of generall being incompetent was using commercial email servers. Which is another whole ball game then trying to run a secure private server to government standards. So, the point remains, it is still equivocation and exaggeration to say that this is related to Clinton's behavior at all.
posted by Zalzidrax at 9:20 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


And that's where we are in 2016. War of the Oppo Drops.

Personally I think we're ascribing too much agency to the campaigns in a lot of the so-called "oppo drops."
posted by kirkaracha at 9:24 PM on October 28, 2016 [7 favorites]


Noteworthy on the rape case: California has very recently removed its statute of limitations for criminal rape; that video looks solid enough to kick off those proceedings as well as the civil trial.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 9:27 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Wait, I just realized something. Chaffetz, who started this whole mess by falsely claiming the investigation was going to be reopened, is a Utah politician who has just recently declared for Trump and against MeFi's adopted own, Egg McMuffin. Clinton is close to Trump in the state, and I wonder if he promoted this as a bigger thing than it was specifically to affect the Utah race.
posted by corb at 9:27 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


You know, even with all of the oppo drops, the election is going exactly the way nearly everyone thought it would. Maybe they're not really driving everything.
posted by Mitrovarr at 9:27 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Nah, Chaffetz is just an asshole.
posted by Chrysostom at 9:28 PM on October 28, 2016 [17 favorites]


Perhaps it's just occasionally.

Printer setup's a pain.

But thinking more broadly: this campaign and these last few years tap (and current JCPL) has me thinking about the second- and third-order effects of ubiquitous technological permeation into our lives, and how it's exposing the cracks between the promise and the implementation. It covers the weaponisation of social media from MRA to goobergobs to state-funded trolling to frogmeme-fascism (and sleazy sexting); the broken security model that still partly assumes everyone lives with the everyday paranoia of an infosec pro; the capacity to fabricate narratives and purported evidence; the neverending onslaught of things that look like meaningful data, and when you look too long into the abyss....

So we joke about Skynet, while we're collectively creating -- with limited sense of agency -- an inverted version of The Matrix where hackers and shitposters fabricate a collective dystopian simulation, with maintenance provided by The IT Crowd.
posted by holgate at 9:28 PM on October 28, 2016 [18 favorites]


Sounds like, from what's been brought out so far, that, at worst, it could lead to Huma having to step aside from the campaign, which seems unlikely at the moment and that Coney did actually try to act in reasonably good faith but got stuck in a tough position by the New York bureau threatening to release info without controls, which would put Coney and the service in a bad light and could have been worse for the Clinton campaign since they would have existed as rumors first, then later have to be acted on extending this whole mess. Some focused questioning of Coney by a few members of congress might force out some people from NYC as not acting in the interest of the Bureau or the country and draw out any partisan implications, should there be some, which could potentially embarrass Ryan and, even more, Chaffey.

Personally, as dreary as it's been, I'm fine with the examination of emails, not so much with how this release was handled, but in general since once the question about it was raised it needed to be seen through. I'd prefer of course if this same level of scrutiny was evenly applied to both parties. Heck, I'd even consider the establishment of a bureau of ethics and inquiry if they would be able to look into the dealings of all our senators and representatives equally to make sure our government was running as it should, legally and ethically. But that'll never happen so this is just another example of partisan investigations driving discourse rather than a legitimate attempt to maintain ethical standards overall. That so many people are taking it as more indicative of Clinton's ethics than politics in Washington is telling in that regard.
posted by gusottertrout at 9:29 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


If Coney can't keep his own staff under control, then he should be fired.
posted by Yowser at 9:32 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


The HRC is a white men's club.
posted by qcubed at 9:33 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


More FL info:

@Redistrict:
At bookclosing, FL has added a net 929,327 voters since '12. Non-whites have accounted for 65% of that growth (39% H, 11% AA, 15% Other).

@Redistrict:
Since '12, FL has added a net 325,485 white voters & 603,842 non-white voters. Keep in mind, Obama's FL margin was 74,309 in '12.
posted by chris24 at 9:34 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


As a favor, could people differentiate HRCs better, since that's a common reference to Hillary too.

I can't see Coney sticking around long no matter what comes of this latest event.
posted by gusottertrout at 9:35 PM on October 28, 2016 [14 favorites]


Hi, when using the letters HRC could people try to keep in mind that Human Rights Commission and Hillary Rodham Clinton are two different things but have the same initials, cause this shit is confusing. Thanks.
posted by threeturtles at 9:36 PM on October 28, 2016 [39 favorites]


It seems to me that Comey might be immune from consequences in all this because it would be political kryptonite. But from my point of view, his failures are not just his moralizing and unprecedented press conference and terrible decision to write the vaguest of letters; the most telling failure is that he, the director of the damn FBI, is easily manipulated by threats of leaks from his own employees. That they would even threaten such a thing should be a firing offense, imho. The fact that he caved should be evidence that he is unfit.
posted by xyzzy at 9:36 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


I've always thought of HRC (Human Rights Campaign) as being the organization for people who wanted to show their support of equality by putting the world's smallest bumper sticker on their car.

I'm reading William Barber's The Third Reconstruction this month, and one of the things he stresses is the importance of being right even if, in the short term, you don't win. One of the examples he uses is John Marshal Harlan, the sole dissenter in Plessy v. Furgeson from 1896. Barber credits Harlan's public and recorded dissent as the groundwork for a great deal of 20th century Civil Rights law. Barber positions social justice activism as a multi-generational struggle, so being discerning about what's right vs. what's convenient is essential.

Which neatly encapsulates my ongoing frustration with the Human Rights Campaign, and the Gill Foundation this week. They're civil rights organizations that apparently chase short-term gains while handwaving that what's right will happen at some point in the future.
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 9:37 PM on October 28, 2016 [23 favorites]


Coney can't keep his own staff under control

And neither can Wiener.
posted by kirkaracha at 9:39 PM on October 28, 2016 [59 favorites]


I really don't understand why, when first confronted with the email scandal, Clinton didn't say something like:

"Yes, like many other non-technical high-level officials both in and out of government, I placed my own convenience ahead of proper security practices. I have certainly learned my lesson, but that's not enough. This is a cultural problem that is only becoming more important, and as President I will work to change the culture of Washington to ensure that every official with access to sensitive information has their methods of access to that information tightly controlled by professional computer security specialists who will be tasked with continuously keeping them compliant, without exception based on rank, technical ability or anything else."

Not only would this have been a forthright acceptance of responsibility for the error, it would have caused a conversation about how widespread these practices are, and gotten people talking about how she really isn't the only executive bypassing security protocols for the sake of convenience.

It seems like such an obvious way to turn a scandal into a plank in her platform, and I don't get why it wasn't her immediate response.
posted by contraption at 9:40 PM on October 28, 2016 [15 favorites]


"Wiener's staff has a knob on its end..." \pratchett
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 9:41 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


Would have thought the definite article would have been a giveaway. As is the contention that it's a white man's club, which we know in the presidential context is Trump central?
posted by qcubed at 9:41 PM on October 28, 2016


Is it the law that the Secretary of State, cannot have private emails? Is every letter typed by a cabinet member subject to the scrutiny of the FBI? This question comes late, but hey, I had to ask. Then when other cabinet secretaries used the same system as Clinton I have to think that institutional abuse of women is a real thing. I can not stand Chaffetz, he is an abusive man, that revels in it, thinking it will bring him admiration, and ultimately higher office. He has no redeeming qualities as a human being. He is like a lot of yes men, who when your hear all their yeses all at once, sound and behave, like a pack of dogs.
posted by Oyéah at 9:43 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


@mattyglesias:
The only way the email story could get any worse for Clinton would be if some kind of actual wrongdoing were unearthed at some point.
posted by chris24 at 9:43 PM on October 28, 2016 [156 favorites]


The ideal situation for Chaffetz is for Hillary to win but enter the White House with more limited downballot gains and looming shadowclouds, so he and his pals can choke anything from the executive branch for another two years with Clinton Rules investigations, then make 2018's midterms a de facto impeachment referendum.

One thing that's perhaps been obscured by the Actual Orange Fascist is the extent to which the post-1994 Congressional GOP simply does not regard Dem presidents as legitimate, and has acted accordingly. People like Chaffetz (who arrived in '08) or the big '10 crowd have gone into work since taking the oath thinking "how can we shut down government today?"
posted by holgate at 9:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [12 favorites]


"Comeys actions out of an abundance of caution make perfect sense if you have a profound bureaucratic myopia." — Josh Marshall
posted by My Dad at 9:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [3 favorites]


They are looking for personal wrongdoing. They are looking for an affair. They are looking for any little bit they can get a claw into. They are grasping at straws.
posted by Oyéah at 9:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]



Woman Who Claims Trump Raped Her When She Was 13 Has Released Video. Here's What She Had to Say...

I wonder if this gains any traction.


The video's been out since at least July, so... probably not, since it hasn't yet.
posted by BungaDunga at 9:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


It seems to me that Comey might be immune from consequences in all this because it would be political kryptonite.

I bet Obama fires him after the election. The fallout can't really impact Clinton because she isn't president yet (and they're going to be throwing everything they have at her anyway), and the fallout can't really harm Obama because he's leaving office anyway.
posted by Mitrovarr at 9:48 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Would have thought the definite article would have been a giveaway. As is the contention that it's a white man's club, which we know in the presidential context is Trump central?

I wouldn't go that far regarding The Human Rights Campaign. They're not the Log Cabin Republicans (although I think they declined to endorse Trump). And it looked to me that HRCamp volunteers were stumping hard for Clinton at Savannah Pride last week.

That doesn't mean they don't screw up when it comes to down-ticket endorsements, or when it comes to lobbying for specific laws.
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 9:50 PM on October 28, 2016


So it sounds like the only thing new here is that Abedin sometimes used Wiener's computer?

Right. The FBI almost certainly had Huma Abedin's own computer, probably turned over to them voluntarily by her. Then, looking for illegals sexts on his computer, they realize she sometimes used it to print emails. Maybe there are some of the missing deleted emails! We'd better let people know and check them out. Oh yeah, we need a new and separate warrant to even look at them.

So not only is there no sign of anything sketchy, it's actually a low grade vein of ore, since really scandalous emails are probably not forwarded to another computer to be printed out.
posted by msalt at 9:52 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


But had Comey simply said all that clearly and slowly instead of sending a ridiculous letter and standing back while his agency leaked like mad, I might have not slammed my head repeatedly into my desk today.
posted by zachlipton at 9:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [8 favorites]


Woman Who Claims Trump Raped Her When She Was 13 Has Released Video. Here's What She Had to Say...

I was just going to proclaim my frustration and anger over the fact that Trump keeps saying Hillary shouldn't even be allowed to run due to all the [fake] criminal allegations against her, and that it needs to be dealt with before her term starts, yet he's the one with actual exisiting guilty judgements and an actual November 28 trial date for fraud, and, and a judge determined there's enough evidence to set a heating for whatever this horrible will be for December.

Trump's Mirror aside, is there a press embargo on these trials? I don't recall hearing any questions about it, not recently, maybe not ever. Meanwhile, MSNBC gives Trump entire blocks of air time to let lie about Hillary's "crimes." Come on, Joy, nail those surrogates!

I wish so hard we could make broadcasters defend their FCC licenses during an annual renewal reviews.
posted by Room 641-A at 10:00 PM on October 28, 2016 [24 favorites]


a thinkpiece entitled:

Could Orange Facism be as Harmful to America as Clown Communism has been for Venezuela?
posted by ethansr at 10:00 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]




Not only would this have been a forthright acceptance of responsibility for the error, it would have caused a conversation about how widespread these practices are, and gotten people talking about how she really isn't the only executive bypassing security protocols for the sake of convenience.

I thought Clinton admitted that it was a mistake and apologized back in July. I think in terms of her campaign, it's probably a good idea to change the subject on an issue that had been closed (to the best of everyone's knowledge) instead of giving Trump an inch.
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 10:06 PM on October 28, 2016 [5 favorites]


This is a cultural problem that is only becoming more important, and as President I will work to change the culture of Washington to ensure that every official with access to sensitive information has their methods of access to that information tightly controlled by professional computer security specialists who will be tasked with continuously keeping them compliant, without exception based on rank, technical ability or anything else.
This is a lovely and principled thought, but the problem is that IT security gives so little thought to the user experience that it is almost impossible to comply without hamstringing productivity. My dad used to ask me to crack his laptop because IT restricted access to notepad. Hillary asked the freaking NSA for a secure access device and they said lol nah. State employees complained that accessing secure state systems remotely was too convoluted and nothing was done.

Overcoming user instigated barriers to security was by far my greatest challenge as a security professional, and the vast majority of the time my users were working around an unnecessarily inconvenient process, UX problem, or a lazy restriction that could be fixed with a more secure infrastructure. For example, my dad wasn't allowed to have notepad because it could be used to edit the registry, but a more granular security policy could have granted access to that application. Instead, I just cracked his laptop and gave him admin privileges.
posted by xyzzy at 10:10 PM on October 28, 2016 [37 favorites]


The national security story that should have legs is the Trump campaign's continued use of intelligence that likely came from Russian operatives.
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 10:11 PM on October 28, 2016 [11 favorites]


Not only would this have been a forthright acceptance of responsibility for the error, it would have caused a conversation about how widespread these practices are, and gotten people talking about how she really isn't the only executive bypassing security protocols for the sake of convenience.

You are mistaking the issues. Use of the private email server was not the security issue. Use of private email systems is not prohibited. The issue was whether classified information was transferred on unsecured email systems regardless of whether those unsecured email systems were .GOV accounts or private accounts.

.GOV or private doesn't matter. Both are unapproved for classified information. The dispute is whether classified information was transmitted via email. Clinton claims it was not. The private server is irrelevant to that issue. People would be having the same argument even if she used a .GOV account as were her aides because those are unsecured accounts.

The only issue regarding her private server was its use for both private and government business. This isn't a legal issue and it is not a security issue and is not prohibit by law. It is an issue of practicality. At the time, Clinton figured that using one account would simplify her communications. But in the long run it complicated them because she did not anticipate the effort required to go through and separate those 60,000 emails into those business ones that should go to archives and those personal ones that should go to the bit bucket.

This miscalculation probably cost her $100,000 or more of lawyer fees to have someone go through all of her email. So when Clinton says it was a mistake, it was a mistake that seemed to save time and convenience in the short run but actually cost her more time and money in the long run. It was not a legal mistake. It was a logistics mistake.

So your comment about bypassing security protocols is misguided. She wasn't bypassing security protocols.
posted by JackFlash at 10:13 PM on October 28, 2016 [62 favorites]


This is a lovely and principled thought, but the problem is that IT security gives so little thought to the user experience that it is almost impossible to comply without hamstringing productivity.

I mean, it's not like the Secretary of Fucking State has any need for electronic communication outside Foggy Bottom. If she had to visit 112 countries for her job it'd be a different story.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:17 PM on October 28, 2016 [22 favorites]


So not only is there no sign of anything sketchy, it's actually a low grade vein of ore, since really scandalous emails are probably not forwarded to another computer to be printed out.

Unless... what if Huma was printing them out for Hillary's Scrapbook of Wrongdoing?!
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 10:20 PM on October 28, 2016 [22 favorites]


The latest one is the draft our daughters fake-conscription "ready to die for Hillary's war in Syria" bullshit. That one came out of /pol/ two nights ago I believe and people have been running with it.

I'm Facebook friends with a black, female, ferociously anti-Trump veteran whose photo was used (without permission, obviously) in one of those "ads". She is fucking furious about the whole thing.
posted by Itaxpica at 10:21 PM on October 28, 2016 [24 favorites]


If it'd been anyone else, she would have been fired. It looks to many people like our leadership is completely unaccountable.

I have some sympathy for her. IT security can be a lot like the police: stupid as hell.
posted by Strange_Robinson at 10:22 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


Other people did do it. Powell and the entire Bush administration. Only they didn't comply with the record keeping requirements and deliberately deleted 22 million emails. Nobody fired or investigated them.

And sorry, but there are a metric shit-ton of things the boss can do in any field that Joe Blow can't get away with. Hardly indicative of raging unaccountability.
posted by chris24 at 10:26 PM on October 28, 2016 [64 favorites]


Hillary Is Haunted By Men’s Dicks Getting Them in Trouble
While Hillary Clinton has done plenty on her own to endanger her chances at winning the presidency, in the waning weeks of the 2016 campaign, her personal shortcomings aren’t dominating public discourse. Instead, men who don’t know how to properly manage their sexual whims are dominating public discourse.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:29 PM on October 28, 2016 [12 favorites]


James Comey doesn't strike me as somebody who gets out of the office much.

Anyway, the calmest campaign pros right now seem to be the NeverTrumpers, so we'll see what the weekend brings.
posted by holgate at 10:31 PM on October 28, 2016 [2 favorites]


I am faculty at a university where they have recently "upgraded" the email system to an unwieldy monstrosity. In order to get email on our personal phones, we were supposed to submit them for encryption. I don't have access to patient data or any data regulated by HIPAA. I am not submitting my personal phone to IT, where I have to sign off on the department being able to, not only access, but erase the entire contents of my phone. I feel for anyone working at any institution whose IT capabilities are so poorly resourced as to have staff purposely eluding the policies.
posted by Ima Sockpuppet at 10:35 PM on October 28, 2016 [26 favorites]


Many months ago, in conversation with one of the many Texas Republicans I know, we got to talking about the election. He was mad about the email thing and I told him, "Yeah, it's the usual corruption. It's wrong, and we should have better leaders than that. All of them do it. So if they burn her, I hope they burn all the rest of them too."

Guys, it's a problem when our leadership is unaccountable. This is what the banality of evil actually looks like. My first major disappointment with Obama? That he gave everyone in the previous administration a pass. Then I spent the next six or so years of his administration watching them reinforce most of the worst of the Bush years. The only exception I can think of is the banning of torture.

Like it or not, we live in an increadibly paternalistic culture. When mom/dad acts like the rules don't count for them, the kids learn to be the same way.
posted by Strange_Robinson at 10:40 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


I have assumed from the outset of this email flap that there is a robust network of federal employees using personal email accounts to do lots of informal governmental business, and that without that critical network much of the work of the federal government, especially the parts that need to move quickly, would slow to a crawl or just not get done.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 10:45 PM on October 28, 2016 [23 favorites]


When mom/dad acts like the rules don't count for them, the kids learn to be the same way.

If you think Trump will do a better job following the rules, vote for him instead.

Want a third option? Doesn't exist.
posted by Mitrovarr at 10:46 PM on October 28, 2016 [17 favorites]


In light of today's events, it's fascinating to revisit Politico's The Case Against James Comey, which came out last month:
This is the James Comey that so many have come to admire over the course of his long and distinguished career: a man of depth and compassion. There is every reason to believe that he comes by his convictions honestly. But there, perhaps, is the rub: In his zeal to deliver results that reflect his own deeply-held conception of justice, Comey has significantly eroded the self-restraint that constitutes our last check upon his exercise of power.

Whatever Comey’s motivations, this “ends-justify-the-means” approach to law enforcement carries profound risks—and troubling implications not only for the remainder of his tenure, but for the future of the agency he leads.

“I think there is a danger here,” says Akerman. “This is not something that can be countenanced. ... What [Comey] did goes totally contrary to our system of justice.”
Bonus fact: Comey opposed the Obama Administration's criminal justice reforms because he argued that harsh mandatory minimum sentences make it easier for law enforcement to threaten defendants into cooperating with law enforcement investigations or face draconian prison terms.

Bigger bonus fact: did you know that Comey was deputy special counsel to the U.S. Senate Whitewater Committee?
posted by zachlipton at 10:49 PM on October 28, 2016 [50 favorites]


The only thing Trump has talked about that got my interest was his talk around trade deals. Otherwise? He's a Republican for Christ's sake. Not my bag. Give me the hawkish, police state president.
posted by Strange_Robinson at 10:54 PM on October 28, 2016 [1 favorite]


IT security gives so little thought to the user experience that it is almost impossible to comply without hamstringing productivity.

I don't speak Linux, but I understand it allows much more granular controls than Windows. Of course, then you have to teach people how to use Linux and wean them off Gates' "I know what software you need and what it should do" approach to computers.

Most of the companies I've worked for, including those whose main task was processing huge collections of legal data, had atrocious security, because the corporate side of things had no idea how IT security works, and the get-stuff-done department was focused on productivity because salespeople were breathing down their necks with "do it now-now-now"--because absolutely nobody involved in the process (other than production department) had any idea what the security risks were.

Occasionally, IT would get a command from the higher-ups, and security locks of some sort would go into place for about a week, before someone in production sent back a memo, "hey, Client X has demanded we do [these things] and also grab data from [this website] but our security settings don't allow that... also, it needs to be done by tomorrow... Imma just throw this stuff on a flash drive and do it at home mmkay? lemme know when you've fixed the setting; stage 2 should be here next Thursday." And before next Thursday the restrictions were gone.

The fact that Clinton set up a private server instead of just using a gmail account speaks volumes about her commitment to security.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 10:55 PM on October 28, 2016 [27 favorites]


This isn't a legal issue and it is not a security issue and is not prohibit by law. It is an issue of practicality. At the time, Clinton figured that using one account would simplify her communications. But in the long run it complicated them because she did not anticipate the effort required to go through and separate those 60,000 emails into those business ones that should go to archives and those personal ones that should go to the bit bucket.

Or she was trying to dodge FOIA.
posted by andoatnp at 10:58 PM on October 28, 2016


Windows isn't really the problem as much as I hate to admit it. It's that good security is expensive. And the bosses, well, they won't do anything about it till a fire burns down a whole theater of people.
posted by Strange_Robinson at 11:00 PM on October 28, 2016 [13 favorites]




Or she was trying to dodge FOIA.

Curiously, Clinton is the only Secretary of State in history since the advent of email to fully comply with the FOIA and provide copies of her emails to the national archives.
posted by JackFlash at 11:07 PM on October 28, 2016 [143 favorites]


This is what the banality of evil actually looks like.

Really? Really? Allegedly improperly secured emails is what evil looks like? Come the fuck on.
posted by threeturtles at 11:13 PM on October 28, 2016 [88 favorites]


Well, allegedly improperly secured emails is certainly what banality looks like.
posted by oneswellfoop at 11:25 PM on October 28, 2016 [54 favorites]


You forgot the banal part. Obscene per capita energy use in the US would fall under the same category.
posted by Strange_Robinson at 11:29 PM on October 28, 2016


Some footage of the homeless woman defending Trump's Hollywood star getting shoved to the ground and having her signs torn up.
posted by nicolas léonard sadi carnot at 11:36 PM on October 28, 2016


This is what the banality of evil actually looks like.

"If you want a vision of the future, imagine a personal email being deleted from a server - forever."?

Or maybe. Waterboarding. Sexual assault. Voter disenfranchisement. ...
posted by sebastienbailard at 11:38 PM on October 28, 2016 [19 favorites]


Those are all great examples.
posted by Strange_Robinson at 11:44 PM on October 28, 2016


This is what the banality of evil actually looks like.

Or that time when Hills hit "Reply All" instead of "Reply." The horror... the horror.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:50 PM on October 28, 2016 [4 favorites]


Jesus. Shoving homeless women. Yeah, way to claim the moral high ground.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 12:03 AM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


"This is what the banality of evil actually looks like."

Or that time when Hills hit "Reply All" instead of "Reply." The horror... the horror.


Banalitynas of evil
posted by duffell at 12:05 AM on October 29, 2016 [10 favorites]


Oh no, the e-mail thing most certainly is a good example of the banality of evil, just not in the way that Strange_Robinson means.

This investigation is being used to aid an *actual fascist* try to take control of our government and gut it from the inside. That's some straight up Nazi hijinks, as far as I'm concerned.

The media's complicity in this counts too. They could be talking about climate change, but no: it's fucking e-mails. They could be talking about the rise in hate crimes, but no: fucking e-mails. In less flattering news, they could be talking about the pipeline and Hillary's poor response, but no: fucking e-mails. E-mails and more e-mails instead of *anything* of substance.

That is absolutely one form banal evil can take: hyperfocus on pointless minutiae when actual horrors are occurring. And yes, the e-mails? Minutiae. Pointless. Both in this instance, and frankly? Generally. People getting all wide eyed about this strike me as painfully naive: 'obstructive IT department versus people attempting to work on a schedule' is a classic tale with no good ending that many of us have experienced. Prosecuting Colin Powell for this would have been stupid too, IMO.

I'm mostly sorry that the people who said she couldn't have a secure Blackberry were not simply fired one by one until someone said yes, and I feel it's long past time Comey was out on his fucking ass.
posted by mordax at 12:11 AM on October 29, 2016 [133 favorites]


WaPo: American Bar Association to publish controversial report on Trump being a ‘libel bully’

Story covers the back and forth on publishing/not publishing, and provides direct link to the article in question on Media Law.org
posted by valetta at 12:20 AM on October 29, 2016 [8 favorites]


(This thread is too fresh to be Godwin'ed already. Maybe if we turned it off and back on again?)
posted by RedOrGreen at 12:20 AM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


I was strictly thinking the cool acceptance of corrupt leadership, I admit. To me, this whole election looks like the exceptional evil versus the banal evil. I really am sick of the lesser of two evils nature of US politics these days.

I like your version much better though.
posted by Strange_Robinson at 12:21 AM on October 29, 2016


Don't even get me started on how much I despise Hamilton. How the grandfather of Wall Street gets made a hero these days boggles the mind. Every time it comes up, I have visions of Springtime with Hitler.
posted by Strange_Robinson at 12:29 AM on October 29, 2016 [11 favorites]


Is it even possible to Godwin any thread about Trump running for President?
posted by Sara C. at 12:34 AM on October 29, 2016 [16 favorites]


Sara C., I think it's only appropriate to.
posted by msalt at 12:36 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


the lesser of two evils nature of US politics these days
Honestly, that's been the nature of US politics 'on-and-off' for most of our history (and more often 'on'). And we certainly haven't always picked the lesser. So you try to choose your battles for the ones that are winnable and cry yourself to sleep over the ones that aren't.
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:37 AM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


Did anyone see that video of the homeless trump supporter getting harassed next to his hollywood star? I wish I hadn't watched it but it's par for the course for this fucking goddamn election. After voting today, I really wanted to pretend this thing was over but my god what a trainwreck.
posted by R.F.Simpson at 12:42 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Starting to get nervous about Clinton's numbers on 538. 80% isn't a remotely comfortable probability for me.

So, if it's comfort you want, look at the half dozen other reputable people doing stats journalism who give a higher percentage. Nate Silver (a) isn't a fucking seer and (b) (reading between the lines slightly) has calibrated his assumptions about the possibility of polling error in such a way that it's incredibly hard for his model to go above 90% for either candidate. While he dances around it a fair bit, this passage is telling "Most other models also assume that state-by-state outcomes are correlated to some degree, but based on their probability distributions, FiveThirtyEight’s seem to be more emphatic about this assumption, accounting for both the possibility a significant national polling error and other types of correlations, such as between states in different regions".

You're never going to get comfort from 538. Their model is far too cautious about polls for that.

But as I've said, Silver isn't magic, he doesn't know anything the other reputable people doing analysis don't. He is just one person with a model that has shown some success, among other comparatively successful models.
posted by howfar at 12:43 AM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


Don't even get me started on how much I despise Hamilton

WEEHAWKEN. DAWN. GUNS. DRAWN.
posted by corb at 12:43 AM on October 29, 2016 [49 favorites]


Didn't that turn out badly the first time?
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:47 AM on October 29, 2016 [18 favorites]


I was strictly thinking the cool acceptance of corrupt leadership, I admit.

I understand. I wouldn't characterize anybody as coolly accepting what's going on right now though - the one constant this election season is that everybody's brimming with rage and despair, we're just having some very heated differences of opinion about what we should be upset about and what we should do to fix it.

I think it may just look that way because what counts as corruption is a subjective judgment, so things that really sting to you are being shrugged off by a lot of people, while they're watching you do the same for their frustrations.

Upon preview, because I comment too slow for these threads:

Is it even possible to Godwin any thread about Trump running for President?

Not in a way that invalidates the thread, no. When honest to goodness fascists are about, it's an appropriate comparison to make.

Did anyone see that video of the homeless trump supporter getting harassed next to his hollywood star?

That's awful. :(
posted by mordax at 12:49 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


As brief respite from rage & despair may I offer FYA (For Your Amusement) two posts from Democratic Underground:
1. Fishing With James Comey On Hillary Pond
2. "When Your Stupid Twitter Poll Backfires & You Trigger Yourself"
posted by valetta at 12:58 AM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Don't even get me started on how much I despise Hamilton.

Back in college in 1998, I went to see Atari Teenage Riot. For some reason, there were some very preppy & drunk polisci majors at the bar. Have no idea why they were there since ATR wouldn't be their thing at all. Anyways, Alec Empire (lead singer/songwriter of ATR) was going off on a rant between songs. Ended with "Fuck the police! Fuck the government! Fuck capitalism!!!" The polisci guys were deeply amused. At the end of the "fucks", one of them yelled "You got it maaannn! Fuck Alexander Hamilton!"
posted by honestcoyote at 12:58 AM on October 29, 2016 [19 favorites]


"the lesser of two evils nature of US politics these days"
Honestly, that's been the nature of US politics 'on-and-off' for most of our history


That's been the nature of human beings for all of human history. Some people are less evil than others, but nobody is perfect. All the Clinton "scandals" are just stones being cast by those who are not without sin themselves.
posted by OnceUponATime at 12:59 AM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


I'm not really looking for pure. What I would like are higher standards. At least Huey Long, you know, not Gordon Gekko
posted by Strange_Robinson at 1:30 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


> Don't even get me started on how much I despise Hamilton. How the grandfather of Wall Street gets made a hero these days boggles the mind. Every time it comes up, I have visions of Springtime with Hitler.

To be fair, though, Hamilton as portrayed by LMM isn't a hero, not exactly, but sort of an enterprising jackass. He only looks like a hero because "enterprising jackass" describes most of the other American founders as well.

I find myself shouting "counterrevolution! the constitutional convention was a counterrevolution!" during the bits about the federalist papers. And "WRONG SIDE YOU'RE ON THE WRONG SIDE SHUT UP HAMILTON" during the cabinet debate about whether to support France.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:41 AM on October 29, 2016 [25 favorites]


As far as I can tell if the standards were any higher, there literally wouldn't be anyone available to take the job. Or should we just start in the Senate and go down the list of All Americans until we get to the first person who has hasn't ever made any of the mistakes listed on the criteria sheet? (Of course every time you find a person their specific past mistakes get added to the sheet for next time, as we've seen with the email server thing.)
posted by threeturtles at 2:41 AM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


One day we will find a true Scotsman politician*. In the meantime, there is a lot of shit to get done.

* Applies only to Democrats; the Republican base is aroused by petty meanness, racist jingoism, criminal misconduct, rapey misogyny, and general malfeasance, so good luck there.
posted by maxwelton at 3:10 AM on October 29, 2016 [20 favorites]


Eric Alva, an Iraq War veteran and former national spokesperson for the Human Rights Campaign, has posted this to Facebook:
The organization I once stood behind as their "National Spokesperson," has lost my trust and I want a divorce. You are so wrong on this, as an organization and as a President Chad. Last year I was awarded the Chuck Jordan Award for all the work I did with HRC and other communities. I honor Chucks memory every day but I will NOT attend another single HRC event til you earn my trust again. Until then we are done !!!!

Tammy Duckworth is a fellow Purple Heart Receipent and for you to allow and stand by Senator Kirk to treat her with these racist comments. You are no better then him or Donald Trump !!!
A LOT of former staff and volunteers--and current donors--in the comments to that one, echoing his dismay and similarly announcing their "divorce" from HRC.
posted by duffell at 3:28 AM on October 29, 2016 [43 favorites]


Pretty sure it's not Godwining when it's an actual white supremacist fascist madman.
posted by chris24 at 4:23 AM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


Or she was trying to dodge FOIA.

Since they were coming from state, they're in the sender's account. And if it's outlook, on exchange.

Good luck trying to dodge FOIA with that going on.
posted by mikelieman at 4:29 AM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


Hamilton is such a New York City story (past and present) that of course it's in love with Wall Street. In the battle between banks and slaveholders, banks look like the good guys. Nobody was actually looking out for the repressed.
posted by rikschell at 4:29 AM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


Don't even get me started on how much I despise Hamilton. How the grandfather of Wall Street gets made a hero these days boggles the mind. Every time it comes up, I have visions of Springtime with Hitler.

I'm in the "Burr should have done it the first time he had cause to demand satisfaction from Hamilton" camp, Tempered by Burr founding the core of Chase-Manhattan Bank. Overall, I'd buy Burr a drink.
posted by mikelieman at 4:38 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


I've always thought of HRC as being the organization for people who wanted to show their support of equality by putting the world's smallest bumper sticker on their car.

I've always thought of opposition or even lukewarm support to HRC on the grounds of equality as being the approach for people who think that the only thing you should be measured by in terms of your activism is what size bumper sticker you put on your car.

And not on whether you were e.g. an AIDS activist before it was cool and whether you had overseen a large step forward in domestic trans rights even while your job was supposed to be foreign affairs.
posted by Francis at 4:40 AM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


Or she was trying to dodge FOIA.

Requesting a secure Blackberry first is a weird way to do that.
posted by chris24 at 4:41 AM on October 29, 2016 [42 favorites]


Francis, the "HRC" Halloween Jack was referring to is the Human Rights Campaign, not Hillary Rodham Clinton.
posted by J.K. Seazer at 4:42 AM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


Francis, Human Rights Campaign ≠ Hillary Rodham Clinton.

Can we all just agree to spell out HRC (at least in first use) in our comments rather than using the acronym?
posted by duffell at 4:43 AM on October 29, 2016 [15 favorites]


@jelani9:
Not content to destroy his career and his marriage, Anthony Weiner's pervy fixations may now imperil democracy itself. Aim high, I suppose.
posted by chris24 at 4:53 AM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


This too will pass, and there will be a Madam President of the US.

But man, Comey is a piece of shit. How can he not be fired already? This is so obviously against every rule in the book - again!! I know it get all the conspiracy folks up in the red if he was fired, but it just seems there should be some sort of consequence for failing so badly.
posted by mumimor at 5:02 AM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


But man, Comey is a piece of shit. How can he not be fired already?

Upthread there was this "FBI agent overheard on a plane, deconstructing the internal office politics" comment, and while I seriously doubt the 'overheard on a plane' aspect, I completely accept the "NY Office is pissed over Eric Garner thing, and forcing Comey to do this is payback" aspect.

I'd put 20 on "discrete interval after election day, Comey resigns"
posted by mikelieman at 5:06 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


And. Fucking Office Politics. Talk about "banality of evil"
posted by mikelieman at 5:07 AM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


This is what the banality of evil actually looks like."

Belatedly, banality of evil refers to a series of banal, mindless, thought-terminating cliches that lead to the fucking Holocaust, so can we not?
posted by maxsparber at 5:15 AM on October 29, 2016 [28 favorites]


"tie your server down, tie your server down
lock those hackers out of doors, we don't need them making scores
tie your server down, tie your server down
make sure we're all scandal tight ..."
posted by pyramid termite at 5:20 AM on October 29, 2016


that lead to the fucking Holocaust, so can we not?

chris24: "Pretty sure it's not Godwining when it's an actual white supremacist fascist madman."

And there is a non-zero probability that the internal office-politics at the FBI might have a material outcome on this election, where there is an actual white supremacist fascist madman running for office.

I'm a Jew. I lost family in The Holocaust. I'm fucking terrified.
posted by mikelieman at 5:20 AM on October 29, 2016 [29 favorites]


With that said, GO VOTE! We all show up and vote, and it's Hillary Rodham Clinton 73 to 27.
posted by mikelieman at 5:21 AM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


Oh, how I wish I could vote in y'alls election.
posted by Too-Ticky at 5:23 AM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


that lead to the fucking Holocaust, so can we not?

this guy's talking about deporting 11 million people - he's getting damned close
posted by pyramid termite at 5:25 AM on October 29, 2016 [49 favorites]



The thing that gets me so, so, so angry about 'The Emails' is that the only reason this is happening is because she is a Clinton and a woman with political ambitions.

We know this would not be happening to this extent if she wasn't these things because one, The Republicans themselves said they only pushed it in order to bring her down and two, other men and adminstrations have not only used private server but actually got rid of millions of emails on purpose.
And yet crickets. No outrage. No wtf were they thinking. Just oh well, that was a long time ago but hey this is a CLINTON.

Was what Clinton do with her private server wrong? Yep
Did she need to be called out for it and told not good? Yep

But all this and for month and months and months. And even when the investigation shows 'not good, but not illegal' it doesn't stop.

This is what misogyny in action looks like.
posted by Jalliah at 5:54 AM on October 29, 2016 [81 favorites]


Christ, will the e-mail thing never die? I guess it's a shame that Trumpistas and undecideds skew blue-collar, because working a desk job it's pretty easy to see IT as power-mad tinpot dictators who don't bother to differentiate between the important and unimportant, or ever justify their pronouncements.

I'm at a university, and I'm on our college's tech-and-facilities committee, and in the past year we've fielded three policy changes from IT: first, a move from encrypting only sensitive information to whole-disk encryption on personal machines; second, a baroque change in the specific number of days emails are stored and which folders they're archived in; third, an attempted (likely to be thwarted) ban on personal printers. The first almost certainly enhances security for people who are bad at keeping their data organized, the second might be related to some FOIA issues but I really don't know, and the third is a naked power grab (IT gets no budget for print jobs which don't go to their printers). But we don't bother to differentiate these, and people work around them all the time. Any given act of resistance could be anything from a FERPA violation down to a harmless "fuck you" to our administration, and not telling us what's important leads a lot of folks to dismiss everything IT says as just getting up people's noses because they can. Talking to friends in the "real world", I get the impression corporate IT is not much better, and I doubt government is either.

The whole private-server/government-server thing is irrelevant from a security standpoint (if you are sending or storing secret data unencrypted on Internet-connected machines, you have already failed and it doesn't make a damn bit of difference who's running the server), which means it rises at best to the level of policy violation and is pretty easy for anyone who's dealt with IT pronunciamentos before to shrug at and try to find a workaround for.
posted by jackbishop at 6:03 AM on October 29, 2016 [26 favorites]


third is a naked power grab

Printers are a pretty common network attack vector as they often run old, unpatched firmware/operating systems. Imagine, in this world where important, older, higher ups and their secretarial staff still print out so many emails, what you could get from watching what passes through a printer.
posted by dis_integration at 6:08 AM on October 29, 2016 [11 favorites]


Clinton leads Trump 42 to 36 percent as he loses women's support ...
Reuters-15 hours ago

Emerson Polls Show Razor Thin Race Between Trump, Clinton in ...
Breitbart News-12 hours ago


Something something horserace bullshit Nate Silver is a punk. Robble robble.
posted by petebest at 6:08 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Yeah, I was working with a friend and colleague, and she asked if I could find a document in a mail she sent me some time ago. I rummage in my mail box, and then reply: "no, it's from that time when I lost a years worth of mails because of something IT did while updating the server, don't you remember?", she goes, "oh yes, that's how I lost it too".
Then we shift to gossiping and talking about the election, and she is all for Hillary, except, she says: "there is something fishy about those emails". I just look at her and we both laugh out loud.
posted by mumimor at 6:14 AM on October 29, 2016 [47 favorites]


When the first Veritas tapes came out, I wondered if Mrs Clinton would make a public denunciation of the kind of tactics Foval et al engaged in. Tricky call - doing so would on the one hand would take the high ground, but it would also bring more attention to such tactics, throw those soldiers under the bus, and possibly discourage other free lancers from doing whatever it took to win this motherfucker.

With the video of anti-Trumpers beating up a little old black lady vagrant, she's kind of lost the opportunity.

Less visceral but also interesting is the audio tape of her suggesting the US should intervene in other country's elections. Old, true, but still, it does add fuel to those who talk about stolen elections.

Whether any of this (or if Assange's or Kim's or O'Keefe's promised updates) have any effect remains to be seen. True believers and good haters on both sides tend to forgive a lot, and ignore a lot, and focus on trivia.
posted by IndigoJones at 6:21 AM on October 29, 2016


Your company's IT staff are not responsible for the vast majority of the decision-making you see coming down from on high- it's mostly either "somebody above us demands this", "compliance with various laws and regulations demands this", or "this is necessary to secure/fix something because somebody above/below us won't otherwise stop doing this thing that endangers/disables the system". IT would love to sit back, read Reddit, and click Next to apply patches. They're not messing with you for the fun of it.
posted by Pope Guilty at 6:23 AM on October 29, 2016 [24 favorites]


today's electoral map
posted by farlukar at 6:34 AM on October 29, 2016 [20 favorites]


When mom/dad acts like the rules don't count for them, the kids learn to be the same way.

Doesn't the email leak include Chelsea Clinton chewing out Bill for even just the appearance of impropriety?
posted by srboisvert at 6:37 AM on October 29, 2016 [15 favorites]


[A couple deleted. Let's not have a big derail on if the homeless woman Trump star thing seems like it was / wasn't staged. If there's more actual info from reliable sources, links are fine.]
posted by taz at 6:43 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


When the first Veritas tapes came out,

Am I the only IT guy who had to read this twice?
posted by mikelieman at 6:44 AM on October 29, 2016 [16 favorites]


They're not messing with you for the fun of it.

Unless it's New Head Of IT With Their Own Way Of Doing Things, or A Deal To Use Tech So Bad There's Either Massive Corruption, Massive Stupidity, Or Both. Or 'You can have safe, or you can have useful. Pick one' (which usually ends up neither - vide HRC).

Frankly, I doubt most organisations then or now would survive an aggressive security audit. As was said upthread - the only way this could be worse for Hillary would be if some evidence of actual wrongdoing emerged.
posted by Devonian at 6:47 AM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]




October 27, 2016 - Clinton Catches Trump For Ties In Georgia, Iowa; She's Up In North Carolina And Running Away In Virginia Quinnipiac University Swing State Poll Finds Quinnipiac

GEORGIA: Trump 44 - Clinton 43, Johnson 8
IOWA: Clinton 44 - Trump 44, Johnson 4
NORTH CAROLINA: Clinton 47 - Trump 43, Johnson 5
VIRGINIA: Clinton 50 - Trump 38, Johnson 4

posted by petebest at 6:50 AM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Can we all just agree to spell out HRC (at least in first use) in our comments rather than using the acronym?

Or think twice about using acronyms at all, except in truly obvious cases? I don't spend a lot of time on politically focused discussion groups or Political Twitter or whathaveyou and as a result there are quite a few comments in these threads that are completely content free for me since somebody couldn't be bothered to type an extra 10 or 12 letters when punching in a comment. I mean, I know that those are some of the most plugged-in people here and I am grateful that their contributions to these threads are super-informative -- but they could be even more so if they committed to making themselves absolutely clear for non political junkies like me.
posted by Mothlight at 6:50 AM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


I doubt most organisations then or now would survive an aggressive security audit.

I have, oh, 30 years of IT security auditing experience, although since college I've only worn a White Hat, and I can say that in my professional opinion that most organizations would not survive any sort of security audit more intensive than say, signing off on PCI compliance.

An unnamed client JUST IMPLEMENTED encryption for emailing credit card transactions. Good on them, I guess...
posted by mikelieman at 6:51 AM on October 29, 2016 [12 favorites]


The email thing reminds me of when my car had been broken into. Nothing of real worth was stolen. The worst thing was the shattered side window. So I took it in to get repaired, paid the money, and moved on with my life. One thing I discovered, though, was that those tiny pieces of shattered window glass get everywhere, and it seemed like every two or three weeks I was finding little bits of glass when I thought I had cleaned them all up.

Republicans keep finding those little shards and get angry all over again even though the root cause was finished and done with a looooong time ago.

There. I found the perfect metaphor. Now I'm going into hibernation until this shit storm is over. G'night, folks!
posted by AlonzoMosleyFBI at 6:59 AM on October 29, 2016 [83 favorites]


JAMES COMEY BROKE WITH LORETTA LYNCH AND JUSTICE DEPARTMENT TRADITION

Comey was more concerned about remaining in good standing with Republicans than actually influencing the election. Josh Marshall saying Comey may have even been pressured by Chafettz to write Congress. If that's what happened, he has to be gone, after the election even. Even if he didn't bow to explicit pressure, a President Clinton cannot keep him. The most charitable interpretation is he broke with longstanding policy and the Attorney General out of naive recklessness. The other reading is he was pressured by Republican congressmen to influence the election, and did so. Either is disqualifying.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:00 AM on October 29, 2016 [37 favorites]


The emails seem really trivial to me given that the last Republican administration:

1: Falsified intelligence to support a war.
2. Outed a CIA operative to a reporter as political retribution.
3. Intentionally destroyed records to get around record-keeping obligations.
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 7:02 AM on October 29, 2016 [53 favorites]


given that the last Republican administration:

Doesn't count, IOKIYAR.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:03 AM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


The emails seem really trivial to me given that the last Republican administration:

That list doesn't even get us started. The Bush Admin was a regime of torture, for gods sake. Not to mention AG Gonzalez's use of the justice department as a political arm. And Scooter Libby? And on, and on, and on. The Bush Admin was a cornucopia of prosecutable scandals and somehow W just gee-whiz aww-shucksed his way into a retirement of acrylics and ranching. If the media and the congress had the same scale of outrage over Bush's problem as they do over this incredibly insignificant Clinton scandal, we would've been at a constant DEFCON 9000 RED ALERT status with Drudge's page nothing but a hamster-dance wall of siren gifs. I just don't get it. I mean, I get it, politricks and all, but I don't get it.
posted by dis_integration at 7:12 AM on October 29, 2016 [38 favorites]


Doesn't count, IOKIYAR.

I was going to post a link to Elizabeth de la Varga's excellent mock-indictment of Bush, Cheney, Rice, Rumsfeld, Powell, et. al. for violating 18 USC 371 but then outrage fatigue set in.
posted by mikelieman at 7:12 AM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


And on, and on, and on.

And a special "FUCK YOU" to John Woo...
posted by mikelieman at 7:13 AM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


An unnamed client JUST IMPLEMENTED encryption for emailing credit card transactions. Good on them, I guess...

You just reminded me of the time back in the late 90s/early 2000s when I was looking over a client's code that I was having to update. In it, in a system that was handling some pretty sensitive data, someone had hand-rolled his own encryption algorithm. I didn't spend too long looking at it because I was working on a different piece, but I seem to remember it wasn't a whole lot better than a Caesar shift.
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 7:15 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


And a special "FUCK YOU" to John Woo...

Face Off was certainly a prosecutable offense, but this might be a little hard on John Woo.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:18 AM on October 29, 2016 [33 favorites]


Face Off was certainly a prosecutable offense, but this might be a little hard on John Woo.

Indeed. John Yoo is the piece of shit I meant to denounce. My bad.
posted by mikelieman at 7:20 AM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


And a special "FUCK YOU" to John Woo...

Errrrr do you mean John Yoo?
posted by Talez at 7:20 AM on October 29, 2016


Meanwhile, total Clinton endorsements from newspapers, magazines, and periodicals now number 320. These include 71 with a circulation of 100,000 or greater, 43 that endorsed Mitt Romney four years ago, and many, many instantly recognizable names such as The New York Times, The Los Angeles Times, The Houston Chronicle, The Washington Post, The San Jose Mercury News, The Boston Globe, The New Yorker, Vogue, and Wired.

Donald Trump has 7 endorsements, only one of which (the Sheldon Adelson-owned Las Vegas Review-Journal) has a circulation above 100,000. To get to those 7 endorsements, it is necessary to include such papers as the Antelope Valley Press, The Hillsboro Ohio Times-Gazette, and the Waxahachie Daily Light.

This is in contrast to the 16 periodicals that have endorsed "anybody but Donald Trump", which includes USA Today (circulation 3,866,000), The Fort-Worth Star Telegram (circulation 298,000), and the Deseret News (circulation 102,000). While Trump has finally exceeded the number of endorsements for Gary Johnson, which come in at 6, Johnson has gotten endorsements from three newspapers with a circulation above 100,000 and the combined circulation of the publications endorsing Johnson beat those endorsing Trump by a factor of about 3 to 1.
posted by kyrademon at 7:25 AM on October 29, 2016 [38 favorites]


Police to interview Hollywood star woman

The videotape prompted headlines on conservative news sites, such as Breitbart News, and several calls to police asking why they did not intervene. LAPD Officer Tony Im said Friday that police would write up a misdemeanor battery report on behalf of the woman, using the video and information they obtained from her at another confrontation in Hollywood on Wednesday.

On that day, Im said, the woman also incited the crowd with what he called racial slurs. Police from the Hollywood station went to the scene and “kept the peace,” he said.


Police took down her name and Los Angeles address at the time, but Im did not have the information available for release. He said police would visit the address she gave to interview her.


[Emphasis added]
posted by petebest at 7:27 AM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


From Hillary's Facebook page: "One day I can be president, too."
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:42 AM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Early voting report in Florida. No wait, in and out in 10 minutes since we pretty much memorized the ballot this week. One lone woman dressed in black and pink with a pink boa and cowboy hat holding a "Women for Trump" sign said hi to us as we walked in. Our county has early voting at all public libraries 7a-7p 7 days a week from 10/24 though 11/6.

Afterwards, we went to donate blood (apparently it was civic duty day in the Holly house) and the young woman checking my vitals asked me about my "I Voted" sticker. She had no idea we had early voting and said she didn't think she was going to vote since "they're going to elect who they want anyway" (I wasn't sure who "they" were), but I told her that while it probably seems that way, this election was super super important. That led to a conversation that ended with her checking her registration status on my phone, taking the sample ballot I had in the car along with my name and number and all the early voting info. She's all in for Hillary and voting this afternoon after work!
posted by hollygoheavy at 7:47 AM on October 29, 2016 [182 favorites]


Greater Boston MA and Trump supporters are out in force on the main corner in town. Good to see the most liberal places in the nation aren't immune to these fascist fucks.
posted by Talez at 7:50 AM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


Greg Sargent: This is how GOP hype-ahead-of-the-facts gets rewarded by media's willful perpetuation of smoke/fire effect. Zero penalty. Only upside.

More Sargent: James Comey needs to clean up his mess.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:53 AM on October 29, 2016 [11 favorites]


Gabriel Sherman on the final days of the Trump Campaign includes this charming quote:
When I asked one senior Trump adviser to describe the scene inside, he responded: “Think of the bunker right before Hitler killed himself. Donald’s in denial. They’re all in denial.”
Campaign 101: Maybe don't compare your candidate to Hitler even when everyone else is comparing your candidate to Hitler.
posted by acidic at 8:08 AM on October 29, 2016 [153 favorites]


Talez, I'm metro west, and I too am surprised by the number of affirmative Trump signs/bumper stickers I see. Though most of what I see though is anti-Hillary rather than pro-Trump. There's a huge banner on a neighborhood arterial at the Brookline/Newton line saying "Hillary for Prison"; I was yelled at in the parking lot of my town's library, on the very day that I put a Hillary bumper sticker on my car, by a dude practically foaming at the mouth about Benghazi.

Also, a neighbor down the street who I'm linked to on FB has been increasingly sharing conspiracy-minded anti-Hillary stuff, like those ridiculous "expose" videos. That latter one is mystifying to me--the guy seems smart and grounded and all, and it's like, you can't critically assess the source, dude?
posted by Sublimity at 8:09 AM on October 29, 2016


Final Days
Trump’s advisers are working hard to plan their own futures while riding out the roller-coaster end of the campaign.
...
To hear Kellyanne Conway talk about managing her boss is to listen to a mother of four who has had ample experience with unruly toddlers. Instead of criticizing Trump’s angry tweets, for instance, she suggested that he also include a few positive ones. “You had these people saying, ‘Delete the app! Stop tweeting!’ ” she recalled. “I would say, ‘Here are a couple of cool things we should tweet today.’ It’s like saying to someone, ‘How about having two brownies and not six?’”
posted by kirkaracha at 8:10 AM on October 29, 2016 [22 favorites]


Payback? Russia Gets Hacked, Revealing Putin Aide's Secrets Surprise, they're behind Ukraine after all.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:20 AM on October 29, 2016 [26 favorites]


Larry Sabato's latest has a color for "leans McMullin"
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:22 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Talez, I'm metro west, and I too am surprised by the number of affirmative Trump signs/bumper stickers I see. Though most of what I see though is anti-Hillary rather than pro-Trump. There's a huge banner on a neighborhood arterial at the Brookline/Newton line saying "Hillary for Prison"; I was yelled at in the parking lot of my town's library, on the very day that I put a Hillary bumper sticker on my car, by a dude practically foaming at the mouth about Benghazi.

The only thing that makes me feel better (aside from flipping off one of the chucklefucks in response to those "you know what's up" shibboleth style approval nods that white guys do as I drove past him) is that Trump people are standing on street corners in the 4th bluest state in the union while Hillary people are busy knocking on doors in New Hampshire.
posted by Talez at 8:25 AM on October 29, 2016 [19 favorites]


Payback? Russia Gets Hacked, Revealing Putin Aide's Secrets Surprise, they're behind Ukraine after all.

Favorited in no small part because the first line of the article is, "Karma, it turns out, is a borscht."
posted by ActingTheGoat at 8:27 AM on October 29, 2016 [25 favorites]


As a native Bostonian I don't know why y'all are surprised.Boston has always had a robust white supremacist Masshole faction.

ETA any Red Sox game.
posted by spitbull at 8:39 AM on October 29, 2016 [18 favorites]


Face Off was certainly a prosecutable offense,

Pistols at dawn, sir.
posted by soundguy99 at 8:40 AM on October 29, 2016 [11 favorites]


I'm in the "Burr should have done it the first time he had cause

When he suckered Hamilton into signing off on a clean-water idea that turned out to be a bank for Burr? I'm all on Hams side on that one.
posted by corb at 8:45 AM on October 29, 2016 [10 favorites]


Karma is a beet soup?
posted by Too-Ticky at 8:50 AM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


I must confess that I, regarding the current foofarah, am decidedly underwhelmed. You may now return to your collective hyperventilation.
posted by y2karl at 8:51 AM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


Pistols at dawn, sir.

Regret to inform the standard MetaFilter duel is broadswords in a pit, Abe Lincoln-style.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:53 AM on October 29, 2016 [18 favorites]


My job is a quasi-technical position directly in between end users and central IT. It's infuriating from both sides, and at the same time I see both sides' points. Our users are by and large not technical people. Many are brilliant, experts in their fields, way smarter than I will ever be, but they don't know shit about computers, they just want them to work the way they need them to. On the other side, IT is tasked with herding a tremendous amount of cats, whenever anything goes wrong they get blamed even if it had nothing to do with them, and when things go right, it's invisible and no one thanks them. The central IT leadership seems to have responded to this state of affairs by turning the department into a heavily armed silo.If they tell you anything about their internal decision-making processes, they have to kill you. They won't even share an org chart, so no one has any idea who is actually in charge of what. And when it comes to security, they have basically decided that the answer is no before anyone has even asked the question. Which makes it hard to do my job of introducing new technology to end users that help them solve their problems, or in cases where users have already identified what they need, getting that tool integrated into our infrastructure.

So, my view of the emails is that they're a symptom of the same war between the technical and non-technical staff that many large, diffuse organizations have. And you better bet that there are different rules for me vs. a provost where I work when it comes to dealing with this particular battleground and skirting various best practices.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:54 AM on October 29, 2016 [45 favorites]


Karma is a dish best served cold.
posted by mazola at 9:01 AM on October 29, 2016 [16 favorites]


Campaign 101: Maybe don't compare your candidate to Hitler even when everyone else is comparing your candidate to Hitler.

Heh. The NY Mag piece conjured up a vision of Trump as a latter-day Enver Hoxha mashup:

Trump: "We need more bunkers. I'm gonna build so many bunkers. Russia is better at bunkers. They have new bunkers. Our bunkers are old. We are old at bunkers." [fake, probably, but there's more than a week to go here]
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 9:02 AM on October 29, 2016


@NormOrnstein
Reading Comey's defensive apologia leaves me even more outraged. He violated his agency's own procedures to ingratiate himself w/ FBI agents
posted by chris24 at 9:07 AM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]



My mom, who is a lawyer, just told me that she attended the training be a voters' rights protection volunteer, assigned to a polling place on election day. Because she lives in one of the cities in Ohio that has been mentioned as a possible target for voter intimidation by open-carry Trump supporters, the stakes are very high.

I'm often very proud of my mom, a lefty liberal who went into corporate law in the '80s to support her family, instead of legal aid, like she wanted. I have never been prouder of her than I am today.


Hey. that's cool, my Mom is also a lawyer in Ohio who's attending that training and... and... oh. And that's how I found out my sister was a mefite!
posted by longtime_lurker at 9:11 AM on October 29, 2016 [302 favorites]


The central IT leadership seems to have responded to this state of affairs by turning the department into a heavily armed silo

This is my experience with security-related departments of all flavors (IT, physical security, AT/FP, etc.) You can't ask them for help. You have to ask your own chain of command, all the way up to director level. Once you can get a top-down directive from the security director, prompted by agreement with his/her peers, for IT to "see what they can do to make X happen for ctmf", that's when you can maybe get something done.

Strangely enough, the branch of security-world that seems to be the easiest to work with is classifying authorities. If I want to take a fragment of some large classified document and do something unclassified with it, they have been very helpful in promptly either authorizing my piece as fine or helping me achieve my goal in a different way.
posted by ctmf at 9:18 AM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


I am in the organic bread place. There is a heavy guy, maybe 55, maybe 65 in ill health. He is white, shopping the day old stuff, drops his wallet, and complains of sciatica.
I say, "Oh something, something, sympathetic."
He says, "I can't hear you, wearing earbuds and listening to Alex Jones."
I say, "Oh I am sorry."
He says, "Oh it is just comedy to me."
I ask, "Did you vote?"
He says, "Yes, I voted for Trump."
I say, "Oh I am sorry. I voted for Hillary."
He says, "It's OK, as long as you voted."
posted by Oyéah at 9:22 AM on October 29, 2016 [17 favorites]


I bake my own bread
posted by Namlit at 9:25 AM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


The takeaway is Trump empowers him theoretically, and Hillary empowers me in reality.
posted by Oyéah at 9:26 AM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


I usually bake my own bread too, but I don't have a good sourdough starter right now, and that is the flavor of the fall. So. Sorry to digress.
posted by Oyéah at 9:27 AM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


Early voting report, Humboldt Park, Chicago:

This was my first time early voting and I thought I would miss the pomp and circumstance of voting on election day, but I really didn't! There was a short (5-10 people) but steady line. Poll workers were organized and friendly, and everyone seemed to be in a good mood. Multiple spanish-speaking poll workers and definitely lots of Latinx voters. (Not surprising in a traditionally Puerto Rican neighborhood, but still nice to see.) A daughter was helping her spanish-speaking parents vote next to me. I overheard one of them say in Spanish what I think was "the President is the important one, right?" A white couple had their two little girls with them.

It was also the first time I've used the electronic ballot, and it seems to work pretty well. You can use your finger but the poll workers were recommending the stylus as it was easier. You confirm your choices at the end on the screen and then again as a paper receipt with all your selections printed out. I'm glad I had a paper copy of my sample ballot & all my notes with me, because there was zero cell service in the library. So if I had been counting on looking things up online on my phone I would have been SOL.
posted by misskaz at 9:27 AM on October 29, 2016 [18 favorites]


Boston has always had a robust white supremacist Masshole faction.

WEEI is Radio Masshole.

[Comey] violated his agency's own procedures to ingratiate himself w/ FBI agents

I think about how NBC's Pete Williams does his job behind the scenes, since he is an excellent and respected reporter. Is the problem here that the FBI operates by making cryptic public statements, then briefing anonymously from the top once the horse has bolted because people like Williams are trusted to do the explaining? Or is it that there's a culture of leaking from further down and fighting turf wars through friendly journos and sympathetic pols, as other reporting suggests?

Probably a mixture of both: no matter what, it comes across as a politically-conservative (because law! and! order!) culture of blabbermouths, similar to how the NY tabloids have an iffy co-dependent relationship with the NYPD, and this isn't a new thing at all.
posted by holgate at 9:31 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Robert Reich:
Yesterday I spoke with a former Republican member of Congress whom I’ve known for years.
Me: What do you think of your party’s nominee for president?
He: Trump is a maniac. He’s a clear and present danger to America.
Me: Have you said publicly that you won’t vote for him?
He (sheepishly): No.
Me: Why not?
He: I’m a coward.
Me: What do you mean?
He: I live in a state with a lot of Trump voters. Most Republican officials do.
Me: But you’re a former official. You're not running for Congress again. What are you afraid of?
He: I hate to admit it, but I’m afraid of them. Some of those Trumpistas are out of their fu*king minds.
Me: You mean you’re afraid for your own physical safety?
He: All it takes is one of them, you know.
Me: Wait a minute. Isn’t this how dictators and fascists have come to power in other nations? Respected leaders don’t dare take a stand.
He: At least I’m no Giuliani or Gingrich or Pence. I’m not a Trump enabler.
Me: I’ll give you that.
He: Let me tell you something. Most current and former Republican members of Congress are exactly like me. I talk with them. They think Trump is deplorable. And they think Giuliani and Gingrich are almost as bad. But they’re not gonna speak out. Some don’t want to end their political careers. Most don’t want to risk their lives. The Trump crowd is just too dangerous. Trump has whipped them up into a g*ddamn frenzy.
posted by gwint at 9:35 AM on October 29, 2016 [166 favorites]


"To hear Kellyanne Conway talk about managing her boss is to listen to a mother of four who has had ample experience with unruly toddlers."

I am thrilled to see the strides women have been able to make in the political arena during my lifetime, but a) it's not nearly enough and b) they still need to spend much too much time cleaning up after child-men who have been allowed to stay in this perpetual adolescence (if that) because they know that women have been conditioned to clean up their messes.

I wish I knew whether all this astoundingly blatant sexism would result in more people recognizing the degree of double standards and retrograde gender assumptions that women deal with on a regular basis instead of insisting that we got rid of sexism when women entered the workforce and got to wear pants and IUDs (you know, around the same time we ended racism?)

Or if its just going nudge the Overton window that much further to right, until we're nostalgic for the days of dog whistling instead of face-screaming abuse.

I don't know about the rest of you, but this election season is making me depressed as all fuck.
posted by bibliowench at 9:37 AM on October 29, 2016 [16 favorites]


I early voted in North Carolina yesterday. The site was surprisingly busy - probably 20 people voting and in line. I got in a little trouble for using my phone to look at a voters' guide (I need it to know which judges to vote for), but I gave the poll worker my best no nonsense attitude and he backed off. So yeah, bring a printout, for a variety of reasons.
posted by jeoc at 9:37 AM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]




"Final Days" article: As Bloomberg Businessweek recently reported, Trump’s son-in-law–cum–de facto campaign manager Jared Kushner is building a proprietary database of some 14 million email addresses and credit-card numbers of Trump supporters. That list could form the foundation of a new Trump media company. According to one Republican briefed on the talks, Kushner has approached Wall Street bankers and pitched ideas for media start-ups. “How do we monetize this?” he’s asked.

A deplorable frenzy tv.
posted by petebest at 9:43 AM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Early voting at my site in Boston yesterday was insane, hundreds of people in line and an hour wait in cold drizzle the entire time the station was open. This may be partly due to the fact that this is MA's first foray into early voting and they need to work out some kinks. And of course, there are no competitive races to vote on anyway apart from ballot questions, but still, enthusiasm around here seems very high.

The line was long enough for people to be legally (I guess) electioneering at the end of it. The Stein guy was pretty aggressively annoying.
posted by Turd Ferguson at 9:45 AM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


And whats with the separated-at-birth thing with Comey and Ashcroft?

He doesn't sing does he?
posted by petebest at 9:47 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]




That list of Trump folks is going to be a target for a lot of hackers.
posted by humanfont at 9:49 AM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


It's so weird hearing about long lines for elections. I don't think I've ever waited more than 10 minutes to vote even on election day, here in the SF Bay Area. That includes very rural polling places in the Santa Cruz mountains to downtown San Francisco.
posted by ryanrs at 9:50 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


I worked a polling place, a line that made a large serpentine s-curve thing, to shelter voters indoors, and then snaked out doors. This happens at rush hour on election day, and lunch hour.
posted by Oyéah at 9:55 AM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


GOTV canvassing report from NH:

People are still super excited and ready to vote for Hillary; most were just worried about long lines on election day (no early voting), and annoyed at Comey. Also, *tons* of volunteers out today--two weeks ago was a big bump up from the week before that, and today was close to double. That combined with town business trick-or-treating made the campaign HQ a mob scene.

Also, we got to see/meet/hear from Sean Astin who was so emotional and fired up it was amazing.

We got this, y'all.
posted by damayanti at 9:57 AM on October 29, 2016 [39 favorites]




Who could have ever imagined we would have an election in which Wiener Probe would be a continuing headline? This is the Bizzaro World election. This is the unhealthy touch election.
posted by Oyéah at 10:00 AM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


I have done the thing which needed doing.

Clear skies in Austin, Temperate weather, no wait whatsoever at the Howson Library on Exposition blvd. Austinites GO DO THE THING NOW! Vote!
posted by Devils Rancher at 10:04 AM on October 29, 2016 [20 favorites]




I had to check out of the thread last night, the anxiety was too much for me.

This weekend, Mr Sunny and I will print out our sample ballots and go vote. No better way to feel better!
posted by annsunny at 10:12 AM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


He: Let me tell you something. Most current and former Republican members of Congress are exactly like me. I talk with them. They think Trump is deplorable. And they think Giuliani and Gingrich are almost as bad. But they’re not gonna speak out. Some don’t want to end their political careers. Most don’t want to risk their lives. The Trump crowd is just too dangerous. Trump has whipped them up into a g*ddamn frenzy.

Yeah, Trump whipped them up. Not y'all dancing around Obama being a citizen or not. Not y'all demonizing Clinton to an absurd degree. Not y'all making absolute obstruction the order of the day. Not y'all putting Trey Fucking Gowdy in charge of stuff. Not y'all indulging every worst whim of the tea party crowd, standing up in public and saying dumbass bullshit you know is false but don't care because just barely enough of your supporters lap it up.

Yeah, it was all fiiiiiine until Trump whipped them up.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 10:14 AM on October 29, 2016 [177 favorites]


That list of Trump folks is going to be a target for a lot of hackers.

That's an interesting hypothetical: what's the intellectual property status of a database of personal (but mostly public) information that you rent to other organisations? Provenance and formal authorisation obviously matters here, since if you pay for DB access, there are going to be contractual restrictions on sharing it further.

And what would be the legal ramifications for TrumpOrg if it gets hacked? Data protection laws in the US are mostly a joke, but there'd surely be class-action lawyers who'd take that on.
posted by holgate at 10:18 AM on October 29, 2016


Wife and I early voted this morning. Northeast Florida. No waiting, fairly quiet, group of Trump supporters across the street waving at people as they pulled in to the parking lot.

Got done voting, waiting for my wife outside. A twentysomething guy is waiting beside me, he's grinning at the door. His girlfriend comes out smiling, wearing a First Time Voter sticker.

"How's it feel?" he asks.
"Great!" she says.

A guy comes out a moment later, looks them up and down and smiles. "Guess I should have worn blue today, yeah?"

There's hope.
posted by Mooski at 10:20 AM on October 29, 2016 [33 favorites]


This is the unhealthy touch election.

It's more than that. It's the sexism election. It's the, I-can't-keep-my-hands-outta-my-pants election. It's the boys will be boys election. And it's no fucking surprise that a 70 year old woman is having to clean up the sticky messes of her husband, her aides husband, and her opponent.
posted by Sophie1 at 10:21 AM on October 29, 2016 [94 favorites]


ryanrs: "It's so weird hearing about long lines for elections. I don't think I've ever waited more than 10 minutes to vote even on election day, here in the SF Bay Area. That includes very rural polling places in the Santa Cruz mountains to downtown San Francisco."

Same here in PA. In thirty-four years of voting, I've never waited more than ten minutes to vote. There really should be national standards for votings places per voting population.
posted by octothorpe at 10:29 AM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


Slate has an interesting article about how tribalism will dull the effect of the email revelations. It may be wishful thinking, but I was more interested in this part:
The folk theory of American democracy is that citizens deliberate on the issues and choose a candidate. That is false. The truth, as political scientists Christopher Achen and Larry Bartels describe in Democracy for Realists: Why Elections Do Not Produce Responsive Government, is that voters are tribalistic. Their political allegiances come first, and their positions and beliefs follow. We’ve seen this with Donald Trump. Support for free trade is a longstanding belief within the GOP, but Trump is a major opponent, slamming most of the trade deals of the past 30 years. You would think that this would depress his support among Republican voters. It didn’t. Instead, those voters changed their views of trade. Their beliefs followed their affiliations, not the other way around.
posted by xyzzy at 10:36 AM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


Relax, guys, and watch this Canada Lynx getting a good scratchin'.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 10:38 AM on October 29, 2016 [70 favorites]


Now don't you feel better?
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 10:39 AM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


Cute, but I've watched this, so was slightly uneasy:

Never Turn Your Back on Big Cats

posted by mandolin conspiracy at 10:41 AM on October 29, 2016 [11 favorites]


Now don't you feel better?

As my lovely wife would say: SCHO CUTE HUGE KITTY!

(Yes, btw; I do feel better)
posted by Mooski at 10:43 AM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


Printers are a pretty common network attack vector as they often run old, unpatched firmware/operating systems. Imagine, in this world where important, older, higher ups and their secretarial staff still print out so many emails, what you could get from watching what passes through a printer.

Not very much apart from intra-office politics and risotto recipes? Hillary's server was an unclassified system. The disputed classified emails are in the single digits.
posted by ymgve at 10:45 AM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


Their beliefs followed their affiliations, not the other way around.

Not to mention their views on "character".
Can you remember that it actually was a big issue whether a candidate had smoked a joint 20 years earlier or whether he inhaled or not? Not to mention extramarital affairs. Yeah, those were quaint times...

Today it's all "so what if he has a habit of forcing himself onto women or not paying contractors."

Not sure which one is better though. I wish there was some middle ground...
posted by sour cream at 10:46 AM on October 29, 2016 [14 favorites]


Not very much apart from intra-office politics and risotto recipes? Hillary's server was an unclassified system. The disputed classified emails are in the single digits.

That post isn't specifically about Hillary's system or the State Department.
posted by Pope Guilty at 10:53 AM on October 29, 2016


To be more specific, the reason printers are a good attack vector for attacking "normal" companies is that they mostly have a single internal network where everything happens.

The State Department, and thus by extension Clinton, has SIPRnet available which shares no computers, printers or cables (Maybe not even on the same power grid?) with anything connected to the internet. Everything classified happens there, and that leaves all the "boring" unclassified stuff for the internet-connected systems.
posted by ymgve at 10:55 AM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Let me tell you something. Most current and former Republican members of Congress are exactly like me. I talk with them. They think Trump is deplorable. And they think Giuliani and Gingrich are almost as bad. But they’re not gonna speak out. Some don’t want to end their political careers. Most don’t want to risk their lives. The Trump crowd is just too dangerous. Trump has whipped them up into a g*ddamn frenzy.

...yeah. So what, you want a medal?

I mean, on the one hand, good for acknowledging your own cowardice. Not that that tiny shred of self-knowledge is worth a lot if you're not going to change your behavior in the slightest.

You're scared about your *own* physical safety? You know what I care about? The physical safety of the people who are actually standing up to Trump and his mindless horde. I care about the safety of the woman who will very likely be the next President, because you've stood by silent while she's been treated as a treasonous killer by your own party. I care about the safety of the people who will end up the targets of random violence by frustrated, angry men who hate women and minorities.

The Republican leadership can go straight to hell. They don't get any credit for being secretly appalled by Trump and doing goddamn *nothing* to take a stand against the way he's whipped up the most violent, paranoid tendencies of his followers. The real heroes of this election are the nobodies who knock on doors and make phone calls and talk to their neighbors and slap those Clinton bumper stickers on their cars. The people in this thread who have been posting about taking part in phone banking and chatting with people they know...you are doing more for the well-being of this country than the entire Republican party right now, and I have so much respect for you.
posted by Salieri at 11:02 AM on October 29, 2016 [157 favorites]


DT, currently in Golden, CO: Coloradans are going to see a double digit hike. The number is so big, I'm not even going to tell you what it is! So big!
posted by Sophie1 at 11:07 AM on October 29, 2016


OMG! This American Life just came on, topic being the impending breakup of the Republican Party and name dropped James Lileks as a Trump fan wiith a podcast. There goes a Why I can't wtf on my part. I supposed I could have guessed but still...
posted by y2karl at 11:09 AM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


Coloradans are going to see a double digit hike.

Plot twist: He means average temperature.
posted by Mooski at 11:11 AM on October 29, 2016 [18 favorites]


Also, we got to see/meet/hear from Sean Astin who was so emotional and fired up it was amazing.


Oh man! Was it like this? Or was it more like this? I could use a bit of both after the last couple days.
posted by EatTheWeak at 11:18 AM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Donald Trump Is Fulfilling His Destiny with 10 Days Left: Things are getting Biblical.
But here's the thing. For most of the campaign, Trump has been writing his own personal Revelation, but he generally has stopped at Chapter 20, when the unrighteous are judged and tossed into the lake of fire. He has his seven-headed beast (the current administration), his whore of Babylon (guess), and his four horsemen (immigration, crime, Isis, and Obamacare). They have all followed with him, as the old book puts it. But now, at the end of the campaign, he's is finishing his Revelation. He is selling them the walls of jasper and pounded gold, the place of eternal life and living water, his own New Jerusalem, undoubtedly with a large white grand piano in the lobby.
posted by homunculus at 11:19 AM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


Early voting Chicago: Toman Library

No lines, friendly staff, voting machine worked perfectly for for me, wife's was cranky but worked just fine. Mine had a stylus, hers didn't that she saw.

They had about 20 machines.

Mostly Latino voters, but that is completely expected for the area.

NO STICKERS. Just I voted braclets. Made mine big so I can wear it till Nov. 8th.
posted by AlexiaSky at 11:22 AM on October 29, 2016 [14 favorites]


Josh Marshall: As I wrote yesterday, before we knew the bulk of the information uncovered over the last 24 hours, I still do not think (though my credulity is somewhat more strained) that Comey operated out of any partisan motive. But I do think his highest priority was protecting himself and the FBI from Republican criticism. The net effect was a colossal fuck up which I fear will have profound repercussions regardless of who wins the presidency in 10 days.
posted by Chrysostom at 11:26 AM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


Well, on the bright side (I've got to find a bright side), maybe this helps tamp down the violent "EVERYTHING IS RIGGED AGAINST US" crap after she curb-stomps him on November 8.
posted by saturday_morning at 11:30 AM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


Pantsuit or a stately red dress, a la Queen Elizabeth II?

Lady Gaga meat dress, carved from the carcasses of Anthony Weiner, James Comey, and Steve Bannon
posted by ejs at 11:33 AM on October 29, 2016 [48 favorites]


Well, on the bright side (I've got to find a bright side), maybe this helps tamp down the violent "EVERYTHING IS RIGGED AGAINST US" crap after she curb-stomps him on November 8.

I mean, he accused postal workers or election officials of throwing out votes for him today, so not looking so likely.
posted by zachlipton at 11:33 AM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


For some reason, YouTube suggests me to click on the live stream of Trump's latest show. The suggestion is part of a bunch of Funny Fails videos. There's still hope, I'm saying.
posted by Namlit at 11:38 AM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


his own New Jerusalem

"We're going to build a wall, and it's going to weep like nothing you've ever seen. It will weep so hard, believe me" [fake]
posted by Room 641-A at 11:38 AM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


I mean, he accused postal workers or election officials of throwing out votes for him today, so not looking so likely.

Based on an obviously fake Twitter post

This is why [real] and [fake] tags are important, folks!
posted by ymgve at 11:39 AM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


Wow that Final Days piece linked above really is good. If you are waiting for the Behind the Scenes books to come out, go read this as an appetizer.

The big take away for me is that Trump could give two shits about his faithful followers but Kushner is slavering at the idea of making money off them. Forget the Scion range of hotels-- Ivanka is going to come out with Trump Cola and Trump Chips. Maybe a nice line of Trump guns or Trump camping gear. Definitely more MAGA wear: windbreakers, sweat pants, tank tops, and sweatshirts.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 11:44 AM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


"The polls are rigged", says white female Trump supporter after she's arrested for voter fraud...
posted by Devonian at 11:46 AM on October 29, 2016 [8 favorites]


@KellyannePolls:
Astonished by the all-out assault on Comey by Team Clinton. Suggesting he is a partisan interfering with the election is dangerous & unfair.

From the campaign that has been attacking Comey and the FBI as corrupt and part of the conspiracy against Trump since July. I will never understand people who want to give her a pass. Honestly, people doing evil for the nice paycheck are worse than true believers.
posted by chris24 at 11:46 AM on October 29, 2016 [47 favorites]


Honestly, people doing evil for the nice paycheck are worse than true believers.

She should know.
posted by Mitrovarr at 11:49 AM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


> "Support for free trade is a longstanding belief within the GOP, but Trump is a major opponent, slamming most of the trade deals of the past 30 years. You would think that this would depress his support among Republican voters. It didn’t. Instead, those voters changed their views of trade. Their beliefs followed their affiliations, not the other way around."

... No. It shows that the vast majority of Republican voters never actually gave a shit about the intricacies of trade deals one way or the other. But there are definitely "third rail" issues that voters actually vote on, which is why Trump is busy pretending he is now deeply against abortion.
posted by kyrademon at 11:53 AM on October 29, 2016 [11 favorites]


Conway isn't just doing it for the paycheck, she's been after the Clintons since the 90s.
posted by Yowser at 11:53 AM on October 29, 2016 [19 favorites]


Forget the Scion range of hotels-- Ivanka is going to come out with Trump Cola and Trump Chips. Maybe a nice line of Trump guns or Trump camping gear.

Tactical Trump flashlights and pocket knives in matte black, digital camo or genuine 24k gold plate.
posted by contraption at 11:55 AM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


I mean, on the one hand, good for acknowledging your own cowardice. Not that that tiny shred of self-knowledge is worth a lot if you're not going to change your behavior in the slightest. You're scared about your *own* physical safety?

QFT. That's a textbook violation of the agreement we make when we choose leaders. You get all the perks, glory, and decision making power. In return, you're expected to take the personal risk when it comes time to do the hard thing on our behalf. He wants the good part without paying for it.

It's exactly what Simon Sinek is talking about in the video that's been making the rounds of the leadership-training circuit. (relevant bit at about 25:00)
posted by ctmf at 11:58 AM on October 29, 2016 [15 favorites]


Conway isn't just doing it for the paycheck, she's been after the Clintons since the 90s.

Finding a way to extend a one-off job into a sustainable career. Smart, but doesn't mean she is or isn't a true believer.
posted by ctmf at 12:01 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


The Alex Jones and Donald Trump Survivalist Apprentice Show, coming soon to Breitbart TV. Real weapons, real kills.
posted by Yowser at 12:01 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


I got to vote early today in Florida. In a fitting coincidence, I was in a Supergirl costume when I got to cast my vote for the first woman president. A+ idea, would do again.
posted by PearlRose at 12:03 PM on October 29, 2016 [134 favorites]


True ctmf, i just wonder why the media has totally failed to report on Conway's decades-long hunt against Clinton. (other than Keith Olbermann)
posted by Yowser at 12:03 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Got a new email from the Hillary campaign:
...news broke yesterday that Trump is pouring in another $10 million of his own money into the final 10 days of this race -- and he’s going to use that to help pay for $25 million in new ads in battleground states.
Y'know, I might be concerned, except... Trump thinks Pennsylvania is a battleground state. And Maine. Not that there's no chance in hell of winning one of Maine's electoral votes, but I'd expect those dollars to be better spent in, say, Utah, where he's at risk of having his voters split off to Egg. (I suppose he thinks Utah is a lock.)
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 12:11 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


> "Smart, but doesn't mean she is or isn't a true believer."

Who cares? After a certain point, you are what you pretend to be.
posted by kyrademon at 12:11 PM on October 29, 2016 [27 favorites]


For most of the campaign, Trump has been writing his own personal Revelation, but he generally has stopped at Chapter 20

Odd, I thought he usually stopped at chapter 11.
posted by Twain Device at 12:13 PM on October 29, 2016 [60 favorites]


Conway is a soulless self-dealer. I am sure she thinks she "believes" in something. The deference paid to her because she's supposedly "nice" by the media is such bullshit. She is every bit as much a snake as Steve Bannon and someday I hope someone hacks her goddamn emails.
posted by spitbull at 12:14 PM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


Farenthold's latest is up: Trump boasts about his philanthropy. But his giving falls short of his words. It features various occasions where he turned up at major charity events without being invited or giving a donation. Come for the photo of Trump and Guiliani doing the macarena, stay for the Boy Scout registration fee.
Afterward, Disney and Buchenholz recalled, Trump left without offering an explanation. Or a donation. Fisher was stuck in the audience. The charity spent months trying to repair its relationship with him.

“I mean, what’s wrong with you, man?” Disney recalled thinking of Trump, when it was over.

For as long as he has been rich and famous, Donald Trump has also wanted people to believe he is generous. He spent years constructing an image as a philanthropist by appearing at charity events and by making very public — even nationally televised — promises to give his own money away.

It was, in large part, a facade. A months-long investigation by The Washington Post has not been able to verify many of Trump’s boasts about his philanthropy.

Instead, throughout his life in the spotlight, whether as a businessman, television star or presidential candidate, The Post found that Trump had sought credit for charity he had not given — or claimed other people’s giving as his own.
posted by zachlipton at 12:17 PM on October 29, 2016 [41 favorites]


Let's maybe tone down the Biblical references like "soulless" and "snake". It's pretty messy as it is.
posted by Namlit at 12:18 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


I think he thinks that "Philantropy" is when you own only very few tiny stamps.
posted by Namlit at 12:20 PM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


With all the discussion of prominent Republican women and their faults or merits, I'd like to tip my hat to Nicolle Wallace. I have always found her to be principled and reasonable, and I enjoy her talking head segments from an intellectual standpoint. My appreciation for Ana Navarro is almost entirely visceral, though I think she is also a very smart and principled woman.
posted by xyzzy at 12:22 PM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


Complaint asking DOJ to investigate Comey's conduct interfering into election has been filed.

If Comey’s actions were politically motivated, he would be in violation of the Hatch Act.
posted by petebest at 12:24 PM on October 29, 2016 [19 favorites]


"Soulless" is not a biblical reference.
posted by spitbull at 12:27 PM on October 29, 2016 [8 favorites]


The DOJ complaint was filed by The Democratic Coalition Against Trump, which I think explains how little traction it is getting in the media. Democrats need to learn how to name their witch hunting organizations better. See: Judicial Watch.
posted by xyzzy at 12:28 PM on October 29, 2016 [11 favorites]


"The polls are rigged", says white female Trump supporter after she's arrested for voter fraud...

Called it. "I wasn’t planning on doing it twice, it was spur of the moment" is the kicker here: I can well imagine die-hard Trumpsters so worked up by the non-stop diet of "it's rigged!" that they're acting on self-induced panic, but instead of going down to the cities to check up on Those People Voting, they're going to try to offset the "obvious fraud" in their own lily-white communities.

This is going to be a test of voting systems in places where nobody typically bothers to look.
posted by holgate at 12:29 PM on October 29, 2016 [18 favorites]


Something I've been trying to express to disillusioned millennials toying with 3rd party voting is this: say youre a 28 year old right now who's had trouble getting into your chosen profession. Trump gets in the economy is going to crater again and probably hit a hard recession. When/if we come out of it you'll be too old to hire at entry level. I wouldn't hire a 38 year old developer with a CV full of nothing but barista and bar experience.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 12:30 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


I wouldn't hire a 38 year old developer with a CV full of nothing but barista and bar experience.

If you would hire a 23 year old developer with a CV full of nothing but barista and bar experience, but not a 38 year old developer with a CV full of nothing but barista and bar experience, you might not be violating the law (age discrimination generally applies only to people over 40), but you would still be kind of an ageist dick.
posted by dersins at 12:34 PM on October 29, 2016 [129 favorites]


I wouldn't hire a 38 year old developer with a CV full of nothing but barista and bar experience.

So you just straight-up admit to discriminating based on age? Or do you really mean you won't hire someone who got their education 10 years ago and didn't go anywhere with it?
posted by Mitrovarr at 12:34 PM on October 29, 2016 [10 favorites]


Also on the collateral damage front: how much more bullshit is poor Human Abedin going to have to endure?
posted by Senor Cardgage at 12:35 PM on October 29, 2016 [14 favorites]


I wouldn't hire a 38 year old developer with a CV full of nothing but barista and bar experience.
Aww, that's so sad. I was promoted from the help desk to unix system administration when the unix guys noticed that they never got paged on the nights I was armed with sudo. And I got that help desk job after selling computers at Best Buy armed with nothing more than a GED. Sometimes people just need a chance to show what they can do.
posted by xyzzy at 12:35 PM on October 29, 2016 [117 favorites]


"Soulless" is not a biblical reference.

...got a point there. I noticed.
posted by Namlit at 12:36 PM on October 29, 2016


So you just straight-up admit to discriminating based on age? Or do you really mean you won't hire someone who got their education 10 years ago and didn't go anywhere with it?


This. Its very unlikely their skillset will be up to date and world-tested enough to be of use.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 12:36 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


But I thought there was a developer shortage.


^^^ sarcasm
posted by Yowser at 12:37 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


So you'd hire a 38 year old who was just trained, then?
posted by Mitrovarr at 12:38 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Of course. And we have. Perhaps I should have worded this all better.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 12:39 PM on October 29, 2016 [15 favorites]


Tactical Trump flashlights and pocket knives in matte black, digital camo or genuine 24k gold plate

Trump commemorative coins will be a big thing. I got a mailer for one just last weekend. Silver-plated 1 1/2" diameter with Trump on both heads and tails. All for $4.98. They didn't say what the coin was made of, but at that price it had to be aluminum. Or plastic.
posted by teirnon at 12:39 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]




Of course. And we have.

Well, all right then. But you should probably be more careful with your wording in the future.
posted by Mitrovarr at 12:40 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


Fahrenthold's latest has a lot of fascinating new detail on Trump the Life-long Chiseller, done with his typical light touch:
The Trump Foundation gave $50,000 in 1995, and another $50,000 in 1999, to a nonprofit called the National Museum of Catholic Art and History....

The museum was housed for much of the 1990s in a former headquarters for “Fat Tony” Salerno of the Genovese crime family in East Harlem.
It also says a lot about what people can get away with under the auspices of 501(c)(3) status if nobody's looking hard.
posted by holgate at 12:44 PM on October 29, 2016 [23 favorites]


Wait, wait, wait, here is my latest whack conspiracy theory. Putin has the goods on Comey! You know, some goods. He got advised that his life is going to be a shopping cart, if he doesn't come up with something on Clinton. Now, I think, there is something very specific, they are looking for in the email haystack, with regard to Hillary. They already have the information, but it has to come out of the email pile, because otherwise, it is obviously a bought and paid for hack job. Yes, so it links to bedroom, or Benghazi, and either throws horrific shade, or a criminal complaint. Trump has paid his dues in Russia, no doubt.
posted by Oyéah at 12:45 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


God bless Fahrenthold. He's been doing the research and bringing the good stuff.

I found this anecdote particularly telling:
For instance, Res — the executive who had spent years leaning on Trump’s contractors to buy tables at his wife’s fundraisers — came to Trump to ask for a favor of her own.

“I got an award from a group called the Professional Women in Construction,” she recalled. There was a gala. There were tables. She’d sold a number to subcontractors she knew.

But, usually, the winning woman’s employer was the big spender, buying multiple tables or paying for high-level sponsorships. That was Trump.

He didn’t.

“He showed up at the door and bought one ticket,” said Lenore Janis, the leader of the Professional Women in Construction at the time. The ticket cost $100.

“And then he said to me, the president of the organization, ‘I have a few things that I want to say. I will need the microphone,’ ” Janis said.

She said no. But Trump found somebody who said yes. “He got up there and for 15 minutes he blew his own horn,” Janis said, so that anybody watching would think he’d written a big check.
Of course he would think nothing about throwing his weight around to talk about himself...at the gala for Professional Women in Construction.

OF COURSE.
posted by Salieri at 12:46 PM on October 29, 2016 [101 favorites]


I just hope that enough Trumpistas are arrested for trying to vote twice to leave too few at large to start their armed revolution. Also, in jail, thy can get to meet their hero.
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:50 PM on October 29, 2016


A Scandal Too Far? Huma Abedin, Hillary Clinton, and a Test of Loyalty

NYT lifts the hood on the nothingburger grill, finds Weiners in it.

I thought the title was referring to her pants in that photo. Ay yi yi
posted by petebest at 12:50 PM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


It’s like saying to someone, ‘How about having two brownies and not six?’”

First they came skittles and I said nothing...

Then they came for tic-tacs and I said nothing....

Then they came for brownies and I said "DO NOT FUCK WITH BROWNIES!"
posted by srboisvert at 12:54 PM on October 29, 2016 [21 favorites]


The important thing is that nobody was looking at Trump's charitable activities until he tried to cheat the vets as part of a ridiculous stunt when he refused to show up at a debate and ran his own event against it:
In January, Trump skipped a GOP primary debate in a feud with Fox News and held a televised fundraiser for veterans. In that broadcast, Trump said he’d personally donated to the cause: “Donald Trump gave $1 million,” he said.

Months later, The Post could find no evidence Trump had done so. Then, Corey Lewandowski — Trump’s campaign manager at the time — called to say the money had been given out. In private. No details. “He’s not going to share that information,” Lewandowski said.

In reality, at that point, Trump had given nothing.

Trump didn’t give away the $1 million until a few days later, as the news media sought to check Lewandowski’s false claim. Trump gave it all to the Marine Corps-Law Enforcement Foundation, which helps families of fallen Marines. Trump bristled at this reporter’s suggestion that he had only given the money away because the media was asking about it.

“You know, you’re a nasty guy. You’re really a nasty guy,” Trump said. “I gave out millions of dollars that I had no obligation to do.”
Farenthold and the Post were relentless at trying to track down where the money went after the Trump campaign kept stonewalling them. That's what led to broader questions about the Foundation and Trump's giving, culminating in this story today. Had he just given the money to veterans charities promptly and released a list of where it went, he could well have skated through the election with a general reputation as a philanthropist. But he got greedy and tried to weasel out of his pledge, and one reporter wasn't going to forgive him for that.
posted by zachlipton at 12:55 PM on October 29, 2016 [63 favorites]


Let's tone down the Biblical references...

Oh, for Christ's sake. Like it or not, the King James Bible is a great work of literature and part of your cultural heritage. Or do you have a problem with Ovid's Metamorphoses, too ? And speaking of that, this is almost as insane as referring to Classical Greek and Roman authors and philosophers as Old Dead White men. They weren't as far as they were concerned -- the cultural construct 'White' having yet to be invented for centuries yet.

And, anyhow, where do you get off trying to control other people's language ? Soulless and snakes are living concepts still and one doesn’t have to be a believer to get the thoughts behind them just because they are double plus ungood to you.
posted by y2karl at 12:56 PM on October 29, 2016 [61 favorites]


I love the early voting stories, and every one gets a favorite. Do it now! Tell your friends!

One interesting tidbit from CNN: the Clinton organization's GOTV operation is so organized that they had soft-support and converted Trump or Republican voters flagged and prioritized for earliest possible voting. They knew something like this was likely, and they were on it.
posted by msalt at 12:57 PM on October 29, 2016 [24 favorites]


MetaFilter: you should probably be more careful with your wording in the future.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:59 PM on October 29, 2016 [13 favorites]


Those pants were awesome.
posted by angrycat at 1:00 PM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


Here's the transcript on Trump about ballots being destroyed:
Like people say, "Oh, here is a ballot, bing! Here is another ballot, throw it away. Throw - oh, here is one I like. We'll keep that one." I have real problems. So get your ballots in. We're trying to have some pretty good supervision out there. We have a lot of people watching you people that collect the ballots. We've got a lot of people watching the people that collect the ballots.
Yes, you do, in fact, have real problems. Bing!
posted by zachlipton at 1:01 PM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


Oy vey. I go take care of real life for one day and Hurricane Comey hits the teapot.
posted by bardophile at 1:08 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


y2karl, it's all fine, you know: I'm not living in that corner where you seem to suspect me hanging out, like, at all.
It just struck me that, as there's so much of the "she's the devil" type of stuff being strewn around these days, it might be a thought to refrain from doing the same kind the other way round, even if it's about Conway, whom I, too, dislike quite a lot.

This was anyway not about "trying to control" anyone's language, it was my opinion about someone else's wording.
posted by Namlit at 1:21 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


That NYT piece on Huma Abedin describes exactly the sort of self-inflicted wound that goes against the narrative that Hillary is solely a political creature. Any pure careerist would have shitcanned Huma after the Weiner documentary. It makes sense to protect an aide when she is being attacked over her mother or her husband, but Huma's decision to play along with that ill-advised (but amazeballs) doc was simple self-harm that had the capacity to damage Hillary's campaign. But no, Hillary is loyal to a fault, forever unwilling to correct her blind spots when it comes to loyalists in her camp.
posted by xyzzy at 1:22 PM on October 29, 2016 [10 favorites]


Hillary is loyal to a fault, forever unwilling to correct her blind spots when it comes to loyalists in her camp.

Or it could be that Hillary knows loyalty is a rare quality and one that has such value it can't be monetized or career-ified.
posted by fraula at 1:26 PM on October 29, 2016 [22 favorites]


Here is another ballot, throw it away.

It's not just that he's encouraging people to believe, there is widespread fraud: he's putting ideas in people's heads on how to commit fraud. I'm going to bet now that there'll be one county somewhere where that happens because a county board worker has a tizzy.

Hillary is loyal to a fault, forever unwilling to correct her blind spots when it comes to loyalists in her camp.

"Forever" is a bit blanket. I don't see Mark Penn anywhere near the campaign.
posted by holgate at 1:34 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Namlit it's all cool. But I would point out that mutatis mutandis "snake" and "soulless" are culturally and religiously non-specific and bog standard metaphors for condemning lying, hypocrisy, underhandedness, and character assassination in the political rhetoric of a public figure. Those tropes can be sourced in the traditions of most religions and cultures.

Kellianne Conway is no better than the demon she serves.
posted by spitbull at 1:36 PM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


Huma's decision to play along with that ill-advised (but amazeballs) doc was simple self-harm that had the capacity to damage Hillary's campaign.

She and Weiner maintain that she did not consent to be in the movie and that the filmmakers/studio did it against their wishes.
posted by melissasaurus at 1:39 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Has anyone commented that this is the David S. Pumpkin of October Surprises?
posted by oneswellfoop at 1:39 PM on October 29, 2016 [10 favorites]


Hillary knows loyalty is a rare quality and one that has such value it can't be monetized or careerified.

You don't get where Clinton has gotten as a woman in a misogynist system without building plenty of allies and showing you can be trusted to support them and vice versa. That, along with being good at what you do, is the only way to build a career if you're not part of the old boys club.
posted by gusottertrout at 1:41 PM on October 29, 2016 [18 favorites]


Has anyone commented that this is the David S. Pumpkin of October Surprises?

You don't demean David S. Pumpkins like that.

Any questions?
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:44 PM on October 29, 2016 [15 favorites]


Has anyone commented that this is the David S. Pumpkin of October Surprises?

No, I'm sorry, there isn't time.
posted by petebest at 1:44 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


If I were a Congress member I would be so satirical. I would start an investigation into whether, if you read Hillary's emails backwards you got Satanic messages.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 1:45 PM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


More like The Great Pumpkin of October surprises amirite?
posted by spitbull at 1:46 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


Satanic Hilary is actually a thing Trumpers are concerned about, FWIW. They consider this a possibility as a conclusion from their careful observations of the motions of flies. [true, honest]
posted by Artw at 1:50 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Now I'm visualizing Linus in the pumpkin patch being confronted by David S.

"NOT a Great Pumpkin, not even a very good one." (But then, THAT'S THE JOKE)
posted by oneswellfoop at 1:51 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


I have studiously avoided talking politics with my conservative Alabamian dad this election. (My mom, despite often voting Republican, and also an Alabamian, told me months ago that she's voting for Hillary.) Dad's not your typical Alabama conservative (he's Catholic, for one thing, and worked for Senator Paul Simon for a summer during college, for another). Today, during an otherwise politics-free conversation to catch up on what's been going on this week, he said in passing that he's really tormented by the election, and that he was starting to think he might not vote at all.

I don't think I could convince him to be happy to vote for Clinton. But after our phone call, I was thinking that perhaps I could do something to help keep give him another option that would be proactive, but also not a vote for Trump. I thought about what I know about Dad's political opinions, and various things I've read on MeFi, and I did a little research about the official write-in candidates in Alabama.

I called him back. "Dad," I asked, "have you heard of a man named Evan McMullin?"
posted by ocherdraco at 1:52 PM on October 29, 2016 [65 favorites]


Satanic Hilary is actually a thing Trumpers are concerned about, FWIW. They consider this a possibility as a conclusion from their careful observations of the motions of flies.

You don't even need the flies if you start from the axiom, "Hillary Clinton is Evil" and go from there.
posted by mikelieman at 1:54 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


For what it's worth McMullin isn't on the ballot here in California. Wikipedia says he is not on the ballot in Alabama, either.
posted by Sara C. at 1:56 PM on October 29, 2016


I know. He's an official write-in candidate in Alabama. (Which is what I told my dad.)
posted by ocherdraco at 1:56 PM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


BREAKING NEWS HILLARY IS CORRUPT!!!!!! UNDERCOVER VIDEO STING CATCHES ILLEGAL CAMPAIGN FUNDS SOLICITED BY DEMOCR—wait, it was a Republican. Carry on.

The Intercept: Trump Super PAC Sting Shows How Citizens United Opened Door to Foreign Money
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 1:57 PM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


Huma's decision to play along with that ill-advised (but amazeballs) doc was simple self-harm that had the capacity to damage Hillary's campaign.

She and Weiner maintain that she did not consent to be in the movie and that the filmmakers/studio did it against their wishes.


Wait what. how does this work? Isn't that a lawsuit waiting to happen? And also what the EVER loving fuck??
posted by schadenfrau at 1:58 PM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


Not to jump on one of my hobbyhorses or anything, but probably the best way to assess Kellyanne Conway is through the lens of her effects on the world, rather than through the lens of whatever abstract principles she may or may not hold. Ideals (or the absence of ideals) don't really matter except through how they're made material through actions in the world, and whatever Conway's ideals/absence of ideals are, the effects are clearly awful. Her Baghdad Bob schtick isn't going to win Trump the election, but it may be riling up violent white supremacists enough to help inspire them to take extra-electoral action after Trump's loss.

That aside: can I say that I've had the hardest time working up a proper hate-on for Trump lately? He's empty inside, he's dimwitted, and he appears to have no working theory of mind. His universe is tiny, because it doesn't extend past his own selfhood, and his own selfhood is maimed and limited. I don't think the man has ever gotten the chance to experience anything good about life.

I've spouted slogans like "wealth is a disease" a bunch, and I've intellectually grasped how capitalism maims the rich as well as the poor, but with Trump it's so viscerally obvious that his inheritance long ago snuffed out his human potential.

I have relatives who vote for Republicans out of an abiding respect for hierarchy, out of the idea that the rich deserve their power, that obedience to power is a crucial element of the good life, and that it would be unfair to both the powerful and the powerless to take away their wealth; unfair to the powerful because they deserve it, and unfair to the powerless because it takes away our chance to serve.

For my part, I think it is unfair to inflict either wealth or poverty on anyone. Both wealth and poverty strip life of its flavor.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:59 PM on October 29, 2016 [38 favorites]


Has anyone commented that this is the David S. Pumpkin of October Surprises?

10 days 'til the election. They can't all be winners.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 1:59 PM on October 29, 2016 [12 favorites]


It's a shame Huma was never a MeFite. One anonymous AskMe about her and her husband would have gotten a deafening chorus of "DTMFA"* from the assembled MetaMasses. Well, I suspect Hillary would've gotten much the same response.

*acronym for Dump The Mother Fucker Already
posted by oneswellfoop at 2:01 PM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]




I'm still at 9:00 last night, but dropping down to the bottom just to say, Woo! ennui.bz AND clavdivs in one election thread!
posted by rabbitrabbit at 2:01 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


> I called him back. "Dad," I asked, "have you heard of a man named Evan McMullin?"

Are there any downballot races that your dad might negatively effect if he goes to the polls? That's why I'd never dream of having the McMullin Conversation with my conservative relatives...

(well, that and also tbf I'm pretty sure they consider Mormons to be devil-worshippers, so the conversation would be a non-starter anyway)
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 2:03 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Oh, my dad was going to the polls regardless. Downballot races are important to him. He was just going to abstain from the presidential race. I should note that he's not a Republican; though he usually votes for the Republican candidate in presidential elections, on local ones he's much more variable. (He's conservative in comparison to me, but much less conservative than your average Alabamian.)
posted by ocherdraco at 2:08 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Conway isn't just doing it for the paycheck, she's been after the Clintons since the 90s.

If I remember correctly, she, Ann Coulter, Laura Ingraham, and the late Barbara Olson all came to prominence around the same time as anti-Clinton pundits in the late 1990s. It's also worth noting that Conway's husband was one of Paula Jones's advisors in her lawsuit against Bill Clinton.
posted by SisterHavana at 2:09 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]




Trump Super PAC Sting Shows How Citizens United Opened Door to Foreign Money

So it turns out that maybe all those emails to foreign VIPs weren't an accident, after all.
posted by Sara C. at 2:10 PM on October 29, 2016


Hamilton is such a New York City story

Enough with the Empire State overrepresentation in this election cycle!
posted by Apocryphon at 2:23 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


steals Anthony Weiner's time machine to gift Burr a modern pistol with which he could double-tap Hamilton

How about a Sten?
posted by mikelieman at 2:23 PM on October 29, 2016


Erica Garner responds to Clinton campaign's emails about her father.

I've been reading this a few times and I'm not quite seeing it. Someone thought Eric Garner should be mentioned in an op-ed about gun violence and someone else said basically "that makes no sense because he wasn't killed by gun violence" and that was it. Right?
posted by zachlipton at 2:24 PM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


So at his latest rally Trump is now directly accusing Loretta Lynch of a quid pro quo deal with Clinton to keep the FBI off her back.

This is becoming normalized. This is regular political discourse from one of the nominees of a national political party.
posted by Talez at 2:26 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


steals Anthony Weiner's time machine to gift Burr a modern pistol with which he could double-tap Hamilton

I'm pretty sure you could get rich off a historical Hot Tub Time Machine remake set at the turn of the 19th century starring Anthony Weiner (because what else does he have to do at this point?)
posted by zachlipton at 2:26 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


> I've been reading this a few times and I'm not quite seeing it. Someone thought Eric Garner should be mentioned in an op-ed about gun violence and someone else said basically "that makes no sense because he wasn't killed by gun violence" and that was it.

yes and also it sucks a lot when politicians you don't agree with discuss whether or not they can co-opt the tragedy that's become your life's work for something that you don't particularly care about.

I think maybe rather than trying to determine whether that particular series of emails was either normal or terrible, we can just agree that it's both normal and terrible.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 2:27 PM on October 29, 2016 [12 favorites]


Clear skies in Austin, Temperate weather, no wait whatsoever at the Howson Library on Exposition blvd. Austinites GO DO THE THING NOW! Vote!
posted by Devils Rancher at 12:04 PM on October 29


Thanks for the tip DR! Went and early voted there, took about 10 minutes. Line was short but a constant stream of people were coming in. And no waiting to use the wheelchair accessible voting machine unlike my usual polling place. A+ A+ A+ HIGHLY RECOMMEND
posted by a humble nudibranch at 2:28 PM on October 29, 2016 [25 favorites]


How about a Sten?

Well, an AK-47 would be overkill.

The existence of that book blows my mind because Turtledove claimed he got the idea after another author claimed of cover art as historically inaccurate as Robert E. Lee holding an Uzi. Did he actually steal the idea from Harry Harrison? Or maybe that Harry travelled back in time to steal the idea from Turtledove first?
posted by Apocryphon at 2:28 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


This Brit went to a friend's for dinner tonight. Afterwards, my friend's partner started in on how there was "no difference" between Trump and Clinton, that both were "corrupt beyond belief" and how "a vote for Trump is a vote to change the status quo".

I'd like to thank the contributors to this and previous threads for the words that brought her round, finally, finally, to acknowledge that Clinton would be the only choice for an undecided not fond of anarchy.

Then she revealed she voted for Brexit. That's when I left.
posted by doornoise at 2:33 PM on October 29, 2016 [108 favorites]


Don't even get me started on how much I despise Hamilton. How the grandfather of Wall Street gets made a hero these days boggles the mind. Every time it comes up, I have visions of Springtime with Hitler.

I wonder if LMM and co. could pull off a musical about, say, Andrew Jackson. Subvert the American icon and all that. Get Sarah Vowell to cowrite the project. Or better yet, make a musical about Lafayette (which Jackson could still appear in!), but that wouldn't be as subversive. Wonder who would play von Steuben.
posted by Apocryphon at 2:35 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


A cousin of mine wants to know whether the US media is lying about Trump being behind in the polls. Thank you to all of you for educating me sufficiently about polls that I could confidently disabuse him of that notion.
posted by bardophile at 2:39 PM on October 29, 2016 [10 favorites]


@rappingranny:
The last month of this stupid fucking election has been a cursed advent calendar you open up each day to a new bullshit surprise.
posted by Wordshore at 2:41 PM on October 29, 2016 [41 favorites]


I wonder if LMM and co. could pull off a musical about, say, Andrew Jackson.

Someone already did that.
posted by airish at 2:43 PM on October 29, 2016 [13 favorites]


When the random "how about this?" suggestions between political campaigners are released to the wild public, you're going to find something to offend or insult just about everyone. That's the strategy of Wikileaks and their masters - to make Hillary more offensive to more people. Of course, a similar strategy couldn't be used against Trump because every offensive/insulting thing his staff suggests ends up as part of his stump speeches.

This is becoming normalized. This is regular political discourse from one of the nominees of a national political party.
The good news is No, it really isn't, or else a lot more Republicans would be following Deplorable Donald's lead rather than quietly hating him but afraid to speak up. Some of the Teabaggers are as just bad (but not even all of them) , but they've accomplished nothing more than annoying Paul Ryan (a laudable goal, but...). Depending on the size of Trump's electoral rejection, his campaign will be either an example of what NOT to do or of how to commit political suicide.

A cousin of mine wants to know whether the US media is lying about Trump being behind in the polls.
It's actually more likely they're lying about him having a snowball's chance in Hell, because (a) horserace coverage never succeeds when one horse is 25 lengths ahead and (b) Trump still has plenty of friends in The Media, most of whom are just better at concealing their racism and/or misogamy.
posted by oneswellfoop at 2:49 PM on October 29, 2016 [10 favorites]


I'm with Oneswellfoop on the normalization and invented hype train. Add the desperation for a horserace to the 'don't get complacent/send more money now!' Clinton trumpets and it's no wonder outsiders think Trump is some kind of actually legitimate threat. We're so disconnected from reality this election, it's just bizarre to me. So much for the internet helping with that.

As for dumping cherry picked info, definitely true. Did the Clinton PAC organizer hiring provocateur goons in order to create violence at Trump (or was it Sanders?) rallies turn out to be real or another inflated claim? I can't see much about it out there other than the first whiffs. Has it been investigated/dissected/discredited properly?
posted by rokusan at 3:00 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


This is becoming normalized. This is regular political discourse from one of the nominees of a national political party.

Becoming? He started with Mexicans are rapists a year ago. Seems like five. There's no way his flava of racist bullshit doesn't stay in circulation in politics after Nov 8. The GOP is frantically working on monetizing it now.

Money talks and as has been pointed out many a time here, the butt Trumpets are wealthier than your average voter.
posted by petebest at 3:02 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


So at his latest rally Trump is now directly accusing Loretta Lynch of a quid pro quo deal with Clinton to keep the FBI off her back.

This is becoming normalized. This is regular political discourse from one of the nominees of a national political party.


Well, the whole Bill Clinton and Loretta Lynch tarmac meeting was a terrible idea from pretty much all points of view. I don't believe there was collusion but there are a lot of people who do, and Trump is going to use whatever ammunition he can.
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 3:02 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


I wonder if LMM and co. could pull off a musical about, say, Andrew Jackson.

I'm partial to John and John's classic musical, myself: James K. Polk (our Eleventh President).

Next election, I hope we have TMBG-themed posts, because I could kill with the lyrical references.
posted by rokusan at 3:03 PM on October 29, 2016 [23 favorites]


There's no way his flava of racist bullshit doesn't stay in circulation in politics after Nov 8. The GOP is frantically working on monetizing it now.
...and mostly failing at it. Not only is Trump's fundraising a joke, but even the safely-dogwhistling Koch Brothers are having more trouble getting money to throw at the GOP. So without an internal party coup, I see the Trumpians as personas-non-get-closer-than-a-ten-foot-pole after the election. And the Deplorable Donors list the alt-right is assembling now is totally NOT for Real Republicans.
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:13 PM on October 29, 2016


For what it's worth McMullin isn't on the ballot here in California.

California is an In-n-Out state.
posted by rokusan at 3:16 PM on October 29, 2016 [20 favorites]


Early voted today in a sleepy 'burb near Boston. We've never had to stand in a line to vote before - we usually go in on the morning of election day, before work, and cruise through in aoutb five minutes. Not so today - the place was packed.

I'm not a very good stander (or walker) so it was kind of painful, and the nice lady behind me with a cane was also toughing it out. My roomie wondered aloud, "I wonder if it was this busy all day?" and the nice lady in FRONT of us said, "Oh, yeah. My husband got here at 9am this morning, and it was way worse."

Got my sticker, and stuck it on the back of my phone. Got a lollipop, too, and I am now having magical-thinking-type-thoughts about the dangers of consuming it too early...
posted by invincible summer at 3:17 PM on October 29, 2016 [22 favorites]


California is an In-n-Out state.

And we wear Chucks not Ballies.
posted by Talez at 3:17 PM on October 29, 2016 [8 favorites]


Raygun have a new t-shirt design out which is rather good.
posted by Wordshore at 3:18 PM on October 29, 2016 [15 favorites]


I voted by mail, and a few days after I got a text confirming my ballot had been received and will be counted. Woo! Later that day I saw that the Bundy brothers had been acquitted. WTF? In short, Oregon is a land of contrasts.
posted by WordCannon at 3:18 PM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


Did the Clinton PAC organizer hiring provocateur goons in order to create violence at Trump (or was it Sanders?) rallies turn out to be real or another inflated claim?

Trump rallies, and it wasn't just inflated, it was completely false. Serial Hoax Perpetrator and Master of Disguise James O'Keefe managed to get a low-level Clinton staffer on camera speculating about how one could hypothetically start shit at Trump rallies by paying people to go in as agents provocateurs, and then used his signature trick of bad-faith editing to make it seem as if said staffer had admitted to actually doing it. It was spectacularly poor judgement on the part of that staffer to allow himself to be seen even talking about that idea in the abstract—very unprofessional of him—but that's as far as it went.

O'Keefe managed to lead someone into saying "Well sure, if you wanted to cause havoc you could always just give a handful of people $1,500 to start some mayhem at a Trump rally, but that would be nakedly criminal and so of course we'd never do that," and then did his usual hack job on the recording to make it look like there was really something there. And then Trump, because he has no reapect for truth, reality, or the democratic process, ran with that as if it were a real story and not something ginned-up by a known con man.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 3:19 PM on October 29, 2016 [18 favorites]


Leadership is about more than the legislation one sponsors and the votes one casts. On Thursday night, Senator Kirk’s comments about his opponent’s heritage were deeply offensive and racist. His attempt to use Congresswoman Tammy Duckworth’s race as a means to undermine her family’s American heritage and patriotism is beyond reprehensible. Yesterday, Senator Kirk tweeted an apology that failed to adequately address the real harm and magnitude of his words. So today, following a vote by our board’s committee, the Human Rights Campaign withdrew our support of Senator Kirk.
Chad Griffin, President of the Human Rights Campaign
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 3:20 PM on October 29, 2016 [45 favorites]


Long lines at the polling places in Boston today, but I'm sure that was for the all important Suffolk County Register of Deeds race :-).
posted by adamg at 3:24 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


Next election, I hope we have TMBG-themed posts, because I could kill with the lyrical references.

And with them we'll beat little Van, Van, Van, / Van is a used up man
posted by Apocryphon at 3:24 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


October 28, 2012: Romney and Ryan barnstorm Ohio as new poll shows tied race

“You guys, you got clear eyes, full hearts, and on Nov. 6, we can’t lose,” Romney said, referencing a motto in the television show “Friday Night Lights” that the show’s creator has asked him to stop using. “Paul Ryan and I will not fail you!”

Ryan campaigning for the GOP nom?! Weird.
posted by petebest at 3:24 PM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


I don't see Mark Penn anywhere near the campaign.

He's spying and skewing Pollyhop Bing search results in his new 'special projects' position at Microsoft.
posted by rokusan at 3:29 PM on October 29, 2016


My mistake, Microsoft was last year. This year, Penn is back to lobbyist-greasework with his own firm.
posted by rokusan at 3:32 PM on October 29, 2016


ymgve:
The State Department, and thus by extension Clinton, has SIPRnet available which shares no computers, printers or cables (Maybe not even on the same power grid?) with anything connected to the internet. Everything classified happens there, and that leaves all the "boring" unclassified stuff for the internet-connected systems.

Bit of clarification there - power systems and physical cabling need not be separate. from http://www.usmilcom.com/military.htm

All data transmitted on SIPRNet between secure facilities must be encrypted by approved NSA encryption systems. While the public Internet can be used to transmit encrypted SIPRNet packets ("SIPR over NIPR"), no access is permitted between the two networks.

(Also, hello Metafilter. First time poster, been lurking since late '99 I think. Finally got drawn in.)
posted by Enturbulated at 3:41 PM on October 29, 2016 [92 favorites]


So today, following a vote by our board’s committee, the Human Rights Campaign withdrew our support of Senator Kirk.

Better late than never, I guess?
posted by Surely This at 3:46 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


How about a Sten?

i mean really why not the entire beresaad
posted by poffin boffin at 3:49 PM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


Finally got drawn in.)
posted by Enturbulated

Sooner or later, we all get drawn in... but not usually via a mispronounced emergency room procedure.
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:49 PM on October 29, 2016 [8 favorites]


Next election, I hope we have TMBG-themed posts, because I could kill with the lyrical references.

Obscure point but for a while in the last decade (when lurking but not a member of MetaFilter) I thought - cannot remember why - that user #1 was also a member of TMBG and MetaFilter was his wacky non-musical side project.
posted by Wordshore at 3:49 PM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


And we wear Chucks not Ballies.

Yeah that's right
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:50 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


I thought - cannot remember why - that user #1 was also a member of TMBG and MetaFilter was his wacky non-musical side project.

I had a theory that he was also Lowtax
posted by thelonius at 3:51 PM on October 29, 2016 [10 favorites]


Next election, I hope we have TMBG-themed posts, because I could kill with the lyrical references.

I'm assuming that sometime around 10 or 11 ET on the 7th we'll see the last election post, which will consist entirely of a link to a performance of the appropriate Ramones song.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 3:52 PM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


Next election, I hope we have TMBG-themed posts, because I could kill with the lyrical references.
Even Old New York was once New Amsterdam.
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:53 PM on October 29, 2016 [8 favorites]


Someday, that ant, he will grow up to be President.
posted by zachlipton at 3:55 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


which will consist entirely of a link to a performance of the appropriate Ramones song.

i want to be sedated
posted by pyramid termite at 3:56 PM on October 29, 2016 [25 favorites]


I know politics bore you, but I feel like a hypocrite...
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 3:57 PM on October 29, 2016 [21 favorites]


This is where the party ends
I'll just sit here wondering how you
Can stand by your racist candidate

posted by RobotVoodooPower at 3:57 PM on October 29, 2016 [36 favorites]


you are doing more for the well-being of this country than the entire Republican party right now

It's worth noting that phonebanking against Trump and being a Republican in an elected party position are not mutually exclusive right now. Says, uh, a frieeeeend who's been charged with GOP GOTV for her district. Yeah, that's it, a frieeeeend.
posted by corb at 3:58 PM on October 29, 2016 [68 favorites]


Yes. That is the song I referred to. Because it references there being 24 hours to go.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 3:58 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


if trump wins we can go with the kkk took my baby away
posted by pyramid termite at 3:59 PM on October 29, 2016 [13 favorites]


The story of the Trump supporter who committed voter fraud by voting twice actually makes me really sad.

Like...your life is so narrow that you probably only allow yourself to get your news from far right-wing, conspiracy-heavy sources. Anything that might burst that bubble is ignored as "biased liberal media". You've gotten yourself whipped up by a candidate who is promoting the idea that the election is rigged against you. Maybe the only friends and family you talk to are in the same boat, and instead of injecting some independent thought the whole lot of you just wind yourselves in tighter and tighter circles, insulting yourselves against the real world.

You've surrendered yourself to willful ignorance and allowed yourself to be ruled by fear and paranoia, and out of panic you decide to do what you're convinced that the other side is already doing anyway, as a way of balancing the books.

And now you've got a nice arrest record to enjoy, and possibly a conviction down the road.

If you were able to open your mind, you might say, "Hey, the system works after all. If they caught me doing a boneheaded thing, that surely means that there aren't cases of hundreds or thousands of people voting improperly. So maybe I was wrong." But instead, you'll probably decide that the fact you were caught is just one more piece of evidence that the system is rigged against you - because they're making an example out of you and letting the Democrats off the hook. Certain groups of people will see you as a hero and a patriot.

I don't know this woman, of course. But it's just such a small, sad way to live. I hope she can take some good lessons from this, but I'm worried that too many people in this country are too far gone down the road of conspiracy.
posted by Salieri at 4:00 PM on October 29, 2016 [57 favorites]


Advance voting report here in suburban Atlanta. 2 hr. wait to vote on this 80˚ Saturday afternoon at one of two polls open in the county. There will be nine locations open on Monday, so hopefully not quite as painful for those folks, but happy that I got my sticker!
posted by goHermGO at 4:02 PM on October 29, 2016 [19 favorites]


> "...and mostly failing at it. Not only is Trump's fundraising a joke ..."

Trump's fundraising with *big* donors has been a joke. There are probably many reasons for this, ranging from those who are genuinely disgusted by his racism, sexism, and obvious unfitness, to those who merely feel he's an idiot who won't win no matter what.

However, his fundraising with *small* donors has not been a joke at all. I was depressingly incorrect in an earlier comment when I said he would come out of this election with a database of 2 million people. It turns out it's more like 14 million.
posted by kyrademon at 4:03 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


I can picture the entire Trump clan performing an election night version of "We're a happy family."
posted by spitbull at 4:06 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


Went to early vote, anticipating short lines if any since it's not widely publicized that California even has in-person early voting. An hour plus wait with lines around the block. I decided not to take the plunge today (I have an insanely busy weekend), but huzzah to everyone else!
posted by Sara C. at 4:07 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


insulting yourselves against the real world.

Probably not the word choice you intended, yet this, too, makes sense in the Trump-supporter context.
posted by eviemath at 4:07 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


A thought occurs. If Trump wins what's the chance of Attorney General Giuliani firing the team leading the contempt charges against Arpaio?
posted by Talez at 4:09 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Probably not the word choice you intended, yet this, too, makes sense in the Trump-supporter context.

*shakes fist at closed edit window*
posted by Salieri at 4:09 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


Guys, guys, enough with the time machine talk. We will did learn|ed it isn't a good idea.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 4:10 PM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


The story of the Trump supporter who committed voter fraud by voting twice actually makes me really sad.

Like...your life is so narrow that you probably only allow yourself to get your news from far right-wing, conspiracy-heavy sources.


I listened to this episode of TAL today, and it was frighteningly eye-opening. One of the more chilling moments was the reporter's conversation with a man who was utterly insistent that parts of the US were already "under sharia law" (though the only one he named was Dearborn, Michigan).

The reporter seemed genuinely flummoxed by how insistently uninformed the man was, and he in turn was incredulous that she would dare to say that no, in fact, there are precisely zero places in the country under sharia law.

"You really believe that? You need to read more," he told the reporter.

Her reply was something along the lines of "I do read. I am a journalist reporting on national stories," but the dude was just unflinching in his xenophobic ignorance.

It was depressing as fuck, and explains so, so goddam much about this election cycle.
posted by dersins at 4:16 PM on October 29, 2016 [86 favorites]




Is the Guardian's Richard Wolffe a MeFite? His latest column uses the terms "dumpster fire of an election" and "giant nothing-burger." He certainly has the snark:

All that’s left are the obvious problems posed by a radical Islamist from Kenya looking to foment a socialist revolution from the Oval Office. Given that he has only two months left in the White House, President Obama needs to speed up his secret plans or else he’ll turn into an even greater disappointment to the right-wingnuts.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 4:36 PM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


Guys, guys, enough with the time machine talk. We will did learn|ed it isn't a good idea.
I learned that from the first of the Peabody and Sherman cartoons in 1959.

And what dersins described was not so much "xenophobic ignorance" as the product of an intense disinformation campaign. Even the most enlightened religions require their believers to buy into 'facts' that are demonstrably impossible. "But the Old Testament floods were an analogy..." no, not to many people. And the cults on the Right and Alt-Right are sold on a modern equivalent of the Pantheon of Greek Gods.
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:39 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Did he happen to explain what he thought sharia law was? My suspicion is the dude is unclear on where the blame lies for Detroit's (Dearborn) misery.

That would be the corporatist's, buddy. It's been a bi-partisan effort.
posted by Strange_Robinson at 4:41 PM on October 29, 2016


I mean, you want Sharia law, just come to Texas. They stone adulterous women down here (/sarcasm)
posted by Strange_Robinson at 4:45 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Dearborn's pretty heavily Arab-American, to be (more than) fair.

Still not under Sharia law, though!
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:46 PM on October 29, 2016


Here's the video:

Guy chants "Jew-S-A" in front of press pen

Where's the USSS?
posted by Talez at 4:46 PM on October 29, 2016


Next election, I hope we have TMBG-themed posts, because I could kill with the lyrical references.

What's that orange thing.... DOING here?
posted by mmoncur at 4:47 PM on October 29, 2016 [21 favorites]


I'm assuming that sometime around 10 or 11 ET on the 7th we'll see the last election post, which will consist entirely of a link to a performance of the appropriate Ramones song.

(That post will probably be the 156th on the blue tagged with 'Election2016'. We've come a long way.)

Have been mulling about this and song lyrics that seem appropriate; I assume you mean Bonzo Goes to Bitburg, which came to mind when watching the Genesis Land of Confusion video. Also thinking of Gil Scott-Heron's epic ("You will not be able to plug in, turn on and cop out"), Eminem's recent "Campaign speech":

Consider me a dangerous man
But you should be afraid of this dang candidate
You say Trump don't kiss ass like a puppet
'Cause he runs his campaign with his own cash for the fundin'
And that's what you wanted
A fuckin' loose cannon who's blunt with his hand on the button
Who doesn't have to answer to no one—great idea!


...or Tracy Chapman's Talkin' bout a Revolution, my favorite The Police track, or something by Bruce (either this or, especially, this). Or possibly trying to persuade Cortex and Jessamyn to do a ukelele duet of Guthrie's "This Land is your Land", which could work really well.

But if it looks like Trump is going to win this, then probably Blanck Mass by Chernobyl as we'll be speechless and devoid of words, and because it was used in that scene in A Field in England which may be apt, the morning after a Trump presidential victory.
posted by Wordshore at 4:48 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


You could easily make a list of elements of sharia law that any Christian Conservative would agree to endorse and then go "Surprise!" except you'd probably get your face shot off at one of the first 10 times you do it.
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:50 PM on October 29, 2016 [19 favorites]


Hahaha Trump accidentally confused his deplorables at the rally he's having in Phoenix.

He started in on the spiel about how horrible it is that the administration announced that they were going to invade Mosul before the fact, mockingly quoting them as "We're going to invade Mosul in two months... We're going to invade Mosul in one month... We're going to take out the leaders of ISIL..."

then he went on a side rant about how he doesn't like saying 'ISIL' instead of 'ISIS'*

then he went back to the main rant (mock-quoting Obama) "We're going to take out the leaders of ISIS

but then the deplorables went wild and he awkwardly had to remind them that they weren't supposed to cheer right now

Sad!

*I missed why this is horrible but apparently it is now
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:51 PM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


Did he happen to explain what he thought sharia law was?

Yeah, no, it seemed pretty clear that he didn't have any idea what he meant by Sharia law, other than that has something to do with "the Muslims" and is therefore a harbinger of the end times or something.
posted by dersins at 4:51 PM on October 29, 2016


I listened to this episode of TAL today, and it was frighteningly eye-opening

This is really fascinating. In a horrible way.

But at the end of the day, its the racism.
posted by mumimor at 4:52 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


I myself have to remind myself constantly that bombing the hell out of Muslim countries does not equal the US hates muslims. It really is a lot of work for me to buy the whole Dems are the non-racist corporate party.
posted by Strange_Robinson at 4:53 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


Kyrademon: I was depressingly incorrect in an earlier comment when I said he would come out of this election with a database of 2 million people. It turns out it's more like 14 million.

That's 14 million people who are rubes. They are marks. They are the sort of people who believe a foul, grabby loudmouth who tells them that they'll win, that they'll win so much they'll be sick of winning, just send in another $25. They'll keep on doing it - if it isn't the election, it will be money for "investigating" the results. Or to indict the President. Or something, anything, over and over.

Salieri: The story of the Trump supporter who committed voter fraud by voting twice actually makes me really sad.

When Trump calls on people to swallow lies about their friends and neighbours, to hate them, to believe that they're thieves and parasites and rapists, he is literally asking them to sacrifice their integrity. It's so much more valuable than a monetary contribution, because it's the gift that will keep on giving. Trump's followers cheer when he declares that he will tear the Republic apart. They're his now. Of course they'll commit crimes if they are persuaded that it's in the service of the Cause. We've seen this so many times before. It's a cult, it's a shared delusion, it's a revolutionary movement. And judging by previous experience, it will be around a long time, as long as Trump and his scions can milk it.
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:54 PM on October 29, 2016 [33 favorites]


Snopes traced that to a fake news article on National Report

http://www.snopes.com/politics/satire/sharia.asp
posted by tsuipen at 4:58 PM on October 29, 2016


I myself have to remind myself constantly that bombing the hell out of Muslim countries does not equal the US hates muslims. It really is a lot of work for me to buy the whole Dems are the non-racist corporate party.

I don't think the US "hates Muslims". By and large, even many (maybe most?) Republicans don't hate Muslims as such (though they may distrust or fear them).

However, I think it's accurate to say that the majority of Americans, and certainly the general policy of the US government, demonstrate fairly callous disregard for the lives of humans outside the borders of the US, with notable exceptions for people in western Europe and historically white-majority English-speaking nations.

Not sure that's better, particularly?
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:06 PM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


I listened to that TAL episode, and yes, so sad and scary.

There is a special level of disgust I feel for the people who lead those "meetings" where they are basically inventing reasons for people in that area to be afraid and teaching them to hate their own neighbors. Stoking fears of interracial dating, spreading lies about sharia taking over. They would deny up and down that they are racist (just just raising questions and using common sense, of course!) but this is exactly the type of bullshit that makes people receptive to the message of the white nationalists and neonazis.

My sister-in-law is one of those Somali immigrants who settled in the Twin Cities. She and my brother live just across the river in western Wisconsin in the small town I grew up in. I have never heard her complain about the community, but I experienced the narrow mindedness when I was a teenager there and couldn't get out fast enough. The people of Somerset, WI have a lot in common with the people of St. Cloud, MN and it makes me so very afraid for her and my one-year-old niece.
posted by chaoticgood at 5:09 PM on October 29, 2016 [15 favorites]


It's not that long ago I was an economics person; I believed that social injustice was more about economy and class than about race. If it were today, I would have been for Sanders in the US, and Corbyn in the UK.
Through my work, I learnt that is simply not at all true. Racism is the main driver of politics today. Even the anti-racist left politicians have to somehow placate the racists in order to get votes and gain influence.
posted by mumimor at 5:11 PM on October 29, 2016 [15 favorites]


Dearborn's pretty heavily Arab-American, to be (more than) fair.

Still not under Sharia law, though!

Great bakeries, though.

[It's how you can tell you've entered Dearborn from Detroit - the bakery density skyrockets.]
posted by Preserver at 5:16 PM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


I was having problems with my grandmother in regards to alternate political reality.

She's 85, hard of hearing and watching fox news supplemented by the news paper. She doesn't get out much- but she knows both of her adult children have significant money problems (money problems related to disability).and she is terrified of the government taking what she has At this point medicaid asset rules are a real concern, but she doesn't understand. In her mind, medicare is falling apart, an she can't get the care she wants at a cost that is acceptable to her.

Really I think that fox just reinforces the scarey things about life and she relates enough for it to be true. Because she isn't seeking out other sources it just reinforces itself.
posted by AlexiaSky at 5:16 PM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


I sometimes think white racism is due to how thoroughly commoditized white culture has become.
posted by Strange_Robinson at 5:18 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Let's take a trip down IOKIYAR Email Lane:

Like Clinton, the Bush White House used a private email server—its was owned by the Republican National Committee. And the Bush administration failed to store its emails, as required by law, and then refused to comply with a congressional subpoena seeking some of those emails. “It’s about as amazing a double standard as you can get,” says Eric Boehlert, who works with the pro-Clinton group Media Matters. “If you look at the Bush emails, he was a sitting president, and 95 percent of his chief advisers’ emails were on a private email system set up by the RNC. Imagine if for the last year and a half we had been talking about Hillary Clinton’s emails set up on a private DNC server?”

Most troubling, researchers found a suspicious pattern in the White House email system blackouts, including periods when there were no emails available from the office of Vice President Dick Cheney. “That the vice president’s office, widely characterized as the most powerful vice president in history, should have no archived emails in its accounts for scores of days—especially days when there was discussion of whether to invade Iraq—beggared the imagination,” says Thomas Blanton, director of the Washington-based National Security Archive.

posted by T.D. Strange at 5:23 PM on October 29, 2016 [66 favorites]


Dearborn's pretty heavily Arab-American, to be (more than) fair.

Still not under Sharia law, though!

Great bakeries, though.

[It's how you can tell you've entered Dearborn from Detroit - the bakery density skyrockets.]


I have to confess that my knowledge of Dearborn is mostly from a "foodie" perspective. I will say that as an obvious outsider I was never made to feel uncomfortable there. To the contrary, everyone I encountered in Dearborn seemed outgoing and friendly. I just don't get the hyped-up fear that people have of Arab people*, or muslims in general.

My main impression was of how great the food was. Not only bakeries, but restaurants as well. One place we went to got an "American Classic" award from the James Beard Society last year. Well deserved IMO.

* Pretty sure that many of the Arab-Americans in Dearborn are actually Chistian, not Muslim.
posted by Surely This at 5:30 PM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


Exclusive: FBI still does not have warrant to review new Abedin emails linked to Clinton probe

Holy shit. Comey really didn't think before pulling the trigger aimed at his genitals did he. The relevant FBI agents haven't/can't even look at the emails and he's sending out that letter and calling them "pertinent".
posted by Talez at 5:33 PM on October 29, 2016 [68 favorites]


This was anyway not about "trying to control" anyone's language, it was my opinion about someone else's wording.

My bad, understood, it's all good, namlit, but it is, as we all know here, easy to misread what people write sometimes.
posted by y2karl at 5:34 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


I just got a chance to visit the Arab-American National Museum in Dearborn, and it was awesome. And behind it is an incredible full grocery store with a bakery, prepared foods, gifts, candy, and groceries from around the Arab world. Highly, highly recommended. Also, I learned a lot about the history of Arab-descended people in the US; I thought I was pretty well versed already, but no, I wasn't, and I learned a lot more.
posted by Miko at 5:34 PM on October 29, 2016 [28 favorites]


I sometimes think white racism is due to how thoroughly commoditized white culture has become.

How do you mean? (Honest question - I'm not quite connecting the dots here but I'm intrigued.)
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:37 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


with notable exceptions for people in western Europe

Are you forgetting Strategic Air Command's repeated firebombing of German cities? The US Military doesn't discriminate when it comes to raining bombs down on our enemies. Heck we maintain an entire nuclear arsenal on a hair trigger ready to kill the whole world just in case it is necessary. Feel better? Me neither.
posted by humanfont at 5:37 PM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


Exclusive: FBI still does not have warrant to review new Abedin emails linked to Clinton probe
As of Saturday night, the FBI had still not gotten approval from the Justice Department for a warrant that would allow agency officials to read any of the newly discovered Abedin emails, and therefore are still in the dark about whether they include any classified material that the bureau has not already seen.

“We do not have a warrant,” a senior law enforcement official said. “Discussions are under way [between the FBI and the Justice Department] as to the best way to move forward.”

That Comey and other senior FBI officials were not aware of what was in the emails — and whether they contained any material the FBI had not already obtained — is important because Donald Trump’s campaign and Republicans in Congress have suggested that the FBI director would not have written his letter unless he had been made aware of significant new emails that might justify reopening the investigation into the Clinton server.

But a message that Comey wrote to all FBI agents Friday seeking to explain his decision to write the controversial letter strongly hinted that investigators did not not yet have legal authority establishing “probable cause” to review the content of Abedin’s emails on Weiner’s electronic devices.

In that message, Comey told agents that he had only been briefed on Thursday about the matter and that the “recommendation” of investigators was “with respect to seeking access to emails that have recently been found in an unrelated case.”
posted by cashman at 5:39 PM on October 29, 2016 [11 favorites]


What if Donald Trump Won With a GOP Congress? | AM Joy | MSNBC

Lawrence O’Donnell attempts to lower the JCPL.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:40 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


Are you forgetting Strategic Air Command's repeated firebombing of German cities?

No; but I don't think it's excusing Dresden to say that the US generally saw Germans as fully realized human beings even in the depths of World War II. I don't think our current foreign policy demonstrates the same recognition of a shared humanity with persons whose ancestry is from south or east of the Mediterranean.
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:42 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


i've driven through dearborn on outer dr - you could see the sharia in the air, like a dense fog or something ...

no, that was me smoking - never mind
posted by pyramid termite at 5:42 PM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


I have to confess that my knowledge of Dearborn is mostly from a "foodie" perspective. I will say that as an obvious outsider I was never made to feel uncomfortable there. To the contrary, everyone I encountered in Dearborn seemed outgoing and friendly. I just don't get the hyped-up fear that people have of Arab people*, or muslims in general.

My main impression was of how great the food was. Not only bakeries, but restaurants as well. One place we went to got an "American Classic" award from the James Beard Society last year. Well deserved IMO.

* Pretty sure that many of the Arab-Americans in Dearborn are actually Chistian, not Muslim.


Not anymore. It's true that the first Middle Eastern immigrants in Dearborn were Christian (Lebanese, Armenian, etc.) but it is now majority Muslim (Dearborn is about 40% Arab American). There's a large Chaldean community in Sterling Heights and other pockets of Christian Arabs are scattered around. The metro Detroit Arab-American community is notable for its lack of sectarianism. Not to say that there aren't class and other divides, just that Middle Eastern sectarian conflicts tend not to be carried over.

Yes, the food is excellent even beyond the numerous bakeries!
posted by Preserver at 5:44 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


It's an interesting and a helpful question, actually: what would the foreign policy of a superpower committed to recognizing the universal nature of human rights look like? That's where progressives should be dragging the conversation after (turn, turn, turn, curse, spit, etc.)
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:45 PM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


The metro Detroit Arab-American community is notable for the lack of sectarianism. Not to say that there aren't class and other divides, just that Middle Eastern sectarian conflicts tend not to be carried over.

Wow, it's almost like the intractable, eternal clash of religions and tribes gets better when people aren't living in situations where their communities aren't constantly pitted against one another!
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:47 PM on October 29, 2016 [36 favorites]


i've driven through dearborn on outer dr - you could see the sharia in the air, like a dense fog or something ...

no, that was me smoking - never mind


More likely you were looking toward Zug Island.
posted by Preserver at 5:51 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


or they all have another community they can look down upon and oppress
posted by pyramid termite at 5:52 PM on October 29, 2016


I just don't get the hyped-up fear that people have of Arab people*, or muslims in general.

It's most likely due to a combination of xenophobia, fear of the unknown, and a political party that is all too ready to exploit those fears for their own gain by trumping up "we don't know what they're going to do, we better be careful" rumors.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 5:53 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


heh - i had a friend who lived in delray off of e jefferson and if the wind was blowing the right way, her windshield would be covered with soot from zug island

which is several miles from dearborn, you know ...
posted by pyramid termite at 5:53 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Probable cause isn't a hugely high bar, but I guess there's a real question as to what the FBI would be investigating. If it's improper storage of classified information on the Abedin/Weiner laptop, what's the probable cause to believe there are classified emails, separate from the emails already reviewed by the FBI, on the laptop, and how do make an argument specific to this laptop that wouldn't apply to any government employee with a security clearance who owns a personal laptop and an email account? And, at least for emails from earlier in Clinton's time as Secretary, would the statue of limitations have already lapsed?
posted by zachlipton at 5:54 PM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


I know it's been said in lots of places recently, including here, but the Clinton campaign really needs to do something to change this narrative. This latest email thing is nothing but a zilchpickle (thanks, Devonian) on top of the giant nothingburger that has been this entire emails non-scandal, but there's not much going on in the election right now and there's nothing else to really chew on over this weekend. They need to come out on Monday morning with a new story that has some real meat to it, so that the press can have something else to talk about going forward. It's coming down to the wire here, and a lot hinges on the Clinton campaign's ability to keep their own supporters fired up while making Trump-leaning voters feel as disgusted as possible with the Republican candidate.

If Hillary wants a Democratic congress to help her get some shit done in her first two years, she needs turnout to be in her favor. The biggest part of that is not so much about getting out the vote with her own base—though that's important, and her campaign is all over it—but rather a matter of getting the folks in the mushy middle pissed off enough at Trump that they show up at the polls just to vote against him, and getting some of the long-term Republican partisans who are uncomfortable with Trump but who would normally vote for him just because he's who their team is fielding this year to feel disgusted enough that they stay home or leave the Presidential spot on the ballot blank.

To achieve that, she needs to be on top in the media narrative going into the final stretch. The country was pretty livid when the Billy Bush video came out, but that's mostly died down now and some voters are beginning to drift back toward Trump. This new emails thing is just a blip, but we're now in the part of the canpaign where blips matter. If she has any good oppo that she's been sitting on, we're coming up on the time when she should unleash it.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 5:59 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


My hunch is that they're not sitting on anything. It's getting a bit late for an October surprise. In three days, it'll be November.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:03 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Putting out the October Surprise in November would certainly be unexpected
posted by thelonius at 6:06 PM on October 29, 2016 [34 favorites]


Yeah, I'm kinda feeling that too. Regardless though, she needs to fond some way to grab the media by its nose ring and make it look at something else. If I were her though and I had one big bomb to drop, I'd be saving it for the evening of November 6th, so that it would have one full news cycle to run and would still be maximally fresh on the actual 8th. Right now she needs to take the media's gaze off herself and put it back on Trump—so if she has two bombs, now is the time to use the first one—but the final 48 hours will probably be the most critical.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 6:08 PM on October 29, 2016


Less time for people to forget about it? It seems like some people are persuaded to vote against Trump by some scandal but then drift back to him in about a week.
posted by dilaudid at 6:09 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


GOP braces for turmoil after Election Day
“It’s like Humpty Dumpty fell and broke, then a giant lawn mower ran over it, acid was thrown on the pieces — and a bunch of racist idiots ran off with an arm and a leg,” said John Weaver, a longtime Republican consultant. “How do you put it back together? I don’t know.”
posted by kirkaracha at 6:11 PM on October 29, 2016 [14 favorites]


Typically the election would be earlier in November than this year's, though - there's plenty of time for more Surprises. The news of Bush's DUI came out on the Friday before the election.
posted by janewman at 6:11 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


The news of Bush's DUI came out on the Friday before the election.

Which changed everything, of course.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:12 PM on October 29, 2016 [10 favorites]


Oh, no, no more surprises, please. I mean, if this is just the tip of the iceberg of what's coming in the next 10 days ...
posted by StrawberryPie at 6:13 PM on October 29, 2016


A thought occurs. If Trump wins what's the chance of Attorney General Giuliani firing the team leading the contempt charges against Arpaio?

Pretty much 100%. Surely you don't expect Giuliani to uphold a case against the Secretary of Homeland Security?
posted by duffell at 6:18 PM on October 29, 2016 [12 favorites]


At least I have a Halloween costume: an IOS notification saying: Anthony Weiner wants to FaceTime with you.
posted by shothotbot at 6:22 PM on October 29, 2016 [20 favorites]


Media narrative makes a marginal difference, to be sure, but I think the variance in outcome is mostly determined already by the ground game. Unfortunately, we don't have any real precedent to look at in terms of what the difference between a top-notch GOTV effort vs. basically nothing will be.

What I mean is, if you assume that Sam Wang's Meta-margin is basically accurate, Hillary is currently more likely than not to get between 3-5 percent of the popular vote. That translates into an EV win pretty similar to Obama '12 (solid but not overwhelming) and a gain of perhaps 10-15 House seats. I imagine that if horse-race coverage ends up being stupid email nothingburgers for the next week, she may end toward the bottom of that range; and conversely, if this ends up being a two-day story Trumped by some other idiocy that Donald says / does / is accused of / is seen on video doing, maybe she gets toward the top of that range.

But it is also entirely possible that the massive ground game advantage may noticeably drive the Dem turnout up. And I think that's the best hope that we have to turn the House red and to deliver the stinging rebuke to fascism that we actually need to be able to turn the page on this horrible year. Frustratingly, though, this wasn't foreseen or built into the poll forecasts (and how would that even work?), so it's sort of an open question that could mean nothing or could mean a net 3%? or even 5%?!?! advantage toward Clinton and downballot Dems.

I'm not trying to unskew the polls, here: I'm saying there's a genuine factor that wasn't included because no one anticipated how awful the GOP-Trump coordination efforts would be.

This ground-game effect is either already true, or it isn't true (or so minor as to be irrelevant): but we won't know until the votes start to be counted.

Call it Schrödinger's Ballot Box.
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:24 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


“It’s like Humpty Dumpty fell and broke, then a giant lawn mower ran over it, acid was thrown on the pieces — and a bunch of racist idiots ran off with an arm and a leg,” said John Weaver, a longtime Republican consultant. “How do you put it back together? I don’t know.”

You stuff as much as your shitty agenda through the statehouses as you can knowing you've at least got a few million wage slaves that can be dismissed if they display insubordination like daring to ask for a living wage.
posted by Talez at 6:26 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


Ahh, by 'Turn the House red' above I of course meant 'blue'. I'll blame it on the fact that a friend from Canada was staying with me this weekend and I must have switched my mental partisan colo(u)rs around again
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:26 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Sharia courts do of course exist in America and even receive a bit of official recognition and support: namely, the same status accorded to batei din, Canon Law courts, and a great variety of other religious and secular non-binding arbitration systems. They're opt-in and pretty much the only way they're officially recognized as far as I can tell (IANAL) is that, if the disputants in a civil case agree to the judgment of these non-governmental courts, the governmental judiciary considers their role in the dispute complete and will butt out.
posted by jackbishop at 6:27 PM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


What I mean is, if you assume that Sam Wang's Meta-margin is basically accurate, Hillary is currently more likely than not to get between 3-5 percent of the popular vote.

Are you trying to kill Justinian?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:29 PM on October 29, 2016 [29 favorites]


Sharia courts do of course exist in America and even receive a bit of official recognition and support: namely, the same status accorded to batei din, Canon Law courts, and a great variety of other religious and secular non-binding arbitration systems. They're opt-in and pretty much the only way they're officially recognized as far as I can tell (IANAL) is that, if the disputants in a civil case agree to the judgment of these non-governmental courts, the governmental judiciary considers their role in the dispute complete and will butt out.

Exactly. The only thing that's literally different than other people and their religion is brown skin.

It's like when people complain about their food being turned halal and all you can do is facepalm at the stupidity of demanding [x product] not be certified halal.
posted by Talez at 6:30 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


What is white culture? Country music? Polo? Disney? Indiscriminate murder of non-whites?

Maybe it was too universalized, whatever white culture is/was. This white boy certainly cannot explain what white culture is.

Modern US rock music, for example, while it still has some cache, is a pale imitation of tired formulas. Why did it become that way? I figure it's because the MBA type's got ahold of it, but who knows. It's largely not authentic, been market tested into sterility, and rarely has much interesting to say.

One small anecdote:

A metal-head buddy of mine told me once he couldn't get into hip-hop from the misogyny. That kinda statement I like to call soft-racism. I'm like, dude, have you listened to much metal?

It's a kind of projection taking place there. Inferiority masking itself as disapproval of the other. Pure shadow stuff in Jungian terms. He knows as well as I know that endless repetition of AC/DC is not worth doing.

White culture is only real in opposition to the other.

As a final side point, I predict the Republicans will expand the definition of white around the time the so-called demographic turn occurs. It's already happening with their courting of hispanic-whites. Plenty of mestizo and native hate there to keep on keeping on with their current strategies. As long as the definition of white comprises 51% of the country, they can keep going like they have been.

I owe a great deal of debt to Coates on these points.
posted by Strange_Robinson at 6:30 PM on October 29, 2016 [13 favorites]


Are you forgetting Strategic Air Command's repeated firebombing of German cities?

Not to be too pedantic but the Strategic Air Command was formed in 1947 and, the saturation bombing of Dresden and Hamburg aside, deliberate firebombing with gelled gasoline was something more done to the Japanese. Over 100,000 civilians died in the raid on Tokyo.

And as to the deliberate bombing of civilians in the Second World War, many argue was the Germans who started it. But Britain and the United States were the ones who came up with, expanded and rationalized the concept of strategic bombing, i.e., of civilian populations in industrial cities, so your point is not without merit.
posted by y2karl at 6:32 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


namely, the same status accorded to batei din, Canon Law courts, and a great variety of other religious and secular non-binding arbitration systems

My understanding was that they were binding. It may vary by jurisdiction.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:33 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Are you trying to kill Justinian?

I've been operating for a good month now on the assumption that the revenant JCPL has long since fully inhabited the desiccated fingers of Justinian's corpse in an epic quest to spread its reign of panic across the blue and beyond.
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:35 PM on October 29, 2016 [15 favorites]


Trump and Pence have found out that Egg McMuffin exists.

Spoiler: He's "Bill Kristol's puppet".

My understanding was that they were binding. It may vary by jurisdiction.

They're officially non-binding but ex-communication and/or shunning from a community is a powerful thing. Hell, some Jewish women don't get remarried because they don't can't get a Get from their ex-husband despite their secular divorce being legal.
posted by Talez at 6:35 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


White people created classical music, shuffleboard, licorice, and many other things.
posted by thelonius at 6:35 PM on October 29, 2016 [13 favorites]


Spoiler: He's "Bill Kristol's puppet".

No puppet! No puppet! You're the puppet! NO YOU'RE THE PUPPET!
posted by Justinian at 6:37 PM on October 29, 2016 [50 favorites]


Puppet! You're the puppet! He's the puppet! Everyone's the puppet! Puppets for everyone! Putin gets a puppet! Puppets, puppets everywhere!

non-edit: Curse you, revenant JCPL! You can steal my friend Justinian's body but you can never have my puppet mockery!
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:39 PM on October 29, 2016 [10 favorites]


Guys, I think my adrenaline receptors are burning out. It's not a good feeling.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:41 PM on October 29, 2016 [12 favorites]


It's like when people complain about their food being turned halal and all you can do is facepalm at the stupidity of demanding [x product] not be certified halal.

I remember a story from years back, that said airlines just served the Kosher meal if someone requested Halal, since it technically fit. Now I'm wondering if I remember that right.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:43 PM on October 29, 2016


White people created classical music, shuffleboard, licorice, and many other things.

You've reminded me of a bit from the Mockumentary "C.S.A.", which is an alternative-history look at "what the history of the country would maybe have been if the Confederacy won the Civil War". There's a bit from the "1960s" which discusses the cultural revolution brought about when the culture of Canada - vitalized by artistic freedom - catches the eye of the people on the southern side of "the Cotton Curtain", compared to what they had for entertainment.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 6:47 PM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


I think there's enough overlap between halal and kosher that airline meals are probably designed to meet criteria for both. I'm afraid to say more since we are probably already doomed to have a (fascinating, but incredibly off-topic) long derail about the minutiae thereof
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:47 PM on October 29, 2016 [8 favorites]


They were't 'white' when classical music was made. White as a concept is pretty young in historical terms. I suspect it only came to matter because of slavery here in the states. Licorice was Egyptian, yea? Can't speak to shuffleboard though.

The current definition of white is not the same as it was even twenty years ago. For instance, it's relatively recent that Jews got lumped in with whites. I suspect that is what's driving much of the anti-semitism above and beyond the cover of tired WW2 retreads.
posted by Strange_Robinson at 6:47 PM on October 29, 2016 [11 favorites]


As a final side point, I predict the Republicans will expand the definition of white around the time the so-called demographic turn occurs. It's already happening with their courting of hispanic-whites. Plenty of mestizo and native hate there to keep on keeping on with their current strategies. As long as the definition of white comprises 51% of the country, they can keep going like they have been.

Next up: the GOP culturally appropriates the paper bag test and starts to deploy it (on the q.t., of course) on Hispanic voters.
posted by fuse theorem at 6:50 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


Sharia courts do of course exist in America and even receive a bit of official recognition and support: namely, the same status accorded to batei din, Canon Law courts, and a great variety of other religious and secular non-binding arbitration systems. They're opt-in and pretty much the only way they're officially recognized as far as I can tell.

Don't forget Judge Judy.
posted by JackFlash at 6:52 PM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


I think there's enough overlap between halal and kosher that airline meals are probably designed to meet criteria for both. I'm afraid to say more since we are probably already doomed to have a (fascinating, but incredibly off-topic) long derail about the minutiae thereof

Yeah, I was just wondering about the emphasis on halal food, versus kosher. But /derail.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:54 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Meanwhile, today, in bluest of the blue Massachusetts, members of the police union in the Boston suburb of Medford joined in a fall festival by "arresting" somebody in a Hillary Clinton outfit and palling around with a Trump impersonator. They originally posted the photos to their Facebook page, but for some reason took them down after some gloomy Gusses began complaining about stuff like impartiality and fairness.
posted by adamg at 6:59 PM on October 29, 2016 [44 favorites]


White as a concept is pretty young in historical terms. I suspect it only came to matter because of slavery here in the states.

The Origins of Institutionalized Racism – a System to Control Blacks … and Whites
Why is there such a system that has a solid foundation and that has existed all this time, and is so deeply ingrained? Why is there institutionalized racism? If one accepts such a premise, that there is such a thing, then the most obvious answer is that it exists to control blacks, African-Americans. And to control other minorities, Mexican-Americans, Native Americans.

Yet this system is not meant to only control blacks – and other peoples of color – but it also is meant to control white people.
...
[Howard] Zinn and [Theodore] Allen both describe how in the early years of the 1600s in the colonies, slavery had not yet been regularized or legalized, even though there was already a developing pattern of unequal treatment. Zinn discovered evidence in the 17th century showed that where whites and blacks found themselves with common problems, common work, and a common enemy in their master, they behaved toward one another as equals.
...
The colonial rulers learned that the only way to survive and maintain control was to keep their enemies divided. They learned that by developing a system of inequality between the black and white servants, they could mold the allegiance of the English poor to the masters.

The colonial assemblies began passing measures that over time – over a half century at least, piece by piece, law by law, began constructing “the slavery codes” – that developed this unequal treatment of whites and blacks. At first, measures were passed outlawing sexual relations between blacks and whites – installing worse penalties and punishments for blacks. This dichotomy in how people were being treated, built an unequal structure of racial slavery, where black laborers were slaves but white laborers were not slaves. This was the beginnings of institutionalized racism – a system based on the unequal treatment of whites and blacks.
...
Only one fear was greater than the fear of black rebellion in the new American colonies. That was the fear that discontented whites would join black slaves to overthrow the existing order.
posted by kirkaracha at 6:59 PM on October 29, 2016 [24 favorites]


Classical music is still being made. And the standard repertoire of the classical music industry was mostly composed at the height of African slavery, and paid for with the profits of empire, including slavery and genocide. Beethoven isn't Plato.
posted by spitbull at 7:00 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


Same interview, Trump says he could take Diamond Joe.
posted by Talez at 7:01 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


I live in Medford and those photos are (a) par for the course and (b) depressing.
posted by pxe2000 at 7:06 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


Qallunaat - an ethnographic study of white people. (Previously)
posted by eviemath at 7:10 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


[Everybody rein in your multiple branching derails and cut back on the one-line referent-free snark!]
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 7:11 PM on October 29, 2016 [8 favorites]


Oh, and the guy on the right side of the photo showing Clinton under arrest is the union president.
posted by adamg at 7:13 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


Oh, and the guy on the right side of the photo showing Clinton under arrest is the union president.

The phrase he used in his please explain to the local news was:
"These were Halloween costumes. It was meant totally as a joke. I apologize if this offended anyone in any way. I never expected this sort of reaction. It was poor judgment on my part," said MacGilvray.
JUST A PRANK, BRO!
posted by Talez at 7:16 PM on October 29, 2016 [10 favorites]


Why isn't doing this in uniform an instant firing?

What the hell.
posted by Yowser at 7:20 PM on October 29, 2016 [17 favorites]


Meanwhile, today, in bluest of the blue Massachusetts, members of the police union in the Boston suburb of Medford joined in a fall festival by "arresting" somebody in a Hillary Clinton outfit and palling around with a Trump impersonator.

Jesus christ. I am so fucking tired of this election. Those cops should be suspended.

I'm historically a Republican voter (in MA it's a different landcape; I've been registered independent my whole life). I have done so because (a) I'm not a big fan of one-party states and (b) I honestly do think that there's been a lot of reasonable compromise found between the Democratic controlled state congress and the often Republican governor or other officials. So sure, at the national level there's some bullshit, but at the state level I feel like it's a different story.

At this point though ... fuck that. I voted today (woohoo, early voting). I voted straight-ticket Democrat, for the first time in my life. At this point, I don't give a shit if you're running for dog catcher: if you're still associated with the Republican party, I want you the fuck out of any possible position of power.
posted by tocts at 7:20 PM on October 29, 2016 [144 favorites]


Why isn't doing this in uniform an instant firing?

What the hell.


Contracts with police unions that make it basically impossible to fire a cop who shows nothing but contempt for the rule of law? Just a guess.
posted by duffell at 7:21 PM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


Ali Vitali ‏@alivitali Man shouts at press pen (and spits on me in the process of shouting) that we are the "enemy" who must be defeated & then screamed "JEW-S-A"

This incident happened here in Phoenix, and I am absolutely livid.
According to Clara Jeffery, editor-in-chief of Mother Jones, the reporter was able to get security to remove him as a dangerous threat. But the Trump campaign claims the reason he was facing away from Trump (and toward the press area) was to show his disagreement with Trump's talking points about voter suppression.

I mean, come on.
posted by Superplin at 7:24 PM on October 29, 2016 [10 favorites]


Contracts with police unions that make it basically impossible to fire a cop who shows nothing but contempt for the rule of law? Just a guess.

Nothing makes me seriously reconsider my support of public unions than the police unions.
posted by tclark at 7:24 PM on October 29, 2016 [30 favorites]


Medford Police have had one or two other problems over the past year.
posted by adamg at 7:26 PM on October 29, 2016


There have been a bunch of new events added to Hillary's campaign schedule (unaffiliated page but links to official events) for the coming week. Hillary will be in Cincinnati on Halloween and in Florida the next day, then North Carolina on the 3rd.

President Obama will be in Columbus on Tuesday, then North Carolina on Wednesday, and Jacksonville & South Florida on Thursday. He'll be on Real Time with Bill Maher on HBO on Friday night.

America's dad is doing early voting events in Michigan tomorrow, North Carolina on Monday, Wisconsin on Tuesday, and Iowa on Wednesday.
posted by cashman at 7:27 PM on October 29, 2016 [5 favorites]


unaffiliated page but links to official events

Pretty sure it's affiliated. The campaign site links to there. Not sure why it's a different URL.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:31 PM on October 29, 2016


Oh, and today I discovered that one of the local Democratic Party employees is a former student. She'd always looked familiar, but I am terrible at connecting names and faces out of context, so she had the advantage of knowing my name. When I turned in my canvassing packet (after three hours in the nearly 100-degree heat, because Phoenix in late October), she shyly said, "So, I think you were my professor..."

We high-fived over her excellent career choices.
posted by Superplin at 7:32 PM on October 29, 2016 [35 favorites]


> That's 14 million people who are rubes. They are marks.
When American Gods premieres early next year, I'm afraid I'm going to be reminded of Trump's sleaziness when get to Wednesday's seductions and grifting.
posted by Fiberoptic Zebroid and The Hypnagogic Jerks at 7:34 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


Pretty sure it's affiliated. The campaign site links to there. Not sure why it's a different URL.

I thought so too - then I noticed their disclaimer recently. "Hillary Clinton Speeches is not affiliated with Hillary Clinton, her representatives, or Hillary for America."
posted by cashman at 7:36 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


(In case anyone is keeping track, this was GOTV date #2. There isn't going to be a #3.)
posted by Superplin at 7:38 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Tomorrow Trump is in Vegas, CO and NM (?), then MI for two events on Monday (??).

Liz Mair (who's working w/ Johnson) suggests that it's because Rs in NM and MI are going L, but also that he's been baited into going there and wants to rage against Gov. Martinez and Ford Motors. Pence is in NH and FL on his strange parallel campaign.
posted by holgate at 7:40 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Has anybody at the Trump campaign ever looked at a map? Either an electoral map or just a geographic one. Because nothing about the schedule of his events makes any sense by either standard.
posted by zachlipton at 7:46 PM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


So it turned out tonight that one of the guys at our board gaming table was all in for Trump. When asked why, he said he thought Hillary was the "more warlike candidate."

When it was pointed out things Trump has said, he first went with "well, he didn't say that." and when it was pointed out that "yeah, he did, here's proof," he instead went with the more nuanced defense of "well, that's not what he meant. It's not his policy."

So he... doesn't believe that what Trump says is his policies for office are what his real policies, I guess, but he's still voting for him based on... apparently some secret policy agenda that he did not actually say? I dunno. The discussion trailed off at that point, and I decided I'd rather spend my energy elsewhere tonight than deal with the dude.

Still, I'm going "I don't grok how anyone could believe those aren't his real policies, and be voting for him without knowing what his 'real policies' are, if those are not they." The sheer mental contortions involved here are maddening.

Of course, I suspect the real answer is dude is just anti-Hillary.
posted by Archelaus at 7:46 PM on October 29, 2016 [18 favorites]


Yeah there is no good reason for Trump to burn a valuable day in Michigan, where he's being very solidly beaten by Clinton.

He might as well campaign in Vermont for all the good it will do him.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:48 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


i don't know whether anyone's been keeping tabs on certain right leaning websites, but at least judging from zero hedge, people are totally losing their shit and trying to come up with any and all conspiracy theories to explain why trump's going to lose the election (when he's not going to win it, ah ha ha ha)

why hasn't it occurred to these people that trump's just an asshole and we just don't plain fucking want an asshole for our president?

is that really hard to understand?
posted by pyramid termite at 7:49 PM on October 29, 2016 [18 favorites]


Erick Erickson Is Sorry About Some of the Things He Has Said. Prompted by a personal health crisis (although it refers to his mounting medical expenses, no opinion in there of Obamacare), and threats received after he dis-invited Trump to an event he sponsored.
posted by oneswellfoop at 7:50 PM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


(In case anyone is keeping track, this was GOTV date #2. There isn't going to be a #3.)
Is that a comment on GOTV or your date?

I'm officially completely overwhelmed. I did GOTV all day both days for the past two weekends, and this weekend I have off but I have to study for a computer science exam on Tuesday for which I am completely, woefully unprepared. Work is nuts, and I just realized that I'm due to get my period on Sunday of GOTV. I hope it will be late, because I'm tethered to a staging location in some random person's house for the entire day, and I don't want to flush tampons down their toilet, but I also don't want to leave dirty tampons in their trashcan. These are not the GOTV problems that they tell you about in GOTV training.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:51 PM on October 29, 2016 [25 favorites]


I've been reading Erickson this year and despite his history I think he is going some sincere rethinking of his views and it's interesting to follow.
posted by spitbull at 7:52 PM on October 29, 2016 [11 favorites]


The Trump campaign firmly believes all public polls are rigged, so evaluating his scheduling based on our perception of facts is futile. Trump is convinced he's in a dead heat, and white midwest states are still his secret path to victory, because all of his hidden, white, first time voters are there. That's his only hope, so that's what they're still playing for.

At this point anyone who knows better inside the Trump campaign also knows there's no point in making any real effort to run a coherent strategy over the next 9-10 days. Either a few million extra white people show up for Trump, or he loses.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:55 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


Egg is going for the jugular. Go Egg.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:55 PM on October 29, 2016 [36 favorites]


ArbitraryAndCapricious: Is that a comment on GOTV or your date?

Oh, I'll be doing plenty more GOTV (even though, like you, I'm overwhelmed and have a big deadline this week for which I'm way behind). Just unaccompanied from now on.

Sadly, I know he won't bother to keep volunteering on his own, either. (This fact encapsulates some of why he's been voted off my personal island.)
posted by Superplin at 7:58 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


Has anybody at the Trump campaign ever looked at a map? Either an electoral map or just a geographic one. Because nothing about the schedule of his events makes any sense by either standard.

It makes sense as cover for a string of diamond heists.
posted by drezdn at 8:01 PM on October 29, 2016 [30 favorites]


So Egg is a shadowy morally ambiguous intelligence apparatchik but he's OUR shadowy morally ambiguous intelligence apparatchik!
posted by Justinian at 8:02 PM on October 29, 2016 [28 favorites]


Tomorrow Trump is in Vegas, CO and NM (?), then MI for two events on Monday (??)

Seems legit. HuffPost Pollster: Nevada (Clinton +2.3), Colorado (Clinton +5.1), New Mexico (Clinton +9.3), Michigan (Clinton +7.3).

It makes sense as cover for a string of diamond heists.

Maybe he's mapping out a sad face across the US.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:03 PM on October 29, 2016 [15 favorites]


So Egg is a shadowy morally ambiguous intelligence apparatchik but he's OUR shadowy morally ambiguous intelligence apparatchik!
Pretty much.

It's so weird that in a week and a half, this will be over. What are we all going to do with all that excess emotional energy?
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:03 PM on October 29, 2016 [17 favorites]


I've been reading Erickson this year and despite his history I think he is going some sincere rethinking of his views and it's interesting to follow.

It does seem like he is and that's very much a good thing.

I'm sorry that his wife is ill, I'm sorry that he's having to deal with medical bills and such, I'm sorry that people are making death threats to him and his family. That's just awful.

But: it's just so tiresome to watch these whiny asshole conservatives who have spent so much time spreading shit, and then they show up to get their gold star stickers because their BS is actually catching up to them on a personal level. It just feels like they're only moving as far and as quickly as they are comfortable moving. They're still setting their own timetable for "evolution", and that in itself is a massive privilege.

I just want one -- ONE -- of them to stand up and say, "wow, you know what? I really fucked up and spent a really long time not listening to POC and women and low-income people, and I used my platform to hurt a lot of people, and now I'm going to sit down and shut up for a bit. The only time you're going to hear from me for the next X number of months is when I'm sharing what I'm learning or amplifying the voices that I spent so much time silencing."
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:04 PM on October 29, 2016 [67 favorites]


Egg's going to be on Meet the Press tomorrow, by the way.

I wish panel members on the Sunday morning shows would just turn anything Trump to Egg v Trump. Like Trump, you're not even on Hillary's level to have a discussion yet. Here. Battle with Egg.
posted by cashman at 8:04 PM on October 29, 2016 [16 favorites]


I remember the 1980 election, WWF and D&D Saturdays.
And I remember watching the WWF and yelling "that's rigged!" (Duh) so I was teased until we got to the 'Tomb of Horrors'. Which is rigged!
posted by clavdivs at 8:04 PM on October 29, 2016 [4 favorites]


If you have ANY emotional energy LEFT when this is over... get a sportsball team to root for.
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:06 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


What are we all going to do with all that excess emotional energy?

I'm pretty sure if we don't elect a Fascist on the Tuesday after next, a bunch of us will expend it that night yelling praises into the air and celebrating.
posted by cashman at 8:06 PM on October 29, 2016 [13 favorites]


I early voted in South Florida (read: blue Florida) today. 30 minute wait in drizzley rain. Lots of PoC and women. I felt encouraged.
posted by gatorae at 8:06 PM on October 29, 2016 [30 favorites]


Contracts with police unions that make it basically impossible to fire a cop who shows nothing but contempt for the rule of law?

Unions generally make sure that there is a process to follow, and effective grievance procedures when management doesn't follow the process. I am not familiar with police unions specifically, but in my experience with academic unions and the tenure system, there can also be an issue of management not being particularly good at documenting employees' performance in a way that would support eg. firing or other disciplinary action for an employee who is engaged in gross misconduct. (And on the flip side, management may not always be particularly good at documenting and rewarding positive job performance either.) In general, managers can do an awful lot in terms of setting workplace culture. I'm not a fan of police unions based on their political positions and past actions, but I wouldn't lay all of this on them.

I just want one -- ONE -- of them to stand up and say, "wow, you know what? I really fucked up and spent a really long time not listening to POC and women and low-income people, and I used my platform to hurt a lot of people, and now I'm going to sit down and shut up for a bit. The only time you're going to hear from me for the next X number of months is when I'm sharing what I'm learning or amplifying the voices that I spent so much time silencing."

Well, there was the recent story about the son of the guy who founded Stormfront having repudiated white nationalism, and working with the SPLC to help reverse some of the damage his earlier efforts had caused?
posted by eviemath at 8:09 PM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


In Florida, 99% more Latinos have voted this year than at this point in 2012.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:10 PM on October 29, 2016 [37 favorites]


I live in Massachusetts. Such is my rage over this Medford police thing that I cannot coherently express it here. Rest assured though that I am doing what I can elsewhere to help blow this up. This event is a perfect example of what is wrong with our police force in this country: they share the values and worldview of Donald Trump. These fuckers live in such a bubble of alt-right propaganda that they actually expected to be celebrated for this display. I am incandescent with fury right now.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 8:11 PM on October 29, 2016 [58 favorites]


Yeah. That's a really good example, actually, that I'd forgotten about. Derek Black.
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:12 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


The polls are rigged", says white female Trump supporter after she's arrested for voter fraud..

Well is the past is any indication I will being spending at least a day flucuating between feeling like I need to run around in circles and sitting quietly while I have a really good cry.

Any time I've spent time under emotional stress this happens when it's over. Doesn't matter what it is, good or bad.
posted by Jalliah at 8:13 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


So he... doesn't believe that what Trump says is his policies for office are what his real policies, I guess, but he's still voting for him based on... apparently some secret policy agenda that he did not actually say?

This is one of the most common "arguments" I've seen from otherwise "reasonable" people, and it's infuriating. He won't actually do any of the things he says or has been repeatedly implicated in, you see, and here are the things he will actually do, based on nothing but my personal conjecture.
posted by Behemoth at 8:24 PM on October 29, 2016 [13 favorites]


...Because nothing about the schedule of his events makes any sense by either standard.

It makes sense as cover for a string of diamond heists.


That would be about the only way for Trump's entire presidential campaign to make any sense.
posted by Flashman at 8:26 PM on October 29, 2016 [8 favorites]


Egg seems very excited he gets to throw a punch on Twitter:
.@realDonaldTrump, Yes you’ve never heard of me because while you were harassing women at beauty pageants, I was fighting terrorists abroad.
--@Evan_McMullin
posted by zachlipton at 8:27 PM on October 29, 2016 [50 favorites]


I'm conflicted about police unions as well. Even though I'm on the management side by position, I'm also a big believer in unions as a concept. I even like our union well enough (though, they tend to be kind of... well not INcompetent, just less effective than they could be).

I try to imagine what is so gross about police unions, and then identify exactly what it is they do that I wouldn't expect our union to do. Insist on procedure? Represent the employee? Bargain for contract provisions to the best of their ability?

The only thing that makes our union different than the police one is: ours genuinely feels that it's in their interest and their other members' interests to get rid of genuinely problematic people. For every shit head, there are dozens of good employees wishing that person would get what's coming to them. They have been known to decline to represent employees (past a certain point, or to do so only on due process.) Since I genuinely don't want to screw anyone over, we don't really conflict very often. Extremely rarely, in fact. But maybe all managements aren't like mine, and so the unions can't be like the one we have without getting run over.

The police unions seem to have made the decision a long time ago that membership would appreciate more of a "employee, right or wrong" defense-lawyer-like zealotry. And now it's self-reinforcing. That is what they're like, so that's what the membership expects.
posted by ctmf at 8:28 PM on October 29, 2016 [7 favorites]


The close relationship between police and prosecutors is such that there absolutely need to be independent prosecutors to deal with police misconduct. That would go a hell of a long way toward addressing this problem.
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:28 PM on October 29, 2016 [18 favorites]


Regarding the police in Medford, Check the Police has a lot of great information on their website about common elements in police union contracts that make it much more difficult to hold cops accountable.
posted by duffell at 8:29 PM on October 29, 2016 [3 favorites]


The police unions seem to have made the decision a long time ago that membership would appreciate more of a "employee, right or wrong" defense-lawyer-like zealotry. And now it's self-reinforcing. That is what they're like, so that's what the membership expects.

And that's why they all must be destroyed.
posted by Artw at 8:30 PM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


...but he's OUR shadowy morally ambiguous intelligence apparatchik!

I just posted his Twitter comment on Facebook with the commentary "I'm glad he's on our side."

Back in '07 a bunch of intel on Iran was leaded that basically undermined Bush Co.'s war drum beating at the time. At some point during that there was an article titled "The Revolt of the Spooks" or some such where the big pull quote from some former intelligence apparatchik went something like "I think most of us in the intelligence community feel a stronger loyalty to the continuity of the United States than we do to the person of the President".

I've drawn strange comfort from that quote this election cycle.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 8:32 PM on October 29, 2016 [16 favorites]


Gabe Sherman's NYMag piece offered a little bit of insight into the travel itinerary (other than the still-valid assumption that he likes sleeping in one of his own beds):
When she was promoted to campaign manager in mid-August, Conway met with Trump in his office on the 26th floor of Trump Tower. She told him two things: that he was losing and that he was running a joyless campaign. “What would make you happier in the job?” she asked.

“ ‘I miss flying around and giving rallies when it was just a couple of us on the plane,’ ” he told her.
So, it's because Don-don wants to fly his big plane and have lots of rallies and if he doesn't get to do that he has a sad.

Compare that to the Clinton campaign itinerary, which shows the value of having multiple surrogates to cover different states and regions within states and demographics. Even then, it's really focused: FL, NC, OH as true battlegrounds; CO, NH, WI in the second tier; IA as a coin-flip that's leaning redder this cycle; AZ as a stretch goal. PA is not on the itinerary until Katy Perry next Saturday. It's an electoral map that starts at 272.
posted by holgate at 8:36 PM on October 29, 2016 [18 favorites]


Meanwhile, in the land of Steve Bannon's election fanfiction, I just saw this comment on FB from a Trump supporter: "The emails found implicate Hillary greatly for selling weapons through Benghazi to Isis."

Cyriak, if you're out there and you're listening, the world needs you to make a fractal infinite-loop facepalm animated gif.
posted by duffell at 8:39 PM on October 29, 2016 [16 favorites]


We went to visit family in rural PA today. Living in Manhattan, we don't see many political signs, so I saw my first two Trump signs ever today, and quite a few Hillary ones. Most signs were just for local candidates.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:41 PM on October 29, 2016 [1 favorite]


I try to imagine what is so gross about police unions

It's the "them against us" attitude some of them adopt, where the "them" is not the boss in his nice office, but the people they serve, the people pay their salaries and benefits. It's the "we are the only ones standing in the way of anarchy" mindset assisted by easy access to military hardware, which is an attitude especially prominent in mostly-white areas near to cities with a larger minority population, but also prominent in diverse cities with non-diverse police forces. The prevailing American cop-union narrative is not that different from Trump's hallucination: with threats at every corner, live in fear, respect our authority, give us more hardware.

Teachers' unions are generally not like that.
posted by holgate at 8:42 PM on October 29, 2016 [41 favorites]


Teachers' unions are generally not like that.
Teachers don't carry military-grade weapons.

BLUE LIVES MATTER
MORE THAN YOURS
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:44 PM on October 29, 2016 [10 favorites]


GOTV report from Colorado Springs: finished my 10th canvass shift since 10/17. I'm terrible at keeping track for myself of how many doors were in each packet, but I'm pretty sure I've knocked on over 300 doors by now. I also sort of regret not having a fitbit or similar for tracking steps because I'm curious how many miles I've walked. One of the amazing volunteers in the office is working on a spreadsheet where she's tracking votes-per-canvasser and as of yesterday, I'm up to 86 people who've voted out of the ones I've canvassed.

Canvassing is a little weird, I started to notice that the further north I was, the more likely people were to tell me to "be careful" toward the end of our conversations or point out Trump supporting neighbors and tell me to not bother. I explained that we go out and talk to likely Dem voters. One guy who's supporting Hillary went on to tell me today that he felt sorry for Paul Ryan, and what a tough spot he's in trying to do anything with the Republicans in Congress, and I thought that he must be an immensely compassionate person to have sympathy for that wide-eyed, granny-starving jellyfish, but I didn't say anything. The best conversation today was with a man who told my daughter and me that he was a lifelong Republican from Texas, who'd switched his party affiliation and was happy to vote for Hillary. He can't support what the GOP is doing or their attempts to blame it on Democrats. It's affirming to meet people who have the courage to say it isn't right and vote for the person rather than party. I've signed up a few folks to volunteer and talked to more about phonebanking from home. It's fun to talk with folks who are enthusiastic about voting for Hillary or even better, who have already voted (and just not been stricken through yet), and it's frankly encouraging to see how well the operation is running--packets prepped and prioritized, calls going out to volunteers, data being entered. It's not flashy, but it's competent and it's working.
posted by danielleh at 8:45 PM on October 29, 2016 [59 favorites]


Apropos this thread in general, the Guardian today had (IMHO) a pretty good summary of Trumpism. I hope they're right that it will eventually pass....
posted by StrawberryPie at 8:48 PM on October 29, 2016 [2 favorites]


The prevailing American cop-union narrative is not that different from Trump's hallucination

I was thinking that. Or like the GOP's problem now. Spent so much time encouraging the gross elements to inflate membership; now that same group has them over a barrel. (Assuming they're at all unhappy with that situation in the first place, which might be giving them too much credit)
posted by ctmf at 8:52 PM on October 29, 2016


It makes sense as cover for a string of diamond heists.

That would be about the only way for Trump's entire presidential campaign to make any sense.


Has anyone checked for new Banksy pieces after each visit?
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 8:54 PM on October 29, 2016 [19 favorites]


Harold MacGilvary, the Medford Patrolman's Association president who was photographed "locking up" Hillary Clinton, later issued the most textbook non-apology I have ever read:
"These were Halloween costumes. It was meant totally as a joke. I apologize if this offended anyone in any way. I never expected this sort of reaction. It was poor judgment on my part," said MacGilvray.
Shameful. Contemptuous. Not even trying to pretend he's sorry. The above is from this local news article, which is the most detail I can find on the incident at this time.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 9:03 PM on October 29, 2016 [6 favorites]


Friend who works at a Circle K downtown, near the Convention Center, just messaged me:

There was a zombie walk and a trump rally downtown today. Guess which brought in more freaks to circle k

I asked what kinds of things people buy as they're trying to make America great again, and he said mostly cigarettes and beer. "One bought a Corona, and I laughed."
posted by Superplin at 9:04 PM on October 29, 2016 [31 favorites]


zachlipton, that is choice. Say what you will about McMuffin, he can deliver a sick burn.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 9:24 PM on October 29, 2016


There was a zombie walk and a trump rally downtown today. Guess which brought in more freaks to circle k

Strange things are afoot at the Circle K?
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 9:31 PM on October 29, 2016 [32 favorites]


I try to imagine what is so gross about police unions

There's an essay in Jacobin that I can't find right now that argues the fundamental difference between police unions and other unions is that police are bosses, not labor. Ms. stet says, "Interesting. Even if they're labor within their own organization they're bosses for the rest of us."

So yeah, I kind of think that's the fundamental difference.
posted by stet at 9:38 PM on October 29, 2016 [70 favorites]


I mean, Egg does go on to say "we will not sit by while two corrupt, self-serving, big government liberals like you [Trump] and Clinton destroy our country," so don't praise him too much or anything.
posted by zachlipton at 9:59 PM on October 29, 2016 [18 favorites]


I was thinking that. Or like the GOP's problem now.

And like the NRA's sales pitch too, though in their case it's "don't trust the cops to save you!" which adds to the mess. But as the NRA is a marketing group for gun makers, the FOP is a kind of marketing group for ever-expanding police departments.
posted by holgate at 10:04 PM on October 29, 2016


> Next election, I hope we have TMBG-themed posts, because I could kill with the lyrical references.

A little late to this party, but:

Orange Man, Orange Man
Angry because he has the tiniest hands
How many wives? It's not important
Orange Man

Is he a threat? Or is he a mess?
Can he respect anyone in a dress?
A dumpster fire with no regrets
Deplorable Man, Deplorange Man
posted by Johann Georg Faust at 10:32 PM on October 29, 2016 [67 favorites]


I've been thinking R.E.M.'s Ignoreland would be good for an election day post title. Politically oriented and full of vitriol.
posted by Chrysostom at 10:38 PM on October 29, 2016 [9 favorites]


You wouldn't even have to modify TMBG's Your Racist Friend very much.
posted by StrawberryPie at 10:48 PM on October 29, 2016 [11 favorites]


New poll of Alaska:
10/21-10/26
Clinton 47% (+4)
Trump 43%
Johnson 7%
Stein 3%

Tweet
posted by melissasaurus at 11:11 PM on October 29, 2016 [29 favorites]


McMullin tweeted that his Principles for New American Leadership are up. I am fascinated.

Our nation was founded by courageous, principled Americans who took on the seemingly impossible fight ...

No, our nation was founded by courageous, principled English citizens who decided to do something else with their lives. That's how countries get founded. I mean, I guess you could call them "Americans" on the grounds that they lived on one of the the American continents, but that's quite a stretch.

1. Our basic rights are God-given. [life, liberty, pursuit of happiness]

I do note that he doesn't define "God." As a polytheist, I find that annoying. Which deity does he believe gave us those rights? He also doesn't define "rights." He lists them but doesn't say what makes them "rights."

[2, 3] Any changes to the Constitution must be made through the amendment process it provides, not by Judicial or Executive action.

He has several points that boil down to this. He does not specify the difference between "changes" and "interpretation to apply to circumstances that didn't exist when it was written." A strict definition of the Constitution would assume that "free speech" didn't include phone texting.

4. Our leaders must be honest and wise. Um, I thought he was going with strictly Constitutional approach. Nowhere in there - in any federal or state requirement for office, as far as I know - is "wisdom" nor "honesty" required.

[5] It is our civic duty to be informed and engaged on important issues

See above. Says who? And how will this "duty" be enforced--will the uninformed and disengaged be told they're not allowed to vote?

And from there he devolves into "government must be fiscally responsible, esp with entitlements" but "gov't has a responsibility to help people out of poverty" and "health care is a right."

Fascinatingly, he insists that our 2nd amendment rights must be protected. He does not say that any other amendments need special consideration.

My test for 2nd amendment rights politicians: Are they willing to hold their rallies and debates in open carry venues? If not, they're just blowing smoke; they don't want citizens to have the right to bear arms; they want some citizens to have the right to bear arms in some situations. Which is, hey, just what those of us on the screamin' liberal left want. We should be arguing over which citizens and which situations, not whether or not all people should have the right to carry guns all the time, anywhere they want.

9. We must protect life from birth to natural death. Huh. Does that mean he's anti-death-penalty? Somehow, I doubt it. Sneaky, that. On his issues page, it's conception to death, not birth to death.
A culture that subsidizes abortion on demand runs counter to the fundamental American belief in the potential of every person - it undermines the dignity of mother and child alike.
Did he... did he say that abortions should be banned because they're undignified?

Sorry about the long ramble; I'd tagged Egg as vaguely too-Repub-esque -for-me but hadn't really looked at the details yet.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 11:18 PM on October 29, 2016 [29 favorites]


Egg is a conservative, no question. And were he running against Clinton as a Republican he'd have very little support here. His stated positions in his Principles for New American Leadership are his beliefs, but in many different interviews, Tweets, or conversations I've read from him, he is a little more nuanced in some positive ways than most current Republicans seem to be.

His stance on religion is interesting in that his beliefs are laid out in the Principles, but he also constantly talks about freedom of religion, where America is a place for all religions and for those who have none. He's been explicit about including atheism in his discussion and strong in talking about religions other than Christianity. How he would square his Principles with his statements isn't entirely clear, and that goes towards many things he's said.

Since we have no real history of policies or positions beyond his recent claims, we can't easily point to a clear governing position he'd adopt, so the tension is between his conservatism, his more liberalesque statements, and, I suppose, his work for the CIA and Goldman Sachs.

His campaign so far has spent much more time and energy criticizing Trump and the Republican leadership than Clinton, and I mean a lot more with the leadership taking almost as much criticism as Trump himself. His complaints about Clinton are the standard "She's completely corrupt" style arguments, with a few pointed jabs at some specific event which has occurred since he's been running. The new email thing, for example. But he's generally been a lot more general in his criticism of Clinton and hasn't put much nuance or emphasis on it so far. That's surely in part due to his entering the race intentionally as a Trump spoiler, but the criticism of Republican leadership isn't as much a spoiler thing as it does go towards the suggestion he is really trying to build some alternative to the current brand of Republican.

In particular, he's vehemently anti-deplorable, and his main positive focus is on inclusion for all. The campaign has consistently been out front with denouncing sexism, racism, and one "true" religion stuff. His goal seeming to be to remove those things from any potential governing party, leaving them as isolated as possible on the fringes of our system. The campaign wants a "return" to "true" conservative values with more individual states control. But even within his calls for "true" conservatism, he shows more nuance than most Republicans, including things like wanting to improve choices for women to prevent pregnancies in his pro-life talks, allowing for the need for some strong central government when something truly is a federal issue (he's pro-medicare and SS for example, he wants to end Obamacare, but his criticism in part is because it leaves too many people uninsured and believes a state/market solution could work better, he wants to increase employee wages in part through wage supplements rather than just increasing the minimum wage, he wants to appoint judges who respect the original intent of the constitution like, allegedly, Scalia, but also has allowed that time has moved on and some issues need different considerations, he personally believes a marriage should be between a man and a woman, but considers the Obergefell decision to be defining and does not want it reopened, and so on. (Egg being 40 and unattached has raised some eyebrows on the right hinting at a connection to the above claim and/or the below one.)

A big interest of his, no surprise given his time with the CIA, is in our foreign policy. He's definitely pro-intervention in Syria, and back in March was giving speeches about what he calls the genocidal regime there. He was directly involved with bringing over Caesar from Syria, who's photographs were instrumental in shaping the direction of policy here and purport to show atrocities the Assad regime had carried out. His TEDx talk from March is online, and has many of those images. (Very graphic) There has been some doubt and criticism of Caesar and those images from some quarters, so I am not taking a position on them, just pointing out that is a key concern for Egg, so take that as you will. In a related way, if one does take a strong "once a spook always a spook" attitude, and Egg is just a CIA operative, then what all of the above suggests about CIA concerns with the Republican party is interesting.

As a one time contributor to the Egg campaign, and proud Egg for president bumper sticker owner, I figured I should try and look into his campaign as it goes along to see what my money is going for. While I'll be voting for Clinton, I'm still plenty intrigued by Egg and the goings on out west and haven't regretted giving him the cash so far.
posted by gusottertrout at 12:40 AM on October 30, 2016 [26 favorites]


You wouldn't even have to modify TMBG's Your Racist Friend very much.

At the risk of starting a 'what is the correct response to racist acquaintances?' derail, I get incredibly annoyed every time I see this half-hearted, party-leaving 'oh my poor white person feelings of hypocrisy' rip-off song mentioned on MetaFilter because The Special AKA said it first and without equivocation: if you have a racist friend now is the time, now is the time, for your friendship to end.
posted by jack_mo at 12:44 AM on October 30, 2016 [27 favorites]


Holy shit... The FBI doesn't even have a warrant for the emails that Comey wrote Congress about. I can hardly believe this.

This is really making clear to me how, even after Trump loses the election, having a party that is as far gone into denial and echo chamber land as the Republicans is a serious, serious threat.
posted by overglow at 12:56 AM on October 30, 2016 [37 favorites]


Oh, sorry, one last interesting tidbit about Egg and his TEDx talk was his final sales push. His pitched belief was that the US needed a true marketplace of competing ideas. He used Bosnia as his analogy for what he wants to see happen in Syria, claiming (essentially) that Clinton was given opportunity/forced to act by getting pushback from Senators in both parties, and without that further atrocities would have transpired. The larger suggestion then possibly being that Egg is looking for that same dynamic to occur in current politics and doesn't see that happening as it is. (Assuming his statements are actually his beliefs anyway.)
posted by gusottertrout at 12:59 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


Mailed in my vote and I was happy to see that it got delivered and was counted by the time I checked online this week. Such a relief to have that done!

Also did some more phone banking for MeFites United. My most memorable call today was the man who -- after I introduced myself as a volunteer -- said, "Oh! God bless Hillary!" and "Trump is crazy!"
posted by rangefinder 1.4 at 1:15 AM on October 30, 2016 [31 favorites]


The Observer: 2006 Audio Emerges of Hillary Clinton Proposing Rigging Palestine Election
On September 5, 2006, Eli Chomsky was an editor and staff writer for the Jewish Press, and Hillary Clinton was running for a shoo-in re-election as a U.S. senator. Her trip making the rounds of editorial boards brought her to Brooklyn to meet the editorial board of the Jewish Press.

The tape was never released and has only been heard by the small handful of Jewish Press staffers in the room. According to Chomsky, his old-school audiocassette is the only existent copy and no one has heard it since 2006, until today when he played it for the Observer.
N.b.: The Observer is owned by Donald Trump's son-in-law, Jared Kushner.
posted by Joe in Australia at 1:33 AM on October 30, 2016 [4 favorites]


So Egg is a shadowy morally ambiguous intelligence apparatchik but he's OUR shadowy morally ambiguous intelligence apparatchik!

I mean, Churchill said he'd ally with the Devil to fight Hitler.

he was talking about the russians, but same difference
posted by Itaxpica at 1:34 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


The Observer: 2006 Audio Emerges of Hillary Clinton Proposing Rigging Palestine Election

Scroll up. I'm not convinced her remarks, and all the Observer gave was a single sentence out of context framed in the most pro-Trump way imaginable, cannot more charitably be interpreted as more like "the US shouldn't have pushed for elections unless and until it was reasonably confident Hamas wasn't going to win." In any event, she clearly didn't propose rigging an election, as the headline suggests, because she made that comment after the election took place.
posted by zachlipton at 1:51 AM on October 30, 2016 [29 favorites]


Even if she wanted the US to rig the election why would she ever say so to the press? It's ridiculous. "to determine" means "figure out who would win" as zachlipton says.
posted by Justinian at 1:58 AM on October 30, 2016 [8 favorites]


Zachlipton: Scroll up.

Oh, I missed your earlier post, sorry. Yeah, it's basically a pile of nothing; I just posted it here for completeness' sake. Anyone know if Eli Chomsky is related to Noam Chomsky? That really threw me when I read it the first time and missed his first name.
posted by Joe in Australia at 2:02 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


The weird thing to me is that the tape is so isolated to just that fragment. If she dropped that kind of bombshell to several reporters and they understood it to be about rigging an election, shouldn't there be some kind of a follow-up question? And then the Observer takes the ridiculous leap of linking it to Trump's claims that this election is rigged, not to mention the weird stuff at the end about the Jewish Press protecting people in power.
posted by zachlipton at 2:03 AM on October 30, 2016 [5 favorites]


Trump presidency could provoke 'world disorder': Nobel Peace Prize winner Jose Ramos-Horta.

I and many of my friends, Nobel Peace Prize laureates, are extremely concerned with the tone of a presidential candidate Donald Trump in making disparaging remarks about migrants, about Muslims, and refugees.
posted by adept256 at 2:08 AM on October 30, 2016 [3 favorites]


Our nation was founded by courageous, principled Americans who took on the seemingly impossible fight ...

to steal the land away from sovereign Indigenous people who already lived here.
posted by spitbull at 3:39 AM on October 30, 2016 [36 favorites]


Wait... wait... so Trump finding out about Egg does actually seem to have happened like that Downfall video I did many election threads ago?!

Damn. What an election.
posted by garius at 3:52 AM on October 30, 2016 [52 favorites]


I'm not sure how much of a derail this is, but for all of Massachusetts' bluer-than-thou status, Medford has historically been a little more red-based purple. When I was in high school (and Bill was in office), the school newspaper ran antiabortion editorials with explicit ties to Catholicism. (The editor ran the internal-narrative-of-a-fetus meme when the school was considering making condoms available to students.) We were also the site of a race riot that closed the school for a week.

Granted, this was back in the 90s, and some things may have changed since then...but if you grew up in this kind of tribal, conservative environment and no one tried to teach you that this was wrong, it's understandable that you'd think that campaigning while in uniform for a White supremacist presidential candidate was acceptable. I love my hometown, but it is not without its problems.
posted by pxe2000 at 3:58 AM on October 30, 2016 [6 favorites]


that Downfall video I did many election threads ago?!

I didn't get to tell you at the time because I was late watching it, but that shit is HILARIOUS. Highly recommended, would LOL again.
posted by threeturtles at 4:03 AM on October 30, 2016 [13 favorites]


I just don't see how he can believe attacking McMuffin now is anything other than a lose-lose for the Trump campaign:

1) It legitimizes Egg's candidacy for those Republicans in Utah looking for a not-Trump option
2) It raises Egg's profile on both a state and national stage.
3) It gives Egg the ability to throw out that zinger of a not-Trump tweet.

But then I suppose I'm trying to apply logic where none has existed for a long time. As always, Owen Ellickson nails it:
McMAHON: I saw your quote about the Mormon... Don, you did him a big favor.
TRUMP: Wheh? Come off it.
McMAHON: You babyfaced him!
TRUMP:

McMAHON: "Nobody's heard of the guy." Arrogant heel vs. fresh baby! You're DiBiase--
TRUMP: He's the 1-2-3 Kid.
McMAHON: And Pence is Virgil

TRUMP: McMullin slammed me! I'm gonna 3AM this creep so hard...
McMAHON: Don't do it, pally. Be strong.
TRUMP: Tweeting insults IS strong!
[Fake, obviously, for those unfamiliar with Ellickson's parallel universe where Trump is regularly chatting to WWE's Vince McMahon]
posted by garius at 4:17 AM on October 30, 2016 [13 favorites]


Do you think Agent Egg uses a scrambler?
posted by Devonian at 4:30 AM on October 30, 2016 [6 favorites]


It’s remarkable really that even if Trump and McMullin split the conservative vote in Utah 50/50 it still doesn’t mean that Clinton will win. Although based on the 2012 results, in Washington D.C. you could split the Democratic vote evenly between eight candidates and the Republicans would still come in ninth.
posted by Bloxworth Snout at 4:45 AM on October 30, 2016 [5 favorites]


What's with the ABC news tracking poll? It's gone from Clinton +12 to Clinton +1 in one week. That seems... unlikely. (Note that the narrowing happened before the Comey bullshit).
posted by Justinian at 4:50 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


> NO STICKERS. Just I voted braclets.

Yeah, no stickers in Chicago because this is why we can't have nice things. But the new wristbands are pretty bitchin! Saw one on Thursday and was immediately jealous.

(Though I have to say, I don't understand how it solves the problem. I mean, can't wristbands get stuck places too? And wristband advesive is so much stonger than sticker adhesive.)

> Made mine big so I can wear it till Nov. 8th.

Yes! VOTE EARLY, VOTE OFTEN.
posted by Westringia F. at 5:16 AM on October 30, 2016 [4 favorites]


What's with the ABC news tracking poll? It's gone from Clinton +12 to Clinton +1 in one week. That seems... unlikely. (Note that the narrowing happened before the Comey bullshit).

My understanding is that they modified their likely voter calculation. Not sure how, but only a methodology change explains the jump.
posted by dis_integration at 5:26 AM on October 30, 2016 [1 favorite]


This might make me a bad person but I hate those damn stickers. Sign me up for team receipt.
posted by gusottertrout at 5:28 AM on October 30, 2016 [1 favorite]


Changing methodology halfway through an experiment is hella unscientific, though. If that's what they did, their results are no longer comparable to previous iterations of the poll, and also they no longer have a randomly-selected sample. It would totally invalidate all their work. You can't just change the rules when you don't like the results you're getting and expect people to take you seriously.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 5:31 AM on October 30, 2016 [8 favorites]


Man, we don't get anything in Pittsburgh except a weird little stub torn off the weird little carnival ticket we give to the guy who sets up our voting machine before we vote.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:34 AM on October 30, 2016 [3 favorites]


I got a rock.
posted by kyrademon at 5:38 AM on October 30, 2016 [30 favorites]


Now you just need a piece of string.
posted by Grangousier at 5:42 AM on October 30, 2016 [17 favorites]


Hillary has got this

Hello from England, where in just the last few months alone:

- The national football team were beaten by Iceland.
- The national cricket team were beaten by Bangladesh.
- Brexit.

Also, it's 2016. Assume nothing.
posted by Wordshore at 5:51 AM on October 30, 2016 [69 favorites]


I just read a little about the ABC poll. The shift isn't from people moving away from Clinton so much as Trump voters reporting that they are more likely to actually go vote. The likely voter modeling thus shifts, and if the poll is reporting on likely voters, that's going to have an impact on the numbers.

Now is the time to GOTV, my friends.

I'm just trying to make it through the next week, and after that I will confront more seriously the deep despair I'm feeling over what this means about the people I share this country with. I can't go too far down that rabbit hole right now. I might never come out.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:52 AM on October 30, 2016 [10 favorites]


Nothing was less surprising than England being beaten by Iceland.
posted by corvine at 5:54 AM on October 30, 2016 [10 favorites]


A friend of mine is a polling place worker here in Pittsburgh, I should ask him why we don't get stickers.
posted by octothorpe at 5:55 AM on October 30, 2016 [1 favorite]


Oh and going way back to Mr. Anonymous Former R Congressperson:

FUCK YOU SO MUCH, BUDDY. You're afraid of bodily harm? My rage really is just beyond reckoning at this spineless, useless piece of shit and all the other cowardly pieces of shit like him. This is the rage that's going to fuel me on my canvassing shift today. I'm proud to go out there and represent the forces of tolerance and love out there, which is a greater feeling of fulfillment than this soulless ghoul will ever know.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:59 AM on October 30, 2016 [57 favorites]


I'm just trying to make it through the next week, and after that I will confront more seriously the deep despair I'm feeling over what this means about the people I share this country with. I can't go too far down that rabbit hole right now. I might never come out.

What I'm thinking is that assuming Clinton wins, we have another four years to get our shit together. I'm coming out of this different than I went in - there's different work to be done than I thought, and I am more willing to work on electoral stuff. I bet I'm not the only one. People are going to scatter to their various projects after this election, and people here who are together in rooting for Clinton are going to split up because many of us will oppose many of the things her government does. But - as we know from history - the weight of multiple left and liberal projects happening simultaneously is a big deal and they tend to reinforce cultural shift.

It's not that midterms aren't important, it's not that nothing can happen between presidential elections, it's not that we won't have three years until the campaigning begins again...but we'll have some breathing room and we need to use it.

So what we've learned is that we share this country with people who are far more racist, misogynist and violent than we believed - even if we believed they were pretty bad before. Sure, we can sit with that, but basically it's time to figure out how to bring the fight. If they want culture war, we can all bring that on all kinds of levels, and if we can win this election we can win that fight.
posted by Frowner at 6:01 AM on October 30, 2016 [57 favorites]


I just want one -- ONE -- of them to stand up and say, "wow, you know what? I really fucked up and spent a really long time not listening to POC and women and low-income people, and I used my platform to hurt a lot of people, and now I'm going to sit down and shut up for a bit. The only time you're going to hear from me for the next X number of months is when I'm sharing what I'm learning or amplifying the voices that I spent so much time silencing."

Yes, there's Derek Black, but more along the lines of Erick Erickson, there's John Cole of balloon-juice.com fame.
posted by NoMich at 6:09 AM on October 30, 2016 [5 favorites]


I early voted yesterday, and while it's pretty forgone that nobody I voted for will win in blood-red Louisiana, at least I got my Blue Dog I Voted sticker.
posted by Bringer Tom at 6:13 AM on October 30, 2016 [14 favorites]


About Those Odds-of-Winning Projections.
There are quite a few sites out there giving "odds" that Hillary Clinton will win the presidency, and they are all over the place. Nate Silver and FiveThirtyEight actually have three different calculations, which give Clinton a 79%, 81.1%, and 80.4% chance, respectively. The New York Times pegs it at 91%, while PredictWise says it's 87%, and the Princeton Election Consortium thinks it's 99%. This is an enormous spread—20 points!—and they obviously can't all be right. In fact, they can't even all be close. Slate's staff, for their part, has thrown up their hands and decided to average all the others, giving Clinton an 86% chance of winning.
posted by Coventry at 6:15 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]




there's John Cole of balloon-juice.com fame

Yeah, he migrated out of the wingnut fever swamps some years ago, I think? Maybe around the twilight hours of the W. administration.
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:19 AM on October 30, 2016 [1 favorite]


Still, I'm going "I don't grok how anyone could believe those aren't his real policies, and be voting for him without knowing what his 'real policies' are, if those are not they." The sheer mental contortions involved here are maddening.

This is actually a perfect example of how subliminal persuasion, as some of the people who have tried to explain the method behind Trump's word salad have tried to tell us, actually works.

The theory, which is pretty well borne out by the success of the advertising industry, is that humans are not rational. We make decisions based on feelings and impressions which are often beneath even our own conscious perception, and it is these impressions which the advertiser and propagandist seek to create with repetition, conceptual linking, and other techniques. ("Obama founded isis" kind of flopped but "crooked Hillary" turned into what these dudebros call a "linguistic kill shot.") When we are challenged on such a decision after we have settled on it, only then do we rationalize it. And as this encounter perfectly illustrates, even a failure to successfully rationalize often won't change our mind.
posted by Bringer Tom at 6:23 AM on October 30, 2016 [26 favorites]


I don't think those skeletons are part of it anymore...
posted by schmod at 6:24 AM on October 30, 2016 [3 favorites]


I'd been worried I haven't been doing enough in this election because I live in the UK. But I just found out that Democrats Abroad has a phone bank operation to make sure people are getting in their mail-in ballots. So, I guess I'll be doing some phone banking this week ...
posted by kyrademon at 6:26 AM on October 30, 2016 [19 favorites]


I don't think those skeletons are part of it anymore...

Nah, they wised up and took the gig with David S. Pumpkins.
posted by C'est la D.C. at 6:31 AM on October 30, 2016 [3 favorites]


Two former Deputy AGs, one D one R, unload on Comey.

James Comey is damaging our democracy
posted by chris24 at 6:32 AM on October 30, 2016 [28 favorites]


From the breathlessly titled Trump tears into US judicial system (CNN) we see the two modes of communication at work as reported by a Mainstream outlet.

TRUMP: Rah rah rah, Graaar, Me Me. Rigged stupid loser country!

CLINTON: This announcement from Director Comey, of which little substance can be said to be found within, is terrible. As Americans, our chief concern is fairness under the law and these misleading zzzzzznnnnkkkkk

When I hear people whom I otherwise would have described as intelligent, articulate, reasonable people discuss the election, THAT's what I hear them talking about. "They're both so terrible" . . . to read about. One's offensive and the other has committed the crime of being boring.
*waves away the vapors*

The burden is on the media- mainstream or otherwise- to bring the light of truth to these campaigns and they are as uninterested and incompetent at their tasks as Donald is.

Note for 2018: we need the Mtv-style-bumper aesthetic for Dem races. Somebody goose a SuperPAC while the rest of us fire up, and learn how to use, Final Cut Pro. Meet back here in 18 months. Ready? Break!
posted by petebest at 6:36 AM on October 30, 2016 [20 favorites]


Always with the negative waves, Wordshore, always with the negative waves!
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 6:39 AM on October 30, 2016 [3 favorites]


I just want one -- ONE -- of them to stand up and say, "wow, you know what? I really fucked up and spent a really long time not listening to POC and women and low-income people, and I used my platform to hurt a lot of people, and now I'm going to sit down and shut up for a bit. The only time you're going to hear from me for the next X number of months is when I'm sharing what I'm learning or amplifying the voices that I spent so much time silencing."

It strikes me that we've seen that happen, but whenever they do, they get a lot of blowback like, "screw that guy, why didn't he do it sooner?"

So maybe that's why they all plead family stuff, in an effort to deflect that kind of hassle.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 6:40 AM on October 30, 2016 [10 favorites]


@LOLGOP:
Republicans are so upset about email security that they're basing their entire campaign on hacked emails.
posted by chris24 at 6:49 AM on October 30, 2016 [7 favorites]


Strange things are afoot at the Circle K?

Or strange things ate a foot at the Circle K?
posted by entropicamericana at 6:50 AM on October 30, 2016 [1 favorite]


No warrant
No warrant
You're the warrant

Weiner hands over laptop, warrant may not be required (cw:NYPost, Fox, Weiner: wash your hands before returning to thread)

Oh and while we're in here, 33,000 'deleted' emails may have always been available.. Multiple storage locations. FBI never asked.

[Emphasis added below]
The Platte River Networks executive, whose name was redacted from the interview report, said PRN tech Paul Combetta “created a ‘vehicle’ to transfer email files from the live mailboxes of [Clinton Executive Services Corp.] email accounts [and] then later used BleachBit software to shred the ‘vehicle,’ but the email content still existed in the live email accounts.”

Unless one of Clinton’s aides had the capability to log in to the PRN server as an administrator and remove a mailbox, her archived mailboxes more than likely still reside somewhere in that system. And they may also materialize on an internal “shared drive” that PRN created to control access to the Clinton email accounts among PRN employees. PRN has been under FBI order to preserve all emails and other evidence since the start of its investigation last year.

Clinton’s missing “personal” emails may also be captured on a Google server. According to FBI notes, Combetta “transferred all of the Clinton email content to a personal Google email address he created.” Only the FBI never subpoenaed Google to find out.

posted by petebest at 6:52 AM on October 30, 2016 [12 favorites]


The close relationship between police and prosecutors is such that there absolutely need to be independent prosecutors to deal with police misconduct.

I always thought it would be natural to have a higher level of government investigate police misconduct at a lower level i.e. Feds investigate state police which investigate local police but it is one of those neat ideas which have nothing to do with how politics work.
posted by shothotbot at 6:54 AM on October 30, 2016


Accoriding to the NYPost, Trump offered Christie the VP slot. Manafort got him to change his mind by faking mechanical problems with his plane. Yeah, he'd be great with the decisions of president.

Trump offered Christie his VP slot - Then rescinded it
posted by chris24 at 6:56 AM on October 30, 2016 [13 favorites]


*wavy daydream effect*

CLINTON: Found 'em. All 33,000 emails up on the campaign website. Go nuts.
TRUMP: We're gonna read these bigly, they'll be so crooked
CLINTON: HA!

"Hail to the Chief" plays as Hillary waves from Inaugural podium

*wavy daydream effect*
/harp
posted by petebest at 6:57 AM on October 30, 2016 [9 favorites]


Guardian: Inside a Donald Trump rally
The video is scary.
I get the impression that many Trump voters feel that they have nothing to loose. Not so much in terms of their livelihoods as in terms of the values and yes, politics they have believed in. They are not all that stupid: I think a lot of them can see they have been had by the Republican party for the last two decades or more. Remember how Kellyanne threatened the Republican members of Congress with revealing their sex scandals if they turned against Trump - they are all corrupt, cheating, lying a..holes, and the electorate knows it. So why not choose someone who is openly a crook? Who talks from the gut(ter)? Who will threaten and bully the clown congress into submission.
It seems a lot of people (not only in this article, I've seen it many times), voted for Obama back in 08, and were disappointed that he couldn't deliver, so they are not going back for more of the same with Hillary.
And then, for the type of people who attend the rallies, it's fun. I think we all know people who enjoy doing and saying things they know are bad, because they enjoy seeing our shocked faces. It's the only power they have and get to wield, after all. Heck, I have a friend who says disgusting things, and his politics and actual doings are the exact opposite, he is to the left of me, he actually uses every penny he has to support and immigrant family. I really don't get why he does the offensive stuff - maybe it's a form of tourettes.
Long winding thought ended: to change the Trumpists, you need to get the corruption out of American politics. Good luck with that..
posted by mumimor at 6:57 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


Oh and while we're in here, 33,000 'deleted' emails may have always been available.. Multiple storage locations. FBI never asked.

QUICK -- recover them so Donald can renege on his promise to release his tax returns once the 33,000 e-mails were recovered! I've been dying to hear his next excuse.
posted by phatkitten at 6:58 AM on October 30, 2016 [20 favorites]


So, this probably makes most people feel worse, but: The Cubs Have A Smaller Chance Of Winning Than Trump Does [538].
posted by Huffy Puffy at 7:05 AM on October 30, 2016 [5 favorites]


Anyway, nobody really knows how email works. I don't; my internet provider's tech support does SO not know how e mail works (especially mine); my spammers don't really know (or their stuff would look different from how it looks); Hillary doesn't; Donald doesn't; nor apparently do the investigators.
Yeah, let's turn to tax returns. We know how those work.
posted by Namlit at 7:05 AM on October 30, 2016 [4 favorites]


It's 2016

Well the Pirate Party came up short in Iceland (thank Thor) and the Cubs are about to lose the World Series and militarized cops are beating down Indians in the Dakotas like they have for a couple of hundred years. Therefore in conclusion, 2016 is a land of contrasts and an island of mixed metaphors and stuff.
posted by spitbull at 7:07 AM on October 30, 2016 [5 favorites]


So, this probably makes most people feel worse, but: The Cubs Have A Smaller Chance Of Winning Than Trump Does [538].

So did the Cleveland Cavaliers.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:10 AM on October 30, 2016 [6 favorites]


From the Guardian article:
When I ask Urban about how, as a woman, she feels about Trump’s self-confessed sexually predatory behavior, she gets indignant. “I’m sick and tired of this being brought up. Words come out in the wrong way at times; you put your foot in your mouth. I don’t think Donald Trump is remotely derogatory to women.”

. . . . Whats that thing to say when words fail?
posted by petebest at 7:10 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


Words come out in the wrong way at times; you put your foot in your mouth.

Small hands come out in the wrong way at times, too.
posted by Slothrup at 7:13 AM on October 30, 2016 [3 favorites]


Good news from Florida:
In FL, 36% of likely voters say they have already voted, and they are breaking for Clinton, 54-37

Among those who haven't, Trump up 51-42
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:13 AM on October 30, 2016 [7 favorites]


Slate's staff, for their part, has thrown up their hands and decided to average all the others, giving Clinton an 86% chance of winning.

Oh just great a poll of polls of polls. what's next?

Why does the exact probability at any given moment matter so much so many? What requires "throwing up hands" about observing that the various aggregators use different methodologies to reach slightly different probabilities, all of which are purely theoretical until they become irrelevant?

And finally, a cry: why isn't basic statistics a requirement for a high school diploma in the modern world?
posted by spitbull at 7:16 AM on October 30, 2016 [9 favorites]


In firey rebuke, Ryan un-endorses Trump, says 'America is more important'*

*Ha! Naaah just s**ttin' ya. He's still cowarding it up in true Count Chocula granny-starver fashion. Staying away from his challenger, refusing to speak in recognized words. As a true leader does.
posted by petebest at 7:19 AM on October 30, 2016 [7 favorites]


Both 36%*54% + 64%*42% and 36%*37% + 64%*51% are roughly 46%. That doesn't seem like good news.
posted by J.K. Seazer at 7:19 AM on October 30, 2016 [8 favorites]


Why does the exact probability at any given moment matter so much so many?

Statistics is hard, although polling is not really rocket science in the scheme of things. An exact number is easy to understand (and sell), and most people are bad at math.

And finally, a cry: why isn't basic statistics a requirement for a high school diploma in the modern world?

Too close to the same skill set needed to understand credit cards and student loan interest.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:21 AM on October 30, 2016 [7 favorites]


octothorpe: "A friend of mine is a polling place worker here in Pittsburgh, I should ask him why we don't get stickers."

I did email him and his answers is:
Because the county is too cheap. This year, I bought them myself on Amazon to give to the voters in my precinct, but they won't reimburse me.
posted by octothorpe at 7:22 AM on October 30, 2016 [22 favorites]


The thing is, not all likely voters actually vote, and one of the big questions in this election is what turnout is going to look like. The 36% are people who already voted. The other 64% may or may not actually get to the polls. This is a thing that looks like a math problem but is actually not.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:22 AM on October 30, 2016 [19 favorites]


Mitch McConnell: True Leaders Say Nothing

As he's made the rounds in his home state of Kentucky this month, McConnell has either ducked reporters' questions or explicitly refused to address the topic he acknowledged was on everyone's mind: his party's presidential nominee.

At a local Chamber of Commerce event in Danville, McConnell twice instructed the crowd not to ask him about the presidential race "even though that's what I know you all wanted me to talk about."


Our party is fine! Everything's great! Uh, uh, hey look, a dog!
posted by petebest at 7:27 AM on October 30, 2016 [9 favorites]


I live in Medford and those photos are (a) par for the course and (b) depressing.
posted by pxe2000 at 10:06 PM on October 29 [3 favorites +] [!]


I live in your neighboring Melrose, where I've encountered exactly one Trump/Pence bumper sticker and no other evidence their campaign exists. Roomie claims to have seen a few lawn signs while walking the dog.

The only bright side is, in MA these idiots are surrounded by hordes of inoculating true-blue dems who wouldn't vote for Trump with a gun to their heads.
posted by invincible summer at 7:31 AM on October 30, 2016 [1 favorite]


Both 36%*54% + 64%*42% and 36%*37% + 64%*51% are roughly 46%. That doesn't seem like good news.

100% of those who have already voted will vote. An indeterminate number, but definitely less than 100% of those who haven't voted, will vote.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 7:32 AM on October 30, 2016 [21 favorites]


The thing is, not all likely voters actually vote, and one of the big questions in this election is what turnout is going to look like.
That's a good point.

This is a thing that looks like a math problem but is actually not.
...Instead of demanding the third duel this thread, I'll just point to Horace Rumpole's comment above.
posted by J.K. Seazer at 7:36 AM on October 30, 2016


*Ha! Naaah just s**ttin' ya. He's still cowarding it up in true Count Chocula granny-starver fashion. Staying away from his challenger, refusing to speak in recognized words. As a true leader does.

You gotta hand it to Donald. He doesn't let himself get constrained by political norms while the rest of the political world desperately tries to stay above street level and not get dragged into the sewer with Donald.

As soon as Donald fired shots Ryan should have just been publicly "fuck this, I'm out, Good luck, Donald". Donald is publicly shitting on him and he just stays meekly in the corner. The Freedom Caucus has already decided it's going to make a shitshow of the speakership in order to make sure the government doesn't even function and will shut down if they don't get their way (since the electorate sure as hell isn't punishing their intransigence). Plus they can just blame any shutdown on Ryan anyway while going back to their districts and boasting about how they stopped the Feds from spending your money for a few days/weeks.

Maybe Ryan feels buoyed by the fact he can just shut his mouth and win the internal party room election and shame the rest of the crazies into line with the magic words "Speaker Pelosi" since he sure as hell can't win if it's declared they're going for a plurality instead of majority.

December 7 is going to be a barrel of fucking laughs.
posted by Talez at 7:36 AM on October 30, 2016 [3 favorites]


Hey I live in Melrose too! We need more suburban meet ups obviously.

30% of MA voters support Trump. And they are loud af.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:36 AM on October 30, 2016 [4 favorites]


Weiner hands over laptop, warrant may not be required (cw:NYPost, Fox, Weiner: wash your hands before returning to thread)

The only surprising thing about that story is the New York Post rose above the urge to call it a "faptop."
posted by zarq at 7:38 AM on October 30, 2016 [4 favorites]


30% of MA voters support Trump. And they are loud af.

My mantra for the last 24 hours since seeing those Trumpkins on my town's corner: Better here than New Hampshire.

That's the great part about Hillary supporters being educated. They understand the electoral college exists and that 4 EVs are in danger right above them.

Trump supporters on the other hand will gladly tilt at windmills trying to turn MA red.
posted by Talez at 7:39 AM on October 30, 2016 [8 favorites]


I did email him and his answers is:
Because the county is too cheap. This year, I bought them myself on Amazon to give to the voters in my precinct, but they won't reimburse me.


Aw crap. I finally registered to vote (and I'm in PGH) and now I don't get a little reward for voting. Guess I'll have to treat myself to a sundae at Klavon's.
posted by Catblack at 7:41 AM on October 30, 2016 [8 favorites]


Marcy Wheeler: The Story About Judicial Dsyfunction Behind the Comey Whiplash

This is a good example of the cost of such investigations. Because the FBI can and does sweep so widely in searches of electronic communications, evidence from one set of data collection can be used to taint others unrelated to the crime under investigation.

All the people writing scathing emails about Comey’s behavior in this particular matter would like you to believe that this issue doesn’t reflect on larger issues at DOJ. They would like you to believe that DOJ was all pure and good and FBI was well-controlled except for this particular investigation. But that’s simply not the case, and some of these issues go well beyond Comey.

posted by T.D. Strange at 7:44 AM on October 30, 2016 [5 favorites]


Scott Adams nearly dislocates shoulder patting himself on the back for his political acumen (WaPo).

And there's this:

“My speaking career ended because of this,” the Bay Area-based cartoonist said of his once-lucrative side business.

Although his book sales have stayed healthy, Adams said that many off-put readers now view “Dilbert” through more critical glasses, which has affected his licensing sales. All told, Adams said, his income has dipped precipitously.


so, karma.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 7:51 AM on October 30, 2016 [53 favorites]


@samsteinhp:
Pete Williams reports that Comey is UNLIKELY to say anything more before the election
posted by chris24 at 7:54 AM on October 30, 2016


It seems to me Comey might not even have a job on Election Day.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:56 AM on October 30, 2016 [5 favorites]


I just caught five minutes of Face the Nation while getting fast food breakfast. I know I'm a naive person, but I didn't realize the state of political discourse was this bad.

Mike Pence: It's extremely troubling that former president Clinton had a private clandestine meeting with the attorney general and two days later the investigation was closed without charges.

Host: Are you saying that the attorney general put pressure on the FBI director?

MP: I'm not saying that, you're saying that.

Host: Then why bring it up?

MP: It's extremely troubling that former president Clinton had a private clandestine meeting with the attorney general and two days later the investigation was closed without charges.
posted by Jeanne at 7:57 AM on October 30, 2016 [31 favorites]


100% of those who have already voted will vote. An indeterminate number, but definitely less than 100% of those who haven't voted, will vote..

On preview, yep. Nobody has anything resembling a straight answer for how likely a likely voter is to vote, but the one number I could find put it at about 80%. If we assume that that's 80% of people who haven't voted yet, and all likely voters are equally motivated, that puts Clinton about 1.5% ahead of trump.

If we assume it's 80% of the entire electorate, and that the people who have already voted are part of the "actually going to make it to the polls" 80% then Clinton's share rises to like 2.5%. Assume that the early voting numbers are also a predictor of how likely each candidate's supporters are to actually bother to vote and it gets better for her still (thought that seems pretty unlikely).
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 7:59 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


Well Bob Goodlatte got up on This Week and referred to HRC's "potential impeachment" in the House. Coming from the Chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, this is utterly stupefying.
posted by Talez at 8:08 AM on October 30, 2016 [18 favorites]




Well Bob Goodlatte got up on This Week and referred to HRC's "potential impeachment" in the House. Coming from the Chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, this is utterly stupefying.

It's really not. If she wins and the Republican control the House, she will be impeached. That's just a fact. Just like that the Senate will not confirm any Supreme Court pick. Like John McCain said.

Republicans don't have a policy agenda for a Clinton presidency. It's obstruction and Brietbart world full time, non-stop. They can't do anything else, and their base would turn on them if they tried, or refused to take the next logical steps.

They're telling us exactly what they plan on doing, which was obvious anyway. We should believe them.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:17 AM on October 30, 2016 [63 favorites]


garius, that was hilarious. I hadn't seen it yet, either, and I thank you for giving the link again. Good job!
posted by Silverstone at 8:29 AM on October 30, 2016 [3 favorites]


electoral-vote.com has Trump at 191 today. The change was Ohio going from Barely GOP to tied. Come on Ohio, you can do this.
posted by cashman at 8:35 AM on October 30, 2016 [4 favorites]


Impeachment of Clinton would be catastrophic for Republicans. It would look brazenly political in a way that pisses off the supposed independent voter and Clinton would just ignore it because there is zero chance the Senate would act on it.

The judicial filibuster is gone assuming that the Senate results in Democratic control. Slam in a Scalia and RBG replacement and laugh at Republican impotence.
posted by vuron at 8:37 AM on October 30, 2016 [8 favorites]


Wow. Bush's White House ethics lawyer Richard Painter says he's filed a Hatch Act violation complaint against James Comey.
posted by chris24 at 8:41 AM on October 30, 2016 [76 favorites]


Impeachment of Clinton would be catastrophic for Republicans. It would look brazenly political in a way that pisses off the supposed independent voter

I'm not so sure the latter implies the former. Quite the opposite, in fact. The Republicans aren't interested in governing at the federal level anymore. They're paid performers for the right-wing media.
posted by J.K. Seazer at 8:41 AM on October 30, 2016 [20 favorites]




Comey is toast. He won't be pushed out until after the election but he has zero credibility both inside and outside of the FBI.

The fact that he gave Chaffetz a briefing before releasing a letter and no advanced warning to Democrats makes him look like a partisan hack.
posted by vuron at 8:45 AM on October 30, 2016 [17 favorites]


The last time they impeached a Clinton, look how well that worked out for them?

It may be the Dems' best hope of driving midterm turnout, frankly.

Please do not throw Hillary into that briar patch, Rep. Chaffetz!
posted by spitbull at 8:46 AM on October 30, 2016 [14 favorites]


@Mbhokie97:
Man hangs black mannequins in tree next to his Trump yard sign. Claims just "Halloween". This is why I don't give a shit about those emails. [image]
posted by chris24 at 8:49 AM on October 30, 2016 [31 favorites]


Volokh: Does expanding the FBI’s investigation from the unrelated case to the Clinton case violate the Fourth Amendment?

(FYI: That's Orin Kerr's work, not Eugene Volokh's.)
posted by notyou at 8:50 AM on October 30, 2016 [1 favorite]


Dumb and destructive is their brand, they are not going to deviate from it. Maybe some conservative "moderates" or "intellectuals" will make a vague noise about it and pine for the days of actually giving a fuck a bout things, but nobody gives a shit what those guys think.
posted by Artw at 8:50 AM on October 30, 2016


33 Things This Election Will Decide That Have Nothing to Do With Trump or Clinton
A marijuana wave, a bisexual governor, the first state carbon tax, and other small revolutions Nov. 8 could bring.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:54 AM on October 30, 2016 [18 favorites]


Yeah that was the best Trump Downfall parody I've seen yet garius, freaking hilariously good!

Hitler: And why do you think no one polls Utah!??
Steve Bannon General: umm, differing cultural norms and poor internet infrastructure?


If you need a laugh it's highly recommended.
posted by spitbull at 8:56 AM on October 30, 2016 [17 favorites]


Jeanne, that exchange reminds me of one from earlier in the campaign between Chris Matthews and Carly Fiorina, in which she robotically repeats "They've been married for a very long time" in response to Matthews' questions about her bringing up Bill Clinton. I wonder if she and Pence both had the same media interview coach who told them to simply repeat their talking points in response to questions that they thought might be leading them to places that they didn't want to go, to stay on message.
posted by Halloween Jack at 9:00 AM on October 30, 2016


Also, that Downfall parody: "Chris Christie speaks Juggalo." Hilarious.
posted by Halloween Jack at 9:01 AM on October 30, 2016 [5 favorites]


33,000 'deleted' emails may have always been available.

In one of the debates, Trump said he'd release his taxes when Clinton released the 33k deleted emails. Clinton should find out who/what storage server has a copy and hand them all over, release 'em to the public (I doubt there's anything more damning in them than what's already been released), and then say, "your turn, Donald... or were you lying about that, too?"
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 9:16 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


Usually Downfall parodies are good for a couple chuckles but ye gods, there's some serious laugh out loud moments there. Well done indeed. "Mein Donald".
posted by Ber at 9:21 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


you want to give out a ton of source material for people to make up deranged clinton conspiracies because you're trying to shame donald trump?

I think there might be problems with this plan
posted by ryanrs at 9:22 AM on October 30, 2016 [14 favorites]


Downfall parodies never work for me, I can actually understand german.
posted by Pendragon at 9:22 AM on October 30, 2016 [34 favorites]


So in Comey's report, he alleges that Clinton was extremely careless because she did not follow department procedures.

Then it turns out that in releasing this recent letter, Comey defied the recommendations of his superiors at the Justice Department and refused to have his letter reviewed by the Justice Department Public Integrity Division as is required by department policy when related to elections.

Which raises the important question -- is this ironic? I'm always unsure after the Alanis Morrissette flap.
posted by JackFlash at 9:24 AM on October 30, 2016 [90 favorites]


Downfall parodies: German speakers must read the subtitles without sound. Otherwise it's a crappy experience on all levels.
posted by Namlit at 9:25 AM on October 30, 2016 [13 favorites]


Which raises the important question -- is this ironic? I'm always unsure after the Alanis Morrissette flap.

I think it's just a dick move, is all.
posted by dersins at 9:26 AM on October 30, 2016 [1 favorite]


Trump offered Christie the VP slot. Manafort got him to change his mind by faking mechanical problems with his plane.

...thus forcing him to spend a night away from his own bed and have dinner with the Pence family. It cements the idea that Trump's decisions and beliefs are based upon the last person he speaks to, like a voice recorder that overwrites itself every time you press 'record'.

I think Sarah Kendzior (again) made an important point: the weeks where Clinton isn't in the same room as Trump have become weeks when the press -- in spite of being abused on the ground and bullshitted in the studio -- normalises the abuse and bullshit and Actual Fascism, because the horserace is the model and everything has to be rammed into it. That's gruesome.

John Cole of Balloon Juice was always a libertarian-minded Republican, but the behaviour of senior elected GOPers in the Terri Schiavo case was the last straw.
posted by holgate at 9:29 AM on October 30, 2016 [23 favorites]


you want to give out a ton of source material for people to make up deranged clinton conspiracies because you're trying to shame donald trump?
I think there might be problems with this plan


I'm working from the assumption that if the FBI has identified likely locations of those emails, they're on target to be released, either via hack or FOIA demand, and Hillary should take advantage of Donald's "make an offer based on something that's never going to happen" strategy to remind people that he doesn't follow through on his promises.

If the emails aren't likely to go public without her releasing them, then she should consider whether what's in them is likely to cause any more wacky conspiracy theory activity than is already going on.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 9:30 AM on October 30, 2016




> I'm conflicted about police unions as well.

The thing is, there is a serious problem with policing in this country that anyone with the slightest bit of objectivity can see.

It harms people of color and innocent people who are harassed and/or convicted, poor people, homeless, etc etc etc very directly.

But it ALSO harms the police officers themselves, and the police departments, and the ability of police departments to keep the peace and accomplish their stated mission.

My point is, you would **EXPECT** police unions to be leading the charge to solve the problem that the police are having right now. They are in a unique position to do so. And they are using their power quite literally for evil instead of for good.

I wouldn't expect a police union to come at this problem the way a typical MeFier would, because their entire job is to represent the view of the typical police officer on the beat. But precisely because they do represent that view, if they approached the issue from a place of "This is a serious problem to be solve, here is the police viewpoint of how to solve it" they would be a very valuable voice in the public discussion this country needs to have now.

Instead, they simply deny, deny, deny and justify to the hilt the necessity of their members being able to beat or murder anyone they feel necessary for any reason they feel necessary.

And that position undermines the rule of law in the U.S. rather than supporting it.
posted by flug at 9:32 AM on October 30, 2016 [52 favorites]


if the FBI has identified likely locations of those emails, they're on target to be released

There's not enough time before the election for the FBI to get its shit together, especially if they're careful about following procedure after Comey's fuckup.
posted by ryanrs at 9:33 AM on October 30, 2016


It strikes me that we've seen that happen, but whenever they do, they get a lot of blowback like, "screw that guy, why didn't he do it sooner?"

So maybe that's why they all plead family stuff, in an effort to deflect that kind of hassle.


This is also why I think it's so important to react to people saying stuff like that with empathy and compassion. What they really deserve is a, "Why'd it take so long?" but that just discourages others. We need to encourage and support more of that behavior so ignore what they deserve and go with what's effective. You're not doing it for them, you're doing for all the people that will be helped by others who finally screw up the empathy and courage to change their ways.
posted by VTX at 9:35 AM on October 30, 2016 [14 favorites]


If a president is going to break the precedent of "FBI directors don't get fired and never resign", it'll have to be Obama and not Clinton. It makes the transition a messy one, but I'm sure he'd be fine spending a day or two in a House hearing telling Jason Chaffetz and Bob Goodlatte to eat shit, and if they have a case to make, make it fast because Sasha's got an after-school thing.
posted by holgate at 9:41 AM on October 30, 2016 [58 favorites]


Pendragon: Downfall parodies never work for me, I can actually understand german.

Yeah, well, you know who else understood German?
posted by emelenjr at 9:46 AM on October 30, 2016 [30 favorites]


In re police unions: police unions (and prison guard unions to a lesser degree) function differently than most other unions. Most unions are organized in opposition to the elite - they are organized to get working people a better deal in spite of union busting, etc. Because the police protect the interests of the elite (as you can see from their general alignment with Trump, general racism, etc) they have a different relationship to the state and the rich than, say, a teachers' union. Police union members are used by the state to bust down other working class people - to bust people for loitering, to police protests, to put people in jail over petty shit, to roust sleeping homeless people, and to intimidate strikers from other unions. This is why they tend to have different values than even your average conservative union and why they have way more scope to express those values. A police union is a state-endorsed association for supporting the state's monopoly on violence. For this reason, it will always have more power than other unions and face less sanction when it protects its members. If a teachers' union says that someone is being fired unfairly, oh, well, we should get rid of all unions and not look into the cause of the firing; if the police union says one of their members shouldn't be excused for murdering someone, why, that's fine.
posted by Frowner at 9:46 AM on October 30, 2016 [37 favorites]


"FBI directors don't get fired and never resign"

William Sessions?
posted by mikelieman at 9:47 AM on October 30, 2016 [3 favorites]


Getting yelled at while canvassing was bound to happen eventually, and if you had your money on "shitty Bernie supporters" please come forward and collect your winnings. They were awful and all I said when they started was thanks, in that case I'll be on my way and they kept yelling as I was walking down the street. Apparently I "NEED TO KNOW I'M SUPPORTING A CROOK!!!!!" Which is right next to my "wake up, sheeple!" bingo square.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:47 AM on October 30, 2016 [99 favorites]


HuffPo: This Billionaire Governor Taxed the Rich and Increased the Minimum Wage — Now, His State’s Economy Is One of the Best in the Country
The reason Gov. Dayton was able to radically transform Minnesota’s economy into one of the best in the nation is simple arithmetic. Raising taxes on those who can afford to pay more will turn a deficit into a surplus. Raising the minimum wage will increase the median income. And in a state where education is a budget priority and economic growth is one of the highest in the nation, it only makes sense that more businesses would stay.

It’s official — trickle-down economics is bunk. Minnesota has proven it once and for all. If you believe otherwise, you are wrong.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 9:49 AM on October 30, 2016 [136 favorites]


They're telling us exactly what they plan on doing, which was obvious anyway. We should believe them.

There will also be a government shutdown. We're getting all the letters and admin prepped now, and moving critical work out of December. See, even the credible threat of a shutdown costs you (and me) the taxpayers truckloads of money.
posted by ctmf at 9:49 AM on October 30, 2016 [41 favorites]


I find that Downfall parodies have begun slowly reawakening my long dormant German language skills. I now get about 25% of it -- which is just enough to be distracting from the subtitles.
posted by humanfont at 10:02 AM on October 30, 2016 [3 favorites]


Ugh, soren_lorensen. I'm so sorry that happened to you. I always feel nervous approaching houses with Bernie signs out for fear of the same thing, but so far, so good.
posted by Superplin at 10:03 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


Not to pile on Medford, MA, but you know what they don't do there? Give out "I Voted" stickers. Somebody set up a Kickstarter to buy them for civic-minded Medfordians (it didn't reach its goal, but the last update said the amount raised was enough to buy stickers anyway).
posted by adamg at 10:04 AM on October 30, 2016 [1 favorite]


flug: exactly. I definitely have a plan for my first 100 days as Honcho of All Police Unions. It involves a wrecking ball and an all-hands "new sheriff in town, get on board or GTFO" YFG speech. This is exactly why I will never achieve the position of HoAPU, and neither will anyone else that agrees with us. That's why I'm afraid artw is right; we'll have to burn them all down and start over.

But hopefully target that with a fine enough focus to not burn down ALL public employee unions, because they aren't all (or even mostly) like that and the collateral damage could be worse.
posted by ctmf at 10:04 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


WeThose of us with the remaining emotional bandwidth after years of abuse from these assholes and who are also reasonably assured of our safety need to encourage and support more of that behavior so ignore what they deserve and go with what's effective. You're not doing it for them, you're doing for all the people that will be helped by others who finally screw up the empathy and courage to change their ways.

Important correction.
posted by schadenfrau at 10:05 AM on October 30, 2016 [18 favorites]


I have repeatedly asked at the polls for a sticker, and every time I'm greeted with ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
posted by pxe2000 at 10:07 AM on October 30, 2016 [3 favorites]


Is it better for Utah dems to vote for McMullin in hopes of denying Trump the electoral votes, or go for Hilllary because it's close and she may win?
posted by humanfont at 10:08 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


Ground report from New Hampshire: so far I've gotten two empty houses and two houses of enthusiastic Hillary supporters who are excited to vote.
posted by pxe2000 at 10:09 AM on October 30, 2016 [13 favorites]


Heavens. In my near-metrowest suburb, I was positively lavished with voting stickers. Next time I hear a neighbor gripe about high property taxes, I'm going to let them know exactly how good they have it.
posted by Sublimity at 10:10 AM on October 30, 2016 [1 favorite]


Trump and Putin
My brilliant friend
The Economist

(The headline refers to Putin's description as colorful which Trump's hack translator rendered as brilliant.)
posted by bukvich at 10:13 AM on October 30, 2016 [1 favorite]


Oh gosh... humanfront I'm inclined to say that the most pragmatic choice is McMullin since giving him both R and D votes will likely push him over the top, and Clinton definitely does not need Utah to win. And it would be hilarious if he won. But on the other hand there's no way I'd NOT vote for Clinton just for the lols, so... Vote Your Conscience I guess!
posted by showbiz_liz at 10:13 AM on October 30, 2016 [5 favorites]


The Salt Lake Tribune article of today, reveals Utah's true bias, as The Trib is supposed to be the middle of the road rag for Utah. They allow their great cartoonist leeway, and a couple of regular columnists, but in today's big cover for Evan they use old poll figures, and try to make the case for all Utah. Never forget that Utah's highest population is too young to vote. The ratio of Mormons to non Mormons is more even than they like to admit, and then bolstered by high population of children. So the Trib is telling Utah what the conservatives want them to hear. Newer polls, but the race as a three way tie. I'm just sayin'. Maybe I am in horrible denial, probably.
posted by Oyéah at 10:14 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


After my Berner encounter, I then signed up an enthusiastic new volunteer on the next block, so it was worth it.
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:15 AM on October 30, 2016 [61 favorites]


(The headline refers to Putin's description as colorful which Trump's hack translator rendered as brilliant.)

The translation makes some sense if it's using the British meaning of "amazing" (similar to Firefly's "shiny") as opposed to the US meaning of "smart." It may still be wrong--"colorful" in the US doesn't necessarily mean anything good, but it does mean "noteworthy" rather than implying any specific trait.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 10:19 AM on October 30, 2016


Sigh: Truckload of Manure Dumped at Ohio Democratic Party Office. The article does say that the county Republican party has offered to help with cleanup, though.
posted by TwoStride at 10:20 AM on October 30, 2016 [11 favorites]


> "Is it better for Utah dems to vote for McMullin in hopes of denying Trump the electoral votes, or go for Hilllary because it's close and she may win?"

I'd vote for Clinton, if it were my choice.

You never know.
posted by kyrademon at 10:23 AM on October 30, 2016 [9 favorites]


Early voting report from Santa Fe: I went last week on Tuesday, was downtown for work anyway, so figured I would walk over on my lunch hour. Coworkers warned me it would likely be busy, but I had a zero minutes wait time. They had four stations where someone looked up your voter record on a computer, filled out the little paper ticket, and handed you your ballot. Looked to be about 30 of the little privacy-winged stations for filling out ballots (about a third were for seated use, rest standing-height). Maybe ten or so other people there voting. Wasn't expecting it, but got choked up filling in that oval for HRC. Two scanner stations, the tally on the monitor readout on the one I used was three-thousand-something. I asked the guy if that was total, or today? He said total, since early voting started on that particular scanner. Said the other scanner was up to five-thousand-something, because that one was closer to the ballot-filling-out stations.

The hubs went on Thursday, same location, same breeze through, same scanner I used, said it was up to five-thousand-something. Texted me a pic of his "I voted" sticker.
posted by mon-ma-tron at 10:24 AM on October 30, 2016 [13 favorites]


"Is it better for Utah dems to vote for McMullin in hopes of denying Trump the electoral votes, or go for Hilllary because it's close and she may win?"

Personal opinion, and worth everything you paid for it: Vote your conscience - attempting to game the system is useless at best and actively destructive at worst.
posted by Mooski at 10:26 AM on October 30, 2016 [15 favorites]


FBI knew for weeks before telling Comey, on Thursday. In other words, one of Comey's first acts was to make it public.

How ... thoughtful of him.
posted by Dashy at 10:26 AM on October 30, 2016 [33 favorites]


Truckload of Manure Dumped at Ohio Democratic Party Office.

Paging Dr. Metaphor . . Dr. Metaphor to the national stage plase . . *klk*
posted by petebest at 10:26 AM on October 30, 2016 [3 favorites]


Whoa, so Santa Fe has a total population of around 70K, and just between those two machines at least 10K have voted early? That sounds crazy.
posted by LionIndex at 10:27 AM on October 30, 2016 [1 favorite]


In other words, one of Comey's first acts was to make it public.

"But can we trust him?"

"Well, there's always the empty gun test."

"What?"

"Give him an empty gun and see if he points it at you."

"He'd never fall for that."

"But if he does..."
posted by Mooski at 10:31 AM on October 30, 2016 [40 favorites]


I actually do speak German but never have a problem with Downfall parodies, partly because there are often hilarious intersections between subtitles and soundtrack.
posted by spitbull at 10:31 AM on October 30, 2016 [4 favorites]


So this just happened. I stopped by my brother's home to drop off a piece of pie I thought he'd enjoy. First, I had a WTF moment when I saw he had a Trump sign in his front window. Then he answered the door wearing a Trump hat. I was appalled and said so and asked how he could support a misogynist. He blathered about emails and Benghazi but then when he said "locker room talk" I exploded. I am astounded at how much rage flooded through me instantly, as I'm usually slow to anger and even-keeled. It was the last straw. My own brother--smart, well-read, raised in the same liberal union-backing home as me, who had the same strong mom who got me a Ms. magazine subscription when I was a teen--has no compunction about supporting a man who brags about sexual assault. I said "misogyny" again and he said he didn't know what I was talking about. I told him to look it up, then threw the pie on the floor and stormed off. I was livid!! Then I felt a twinge of guilt because we avoid conflict in our family, but I cut that shit out when I remembered that I am a nasty woman and he can just go to hell. Thanks for listening.
posted by a fish out of water at 10:31 AM on October 30, 2016 [315 favorites]


FBI knew for weeks before telling Comey

So apparently a warrant to search a computer for relevant information in an FBI investigation should be relatively simple - make sure all the fields on the form are filled in, for example. Then get any one of the 11 active, 13 senior judges or the ~50 magistrates of the second circuit to sign off. They have someone on call 24x7.

Point being, they may not have anything. They should have the warrant by now.
posted by petebest at 10:35 AM on October 30, 2016 [4 favorites]


I would not personally vote for McMullin, because I don't think that contemporary "moderate" conservatives need to be empowered, and I can't see any positive effects coming from a McMullin vote.

Really, the only reason I can think of for someone with reasonable politics to vote for McMullin — who's funny as a metafilter inside joke, but who has a genuinely miserable platform — is if you think there's a legitimate chance that the Republican Party might splinter, and also you think that voting for McMullin would make that more likely to happen. For my part, I don't think the Republican Party is actually going to splinter. I think they're going to keep doing the thing they've been doing since at least the early 2000s.

HOW THE REPUBLICAN PARTY HAS WORKED SINCE (AT LEAST) THE EARLY 2000S:
  1. A breakaway group — the Tea Party, the Trumpists, whatever — moves as hard as they can to the right.
  2. The Republican Party establishment whines and moans a bit about how extreme the breakaway group is, but then...
  3. Follows the breakaway group to the right, because that's the easiest way to maintain a unified party.
  4. Now the Republican Party establishment is as far to the right as the breakaway group used to be. This gives the breakaway group room to move even farther to the right. They take advantage of this opportunity.
  5. goto step 2.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:36 AM on October 30, 2016 [41 favorites]


Ok so I am secretly a Luddite, and my bias is to assume this is user error on my part, but...

I have the MeFites United page up on mobile, and I want to make calls! But there's no button or whatever from the page where it will make my phone call the number automatically, which means I have to write it down, navigate to the phone app, then come back to the page while it's ringing so I can read the script. This is dumb. Ok, I'll pull up the page on my laptop!

Nope. In my HFA account in my laptop browser, the call tool is blank.

There's nothing in the app.

What am I doing wrong?
posted by schadenfrau at 10:36 AM on October 30, 2016


a fish out of water: I'm so sorry. That's terrible.
posted by bardophile at 10:36 AM on October 30, 2016 [18 favorites]


I actually do speak German, but I turned off my German understanding, and heard that as a tone poem, while reading the subtitles. Such a lovely piece. From a site of make your own Hitler parody. Such good stuff. And here is a picture of McMullin's hands. You be the judge.
posted by Oyéah at 10:37 AM on October 30, 2016


So I did my early voting yesterday, in San Jose. There were no lines, no protestors, no watchers and everyone working there was cheerful.

They said there had been crowds in the morning, but when I got there a half-hour before closing, I just walked up and they printed out my ballot. I filled out the selections for the candidates and the gazillion propositions, and I was fine.

And then I treated myself to coffee and caught pokemon in Japantown for an hour.
posted by happyroach at 10:37 AM on October 30, 2016 [16 favorites]


> Personal opinion, and worth everything you paid for it: Vote your conscience - attempting to game the system is useless at best and actively destructive at worst.

Whatever you do, do not vote your conscience. "Voting your conscience" is like "just being yourself" at a job interview; it sounds nice, but in practice is maybe the worst thing you could possibly do.

If you must vote your conscience, adjust your conscience first, to make sure that it's operating in terms of effects and outcomes rather than expression and values.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:40 AM on October 30, 2016 [47 favorites]


I understand the election has made everything seem like life or death but I wish people would slow down on calling for Comey's head. He was in a no-win situation where either disclosing or not disclosing would seem like putting his thumb on the scale and compromise public trust in the FBI; plus, the FBI has been leaking like crazy this year over the Clinton stuff and reading the tea leaves it seems likely the cat was possibly already out of the bag and Chaffetz already knew. I think he had to say something -- especially since the alternative was likely not silence but headlines blaring "FBI GETS SECRET WARRANT TO INVESTIGATE HIDDEN CLINTON EMAILS" -- and given that he had to say something I don't see what he could have said that was much different from what he did say. It's obviously not his place as head of the FBI to formally announce whether an investigation has merit or not before it happens.

What he did likely *minimized*, rather than maximized, the damage to the fairness of the election resulting from this event. It's certainly better that this story was announced the way it was, and quickly debunked, than for it to be characterized by hysteria and rumors pushed on by from "anonymous FBI sources close to the investigation." The idea of the investigation never seeing the light of day before the 8th seems like the fantasy.
posted by gerryblog at 10:40 AM on October 30, 2016 [7 favorites]


mon-ma-tron: The hubs...Texted me a pic of his "I voted" sticker.

You're married to Dennis the Menace?
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 10:41 AM on October 30, 2016 [4 favorites]


If you must vote your conscience, adjust your conscience first

How about, "just vote for the person you want to be President" and quit trying to be clever.
posted by ctmf at 10:44 AM on October 30, 2016 [7 favorites]


a fish out of water: I'm so sorry. That's terrible.

Me too, what a waste of delicious pie!
posted by ActingTheGoat at 10:45 AM on October 30, 2016 [23 favorites]


FBI knew for weeks before telling Comey, on Thursday.

This is very fishy and the real scandal might turn out to be infighting within the FBI. The New York FBI office is mad because local agents were pulled off the Eric Garner case by DC headquarters because they were slow-walking their investigation in solidarity with local police. The New York office in retaliation may have been blackmailing Comey by threatening to leak the information about the emails and Comey may have made his announcement to pre-empt the leaking which would embarrass him.

In any case it indicates mismanagement and lack of leadership on Comey's part. Dirty intra-departmental politics might be the real scandal.
posted by JackFlash at 10:46 AM on October 30, 2016 [25 favorites]


I always vote conscious.
posted by orange ball at 10:46 AM on October 30, 2016 [5 favorites]


How about, "just vote for the person you want to be President" and quit trying to be clever.
posted by ctmf at 10:44 AM on October 30 [+] [!]


If I did that, I'd end up writing in someone crazy and completely wasting my vote. It's a terrible idea.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:47 AM on October 30, 2016 [10 favorites]


Then I felt a twinge of guilt because we avoid conflict in our family, but I cut that shit out when I remembered that I am a nasty woman and he can just go to hell.

This is the best thing that I've read today.
posted by ActingTheGoat at 10:47 AM on October 30, 2016 [32 favorites]


Whatever you do, do not vote your conscience. "Voting your conscience" is like "just being yourself" at a job interview; it sounds nice, but in practice is maybe the worst thing you could possibly do.

This seems to need a [real] or [fake] tag.

To me, the whole point of voting is to say "I, for one, want x," where x is actually what you want. Otherwise, what's the point?
posted by Mooski at 10:47 AM on October 30, 2016 [2 favorites]


No, check that, I wouldn't write in someone crazy. I'd write in someone sane: Angela Davis. But me writing in "Angela Davis" will never, ever, ever make Angela Davis President, or accomplish anything else worthwhile.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:49 AM on October 30, 2016 [7 favorites]


voting is to say "I, for one, want x," where x is actually what you want. Otherwise, what's the point?

You can't always get (exactly) what you want.

But you can try to minimize what you